Yep it shows the disdain the Dem leadership has for progressives, is what it shows. They know when push comes to shove, ol’ Blanche can be bought easily. They want to show progressives that you mean nothing to them. Oh my the next two elections are going to be like ultimate fighting.

Disgusting.

What is it going to take to get our side to realize we got duped into electing another corporate backed international trading, war mongering so-n-so again? Isn’t it obvious that the party structure is stacked to destroy our choice at the polls?

If our ballots are worthless no matter if they’re counted or not because the deck gets stacked before the polls open?

What is left to do with our country? Does everyone wish to remain living in this hell hole where neighbor hates neighbor, nitpicking each other and suspicious that strangers we meet might go postal if we say boo?

It’s time for a change from the bottom up for sure.

I have loved and supported Dennis Kucinich for years. I will continue to do so. I can’t knock the legs out from below him. He is a hero for our side and our needs and wishes. He is a decent man. If our side needs to kick someone, start where the buck stops. The White House.

Here’s an interesting thought. What if they had an election and nobody came? Seriously. Then what?

The big difference between the two is one thing:

Pelosi.

Second, they don’t need Lincoln, so why bother her? They need Kucinich.

But, also, here is an interesting thought. Dems have been saying that once this passes, it will become more popular.

If that was true, it would have gained in popularity once both the House and Senate had passed a version of the bill. In other words, if after Christmas Eve, HCR was closer to coming into being, the Dems theory would have resulted in an increase in popular support.

However, the polls got worse.

Now, with HCR at it’s closest every, Obama’s approval ratings have gone down, not up.

But, on the topic, the big difference is that they don’t need Lincoln and they do need Dennis.

Obama’s 30%-ers at Kos and the like will never admit they were duped. Never.

thank you, dennis kucinich, for doing the right thing!

when you feel that people are always disappointing you, and not living up to your expectations,
sometimes, your wishes for perfection may be appreciated, but are disconnected
from the actually reality of the situation.
it is important to know when winning the battle is ultimately not as important as winning the war.
dennis kucinich realized this.
we will all be better off with this health care reform bill.
the sooner it passes now, the better.
and for many people,
it will mean that their lives will be saved and they will have health care.
this is a cause for celebration.
and if you or loved ones ever need the care that this bill provides,
you will have gratitude for it.

live in the world of yes.
those of us who remember,
watched sadly/angrily….as health care reform went down in flames
during the clinton administration,
and now,
it will be passed.

the world is not perfect,
neither are the people in it,
but the inevitability now,
of this bill passing,
is a wonderful thing!!

It is not true that Obama did not strong arm Lieberman, Lincoln, Baucus because there is nothing he could do. He did not strong arm them because he did NOT want to. Why can’t people see this? Why are they so stupid?

That Obama strong armed Kucinich and others in the past eg. to vote for the war money PROVES that he is aggressive when he wants to. He did not strong arm Lieberman, Lincoln etc. because he did NOT want the public option, and he only used Baucus, Lierberman, Lincoln etc. as EXCUSES to kill the public option and the expansion of Medicare.

The only people Obama strong arms or slams are Kucinich, Howard Dean and others in the progressive camp. Notice how severely he slammed Howard Dean. He never slams Republicans or Blue Dogs. That says something about whose side he is on. Obama stands closer to Lieberman, Baucus, Lincolnm than to Kucinich and Howard Dean.

Why are people so stupid? Why can’t they see all this, something that has been obvious even from the days of the primary battles between Hillary Clinton and Obama? Obama talks a progressive line, but does things that are entirely the opposite of his speech. He thinks we are fools. It is a very cynical strategy.

Obama is a conventional politician–something I knew even from the primary days and a notion is now being sadly proven again and again and again.

It is not true that Obama did not strong arm Lieberman, Lincoln, Baucus because there is nothing he could do. He did not strong arm them because he did NOT want to. Why can’t people see this? Why are they so stupid?

Yes.

Yglesias isn’t stupid, he just got caught tying himself in knots trying to defend Obama.

I hope you have your tetanus shot.

