I hadn’t planned on going to Netroots Nation until a few weeks ago. Dan Choi, Bill McKibben and I had participated in a panel called “What to do when the President’s just not that into you” at the Powershift conference in April, which was oriented towards environmental activism.
In May, Dan decided it would be great to reprise it for Netroots Nation. Not being a fan of summer travel (okay, well, travel period), I said “yes,” thinking it would never happen. The submission and selection process for Netroots Nation panels had long been completed, and I really didn’t think there was a chance to get on the schedule.
Well, never count Dan Choi out. Netroots had a last-minute panel cancellation and suddenly we were on — and Dan was off to Moscow. Joan McCarter of Daily Kos agreed to moderate, and John Aravosis of Americablog signed on as a panelist. Hoping to include some Dream Activists, I also reached out to Felipe Matos who walked 1500 miles through some really crazy shit with Gabe Pacheco and other Dream Activists to send a message to Washington. The Netroots Nation audience was truly awed by his passion and his uncompromising commitment to the cause of helping 2 million young people across the country achieve citizenship and have access to education.
It was a great panel that to my surprise really captured the tone of the conference. The room was packed, and the audience was filled with people from White House Director of Progressive Media & Online Response Jesse Lee and a host of DNC/OFA staffers to members of the media and people who really just wanted an answer to the question posed by the panel.
If you had told me a year ago that a panel entitled “What to do when the President’s just not that into you” would be a love fest, and White House spokesman Dan Pfeiffer would be greeted by booing and hissing, I would have said it was time to put down the crack pipe. But that is pretty much what happened.
Blind, tribalist loyalty to the President was in short supply. The one memorable moment occurred during our panel, when Joan opened the discussion up to questions from the audience. A young man rushed to the front of the stage carrying rainbow-colored flyers that listed Obama’s LGBT accomplishments, and handed one to both Dan and John. He said he was “with Organizing for America” and that in the near future the organization would be “making the 2012 constitutional amendment an issue.”
And then things got awkward:
NICK TSCHIDA (Obama volunteer): I can’t say I’m for marriage equality, but as a bisexual man, I would take a bullet for both of you.
CHOI: You say you’re not for marriage equality?
TSCHIDA: I can’t, no as a….
Dan took the flyer and ripped it, and tossed it in the air.
CHOI: Did you not understand? Here! I believe that I’m an equal citizen.
TSCHIDA: I understand that, but Obama hasn’t gone officially on record for it…
The video is a little fuzzy, so you can’t see my eyebrows shoot up into my forehead. I found it hard to believe that someone from OFA (albeit a volunteer) decided it was a good idea to approach two committed LGBT activists at their panel and tell them they couldn’t support marriage equality because Obama “hasn’t gone officially on record for it” — as if the President had to take a position before it was possible to form an opinion on the subject. I realize the guy was young, but nobody forced him to go running up to the stage with the cameras rolling.
Dan stood up and tore the flyer pieces in two once again:
CHOI: Then, don’t tell me that I’m a bad person, go tell him that he should believe in my full equality and then report back.
To his credit, the kid shrugged his shoulders and tried to joke it off: “Civil unions?”
Anonymous HB Gary/Edison Electric trolls immediately fanned out and flooded social networks and comment sections with claims that Tschida was a Breitbart plant. But in fact he was with OFA, as many media outlets reported.
Dan Pfeiffer only made things worse the next day. DailyKos’s Khali Joy Gray did a fine job of moderating the discussion with Pfieffer, and asked about a 1996 candidate survey in which Obama indicated he supported gay marriage. Pfeiffer maintained that Obama didn’t actually fill out that survey himself. I’m not sure it was possible to offer a worse answer to that question, but Tracy Baim, the editor who published the survey at the time, stands by the paper’s original reporting that Obama’s signature was very much attached to the questionnaire.
The entire event was very symptomatic of the problem that the White House will have engaging progressives in the next election and rallying them behind the President. On the same day that Sam Stein of the Huffington Post reported that “Obama’s Relationship With Gay Rights Advocates Thaws In Time For 2012,” the Obama Justice Department was scheduling a date to put Dan Choi on trial for protesting in front of the White House — the first person since Alice Paul in 1917 to be brought up on federal charges for doing so, according to Choi’s attorney.
Coddling donors doesn’t equate with meaningful action, but the White House consistently conflates the two.
Dan Pfieffer was dispatched to scold the Daily Kos community for not being supportive enough of the President, and to let them know that if they don’t get in line, they’ll be responsible for putting a Republican in office. It was a weak and petty message that did not even come close to addressing the concerns that all Americans share right now. It isn’t only the Netroots Nation attendees who have serious questions about the economy, jobs, civil liberties, social security, medicare, taxes, accountability and a host of other critical issues that the President seems to have reversed himself on since the 2008 campaign.
