Punk rock dads facing the challenges of being, well, punk rock dads are the subject of tonight’s movie The Other F Word, directed and written by Andrea Blaugrund Nevins and produced by Cristan Reilly. It’s hard enough to be a parent these days, but punk rock papas face a unique set of challenges as they walk the pater-path.
In interviews with over twenty fathers involved in punk rock –as well as pro skating and BMX riding, sports which have been heavily influenced by punk culture–the filmmakers have crafted portraits of men whose own childhoods were not exactly perfect (absentee and abusive fathers/parents are a prevailing theme), and are attempting to be better fathers to their own kids, to heal themselves through parenting.
Some of the challenges are humorous: Having to explain tattoos of dominatrixes to your kids, coping with F-bombs and farts, dealing with school officials and other parents when you don’t exactly fit the norm of Ward Cleaver (though funnily enough, a lot of the families in The Other F-Word do have that dreaded symbol of suburbia, the minivan)–when Rancid’s Lars Fredriksen, heavily tattooed and dressed in well, punk rock casual wear, saunters to the park with his kid all the other families bail.
Some challenges are painful: The death of one’s child and friends, and touring almost a third of the year. The stress of touring becomes more and more evident for Pennywise’s frontman Jim Lindberg, father of three girls, as he misses important milestones in his daughters’ lives. His story mirrors the many of the conflicts fathers–punk or otherwise–feel as they struggle to make a living and give their kids more than what they had, emotionally and materially, especially when making that living takes them away from home for long periods of time.
The Other F-Word also takes us through the a personalized history of punk rock through the eyes of the musicians, putting their fatherhood in stark contrast to what some would call a misspent youth. But was it misspent? These men gained insight and maturity through their (mis)adventures, and their lifestyle gave them perspective and interpersonal skills that helped to shape their parenting abilities and give their kids a firmer foundation than they themselves had.
Though several do remark that they can at times hear their fathers’ voices when they interact with their offspring–and the guys get that it is kinda funny to see anti-authoritarian guys become that symbol of mega-authority: Dad.



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Hello Andrea and Cristan. Welcome to Firedoglake Movie Night and thank you for being here tonight!
Hi Lisa! Glad to be here.
hi LIsa! thanks so much for having us!
Good evening Andrea and Cristan, thanks for being here. I sooo loved this movie, being a SoCal child of divorce, punk rocker and having friends who are dads.
oops-need to be more careful with my caps/no caps :)
What got you started on making The Other F-Word?
I’m so glad you loved it. It was a labor of love!
i think there are a lot of people with very similar backgrounds to yours!
No wories, no caps is fine. all caps…well maybe not so much :-)
When Cristan brought Jim’s book to me, my youngest (of 3) kids was 2.5, and I was just starting to think about taking on a new documentary, having spent 10 years parenting. I thought, what better way to tell a story of parenting, and the sea change that happens in your life, than through this very extreme lens.
i had known Jim Lindberg in high school and heard he had written a book called “Punk Rock Dad”…knowing Jim and his way of looking at the world-i knew it would be good and i was right. I gave the book to Andrea, only wanting to go forward with the documentary if she was interested and thankfully, she was!
Welcome to the Lake
I must say it is a bit unnerving when you open your mouth and out comes one of the parents
Thanks for having us here. Yes, the parenthood thing can be a bit unnerving, no?
Do you think the skilss necessary to keep a band together, to live on the road, and all the goes with punk rock helped these guys become good dads–especially give the rough childhoods some of them had?
thanks Elliot!
and totally agree…i think the one that stops me in my tracks every time i hear myself say it is “Because I said so!”
I hate to betray my ignorance, but what is the other F-word? First one that came to mind was F—-t. Next was freak, but how did that become an F-word? (Hell, applies to about half the GOP presidential candidates.)
What am I missing?
Is is father? If so, I don’t get the need to conceal it.
i do! Jimmy has said that it is all about the management of bodily fluids and how you do LOTS of that on the road which really helps prepare you for parenthood…
I think these guys were pretty thoughtful to begin with, and certainly learned from their life experiences, which included time on the road. They know things can be messy, and being a parent is messy.
