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I Need That Record, The Death (And Possible Survival) of the Independent Record Store
I love indie record stores, and not just because the first date I ever had–at 16–was with a 24-year old who worked at DisConnection, a used record shop in Westwood, right by UCLA. As high school girls my friends and I would also haunt Rhino Records, the little store that became a label. We’d buy all sorts of punk records and used stuff and just have a blast going to the record swap meets, meeting new people and looking at records. Friendships and bands were formed out of indie record stores, a story seen across the country as these hubs of alternative thinking drew people together in every community, creating a “general store” vibe.
Later, when I worked at SST Records, the label that brought us Black Flag, the Minutemen and other great bands, there were always these awesome shows at stores like Texas Records in Santa Monica and BeBop Records in the Valley. Record stores like these across the country provided touchstones for touring bands on indie labels and for fans to check out new music from indie labels, swap out their old stuff and hang out.
The landscape in LA began to change. First DisConnection folded because the bottom fell out of vinyl; then BeBop couldn’t stay afloat. Texas Records kept having shows, but they too eventually closed. And it just got worse. Rhino the store closed. We mourned. And we were not alone. Since 1996 over 3,000 independent stores across America have closed. And their loss is a loss to their communities.
In I Need That Record! The Death (And Possible Survival) of the Independent Record Store, Brendan Toller examines why the stores have closed, giving us a look at corporate greed (major labels, big box retailers, deregulation of broadcast media/consolidation of the radio industry) and how progress (CDs, ecommerce, MP3s, file sharing) brought down the indie stores. It’s story not unlike that of family farms and other small local businesses–bookstores, diners, mom-and-pop shops of all sorts– being shut out and shut down. And it sucks.
Along with giving us insight, great music, cool animation/visuals and interviewing Thurston Moore, Lenny Kaye, Mike Watt, Ian MacKaye, Noam Chomsky, Glenn Branca, Chris Frantz, Legs McNeil and others, Toller pays visits to two indie store on their last days. The owner of one goes on to work at Trader Joe’s, while the other starts selling records out of a van, setting up at colleges and other locations for a few hours.
But Toller shows us there’s hope for the indie stores, too. Vinyl records are being pressed (“But dad, everyone listens to MP3s!”); the indie records store was celebrated on record store day April 17, and Exene Cervenka turned all of April into Record Store Month with her in-store mini tour; and throughout May, Rhino Records staged a pop-up store selling tons of used music complete with concerts, benefiting Chrysalis, a local charity. And new independent record stores are opening. Heck, there’s one down the block from me now…




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hello there.
hey hey
hey brendan.
Hi guys!
Before we start, just a couple quick notes: Please refresh your browser ever minute or so to see new comments, questions and answers. To reply to specific comment, hit the reply button underneath it and then type away. Always after a comment or question hit “send comment.”
Please stay on topic–in this case the disappearance of indie record stores–not unlike the loss of family farms, indie bookstores, mom and pop shops, and other traditional cornerstones of community in America; punk rock/DIY; the deregulations of radio and mergers in the record biz; the resurgence of vinyl and new records stores-HOPE! Plus our guests will prolly answer anything you ask about them…
PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC If you want to jump in about the Gulf oil spill, tomorrow’s elections, predator drones or anything else not about tonight’s topics please find a post elsewhere on FDL to do so. Thank you.
Please–and I can’t believe I still have to say this, but–no ad hominen remarks. And please be respectful of our guests and of each other. And yeah, I tpye badly…
Hi Brendan, Lee and Mike, welcome to Firedoglake Movie Night!
My computer made a malfunction.thanks for being here and waiting fo rme to get caught up!
Brendan, Mike, Lee, Welcome to the Lake.
hey mike was just talking to lisa about working on my next doc. with danny fields- very small world!
anywho yes I Need That Record!
Hi! Good afternoon
big respect to brother danny.
Welcome to FDL!
How did you two meet up, Mike/Brendan..
hey lee.
Brendan, Mike, Great Film!! I highly recommend it to everyone.
I was in northampton for a poetry thing thurston and byron had going…
Hi Mike!
