- Free Bradley Manning!!! “For seven days, a makeshift court inside a sprawling military base in Maryland has been hearing evidence in a case that that has raised questions of freedom of speech, the practices of US army intelligence, gender identity and the place of gay personnel in the armed services. Sitting sometimes in secret, at other times in a kind of pseudo-public forum, this idiosyncratic court has been considering whether a full court martial should be held for Bradley Manning, an army intelligence analyst with a troubled background who is alleged to be the source of the biggest leak of US state secrets in history.”
- Did I read somewhere that Anonymous was no longer active? “The activist hacker group Anonymous says it has stolen thousands of emails, passwords and credit card details from a US-based security think-tank. The hackers claim they were able to obtain the information because the company, Stratfor, did not encrypt it. They say Stratfor’s clients include the US defence department, law enforcement agencies and media organisations.”
- “How the West was caught out by the Arab Spring. The Year of Revolution: In the first of a series of articles on the Middle East’s tempestuous year, Donald Macintyre explains how decades of diplomatic strategy was undone by the popular risings.”
- “Senior British officials believe that a “last push” in 2012 is likely to definitively destroy al-Qaida’s remaining senior leadership in Pakistan, opening a new phase in the battle against Islamist terrorism. So many senior members of the organisation have been killed in an intense campaign of air strikes involving missiles launched from unmanned drones that “only a handful of the key players” remain alive, one official said.”
- Mr Robert: “Just for a moment, put aside the current Franco-Turkish war over the 20th century’s first Holocaust – of the Armenians – and remember that Nicolas Sarkozy’s electoral venality (500,000 French-Armenian voters want to hear him tell the truth) and Turkish nationalism (which feeds on holocaust denial) make a bad cocktail.”
Interviews
- Noam Chomsky answers 6 questions.
- Occupy Vancouver interviews Naomi Klein.
- Richard Wolff’s weekly radio program Economic Update. This week he interviews a psychoanalyst about “How economic developments affect the intimate, personal lives of all of us, as we try to cope with the current economic reality.” Scroll down to Saturady, 24 Dec at 12:00pm (on the right) or look for the program Economic Update on the left.
The truth will set you free but first it will piss you off.




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Good morning pups! Guess I’m first, so I put the coffee on to perk and set out this morning’s pastries. I hope everyone had a great holiday!
Good morning SoDrag and thanks for the post and host.
Using the Brits to pimp the “death by drones is soooo successfull” bullshit is pretty cowardly.
Good morning post-Christmas Diner denizens.
Thanks, all, for all the good wishes for the season, and may I say coffee is particularly welcome this a.m.
It’s sorta funny how our drive to label the street in the Middle East/North Africa as potential terrorists kept us from noticing that it’s more about nationalism than religious delusion.
Good morning everyone and it is so good to be back at the Diner. Thank you SD for your thoughtfulness.
Hope everyone survived the holiday and will be back sitting in the booths with us.
Some of the comments to the editorial cartoon are pretty interesting reading!
Now Ruth, you can’t be suggesting that our war mongering, biggest-swinging-dick, MIC driven foreign policy clouds our judgement, can you?
No candy and flowers, just a fluke.
Mornin’, pups
Food overload. Gotta get some of that fresh southern iced tea.
Did you get any snow?
Did you read Larue’s description of his dinner yesterday? I may cry.
Just a touch in the early morning hours, and yesterday it got up into the 40′s so no problem traveling. But I would have loved to see white stuff.
Congressman Ron Paul calls Wikileaks & Bradley Manning Heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soF2uIe8GPk
Which thread? I missed that. He is quite the chef…gave me a couple of recipes two or three years ago when I was helping with a big Christmas feast.
EDIT: Never mind, I found it…
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Here, his second next to the last comment.
http://my.firedoglake.com/larue/2011/12/24/lets-pick-xmas-thanks-to-fdl-firedogs/
Yay! I can join the diner today!
No, where was it? I got home and stayed at Caturday til my lids were slammin’ shut
Sit in my booth. It will be great.
Oh, lordy, I’d'a died.
Didja bring Neko? This is a pet friendly place, ya know. Once they pass through the Buddhist Field we don’t hafta worry about ‘em chasin’ each other.
Have some nice hash brown potatoes just fried up.
I’m still working off the weight gain from reading that. Scrumptious.
Welcome…How’s the beautiful kid?
Neko’s still being shaped like a ball in the nest of covers she made on the bed.
I couldn’t put a meal like that together if my life depended upon it.
Good Morning, SD and Overfedones
Whoop, Whoop, we get a WithaMargaret Coffee Klatsh!.
Many regulars and a Newbie! Welcome to Barnburners.
RevBev, got rain in Dallas? Our snow melted down, now falling from the clouds as needed moisture.
Im in Austin…we had rain off and on all day….quite chilly.
Not quite cold enough to snow. (goshdarnitheck)
Morning, SD.
Juan Cole has an excellent article about how the Arab Awakening is undoing the system of “republican monarchy” of countries in the Middle East. Of course, it is also challenging absolute monarchies as well. But Cole points out how the establishment of republics soon became effectively monarchies as a result of ties with the external world, the intermarrying within a oligarchy, and the grooming of sons of the president as successors.
Makes one be on the look out for further Kennedys, Bushes, and Clintons and their counterparts in the Congress. (Cough, Evan Bayh)
Good morning. Trust you had a great day yesterday?
That’s from my being off doing other things yesterday, didn’t know you were out of town. It would have been chilly anyway, same here. And very drizzly. Good for the crops, anyway.