HAHA!! well….its Fatherhood. :)
In this case, it’s Fatherhood, and how punk rock muscians cope with being the ulitmate family authority figure when all their lives they have been anti-authoritarian. However there are some farts and possibly depending on your perspective, some freaks, in the film (though to me all the dads were really normal)
We could have called the movie “Fatherhood,” but thought that wouldn’t have conveyed the punkness of the movie. Since our guys USE the F-bomb as emphasis between every other word, we thought it was amusing that now they had to grapple with this “other” f-word.
LOL, truly form what I understand about kids, they do pee, poop, spit and spew a bit. As do bands…
What I’d be more inclined to wonder about is how (and how long) any of these guys stay married fathers? Doesn’t marrying a male rock star carry the implicit, if not explicit, reality that they’re going to get their eyes fucked out on the road by groupies right and left? Rock musicians must surpass even professional athletes and movie stars in the “great career to get laid” category. Hell, even some of the roadies get laid!
and from what we understand about bands, the same does apply….
When you started making The Other F-Word, did you have any idea that Jim was moving towards quitting Pennywise–?
We knew that he was starting to feel very uncomfortable in his dual roles. He was thinking that something had to give. We weren’t sure how that would play out, and, in fact, really thought our conclusion was going to be that he just figured out how to be there for his kids big life events.
Instead, just as he was finishing his tour, it became clear that he was at a breaking point. So we kept filming.
We decided that was a path/story/road that we did not want to take as it would have taken a whole other movie to tell! Also, as two moms we are aware of the many wonderful stories about the many wonderful moms out there and frankly, we were much more interested in exploring the “Fatherhood” of it all….
sorry-my last answer was to Beachpopulists question…
Jim has been married for over 20 yrs. Some of the musicians are married, some are on second marriages, or live with their girlfriends, some are single. All are dads.
I have another question: If punk-rockers are anti-authority, how does anybody know? I mean, how can you hear the lyrics over the volume? Or do they just go on-line and read the lyrics? At least with the rockers of my youthful rebellion period — late 50′s ‘s through early 70′s — you could hear and understand the words that made your parents and other authority figures cringe.
(That’s opposed to the music of my no-longer-youthful, on-going rebellion period.)
As a technical note, there is a “Reply” button in the lower right hand of each comment. Pressing the “Reply” will pre-fill the commenter name and number you are replying to and helps for everyone in following the conversation.
someone we interviewed said that they thought punk rockers were the smartest kids in the room-they really had to go out and find it, seek it out- it was not easy to get the music, which was intentional. so i guess they figured out a way in their underground sub-culture to pass the lyrics around.
and now you can pretty much get any lyrics online.
Hugs to you Bev. And, thanks to you and Lisa for this. This is fun stuff!
As a sometimes writer and actor, my room mate and I had quite a parade of interesting people parade through our house when my kids were little. They loved it! It was one of their first lessons in non-judgementalism.
also, back in the olden days, when there were record albums, lyrics came printed either on an sert sheet on on the album cover. And unlike with CDs, you didn’t need a magnifying glass to read ‘em.
Yes. We did find that, although most of the kids of the punkers we interviewed were still small, the older ones were quite open-minded. I love for kids to see as much as possible in the world.
That’s one thing that comes out in The Other F-Word, the dads point put that since they aren’t “normal looking” thier kids leanr to judge beyond appearance. (And then all the “normal” parents bail from the park asthe tattooed poppa rolls up with his kid!)
It was one of the reasons that they defined themselves by look early on. As sort of a test — will you accept me like this? Many of them have stories of getting beaten up for having green hair, and yet, also finding a new kind of community, a new family, because they could spot members of their tribe.
All those years ago, I bought the Everclear CD just for the song “Father of Mine”. It was so real.
that is really one of the best messages to take away from this movie-my own (staunchly conservative!) dad said that by the end of the movie, he no longer saw the tattoos and the piercings…just men who wanted to be good dads.
and that was the most important takeaway for us….break down the stereotypes of people that many would cross the street to avoid….and now see them as just like all the rest of us wanting to do right by our children.
