What this all means is we’ll get a Grand Bargain that cuts Medicaid and raises the eligibility age for Medicare — while cutting taxes for rich people.

Yep, cuz we lives in a demakrasy!!

What’s this demakrasy you speak of…?

srsly

We ought to give them back something equally noxious.

I think the Lake needs a theme song.

Which side are you on?

All that the poll shows is that the American people don’t know what’s best for them. It was the same before the Iraq war. A majority opposed it until just before it started.

You wanna shit on their desks?

I suppose we could shit in their bank accounts, if we could figure out how to digitize shit…

You cannot repeat what you are saying enough times! What you are saying is that when President Obama says 80% of the People agree with him that he is either 1)lying, or 2) psychotic.

Obama is fraud. He’s a coporatist conservative who loathes progressives and caters to the rich elites. He pretended to be for CHANGE during the campaign that would benefit working class and underprivileged Americans….so now he wants to CHANGE Social Security, Medicare and Medicade by GUTTING THEM, while giving MORE TAX CUTS TO THE RICH!

Kinda makes you proud, doesn’t it?

Sobering and impressive.

Even if he’s psychotic he’s still lying.

Ah yes, but according to the geniuses in the WH the “independents” want a bipartisan solution. That is President Bipartisan’s primary goal even though it’s looking like he’s willing to abandon traditional Democratic values and throw the elderly, the sick, the young and the hungry under the bus all in the name of “bipartisanship.” I wish someone would tell him to shove his bipartisanship up his a$$.

But we already know how to digitize shit. It’s called “Free Republic.”

-grin-

Lends new meaning to ” I could give a shit”

Beautiful SD. I want to hear 1,000,000 people on the streets of DC singing this anthem. I’d be for making it the new national anthem.

Hear that? That’s the sound of no one in Government giving a shit about what you want.

Your lying. Obama said 80% of americans agree with his approach to gut entitlements and pretend to raise taxes. MSM keeps showing me over and over gain polls that more or less back him up. I am not sure who the people who were polled in above poll, but they are obviously a danger to society and they need to be rounded up and locked away. Although because they don’t want to cut military maybe instead of jail we will ship them off to the front lines where they can demonstrate their support.

The Lake is takin’ a lot of heat for its/our stand. We’re increasingly referred to as Firebaggers, among other things.

Guess what. I’d rather be a Firebagger than a fuckin’ ignorant dipshit.

Heh, reading the poll results I was given a real good laugh out loud. On question 29, Repubplican leaning respondants were asked who best: shows leadership, understands my problems, blah blah blah blah…

So then, in the results they name the columns LEADERSHIP and UNDERSTANDING. And in first place in the UNDERSTANDS column is… wait for it…. Sarah Palin.

Yeah, she’s actually first in some kind of a column labelled UNDERSTANDS. The mind, it boggles.

Hmmmm. iSmell. Could be popular. Or not.

I’ll offer This One. One Of My Fav Groups, Fav Songs.

Yers is also one of my fav artists in pop/rock . . . love that gal’s work.

Nice.

The IWW still has a songbook. Mayhaps we should come up with our own.

The Peace, Social and Economic Justice Songbook.

I’m thrilled that Medicaid polled so well. When I researched for my diary about it, so many commenters under Medicaid cuts pieces really believed it served: illegals, lazy sluts, welfare queen progeny, etc.

It’s possible that many DO KNOW that 70% of nursing home residents are on Medicaid to pay their living bills, and disabled people are the recipients of the second largest block of Medicaid money.

Booyah!

President Obama, et.al.: “Are there no prisons? Are there no workhouses?”

As a firebagger, I hurl a virtual bag of flaming poop onto the porch of the plutocracy. An Obot can clean up the mess.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OFrKSg6zHU … you feel your dreams are dyin’,hold tight….don’tgive up, you got the music in you….

