Exactly, BT. The whole operation would have been better run as intelligence and black ops rather than sending the military. You can’t win hearts and minds by occupying somebody else’s country.

If the Ewe Ess of Ay hadn’t lost its collective mind on 9/11, we’d have been so much safer in the long run.

So it’s not clear at all why we need to keep nearly 70,000 troops in Afghanistan.

Silly boy, it’s to keep taxpayer money flowing into the coffers of the makers of war toys. Software developers for video games make out like bandits, too. Cuts down on the time required to train drone operators.

No justification for occupation. “Great is the guilt of a President who starts an UNecessary War” John Adams
Same should be true for a President who continues one.

In a Sept. 2009 WaPo oped, Andrew Bacevich made roughly the same point:

America’s long war, which began on Oct. 7, 2001, when U.S. bombs and missiles started falling on Afghanistan, has become the longest in this country’s history. The eighth anniversary of the conflict beckons, with no end in sight.

The counterinsurgency campaign proposed in Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal’s strategic assessment will prolong the war for an additional five or 10 years. The war’s most ardent proponents insist that President Obama has no choice: It’s either fight on or invite another 9/11.

Fortunately, there is an alternative to a global counterinsurgency campaign. Instead of fighting an endless hot war in a vain effort to eliminate the jihadist threat, the United States should wage a cold war to keep the threat at bay. Such a strategy worked before. It can work again.

[...]

One might even use the word “containment.”

The goal that we seek is achievable, and can be expressed simply: No safe haven from which al Qaeda or its affiliates can launch attacks against our homeland or our allies.

This is the opening volley of the fight for permanent bases in Afghanistan. This will be the line that’s hammered over and over in the press when we leave 10s of thousands of troops there.

Disgusting.

In case they hadn’t noticed, the leader of AQ is dead and AQ hasn’t really done jack-shit in about 10 years.

We need 70,000 troops to prop up the corrupt Afgan government. Karziad has pictures of Obama kissing the statue of Ayn Rand.:-)

Wars (or military actions, or whatever) are fought for only one reason: resources. The only reason the U.S. military is still in Afghanistan is oil. If the U.S. is denied its oil addiction, cold turkey’s gonna be a bitch. Not driving our cars to the grocery store will be the least of our probles. We’ll see an economic meltdown that will make our current predicament look like a Sunday stroll in the park.

Wars are about resources, they always are:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Qm2i8mXTjhs/SnlelAPyAAI/AAAAAAAABnc/RkyJS8eMlVQ/s1600-h/CASPIAN-MIDDLE%2520EAST_OIL%2520%26%2520MILITARY%2520PRESENCE.jpg

Except Afghanistan doesn’t produce a lot of oil. We’d be much better off invading Venezuela.

AQ needed the Cheney/Bush shut down of normal defenses followed by the Cheney decision to not have the 1400 mph chase planes shoot down the AQ controlled planes – so they pretended to fly a chase plane at 500 mph and then claimed it could not catch up the AQ controlled planes – something contradicted by the ground crew report of the what the pilots said when they landed at Otis.

Meanwhile I’d be happy is we had two 10,000 per base airbases in Afghanistan – and nothing else (the CIA “5000″ could be a secret bit of overpopulation on one of the bases) – at least then we would have fewer troops in Afghanistan going into the 2012 election than we the 30,000 we had going into the 2008 election.

True – but pipelines – and mining – are trophies the rich can not have enough of.

Agree that wars are about resources, but that giant sucking sound you’re hearing is whatever resources Team USA has being *wasted* on Imperialism in Afghanistan.

Imperialists from Alexander the not-so-Great on down through our frenemies, the Rooskies, have LOST THEIR SHIRTS on attempting to “control the resources” in Afghanistan.

Knock knock yoo hoo: nothing’s changed since Alexander. Go ask Gorbachev had that all turned out for then thar Sovietski’s….

Enh. I think you’re on a stronger ground arguing that “stability” in the entire region is tied to oil.

Not to mention the wealth of mineral resources used in the production of electronics, right?

heh – have you been to Afghanistan (methinks you have traveled some, but I could be mistaken). I have. Pipelines thru Afghanistan are a dream which may not be all that achievable, and the cost-benefit may well not pencil out… How much have YOU and I already *spent* on just that goal??? All I see is: cha-ching cha-ching cha-ching with no dividend at all…

It’s not just Afghanistan, it’s the entire region. And it’s not just about production , it’s also about delivery.

Another possible lost cause, despite the existence of said resources, like lithium. I think our financial Overlords, the chinese, may have first dibs on the lithium anyway. Nice for the Chinese that YOU and I are paying for paving the way to those mines – eh?????

Again: you might want to chat with Gorbachev about that one….

