One of the few perks of being a liberal in a right-wing era is that bitter experience has made us veritable experts in handling rejection in a psychologically healthy (if politically disastrous) way. This is a highly adaptive trait on a personal level; when dumped, one doesn’t blame the dumper, and both inwardly and outwardly seeks the sort of self-improvement that might avert a recurrence. When the shoe is on the other foot, we don’t blame the scorned for their shortcomings, but resort to such charitable lies as the shopworn but still usually convincing, “It’s not you; it’s me.”
Republicans have another approach, which is one reason I would never vote for, much less date, one of them. When one looks at the way Newt and Rudy dumped their many previous wives, Ronald Reagan dumped (some of) his children and, say, Illinois teabagger Joe Walsh cheated his family out of years of child support, is it any surprise that Sarah Palin tossed her Alaskan supporters under her elaborate but fake bus, or that Mitt Romney treats Massachusetts voters who foolishly elected him with the same nostalgic respect Sen. (!) David Vitter holds for his onetime Pampers-toting hookers?
An ungrateful bunch they are, indeed, which brings me to the Democrats. Rather than just be relatively predictable, albeit in a bad way, they do have charming qualities that don’t require beer goggles to appreciate. They seem so much more sincere when they promise everything, and when they fail to deliver, they expend considerable effort in convincing their jilted admirers that they tried to, say, prosecute those criminals, raise those taxes, or keep their sweaty paws off the interns, but unfortunate circumstances intervened. Next time they’ll do better, and you kind of want to believe them, if only because they weren’t completely insufferable asses about it.
This undoubtedly humane approach, unfortunately, turns out to be their worst weakness, always confusing the personal with the political. Bill Clinton was saved from a messy divorce in part because he didn’t dump Hillary and introduce Monica as the new First Lady in a press conference, a startling display of arrogant indifference ol’ Rudy will never live down, 9/11 notwithstanding. But welfare mothers, pensioners, and the untold millions of ordinary Americans clobbered by Clinton’s equally hurtful repudiation had no voice in the matter. Likewise, President Obama’s airy dismissals, always one step removed, of his core supporters as an intransigent hippie-tainted “Professional Left” has so far failed to appreciably dent his personal approval ratings, but has still certainly jeopardized his reelection in the real world.
In one of his wiser if typically morally repugnant statements, Dick Cheney put it best when he said that any President who left office with a higher approval rating than 50% had foolishly left “cards on the table.” He harbored no illusions about the fabled relationship between luck in love and luck in cards; like most Republicans, he would have gladly tossed aside the former in favor of the latter. Democrats, sensitively introspective as they are, could learn a thing or two from Dick and all the rest of them: we’re electing a President, not choosing a boyfriend. Sensitivity’s great, but you, and we, can get that at home.



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Hag!
I would much prefer a competent rascal to a sincere incompetent, as long as the rascal was doing the things I wanted done. LBJ stands out as a classic example.
hey hag!!!! hope you are well! still tryin’ to digest all this; hmmmm— again—like, this gets said by everyone again and again, Obama is hurting himself by treating his hippie stained supporters like shit and making ex-supporters of many of them, but as he loses support, he and his peoples remain convinced that it’s the swing-moderate-independents out there who are the key to victory– all 8 of them; i mean, what the fuck about the base, O-man– that would be ME!
domestically
what’s up, doc—- just heard a new woody song i’ve never heard before– “Chain Around My Leg;” thought it was apropos in light of Biden’s recent comment that Romney will put y’all (and us all) in chains again
LBJ..the last real liberal president. Carter, Clinton, and Obama liberals? LOL.
Agreed. Vietnam will always be a black mark. On the other hand I have thought a lot about this and had a lot of discussions on the issue and I do not think that there was anyone out there who would have done that any differently. There really was a sort bipartisan elite foreign policy consensus at the time, and Johnson at least did not advocate “bombing them back to the stone age.”
Obama believes by alienating millions of liberal, Dem base voters he can pick up one or two Republican votes. He thinks it’s a good trade off.
Exactly. I don’t much care what Lady Bird and the girls thought of him; he got things DONE.