That’s not a difficult choice for me.
But, then, heck, you know how I am.
PS, I guess that poll would mean something if our electeds cared what we think.
It’s a big joke, A game.
I’m working/playing in the yard. It means something to me and government and polls be damned.
Hi dogs. Find your bliss where you can.

And the plutocracy yells back – “Hey you kids! Get offa my lawn!”.

Some people don’t have any problem being a victim to the decisions of this fraud in the WH. Firebaggers refuse to be victims.

My message to the WH.

Heh I used to have a Malvina Reynolds songbook . . . it got disappeared in one of my many moves in younger days, I sure miss it.

Ani DiFranco’s version rocks too:

WE need to update and rewrite her verses though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzQ-n4RLMC4

I too, fling poo.

New WaPost/ABC Poll: 72% of Americans Opposed to Cutting Medicaid, Favor Raising Taxes on Rich People

the problem with polls like this is the fact that they frame the question according to how the right wing wants it framed

we really do not want to “raise taxes on rich people”, what we really want is them paying the same amount as we do, which in fact amounts to a tax increase but it is a war of words after all

saying “raise tax on rich people” sounds like we want more then entitled

saying “bring taxes on rich people to the same levels we pay” points out the fact that they are stealing from us and we want our money back

Don’t waste the fertilizer on those who can afford a lawn.
Fling it in the direction of my garden. Hi Larue.

72% is obviously well short of 1%.

or something.

Per the NYT, Obama has informed the Democrats that he and Boehner are coming together on a plan that is sufficiently not as “balanced” as the Gang of Six plan – has less tax revenue, gives more to the rich and corporate why screwing aged and sick more – that the House GOP will love it – so they should be aware of the imminent agreement.

Details are not available so the left can not mount a campaign against the must pass in 7 days plan.

Who could have seen this coming.

Teehee. Cuties with attitude.

Well of course the communist, outside-agitator liberal media is going to come up with that statistic. /s

I’m sure the asswads working the controls in DeeCee are aware of this poll. What they’re counting on is that almost no one in the (whatchacall) real world is made aware of it. And speaking of slapping around the talking heads to keep them in line, Cenk was having none of it…even at twice the price. Cenk turned down the money in favor of more honest employment. Good on him, and fuck Phil Griffin. Again.

I was going to report that myself;

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/22/us/politics/22fiscal.html?hp&emc=na

get ready, bend over, grab ankles, hold breath, we’re taking it

Nice. Yarbrough’s another one I miss dearly.

BT, great diary, thanks for your work.

The numbers are indisputable, but the oligarchs don’t give a shit.

Bad kharma comes their way . . .

Heh, I’m fine with demanding they pay MORE.

Progressive taxation was instituted for many good reasons. Those reasons are still valid.

Raise their taxes, and make them pay MORE than we pay. And as far as war (or words or otherwise), well, they’re the assholes that declared class war a long time ago. It’s about time we join the fight, doncha think?

Larue, wasn’t ‘there’s a meetin’ here tonight’ originally a union song? I think the Limelighters did it.

Hey You Pup! May your hands become gloriously dirty in the garden!

Gotta water ours in a bit, then hit the gym.

Finally getting a few (6) fresh maters from the vines. Took forever, flowers kept falling off . . . more fruiting now tho.

First couple were awesome. Forget what they are but are dark red purple like heirlooms with a flavor like none else. Fantastic meat inside, less pulp . . . like steak. A lil sea salt n fresh squeeze of lime juice.

Wowser!

*G*

My bad, I meant to link to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEKZdJMDBgQ

That’s what I think of every time I see the MSNBC logo: Lean Forward

They wanted Cenk to play along to get along. Good to know that not everyone in the corporate media has a sellout price.

Is anybody else wondering why the fuck these oligarchs even bother with electoral farces anymore? Why are they still letting us vote? They obviously don’t listen to us at all.

