
*description: Rhinogale melleri *source: http://www.classicnatureprints.com/pr.Smit Mammals/smit.mam1.index.html *artist: Joseph Smit)
One of my very favorite living writers on this planet tells a joke that isn’t a joke really:
… Guy gets on a train with a box, airholes in the side. The man he sits down next to asks him about it, and he admits that he’s got a mongoose in there. Dude B is like, “Not something normal, like a bunny or a cat?” No, there’s more to the story. “It’s because of my older brother. He’s a drunk, among other things, and at this point he’s just completely out of his tree. He sees serpents, everywhere. Everywhere he looks, he’s seeing these snakes and they make him terrified.” And Dude B is like, “So they’re imaginary?” Yeah. “So then why the mongoose?” And the first guy smiles and looks very meaningfully at the box, which is empty. “Imaginary mongoose.”
I really can think of no better way to describe the political conversation we are having in this country about economic issues, than to tell that story up there. We are not having a debate about the economy. We are not discussing problems and solutions. We are not working out causes and effects.
We’re just walking through the American landscape with a cleaver and we’re hacking away, declaring that we have to do this, that we have no choice.
Where can we cut next? How much can we cut here, or there? We’re broke, you see. Look at this piece of paper I just had an intern make copies of. It says we’re broke. It says it in special red ink I wouldn’t be able to use if we weren’t broke, so let’s cut. Cut cut cut cut.
And anybody dumb enough to stick his head up and say look, not only are we not totally broke, but the degree of broke that we actually are is entirely fixable by doing a few very simple things that for no reason at all we have declared off-limits, anybody dumb enough to do that is called crazy.
(People who can see clear to the other end of a problem generally wind up being called crazy, which sucks for them because the step after calling them crazy is to throw them in prison and the step after that is worse.)
Crazy, because when you’ve spent as much time as we have, as a country, NOT having the real conversation we should be having, you get really pissed off when someone points out that your bullshit is, in fact, bullshit and there’s no need for a mongoose here. You get really defensive, I mean, we must be broke. All those people said so. We must not have a choice, because all those people said so.
We have no choice but to to do away with food for the poor, books for schoolchildren, medicine for the sick. We have no choice but to take away bargaining rights, food stamps, bus routes, train stops, health clinics, anything and everything anyone can think of EXCEPT war, because we’re broke.
We can cure war, famine, pestilence and death with one decade of fair income taxes from GE. Suspending our wars will provide enough funds to make our schools palaces. We could feed hundreds of people for what we spend on just one day of dropping bombs on other countries in the name of peace.
We do have a choice. We don’t have to declare the majority of the conversation off limits and then fight over the few political scraps that are left. We just have to admit that the snakes are invisible and so is the mongoose.
I won’t be holding my breath until that happens.
A.



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I like your story. It doesn’t sound crazy to me. Recommended.
P.S. Where can I get a mongoose too?
We’re doing none of the things you describe. 3% of economists, the MOTU, and the PTB are doing the things you describe or not doing sensible stuff to counter real problems.
Not that the rest of us have any other options.
About all you’re missing is the part where we cut corporate income taxes and claim it’ll make us less broke.
Allison!
Always enjoy reading your stuff. You get right to the heart of the issue.
Not only are the people asking the right questions crazy, but they are oftened ignored by the MSM. If a tree falls in the woods and no talking head mentions it on Sunday morning…….
Yep, well put.
•’They couldn’ta said it if it weren’t the truth.’
•’They risk being proven wrong, so they must be right.’
•’Look at all of those people shouting, day after day, convinced that they are right – they must have a point.’
Allison!
I am a madman. I say that there are four things we need to do. We need to slash the defense budget by 2/3 (getting out of all of our current clusterfucks in the process), which still leaves us with more than double anyone else. Second we need to raises the top marginal rate to 90% the way it was under Eisenhower (and every other time we needed to pay off a war debt) and corporate tax rates to 50%. Third we treat all income the same, including capital gains and inheritances. Fourth we eliminate all tax breaks that are not generally available to individuals in the bottom half of the income distribution or to legitimately small businesses. We do not have a spending problem (other than defense), we have a revenue problem when personal income tax for the wealthy are at their lowest levels ever and most of the Fortune 500 companies pay no taxes.
Ding!
Seems that if you actually look at historical facts the longest periods of sustained ecnomic growth were right around the times that the tax rate was up around 90%
Edit: You know, when the rich actually reinvested their money into their businesses instead of gambling with billions on Wall St and seriously screwing the majority of the country in the process.