ANd hey Lee– man who is busy making vinyl records relevant again by pressing and spinning.
well Mike was in Florence, MA for Byron Coley’s Poetry fest for like 6 hours or something and I had gotten in touch. Glenn Branca actually gave me the tip that you’d be in town Mike and I just got in touch about the project throuygh MySpace initially…
brendan had me talk about the nightmare mom-and-pop stores were facing.
yeah, it was near norhtampton, in florence, mass.
in an appropriate space byron and thurston probably run the most underground rare record store in the US…
brendan, there’s a lot of parallels between indie record stores and other businesses in the US which are getting squeezed out by big conglmerates…
yet like niche organic farming, for example, indie lables and stores are coming back (and some never left). Lee’s label is one example of that, as are the vinyl stores popping up.
ANd Mike, you played jst a couple weeks ago at the Rhino pop up store…
yeah but rhino is closing!
ANd Mike, yeah, your point was def well made and taken…have Pedro mom and pops been squeezed at all by corp stores? and do you see a lot of changes as you have cruised the bywaters of US?
yeah i was just barely born in the 80s but it seems like a similar atmosphere out there where the majors are struggling and the indies are starting to be able to play on a more level playing field. there’s still such a divide between the majors and indies though…
they have all been squeezed out here in pedro but mike brady just opened a pad on sixth street.
actually we have no corp stores in pedro – they all closed too!
thats great.
about mike brady’s place that is…
Yes, the Rhino was a special one-month dealio to raise funds for a cool charity, Chrysalis Foundation
Lee, what challanges and changes have you seen in indie markets since you founded your label in the early 80s (form inside a record store you managed)
What was said in the film about the majors – how bad they blew it, literally all along is so true. I remember back – when I managed a record store in Tucson called Roads to Moscow between ’81 – ’83 – the guy who owned it, he lived in Phoenix and came down once every week to take money and bring posters and imports – he always had TONS of new albums, promos from the majors that someone would sell to him for like $1 each – man we had like three feet of “Urrg, A Music War” for $2.50 each…
yeah the major’s business plans are baffling at times…
In a similar vein. How much effect do you think the various on line independent stores and help sites like CD Baby, Record Store Day and Reverb Nation have on the indie scene, and are they at cross purposes to the Mom & Pop Indie shops on the streets? (hope I’m not violating any rule by mentioning specific sites here)
Hey, there was a Roads in Phoenix too. I bought a bunch of albums there, especially the Robert X Planet and Lucy LaMode discs – hah!. Still have them all.
hmm… I think it’s different terrain – physical stores are locally connected maybe more than internet present pads.
Cut outs and promor records and stuff. When I worked for Dukowski at SST we were so econo, and it was fun–we’d grab a stack of posters and some tape and go to stores and set up a display or two in each store. Peopel would be OMG YOU’RE CHUCK and YOU”RE DOING THIS! Rather than some hired promor guy.
i think sites like CD baby, Amazon, GEMM, Record Store Day etc. are all apart of the puzzle just another way to obtain music. The thing is so much of the music culture is lost when your main street store closes. Just the cross pollination of different musical tastes, backgrounds, info, exchanges etc.
I have fond memories of record stores in the 80′s in the uk
You go in now turn round & come back out …
they don’t have it!
it’ll all be online soon!
Apart from a few ie : Europa (my niece’s shop in Stirling Scotland)
Well, let me say something positive here – once upon a time you’d press a ton of records as everyone would order, sometimes blindly and your records would end up in stores they should not have been in – I remember that store on Vine in Hollywood what was it called – Warehouse? They had a section for one of my bands that honestly, didn’t really belong there – Aarons, Rhino, Pooh-Bahs yes but Warehouse? Nope. Thus I always had to deal with returns, refurbs, etc. You know that Tower’s return warehouse was larger than most warehouses of distributors! At one point, when Mordam, my old distributor would order a record, I’d make them give me Tower’s pre-order, go down the list and reduce when I thought a record didn’t fit. In my case I did a lot of stuff that was truly specialty and niche… while sales are lower these days I see NO returns, whatsoever!