If there is an election, that means someone is running and presumably they would vote for themselves (and get their family to vote too) so you’d still have a ‘winner’ or maybe a tie

It would be an amazing thing though, if everyone except the candidates stopped voting

Follow the money — it pays for Masterpiece Kabuki Theater.

I’ve always said that if Kucinich voted no and the bill failed, it would be he that got the blame, regardless of how many votes it failed by and regardless of the “Democrats” that voted no because they could not insert language into it that outlaws all abortions for all but the rich for all time. This just demonstrates it.

Pretty hard to win an election and have a mandate if you win 3 votes to 0 isn’t it?

No offense, but keep your day job. “live in the world of yes.” “the world is not perfect.” Is this a parody?
I’m still amazed that people who call themselves progressives support this this reactionary piece of legislation. Really amazed.
But jkaren, if as you say, “we will all be better off with this health care reform bill” I will gladly eat my words. Unfortunately, I believe I’ll be proved right.
Obama’s bill truly sucks. How’s that for poetry?

Then the crazy 22% who supported Bush get to be 100% of the electorate.

No, he doesn’t get it.

For the better part of a year-and-a-half. I’ve been among those objecting vociferously on his comment threads to Matt’s posts about how powerless Obama is in the face of intractable Congressional incompetence and opposition . He knows who signs his checks and gives him a national forum. So do you.

We love Matt because he’s smart, well informed, works his ass off, covers an astounding range of topics, and tries to be a “progressive realist.” He also speaks to a different demographic (young) than most left political bloggers. Young is important. Enormous potential. And his spelling and editing have come a long way. He just hasn’t figured out what reality is. Yet.

He’s been in the veal pen on HCR for the duration, but he has occasionally extended an exploratory pseudopod gingerly under the fence (to fatally mix the metaphor).

Be kind to Matt. At least he didn’t call Kucinich a “little prick,” and mispronounce his name. And he’ll be around a long time after we’re gone.

It’s been established that Obama made a no-public-option deal with the industry at the beginning of the process. So it’s baffling how anybody can delude themselves into seeing his actions from any other perspective.

All your points are valid but it’s important to note that throughout this entire health care saga – it’s the liberals and progressives that have conceded and caved every step of the way – while the conservadems – as odious as they may be – hang tough.

My conclusion – there are no real progressives in congress – just in name only. The proof?

So called progressives are enthusiastically passing the Senate Bill. What more proof do we need.

Blue Texan –

Agree completely and just wanted to say that you write great stuff here. Always enjoy your posts, even on dark days like this one.

LOL…if they vote..but would it really change anything? These crazy buttheads are getting everything they want and then some for the past 5 or 6 administrations.

The argument that the Big Obstacle couldn’t do anything but sit on the sidelines was one of the worst excuses to circulate in the debate. I hope it is now thoroughly torched, boiled, buried, dug up and then torched again.

I think we need to have an unconditional surrender ceremony like they had in WW2, and then a huge funeral procession down Penn. Ave. mourning the death of democracy.

Ho hum. Another day, another time Yglesias looks silly.

He’s got to be nearing the UCLA 88-game streak by now.

These people aren’t progressives Carolyn in anything but name only. They are frauds.

Thanks, BigJess. I appreciate that very much.

Yglesias has become an example of the left-like Democratic Party and even self-described Socialists who act no different when push comes to shove. A blogger that was almost liberal that took a job with the Washington Post and quickly determined which side his bread was buttered on. The perfect metaphor for DC.

I don’t really think that’s the case with Yglesias. He supported the Iraq war, remember. He seems predisposed to pick fights with the Democratic base, hence Sullivan’s “Yglesias Award.”

Obama is a neocon. This is by far the best explanation for his differing treatment of Blanche Lincoln and Dennis Kucinich. (Personally, I’m just glad Dennis is OK.)

As a proud Cynthia McKinney voter, I sometimes get upset and call my fellow progressives stupid, when I know they aren’t really stupid. Not exactly.

But how in bloody Hell could they fail to tell the difference between a Democrat and a neocon?, I fume. Dealing with this turmoil is my cross to bear.

Simply put, what is making the progressive community seem a bit dense is the worst case of cognitive dissonance in recent memory.

