Hello Everyone, and welcome!

Richard, Welcome to the Lake.
Colin, Welcome to the Lake from across the pond.

Jeanne, Thank you for Hosting today’s Book Salon.

Hi All, Good to be with you. Colin Robinson

I’m happy to be here. I think this project is really exciting.

Hi Colin, Hi Jeanne. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Colin, since you chimed in first…
Can you tell us a little bit about how this project got started? Going Rouge is the first publication from OR Books, correct?

Richard and Colin, thanks for this book!

How did you come to pick these specific authors?

Yes. We startred the publishing company in the smmer and had not planned on putting out any new books until next year. But then this project came up, and it seemed irresistible.

*rubs hands together*

i love this book. SRSLY.

Welcome to Firedoglake!

How has the response from the public been to the book compared to what you expected?

I’m not entirely sure whether there would be copyright issues, but a book of just her tweets would be enough to extract confessions from criminals.

And thanks for hosting this salon, Jeanne!

Good afternoon and welcome to FDL Richard, Colin, and Jeanne.

I have not had a chance to read your book (and absolutely no interest whatsoever in reading Going Rogue. I would usually ask how you can write a parody book when the person being parodied is someone like Palin, but then saw in the introduction that you used real life examples.

It just seems to be getting more and more difficult to writer parodies and satires when the subjects are populating our airwaves each day.

I loved the section in Going Rouge that showed her Top 25 Tweets. A great sadness of mine is that one of her “handlers” put the kibosh on those spontaneous twitterings…

Hi Peter and hi to Bev too–thanks for organizing this. The authors represent what Betsy and I think are the very best essays on Sarah Palin written during the campaign and through the present moment. Reading over the TON of stuff about her–we were really impressed with how quickly and thoroughly progressives and feminists were able to hone in on the important issues–Palin’s record as governor, her connections to the extreme right, her ethics abuses during Troopergate and the cynical logic behind picking her as VP candidate in the wake of the Hillary-Obama dust up. Going Rouge is the testament to their great work.

Of course, so much of what progressives were able to do depended on the work Jeanne and Shannyn Moore has done as bloggers up in Alaska, not just during the campaign, but WAY before that–when nobody in the Lower 49 really knew who she was. So we are beyond delighted to have both of them in the book too.

Well in terms of parody– SP’s tweets really do the job on their own. But of course, there’s a lot of dangerous stuff lurking in her lies and challenged language. So we had to include some serious material too!

The response has exceeded our wildest expectations. The book first gained attention, I believe, because of the play on the title and the striking simlarity of the covers, but then word got out that Going Rouge is actually terrific read, as you would expect from a boook with so many great contributors. I also think people have been buying it as a way of protesting against the publishing and media hooplah that has surrounded Palin’s own book.

Thanks for the nice words, Richard. I was honored to be asked to participate in the project with such great writers and thinkers.

So, I’m going to ask the question – Have either of you read Going Rogue?

Her book tour tweets are nearly incomprehensible, so if that’s her “handler’s” work, then she should think about getting another handler.

Richard and Colin – Did anybody you contacted NOT want to participate in this?

I’ve dipped into it. It seems well written in the main and it’s a compelling story. But that just makes the politics it carries more dangerous.

I have. I have to say, her ghost writer–Lynn Vincent–is pretty good. I mean, I can only imagine how much work it was to turn SP’s narrative into a coherent book.

Two things about it. It’s a LOT meaner to the GOP machine than I had thought it would be. She’s really Sarah Baracuda in it. Second, if there can be said to be a point to the book — it’s free markets all the way. That’s where SP is the most ideological and dangerous, I think.

I’m glad it’s done so well. I’m curious about how many e-books vs. paper copies you’ve sold. Can you estimate what percentage of your total sales comes from e-books?

part of me wonders if the best thing would be to just completely ignore Sara Palin and all her idiot followers. Don’t give them any coverage don’t even make fun of them just act like they don’t exist. Maybe they would pass into obscurity. But of course we know the media isn’t going to do that. I just feel like giving her any coverage is in some way validating her as a political figure. If we ignore her bullshit craziness maybe she will go away. It works well for me when dealing with crazy people on the bus.