Online helps feed the love but its not the same as face to face interaction and getting to know different people that might be into the same things you’re into…
Same store – same owner!
in 1981 I was calling indie record stores from sst records. they asked me to come up w/another name so it didn’t sound like someone from one of the bands so I came up w/the name “spaceman” and never said I was mike watt. I used to call up college stations too but in those days you wouldn’t believe how many were playing journey and stuff like that… they were looking for major label jobs after college. things sure change at those pads a few years later!
I think that small shops, online or off are a great help to indie bands and collectors. I wanted ot get a Blue Daisies record as a friends birthday present. I found a dealer in used vinyl through an aggrator (like abe.com but for music) ordered it and was thrilled. Without the intertubes my friend would have been deprived of “Dance Dance Dance” and and other art school oize hits.
Mom and pops seve a purpose though because they get people OUTSIDE interacting face to face and not in emoticons. You can record a record online swapping tacks, but you cna;t really jam, ya know…Humans need ot see each other, touch each other, look inot each others eyes, and record stores, cafes, books hops, shows, swap meets, poetry readins al provide that.
Well that’s cool! The newer record stores or stores that have really adapted to all the changes seem to get it and are doing fairly well fostering cool music communities and select great records too…
this pad in pedro mike brady just opened, they sells clothes too! maybe that’s what you gotta do these days!
http://www.2catzclothing.com/
It was fantastic. And to Brendan’s comment @ #40, it was so fun to have a regular human who knew their regular customer. So much better than some pop-up window that says “Other people who bought this also liked…”
Because the human was SOOO much better at it. Perfect example was at Roads to Moscow. I started collecting all this Nina Hagen, and the guy said to me one day “I think you would like Klaus Nomi” and put on a record, and SHAZAM! loved it, bought it.
Amazon basically sublets space to small dealers for a fee, too. I was looking for another CD, out of print, found it VIA Amazon, but sold thru an indie dealer, Amazin took a cut, but hey…
yeah why are there no record store bars? i think crossing it with another venture is smart…
Yes Amazon can’t really see the parallels between M.I.A and Gang of Four…
I’ve done gigs in pads that were also laundromats!
I think amazon has some software that tries to guess what you like by what you’ve already bought.
Yep I miss that about the eye contact while flipping through records – you know what Thurston said about touring being about going to record stores, so very true – Anyone who toured up and down the West Coast in the ’90s knows that the entire trip was vinyl heaven – LA of course, Ventura had a shop, Streetlight in Santa Cruz was a treasure trove (is it still there?) San Francisco, Eugene, Portland, Olympia, Seattle, Bellingham and Vancouver – it rained vinyl, nonstop… and when there was no indie shop there was a thrift store with stacks of old records!
actually I think tower was started in the back of a drug store so the parallel universe thing might be an old idea.
yeah no computer program can really replace the knowledge a person who’s rel into the music might have
and thrift stores sell ‘pert-near everything…
It’s good ot have a diversity of stuff that fits the same aesthetic, like SAop Plant/La Luz. And clothes, records, books, it’s a mindset sorta. A nice hang too I bet.
BTW, for those of you in SoCal who want to support local bands, Mike Watt and the Secondmen are playing a benefit June 25 at harolds place in san pedro to helps raise fundage for the local bands to get a decent PA they can share.
“zed of london” in long beach is where I first started buying punk records.
I completely agree with you. We had a great store here in Topeka called World Records. It was a place to hang out, meet people, talk music. Where I discovered fIREHOSE, SST Label, lots of stuff. The thing today here is used CD shops. There is a chain of them here. Though they function in a similar way, they aren’t indie, and the personal touch is gone.
Lee, do you sell to stores? On line only? And how do you buy records for your collection of exotica and other unique stuff?
the cat there, mike and his ma were first importing hippie spacey albums chains wouldn’t carry and they had the first ins on the records from overseas, the first punk ones.
yeah thats a bummer… in CT where I’m originally from a bunch of chains sort of erradicated all the mom and pops even before the internet… and now those chains are gone… something that the customer “john the bomb” talks about in the beginning of the film
My first punk rock records came from a small chain in Tucson called Zips and a hippie pad type indie store on 4th Ave in Tucson called “Record Room” ( a spin off of a ’70s used and bootleg store called Hot Rocks.) So many of our favorite indie stores were originally used record stores!
yeah, they smoked the mom-and-pop’s and then got big karma backhand!