Oh yeah. So then we can buy the stuff that they manufacture with the resources we already paid for.

I <3 Global Economics + Teh Warz

So it’s not clear at all why we need to keep nearly 70,000 troops in Afghanistan.

Plus contractors…

Yep. Plus anyway wasn’t Barry Zero saying Team USA has *wastes* tons of money on Afghanistan bc of all the scary scary mooslinz there? So why are we, like, you know, indulging ourselves in reality???

I thought we went to Afghanistan in the first place bc it was all, like, playing one giant video game against our dreaded teh scareee enemy Osama. So: No Osama??? Now Barry Zero’s gonna go *invent* us another scary scary brown-skinned boogeyman…. booga booga

… and mercenaries… and third world workers… and… and…. the list is endless, and let’s not forget *pallets* of $100 bills…

Heh. “Never get involved in a land war in Asia.”

Oh, agreed. It’s an incredible foreign policy blunder. (see my #22)

Alexander the Not so great?? He is one of history’s finest military minds. But ok, if you dont like wars, he was also responsible for spreading a culture of reading, writing and learning all around the greek empire.

Ok, you’re most likely right about that, but Alexander had his issues and met his “waterloo” by over-extending his empire. Sure Alexander’s militaristic imperialism brought some “good” things to the peoples he conquered. So did Ghengis Khan. Not sure, though, that venerating imperialism & military might is what I feel like doing at this time. just saying…

I don’t think so. Osama bin Laden, even if he had help from some factions of the Pakistani military and ISI, was still hunkered down in Abbotabad, keeping a low profile. When Afghanistan was a safe haven for al Quaeda, Osama bin Laden was receiving reporters for interviews, openly operating a training camp and doing so without worry of discovery by the Taliban government. Your argument rests on the assumption that the Pakistani military and intelligence services have the same unit cohesion that their US counterparts do and that the head of state necessarily drives what happens. It is not clear whether the parts of the military that really control Pakistan’s nuclear arsenal and the folks who were helping Osama bin Laden were the same.

Any place is a safe haven if you’re quiet enough. And discreet enough. And can indeed cover all the details of your whereabouts. And all of the US technical intelligence was worthless in trying to find a man who was using a trusted human courier to transact all his business.

I think that the idea of Afghanistan becoming a safe haven again for terrorists is way overstated. Even the folks most aligned with al Quaeda in Afghanistan have foresworn going down that road again. Even Mullah Omar concedes that it was a mistake. What is more significant are the changes moving through the Arab world and Sunni Islam. The success of those makes the use of terrorism less attractive because in the end (after 20 years of attacks) it has not worked to change anything except US Constitutional foundations. In the muslim world, nada.

I’ve watched, in my whole life, the incredible waste of resources and blood for a mindless race to be king of the mountain. Now, here we are blowing over half our budget on the military and the attendant costs to stay on top . Half the oil we burn every day is on military excursions adding to climate destruction and the deficit. We’ve declared ourselves exceptional license to murder those who don’t measure up exceptionally wise without regret, any guilt or shame.

I see no way back to a sensible “defense” budget until we go broke and break up like the Soviets before us, Lord hasten that day is all I can say.

Good question. Which is not likely to be asked at any White House press briefings, now that Helen Thomas is retired.

We get ball caps from Vietnam now. Used to be made in North Carolina.

Endless imperial wars and occupations… And some folks thought that Obama was a “liberal” or gasp, even a “progressive.” Wrong. Obama is a Republican. Being black in Chicago, Illinois meant that he could not run for public office as a Republican, so he became a “Democrat.” Once he became President, he came out of his Republican closet, as a gas;, Republican.

Obama is the biggest fraud in American history.

When Obama and Biden write their respective autobiographies, their point of view will come around to the troops in Afghanistan were there “to protect” Pakistan from India. See how easy this is, when it comes to misdirection for their obvious criminal stupidity.

Jaango

That’s what it comes down to. Criminal stupidity. Those of us who believe in such things call it evil.

At once, the US military can see and touch any terrorist on the planet, and yet there is no end to their safe havens–being such wonderful abstractions, I suspect their number is infinite. Makes perfect sense to me provided the parts of my brain that store these “facts” never talk to each other. Seems to work about the same way for any other topic some person with a boatload of power and money is explaining to me on the TV.

Blue Texan, your final sentence asks me to think. However, after a steady diet of propaganda, I have been conditioned by its real purpose of preempting thinking by depositing ready-made answers where thinking should go. I’ll wait for the President’s next address to find out why 70,000 troops should be in Afghanistan. I can hardly wait for the Right Answer!

Puzzlers for the high priests of propaganda to wrangle with: How many terrorists can dance on the roof of a safe haven? How many hits from Hellfire missiles does it take to get to the terrorist center of a safe haven? The world may never know.