You know, this is the first time I’ve been asked this. And in terms of previously published material — I think almost every single author we contacted was beyond happy to participate. So that’s a sign of something.

Colin & Richard,

I just finished reading or skimming your book. A friend loaned me his copy for the weekend. It’s good to have all these important articles under one cover. You did a good job of grouping them into categories.

I was thinking, as I read, “There should be more in here about her anti-science stances over the years.” Then I realized that perhaps nobody has yet written a definitive article on that subject. Also, her obsession with secrecy, as exemplified by the state of Alaska’s shutdown of public access to a lot of information while she was governor. It is covered well in the context of the McCain campaign’s heavy-handed insinuation into the AK executive branch in the fall of 2008, but not so well as a pattern that was already there.

Still – the best book out there yet on Palin’s vast shortcomings as a true leader.

Hiya, AKM!

Watertiger — Believe me…I thought LONG and HARD about that question before we did the book and even during the media hoopla over it. But more and more, I am convinced we cannot ignore her. Think about what she has said most recently about climate change–that Obama should boycott Copenhagen and that any form of cap and trade regulation would damage the economy. Then think this: today, only 36 percent of Americans think climate change is man made, and all these GOP congressman are headed to COP15 to carry SP’s message.

She is the most effective spokesperson now for the Tea Party party…and that kind of crazy, we can’t afford to ignore.

This book is great — I’m in the middle and enjoying every essay in it.

Can you tell us how a book like this comes together so quickly? There are so many contributors; are all the essays reprinted from elsewhere, or are there original sections? Is it hard to get reprint permissions?

Thanks so much for this book. Since she isn’t going away anytime soon, Going Rouge will be an invaluable resource, I imagine, on Sarah Palin’s history. She’s certainly invested a lot of time and money in re-writing it, and it’s great to have this book as a reference.

sorry that last reply was for bforbendetta — not watertiger.

I just want to say this was a genius production and kudos for getting it up and out the door in time.

SP is not on a bus, she’s on a private jet and she has the backing of many powerful and rich people. The section of the book about the visits to her governor’s mansion in Alaska by the leading lights of the right of the Republican party prior to her pick by McCain is very eye-opening. She did not emerge form nowhere. As to the e-book vs paprback sales, the paperback has been far more popular. though we have sold a lot of downloads too – I’d say between 5 and 10% of all sales.

Different kind of crazy person, different kind of bus.

May you prosper from this – and live long.

I agree, Richard. Those who are her “base” are not going anywhere. They’ve bought what she has to sell and they’re in it for the long haul. At this point, ignoring her just means she can continue to influence these people but without scrutiny.

I think the time for ignoring her is past. Unfortunately.

You’ve done an excellent job of getting some really important messages on record in one place.

Unless you ride the D6 bus that goes up and down K Street in DC, the crazy people on your bus are not trying to influence and set national policies on things like health care, Afghanistan, climate change, etc. Ignoring Sarah Palin and her followers would be a serious mistake. They need to be noticed and held up to scrutiny and ridicule, so that it’s not contagious.

Indeed, that is the point of Jeanne’s piece “The Ugly Irony of Going Rogue.”

Jeanne, your thoughts?

glad you came ’round. didn’t know what to get myself for xmas. think i know now.

palin is such an asshole. doncha think??

Edward Teller — nice handle. Don’t nuke us! Ok but seriously, yes, SP is clearly ramping up to be the major opponent of climate change in the next year. She’s perfectly poised to do this as former gov of Alaska, the cheerleader for drill baby drill. And of course, on sex ed, she supports ab-only education, also not backed by science! But in both cases, she has a kind of personal appeal–she’s the frontierwoman and Bristol’s mom–so at least with the GOP base, that makes her someone to listen to on these subjects. If not someone who listens to science.