Obama is a tsunami of cognitive dissonance. After bieng sworn in as President, he immediately ripped off his rubber mask, exposing the hideous Chicago Blue Dog beneath. This would boggle anyone’s mind.

I knew Obama was a neocon from the get-go (really, a five-minute Google search would have done the trick), but I’m still in no position to throw stones. The difficulty of admitting one has screwed up has made fools of us all. But if you look around the progosphere, you’ll see progressives convincing themselves of all sort of silly things (i.e., the health-care bill is a good bill that will save the Democrats) rather than face the truth about Obama.

Here’s an interesting thought. What if HCR (so-called) doesn’t pass?

Then what has Dennis gotten for his trouble?

I was thinking about that same thing today but then realized the Far Right;Teabagger wackos will come out in force.

I really think you completely obliterate the scale when you say things like “Obama = Bill Kristol.”

Well, wait and see whether Obama campaigns for Lincoln. You know he will for Kucinich now and maybe Lincoln doesn’t get that benefit for being intransigent (I know, I know: folks around here will say “Albatross” instead of benefit ;)). That is also how the presidential pressure deal works. Plus, Blanche is doomed and they don’t need her vote for reconciliation to fix a bill that’s already passed the Senate, so she’s free to tack rightward in a vain attempt to save her political career.

If they had an election and nobody showed up to vote we would be on an even faster track to full-on feudalism. As much of a corporate puppet as Obama has turned out to be, we would be stuck with someone like a Dick Cheney if we stopped voting.

The key isn’t to drop out, the key is to drop in. We need to stop being afraid to vote someone out just because they’re the lesser evil. And if you can’t find someone good to vote for – you know what they say, if you want something done right, do it yourself. Get some petitions and get on the ballot.

Try out a little township rebellion.

I asked yesterday what would happen if this loses. I imagine that the spin coming from the WH will be like nothing we have ever seen.

Welcome to FDL, perrylogan = completely clueless

We need more clueless trolls running around here, there has been a massive shortage lately.

But Dennis Kucinich, on the other hand, stands up for a key principle of health care reform that the president campaigned on — and gets a personal visit from Air Force One.

Yeah, but AF1 has Starbucks. Much easier switch positions over a good cup of coffee.

“Obama’s bill truly sucks. How’s that for poetry?”

well, not too poetic….but for you, there is a greater philosophical issue here.
people who do your kind of black and white extreme thinking,
and categorize things as “all good” or “all bad” dont always think things through
as rationally as they should.

as time goes on, you will realize that we hardly
ever receive everything we ask for in life.
of course, we can try!
no harm in trying,
but there is a harm in persisting when it flies in the face of reality.
sometimes, we only get a little of what we want.
when that becomes the reality of the world we live in,
we have to go to a place of acceptance,
and use our anger in constructive ways,
not in ways that can hurt what is better for other people,
even if it “makes us angry that the world cant be as we wish it to be.”

that is just the way it is.
make the best of it.
work with what you have.
know when to give up your fight,
and look for the good in things.
you will stay healthier!

Uhhh…Most likely, Dennis will be re-elected no matter how he votes, right? That’s not true for Blanched. Yes, we know there are many Arkansans that want a “public option” and such, but obviously Lincoln disagrees. She’s moving more to the right as she gets pressured, so what would be the benefit of spending time and money on trying to get her to switch?

Isn’t it much safer and easier to get someone like Dennis on your side with this than Blanched?

Same to you pal. I’m not the one who voted for a flaming neocon.

You have him confused with that other faux-liberal, wet-behind-the-ears, callow but intelligent and well-informed kid. Matt’s bread is buttered by Podesta and his supporters at CAP.

FYI, there’s a Seminal post by Ed Bortz, Green Party candidate, from yesterday at 8:12 P.M., that advocates taking to the streets right now to scream for single payer. He likens this momemnt to when the civil rights workers were murdered in 1965.

Seems to me like a good first step. Just go to your local City Hall today or tomorrow with a big sign, and don’t get arrested.

Yeah that would require being able to read now wouldn’t it?