The anonymous trolls who flood social media channels with blind obedience to the White House were almost nowhere to be found at Netroots Nation 2011, while the people who were willing to match their faces to their names don’t seem willing to accept “better than Sarah Palin” as a sufficient response to the problems the country faces right now. It might behoove some enterprising journalists to start asking why these mysterious people who spend all day long cheering the President and attacking his critics on social networking sites apparently don’t want to show their faces.



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I’d say that OFA must have been listening to his iPod for the hour of the panel or something. He certainly can’t have been listening to the panel, or he’d have had an inkling of how poorly his schtick would go over before he said it.
About Pfeiffer: It gets even more ridiculous. As has been noted in a number of places now, Pfeiffer’s position is that Obama was actually in favor of civil unions back in 1996 (yes, good old “separate and inherently unequal”).
Trouble is, that concept did not exist then. It wasn’t until December 1999 when the Vermont Supreme Court handed down its decision ordering that marriage rights be granted, but did not require that they be called the same thing. The law passed and in July 2000, Vermont was the first state ever to have two categories of civil marital contract.
Pfeiffer’s absurd assertion is that Obama was somehow prescient, supporting a different and separate type of marriage-like legal entity before it had even been invented.
What Do You Do When the President is Just Not Into You?
You frost him with ambivalence.
We don’t need to have his people tar us as DFH.
Dan Pfeiffer should have had to answer about the coziness the WH has with banksters and jared bernstein’s
http://news.firedoglake.com/2011/05/30/jared-bernstein-lets-slip-interesting-info-about-wh-economic-views/
What about the 99ers
That’s a post.
The answer to the question your title poses, Jane, is:
“You stay home and withhold your support or, if you’re sufficiently incensed, actively work against his re-election.”
While LGBT, Rule of Law, torture-coddling and war-mongering are all important issues, the one which will make the difference in the election is the economy. But, more to the point, the decision on whether to re-elect Obama is really a decision the society will make to answer this question:
Time was, eliminating unemployment was even more important to politicians than not touching the third rail of politics – social security. If you tolerated unemployment, you soon found yourself hitting the bricks, too.
But, if Obama is allowed to transgress that boundary and is re-elected after doing nothing to get people employed at meaningful wages (even in grunt, meaningless jobs), then no politician will ever again feel the need to fix unemployment.
We’ll get the same economic policies from Obama or whatever Romney clone the Rethugs cough up to challenge him, and the social issues are merely a tool both parties use to excite their respective bases. So, to my eyes, allowing Romney to win (and the Rethug Establishment won’t allow Palin or Bachmann to win) won’t be that much worse in absolute economic terms, than Obama has proven to date. Because Obama’s not going to change his tune or his policies. After all, he’ll be looking for a nice gig when he gets out of ofice in ’16 and can’t burn any bridges. But allowing Obama to win means fixing unemployment will never be an issue again, because only the rich will count and Obama will have proven that to all other politicians.
Thanks Jane, wish I could, but I gotta get to work here. I’ll be happy to let someone else run with it.
I could do that. I had a bunch of conversations with people about Pfeiffer and the marriage equality thing.
What a difference a URL makes. Extract from Kos on NN11
Banner: Netroots Nation straw poll shows attendees support Obama, want to face Palin
Roll call: “Despite their grousing about the administration during the Netroots Nation conference, liberal activists and bloggers are relatively happy with President Barack Obama’s performance.”
Kos theme: There’s got to be a pony in here somewhere.
I prefer Jane’s assessment.
But but but…”what about the supreme court appointments?”
That’s an issue we that are pissed off at our president enough to withhold support or actively counter him are going to have to face.
Thoughts?
Please, by all means, go for it. :-)
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
I certainly hope that Jesse Lee and the staffers went back this morning and told the WH and Capital Hill what a mess they made for themselves. Not only is the President not into us, we are just not into him or the Dems either.
Dan Choi gave an honest reaction to the situation. Good for him!
As for the President and the “LOTE” message, it won’t work for many people. Why? Because the President has been just as pathetic as most of the Republican candidates. Actually, worse… I thought George W. Bush was the worst President of my lifetime. But, Barack Obama with expansion of wars, attacks on whistle blowers, extension of the Patriot Act, “austerity” measures for citizens, and an extension of the Bush Tax Cuts for the wealthy to name just a few, is the WORST Democratic representative I have ever seen.
As for the question on what to do when the President is “just not that into you”…you primary him and find a better candidate.
Choi has a spine!
Thanks Jane.
OfT, but both parties are vulnerable on jobs and outsourcing. Top 100 US Defense contractors offshore a huge percentage of the work to the People’s Republic of China, India and other foreign suppliers. A right (Ron Paul (W-TX)) left Tammy Baldwin (D-WI) coalition could downsize the corpratist welfare with a campaign to bring home all the defense work.
It’s bad for national security to share specs with your adversaries.
What I like about Choi is that it’s not about being gay, it’s about being EQUAL!
Absolutely! That is the only issue in reality.
The comments I saw were not that this OFA loon was a Breitbart plant, but that he was a Hamsher plant. That ludicrous notion popped up on several comment threads at MyFDL during NN week.