We’ve had three straight days of brilliant sun and mild (40s) temps here in Indianapolis. No snow in the forecast (TM) for the week. I head for home this evening, and only flurries forecast for this week there too.
Actually It’s OK by me….I haven’t seen a paper…any Occupy news? Last Ive seen was about the lawsuit….
Be Careful….HOw long is the trip?
Yep, I did. Thanks for trusting me.
Had a decent lunch at my mom’s with sisters and other family.
No fights. Not even any stupid comments that I can recall.
Seeing both my boys together was the best gift yesterday delivered.
Makes one be on the look out for further Kennedys, Bushes, and Clintons and their counterparts in the Congress. (
CoughBarf, Evan Bayh)I’m sure you won’t mind a bit of editing from an Indiana resident…
Not sure why but strike thru is wonky this morning.
As Om would say, safe travels, safe home. Same goes for all the traveling pups.
I’ve seen nothing for 3 or 4 days now. Will check with Kris in a bit.
Safe travels!
Just under 3 hours, no biggie. Great holiday with kids & grandkids, but looking forward to my own bed.
That looked like a wonderful holiday in the making.
Good for all of you.
I have to tell you something Molly. We don’t have a lot of PT Cruisers in my neck of the woods, but when I do see one, I peek at the driver and imagine it might be you.
(You already knew that I’m a little goofy sometimes.)
Indeed, and his girlfriend and I are teaming up against him, on the sly, to make him get over what’s been keeping him away from me and the rest. She and I had a great little chat about it, and we’re “on it”.
Egypt is the place to keep an eye on. If the military prevails they’ll be back to Mubarak-like dictators. I was listening to an interview with Tariq Ali on Alternative Radio the other day and Tariq said something I’ve not heard from anybody else but I’ve long thought of. The revolutions in the Arab countries have succeeded because the people involved were willing to sacrifice their lives in the struggle. We’ve yet to reach that point in Europe or the US. Until we reach that point it’s going to be nothing but minor variations of the status quo.
Oh, that’s funny. Mine is light blue, so if you see another color it won’t be me. But I wish I was in SoCA today.
A good cause indeed. Here’s hoping.
Demi, I haven’t been here much because of the holiday. How did the birthday party go?
Time for me to do a few things, that include looking for marked down candles. One of my favorite celebrations. Also, that awful music in the stores should be gone. Thanks for the good coffee and company.
She’s a sweet girl. Family’s from South America, originally. Zuniga is a pretty family name.
I got her a Nordstrom gift card, and we have a Nordstrom’s Rack sort of nearby. You know I’m not the shopping kind of gal, but, I suggested we go together. I’ll take a personal risk to my habits, just for my heart’s sake. :)
It was great. I’ll shoot you some photos and tomorrow you can view them and see for yourself. Thanks for asking.
Careful, bad habits form suddenly! Good times.
Good Morning, oldnslow.
That was a pretty interesting comment. You can only imagine what my brain did with it. A dick so big that it obscures one’s vision. I’ll leave it at that.
How come I can’t find a freaking pen that works on my desk? I’ve picked up two that don’t work, a lip liner and an eyeliner.
I’m off today so I don’t have to put on my capitalist cesspool bathing costume.
Cherokee Morning Song
Me too. Trying to decide what to do with the day.
But, you’re wearing something, right?
I don’t now. Perhaps for the same reason I can’t find a cat who will behave herself on my desk?
Got plenty of things I should do but whether or not I do ‘em is a different story. Feel more like sittin’ here and bein’ a slug.
She is a beautiful girl, though. Saw the pix at Caturday. I lurked a little but didn’t have the mojo to speak. I was all talked out. :O Believe it or don’t.
What, you never heard of nekid blogging? *g* Had to put jeans on to feed Sweet Pea in the carport. Wouldn’t want to upset the elderly neighbors.
The mister is reading a story about how the FBI shooting range attracts a good many deer. It’s the safest place for them to be during Hunting Season.
Gee, I have the same problem.
I have heard of, and participated and I almost just told you that we usually only do nekid blogging when it’s over 100. But, you’re the host, you set the standards.
I did sneak out to put out some trash last night in just my pj top and socks. It was dark and the top falls below my butt.
I remember those late evening threads. That was fun.
I don’t! LOL!!
That’s kinda the way I’m leaning to be honest.
My Dad used to say he thought I was vaccinated with a phonograph needle. If I said that to any of my grandkids, they wouldn’t know what I meant.
Just don’t eat Cheetos while blogging nekkid. That can have deleterious effects.
Just sittin’ here thinking of Eureka Springs. Yes, those were fun times.
Also thinking of other firedoggers who have moved on to other things.
Same here.
It is s’posed to warm up abit…as soon as the sun shines (and I dress, of course)Im going to take Angela to the vet….we have had a terrible weekend, and this mornng does not look good. Sorry to be dreary…
Once in a blue moon, it happens.
Neko is still intent on eating the little foam thingy on the end of my mic. What a kitteh!
Speaking of that, has there been a Rayne sighting lately? Anyone?
Remember Pach? I think his family name is Zuniga.
You’re not being dreary to us, you’re just sharing the reality of your world. You think today might be the day?
If it is, I want you to imagine that we’re all with you. You’ll do the right thing at the right time. Just know we all care about you very much.
(((RevBev and Angela))) That’s always hard. It almost makes me not want any more pets but I can’t seem to do that either.
Oh, you found it? I thought Neko ate it. Or pretended to.
(((Bev and Angela))) I am so sorry I know you must be heartbroken. Kind wishes coming your way.
Good morning all slept in late again. Looks like I am getting into a habit.
Not by me. :(
{{{RevBev & Angela}}}
We’ll be thinking about you both.