Watt: I know you have marketed your stuff through Amazon by order only, which I learned was that you burn the cd on demand. How does that work for you? If an indie store wanted to sell those discs could you supply?
And it fails a lot, and is sorta creepy too. “people who bought this also bought THAT” sometimes if i am bored I will search for different wack stuff and see what else people bought.
hmm… no, I haven’t done that, sorry! I think you heard wrong.
Karma Records wasn’t really an indie, but was first record store I hung out in. Then Ozarka, which was mostly used records… followed by DuRoc Records, Earwax, Tracks …
All in Bloomington IN.
Tying into the Cannabis thread – Karma donated a large quantity of rolling papers for Smoke Ins back in 1978.
Ye..and Rhino sold tons of concert bootlegs as did the records store in berkelely. And out of those came more than a few labels.
yeah cant see Best Buy doing that… haha
No, I probably got it wrong.
it’s ok, michael51 – does amazon have a system that does that? sounds like cd baby or something…
Lisa – I have a distributor that sells to stores, I was with Mordam Records for years who sold to Lumberjack and some of you reading might know that a certain individual who ran Lumberjack into the ground declaimed bankruptcy owing myself a low-five digit figure and as well owes Sympathy, Bomp, Dr Strange, Alt Tend and a ton of other labels a HUGE sum of money. Anyway, the best guys who worked at Lumberjack started their own distro called Independent Label Collective and really helped to save some of the labels from ruin.
I personally run a mail order cart from the Dionysus site http://www.dionysusrecords.com/shop and what with the death of shops my mail order business is better than ever. I sell not only my label but all kinds of indie produced records.
I honestly don’t collect as much as I used to – no more thrift stores, swap meets, record hunting for me, don’t have the time for it mostly – my interests have shifted a bit I’ve spent more on art in the past three years than records but I do still buy a few things – paid way too much for a rare psych record from eBay a couple of weeks ago – I do hit Amoeba as well though not as often as when I was DJing twice a week, there was a two year period where I was going there once a week! I get stuff from Amazon, once in a while Rockaway, and sometimes I keep a title or three from a label or distributor order for my shopping cart.
It seems that there’s a parallel between having an active local scene and making the indie store successfull. Those of you who have been around and participated over the years have any thoughts on what a person might do to develop today?
yeah, why does amoeba stay afloat? any thoughts?
Found Tom’s CDs and LPs, a follow on to Ozarka.
DuRoc Records was named after a breed of hog.
well amoeba is HUGE and really organized in terms of stocking… when I lived in Culver City in the summer of 2006 I couldn’t get out of that store without spending $50… stocking and knowledgable people and having instores i think are key to running a great store today… anything that keeps the people coming back and encourages local music scenes to develop
Reading, having touring and local bands play..midnight madness sales, show I NEED THIS RECORD for free on a big screen TV…
I think that was a great idea in the old days too!
they actually put aarons out of business big time we talked to the owner Jesse Klempner he was so upset that they moved in a mile away from him when Aarons was such an establishment… poor guy literally had a heart attack moving his store out
yeah, I think the first one was in s.f.
anywho on a positive note i think if you can somehow keep prices almost the same as amazon or other online outlets. i know you can’t really compete with itunes because there’s no packaging or shipping costs involved…
I went to aarons a bunch.
CD Baby does, I believe. But I may even have picked that up from the Hoot Page about your discs. I can’t remember but I do know it included yourself, George Hurley, and others. Sorry for backtracking I just saw your comment. (everytime I hit refresh I have to scroll back down to the bottom of the page- a bit of high tech inconvenience)
Well, they are the only ones left around there – you know since Aaron’s closed, they are it. I do like the fact that, in a place that huge, I can ask for an obscure title and if they have it in stock be pointed right to it. I love how their vinyl section keeps growing! The staff really knows their stuff as well… it is still not the same feel as the indie stores of back when but you know they have a lot of 45 and when I do shop for records, that is the first place I head.
They buy a lot of used stuff at low cost..sell rare collectibles for high, have HUGE selection of everyhting used on new, have great shows that draw, and knowlegable nice people behind the counter. And a vibe..that’s my take, anyway…I mena virgin Mega store closed and Amoeba is open, that says something
That was a serious bummer, losing Aarons.