If that’s crazy, sign me up for a straitjacket.
was gonna diary this
BUT TILL THIS SHIT stops
there is no hope
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1367780/Pentagon-overpaid-billionaire-oil-tycoon-Harry-Sargeant-200m.html
howdy Allison,we were dinner partners one night,a few years back
i would be happy with 50%
we ll split it 50 50 with em
That is because it produces incentives that provide for the widest distribution of income, rather than our current (or Gilded Age or 1920s) concentration of wealth. More money to working class people means more consumption, which means more production, which means more jobs. It is workers, not capitalists, who really create jobs. Even a loathsome worm like Henry Ford understood that he needed to pay his workers enough that they could buy his cars. Our current MOTU have forgotten that lesson.
Fucking Pentagon throws money down any hole it can find. If these motherfuckers actually had to stick to a budget…
90% is a disincentive to work imo
We’re having a book salon on Treasure Islands by Nicholas Shaxson. Be sure to sit in on this one.
There is a complete explanation of the way GE and all the rest of the corporate persons avoid taxation.
cant tolerate it anymore,retiring in Europe,far enuf away from nuke plant
I’m not sure work done by the likes of Lloyd Blankfein and Jamie Dimon is worth doing.
All the current rates do is produce incentives for large corporations to pull money out of the business and gamble with it on the Wall St. They reap much higher profits when it pays off. The problem is when it doesn’t…see 2008.
yeah,but taking 90% of a vascular surgeons pay…well,thats hard work
It’s the marginal rate. So like anything over say a million is taxed higher and so on. And I believe it taxes that high on only what you claim as profit or pull out of the business. What you reinvest with more jobs, higher pay, better benefits, better facilities, etc you are not taxed that high.
I am not a tax lawyer so I could be wrong.
bingo
Where are you thinking about going?
my dad,a working MD,was taxed at 90% for many years…its too much
That would only be on top earners. In the Eisenhower administration it was on income over $250,000. In today’s dollars, it would be roughly $2.5 million. You do not “work” for that kind of money. The people making that much are basically siphoning money away from the people actually producing value.
France
see 22
My goal ending up living in Copenhagen some day.
Goal….Dream…whatever
great post. i don’t get it either, but there it is, ruinous insanity as far as the eye can see.
and here’s my fav old joke, for the hell of it and which has nothing to do with anything: a grasshopper goes into a bar. bartender says, “hey, we got a drink named after you!” grasshopper says, “really? you got a drink named Larry?”
But it created the most prosperous period in American history. Without that level of taxation on top incomes the top earners drain all the wealth out of the system, as they do now.
See mine at 28. We will never agree on this issue.
im working on it now…no health insurance…gotta go somewhere sane
then tax capital gains,not salaries
90% on total income? I don’t think anybody would argue that a doctor should be taxed at 90% for what he makes being a doctor.
We’re talking about large corporations. Millilonares and Billionares not couple-hundred-thousandares.
No Way they have already pillage the tax system.. 90% NOW! Shit then little old ladies and gentlemen don’t have to go without their Meds or food or shelter or or or ….
I do love France. It gets its power from nuclear plants, which are sprinkled across the nation.
It doesn’t seem to affect the cheese.
i agree….some surgeons spend 5,6,8 hrs in operating room ,look at Gabbie Giffords
Never understood the defense budget. I mean, I get the importance of national defense, but it seems to me most of our weapons programs are distinctly offensive in nature. Gotta ask, Why is that? If the government builds ‘em, you figure they’re going to use ‘em. I really don’t think many countries really want to mess with the U.S., even if we spent 1/4 the amount we do for ‘defense.’ (Plus, we’re a good market and a destination point for so many; good will is our best defense!)
As for the so-called war on terror which began 9/11, perhaps? And how many people from all over the world were murdered that terrible day? Well, how many people die each day from smoking cigarettes? My point is, we might want to keep a little perspective on things before running down the street with our hair on fire, and sacrificing freedom to something as nebulous as ‘national security’ and feeding the MIC beast.
i have located myself > 250 from plants
Allison, thanks a lot.
Sorry, off topic.
Based on one conversation with an acquaintance who is studying to be a teacher at the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee, they have done a great job of getting the word out about April 5. She’s on it big time.
Unfortunately whatever union represents workers at a (Milwaukee County) Roundy’s/Pick’nSave at which I shop, has not. I’ve asked a few workers (who I know are sympathetic) if their union has informed them about April 5. None of them have even heard from the union about the election.
Apologies for the off topic.