I do remember Pach. Thanks for the memory.
Check your email. I’m sorry.
You know, that is my thought exactly….This is my third cat….the 2nd one I had just had a short time after my daughter had moved and left her with me….but the 1st and now Angela are devastating….I will have to find another love object, for sure. This is too hard. Angela is not only really cute, she is so loving and receptive….just a nice girl.
I think Rayne left rather abruptly. Dunno why. I think she used to be the mother hen over whatever preceded MyFDL, wasn’t she? She is Asian and I recall her writing about her own views back when that book (or article?) about the “mean” Chinese parents was published.
Thanks to you all…I will let you know…..At least it is to get sunny shortly, so Im waiting…tearfully.
Good morning ’99. Nothing wrong with sleeping in once in a while. The older I get the less I seem to sleep. Although, got 5 solid hrs last night. I think my freind GlenLivett had something to do with that.
We’ll all be thinking of you and Angela with love, RevBev. Please keep us posted.
Thanks…of course. I guess we’ve all been in this place…
Yes he is probably a distant cousin to Jack Daniels who used to visit me a long time ago. I usually don’t sleep well but I guess all the activity with my kid has worn me out.
(((RevBev and Angela))).
Hadn’t figured on crying this morning. Damn.
I found most of it. It was pretty shredded though but she’s still fixated on it.
I just find it troubling. The sudden unexplained disappearances. One of the idiosynchratic oddities of this type of community I can not seem to adjust to.
More times than I care to remember. Just think of the good times Angela has brought you. I know that doesn’t make it easier but sometimes it helps.
I have to live vicariously with everyone else’s kittehs, since three allergic/asthmatic grandkids mean I can’t have them if I ever want the kids to visit. So I lurk at Carurday and stay in touch with my step-kitties here!!
I’m not usually (i.e. never) up this early, I’ve spent the past 45 minutes listening to the Chomsky interview.
He’s omniscient.
Only have a couple of fingers one or two times a year. That said, I actually enjoy it very much. I suppose that’s why I save it for Christmas and my birthday.
Yes, I do too. But it’s a huge community and folks are bound to come and go for different reasons. I have left a couple of blogs because they no longer appeal to me–can’t imagine leaving FDL though.
Me. either….Happened once also with a Yorkie…right at Christmas…there must be a lesson. SD, you have helped us build a wonderful community…Almost an Eden where we can love one another and the creatures….
Well I am off to swim (in a pool) hope everyone has a good day. Since Monday may give you the blues, here is some blues for Monday.
(((Bev and Angela)) I will be thinking of ya both.
Thank you Pop….You were not here when I “inherited” Angela….it’s a pretty good story that I will re-tell one day….She came with so much stuff from her previous owner….We haven’t even used all of it…
Moderation is good but since I could never use moderation I gave it up. *g* Especially now with my condition I feel better.
I agree with you about people leaving for different reasons. And, it’s our curious human nature to want to know Why. I’ve never spent much time on other blogs, but my sense is that the people who come here have rather strong belief systems and sometimes those kinds of people can be tempermental and stubborn, if you know what I mean. It’s hard to put the ego back in the bottle, and maybe personal kabooms here have “scared” some away. I’m just theorizing and I could be completely off track on this.
What can we do for you? Would you like me and CBL to come sit with you? Anything? Say the word and we will do everything in our power to make it happen.
Looking forward to the Angela story. I am a softee when it comes to animals. Why i couldn’t become a vet.
The lesson I’ve learned is to keep at it. I can only save a few but I’m bound and determined to save and love as many as I can. As painful as loss is, and it can be devastating, it doesn’t compare to whatever time we have with them, a time of love and happiness.
That is so kind….the office is very near by, so I can get there….That’s all I know, so please enjoy your time together.
I will keep you up to date, and I still want us to get together..
We’ll wait for better times….Thank you for your offer and concern. B
You! That’s a wonderful offer. I’ve got tears.
Please don’t be shy about reaching out. We will be here a short drive away.
Power to you….the Yorkie and 3 cats all came from someone else due to circumstances….I hope to give us being a “rescuer”, though I certainly agree with you about the love and joy…..However, I may have to join a 12-step program, if you know what I mean…..I am slowly putting on my messy clothes and watching for the sun.
Thank you….the temptation is to meet you….I’ll probably wait for better circumstances….Your kindness is palpable.
I’m pretty sure I never heard the Angela story either, so when you feel up to reminiscing, I’d love to hear.
God love you sweety.
{{{RevBev & Angela}}}
Thanks for opening the Diner this morning, SD. I’ll be back later to see what’s the skinny.
On a slightly different note, I think I found out where all of the Obamabots went after Daily Kos began to *gasp* criticize Obama. They seem to be at TPM. I think I may have to delete that particular shortcut.
Great…I’ll get the wine….
I dumped TPM quite a while ago. Talk about blinders and tunnel vision.
Right? Now tell me, how is it “progressive” to have a majority in the House and (supposedly) a filibuster proof majority in the Senate and in two years only be able to pass the Heritage Foundation’s wet dream version of “health care reform”? When I mention that uncomfortable fact, I get Ben Nelson, Blanche Lincoln and Joe Lieberman thrown into my face but they seem incapable of understanding that those examples support my conclusion that “Democrats” and “Republicans” are virtually identical. And usually it’s in all caps. They are unhinged over there.
We all know that pain. Dreadfully sorry you are having to deal with it now.
It’s uncomfortable to admit what the reality is so rationalize and point fingers.
I also will chime in to point out the evolution of FDL to a non-veal penned
Wobbly organization.
We’ve gone from new and better democrats to Marxist philosophy.
