hatch should have his bluff called

And our wonderful corporatist “mainstream” media reports Hatch’s views without comment, much less factchecking.

Kinda like how in their coverage of today’s cage match between Obama and the GOP House, they reported the House lies without comment and carefully edited Obama’s comments to make it look like he didn’t lay a glove on the Goopers.

Cut Hatch some slack. He’s had a busy day preventing progress.

ELI!!!!SUZ,……….he should be *****

(MOD NOTE: no fantasy violence please)

SADLY!!!!

I’m surprised that Hatch had the good taste not to claim
that BFF Ted Kennedy would agree with him if he were still around.

The really sad part is that the Dems will be frightened by these threats.

It really is a “reporting from a parallel universe” experience every time I see Republicans talking about how much they love bipartisanship and Democrats are mean nasty power-hungry extremists who don’t respect the Constitution.

They are an interesting breed aren’t they ?

SAW THAT……….THEY LOST all relevance LONG AGO…….audience soon to follow

What a pompous ass.

But, we’ve long known that.

“Gosh! If they’re obnoxious *now*, think how much more obnoxious they’ll be if we go through with this! They’ll all vote Nay times infinity, and then what will we do?”

Why do I hear Frank Zappa singing “with a circular motion, RUB IT”?

“(MOD NOTE: no fantasy violence please)”

Ahh ! Please ?

In essence, Hatch is threatening that Republicans will be obstructionist assholes if Democrats try to do something about Republicans being obstructionist assholes. I don’t doubt that they’ll make good on his promise, but I’m not sure how effective it is to threaten to do the exact same thing that you’re already doing and were going to continue doing anyway.

Geez…. This is a change of pace for the republicks how?

Happiness runs in a circular motion.

Oh no! The Republicans are threatening to be hostile to the Democrats!

(This is an awful lot like a guy who just hit you in the head with a crowbar and stole your wallet threatening to hit you in the head with a crowbar and steal your wallet.)

trip accidentally off a bluff

Call the pricks bluff. Calling him a prick is being charitable.

Hatch is really, really an example of someone who has been in power way too long and believes his own press releases.
Sadly, here in Utah there’s virtually no way he’ll get voted out of office until 3 terms after his passing…and the late Senator will probably won’t be as bad as his living self is.

okay back to GREAT EXPECTATIONS

More like hitting you with a crowbar because you don’t have a wallet because he already hit you with a crowbar and stole it.

“We are the Senators who say Nay and we demand you to bring us a shrubbery !”

This is some sort of reverse kung fu. If the Ds will quietly accept defeat on all issues then Hatch will call off the dogs that threaten to defeat the Ds.

Personally I’d much prefer outright hostility to the current game of rally round the lobbyist campfire. If ever the Republican request (well, Bush) to “bring it on” ever was appropriate this is it. Please, please force Obama to make a stand against the corporatist middle. Please show him that trying to be a Republican-lite is a road to failure.

Heck, if I could I’d even consider voting for Hatch if, I lived in Utah and he weren’t, well, lower than pond scum.

Sad but true.

I guess the other analogy here would be the Gang Of 14 “compromise” where the Republicans agreed to not eliminate the filibuster if the Democrats agreed not to use it.

The Ds’ version of taking a stand is being a R.

I like how Joe Lieberman always portrayed himself as a courageous maverick for standing up to the rest of the Democratic caucus. Especially when Republicans controlled all three branches of government…

I would expect the dims to stand and deliver, that is what we elected them to do. Not piss their pants because some asshole threatens them.

We have out of touch corporatist Democrats and we have crazy corporatist Republicans duking it out over how many angels can dance on the head of an insurance company exec and other equally relevant questions. We have two political parties in this country. They should be called Dumb and Dumber. Then the only question would be which is which.

I really don’t think Hatch’s threat is going to have any effect on the Democrats whatsoever. They could still very well cave (it’s kind of their thing), but it won’t be because of Hatch.

Nicely said.

I always thought Joe Lieberman portrayed himself as a contemptible scumbag. Perhaps I missed the subtleties?

The democrats are dumber by far. They controlled all three branches of government and still figured out how to pass republican legislation and lose possibly the safest senate seat in the nation.

In the movie playing inside his head he’s some kind of courageous hero, and he can’t understand why progressives are so unappreciative and ungrateful.

hummin right along I see

Two branches, but otherwise correct.