Can you believe that her WaPo op-ed claimed that it was Obama who was politicizing science!

I was very glad to be reminded that one of the leading conservative lights who visited her during the right-wing-cruises was Michael Gerson, for instance. Much is made over the Weekly Standard and NRO contributors who puffed her up after those luncheons in the governor’s mansion and helicopter rides, but we very seldom see mention of Gerson being there. He had just moved from his Bush WH speechwriting post to the neocon op-ed page at the Washington Post, so being part of that Northern Lights cruise is very telling to me.

Palin’s audio-book (ack!) is being released on December 26 to sell as many hard-cover copies as possible before the holidays. Any plans for a follow-up audio book?

I don’t think we can afford to ignore Sarah Palin. We must document her continual stream of lies on an on-going basis. She managed to pull end of life counseling from the health care bill FROM FACEBOOK! It’s not that the MSM media is to blame so much as the GOP is pandering to her.

I have a question for Jeanne. How have Alaskans reacted to her book? I am SO curious!

Is Palin doing her own audio-book, or William Shatner?

We have been talking about an audio version. It’s more difficult with the different voices of an anthology but if people want it …

I touched on that in my comment 33 that posted right before yours. We crossed messages there, I think. But the fact that she continues to influence policy, and guide the debate from Twitter and Facebook is alarming.

A tech note:

If you are replying to a specific comment, click on the “reply” button underneath and to the right of that comment. This will put a little ribbon above the “Leave your response” box that says “Replying to XXX @ ##”. Type your reply as usual, and it puts that nice little “In response to . . .” note inside your comment when it appears.

Do any of you think she risks overexposure at any point? she’s becoming fairly ubiquitous these days.

Teddy — the book has both previously published material and new content, Jeanne’s essay for example, and a forum with Mike Tomasky, Chris Hayes, Jane Hamsher of FDL! and Amanda Marcotte. It’s a lot of paper work getting reprint permissions for sure. But all the writers were so thrilled to be included.

Somehow, having seen a few too many TV ads where Going Rogue is being offered for $4.95 and a “free” subscription to NewsMax, I think she might have hit the wall on actual hard back sales.

But then I might be an idiot.

Richard,
I think that a lot of Alaskans are angry about it, or disgusted. There are certain things that are very obviously untrue, or twisted truth that Alaskans would notice more than a casual reader in the Lower 48 who is more interested in her “story.”

She will be signing books here on Sunday, finally. But she is doing it only on military bases – one in Anchorage and one in Fairbanks. She understands that a group with signs calling her out on her nonsense is pr she doesn’t want to have.

For me, Palin is about the empty suits our elites choose to work through. There are two distinct editions of this. Reagan, Bush II, McCain, and Palin, media stars and empty vessels. Bush I, Clinton and Obama, less empty, more overly corporatist.

Agreed.

I’m in Missouri, and she’s still the conservative darling of the rightwing corners of our state.

I think overexposure is an oxymoron in contemporary American politics.

Just popping by to say thank you so much for putting “Going Rouge” together!

If she does keep this up, aiming toward 2012, you’re going to have to do a sequel. Let me suggest a working title: “Also“

Originally, I believe, Going Rouge was only available online at orbooks.com. But now it is available in selected bookstores. Can you talk a little bit about why you decided to change strategy on this project?

Do you mean over exposed in a Levi Johnston kind of way? Um, er, ok…well, I think a lot might change after 2010–after the mid term and as the GOP gets serious about picking a candidate. But until then, all SP has to do is keep up her facebook and twitter feeds and write the occasional op-ed against health care, climate change (or immigration reform, EFCA, anything the Dems want to do) and it will be instant news flash for her. That’s not all that much work now that she’s quit being governor.

Followed, of course by:

Also, too.