Hell I can remember when ghost 911 was practically laughed off this blog to becoming a seriosly discussed writer.(just as an example)
{{{RevBev & Angela}}}
Thoughts are with you .
Indeed, there has been a palpable evolution. I used to get in lots of trouble here, under a previous incarnation, for being ahead of the curve in seeing that it was a waste of time to play the Dem team game. And for suggesting that discussion and analysis of more militant philosophies and tactics were in order. Now, everyone is on board with Occupy. Definite progress, albeit it was personally difficult to abide what seemed like a too-slow coming around. But people are slow to change viewpoints that they have previously taken a stand on. Human nature. But, it’s good to see even slow evolution. It seems to me that the next serious discussion will have to be about how “pure” a people’s revolution must and should be.
BTW, does anyone have any current news/info about DW Bartoo? I sure am missing that man. He hasn’t posted anything since early December.
I think ghost also decided to soft-pedal the conspiracy theories in the interests of comity, and is really quite an intelligent commenter otherwise.
I haven’t seen him either, although I didn’t remember that it had been that long. Did he mention taking a break?
In my classroom I question everything. On the blog I am less an arguer than a conciliator.
I have paid professionally for my ahead of the curve pronouncements and sometimes feel the need to lie low in these xenophobic times.
I read “Das Kapital” in grade school, Trotsky in high school.
I’m very much an “autodidact” like Sothern Dragon and eCAHN. Gotten me in a lot of trouble challenging “comfortable dogma”, but I say waht I think!
It is true that the politics of this site have changed.
To some extent this change might be attributable to evolution. Another significant aspect of it is that a good number of people have left. I was startled the other day when I checked out the site numbers from December 2010 as compared to December 2011.
I always find your comments worth reading, I recognize you as one who, like me, trusts his own thought process enough to follow wherever it leads. That practically guarantees being something of an outlier at any particular moment.
IIRC he said he was taking a break to work on something and I’ve seen other commenters who said they thought it was a writing project of some sort. I’d sure like to read whatever it is cuz he’s a great writer.
Thanks RC,
I learn alot at this site and so leave my slow typing thoughts to EPU land.
Definitely evolving. It’s moved from center-left to left and radical left, to use outmoded but convenient labels. The dogmatic Obama and Democratic Party supporters have bailed for the most part. The Lake is looking more and more at the system and issues. Obama and the Democrats not only maintaining the status quo but strengthening it caused a seismic shock.
Agreed!
I absolutely adore his whimsical writing style, and his beautiful soul. I detected some negative feelings from him re the site, so I am worried that he may have left us, and would sorely regret not having established a personal avenue for maintaining contact with him. There was some mention of the mayoral election holding some interest for him, not sure if that was serious or in jest. ?
Good mornin, Lakers
I hope all your Christmas wishes came through…well most of them anyway.
I got up late today after “working” yesterday feeding 24 people Christmas fritattas. Some didn’t even like that; eggs scrambled, if you please!
Oh well…
Hmmm, the spell check know not of frittatas. It suggests “irritate”! LOL!
Gets worse if you are a professional autodidact!
I certainly hope he hasn’t left us.
I just let the negativity flow by. I/we can’t agree with everybody all the time nor can I/we please everybody. I just have to take in stride. People are testy and with good reason.
As I see it, over the past several months the Overton Window has been nudged leftward. I give the OWS considerable credit for this.
But, generally speaking, in terms of the nation’s politics, there has been no dramatic shift.
Too soon to measure accurately. This is not the Arab countries. There aren’t enough people paying attention to what’s going on around them. It’s going to be a slow process but Occupy has been a primer to turn the apathetic into a populist movement, with its emphasis being to change the system, not just the functionaries who make it
workfunction.during the health care reform push here at fdl, i about went crazy. it was a lot of effort to push a compromise instead of pushing for what was really necessary: single payer. i’m very glad to see we’ve gotten more to the left. it’s way more where my comfort zone is.
For sure I haven’t visited that site in a year and a half. i still say many people will come here when they finally realize the truth about Obama.
Good morning RC you are correct it is a slow evolution. It took me almost 55 years to realize it. Everyone progresses at their own pace. The main thing is that thy discover the truth before it’s too late. I think that awakening is happening. Happy holidaise to you my friend.
That was quite the learning experience. IMO theoretically, and simplistically, it came down to supporting what was supposedly possible versus what was impossible. When the final bill emerged there was a shift to not support what some thought was possible. I was embarrassed having initially supporting what was possible then having it turn out to be a piece of shit. We lost some of the single payer advocates and that’s truly unfortunate. In hindsight, we should have supported single payer to the bitter end. We’ve grown and learned.
PS…For who ever checks back…Angela and I are home….Vet gave us alot of food that she may be able to manage…we’ll see…and live around for a few more days. If need be, she can see her own vet later in the week. Right now she is resting from all the indignities…but alert. Will eat again shortly. Thanks for all the generous and caring hearts….and the Sun is out.
Wow, that’s wonderful. Every day is a blessing.
*happy dance!!*
(((RevBev and Angelia)))
Good news so far she is lucky to have a caring person such as yourself to look after her. Sending good wishes to you.
Same here. Whenever I do a “reality check,” it always turns out that there is no better place than this to learn and have quality interactions with people I can respect and care about. We don’t all have to be identical to be valuable.
Thanks….I feel really lucky we oould get there…he does emergency clinic stuff and I had talked to him a long time on Sat when I could not get there b/c I was working….He was very attentive…cleaned her up and saw how alert she still is….What a funny girl. Thanks for walking the walk….
That’s great to hear. Enjoy every precious moment you can get.