On Wisconsin!
read
WAR IS A RACKET
Capital gains should be taxed more IMO. At the very high level of investment the kind of trading and speculation etc is very risky for the economy and because of this risk they should have to pay a high tax/fee to help cover lossess that they may occur that will have large implications for the economy as a whole. Of course I’m not refering to lower level investors. But the large investments made by arge companies have huge consequences when they are poor investments and these consequences affect more than just the business that made the initial investment.
agree 100%
Great diary. They won’t even raise the tax to what it was under Clinton 35 to 38 was it, when we had a bit of a surplus. Eisenhower was so sane compared to today’s asshole’s. Greenspan,Geithner,Summers and the rethugs,democrats and Obama,sigh..Talking bout a revolution, Tunisia Egypt Wisconsin and if things don’t change here ” they took my jobs man” South Park great Trey and Matt. I will be saving up to see the “Book of Morman” on Broadway here in the Big Apple. Word is it is quite great. Without great comedy there is no hope.
To be taxed at 90%, you had to be in the top fraction of 1% of earners (at any time in US history). That does not apply to all of your income, just the top portion (see mine at 23 for the thresholds we are talking about here). To put it in perspective, $348,000 a year puts you in the top 1% of earners in this country today.
hahahahhha
my brother who is a working MD,is taxed at nearly 90%
its called ALIMONY…teehee
That is not taxation, that is blood money.
lol
I think we’re on the same page. In order to hit the 90% level you have to be a very high earner. You came up with 2.5 million in today’s dollars, i wouldn’t argue against that. I would probably go a little lower but that’s splitting hairs. The point is people earning a million plus are paying next to nothing today. And the higher you go the less you pay it seems. Till you start actually getting paid back 3 billion dollars just for not tanking when every right wing pundit had you declaring bankruptcy over a year ago.
“Sweet, you’re still in business. Now become even more profitable by slashing workers pay. Next year will give you even more money back.”
SIAP 400 Americans have more wealth than half of all Americans combined
That $2.5 million was the direct translation of the threshold during the Eisenhower era adjusted for inflation (things really are 100 times more expensive now than when I was born). I would actually set the threshold at $1 million or perhaps lower. Again, the 90% is only paid on income over that amount. You would (as you always have) pay less on income less than that amount. It is worth noting that the average effective tax rate (what they actually pay) on the Forbes 400 wealthiest Americans is less than I pay and I earn a little over the national average.
the mind it boggles
Might be invisible, but the mongoose has landed, and we ‘mericans just love our phantoms.
The problem, or impossibility in our current economic matrix, is that if we cut military then that means cutting jobs…there are weapons plants or military facilities in every congressional district in the country. Great leverage for the militarist lobbyist.
For the military is the largest corporate welfare program going on in America. All those clintonista welfare queens were really, and still are, cigar smoking war profiteers and their engineering/design staffs. When it is stated that ‘we are broke’ it inevitably means that more (tax) money must be put into militarism to maintain present levels of unsustainable excess. Just watch…clean energy is out…what is Obama to do to create jobs? Just watch. Keep your eyes on the snake. Or, rather, (since I love all things serpentine), on the hidden militarisms and expanding wars. Kanpai!
Absolutely.
The top 1% earn about 1/4 of all income in the US.
Now, that is outright usury…! ;-)
i still say ,make em at least….give up 1/2…half would be a home run
That would be several times as much as the top 1% currently pays (which is far below the top marginal rate).
clean energy could create millions of jobs,design,manufacture ,installation,maintenance
its reasonable
But I think we’re missing the point here…
We spend way too much on,
poor dear wanted another wife and family
poor demented Merkins
okay…beddy bye,sweet dreams puppers!
Night.
*heh* Ya wanna play…? Ya gotta pay…!
Aloha, sadly…! ;-)
I should toddle off as well. Have a full day of corrupting tomorrow. We ae covering politics and inequality. I get to talk about this again in my classes this week. Take care all.
Night
Night Doc
Fuck the rich. Jump you fuckers!
I guess we can sing as “Amphion OF Dirce” used to sing while our Beloved Leaders bastardize the truth about war, peace and the economy.He has no fear of looking in the mirror because it never lies. His advisors told him so. Since he his is the smartest person in the room who lack one important quality (common sense). We are left shaking our head or throwing things at the television and asking the universal question. Who is this mask man? Poor little Timmy out one of Charles Dickens novel at Treasury no longer have to ask can he have some more please. He all well now. His stomach and mind is full. He can now help find the money for war. As for the people who are despondent and desperate, there is nothing for you.
But will clean energy create millions of jobs? I don’t think so, The republiscum have already knifed it, and many of the upper-level investors are the same republiscum bastards who brought us the oil industry…energy investors. and the dems are confused over those luscious crumbs falling off the table and want more of them.
Militarism is us. US bombs rule the planet. Obama knew that long ago or he would not have been allowed to win.
Thanks.
That’s a really compelling stat and I don’t doubt you.