:0)

Jeanne’s experience might be different from mine, but Palin lost a lot of luster among long-time followers when she quit. I was at a meeting at Wasilla’s biggest bookstore the week her book came out and last week (yes, they have a bookstore in Wasilla). I could see the stand on which Going Rogue was displayed for hours. Nobody bought a single copy.

We didn’t change strategy. Our model, which has never beofre been tried, is to sell direct to the reader for a period so that we can devote the money otherwise going on big bookstore discounts and distribution costs to promoting the book with a serious budget. Once we had got a buzz going for it, we passed it on to a conventional publisher to sell it in bookstores. That’s what we’ll be aiming to do with all our books

The thought of a Going Rouge audio book seemed appealing to me, with all the different voices. I think it would be interesting for posterity.

Can someone please capsulize for me why she’s the anti-feminist? My 28 year old son is a wingnut and just luvs him some Sarah Palin. As a female Wall St pioneer, this pains me greatly. But I’ve had a hard time articulating why she’s the opposite of me.

I think the proper response is “couldn’t have done it without you!”

I was just re-reading your contribution, and loved your description of getting the news that Palin was chosen as McCain’s running mate.

Shorter Sarah Palin: Alaska who?

It’s been great to see Going Rouge in bookstores. I love the OR books model–which works I think for everyone–the writers and readers.

Can someone explain how she gets access to military bases so easily? A protest was organized online over her Ft Hood appearance, but it went ahead anyway. Do other authors get book signings on-base, or is this special treatment? Why do we allow our troops and their families to be preyed upon by this serial liar who questions the birth certificate and legitimacy of the commander in chief, especially during wartime?

Great. Thanks for clearing that up. If people want to purchase the book from a bookstore, where can they go? Is there a list of merchants available online?

You really need to get this book, eCAHN. Jessica Valenti takes that question and runs with it, as do others. Jessica’s title: “The F-Card Won’t Wash: Sarah Palin is Disastrous for Women’s Rights.”

Who’s the reader? Presumably not Sarah herself, as I suspect her reading skills might not match her taylor made specifying.

Seems like I should send a copy to my son for Christmas. And then, when he complains, act ignorant, like I didn’t know that I hadn’t sent him her real book. *g*

I don’t think that’s fair as a magazine at large. We have been intensely critical of his escalation in Afghanistan, for example. And continue to publish tough critics of Obama like Jeremy Scahill and Naomi Klein.

But I think it is fair to say, there’s a lot of anguish on the progressive left these days. You can direct that at Obama–and that is fair in a lot of ways–but then, look at the filibuster in the Senate, or the damage that GOP minority has been able to do–aided and abetted by bluedog dems.

One commentator missing from your contributors is Andrew Sullivan, whose obsession with Trig’s birth overwhelms his rather commendable focus on “The lies of Sarah Palin.” Did you consider asking Sullivan to contribute to this book?

As I understand it–the military does not consider her a politician, but a private citizen, and has given her access to do some events on the basis. I could be wrong…so worth checking out.

It’s in all the independents now, and the major chains too. Indeed we recently received an irate note from a Palin fan who claimed that Barnes and Noble was giving Gpoing Rouge preferential placement over Palin’s own book and that purchasers should be vigilant when entering this left-leaning bookstore chain so as not to be fooled into buying the wrong book.

Perhaps there’s someone else here who can speak more to what is normally allowed on military bases, and what kind of access other authors can expect to get. I know that her military base appearances continue, despite some problems that have occurred. I find it disturbing. She also paid a visit to Walter Reed a few days ago, so she’s doing the rounds.

Some patients would not allow her in their rooms for a visit despite a generally warm reception.

They used a number of Sully’s “Lies” and credited him for it.

LMAO! Barnes & Noble, communist booksellers!

Also Gloria Steinmen’s essay on Going Rouge explains Palin’s anti-feminist position really well. Being a feminist is not just about electing ANY woman, it’s about electing women (and men) who advance policies that are good for women. Palin falls far short of that standard.

Believe it or not, she actually does read the book herself from what I’ve heard. I may be wrong, but I’m not going to listen, in case I’m right.