Much love to you and Angela. It often does make difficult things easier to bear when the sun’s out.
I don’t last long at other “progressive” blogs. Had one site ban me after 1 comment. Not too shabby.
I guess I don’t belong here. Perhaps that’s why many people leave.
Enjoy the rest of your holidays!
What’s that supposed to mean?
It’s very easy to get carried away with the bit about being “willing to sacrifice their lives in the struggle.” In the US it reeks of that 1848 Les Miserables hubris. I remember very clearly the deep disappointment among a whole bunch in my generation when they had their 31st birthday and were still alive. It can also lead to a suicidal and defeating one-upsmanship.
Because it requires taking a serious accounting of the strategic value of losing one’s life at a particular moment. You know the movement in the US is not there yet because it takes a Christmas holiday. This is not a moralistic statement; it’s a strategic observation. You only knew Tunisia was there when it was clearly that the self-immolation of a fruit-seller had produced a huge popular response. And in Egypt, you only knew when a month after the security police had killed a teenager there were people camped in Tahrir Square and sleeping under tank treads to prevent the tanks from moving. Indeed, that told you about what their reading of the situation of the Egyptian armed forces was. Most of the martyrs did not necessarily act in a way that would get them killed. But by being where they were they were at increased risk.
My reading of the strategic situation of the movement in the US is that there could be a hundred people killed and the machine would go on. That is because the movement while growing fast has not reached a size in which people would be touched by what happened to a member of their personal network. Nor has the movement reached a size where large numbers of the police and military have members of their personal networks affected by the repression of the Occupy movement here.
At the moment, my sense is that the main enemy of the movement is impatience. A popular movement of 100-150 million US adults is going to take a while to evolve. It’s going to take time for sympathetic people to move to support, for support to move to participation. There are lots of levels of fear that must be worked through before severe repression evokes a severe backlash. Which is why the “you’ve had your fun, now go home” form of repressive tolerance has worked so well in the US. It’s going to take time for folks used to this attitude to draw enough of a response to force folks to face their fears. In contrast, the Arab republican monarchs were on a hair-trigger for dissent and suppressed it quickly, aggressively, and as thoroughly as they could.
That said, the movement in the US already has martyrs. Most were the homeless who came into an Occupy camp for food, shelter, and stayed. And instead of likely dying on the street, died in an Occupy camp. And whose deaths often became the excuse for evicting the encampment. The stories of what happen to those martyrs resonates with a wide range of ordinary people because the invisible became visible and the motives of the government were transparently aimed at keeping the homeless invisible–or evicting them to somewhere else.
Continuing to learn and grow is more important than the pace at which one does so, although, real world, both can be pretty important. Occupy holds great potential as a catalyst to speed up the process, IMO. Looking forward (why do those words now make me feel guilty lol) to an interesting new year. Hugs and best wishes to you and yours, popyeye.
I don’t think so. Try again. *g*
Sorrows shared are halved. Joys shared, doubled.
Hear the good news…we are not alone.
I must have missed something.
Starbuck, are you alright?
I have learned so much quicker being here and reading than any other place. You have always treated me with respect and I have learned from you. Yes OWS has sped up the process and spring is around the corner. Thanks for the holiday wishes.
LOL Same here. Glenn and the Rude Pundit are the only other political places that get regular visits from me.
See my 141
Where is that coming from?
What’s up, sweetheart? Would you share what it is that’s on your mind?
((((Starbuck)))))
It might be more comfortable to hang out with people who only agree with you. I find that I learn more when I hang with a crowd that sometimes has different opinions. And, heck, we’re not dead yet, we can always learn.
I remember years ago, people here were talking about Taking It To The Streets, revolution and I couldn’t wrap my head around that idea. It just seemed impossible. But, I stayed and learned a few things, to say the least.
Now, we have revolution in the air and people are in the streets. I was wrong before, and I’m glad I was.
I have been here since before FDL was FDL. In fact, since the site was held by someone who turned it over to Jane and Christie, asking that his readers stay with them because it would be a good site.
Most of the time my comments have been ignored if they were too far ahead of the CW. There was a time that those of us, including Ghostof911, were attacked as nuts for not believing the official 9/11 story. In fact, those diaries were encouraged not to be published. It was not as bad as Mahablog or some others, however. Eventually, I think, most of you will become less antipathetic toward my view of 9/11 as you think about it. After all, the official government story is a conspiracy theory.
I was one of the first here to make disparaging comments toward 0 and point out that he was a continuation of w’s policies of crushing the middle class. I was not joined by very many for quite awhile, but now I’m pretty main stream in that regard. I did give up on TPM, Digby, DU, and even Eric Alterman.
Remember this site was originally trying to work inside the dim system to bring about reform. Jane worked to get Ned Lamont to win the dim primary in 2006. When the ptb in the dim party supported LIEberman anyway, a light seemed to turn on for Jane and the direction of this blog.
Of course I don’t agree with everyone on everything, but the depth of analysis here is so much better than the paid
shills, er, pundits in print and broadcasting. Mostly, I do agree with the commenters here. I do read Somerby for his analysis of the not-too-bright that have the various outlets.Can you say anything more about the pre-Jane and Christy? I didn’t know there was such a thing.
RevBev, so far good news. Perhaps it will turn out to be great news. (((RevBev & Angela)))
If we all agreed on everything we wouldn’t learn much here. Very good analysis of things. I know as far as myself is concerned sometimes I am hesitant to make comments and sometimes when I do they are ignored as well. But as I have learned there are many lurkers here and you never know how your words affect people and their beliefs. Just my 2 cents.