I’m disappointed in Kucinich. Taking his reasoning that a loss for Obama on this issue would hurt his presidency (and by extension the Democratic Party) as genuine, it’s a fateful error. Yes, a loss on this terrible bill would hurt Obama’s chances for reelection. So what? A loss would have given the Administration and DNC and the other Dem acronyms a healthy fear of fire. Now the left will likely be both more pessimistic AND more likely to secede from the Party. Only the 23%s will support Obama from the left.

Obama probably doesn’t care. He’s in. His barrier busting skin is thick. Kucinich is saving the cancer in the hopes of reviving the patient some day.

There is so much to be upset about with this, but I think what bothers me the most is DK pretending that he would ever stand strong. If he intended to cave, he should have just sung the party line from the beginning and never made it seem as if he would vote no. Now, when he caves, without getting anything in return, it shows, without any doubt, that the progressive caucus is just a bunch of “wet paper tigers” (worse than just regular paper tigers).

I believe that is more in the strategy of picking the low-hanging fruit. They probably made the calculation that it was easier to sway Kucinich to vote yes than it was for Blanche Lincoln, especially considering the places they represent. Kucinich wants health reform and understands what it can do for his constituents (even an imperfect bill that could be made better in the future) unlike Lincoln, who seems more ideologically opposed to the bill.

Not to feed the “why bother” meme, but even if we got a critical mass of people in the streets the MSM would under-report it as if it was just a tiny fringe. We need to find an effective way to undermine the corporate power structure.

First of all, Lincoln is not in any way “threatening to filibuster” – she couldn’t even if she watned to, any more than the Republicans could under reconciliation rules. Lincoln said the WH hasn’t tried to get her to vote for the reconciliation package – which for the un-unhinged outside of this site makes perfect sense, as they only need 51 votes and frankly can do without Blanche.

But of course, in Firebagger world, it must all be part of a CONSPIRACY.

I used to wonder how any so-called progressives could put themselves in league with the kinds of nutcases lined up in opposition to health reform, but it’s all starting to make sense – you are all utterly insane and well deserve each other.

Whether this bill passed or not, I think Dems are deluded if they think for one second Obama is going to get re-elected. One termer. There hasn’t been anything he has done up to now that hasn’t angered left right and center. He’s toast.

Matt Yglesias looks like an ass, but Barack Obama is an asshole.

Marina….it’s health INSURANCE reform…not health reform…not healthcare reform….it isn’t reforming any healthcare at all. Why can’t people see that?

The Republicans would win. Because they’d show up and vote anyway.

When you have to buy insurance which you can’t afford and then they refuse to pay your bills, come back and talk to us again.

I wonder what world you live in, because your words indicate you’re not from this one.

‘Zactly.

You really should try teh Googles. Save you lots of trouble in the future.

Let’s see…I oppose a law requiring me to spend money I don’t have to buy a product that won’t do me any good. I also oppose the transparent and criminal bribery going on in government and I oppose backroom deals being made that keeps US drug prices ten times higher than in neighboring Canada. Yep. I must be stark, raving mad. Bring on the white coats. They’re coming to take me away, ha, ha, they’re coming to take me away hee, hee, ha, ha, ho, ho…to the funny farm where life is easy all day long….

Thanks for pointing out what Obama and Emanuel are doing their best – never much to brag about – to hide: that Obama cares about his corporate sponsors. His base and middle America be damned. That is exactly the direction he is sending them with this flawed health care bill, which Obama used to corrupt reform more than to implement it.

Dennis put some conditions on his vote that the states have the right to opt out on their obiligation when they create their own universl health care programs like CA SB810. ?

Obama makes Tony Blair and Gordon Brown look like loony lefties.

When will the consequences of this bill be detailed as to who are the victims and what they are left with? Like a Hugh’s list?

I was going to say Ronald Reagan…

I’m amazed this surprises anybody.

It’s been clear to me since he refused to do anything to Lieberman.

He’s not a coward, Obama is a Reaganite.

Me, I just can’t wait for the soaring rhetoric, the pitch-perfect cadence all of which will tell us how fucked we are as we get told how lucky we are that the Bravest of the Brave stood up to the Evil Insurance Empire on our behalf.