I never once went to virgin mega store.
I wonder if Amoeba’s new stuff has enough of a margin to keep them afloat vs the used?
Which brings up the obvious question. Where can I obtain a copy of I Need This Record. I need this film!
yeah i passed the closed virgin megastore in Union Square in NYC almost everyday just too big too pricey and i dont think staff was that helpful in most cases
probably online!
I don’t think DuRoc would have lasted as long if there hadn’t been a vibrant music scene in Bloomington. Same with Earwax and TD’s CDs and LPs (which is still open, moved a quarter block from last location I’d been to.
For a while it was the only bookstore on the Las Vegas strip.
The WeHo store had a great book selection. I never bought music there though, and for books I’d rather go to Book Soup or walk to Skylight.
it comes out july 27th through Music Video Distributors you can preorder it the cheapest here: http://www.seeofsound.com/p.php?s=MVD5020D
http://www.ineedthatrecord.com/Site/I_Need_That_Record_on_DVD.html
You can order I Need That Record here
LOL..great minds run together.
thanks Brendan and Mike. Will check it out with due haste. And Lisa
I miss Aarons – and even more I miss the Aarons on Melrose…there was such killer stuff in that store!
it was started by a farmer with orange crates!
the aarons on melrose was the one I went to.
I can beat your record store memories by about 40-odd years: I remember my babysitter taking me to a record store appearance of the Everly Brothers sometime far back in the 1950s!
Our local little record store in New Jersey only being about an hour outside New York City.
I also dug the original vinyl fetish on melrose – henry and joseph were very happening cats.
wow yeah years later but lenny kaye said patti smith’s first west coast date was at a place called rather ripped records. so many indie stores supported local and indie bands
Indie booksellers are cool too. They’ve made moves to online sales, even small mom and pop booksellers. I used to do maintenance work for one – it’s now affiliated with Abebooks.
Is there an equivalent of Abebooks for Indie record stores?
And the parking lot record swap meets… I think my friend Nipper seaturtle met a bunch of her boyfriends and band mates there! And I know long term friendships were formed in record stores.
the first bass guitar I ever saw was here in pedro in the early 70s at chuck’s sound of music which is where I also bought my first t-rex album (“unicorn”).
Maybe what is needed is an online community in support of the indie store. Information sharing, how to’s that sort of stuff. I’m only aware of communities like that for artists.
there’s thinkindie.com which does a little bit in terms of indie store exclusives…
that’s a good idea.
I found a few places like Abe.com when searching for LPs, bt no one BIG place.
I workd for an indie bookstore on and off for years–evne when I had other jobs I’d do fill in shifts for people and always during Xmas week. Borders put them out of business. And Abe kind killed the used book business though a few brick and mortars are still selling antiquarian books….
I’ve got to comment a bit more on used bookstores – similar personal advice as Indie record sellers. I’d never have read Riotous Assembly by Tom Sharpe if my bookseller hadn’t recommended it. Which led to other very humorous books by him.
yeah the element of hearing a surprise over the speakers is lost without these stores…
remember be-bop deluxe? bill nelson has an online diary and I was just reading how he was bemoaning the closing of the borders in his yorkshire england town!
http://www.billnelson.com/html/villa/study.php?Month=05&Year=2010#May26
There was a store called Jerry’s Records in Tucson – on 6th street in the ’60s, I used to go there in ’68 at the age of 10 while my family would visit my dad’s business partner a few blocks away and look around, even bought a 45 by a local band called The Sot Weed Factor (60s garage rock) which I reissued decades later on a comp of Tucson ’60s stuff…anyway I so remember the layout of the shop, the records on the wall – seeing that “LSD” exploitation LP on Capitol Records – well…a number of years ago I had a dream that I was in that store, as an adult, with a full wallet scooping up all this great stuff at ’68 prices…then wondering how I was going to get it home…then I woke up….really, really sad…
Powell’s is still thriving in Portland. And while Between the Lines is mostly internet sales now, its notable competitor “Caveat Emptor” still has a brick and mortar storefront in downtown Bloomington.
I liked doing maintenance for BTL for store credit, owning books like owning music is a powerful monkey on one’s back.