I hope there are a lot of mix-ups under the Xmas tree and in stockings on December 25th and all the Palin worshipers in my area (Central Texas) who have Palin bumper stickers on their pick up trucks get a copy of Going Rouge. Of course these people don’t can’t read and only listen to FAUX, they won’t know that they have been tricked.

Andrew Sullivan did some great blogging on SP. But we were really looking in this volume for essays that had a more connected feel. Certainly, we credit him for all his work in tracking her lies, but we felt that some of his blog posts raised points that other writers did in a more essay format.

A lot of people have moved on, as has Palin. She comes back from time to time, but many of her former followers aren’t even thinking of her in terms of still being an Alaskan.

Last week, at the Eagle River Fred Meyer, I bumped into Walt Monegan, the Public Safety Commissioner Palin fired because he wouldn’t fire Palin’s ex-brother-in-law from the State Troopers. Hence the term “Troopergate.”

I asked Walt if he was glad to be out of the limelight. He said yes, and that he’s glad “she’s gone.” He’s substitute teaching grade school, and enjoys doing it. He probably should be heading up the current governor’s ramped-up efforts fighting Alaska’s 3rd world levels of domestic violence and sexual abuse. But the state government hasn’t moved on beyond Palin to the point where they’d be willing to re-hire such a valuable administrator as Monegan.

Colin, that’s great. Now that Going Rouge is out there in stores, there will be an interesting dynamic as the two books are juxtaposed. Good fun.

One trick is to take a couple of copies of Going Rouge pile and place them on top of the Going Rogue pile. The bookstore personnel will never notice.

Clinton’s audio book was (except for the introduction which Clinton read himself) read by a professional with a similar accent. Very effective. But then I suppose there’s no professional reader around with Sarah’s twang. You betcha.

Well, the best place to get the book is still http://www.orbooks.com. BUt it is also available at Barnes and Noble and Borders bookstores. I am not so sure about the distribution to independent booksellers…that’s in the paperback publisher’s hands, but I certainly hope they are there. If not–call your indy book publisher and ask to go rouge!

You can direct that at Obama–and that is fair in a lot of ways–but then, look at the filibuster in the Senate, or the damage that GOP minority has been able to do–aided and abetted by bluedog dems

Obama is a Blue Dog Democrat.

I like that idea.

Is it an understatement to suggest that this is Ms. Palin running for president and padding her wallet at the same time, something that would have landed her in a sauna had she tried to do both while governing Alaska? It also gives her a private life, with no public right to peek, so long as she is not a public official. Ms. Palin may be wearing Little Red Riding Hood’s cloak, but she has very long teeth and a tail.

Fox News twice featured the wrong book in screen shots during discussions of Going Rouge. This was commented on by, among many others, Page Six in the New Yorm Post. We therefore were able to enjoy a Murdoch TV station being poked fun at in a Murdoch newspaper, for accidentally promoting a rival book to the lead title of a Murdoch publisher. It does not get better.

I haven’t been following the Alaska news as closely as I should be — but does Palin still meddle in state party politics? Like–if MOnegan were to be reappointed, does she have enough clout to do anything about it? My sense from reading Jeanne and Shannyn’s blogs is no…

Given the “beyond happy” reaction when the authors were asked to contribute to the book, they might be excited about the idea of doing an audio version of the book, too.

Of course, someone would have to read Palin’s tweets and the excerpts from her speeches. William Shatner might be just the one to ask. He’s got experience, after all.

and yet she cons all the rubes in the lower 48 with her “Alaska-ness”.

She really is a consummate grifter.

Not mine, originally. Some one else (can’t remember who) at FDL passed it on to me. Can do it with all the conservative books, but bookstore personel might notice. I’m going into Manhattan this coming week and intend to do my work at least at the neighborhood B&N, if not several other bookstores.