Totally. When you dressed that way, you knew who Your People were. And odds are you’d probably have more stuff in common with them that with the sqaures.
This might be OT, cause he was not a punker, but we had a friend, Doc, who was the rhythm guitar player with the mamas and papas, and you know why they called him doc. He had the black bag. Anyway, he would show up on our doorstep a couple times a year and crash there for awhile. He was the bestest with the kids and they loved him dearly.
Not to mention the music we made!
I had no idea how true the lyrics in Art’s song (Father of Mine) really were, until I sat and asked him questions about his childhood. When I asked him to sing the song acoustically, I also never thought it would feel so raw. He is an amazing man who has taken quite a journey. It was really an honor for him to share it with us as openly as he did.
Sounds like an interesting moment.
Yes. Jack Grisham talks about that specifically: pulling over to talk to someone who had purple hair, and, although he didn’t know him at all, there was an instant kinship.
rock on!!!
peas!
As was said earlier, it’s great for the kiddies to experience various aspects of life and specifically various type of people.
When it’s in an artistic atmosphere, where you get radical people, it’s a wonderful education.
Show them the world is their oyster and they can be whatever they want.
I love that Jack was so comfortable in his clothes that he went to visit the principla at his daughter’s school wearing a shirt that read “F*** the Police”
Were all the punk bands and sports personalities in the LA area or did you have to travel around the country to get all of the interviews?
I know. They all still find it amusing that they stand out. They’ve all been doing it for so long :-)
some may call it comfortable, some may call it oblivious…..!
Experiences that they would never get in school, and an introduction to the “arts”.
How long were you filming?
We travelled. Ron Reyes, of Black Flag, was in Vancouver, BC. Lars and Matt from Rancid, as well as Fat Mike from NOFX were in San Francisco. Art (Everclear), at the time, was living in Portland, OR. And Tim McIlrath is in Chicago.
We didn’t really cover the east coast scene, though. Borne of a slightly different time and ethos. We were also following Jim’s lead. He was our “gateway drug.” And at a certain point, we also had to just STOP. We could have filmed for years!
18 months. Then 18 months of editing.
My daughter performed on stage, singing dancing and she and I did flute duets, and although she doesn’t do any of that now, at 28, living in DC, she learned a great deal about tolerance and also self confidence.
Also, did any of the fathers go into being a single dad at all–I know that some of them were divorced at some point while raising their kids, but that didn;t really seem to get touched on in the final film…
Which 18 months did you prefer, or did you enjoy both aspects equally?
Interesting question. Dad’s did talk about it, but we knew if we tried to cover each guys situation, it would have gotten very confusing for the audience. They all had/have very different relationships with the women who bore their children. Again, we had to make choices in order to keep our film at a reasonable length.
for me, as this was my first documentary, i found the entire process (including this part of it!) fascinating and very rewarding. i loved watching Andrea shape the story, creating a beginning, middle and end from 180 hours of footage.
there are DEFINITELY some things i would/will do differently next time around….but all in all i would say i have enjoyed the whole process immensely and am VERY excited to do another one!
Personally, traveling is very disruptive to my family, so it was hard to be on the road. Though I really love interviewing, I think I love the intensity of crafting a story, and that happens in the editing room. It’s a dark time, and yet so thrilling, that period of making the story come alive.
Great trailer: “My kids gave me life.”
Were there other dads you approached? How did you narrow it down (and I use that term loosely because there are over 20 dads int he film) to these guys?
Sorry to be late but WEEEEE! Love the topic – for busting stereotypes along the lines of “punk rockers are bad – couldn’t be good parents.”
In ’82 (in Phoenix of all places) all my bandmates and I were all living together, along with 2 other couples, and one couple had a baby. They were punks but not musicians.
Anyhow we had our best gig at Mad Square in Phoenix and the whole house came, naturally. And when we covered “My Way” Jim and Shayna came out with the baby on stage! And the house just ROARED!
People loved the fact that “Hey, we can have a kid. And we’re just doing it our way.”
Coco is going to turn 30 next year and she’s a middle-school teacher in Vermont. Couldn’t be a happier punk-fairy-godfather.