Progressive taxation was instituted for many good reasons. Those reasons are still valid.

most people don’t know the original purpose of progressive taxation;

it was because the other taxes are regressive, the progressive tax was to make up the difference

I agree with progressive taxation but the reason for it is not to “make them pay more” it’s to make them pay the same amount, which they still don’t even with progressive tax code

the real solution would be to take all regressive taxes and somehow tie them into income tax, so a person’s rate could be reduced to zero because of regressive taxes, a person’s rate could be raised many fold for the same reasons

are we really voting kris?

we weren’t during either bush terms

Proud to be a Firebagger.

There’s plenty more poo where that came from Demi . . . some have suggested my eyes are brown as a matter of fact (they’re green).

;-)

Someone once said that if elections actually made a difference they would be outlawed. Revolutions make a difference. Elections are merely the facade the plutocracy and the oligarchs hide behind in the Corporate States of America and the Banana Republic for which it stands.

shoto
love ya
but always warn aboutHuffpo link
i wont hit em

If our vote doesn’t matter, which apparently it doesn’t, then no. We’re not really voting. We’re just masturbating the fantasy of democracy while we continue to get screwed from behind.

Proud to be a Firebagger.

times 2

we are all proud to be firebaggers

So we ask folks if they would like more money in the SS check and that somebody else will pay for it entirely. And they say yes. How surprising.

huh?

you do know social security has contributed NOTHING to the debt, right?…you do know it is in surplus, right?

the social security checks have been paid for and then some, the people who have gotten more out of social security are those who received “tax cuts” using social security surplus as the excuse for awarding it

what you might be asking is for those who have invested in social security to fund tax reductions on people who already pay less then the rest of us

that’s not what you are advocating, are you?

Unlike your own garden tomatoes, 72% of all statistics is made up.

Just part of the kabuki, I guess. For ratings on election night.

This is so wrong on so many levels.

First the anti-American level.

I see another non-believer in democracy.

Yeah, the right wing shows their anti-American attitudes ALL THE TIME.

But I like to point them out when I see them.

Anti-democracy is anti-American.

But then, more importantly, the “somebody else will pay for it” BULLSHIT. COMPLETE BULLSHIT.

Social Security recipients checks is 100% funded by Social Security taxes. We paid for it.

What a dick.

I bet if the middle question were couched in terms of “End overseas incursions to allow reduction of military spending” it would have garnered a positive net…

You really don’t know how Social Security works, do you?

And if there were no income taxes at all? What would earners do with their marginal income? Even if they spend it on Schlitz and sluts, it’s still returned to the economy. Me, I don’t drink cheap beer &c, so I’d probably contribute a few thousand a year to Lockheed-Martin.

So let me see if I can sum it all up

Ship jobs to countries that pay slave wages

Deregulate the financial industry and allow them to run a casino

Stimulate the housing bubble thus helping number two above to make even more money

Declare war on terror and start costly wars and DHS to prevent said terror

bail out banks and corporations to the tune of trillions most of it given by unelected FED

Raise the debt ceiling, gut SS, MC

Create Neofeudalism state where everyone can be tracked at all times and instantly located and punished for stepping out of line.

rn to

there needs to be income tax, otherwise those who earn more then they spend on taxable goods would go untaxed.

I believe the best solution would be progressive income tax while allowing 100 percent regressive tax deduction.

Yes and yes . . . *G*

Didja follow the twitter teaparty “debate” yesterday? I’ve been wrong about the wars causing deficits and debts. I’m informed that it is actually social spending that caused all our current problems. All that money for wars is just protecting my liberty.

Many right wingers are indeed un-American, anti-democratic authoritarian totalitarians. Some are deserving of treason trials and the appropriate punishment demanded of that crime.

Very U2 sounding . . . nice.

You look at their stances on almost anything and it’s blatently anti-American. This is why they have to CONSTANTLY use symbolism to make themselves appear American. Flags, flags, and more flags everywhere the eye can see. Cause obviously no one can be anti-American that flys and wears flags everywhere.

And as far as trials are concerned, when 45,000 people die every year due to political CHOICES, those making those CHOICES are murderers. Mass murderers.