Of all the places to drop a turd bomb. That’s highly frowned upon here. I just hope the health department doesn’t swing by for a spot check.
(((Southern Dragon)))
I don’t know that people are so much “ignored” as other commenters just don’t feel the need to respond to every comment. I get those feelings when I think nobody paid attention to something I wrote but that “not everything I write is gonna get commented on” reality lands.
It’s also that there are topics broached here that many don’t have any knowledge of. I know I’m not comfortable commenting on something I don’t know anything about. I’m more likely to go off and get some basic knowledge of the subject before I engage.
Huh? *g*
We’ll hope…This has overtaken the whole weekend, so this for now is a great relief….she looks comfortable and alert. Yes, a gift. Thanks.
That’s true and I guess “ignored” wasn’t the correct word. I don’t comment on things that I am not informed on which is most of the time. LOL
Before Jane and Christy the site was run by a man. It was a small blog with just a small group. I don’t even remember how I got to it, probably through a link. I thought it was somewhat interesting, so I read it fairly regularly. I don’t even remember the main thrust of his views, if there was something driving him. Shortly after I was visiting the blog, maybe a couple of months, he announced that he was giving it up, but that two women were going to take it over, one (ReddHedd) was in WV and the other (Jane) was on the west coast (I think that she was in Oregon). He told his readers to give them a chance and the readers would be well rewarded. I think many did stay, and the site quickly blossomed.
As you may know it has morphed several times and many people have come and gone (for one reason or another) to make it into what it is now. I have scouted around and no other real interactive blog can touch it for real analysis and involvement of the readership. I don’t have to be around only like minded people to be comfortable, but it is hard to be around dogmatically closed minded people. Here I can learn and reevaluate my views. At a closed minded place, I only learn how set they are in their ideology and opposition to a range of facts.
Good news. *positive thoughts*.
We’ll just tell the inspector this is a non-profit. I think they’ll be a little more lenient.
(I’ll just run into the storage room and at least throw away the used rat and mouse traps.)
Bear!
Here I can learn and reevaluate my views.
That, my friend, is the money quote.
SD’s not the only one going “huh?’. what you just said has now mystified me even more.
No quibbles from me. Regardless of what anyone else has said or will say. I could never understand, what with all the “discrepancies”, how anyone who was looking at the issues couldn’t at least be unsure.
Sorry, greenie. You know what dropping a turd bomb is, don’t you? When someone jumps in and says something inflammatory and then runs away without an explanation. That’s what I thought Starbuck did.
And, you get the whole health inspector at the Diner thing, I hope.
Didn’t mean to be so mysterious. Sorry.
Thanks…my dau. had connected me very near end of the Libby trial…did not know that background.
Thanks…we’ll take it. She had quite a going-over at the vet, so she is definitely resting.
That’s a relief. I thought I had gotten into the Electric Kool-Aid or something.
Maybe I’m weirder than I realized. But, I think you, in particular, can handle me.
Gotta run a few errands, but I hope to swing by later.
I don’t there are many critical thinkers who believe the official story. We all have some very serious questions. The problem comes when theories that can’t be proven, more speculation than anything else, enter the picture.
Wha? SD got banned on another site after 1 comment?!?! Some fool must have recommended declawing a cat to save his furniture or something to elicit a ban-worthy response.
The reason I chose ‘ignored’ was because when I first started to criticize 0, nobody else was doing so. The thrust was toward how he was playing ‘eleventy dimension’ chess and it was obvious how he was setting up the repugs for a fall when he moved in for checkmate. I said that was an incorrect argument, but nobody responded to it, not even to say nasty things to me; the commenters kept talking about eleventy dimensional chess. Then, as reality began to sink in, the conversation changed and moved to what it is now.
Another way the site has changed is in regard to 9/11. There were several of us who did not see the official 9/11 story as true. We were attacked in that instance. Jane did say that she did not want this to become an all 9/11 all the time site. There were several diaries written and a couple of people wrote them or responded. Ghostof911 has always been a very insightful commenter, but he was dismissed because he mostly dealt with 9/11. He was gone for awhile, but since he is back and commenting about other stories, he is seen as insightful. Usually my comments on the same topics received few or no responses. In a way, its OK, because I was never banned, but I have the feeling that some of the others on the topic were. Most important for me is a place to state my case, ignored or not, and, maybe, the seed is planted.
Actually it was about Osterity and da Vichycrats.
But your scenario would have drawn a flamer, that’s fer shure, fer shure.
Wow. You’re an original Original Firebagger. What year was the blog done by a guy and what was the name of the blog?
I just returned to read the EPU discussions and agree that our differences make us strong particularly when we know each other enuf to “push the envelope” without being put down.
Oftentimes someone lays out a provacative comment just to invite the discussion that covers many aspacts of the question and invites each professional learner here to “color” the discussion.
I rarely get that quality and compassion elsewhere but in the classroom, where today’s young people teach me not to give up hope.
Thanks for the discussion today. This autodidact just got re-energized!*g*
It is interesting that Starbuck is a newbie commenter and after dropping his bomb has not returned to clarify. I don’t recall that anyone had anything bad to say to him that would have caused such a move by him.
O,Probably not….
Good, thanks…looks like the other autodidact got pissed and we don’t know why.
Sheesh, it’s 1:30. Need to get off my dead ass and get some stuff done. Sita wants to take a nap on the keyboard anyhow.
Be good to yourselves, and all other living things.
Namaste
Never. Give. Up.
I have my own view of 9/11 and though I have never commented about it is because it would be speculation on my part. My view is if you have an argument lay it out with facts/links and if people don’t agree that it is okay.