My Crystal Ball shows me both BHO and Michelle on the boards of WellPoint, Glaxo, Merck and on and on for the rest of their lives, living the good life… houses in the Caymans, Virgin Gorda, maybe a private jet or two at their disposal… those cute kids at some Ivy League schools, with perfect seven-figure careers carved out for them just like Chelsea Clinton. Yes, it’s all worked out well for the Obamas. For the rest of America, we’re Fucked.

Thanks, oh Speech-ious one.

Matt Yglesias looks like an ass, but Barack Obama is an asshole.

Hey, Knoxville, don’t sugarcoat it, tell it like it is!

P.S. I agree with you completely.

And I agree that this what Obama could have done 9 months ago – you know, that “magic wand” that Obamabots always claimed we wanted.

This just confirms in my minds that progressives should have started out with medicare-for-all. We would be just as disappointed as now, but the Overton Window would have been moved.

So I’d like an apology from Jacob Hacker and the other centrists who thought it would be ‘pragmatic’ to push for a stupid unexplainable level playing field public option (what bad branding).

I think this bill is shitty, but I support passing it. From a political standpoint, Dems need to pass something. People respect strong and wrong more than weak and right.

I think Obama did more damage with his “spending freeze” gimmick than will happen with this bill.

The hardball Rahma and Bahma played with Kucinich is a microcosm for how they treat liberals, indeed, their entire base. Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, they will quickly take down the Democratic brand, the Democratic promise of constructive reform for the betterment of middle America.

Obama is no friend to the middle class, through whose ranks he catapulted to the top without stopping to smell the dandelions. He’s already wondering what he’ll do for a day job after he leaves the White House. I’m sure Bob Rubin has a few ideas in mind.

Their ability to “underreport” is inversely proportional to the numbers we can muster. Enough numbers, enough of a threat to the perception of meekness and order, and we’d get some coverage. Even if the coverage is only that we are “crazies,” the People will judge.

PEOPLE vs. BIG CORPORATIONS. WHICH SIDE ARE YOU ON?

The Democrat brand is dead
When is the funeral services?

link?

“People respect strong and wrong more than weak and right.”

speak for yourself.

“Powerless” my left foot. People like Yglesias would have to have been asleep during the campaign endorsement season back in ’08. Case in point, John Lewis.

I was saving this link for just the Republicans…but now am thinking that Dems need the exact same plan!

http://www.rightard.org/

Look for http://www.demtard.org in the near future!!!
Edit…take with grain of salt and a chuckle. Everyone needs one today!

It’s going to be really interesting watching Rahm and his boss trying to rationalize the big-time ass-whuppin’ the party is likely to take in November.

I am sick to my stomach. I still think Kucinich is an honorable public servant and perhaps the only one in Congress who does really have integrity and speaks for the common citizen. I’m sick at the arrogant bullying of DK that the president did up in Cleveland. That was sickening! Obviously, DK decided that to withhold his vote on this disaster of a bill would mean the muzzling of the voice he now has, and that, if nothing else, was worth preserving. I watched DK’s press conference. He DID NOT withdraw his criticisms of the bill. President Obama tried to humiliate DK during the Cleveland visit – tried to make a fool of an honest, decent man who stood up for what he believes. I can forgive a lot of things, but this I cannot forgive. I will never vote for Obama again. I will always see him a politician without honor. It’s my belief that this HC bill will prove to be the democrats’ Waterloo.

You reply to me, “for you, there is a greater philosophical issue here,people who do your kind of black and white extreme thinking, and categorize things as ‘all good’ or ‘all bad’ dont always think things through as rationally as they should.”
You’re the one doing the black and white thinking here.
It’s black and white to think it’s this bill or nothing, as you obviously do. How do you know this?
It’s black and white to think that any bill, regardless of it’s merits is a step in the right direction. You know this how?
It’s extreme, evidently to oppose forcing people to buy a crappy product from the same corporations that they currently hate, with good reason.
It’s extremist now to stand up for a woman’s right to abortion services.
It’s extreme for Americans to demand a choice of whether they want to opt into Medicare or continue with their private insurance.
It’s extreme to oppose having the struggling middle class pick up the tab for the huge subsidies the government will be funneling indirectly to the giant death-by-spreadsheet insurance corporations and the pharmaceutical industry.
Right.
Next you’ll be supporting Obama’s efforts to cut social security and Medicare, because it’s oh-so-reasonable to gut entitlement spending. It will seem rational to you when Obama argues that we will need to do this to pay for this goody-bag to the corporations, aka heathcare reform. And anyone who disagrees with you will be “extreme” and indulging in “black and white” thinking.