“If voting changed anything, they’d make it illegal.” Emma Goldman

She also said this:

“No real social change has ever been brought about without a revolution – Revolution is but thought carried into action”

and this:

“The most violent element in society is ignorance.”

I believe it was Paul Krugman who posted a graph showing that between 2001 and 2011 discrectionary social spending had not increased at all.

Ahhhh . . . recalls my days of Stats class in com studies. Loved the two semesters the dept offered . . . the math then got wayyyy beyond me so I did NOT pursue the business dept stat classes . . .

Gee, I wonder which way Obama and Congress will go on this? The electorate is completely irrelevant when it comes to policy.

To a certain degree I think that is true for as long as people continue to vote for the Democrats and Republicans while believing there is a substantial difference between them…however, more and more people are abandoning party affiliation and I think that makes their vote count because no one owns it.

What this all means is we’ll get a Grand Bargain that cuts Medicaid and raises the eligibility age for Medicare — while cutting taxes for rich people.

And you’ll get Obama and the Republicans telling you that was the message of the 2010 elections.

Yeah, n tell that goddamned government to keeps its greasy paws OFF of my liberty!! *shakesfist*

FDL has not yet given up on the D party. FDL has not yet committed to Primarying Obama. FDL has not committed to Supporting a Third Party Presidential Candidate. FDL is tolerating – not supporting the NPA. FDL is not supporting the Rethuglican candidate. Yet the hour draws near. What is the big picture strategy?

Jane sez Obama kicked us in the teeth again, yet, FDL remains on the fence in the above mentioned areas.

And of course I’m reminded by the line in Hard Days Night where the older man says to Lennon:

“I fought the war for your sort.”

“I’ll bet your sorry you won.” -Lennon

I had a feeling you’d know who made the statement. Sadly the U.S. has a surplus of ignorance. Some of it willful some of it manufactured. There is also a deficit of action.

I have no faith at all in WaPoo, but in reality the numbers should be that 100% of Americans oppose the current deals they are running.

They are not listening to the people because the people don’t scare them at all. They know they will be re-elected thanks to the black boxes.

Do you know what would really cause them to stand up and listen?
An all out effort by all citizens to take back their votes and demand certified paper ballots that are NUMBERED! Yep. That would do it. It would force them to pay attention to the voters and not the money.

Try the Googles for “The Young Turks.” Sort by upload date and you might hit it.

Why don’t you go hassle TPM . . . more of your kind of people there.

I think Jane has mentioned that she would prefer to remain ISSUE oriented, and not party or person oriented.

In response to the question, “In order to reduce the national debt,…

and of course, the need, or desirability, of reducing the public debt is not up for discussion.

… another indication that we’re heading off a cliff

Garden time . . . hold the fort Pups n flag the trolls. ;-)

Thanks again Blue for the diary and info.

Don’t worry, Obama will cave cave cave. Whatever they want, he gives gives gives. If 99% of Americans want something it won’t matter if the money people say otherwise. I am disgusted.

personally, i’d like for us to be able to discuss basic political economics without resorting to false conventional wisdom.

that, i think, would be a big step,

Speaking of TPM, just saw this.

Boner and Bama, new big deal? “All cuts,” the aide said. “Maybe revenues some time in the future.”

WTF? Can this really be happening?

Your tomatoes develop in the Fibonacci series?

I shall either vote for the Rethuglican for President or a third Party candidate. I will not vote for any New Dems or Blue Dogs. I will vote third party or Repiglican.

Voting R supports the simple theory that not enough right wing damage has been committed by our assclown leaders to wake people up.

Southern Dragon, I love the song Which Side Are You On.

Here is Pete Seeger singing it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iAIM02kv0g

Enjoy!!

I soooooooooo miss my garden and it’s treasures. The first fresh grean beans every year, with small new potatoes dug up on top, was always a treat. The tomatoes, oh how you still can’t get a tomato anywhere that’s like one from the garden. The lettuce that was so beautiful AND tasty…

Not to mention the hours spent out there, hours that were as peaceful as any on earth…

Damn I miss it.