True, Vietnam is a black mark. But then, there’s Medicare, Voting Rights Act, The Civil Rights Act, the war on poverty, and the line “in your guts, you know he’s nuts” that LBJ used against Goldwater.
Ironically, Goldwater would be consider a liberal by today’s standards.
Liberalism pretty much died as a governing strategy in the mid-70s, when what would become the DLC starting pushing for a more “business friendly” approach in order to to overcome the massive Republican fundraising advantage.
If we were a couple of slack-jawed know-nothings, whether in Florida or Ohio, we would RULE. Literally, sad to say.
‘zactly
That is pretty much my take on the man. His accomplishments, on balance, outweigh his failures.
i’m in FL, but not slacked jawed– a giveaway I’m not from here;
Reminds me when Kasich passed that anti-union, collective bargaining bill in Ohio (which was resoundingly overturned at the polls a year later), he said “when you come into office, you want to swing for the fences, right? That’s what we did.”. Of course, I don’t agree with the bill, but I do agree with Kasich’s sentiment. You try and accomplish something. You try and hit a home run.
Obama’s too busy punting.
Yup. We don’t have to live with LBJ. He’s not our daddy or husband. He got things done, and a lot of good things.
that’s true (about goldwater)– what a shame that any party– an entire party, and a major party at that (it controls congress!!!!!) can be so damn radical
And I’d have to point out that LBJ was no liberal, either. It was his own Geithner types that led him merrily into Indochina. As a result, the so-called Great Society lasted about as long as cow piss on a hot rock.
You’d have to go back to the Roosevelts to find somebody who made a long-term difference the 1% didn’t like.
Did you hear today that pretty much all the people who don’t plan to vote would have otherwise voted for Obama? Wonder why that could be?
He is obsessed with the mythical “swing voters,” the supposed persuadable moderate independents. The reality, show by all the political science research is there are, as bfl noted, about 8 of those. Most of the folks we call that are not actually swing voters, but rather apathetic Democrats or Republicans who swing not between parties, but between voting and not voting. If you want to get their vote, you need to energize and excite them, the way Obama did the last time. It is basically by playing to the base that you mobilize the “swing voters,” at least for the Dems. It may be a bit more complicated for the Republicans, since many of the “swingers” are moderates and the base are rabid mouth breathers.
HAG! That’s not exactly right. Medicare became law in 1965, so….
i don’t know how i feel right now—– just had a fairly intelligent (not all the way intelligent, but fairly) woman tell me Ryan is “brilliant” and “I haven’t heard any politician this intelligent and realistic about our economy in ages.” I mean— I’m just—- now, the woman was unemployed and either still is or is working part-time; i just don’t get why people vote for people who are OBVIOUSLY not in their best interests
The real irony is that Goldwater effectively created the modern Republican Party. It was people who worked on his campaign, like Cheney and Rumsfield, who went on to establish movement conservatism, PNAC, and all the rest.
Wear your properly held mouth as a badge of honor; it’s all y’all have left.
Especially someone as transparently fraudulent as Ryan.
No, we really are choosing a boyfriend.
Or, in the case of the Romneys, electing a Royal Family.
So introspective tonight, Hag! You okay?
I would not say it was FDR himself though. More of his policies came from the work that Elinore did out among the people. She more than he was the liberal voice in that family.
no talking to them; three months of people talking at each other
and my know-nothingness I wear as a badge of honor, too– how else will they know I’m from New jersey
If you ever watched the film Century of the Self it explains the Democrats Strategy based on social science research which began with Clinton. The problem is they should have read a little more about psychology. If you move your position to the right more, then people will believe your prior liberal position was wrong and so they tend to move their own positions more to the right. As long as the Dems don’t figure that one out, will keep on moving to the right. The Republicans showed they understand Social Conformity Theory very well when they moved to the extreme right after losing in 2008. Then the moderates to be maintain their personal goal of being in the middle moved their opinions to the right. Its simple enough to break that cycle. All you need to do is inform people. Obama’s theory is if I just move things a little in the right direction that will send the ball rolling when all he really needs to do is show more health care and financial victims in his commercials.