If you happen to have a link handy, I like to share those kind of facts with the legions of wingnuts in the comments at the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.
From a realistic point of view I think it would be a far easier sale to the American public to set a 50% top marginal tax rate. Somehow taking more than half of what someone earns just seems unfair or punitive to many people. (Forget that it’s the marginal rate at high incomes and all the other logical arguments, it just “feels” confiscatory and un-American.)
And a 50% top marginal bracket would be nearly a 50% increase on the current 35% rate. Considering, as has been pointed out, that we had modest surpluses under Clinton at 38%, only 3% more than today, then getting up to 50% would be a huge gain, one that I’d happily settle for.
Also, wasn’t it during the Nixon administration that the top rate was something like 73% or 78%? While that is certainly harder to see than 50%, it would be easier than 90%.
Shit, I’d feel better if they were at least paying what they average american is paying percentage wise. But even that doesn’t happen.
Can’t squeeze blood from a turnip and most of these people are a bunch of turnips.
Hey! Just looking into this post — go Kris!
It’s not 90% on total income. It’s 90% after the first x millions of dollars. When Atlas was supposedly shrugging at the 90% marginal tax rates, we were experiencing the most productive years of our nation and of the middle class, and of the educational system. Atlas didn’t start to shrug until he had all his toys and got bored.
*heh* And all I wanna hear is ‘how high’…! ;-)
CTuttle is upstairs!
Late, Late Night FDL: My Life Would Suck Without You
The problem is that in America the snakes are real and there’s not a mongoose in sight. Sure, I like Elizabeth Warren, too, but without meaningful re-regulation, and with all the banksters and their proteges in the Obama administration, the snakes are running amok and feasting on the rest of us.
Thanks to the two totally legal forms of bribery, the campaign contribution and the post-government service fat cat job, the government is an accessory to the crimes and not an enforcer and protector.
Unless we recognize what’s happening and elect some genuine progressives, or even some honest conservatives. things aren’t going to get any better. The Wall Street casinos will keep going full tilt until the economy crashes again, much more catastrophically, and we finally see the light. By then it will be too late, of course, because the Chinese and Arabs will have stopped financing our debt and our allies will have ceased responding to our bullying. All we’ll be able to do is lick our wounds and try to pick up the pieces.
First, we have to establish a Democracy!
Thanks Allison,
I think that quite a few of the folks at FDL are well aware that the need for domestic budget cuts is a myth. But yeah, establishment media keeps posting false reports of snake sightings.
if our country were a plane, i have no doubt that samuel jackson could offer us some advice on snakes…
WE don’t need a 90% tax rate. Just get the corporations to pay some federal income tax instead of the 0 they pay now. THe real people sucking the life out of the United States are its corporations.
France has an efficient and well-paid high-status civil service. The engineers who operate the nuclear plants there are first-class and the regulatory apparatus is strict (though it could always be improved). French taxes are high, but you get value for money. There has been an infusion of American economic values since the mid 1980s, when the Mitterand government fucked up the macro-economy by pursuing an overvalued exchange rate (parity with the Deutschmark). The ensuing unemployment was laid to ‘low productivity,’ which is and was a crock. Most people do not understand the economics of public services, but the French have a healthy distaste for private take-overs of them in the name of ‘efficiency.’ Brussels has not been helpful on this score, as it is dominated by Neo-liberals.
I’ve learned that “polite” people don’t talk about anything that really matters. Try posting something about reducing the military budget on Facebook. Everybody has a relative (what does this fact alone tell us?) that’s in the military and they equate this kind of talk with not “Supporting the Troops” – a major faux pas – and decidedly un American.
So frustrating! We cannot have this conversation!
And you know, and as one of the columns here recently outlined, the idea of somehow getting corporations to pay their share of taxes, reducing military spending, and getting us out of these never-ending wars is a mainstream idea, supported by a majority of Americans!
But don’t ever say it outloud. You’ll either hear crickets or be cast as a subversive, probably both.
So what percent of GDP should the federal budget be?
Also what percent of the total federal taxes should each decile of income pay. I would like see some sort of target. Its real easy to say raise taxes on somebody else, but how much are you willing to pay knowing that no matter who is in charge there are going to be many expenditures you do not approve of.
Everybody wants corporate taxes, but on domestic earnings how is that not just a sales tax? The corporation collects the money from its customers, and passes a percentage along to the government, this sounds like a sales tax to me. Now if you want to tax foreign earnings that would be different, but I believe foreign earnings are exempt.
I am not against higher income taxes but I would want to see the money well spent and in to many occasions in my opnion, the government does not spend money well. Corporations spend it even worse. I am not sure what the answer is.