I don’t think there was any question that the moment she signed the book deal, she was preparing an exit strategy from the governorship. Alaska law states that the governor cannot hold down another job and there would have been head explosions if she had gone off to do a media tour while still in office.

but she has very long teeth and a tail.

And horns.

A fitting image. Some say Blackwater has pre-ordered an entire box of the audio version of Going Rogue, for use in interrogation centers in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

As usual, WT, a way with the words.

Is it ok for you if we buy it from Amazon?

Sure would make me confess to anything in an eyeblink.

Can someone please capsulize for me why she’s the anti-feminist?

Think of Phyllis Schlafly or even Clarence Thomas, people who trash precisely the aspects of society that allowed them to get to where they got in society.

Yes!

This question is probably trivial, but if she’s really running for President, she needs to maintain that wholesome “soccer mom” image to placate her base. So what’s the real story on her and “The First Dude?”

It’s better for us if you buy from OR Books – http://www.orbooks.com – but we will be happy if you buy it from anywhere at all.

I’m afraid that’s right. He is an opponent of constructive reform, not its advocate. Ms. Palin seems to be an opportunist of angst, though her recent appearance in Canada suggests making money is more important than her principles, if she has any. Perhaps she thought no one here would take note, Canada being a furrin country dontchaknow.

Colin,
The mix-ups at FOX were classic. And Murdoch v. Murdoch v. Murdoch… a circular firing squad of the highest order.

And since I have you here, I wanted to tell you that I loved your description of Going Rouge as the “skunk at Sarah Palin’s garden party.” Perfect.

Here’s one thing to keep an eye on in terms of Palin 2012. The GOP sets its primary schedule for 2012 next summer (2010). There’s a lot of debate now as to whether Iowa, NH and SC should still be first. When the primaries should start, etc. Look to see how much Palin surrogates intervene in that process–that will be a sign of how serious and smart she is about running.

Sean Parnell, her successor as Governor, has made some moves that show a bit of independence from Palin’s policies. He is keeping her mineral development policies intact, lock, stock, pipeline, mineshaft and barrel. But he has shown an honest interest in the plight of rural – mostly Alaska Native – Alaskans, has started what may become a model effort for dealing with domestic violence and sexual abuse here, and – well – he’s fairly honest, which is his biggest departure from his predecessor.

Thanks. I got that part. But that does not explain it to my son, who does not see it that way. I need to figure out his POV in order to counter it. When she got on the ticket, he was wildly enthusiatic because of her rabble rousing speech skills, her appeal to the base, and “to women,” who would presumably identify with her, thus bleeding one of the big D bases. Of course that didn’t happen because women didn’t identify with her. But, as my son’s a wingnut, evidence did not change his opinion.

Richard,
I’ve heard you and Betsy Reed give several excellent interviews about Going Rouge. Progressive radio (which is where I spend most of my time)has been good to you. Have other more mainstream media sought you out as well?

Thanks for loaning me your copy of Going Rouge. Not too much the worse for wear.

Sean Parnell is more of the same…less lipstick and drama…but same backward motion for most issues in AK.

Jeanne, setting your own contribution aside, which of the pieces had you howling with laughter and/or saying “Yeah — that nailed it!”?

Palin had policies? Do tell.

Thank you Jeanne. Since I have you here I want to thank you for your manginificent work in getting the truth out about Palin over the past years (and for your excellent piece in the book). It really does restore faith in the possibility of effective journalism at a time when it’s easily shaken

Well, there should be a FDL chat on Obama–stymied progressive or enemy of reform? Look, I hear you all when it comes to financial regulation and the wars–the two biggest issues on the table, for me. But on healthcare, climate change and EFCA — I think the deck is still stacked against any reformer in Washington. Sad to say.

That might be harsher on an Moslem prisoner’s psyche than listening 24/7 to Christmas songs sung by Orrin Hatch.