Kucinich’s statement doesn’t sound particularly tortured. He made a different choice in light of his vote becoming more decisive. I don’t see how Obama visiting his district is some horrible degree of pressure.

On the Blanche Lincoln point, she was bargained with to win her vote. The result of this bargaining was a sensible policy that’s been recast as a bribe, but she’s never been totally ignored. The provision she demanded in exchange for her vote for cloture is going to be removed by the reconciliation vote… does it make sense to expect to win her vote?

I’d prefer it if Obama used the OFA voter file as a trump card in all of this, but apparently he’s decided not to do that. Greenwald says that Obama could’ve done more by threatening committee positions… but Obama has nothing to do with that.

Lastly, just because there are stories about Obama offering or threatening to campaign help on one legislative issue and not HCR is not evidence that he hasn’t been doing that on HCR. I hope it’s being done, but it makes for bad PR if it’s done in public.

Slightly O/T: Anything leaking out about the closed-door meeting that Pelosi held this morning? Arm-twisting, arm-breaking or just exchanging recipes and botox tips?

I’d prefer it if Obama used the OFA voter file as a trump card in all of this

Won’t work on me, since I already put the address in my spamblocker. All the WH is gonna get is a bounce.

don’t know about that, but Kucinich should have showed up for the press conference this afternoon with his arm in a sling.

The “press” will do that for them, thinking up excuses even Rove wouldn’t imagine would try.

Seconded. When Ghandi was fasting to stop the madness, he was weak – and right.

TO Marina and JKaren

You two are liberals like my friends, those afflicted with the “bad liberal gene” which causes the heart to always be in the correct place but their minds and mouths stuck parroting media talking points. I consider it more laziness than lack of reasoning. I mean why read War & Peace when you can cheat off the test taker next to you? Eh!

So just curious Marina, Jkaren – did you actually READ the senate bill or are you getting all hot and bothered by the steaming pile of bullshit talking points Obama has been parading around? And before you respond with “I KNOW WHAT’S IN THE BILL” um, no you really don’t unless you read it for yourself because everybody is twisting the truth here. Both sides. Read it for yourself before calling everyone else out as ignorant.

This bill sucks and if you had read it in full, you would know that. Or at the very least you wouldn’t be waxing all poetic about it’s virtues but more appropriately resigned to it’s passage.

And if you claim to have actually read the stupid bill and still believe it’s the best thing EVER than can you please point me in the direction of the bill that actually helps people get health care? Because I only see the word INSURANCE COVERAGE and the insurance industry, by definition, makes money by providing policies by denying care.

I think that sentiment speaks for a lot of people who voted for him, even those who voted for him because he wasn’t McCan’t or Palin (who would always have been a single temper tantrum away from the Oval Office).

David Dayen has a fresh cross-post up: New Health Care Whip Count: Still 191 Yes, 206 No (205-209 with leaners)

The information is all over the innertubes but since you might have missed some of the stories you might find a TPM version of the story more acceptable. Sorry you missed it and don’t appear to understand the Senate filibuster rules.

The rest of your diatribe is not quite as easy to address. Interesting that you see your comment as the levelheaded response to everyone else’s comments though.

Matt Yglesias looks like an ass, but Barack Obama is an asshole.

It was my one quibble with this post. Yglesias looking silly or whatever is far less important than Obama being such an asshole. I’m just trying to put the emphasis back on Obama where it belongs.

If it passes the spin will be like nothing we’ve ever seen.

“I think he hates asking people Republicans and ConservaDems to do things contrary to what their gut tells them to do.“

You’re probably right. It will be billed as the greatest thing since the electric light bulb.