My 39 year reunion was last weekend; I’ve been like his since before the hangover even wore off. By next week, I hope to be back to normal programming on this CHNN station.
I am not in the market for either a boy friend (or girl friend) or a king. I want a competent manager who will pursue policies beneficial to the vast majority of Americans and prosecute felons regardless of social status or political clout. I also want a pony and a unicorn.
As I see it, the problem with Obama is that he has been far too deferential to the legislature. In the ideal democratic Republic I think he’s right. But we are so far from having a functional legislature that the Executive has to lead. I’m not convinced yet that Obama understands that.
Wonder why? Must be all that punting by Obama. It’s hardly exciting and engerising. Has a punter ever gotten a standing ovation?
Mitt Romney is a unicorn.
Obama thinks that leading is too partisan.
Biden is a trip;
I just saw the speech he gave on memorial day to bunch of people who had lost nrelatives in the service– it was very good
Nah, he is much more of an underpants gnome.
And he thinks elections are a form of Calvinball…
i’m still thinking about LBJ
Hag, you don’t seem to be towing the Liberal line and i believe you will be branded a Radical, wear the brand proudly.
LBJ was a Liberal a war mongering Liberal. Listen to the tapes of him making the decision to escalate his war, his closest advisor said it was unwinnable yet he went ahead because of the upcoming election.
Onitgoes wrote in an earlier thread (What the New York Times Won’t Tell You about Julian Assange”) the following:
“Well this is all part of the Master Plan that was thrashed out after Nixon. They determined then and there that this would be a fascist state, and they set about it in a very very thorough way. And, sad to say, have been inordinantly successful.”
This statement is truth. There was a brief moment right at the end of the Vietnam War when there appeared to be real hope of freedom in America. Listen to Bob Dylan’s “Desire” and the recording of his Rolling Thunder tour, which capture the soaring spirit of the moment. Then the fascist plan began to go into effect. Dylan’s next album, “Street Legal”, issued in 1977, is the diametrical opposite of its predecessors and expresses an incredibly dark and disillusioned mood.
Time for me to toddle off. Did a 6 mile hike with a 750 foot gain in the first half today and I want to go fishing in the morning. Take care all.
In 1965. LBJ was operating in this environment.
Senate: 68 D/ 32 R
House: 295 D/ 140 R
Unemployment: 5.2%
Inflation: 1.2%
Gas: $0.31/ Gal
31 cents a gallon? I need a nap.
Adjust for inflation, Mary.
Super majority, and LBJ used it.
Obama, had a super majority, chose not to use it.
good night, doc! enjoy!
All too often, Obama punted and whiffed, as the wretched Sean Landetta did in the 1986 NFL playoffs.
exactly. I can remember 31 cents a gal.
So do I.
And the Democrats? People like Bill Clinton* used McGovern, Mondale, and Dukakis as “Don’t Bees” and persuaded the mandarins of his party to treat them–and their supporters–as though they’re all carriers of a loathsome disease.
* Who has done more than any living Democrat to destroy the party and what it stands for.
Obama never had 60 reliable votes. That was proven right out of the shoot as the stimulus legislation struggled through the Senate.
More reason not too take a stand?
I’ve never been much of a line toe-er; mostly because I’ve nobody’s come along whose line I waned to toe. If somebody came along and did things my way, who’s to say I wouldn’t go all ‘bot? Luckily or not that’s never happened.
Not only was gas .31 a gallon, but some gas stations gave out freebies such as a car wash or a roll of TP if you filled up.
As much as I try not to wallow too deeply in the “we are fucked” pond, you are so right. That’s the real reason I drink so much.
hic…..
…cup.
Inflation adjusted 1963- 2010, $0.31/gal is $2.18/gal.
So it’s about 1.5 times higher now than then rather than 10 times.
In the 75th Congress FDR had a Senate comprised of 78 Democrats and 18 Republicans.
i can’t drink and let me tell you, without it, wallowing (and i do plenty) is a bitch and and a half; and it’s people like that woman who told me tonight that paul Ryna is “brilliant”– she never heard of him before– she’s somewhat intelligent, just very ignorant
It’s a damned shame we didn’t kill the GOP at that point in time.