Maybe people don’t respond because they aren’t informed enough. Who knows but I learn a lot here by reading the links that people post and then if there is a preponderance of evidence I adopt that view until someone can show me different. I think you are very insightful to the issues and I do try to read what you post as with others with a critical eye as much as I am able. *g*
When information is controlled so tightly as it has been since Cheney, what can thinking people do but speculate? Reasoned speculation is good. I’ve never understood the vitriol hurled at speculation around here. If a statement can be disproven, I’d much rather see a thoughtful rebuttal of the ideas than someone’s comment utterly dismissed.
BearCountry,
I have thoroughly enjoyed reading your thoughts today.
I am flattered that you chose to extend a “friend ” invite a long time ago.
Proud to call you friend.
Starbuck has been at the Lake for years, IIRC, but has Been around a lot more lately.
Have a great day SD. I read the introduction to my Tao book and it started making a little bit of sense to me. Shit it could be an awakening. *g*
Later, SD. Scritches to the kittehs from me.
Well, I really can’t remember the name of the blog or the person that ran it. Jane was the one that changed the name to FireDogLake. She started working to promote Ned Lamont in the 2006 dim primary. The blog as FDL had been in existence for at least a year, so I guess that I slid over from the original in late 2004 or very early 2005. I am a little fuzzy on the dates because FDL was not FDL yet; it was just a small blog among several that I was reading at the time. Real research by me might turn up some dates. I wish that Jane could take the time to outline the history of FDL.
Early on, ReddHedd got more TV time (mostly Washington Journal) than Jane. The good thing about the two women was that they were (and are) very sharp thinkers. They both can point out to someone how they are right and the other person is wrong without being as confrontational as manhy are.
Now it all becomes clear. Thanks for the explanation.
I’m not sure what Starbuck was doing, but I’d bend over backwards to give him the benefit of the doubt until I know more. I’d very much like to know what was on his mind at the moment.
What do you teach?
That is exciting,,,,,Continue to share….
He’s not a newbie at all. He’s been around quite a while.
Wow, I don’t remember Starbuck before a very recent comment. Anyway, he should have clarified.
Redd is doing well. I left a Christmas message on her blog and got a gracious reply.
Her PUAC blogs on Saturday morning got me to delurk.
I miss her writings on children’s issues.
Are you involved in Children’s issues?
There’s nothing wrong with reasoned speculation. The hard-core Truthers are so called because their argument is that if you don’t have a better explanation than they do then theirs is the truth. That’s my problem. I think we’re all aware of the theories out there. I personally don’t have any desire to rehash them. We could have a thread of 4-500 comments and what would we have accomplished? Would we be any closer to the truth?
That is good news.
“Would we be any closer to the truth?”
Well now, ya never know. Who knows who would provide what links or what theories and where the crowd sourcing might bring us? And, I am not personally going to start that thread.
Very like the JFK debate….many theories, but I am not sure anything has ever been established, much less beyond a reasonable doubt, so to speak.
I have taught humanities, literature, history,law, business management, government, criminology, anthropology, ethics, and religion at the college level.
I am presently a substitute teacher and Mr. Mom to three children while my wife completes her undergrad degree. Go figure*g*
I’m gonna guess he took offense to the site being described as no longer being about Obama and Dem Party supporters. Just a guess, he was a regular here back when the site was all about helping the Dem Party win.
Heh, I’m prolly not even going to read that thread. However…judiciously sprinkled bits of reasoned speculation in a thread are provocative and add to the conversation, IMO.
You have the hardest job on the planet.
I appreciate all of the kind responses that I have gotten today. I would like to be friends with all, but I’m very remiss about checking my ‘notifications.’ I am actually in awe of the intellectual firepower here and the activity of those that come here.
I did see something along the line of intellectual progressives really don’t want to deal with the poor and homeless. I think here there is a connection between the two. My stepfather’s father drove a garbage truck, and one of the proudest days of my life was the time I got to go with him on his route. My grandfather wasn’t poor, but that is not generally a ‘glamorous’ job, and is usually equated with poor and homeless.
My best to you and Angela.
As as a parent and educator of 34 years I have watched the American Dream slip away for millions of Americans and the children suffer the most.
It does not have to be this way!
I think a little speculation has to be OK, because we can be sure that an effort is made to keep secret any important facts that embarrass. As long as the speculation fits with the known fact pattern, and especially if it is not contradicted by the known fact pattern, then it has its place in legitimate discussion, IMO.
Speculation is part of curiosity. In the current discussion my comments about speculation are directed only to 9/11 theories/speculation, not speculation in general. We’ve speculated why Starbuck abruptly split.
Wow, what a broad range of subjects.
I hope you’re enjoying your current work!
Understood. My comment was meant as a general one.
I know it’s late, but has anyone seen Edward Teller around lately?
He writes diaries.
Ah Ha! It’s such a pleasure to hear your voice J.
You speak from a what I perceive is a great perspective.
Fun, ain’t it?
Me too. And, I believe others want to know too.
I’ve heard several voices wondering where and why people have left The Lake.
There are also voices here who lift up Lurkers who whatever their own reasons are, don’t add to the choir of souls here.
Whatcha gonna do?
PS I didn’t hear anything offensive to bring on that outburst.
gw I meant to add, “either”. We just can never know what some one else is going through. Right?
Oh, so glad to hear that! Did you need to go to an emergency clinic? Since you mention seeing her own vet later.
I am glad that today won’t be “the day.” I wanted to ask yesterday,but hoped that your not mentioning any troubles might mean she was doing all right.
I feel almost like I know Angela myself, from your lovely descriptions. Wishing you a restful and peaceful week with your dear friend.