Makes me wonder, since most computers are built in the PRC, if their government put a back door in the bios, Windows or some such. Be a great way to penetrate the DoD.
In case anyone still doubts it, Tschida just advertised to the world he is a member of a Cult of Personality. I didn’t realize until now he says he’s bisexual. So while he knows all too well he is a member of an oppressed minority, he’s not willing to believe he is a human being with an inalienable right to equality, simply because his lord and master isn’t on record supporting his own equality.
Fascinating.
How nice it must be for Barack Obama, who doesn’t have to go around oppressing his followers, because they’re all too willing to oppress themselves!
No doubt we’ll see more examples of this going forward. Tschida fits the profile of a Right-Wing Authoritarian Follower. See: Robert Altemeyer, The Authoritarian Personality.
Obama is a war monger, a murderer, a torturer, and a traitor to the constitution. He is a liar and a whore.
Oh yeah. He is also opposed to gay marriage.
Obama should apologize and resign and NEVER speak publicly again.
Thanks Jane for everything you do.
Speaking of which. Would you consider soliciting “Questions for Ron Paul” and submitting them to the RP camp? If you then publish the answers here at the lake I believe that there would be less misunderstanding between your pups and Ron’s kids. Or put another way – separate the real issues from the phony ones.
Thanks again.
Don’t you find it strange that our government would allow that to begin with? I mean, why have your military equipment and parts manufactured outside the country. Either they have a plan to let China have what is left of us after they rob us down to the second layer of dirt, or they are too stupid to hold office and make such decisions.
wHoly CRAP! That’s nothing less than propaganda.
Wow:
That’s one helluva tide shift!
I assume the question is rhetorical. It seems the only honest response is to fight like hell to have a primary challenge to the fraud in the WH.
Rather than an overt “Fook you very much!” to Progressives from Team Obama, I think instead we are seeing a calculated faux wringing of hands as evidenced by folks like Dan Pfeiffer.
Team Obama damn well knows they’ve scammed Progressives, and while not desirous of publicly admitting to this undeniable fact, they expect the latest “Woe is me” whining to con at least some into continuing to buy into the scam at least through November 2012.
Otherwise, all real Team Obama political tactics are aimed squarely at pleasing Independents and a minority of minorities, semi-sentient Repugs, who can’t envision voting for any of the batshit crazy crop of Repugs currently circling the drain for the Repug Presidential nomination.
From your description, Jane it appears that the WH and staffers assume that all Progressives and blog attendees are gay. I guess they have lost the ability to see that this is not the case. We are all working towards a more equal and stable country for every citizen!
With things starting to shift like this, that’s a possibility for the first time, IMHO.
Feingold could *do* something, finally.
Everyone is still too polite. Obama has revealed himself as an enemy, in league with corporate interests, of working and poor people. Glad that this very liberal and very privileged crowd (gulled by him as I was) is starting to get it, but that ain’t enough. The change isn’t coming from people who are still so excited about the invention of the internet (both its power and limits are by now fairly clear). I’m with Choi and–respectfully–I would say that in fact it’s disappointing that more people didn’t applaud his response to the flyer. A tepid response from timid people–the middle class has most to lose.
The thing I love about Choi is that he’s unhesitating and uncompromising, and PASSIONATE!
I truly believe that he would have had the same reaction to that situation in an airport, coffee house, wherever. He’s the real deal.
That he is! He knows he has rights and is equal no matter what the hate baiters say.
Obama apparently thinks he’s in the catbird seat heading into the election. He believes that he can sell out to Wall Street, the Banksters, the corporations, that he can butt-fuck federal workers and unions, cave on Medicare and Social Security, and a host of other issues with impunity.
Why? Because he’s betting that Democrats and progressives will hold their collective noses and vote for him because the alternative is unthinkable. He feels he has a free hand to be the Dino-Corporatist that he is and that there will be zero consequences.
He can smugly sit back and figuratively say, “Look, motherfuckers. It’s me or Romney or Pawlenty or Palin. I got you by the balls. Eat shit and like it.”
You know what? He’ll get away with it because he’ll put on just enough of a charm offensive and throw just enough crumbs out to get his way.
Let’s surprise the fraud in the WH and actively work against his reelection.
Oh, links please. We’re going to start an “identity hardening” page, for when community members suspect that someone is an anonymous plant. Right now they have their permissions suspended until they provide proof of who they are, but I think we should be collecting them all on one page.
Agree. The dollars looted for the MOTU come way before all the sanctimonious posturing about “national security.”
Applause.
Add this one.
Registered the 18th just to scold and cajole, wrong on the facts, you know the type.
President Obama has repeatedly shown that he agrees with Republican policies. Once re-elected, do you think he will suddenly decide to nominate “liberal” candidates for the Supreme Court? His track record indicates he will nominate the person of least resistance…ie. whomever the wealthy and powerful choose. Then in 2016 all the business groups will welcome him with large sums of money for “speeches”.