Enjoy it for me to Larue. *g*

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/07/obama-press-skeptical-house-senate-dem-leadership-on-big-deal-with-boehner.php?ref=fpa

Twooph!

Besides, I don’t see it as public debt. I see it as private debt. Let me explain:

Wars going on for oil and spoils need to be paid for by the interested parites, not the country. Also, Banksters always finding ways to short the economic activity of the country to their own profits. Health, Medical, and Pharmaceutical industries preying on citizens using government dollars and backing. Insurance industries using government regulations and lack of control to create voids in economic activity.

All of those things look like private industry debt to me.

…Which is exactly the right thing to do.

Jane? FDL ran an extensive — though limited — survey asking members how to approach the 2012 election cycle; the survey included a few specific questions about Social Security, health care, and such. Hence, thus.

They won’t catch your reasoning. I can promise you that.

Who do you primary Obama with?

Oh yeah, sorry, I forgot that.

That’s ok I guess, except that tacit support for the D Party is often can be assumed – mistakenly or otherwise.

Am I a troll? Never been called a troll here in 10 years or more. Is what I am saying not relevant to the topic?

I dunno, sorry, I didn’t mean to imply you were a troll.

Details, schmetails.

Seconded!

“All CUTS. Maybe revenues sometime in the future.”

Our bi-partisany President strikes again.

It looks like, according to this “deal” that Blue Texan was almost right on target with that last paragraph of his. *sigh*

72% of Americans want the 2% who make over $250k to pay more in taxes.

I’m surprisend it’s not 98%

No need to feel that way. I also assume that Jane is equal to the sum of FDL’s parts and greater than any one of them.

Well, part of the problem is that not enough peeps have told the Democrats to shove it yet. The establishment won’t let anyone run a primary.

Let’s see what happens to the popularity of the D’s after they cut SS and Medicare. Maybe someone inside the Party will see the writing on the wall and be brave enough to primary O.

Obama has shown his true colors. When the President of this country is more interested in making deals with banks, elites, big medical, and big oil insteal of focusing on the economy he needs to go.

Obama is still operating on Bush’s Service economy plan. No voting plan is going to work until we take back our votes.

I don’t know how many times Jane has said her focus is on issues, not electoral politics.

Where’s the primary challenger? Where’s the 3rd party candidate? Where’s the 3rd party? Where’s the money? You think these things fall out of the sky like manna from heaven? How much effort are you personally putting forth to build up a 3rd party or convincing somebody to challenge Obama? Commenting on blogs doesn’t count.

Right on.

David Shuster tweets:

My hill sources are democratic lawmakers briefed on the President’s latest offer to Boehner. They are infuriated, to say the least.
* * *
GOP insistence on not letting bush tax cuts expire in 2012 will be the same a year from now. WH/Obama accepting GOP “consideration” is nuts

He must be smoking crack. Obama, not Shuster.

I was gonna link to that but I’ve done so so many times thought I’d link to a little more modern artist. And I love Natalie’s voice.

Indeed, who coulda forseen that result.

if he passes this grand bargain ie “Fuck FDR Bill”

you could primary OBAMA and win

FDR, JFK, LBJ, MLK, never would have been friends with OBAMA, and that is a fact.

At this point I’d pick just about anyone over him.

I’ll be writing in Sanders if there isn’t a primary.

If they don’t allow us to primary then we need to create a voting block. We need to do something like the Swing State project again focusing on running someone in every district.

You mean Barack Obama expects democrats to cave again and is just negotiating with the GOP. I’m shocked. Shocked I say.

They might try telling Barack Obama to shove it a few times. After awhile they might get invited to sit at the big people table for negotiations.

There is no caving by BO. He’s just doing his job for the super rich who made him president.

CENK needs to run against Obama! CENK for President!

I’m with you. Utah Phillips has a few good ones, especially his commentary on how the blame is manipulated.

OBOMBA is one of the 28%.