We’ll be glad to serve as a twelve-step program for you…well, we’re more likely to encourage the addiction, I suppose.
For example, the two feral kitties I’m feeding are enjoying the absence of neighbors to bask in the sun (finally!) on the patio right now. So if you want to avoid adopting another, perhaps you do need someone else than us. ; )
thanks demi,
You among others have inspired me take a few more “public” risks.
Ha! What’s gonna happen? Are we gonna get sued?
The great thing about being accepted in a group is that we can be inspired to take risks once in a while, without the fear of Judgement.
It’s all good. In this moment, instant. Godmind.
And there, of course, is part of why we must defeat SOPA…although I guess the effect would be the opposite.
If one of us said something considered offensive to certain powerful folks or companies they could demand that FDL be taken down, and it could be, immediately, no hearing, no trial, no charges, no nothing. That’s the extreme danger of SOPA, and why it’s often described as “would destroy the Internet.” As we know it, anyway.
Thanks for bringing that up.
Must nap now. It’s imperative.
Laterz.
Thanks…Hysterical…yes, an emergency clinic that is really quite near by. The other is way out north so this was verrrry lucky. Will see/talk to our vet this week, depending on how it all goes. She is a cute and kind cat….Im glad you can “see” that….
Enjoy your nap, demi.
My tigers are engaging in naps right now themselves. I’m resisting…I slept nine hours, it’s a gorgeous day, and there’s plenty of stuff to do. Napping seems borng! (But I wasn’t traveling, visiting, preparing huge meals for relatives, etc. etc. yesterday or leading up to it.)
I did make some soup from scratch, using a “Cook’s Illustrated” recipe for the first time. Turned out I was out of bay leaves (how did I allow that to happen?), but it came out quite tasty anyway. I managed to cut a finger while chopping potatoes…there was so much chopping my hand aches this morning (I guess if I had a younger generation, I would have to turn over the holiday prep now, if one dish did that!). No great harm done.
I will if I continue to understand beyond the introduction LOL. SD knows more about this subject than I ever will but I can relate what it means to me. *g*
I am a Mr. Mom to an 8 year old and I am here to say kudos to the women (and men) who raise children as well as work. They deserve CEO pay cause it’s not easy. *g*
Thanks for your care about Angela and for the information….much earlier in a different career, I did quite abit of child focused work….abuse, mental health, etc. I have occ regretted that I did not remain there, although in my hospital worship, 2 of my services are with kids, and I love that. So many struggles for kids these days, as you say.
Oh, Jeez. It’s not that hard and it’s not rocket science either.
Some good news on the SOPA front, because bloggers have threatened to change from Go Daddy to other vendors Go Daddy has dropped it’s support of SOPA. I don’t have a link handy but can find it if you need it. I read about it a few days ago.
demi, I think it may be easier for some than others…but we can surely agree that it is much, much more important than our society treats it as being.
No, thanks, I read about it, too. Pretty funny, actually, don’cha think? Hit ‘em in the pocket…The articles I read about the GoDaddy owner/founder characterized him as basically an old-school business type who really understands little about how the internet works.
But he sure got it when the customers started dropping his company in droves!
Well I guess for me it’s hard and most men have a hard time with it. It was a compliment to all those who do it. :)
Ya think! LOL Money talks and that’s all these PTB understand.
It was very hard for me also. I had not been around chldren, in a bad marriage, a hateful mother-in-law who made certain to remind me that I did not know what I was doing….My blessing was a lovely and winsome and healthy daughter, but I myself was too young and too ignorant. And not ready. Plus, it may not be rocket science, but it ain’t easy, imho.
I don’t think you are ever ready it for it. You learn as you go along I think. *g*
That’s certainly what we hope….
re: not ever “ready:” yeah, prolly one reason I have no kids was that I never felt like I was ready…
I read an op=ed once in the ’70′s by, I think, Margaret Drabble, who wrote that she was glad she was just a little bit too old to be part of the generation for whom effective birth control was a given, because that meant you had to choose, affirmatively, to have each child. In her generation (although the diaphragm certainly existed, I think most women thought it didn’t work well), they pretty much just let it happen. She said she wasn’t sure she would ever have been able to make the decision TO have a child, and probably would have never had them.
That resonated with me. I didn’t think I’d be a good mother, and in my twenties, I think that was probably very true. Later, my health would have meant either work or children; I couldn’t have managed both, and my income was necessary. I’m not sorry not to have screwed up another generation of my family, but wonder some if not having to make that affirmative choice would have made a better life, after all.
Dunno. Can’t know.
Anyway, I admire those who’ve chosen it and done a good job with it.
They change your life that is for sure. I think it would be a better society if people would think as you have done whether or not to bring a child into this world. It is the biggest decision one can make IMHO. Every parent I have talked to says they didn’t think they would make a good parent. All I know it’s like a marriage you have to work at it. I think you would make a good parent btw. *g*
That’s sweet. I’d probably be a better parent now than 30 years ago. But now I really, really don’t have the energy for it!
I started to say something similar…I think the age factor is very important…those who wait a few years have resolved/done somethings/taken care of other interests, maybe then can really be a devoted parent.
Wow, I came back to check in with RevBev and Angela after a day of grandkids, birthday shopping with daughter, and the drive back to South Bend, and the comments grew by 100+ and the topics wandered all over.
Sorry it is really EPU land now, although I have replies to several comments in my head.
Hugs to RevBev and a teensy virtual kiss on top of Angela’s furry head. See ya all tomorrow.
(((My own bed!)))
And I don’t think Starbuck left us. Commented later in the day on another thread. Prolly just a drive-by and didn’t come back to see the confusion.