Agree, makes the issues very clear. It’s that West Point training. The military bearing must really drive the wingnuts crazy.
That’s excellent, Jane. I am loving your transparency on this. It’s very educational for people to really understand the underbelly of modern political “discourse.”
I wish Jane’ assessment of the climate at NetRoots were correct, but this poll of the attendees suggests that most were too dense to realize that the president’s just not that into them.
Twenty seven percent were strongly approving of Obama and 53 percent were somewhat approving.
http://www.rollcall.com/news/Netroots-Nation-Straw-Poll-Obama-206608-1.html
A most excellent response by Choi. That’s the model response and seems like there could be no better framing. Elicits a strong and positive emotional response too. Much love.
I get the feeling that this, like the other ‘stories’ out there that contradict what Jane and others have written here at FDL, is part of the WH media pushback. This is the story the WH wants to see. Not perhaps what actually happened. What I hear is that FDLers *expected* to see what this poll says at NN11 and they actually saw something quite different. And that quite different thing is NOT what the WH wants to see reported.
Kind of like the old fashioned NSF customer lists grocery cashiers use to have posted at their registers. Do not take this person’s check.
It is important framing.
Also says “Thirty-two percent of activists said they would most like Obama to have former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin (R) as his rival next fall, with Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) a close second”
I’d argue that anyone who wants those to be Obama’s opponents is actually betraying America not just a fan boy. I want the Republicans to have the best possible candidate because there is a strong chance Obama is going to have a significantly bad economy as his real opponent.
The Supreme’s are already hopelessly corrupt (remember Bush v Gore)for the next couple of election cycles, and based on Obama’s track record and the fact that Sotomayor and Kagan especially have not distinguished themselves as strong liberal voices (if they ever do), this argument is not as powerful a motivator as it was 20 years ago to vote Dem.
Besides, the political and economic crises coming in the next few years, and our direct responses to them, will determine everything. Will we remain a democracy in name only, run by the wealthy and powerful interested in fascistic hegemony over the poor here and overseas? Or do we elect real progressives not afraid to fight these institutions for power? If we elect a President with the guts of FDR (like we thought we were doing with Obama), and he is supported by a movement that elects folks to back him up in Congress, then members of the Supreme Court can be targeted politically. With Scalia and Thomas we know where the low-hanging fruit is; and I’d be willing to bet that Roberts and Alito have similar dirty financial dealings as well.
If this person was an Obama Plant the plan was not thought out very well. I am hoping it wasn’t and was just random stupid I am not even sure it was well intentioned. Whether the intent was good or not the effect was not I am sure what was intended.
Is obama better than Palin or Bush. Maybe smarter, but he’s done more damage than either of them. Maybe we don’t want a person who’s too smart (did I really say that?).
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/06/20/986959/-Netroots-Nation-straw-poll-shows-attendees-support-Obama,-want-to-face%C2%A0Palin?via=blog_1#comments
Lol, I really like how they gloss over the discontent and just lump those that are “really happy” and “somewhat” happy together to come up with their headline and only pay lip service to the divide. I’d love to know how the questions were framed whether or not the poller was wearing “Re-elect Obama” buttons or this or that.
I call bullshit and it is just an effort to downplay the overall divide. Orange Satan has to do something to kiss the ass of the WH or they may lose their favored status.
Someone must have video of Jane being astounded that vid I would want to see. Given everything that happens in politics it takes a bunch too astound Jane.:)
Tell that to Obama’s Mom when she married an African American lots of American states at the time would not have let her marry O’s Dad.
Great.
First thing I do when I see a troll comment is check the posting history here and on the internet.
It takes me a minute to get the information I need to know who is posting.
The absolute worse thing a voter can do is to continue electing and reelecting corrupt Democrats and Repbulicans over and over and over. This type of convoluted thinking is what has given us the totally corrupt government we have now.
Why would they change? Party worshipers keep rewarding-voting for them.
Voters need to have the courage to STOP doing this. Taking back our government from its corruptors can only happen when voters start voting for candidates OTHER than corrupt Democrats and corrupt Republicans.
In the last election I did NOT vote for a single Democrat or Republican. I voted for Independents, Green Party, Reform Party and one write in candidate. NO corrupt Democrats or corrupt Republicans !
The change will not happen overnight. But if party worshipers keep voting for corrupt politicans then YOU have done EXACTLY what the corruptors of our government want you to do. Why on earth would you do that?
The only explanation is that party worshipers are brainwashed… and they dont realize it.
So 27% “strongly approve” of the way Obama is doing his job. That’s down from 51% in 2009:
http://www.ourfuture.org/files/Netroots-Nation-straw-poll-081409fq1-1.pdf
I’d say that’s a pretty sharp drop.
Thank you. Exactly! The reference to Palin/Bachmann (or any R candidate for that matter …) is a giveaway that this is possibly R propaganda! And also.
:-))
We know that’s not going to happen.
Plan B?