As for something similar for Indie record stores – sounds like a need that should get filled. Abe gives a decent model for how to start.
I jeeze, sometimes half my paycheck would go for books when I worked at the Phoenix in Santa Monica. I have some beauties though. Now if I only had wall space and shelves…
Okay–first vinyl ever bought?
We do still have a bookshop here that specializes in rare and out of print books. It seems to be thriving because of the antique market. But I’m really not a collector. In fact I have mixed feelings about the carbon footprint I leave when I buy or order any hard copy of music. the plastic and vinyl needed to make them, and maybe more importatly, the fossil fuels used to deliver. I do it, but I feel a little guilty.
I think a lot of small booksellers went online – look at a title when you’re searching amazon.com and how many are from there and how many are from another pad…
Abbie Road. I was 9 years old.
Next was the Original Broadway Cast version of Hair. I think I was 10. My DFH roots are deep!
45 of “american woman” by the guess who. hell, I grew up in navy housing!
i got meet the beatles, sgt pepper, david bowie space oddity when i was handed down a turntable at age 8…
The Hullabaloos. Seriously.
Wow, that is an intense memory dream…
The first indie record store I walked inot ever was Rhino, then DisConnection and they showed me how to spot a first pressing and stuff.
I wonder what KXLU and other station did wiht all their vinyl and ll those 45s they had…
I cannot remember – have had records since childhood – one of my brothers was a DJ in the late ’50s at a radio station in Tucson where I grew up – and there were a couple of boxes of records in the closet – I was always being handed a 45 and actually had a collection of singles and albums as a third – grader! I can tell you my first two punk records – Dead Boys “Young Loud and Snotty” and The Bags “Survive”
Same with music.
my first punk record was 45 from the damned called “new rose.”
if it wasnt for indie record stores i would have never heard the damned so early on… i was into the stooges through my uncle then a clerk suggested mc5 and played us the damned’s version of 1969 so cool… we went to get the record the next day because we didn’t have money to pick it up at the time… the next day it was gone! turns out our friend shaun went in and got it without us knowing…
I had Anarchy in the uk! on 12″
and mostly tapes.
Bloomington had a fantastic campus record station called WQAX (spawned a punk band called the Qax Pistols). Their vinyl was bequeathed to the Community station WFHB when it finally came into being.
I’ve got a bit of personal pride associated with WFHB – I multicast a live performance of the Octave Doctors from their signal on the internet in 1994. I believe it was the second or third time live music went out over the internet (first was a band called Severe Tire Damage playing from Xerox PARC – Palo Alto). The Octave Doctors were really psyched to get real time feedback from Australia during their performance.
Mike, that was such an exciting time – It was our equivalent of what it probably felt like to be a teenager in the ’60s buying new records singles…. and the art, colored vinyl etc made it that much more of a joy.
let me tell you about me buying punk records at zed: I would pick them by the name of the band or the record covers cuz I didn’t know shit about anything happening! when u.s. fanzines started happening, I could get a clue but before that it was “roll the dice” and shit like that.
I was lucky to inherit all my aunt Mamie’s old 45s. Even the plastic poodle box she kept them in. Sadly I sold all my old records including hers, my 60′s records, and my blues 78s to pay for summer school one year.
I got that record too! “I wanna be me” was on the other side. 12″ 45s were so fucking loud, great!
One of my fave songs ever, loved hearing it on the radio. Even as a kid, I always felt there was more to to they lyrics, and later I saw parallels to “Heart of Darkeness” when the tribewoman raises her hands up as Marlow sails down the river.
My first vinyl I bought myself was Aladdin Insane. I heard Bowie’s versin of “Let’s Spend the Night Together” and HAD TO HAVE IT.
The first records I was given were by my stepfather who was a film compsoer, I was like 4 or 5–peter and the worlf, new christie minstrals and fairy tales wiht classical music.
ANd I used ot watch the Beatles cartoons in saturday mornings
Zed! I used to mail order from Zed when I lived in Tucson – in fact I still have a $4.99 Zed sticker on my “Yes LA” comp LP! How lucky you were to be able to hang out there!! I
I got the a & m sex pistols “anarchy in the uk” at zed too. also the clash “capital radio” 45 w/the spiel w/the band on the b-side.