But if passing legislation leads to lower lobbyist cash then perhaps the Ds are dancing the more complicated dance.

How the hell did Ted Kennedy ever find anything to like about Hatch?

A douchebaggish font of never ending fresh fuckery.

Tell Hatch to go scratch! They had numerous chances to be bi-partisan, but they blew it. It is time for the Dems to use reconciliation to achieve what this country needs.

Aha. Missed the mind reading part.

What’s your opinion of Lieberman?

I was thinking that Hatch’s threat of more personal animosity might not be such a bad thing. I think personal fondness for Republican friends is one of the reasons Democrats are so trusting and accommodating. Probably not the biggest, tho.

Perhaps that’s why Kennedy, having passed, was so in favor of the current HRC. We can imagine what we want and there is no one to prove otherwise.

In what way has there been any legislation to do that?

FORCE HIM to stand up on the floor and talk/mumble/rail/faint/die – I don’t care. Just force him to make good on his threat OR GO AWAY – for good.

It’s not obvious? How else could he be so smug and self-satisfied?

shit eatin dog fucker of the lowest denomination. . .and those are his good points

Wow, very frightening. Yawn.

If you didn’t like him would you put him with Bush/Cheney or slightly above?

Beats the shit out of me how he could be so smug and self-satisfied. You should be aware that I’ve made commenters on other threads go thru an agonizing interchange to explain to me how people, totally unlike me and everyone I know, think. But you get off easy tonight. I’m not in the mood to make you explain to me how JoeLie thinks in excrutiating detail.

With apologies to dogs?

Today was the first time that Obama got some spine in front of the House Republcans. Where was that guy when they could have used him. Given that, will the Democrats continue the spine and with they throw Lieberman off the chairmanship and politely ignore Hatch.

It is said that the only way you stop a bully is smack them in nose and they bleed all over. So – lets see them remove Lieberman when he shoots his mouth off and politely let Hatch rant and rave and vote him down.

They have to act fast and no fooling around. They still have the majorities.

well that’s never gonna fly as a campaign slogan.

Suffice it to say that lots of assholes don’t actually think they’re assholes.

Ask eCAHN for rankings, I’m a qual guy. . . I guess I should have left off the denomination part!

That I know. It’s the specifics that are fascinating, or not. Actually productive to figure it out in the sense of “know your enemy.”

Zing on me! *g*

I’m surprised there is no discussion of Obama v the moron corps today…oh wit he did well so we’ll ignore it just like Fox.

The wife says it’s night. It’s night.

Have fun.

Today was the first time that Obama got some spine in front of the House Republcans. Where was that guy when they could have used him.

I had the exact same reaction. Obama should have been calling out their illogic, obstruction and hypocrisy rather than making lukewarm statements about how he preferred the public option but was open to alternatives.

Couldn’t listen very long. O still constantly called for compromise. Is that spine?

I actually am pretty fascinated by people’s personal narratives (it was one of my very early posts on my home blog), and how often they’re out of whack with reality. I think it might be one of the things that makes reality shows so appealing to so many people (and so repellent to me).

I’m watching the Olbermann, Rachel and Matthews review of it right now.

I like him better now than I did Wednesday – he once again looked like the smartest guy in the room.

I’ve only had time to read some excerpts, will read the whole thing this weekend. From what I saw, he had some very strong, very sharp rebuttals to Republican foolishness.

People’s narratives was a great way to write a dissertation.

me too

It sounded a lot like Tony Blair during Question Time. I caught a little bit of that on C-Span many years before Bush, and not only did he deftly handle every hostile question, he seemed to be enjoying himself while doing it.

That’s one thing Rachel pointed out about how dumb the pukes were today, they don’t know how to do this like the Brits do.

As Raven intimated, I’m so far into reality that it takes a lot of ‘splainin’ to make me see the alternate reality as others see it.

Have you been watching Blair at the British commish? A shadow of his former self.

I watched a little of that today too. Seemed like he was fielding a lot of softballs….

No, not much interest, really. I lost all respect for Blair after Iraq.

I’m not a kabuki analyst when it comes to British commishes. A lot seemed like what you say, but they do drone on, and I’m a sucker for a British accent, meaning I think they might be leading him into a trap. Silly me.

I lost all respect for Blair when he became W’s BFF.

More like a shadow of a shadow of his former self.