She’s following the tea leaves
She’s looking toward the sky
She lives in the world of yes
Never asking why
She can’t imagine giving in
To the notion there is a lie
That twists the line of reason
Into a self-defeating line
That reads above the entrance
Arbeit macht mann frei

But Dennis Kucinich, on the other hand, stands up for a key principle of health care reform that the president campaigned on — and gets a personal visit from Air Force One.

In the end, the ride he got on AF1 was the only concession. In contrast to the Democratic conservatives, he didn’t get a damn thing. In the end, Kucinich just lamented about the “legitimacy” of the President.

Yglesias looks like a genius in comparison.

The public will be told that this is the greatest health “care” bill in the history of the world. Of course the corporate media will make sure the message is sent across the land and the bobbleheaded public will collectively nod in agreement before beginning the chant U.S.A., U.S.A., U.S.A..

sad but true

With the Republicans reprising the political theater of the absurd, and the Democrats’ powdered wigs flying off their collective heads, can’t Kucinich and Ron Paul put aside enough differences to put the people back in power, together?

The corporate media would savage them.

Can I help you emphasize that, too?

OBAMA IS BEING SUCH AN ASSHOLE

You can’t fool all the people all the time.

A day late and a dollar short.

President Obama has been acting like he’s running for reelection in a red state…arm-twisting liberals while giving a green light to Blue Dog Democrats.

Given a huge mandate by a large bloc of Democrats and Independents (along with even a few Bush-weary Republicans), President Obama has squandered the opportunity, talking about post-partisanship and bi-partisanship, as if he was ever going to sway hardcore, right-wing, racist red-staters.

In November 2008, huge numbers of voters turned out to vote for anyone-but-a-Republican, hoping for a Blue State Democrat, not a Red State Democrat…hoping that the Democrat elected to be president would reverse the criminal policies of the previous Republican administration…hoping that the Democrat elected would hold accountable anyone responsible for the crimes committed…and hoping that the Democrat elected would block anymore conservative degradation of our liberal democracy, our liberal Constitution, our liberal, freedom-loving way of life.

Instead, we got a Democrat as president who acts like he’s running for reelection in a red state.

Not me, dumbass. I mean the independents who gave the Dems the victory for 2 years and now hate Obama.

I realize that I will now be a pariah at FDL, but you might want to check here, where you will find the following information:

Dennis Kucinich has sponsored 97 bills since Jan 7, 1997 of which 93 haven’t made it out of committee and 3 were successfully enacted.

He’s a gadfly.

INSURANCE COVERAGE

That was his big strategy before the campaign, even–not to change the system but to get everyone into it first. If something finally passes, that will be why: it makes money for the entrenched special interests that have a stranglehold on the United States government, have run (present perfect–done it and still doing it) the country into the ground for their own benefit, and orchestrating a marionette theater with the media and the politicians.

Obama was right, so he might get something passed.

.

Why would a corporatist Senator representing Bentonville, AR receive the same Obama treatment as a social justice activist who represents Cleveland, OH?

I realize that I will now be a pariah at FDL

not possible!

Oh, damn near guaran-damn-teed, since I don’t worship at the altar of St. Kucinich!

Bizarro Superman was still a good guy who flew around saving people. In comic books.

I think “things” have advanced much further toward oblivion than we’re willing/able to see. Oblivion being surfdom for us all in a corporate fascist state, which isn’t a conspiracy theory anymore, but a widely recognized likelihood.

I wonder what they got on Dennis, an’ I wonder if the main persuasion that tipped him was assurance that his admirers would not abandon him for this, they’d mostly find a way to stick by him, just like most of Obama’s admirers have done through a hundred far more heinous betrayals than this, even.

I know why so many stick with Obama, cuz I have 3 (of 4) sons who won’t listen to a word against him. They are young, they are where I once was, and the notion that the hope-guy, THEIR guy, is no better than the monsters of the past, is un-fucking-bearable. You look at your growing children, you don’t want to hear from granny boomer that Obama was all just a trick. Naturally!

Mlle Corday
Instantly Reformed Kucinichite

(Don’t hate him. Just reformed. It’s over, and it feels weird, but that’s that, unfortunately.)

me neither, and I’m still around. :)

Whew! I feel SO relieved! You’re one of the FDL folks I have a huge amount of respect for.