Hi Lisa…Earth Angel (a 78) at Ray’s Music in Torrance
I was in Portland recently and popped into Powell’s and was so glad to see it thriving!
And Portland is a great town for vinyl. I stayed in this crazy hotel, and there was a turntable and albums in my room!
Wild titles – Montovani, Elvis, a Styx album (Pieces of Eight – hah!)
My first punk rock singles were the boomtown rats (“she’s so modern” and i stil have some place, then I went to London and Dublin and bought SLF and Undertones, Buzzcoks and whatever I could find.
I brought our new alliance releases there (zed’s) myself and sold them on cosignment! do you folks know that term? punk for us was about more than starting your own band, it was about starting your own label! we learned it from sst.
I did the same back in the ’60s. You could pretty much tell what was going to be on the inside by the artwork on the outside for awhile. That’s why I bought Jimi’s first album, for example. Most recently I bought the first Red Hot Chili Pepper Album because I figured anybody with a cover like that was either great or godawful, but couldn’t be inbetween.
Maximum Rock and Roll, Flipside, even the Bob did change things somewhat, but reviews can be very misleading until you get used to the individuals style. PBR have warned me off of many a dull moment with buzzwords like “bleak” coupled with “brave” or “beautiful” (ha ha)
Can we go back and do it again?
I’m on martha’s vineyard for a bit and they have a great record store called aboveground records. I was so shocked to run into such a mecca for such a small place that’s mostly for summer homes etc… They seem to be doing great.
WOW! Michael warner! we were just talkn about bookstores..which is of course where I met you working in the same shop.
I used to go to Drome Records in Cleveland. I remember Johnny, the owner, just telling me what to buy. “I Got a Right” “Damned Damned Damned” and of course all the Sex Pistol 45′s as they came out. And the Zeros on Bomp.
A moment of silence for the Phoenix…
there was a licorice pizza (fucking chain) kitty-corner from the whiskey and I got the zeros’ first 45 right after seeing them play!
Exactly!
The exciting thing was to put out your own single and/or record. Radio Tokyo had a lable as well as astudio (musch love ot Ethan james, RIP)
SST was sooo aweosme cuz the were utter DYI, set the format for later labels liek SubPop, etc.
in the old days punk records were put in the “import bin” even if they were u.s. – what the fuck??!
I get a lot of punk off of an archive site – musicalfamilytree. Mostly bands connected with my former home. Nice to get old Walking Ruins and Pit Bulls on Crack.
I’m talking about the mersh pads, the chain stores.
I didn’t even know who the Zeros were. It was cool to walk into a record store and trust someone there to educate you.
Yep it’s true that WAS one of the many “meanings” of punk – I did a cassette label out of the store I worked at in Tucson there were a lot of interesting local bands at the time – none of us could afford the vinyl thing but it was important to document and be able to hear your favorite local band at home…I started by borrowing all my friends decks and duping that way, it was a tower of tape machines and each tape probably had a slight speed variation – later on I was able to get them mass duped at this place in Phoenix – actually that’s how I got hooked up with Ruth and Mordam Records, she was working at Rough Trade, I used to buy stuff from her for the shop and she started buying my cassette releases – when I put out my first records she had started Mordam and asked me to come aboard, ’85!
Licorice Pizza started as an indie, one store in West LA, and they were cooler/funkier than tower which was way cooler than wherehouse…I scored Patty Smith Piss Factory single at Licorice Pizza in west LA, it was near Wongs West (which used to be mortuary before if was the Fox n Hounds roast beef restaurant)
Hey, awesome. I was in Tucson in 81-82 and was in Roads to Moscow many times!
no, you misunderstand – I just saw the zeros play and here was their fucking 45, right across the street! I talked to no one in the store.
cosignment is when you stock the records, and the store takes a cut from the sales they make for you, right. Similar to flea market marketing. And not a bad idea, really. Also, I remember how you closed shows by shouting “Start your own band.”
Remember the cut out bin. I got Live at CBGB at a generic kind of mall store. It was just mixed in with other compilations. Must have just been added in with a batch of other records.
amen to that!