Obama group but a volunteer plausible deniability that is until until Pfeiffer also working with O and not a volunteer doubled down on this losing bet/stand on the issues. The majority of voters support this issue so Obama seems to want to be the candidate who runs to the Right of the majority of Americans and drag the Dems that way in the popular mind for the election this fall? Are both sides trying to lose?
Your saying O is acting worse than Nixon…ok now I’m Astounded! I remember the good old days when I was part of the tin foil hat crowd and was not surprised much:(
27% strong approval from O’s base is not good. I wonder what African American polling is like? Chicago African American polling would be real interesting.
From the front page piece at DKos.
The 53% figure is what got my attention.
Yeah, we’re gonna be getting a lot of Obamabots from now on. Like reader I check their activity and web presence.
No more Lesser of two Evils! The Left does not settle! evil does not create jobs, get Gays Married, Get Immigrants rights, end both wars, help homeowners, lower gas prices. All Dems should beware lesser of two evils is not a choice if we destroy the Dems we can and will create a third party.
I don’t give a shit about the Supreme Court right now, because (A) there are and will be for the foreseeable future a conservative majority of five with or without a formally-declared Republican in the White House. The oldest on the bench are, IIRC, Scalia and Kennedy and neither one is getting anywhere near Stevens territory in that regard. The most likely one to get off the bench in the near future, and that isn’t likely, would be Thomas, and that only if his being on the take goes from aroma to hard fact.
Besides, when you look at Obama’s track record of the few appointments he’s made, there are no peaches there. Kagan is a corporate/executive power toady and, in the words of one of her students, “a used car salesman”. Sotomayor is generally pro-prosecution and a token. The New Republic (IIRC) had an article w/in the last two weeks going over it with a very mournful tone, discussing how Obama likes to pick “centrists”. Well, I’m a lawyer and can’t tell the difference between a centrist and a Rethug because the results they’re giving us are indistinguishable. And the result is a one-way ratchet, going ever more rightward.
So, it comes down to whether you want to ratify Obama’s handling of the economy and unemployment or not. If you do, then keeping people employed at a decent wage will never again be a viable issue, and I see poverty in your future.
Choosing the lesser of two evils means you still choose evil.
Given the poll numbers even O’s supporters must admit something is wrong with the Base and its not education as the WH suggests Kos’s people are very well informed on he issues. If O wants to win he must change direction. It takes a strong man to admit when they are wrong and change direction. O’s stand now is not based on Principle or else we can apply that Principle to his Mom marrying an African American.
If his stand is just based on politics well a majority of Americans support Gay Marriage. If its about winning over Red States well the Anti Gay crowd is also largely Anti black Obama with this stand won’t get ANY of their votes but with this stand he loses Gay and Lefty votes. With this stand he gives moderate voters another reason not to vote for him.
Jobs is the biggest issue and O is not giving voters a reason to vote for him a zero on jobs vs negative numbers from the GOP on that issue isn’t going to motivate anyone O needs a positive on jobs to get votes.
O’s position on Gay Marriage just makes it easier to stay home or vote only for Real Lefties but leave O’s space blank on election day.
O needs to fire his political team lucky for him I’m available and near Chicago.
Yeah no more choosing Evil!
That’s my plan. And i am sticking to it.
I think most of the Regulars at the Lake or on board:)
I know it’s just good to make it know time and again and again ….
What to do when the President is just not that into you? Dump him and don’t go back to him. I want 5 million good paying jobs created in 1 year, I want both wars over and the money to be spent on creating jobs. Gays can marry no more torture of anyone or spying on Lefties would be nice cripes I feel like O is a stalker and then my stalker keeps emailing me for cash.
How many Lefties belong to groups spied on by O but are also getting emails for cash from O?
Did even Hitler force Jews to buy Mein Kampf? Books were the net posts of the day.
Agreed its also good to point out that our position is not some random comment but has lots of support:)
If this was an OFA Obama plant, they may have “assumed” the panelists would react in the typical polite manner. In that case, the real message would have been not to support gay marriage. However, due to Dan Choi’s admirable reaction, the message ended up being “gay marriage is about equality”.
Thanks Jane, this is so gratifying to see WH flaks & volunteers fall very hard on their smug faces.
Just one favor to ask. When we say this:
can we always include “war” or “foreign occupations” in the list? The GOP asshats and corporate DINOs spent all Sunday on the war-propaganda teevee whining about how Americans should stop their “war weariness.” Well, no, we shouldn’t. And it’s wayyyyy more than “weary,” Senator McSame.
I want someone who is smart, has common sense, and a conscience in regards to how their actions effect ALL citizens.
Guess it’s time for the quiz.
Take this quiz and see where you stand in your relationship.
1. Do you feel afraid to speak your mind, express how you feel or ask for something you need?
2. Does your partner tell you are “stupid”, “crazy”, or “inadequate” when you disagree?
3. Does your partner make fun of your ideas or opinions?
4. Is your partner bossy and/or try to control every detail in your relationship?
5. Is your partner extremely demanding and jealous?
6. Do you often feel guilty and second-guess your choices in friends, social activities, jobs, etc. because of your partner’s negative comments about these choices?