At least he had principles before.

Now he’s just another sell out.

You haven’t been payiong attention to the site lately have you? I think if you want to call him a saint you need to go over to Kos.

I choose not to play the “purity of thought” game. He’s ineffective as a legislator.

Um, I’m here daily, often. Don’t so much recognize your nym. Maybe we’re here at different times of day…

the feeling’s mutual! (((Marion)))

I bless you weekly for the constitutional fortitude to put together the Sunday Bobblehead lineup. I peruse, shudder, and pray for something good on SciFi or the Food Channel!

that other faux-liberal, wet-behind-the-ears, callow but intelligent and well-informed kid.

I hope you don’t mean kos.
callow but intelligent
well-informed
kid

He doesn’t rate adjectives, much less splashy ones, and much-much less “recognition” in which his name is left out because it’s “understood.” ACK. You didn’t mean him, though, I know ya didn’t.

Thanks
and to think there was a time I taped every show so I wouldn’t miss a minute *sigh*

(Reply to CarlyCorday @ 116, forgot to mash the “reply” button) Intelligent and well-informed kid? He must mean Ezra Klein…

Oh — so you’re a senior citizen like me? /wishing it were snark

veddy good :D

They count on the Accepta sleep aid to do its work on the voters, and they are never let down. The “system” works!

Ah. That fits. Excellent, thanks.

ROFL. She’s here and read NYT before you get up. LOL.

Well, that’s only because I have to be at work at 7:30!

Are you on drugs? What just is a wonderful thing about this bill passing again? Oh wait after reading your post again, I see that you are merely delusional. If you believe what you are being told by those in power, why? They have lied and lied and lied. Why do you believe them now?

Nice way to start a reply. Maybe you’re not familiar with FDL, but we try to avoid ad hominem attacks.

4th son is (again/still) an infantryman in Iraq, which has given him a priceless perspective on presidents.

You will get your gruel. You will eat your gruel. And, you will like it.

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/01/15/sunstein

So don’t be so shocked.

(We’re here to discuss, do some venting, not to conform, so if the only explanation I can see for long lecture comments pushing Obama and his destructive agenda is that the party doing it is a plant, I’ll type that all I want to, anywhere I want to. Um, while I still can.)

I can’t tell the parody from the real thing either. What would the difference be?

Then you lose friends, I wake up at 6, and I’m reading news at 7 on the east coast.

She’s saying she’s going to get bashed for not calling Kucinich a saint. Well since the entire site today is calling him a sell out, she must not be paying attention.

Neither do I. I respected him for making a stand, but he got nothing from it besides a ride on AF1. I don’t find that especially smart.

Expecting him to stand on his own, when the rest of the Progressive Caucus had already done their cheap card table imitation, was probably too much to expect. I blame them all, not just the last one to fall. In total, they’ve managed no more than Kucinich did on his own.

Its time for all of us who supported Kucinich to realize that he is just another politician who can be bullied. We must work against his re election and that of all who vote yes for this atrocity. Also, its time to start looking for a third party which will represent citizens rather than the big corporations which now control both the Dems and the Repugs. Its that simple.

Oh yeah, whining that he’s corporate backed now because he supports HRC, which I figured he’d come around eventually anyway. This bill is a referendum on the president, if it fails, he fails. So does the country, in a way. You all should go join the TEA klux klan, you’d love it. They complain about the same things, corporate backed “politicians” (yeah they aren’t called politicians unless you don’t like them) and of course, their hatred of the Obama agenda. Go join those guys and piss on the 30 million people without health coverage. Disgusting.

The malignancy is complete. No point in discussing it further. The Corporations have metastasized the entire political body. All that’s left is the rotting corpse of Lady Liberty. America is no longer in a state of decline. We are in a state of flat line. At least Dennis was the last patient in the House standing.

Hmmmm….someone who chastises another commenter for not paying attention but doesn’t know what Marion’s brought to FDL all these years.

Given the rest of the inanity today, that one actually made me laugh for the first time today.

Amen.

amen to that too!