Thank you. Oscilloscope (our distributor) really did a great job with that. It was a hard thing to try to convey that this movie is both funny and touching, and they did that.
What a great story! I have chills. And SEE, she’s doing the right thing, that Coco, teaching kids right at that pivotal moment in their lives. What a great thing that came out of the seeming-craziness of being a band baby. Thanks for sharing that, Kelly.
How wonderful for both of you women. Really nice. Story. You girls. Nice.
because Punk is such a tight knit subculture, once we were in and “approved” we were given intros to all of our dads-there actually came a point where we had to say “no more” and stop shooting.
Lots of the dads I assume were rebels of a sort. I wonder if they will give their kids anything much to rebel against?
LOVE IT! I have spent time with friends who are punk parents 9and some who are punk single parents), and they are much more open to their kids doing whatever the want to express themselves, to be free of limitations.
One punk mom though was kinda freaked out when her daughter wanted to wear laura Ashley and really square clothes–but hey, the kid was rebelling agianst her parental norms!
thanks demi! :)
BTW, you can cathc The Other F-Word as it opens across the country: (yes, Kelly it wil be in your city!)
IN THEATERS
OPENED IN NEW YORK ON NOVEMBER 2 AND IN LOS ANGELES ON NOVEMBER 4
NOW STARTING NATIONWIDE
(Click links below to book tickets early)
FILM FORUM
New York, NY
Opening Wednesday, November 2nd
http://www.filmforum.org/weeblylink_new_window
NUART
Los Angeles, CA
Opening Friday, November 4
http://www.landmarktheatres.com/market/losangeles/nuarttheatre.htmweeblylink_new_window
LAEMMLE PLAYHOUSE
Pasadena
Opening Friday, November 11
http://www.laemmle.com/viewtheatre.php?thid=6
LANDMARK KENDALL SQUARE
Boston, MA
Opening Friday, November 11
http://www.landmarktheatres.com/market/boston/kendallsquarecinema.htm
AMERICAN FILM FESTIVAL
Wroclaw, Poland
November 15-20
_
LANDMARK SHATTUCK
Berkeley, CA
Opening Friday, November 18
http://www.landmarktheatres.com/market/sanfranciscoeastbay/shattuckcinemas.htmweeblylink_new_window
TEXAS THEATER
Dallas, TX
Opening Friday, November 18
http://thetexastheatre.com/
SCREENLAND CROSSROADS
Kansas City, MO
Opening Friday, November 18
http://www.screenland.com/showtimes.htmlweeblylink_new_window
THE ROYALE
Phoenix, AZ
Opening Friday, November 18
_
LANDMARK LUMIERE
San Francisco, CA
Opening Friday, November 18
http://www.landmarktheatres.com/market/sanfrancisco/lumieretheatre.htmweeblylink_new_window
LANDMARK VARSITY
Seattle, WA
Opening Friday, November 18
_
SOUTH COAST VILLAGE
Santa Ana, CA
Opening Friday, November 18
LANDMARK (TBA)
Minneapolis, MN
Opening Friday, November 25
_
LANDMARK KEN
San Diego, CA
Opening Friday, November 25
_
LANDMARK RITZ @ THE BOURSE
Philadelphia, PA
Opening Friday, December 2
_
LANDMARK E STREET
Washington, DC
Opening Friday, December 2
_
LANDMARK CHEZ ARTISTE
Denver, CO
Opening Friday, December 9
http://www.landmarktheatres.com/market/denver/chezartiste.htm
CABLE CAR
Providence, RI
Opening Friday, December 16http://www.cablecarcinema.com/
BROOKS MUSEUMMemphis, TNScreening Sunday, January 8http://www.brooksmuseum.org/
thats so funny! whenever the dads are asked at our Q and A’s if they would be upset if their daughter came home with a tattoo the answer is usually along the lines of “only if it was a Palin for President” tattoo
AWESOME Lisa-thank you for that!