7. Are you afraid of your partner’s temper, feel like you walk on eggshells, and/or are constantly monitoring what you say and do as an attempt to avoid making him/her angry?
8. Do you find yourself making excuses for your partner and justifying his/her actions to others?
9. Do you feel more “free” to be yourself when he/she isn’t around?
10. Does your partner throw or break things when angry?
11. Does your partner try to control where you go and what you do?
12. Does your partner pressure you to engage in sexual activities that you are uncomfortable with and put you down if you refuse?
13. Does your partner threaten to kill or hurt him/herself if you have a differing opinion, try to end the relationship, or do something they disapprove of?
14. Does your partner try to make you feel guilty for having a “life” (i.e. friends, interests) apart from the relationship?
15. Does your partner criticize your family and friends and ask you to stop seeing them?
16. Do you feel that you have changed, lost touch with who you are, or become someone else in order to be with your partner?
17. Have your friends or family expressed concern about your relationship and/or your well-being?
18. Does your partner know how to make you feel bad (i.e., what buttons to push) and use it often to hurt you?
19. Have you lost touch with your friends, and only hang out with your partner’s friends?
20. Does your partner try to control you with anger and guilt, or lash out when you don’t do exactly what he or she wants?
21. Has your partner ever hit, slapped, punched, shoved, grabbed or shook you?
22. Has your partner ever threatened to hurt you, take important things away, or leave you?
23. Has your partner ever called you names, put you down, insulted you, and/or embarrassed you in front of others?
24. Do you feel like you never get anywhere when you try to communicate?
25. Do you spend large amounts of time preoccupied with what you’ve said or how it’s interpreted?
If you answered “yes” to 3 or more questions in this Healthy Relationship Quiz, you are experiencing signs of relationship abuse.
As a bisexual man myself, I’d like to make it clear that Nick Tschida doesn’t speak for bisexual men.
Dan Choi has it exactly right: We’re equal citizens, period. Anything else is unacceptable, whether it’s backed by Obama or by Focus on the Family.
I was hoping somebody would point that out. Did you notice that Choi said “report back” to the flyer guy? Choi is a commander, he ordered the dude to go on a reconaissance mission and “report back” what he found. Besides, how many times do we think Choi had to fight for himself at West Point fer chrissakes? He survived anti-gay hazing in the military, a bunch of WH d-bags are not going to impress him.
Jeez! You guys are really ramping up the cyber-defenses. How do I stay on yer good sides? (not entirely kidding ….)
I lurk all the time, and post only when I don’t have to work at a day job or work on DC for Democracy (DC4D) local organizing. So I will look like some random interloper if you didn’t also know that offline I’m an FDL member and supporter of the writers’ foundation, etc.
Seriously, don’t do too much firewalling & ID’ing, plenty of our most interesting members are totally anonymous to me as I still am to most of them.
Someone should tell the clueless jerks in the White House that the “we’re better than the alternative” argument only works if you actually are better than the alternative!
That’s actually klynn @ 53 with the mad internet skillz that are beyond me!
Agreed ~ heads up on the Obamabot watch!
FTW. This guy gets it. That’s exactly what’s going on here. The conference goers were still on the fence, but yeah, it’s moving in a direction the WH really doesn’t want.
Good comment. I’m torn on this issue.
Heh.
I really don’t think it could be worse than it is right now. Really after 12 years of Republican rule would Romney be that much worse. I just hope O’sellout doesn’t get re-elected. He is worse than any Republican would be. At least with a Republican president there might be some Dems put up a fight. There is only one party Fascist.
Thanks, scribe. I’m a lawyer, too, and a member of the bar of the Supreme Court of the United States (relatively easy to join). I agree with your assessment of the court’s role and the very low likelihood that Obama will be able to shift the balance of votes on the court even if he remains in office until 2017. We are late to mount a primary challenge against Obama, but not too late. We were openly discussing a primary challenge back in December 2010, but I said then that we needed a viable candidate by March 2011. We are only three months behind. We could remain inside the party for the primaries and blow David Plouffe’s mind by stealing several crucial primary wins.
I doubt we could defeat Obama, but we could severely erode his support among independents watching from the sidelines as Obama exploded in rage in state after state. We can’t fuck around, though, we need a candidate before August. Primary filing deadlines are just months away after August. After August, Iowa is just four months away; some other state might be even sooner, depending on competition to be “first.”
in my misspent youth I was in love with a lovely young woman who said she loved me too but did not seem to be available to me “I am busy now but later”! and so it went…so what did I do? DUMPED her…that is what people who still love Obama must do DUMP him! Those who are still in love w.BO need an intervention!
It took me a minute to get this joke:
The link to the WH flaks is to our FDL “404 Page Not Found” message, offering multiple options to search for posts by anybody. I searched “White House Progressive Media.” Results since June 2nd? crickets ……..