Just keep your passport up to date and some cash on hand. It’s going to get interesting……..no matter who wins this next round of “Let’s Trash America..USA USA USA.”
Paul Ryan is brilliant? What is the standard of comparison? Dubya? Rmoney hisownself?
can you remember Rachel and her early 2009 post inauguration but called— i forget “Republicans in the Wilderness” or some shit– thought it was too early to gloat– i meaan, just because they had a maroon as head of the party; these people ain’t going away, damn, same ol’ retreads
I’m wondering when they are going to stop SS payments to expatriates. I’m just sure that’s coming along.
I really, really thought the GOP was going to go the way of the Whigs.
I was really, really wrong.
excellent quest– i guess she means compared to the Democrats; she says she hasn’t heard such intelligent and realistic talk about our economy in ages; what can i do; i don’t wanna seem condescending to her– but the woman is a fucking idiot; hmmm, what to say
Well, despite the talk about “preserving SS”…. I don’t believe a one of ‘em, R or D. And I do feel sorry for anyone who is 54 and has paid into Medicare for their entire working life.
And I also remember growing up in the south in the late 50′s and 60′s and, crap!, those Democrats were damned scary!
Well, Medicare is (and has always been) a pay-as-you-go program. It’s an inter-generational promise. We support our parents and grandparents, and we rely on our children and grandchildren to contribute to our medical care.
Ryan wants to abrogate that promise. I’m in the age range you’re talking about, and I’m pretty pissed off about it. I like to joke about my retirement plan being teaching until they pry the chalk from my hand, but that’s my joke. The idea of it being reality also pisses me off.
Those Democrats are all Rethuglicans now.
Ryan wants a voucher system that will not work. I’m not sure where Obama is going with his Bowles-Simpson. I just know that they are not on the side of me or my mid-life kids. When the “Support the Pharmaceutical Companies — Part D” got the vote, it was clear that the fix was in. It’s only gotten worse since then. I do not expect any improvement under either of this year’s miserable candidates.
I know. Ain’t America great!?
I’m with you girl. I put the curlers in early because they double as a helmet later on.
53 here-54 in Dec
It can’t hurt to put a brick in your purse, either….
Thanks for the interesting thread, Hag. Nice to have a spot in the coming storm.
That’s where you’re wrong. Ryan wants a voucher system that will work exactly the way he wants it to. It will limit Federal health care expenditures through CMMS to a specified level. If you can’t buy a health care policy at a price (voucher plus your money) you can afford, die quickly.
He doesn’t care, he and his are provided for more than amply.
Heh. You, for sure, have skin in the game.
see, i knew that women would be in the forefront; i ain’t got no purse
USA authoritarian voters have been carefully taught to vote based solely on emotion. Hence the unemployed lady (mentioned in prior comments) who waxes lyrical about Ayn Rand panty sniffer Granny Starver Ryan. People have been brainwashed to live in fantasyland where they’re directed to see Zombie Ryan as “brilliant.”
I have no doubt that it’s usually well thought out & calculated for maximum effect. They did make a BIG mistake w/ Palin. Seems there are some closet hetero rightwing men who fell into the honey pot & messed up on that pick. Ryan will prove to be effective for what they want which is for Obama to appear to “win.”
Obama will do the same things to Soc Sec & Medicare that Ryan proposes. Just you watch. And my trad Dem friends will bend themselves into pretzels blaming it all on “Republicans.”. And the corp owned propoganda wurlitzer will reliably gin up the TeaPers to HATE on the KenyanNaziSocialistCommie Blah yadda yadda.
The 1% will laugh all the way to their off shore accounts & Ann RMoney can ride her little pony & not have to deal with you people any more.
wait i have to go look something up— who the fuck are my 10 facebook friends who “like” mitt Romney; TEN!!!! hope thyey’re friends i don’t even know
Yep. Like many so-called libertarians, Ryan made damn sure that he got on the taxpayer funded gravy train for life. Gold plated pension & health care courtesy of the 99%. Then some cushy wingnuts welfare gig if he decides to leave politics. Gotta starve granny so Ryan can live the high life. After he “deserves” it