I’ve noticed a huge rise int he number of films about punk rock recenlty–maybe it’s because so many people influenced by it are coming of filmmaking age…Bob & the Monster, Everyday Sunshore: The Story of Fishbone come to mind immediately…
We narrowed it down by virtue of story telling — there were visuals and moments that we didn’t capture in Jim’s life (and he’s our central character), that we then tried to capture in the other guys lives. Jim had agreed to be our central character, but then when it came down to having a camera there during the few moments he had with his family that year, we found we were turned down more than we were accepted. So, with his blessing, we sought out these guys.
There were numerous points when the sheer number of guys scared me — it makes for a lot the audience has to absorb. But the remarkable thing that came of it was the near-universality of the abandonment that these guys experience as kids. That was a story, once given to us, we felt we had to tell.
And then I just had to say, no more.
Very true. I wonder how they would feel about their daughters dating a musician…
Website – The Other F Word
Or maybe — like the rise of the Occupy movement, the message of punk has become necessary in the place we are right now in our culture.
That seemed ot be a common theme–except really with Jim–I got the sense he was from a very intact family, but maybe I missed a moment?
thats very interesting…i think it is a testament to how many were touched by the punk scene and the fact that punk has gone mainstream without anyone really noticing!
again, i think they are ok with, as long as its not Justin Bieber :)
Yes, true about Jim, though I do think MOST Dads, at that time, were a bit checked out on the fatherhood front. The daily shepherding that child rearing is was not really their thing.
Jim explains being drawn to punk because he was bullied as a child because he had strabismis — sp? He was born cross-eyed.
Hot Topic!
Jim is playing again but wiht another band…is he touring at all?
Yes, Jim started a new band in which he calls the shots about when and where they tour. It has made a big difference to him. The band is called The Black Pacific.
Jim’s a very creative guy, and is always writing and playing music. That’s who he is.
EXACTLY!!
he just finished touring with Rise Against in North America and Canada
Right – I think now the term might become “disobedientarians” (maybe!) instead of punk.
There are so many various types of people actually “doing” punk right now that could never imagine the punk label on themselves. But happy to hang out with the mohawk tribe nonetheless. Trippy days!
The Black Pacific website – has a story about your film.
It is true that quitting your band to be present for your kids is a pretty punk rock thing to do..and I love that you captured father and daughter walking past a white picket fence.
And wow, so many Mini vans and family vans, though it makes sense if you’re a musician AND a dad to have a van. I just kept thinking of that episode of the the original Beverly Hills 90210 where Steve about to be a dad has to sell his Corvette to get a minivan–and his world falls aprt…
That’s a great word. I wrote a piece for HuffPost last week about figuring out that my kid was a disobedientarian and how I figured out how to mother him in a punk-like way.
i love that! “disobediantarians”
ha!
luckily for our dads-they are so sure of who they are and NOW so comfortable in their own skin that Jim had no problem rockin’ the white mini van with the Brittney Spears stickers all over it
What projects do you have planned?
One enormous aspect of being punk is being authentic. Being authentic, being true to yourself, is not something that is static. You and your situation keep changing as you move through life. Jim, and a lot of the other guys, feel that being there for their kids is really being authentic to who they are and where they are in their lives, particularly given where they came from. So yes. I think it is punk.
That makes me wish we had a “like” button!
We are starting a documentary that is a natural follow-up, though we will not use the punk prism. It’s about what happens to your life, to your ego, when you find yourself OUT of the spotlight. It’s something that happens to all of us, and we have to figure out how to be in the world after we’ve lost a job, retired, or moved beyond the usefulness of a particular career.
We are again going to be looking at an extreme example.
But docs usually start as one thing and morph into something else as you follow the story.
:D
Next week’s film is change a pace: Barry Stevens and “Prosecutor”
That sounds great, I hope you’ll come back here and join us with it!
we’d love to! thank you Lisa!
I am just so happy about The Other F-Word and all these cool dads who are doing the right thing. Very inspirational!
Thnak you for being here and thank you for making The Other F-Word. And firepups and firebaggers, thank you all for joining us!
thank you Lisa, LOVE your salons….so thrilled to have been asked.
hopefully we will get another chance to chat soon!
best,
Cristan