Actually quite easy. I use Yahoo instead of Google but getting the keywords concise as possible is the key. For suspected trolls or bots, first click on their name here and you’ll get their commenting history here. Type their name in your fave search engine and that will give you a fairly good selection of their history on the intertoobz. Use your user name as a test and see what ya come up with.
Excellent point. I mostly lurk as well. We should be able to tell who is sincere and who is not.
I’m just worried what happens to me if I get red-lined on some “identity hardening” page. Do I have to leave the Lake?
Meanwhile, maybe that Jesse Lee guy at the WH “progressive media dept.” isn’t going to waste time posting here. bmull discovered Jesse Lee has a good buddy Sam Stein over at HuffPo, so the WH already has guaranteed coverage at its corporate captive AOL-owned “liberal” site. Thanks to bmull for the link way back on June 3rd to this HuffPo post from Sam Stein on May 23:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/23/white-house-online-rapid-response_n_865652.html
Note the “Disclosure” and “Update” additions after the end of Stein’s post. Stein didn’t even admit in his original post that he is good buds with Jesse Lee. ass.
How about one more:
26. Does your partner prostitute him/her self to people in positions of power and then tell you there’s nothing left for you, he/she is doing the best he/she can and you’ll just have to go fuck yourself because you sure as hell can’t leave this relationship. The meanies will get you.
There is now a one party system with two heads. Corporate money and power run the whole game. I am sadly resigned to the idea that we will have a republican prez, and that it won’t even be much of a change.
Really, if they would do or say anything about unemployment, the drug war, the environment, gay marriage, Republican malfeasance, unions, education(and its expense),or the tremendous waste that our penal system has become.If they would at all be as willing to speak up for the poor and the elderly as they were to speak against the one outspoken advocate we had in Congress, I would be a lot more comfortable supporting Obama and the current crop of Democrats.
If they’re just going to be Republican-lite, I don’t see the point of sending them any money or giving them any of my time.
Jane, thank you so much for writing & posting this. I’d been hoping for more “summaries” from NN11, and disappointed that I couldn’t find any. A write-up like yours gives us the “facts” and the “flavor.”
Thanks for overcoming your aversion to travel & being there — and for being your usual wonderful self while there.
Arbusto @8 makes my point. We aren’t going to get an accurate accouting of NN11 from Marcos or Arianna.
A lot of disgruntled progressives seem to be talking about staying home in 2012, which I believe is a problem because Democrats can interpret that any way they please (like, we haven’t moved far enough right yet). It would seem more powerful if progressives who plan not vote for Obama again, like me, instead vote for a progressive candidate from a third party, which could not be misinterpreted and used to excuse a further move to the right by the Democratic Party.
I wouldn’t worry about being banned from this site. The “Left” needs as many people as possible to have any chance of a future. If they keep me as a member they will keep you. IMHO the trolls are easy to spot but my problem is in addressing them. I have learned so much from the intelligent, informed people here. I am honored to be a member here.
I think that’s covered in #12.
Not voting is not an option for me. But, neither is voting for Obama or a Republican. We need to determine who is the best progressive candidate amongst Independent or third party candidates. Obama and the Republicans don’t remotely represent my interests so even if the third party candidate doesn’t win, it makes a statement. Then again, maybe that candidate could win if enough people are fed up with both Obama and the Republicans… Jesse Ventura can attest to that.
If we had a Republican in the White House, somebody would fight back when they proposed right-wing policies. With Obama’s bipartisan-negotiation theater, there’s nobody to fight back.
One more thing. GWB never ran against his evil policies before embracing them. That fact alone makes him a more honest president than BHO.
I check things out when someone is going beyond the normal trolling and trying to break up the flow of dialogue on an important issue. I do not “ding” anyone. I do ask people not to feed when the disruption is an intentional effort. If the trolling is very disruptive, I have been known to link to their works across the tubes so that people can read and see the trend in the posters’ work.
Aaaa…only partially. 12 totally doesn’t cover infidelity. Rampant infidelity. Chronic, rug-burn, I won’t be coming home tonight, or any other night, infidelity.
It’s not that he’s not so into you–he and his cronies are ABUSING you.
I’m not a troll, just a cranky old guy who gets wound up sometimes. If I get out of line, just tell me to sit down.
all of those things help us have the most fun on any particular thread. I always love being able to tell a troll that they can go start their own thread but they don’t have the privilege to be an asshole.
Nice analysis They probably did expect polite Dems but Jane’s friend’s polite Dems Bwahahaha the WH did not do their OP research they were lazy and incompetent that tells us about how O’s political opp is run. This does not make me feel confident about the election this fall.
Diary and we really need a way to get each commentor’s response to each question.
How long has it been since you thought “OFA doesn’t suck”? How anyone could volunteer to help OFA and Obama the Sellout and Backstabber at this point is beyond me.
Well done, Mr. Choi!
Well, you’ll get some false positives, too.