Punkism?
somedays I got spat at because I had bright red hair
sometimes I got admiration…
Jello leered at me (I blame the fact I had green hair & was the only girl on stage)
had bright blue hair here a few years ago … people barely noticed.
yet there are unwritten rules as to what must/must not be worn!
I don’t conform.
what I understood consignment (I originally misspelled – sorry!) to be was they only paid you for what got sold… you’d give them stock and hope they’d move it. zed did!
Hey technically we wrap it up at 6:30, but if you all want ot keep at it go on, please, the bar stays open til they last person leaves.
Next week on Movie Night we have Prop 8 The Mormon Proposition.
WHICH REMINDS ME: TOMORROW IS ELECTION DAY, we have some important stuff on the ballot, so please VOTE!
Damn you sound more and more familiar – wasn’t that tape duping joint in Glendale? And did you know/hang out with the Kirkwood boyz?
Ya I get that Mike. Well, they got their record way the hell in Cleveland too. I’m saying I didn’t know who they were and I trusted the record store guy to steer me the right direction.
I don’t know the Zeros totally going to check them out now…
well, I think that cat in your store was very happening!
O and Dancing Cigarettes and the Smears…. I don’t go often enough
brendan, Lee, Mike–thank you for coming on and chatting away, and thanks to everyone who hoped in and shared their love of music and all things indie. DYI and keeping doing it. Diversity is survival and innovation, if do what you love, you’ll be happy.
the zeros were latin cats from chula vista – they were teenagers! one of them now is el vez.
El Vez’s first band. I’m cracking up typing this. Like the Wings joke.
Totally thanks so much for putting this together Lisa and thanks to everyone who chatted!
big respect!
Johnny Dromette was hooked up with PereUbu too. He designed their album covers. We were lucky to be in a musically aware town.
I lived in Phoenix in ’80 for a few months and used to hang out at The Star System – saw The Meat Puppets in a very early show if theirs it was in some kitchen in Tempe – but yeah I knew The Nervous, what was that band, the noise band with George doing poetry and the midget guy??
You can check out Lee’s label at dionysusrecords.com
Watt’s latest for updates and gigs (and don;t forget ot help out the Pedro bands!)
ANd of course the reason we are all here I NEED THAT RECORD
Lee, Mike and Brendan – I live in the Phoenix area and have a friend named Ben who owns Eastside Records in Tempe. A nice store and a great guy; has some awesome vinyl and helps people find turntables and equipment too. What can be done to help somebody like that grow their business in today’s climate and maybe with resources of the internet?
Cool this was great, GOOD LUCK with the film Brendan! Thanks Lisa – nice to see ya (cyber see ya) Mike!
You can find me on Facebook lee.a.joseph
peace
L
Thanks Lee hope it spreads the word these places are important and need to stick around!
bmaz – send me a message via dionysus AT dionysusrecords DOT com with his information I’ll hook him up with my distributor and spread word for ya
Thanks Lisa
Thanks Mike
Thanks All
X
O man, can’t remember the name but I do remember them. They were friends of Robert Planet/Killer Pussy and also played at Mad Square.
yeah, this was a fun event. Thanks Lisa and all who commented.
A hoot! Thanks all!
Thanks Lisa
ANd of course the reason we ar all here I NEED THAT RECORD
Thanks guys. This has been very informative. My last thought is this: In the end, punk was/isn’t about any style, it’s about being real, real music made by real people who really care about what they do.
Who from SST is it that was doing the “folk punk” festival in Wyoming? Greg Ghinn? (sorry, I can’t remember how to spell his name) That’s just one example. Or Richard Hell going south and recording with all those old studio musicians after the Voidoids. Anyway. Thanks.
Outstanding. Thanks to all of you.
David Dayen is upstairs!
Ex-Florida GOP Chair Greer Implicates Crist In Donation Scam
Thanks,
I’m last as usual. Just wanted to mention also Soundclik. One can also record, and produce and distribute from home. Even lowly I have created a song and put it on You Tube.
And a plug for the local Mom and Pop record store here in Bend, Oregon
Ranch Records. They paid me the big bucks to say that lol.
Glad to see this post, music is our universal language. In Mali I speak music, in Germany I add a little om pa pa and der beer.