Oh, and around the same time, I became aware of Greg Palast’s underground report on Blair. Palast posed as some corp whore enquiring what the price to play was. Found out pretty quickly. Blair was simply bought. Not a surprise, but Palast got the goods.

Considering his former self was a shadow (my 77), perhaps we’re saying the same thing.

It helps that Blair has a cold or something, so that his voice at the commish proceedings is raspy.

breaking news upstairs

I just got home and everyone seemed to be having a good time, then,…
breaking news upstairs. And, then? Just saying….the party got pooped on, again.

It was like Obama suddenly snapped out of a year-long coma today. Except for the bonding on “clean” coal, nuclear energy, drilling, etc.

sorry — i don’t have control over when breaking news breaks demi

A Hostile republican promising to be more hostile? This is news?

A recessive obstructionist threatening to be a recessive obstructionist?

If Obama buys this stuff from Hatch he is sunk and so is the Democratic Party.

FDR welcomed his enemies and never stopped fighting. He was threatened in many ways far worse than Hatch et al could ever dream of.

The mistake Obama has made is to naively believe that Republicans would be reasonable.

These are ham handed threats made by someone whose goal is to obstruct and
hopes these tactics will silence Obama. As leader of his party Obama must be bold about what he wants to do and use all of the political tools he has to advance his policies.

Obama has brought some of this on himself by compromising, sitting on his hands,and not taking a strong and open positin on healthcare from day one.

Obama should use this as a lesson in political strategy. If reconcilliation can bring about a decent bill, no Republican threats should stop this. Obama has to learn how to be respected, and yes, feared.

Without political strength emerging from the Democrats, the Republicans will still be running the country to the ground.

Remember how the culture of corruption Republicans treated the Democratic minority in Congress during the criminal Bush/Cheney years when the Republicans were the majority? Remember how Democrats were not even allowed use of congressional hearing rooms to conduct investigations into Bush/Cheney, but were relegated to meeting in the basement?

This is what I don’t get. Almost all the Republicans during the criminal Bush/Cheney years emulated Cheney’s response to Sen. Patrick Leahy on the Senate floor and told the Democrats to go f*ck themselves, over and over again, over one issue after another.

Now that Republicans have even fewer members in the House and Senate than the Democrats had, the Democratic Party leadership bends over backwards seemingly to appease the Republicans, even as the Republicans obstruct repeatedly, just stopping short of actually sticking a knife in the back of all the Democrats.

The Republicans, as they veer further and further to the right, look more and more pathological. Nothing constructive offered. Nothing common-sense proposed. Greed and pathological lying trumping everything else including what is best for our country and for the most American citizens.

And yet Democratic Party leaders, starting in the Obama administration, keep trying to reach across the aisle, reach some type of compromise, even when, from all appearances, they should be telling all the pathological Republicans to go f*ck themselves. Use reconciliation to pass liberal progressive legislation, including pro-public option healthcare reform (minus the mandate, minus any anti-abortion riders). Use recess appointments (like Bush Junior did) to bypass obstructionist Republicans in the Senate.

President obviously wants to be friends with the pathological Republicans. He wants to shake their blood-soaked hands, and yet he seems to keep forgetting to check their free hand, which holds a shiv that they’re aching to stick in him and anything he proposes. How can anyone “play nice” with the bully running amok on the political playground?

We must live on different planets. Just saying we see things differently. Don’t worry. I’m not hanging. Just seeing patterns that I perceive.

Of course less lobbyist cash is what has motivated the votes against the Public Option from the Blue Dogs, etc.

Lobbyist monies promise campaign cash for all and it certainly has been persuasive. The goings on in the Senate were stomach turning.

Oracle,

Thanks for your terrific post.

I’m just saying it seemed like folks were having fun and now it’s just another place to say the FU over and over. Hear me or don’t.

good article, eli, except for that nasty looking photo up top that i keep seeing every time i refresh.

Eli late to the party but my knives are sharp we will hunt.

And as Cuatomec as my witness we will fight! Nuff said!

You’re right Bluetoe2, you are being charitable…

I say – Fuck ‘em! Call Hatch’s bluff – provided the “minority” of 58 senate dems have the balls to do it

Make the “majority” of 41 GOP senators filibuster so the whole nation can see first hand what obstructionist, brownshirted fascists the rethuglicants really are.