For instance, I joined here as Missouri Mule unaware that there is some other MM who is a conservative gun-loving good ol’ boy in some other forum. I shudder to think that anyone confuses me with him. And a quick Google turned up some other MM on a CB forum. Again, not me.
I like the idea of calling out the plants when they are known to be, but I am leery about the idea of challenging or accidentally running off people who are legitimate. I’ve seen cases where people are challenged, sometimes rather aggressively, simply because they have a different point of view. Intolerance for other viewpoints concerns me. Clearly, there is an overall philosophy shared here but it shouldn’t be necessary to have that philosophy to participate, should it? If we have the truth and the facts, we don’t need to be afraid of different opinions. That said, those who come here to troll and purposefully disrupt things should be shown the virtual door.
PS: Thanks for the clip. I’d heard about it, but hadn’t seen it yet.
The guy tried to say something about civil unions as he walked off. Clearly, just a lame ass. OFA is trying to smear Jane by saying she planted him? OFA sucks.
Pretty easy to match content when searching their presence on sites other than the Lake. Most write the same way with the same shit no matter where they are. Plus most have pretty unique user names, some creative some not. Not gonna finger some we’ve had here but they were pretty easy to track. Some are really easy to out cuz they come in here waving their humungous troll flag. They last a day, two tops.
That said, yeah, false positives can be a problem.
Thank you Jane for representing disgruntled Liberals like myself. 80 percent support for a sitting Dem Prez at a meeting of dedicated Dem activists is not something to crow about, but when you’re desperate you do what you must.
Of course, Dan Choi is now the enemy. Over at Obama Juice he is being trashed in the threads pretty well. You think John “I supported the Iraq War and have Iraqi blood on my hands” Cole would step up and defend a fellow soldier, but I guess when you have an agenda to push you can throw away things like decency and camaraderie. He is still used to following Dear Leader garbage that the Regressives taught him so well I guess.
Because you know, wanted to be treated like a human being is a treasonable offense. Choi should sit down and accept the crumbs given to him silently and mutter a “Please Sir, may I have some more?” weakly but with great appreciation of Obama’s awesomeness.
Jackson
BTW, Fractal, I have been here long enough that I do recognize your moniker. I do not think you will get redlined.
MM,
Of course free speech is foundational. However, there are real interruptions in the comments sometimes that are not about conveying another point of view but about breaking the dialogue. Dialogue on issues means productive solutions. It is the equivalent of holding someone accountable who is rude and interrupts a conversation.
The trolls do not want that to happen.
I’ll refine it and see what I can do.
Just back from 5 days at a music festival with all the 4am music jamming, sipping and supping out doors in temperate CA foothill climes one could possibly imagine.
So it is with great delight, vim n vigor I read Mz. Hamsher’s diary about the panel at Netroots Nation.
Thanks for the info Mz. Hamsher n what a great vibe I get from the diary. This is the stuff of such a gathering I would hope for, despite my misgivings that the event itself was full of centrist oriented elites of the professional left . . . . we all know who they are.
N Mz. Hamsher is NOT one of them.
N neither is Dan Choi bless his heart.
What a gerat and inspiring read to come back to!
*G*
That’s a hell of an analysis, I bookmarked that one.
Spot on, no jobs = no help for we the people, regardless of other issues at hand (sorry LGBT’s n antiwar folks, that’s MY reality).
And as long as THIS admin and any other admin is let off the hook for this issue they will NEVER change any other social based issues.
History shows us, it was labor and lack of jobs which put the fear of the voter into politicians hearts for decades upon decades.
All that, gone now.
And even a tech based knowledgeable electorate as proggy as Pups are, has been scammed away from the need at hand, the ONE THING THAT WILL DRIVE MASS ACTION ergo change, the demand for jobs and healthcare.
Just one issue, sitting there, waiting to be grabbed and run with, to arouse the masses and bring better things to ALL of we the people.
Sitting right there. N no one wants to grab it n run with it.
That’s how deeply embedded this elitist bullshit is, it even has proggy’s fooled n scammed.
LeSigh.
There’s a lot in there I agree with.
It’s class war, jobs are the key, and those WITH jobs and econ stability are failing to understand what’s gone wrong with the masses.
N if the masses are unhappy (they are, and getting unhappier daily) then only one of two things is usually the end result.
Mass revolt, or the inevitable collapse of the system so many cling to cuz they got theirs.
Thanks for saying what many seem to either ignore or dismiss condescendingly.
Dang, blog wise that’s one HELL of a huge step to take . . .
Heh heh heh, out the fuckers n name them, keep a list.
You guys are GOOD!
*G*
Heh, just got home Sunday, n I’m still in full fest mode recovery.
I added some thots there, despite the diary being old.
*G*
Glad to see ya held the fort while I was gone . . .
Hell, always delighted to see yer thots . . . thanks.
Like the worst of any Edward Bernays (Father of PR) spin, this one is faster n I an pedal on an old school spinning wheel.
Hey Mz. Hamsher, I’d add this one to the rolls of the insaner, unkind and ill informed . .
*G*