I did try to find a photo of boobies hatching, but couldn’t find anything quite suitable…

Here’s the problem………

Back in the ’80s, I decided that it was best to give up any thoughts of flipping fellow drivers the bird or honking my horn in anger when they cut me off on the highway. Not because I had decided to develop the patience of a saint, but because I realized that some of those crazy drivers are just crazy enough to respond by pulling out a gun and literally shooting me.

And similarly, when today’s version of the Republican party threatens all out, scorched earth-type, nuclear annihilation-level response…. well, we better be prepared to deal with that. Because Republicans today are, very literally, THAT crazy.

Now I’m not saying that Democrats shouldn’t end Republican obstruction by any means necessary. In fact, I think they don’t have a choice in the matter. But I am saying that they’d better plan for the over the top, all out war reaction when they do.

But if they use reconciliation, they can actually pass the public option without a filibuster (which doesn’t exist in its Mr. Smith form anymore, unfortunately, it’s more like a painless procedural vote: If the Democrats have 60 votes, the filibuster fails; if they don’t, it succeeds).

It’s hard for me to imagine what they could do at this point that would be worse than what they’ve already been doing that wouldn’t also make them look even more like insane screeching fanatics.

Gregg Levine is upstairs!
Late Night: How Not to be Seen

What I would like to know is, How does this empty suit keep getting elected? Never offers any solutions,thinks he is more relevant than he is, and always stays well within his party lines with the usual hypocrisy he demonstrates here. He might obstruct? I would expect nothing less from this maggot!

Habit.
Welcome to Firedoglake!

I managed to get this to the Fark.com politics tab for a little more exposure-slated to be there around 3 a.m:
http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4983314#new

I agree, it’s hard for me to imagine too. But one thing that I’ve realized is that Repubicans have far darker imaginations than I do. So I have no doubt that they will come up with something. It will be dirty, and it’ll be something that cause us to say ‘this is a new low even for them.’

Everytime I think they can’t go any lower or play any dirtier, Republicans find a new low. And I’m not saying this because I’m afraid of them or because I think Democrats should be afraid. But it seems to me that every time Republicans find a new low, Democrats are caught off guard and the new dirty trick works. So I don’t want us caught off guard again.

Rove Republican Tactic #1: Attack their strength.

Rove Republican Tactic #2: Ask Frank Luntz to poll to find out what scares people the most, then repeat talking points ad nauseum that the Democrats are doing that.

Rove Republican Tactic #3: If you don’t have time to consult Luntz, just project and you can’t go wrong scaring the bejeezus out of people.

And finally don’t forget the Rove Republican Prime Directive: “Bi-partisanship is another word for date rape.”

Let’s go back to the 1990 DC male prostitution scandal, shall we?
Steve Gobie, who Barney Frank had befriended, hired as an aide, and allowed to stay at his apartment, turned some tricks there, without Frank’s knowledge.
Barney fired him when when this news broke, but (of all people) Larry Craig (!) went after Frank, and attempted to have him censured and expelled. An investigation cleared Frank, but DC insiders indicated that it was the threat of revealing the identity of at least one of those “tricks” that made all that go away. Can you guess who that might have been? (Context is everything ).

Orrin Hatch supported reconciliation for the Bush tax cuts.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=108&session=1&vote=00196#position

He needs to get off his high horse.

My penis resents the fact that you even drew that parellel.

from the plumline.com:
Which is interesting, because Hatch voted for…

* The College Cost Reduction Act of 2007, which passed through reconciliation;

* The Tax Increase Prevention and Reconciliation Act of 2005, which passed through reconciliation;

* The Deficit Reduction Act of 2005, which passed through reconciliation;

* The Jobs and Growth Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2003, which passed through reconciliation;

* The Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001, which passed through reconcilation;

* The Marriage Tax Penalty Relief Reconciliation Act of 2000, which passed through reconciliation; and

* The Taxpayer Refund and Relief Act of 1999, which passed through reconciliation.

Perhaps Hatch would argue that passing health care reform through reconciliation would constitute an abuse of the process in a way that his own votes didn’t. Maybe someone should ask him to explain?

Thanks to Amanda Erickson for the research help.

i’m sure the lds faith has something about not lying; what is amazing though is the msm and those wonderful talking heads on cable feel it is not their responsibility to call a lie a lie.

“facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.” a. huxley