Ms. Palin’s anti-intellectualism, her McCain-like shoot from the hip style, her Miss America-like memory for slight grievances are frightening. Bush proved someone with limited intellect, curiosity and energy could hold the presidency for eight years, lowering the bar sufficiently so that Palin could imagine doing it, too. But she seems like Bush on steroids, more of all his negative qualities. Why is that attractive to so many?

Sarah would have been smart to hire the folks who dressed and groomed her for the election to do so for the book tour.

Yes, Betsy, of course, was on Entertainment TOnight’s The INsider. And I’ve done MSNBC and CNBC. The last was a debate with GOP pollster Kellyeann Conway. It became such a shoutfest, that the network superimposed boxing gloves on our faces–twice!

But the progressive radio has just been the best. Thoughtful, about the issues and about the politics. Not asking me questions about Levi or her hair.

Well, no question that I LOVED the pieces by Shannyn Moore and Elstun Lauesen, the other two Alaskan writers featured in the book. They are both extremely smart and perceptive. Other than that, I think my favorite passage came from Matt Taibbi. I’ll see if I can find it and type it in here quickly…

evidence did not change his opinion

That is the problem with wingnuts. You can’t reason with them and they hate being ignored.

The only stack in the deck is campaign contributions. O is campaign contribution whore-in-chief, and we have many “chats” to that effect.

Well, the GOP answer to that is — Sarah and George are just like you and your neighbors. You can have a beer with them. They’re just folks. I don’t know if the GOP realizes how much of an insult that is to so many millions.

Of course. Still, if I could figure out his POV, it would help me, if not contributing to my communication with him.

Ah… Here it is. (from Matt Taibbi)
“Sarah Palin is a symbol of everything that is wrong with the modern United States. As a representative of our own political system, she’s a new low in reptilian villainy, the ultimate cynical masterwork of puppeteers like Karl Rove. But more than that, she is a horrifying symbol of how little we ask for in return for the total surrender of our political power.”

It goes on, but you get the idea. He nailed it.

But on healthcare, climate change and EFCA — I think the deck is still stacked against any reformer in Washington

Obama didn’t pick a Blue Dog DLCer like Rahm for his Chief of Staff because the disagreed with him. The biggest force against change we can believe in sits in the Oval Office.

I agree that the Senate is as much a stumbling block to reform as was the House of Lords a hundred years ago. But Mr. Obama has not revealed any ache to reform the current rapacious health insurance industry or to improve the delivery of health care. His public inaction and lack of commitment suggests he feels those industries are, like banks, too big to tackle. On the other, I fear he wants only “wins”, regardless of which team prevails, and adjusts which goal post he moves the ball toward accordingly.

Great book.

AKA limp-dick leadership.

I find it fascinating that the one single topic which spotlight-seeker Meghan McCain won’t ever talk about is Sarah Palin. I have to wonder what she saw backstage and whether her heroic image of her dad was shattered by something more than just wedding-ring-fiddling.

What is Sarah’s biggest fault? Any of the editors want to take a crack at that?

To quote Mike Mills from R.E.M.: I want my President to be smarter than I am.

Imagine the self-discipline required NOT to talk about Palin.

Do you think the left should primary Obama in 2012? And who would you like as the standard bearer–someone who has a reasonable chance of winning?

I can’t understand why someone would want the guy on the bar stool next to them to be their president, any more than to be their heart surgeon or the guy who fixed the elevator they’re about to use.

When was the last time that happened?

Teddy, I am headed later to a holiday party where I hear Ms McCain might be in attendance. I’ll ask her what she thinks of SP! I’ll also take notes!

Colin,
Thank you so much for your kind words. I think that we as a society have a lot of rethinking to do – media, journalism, publishing… The ability to communicate widely and quickly is outpacing our ability to adapt gracefully in many cases. Things will readjust, but progressive voices are important on all those fronts.

Because elections are popularity contests. Heart surgery and fixing elevators are technical skills. Duh.

Who are her surrogates, though, and who would ever staff her next campaign? Her scorched-earth approach in GRogue makes me wonder whether any seasoned politicos or operatives would want to sign up for that kind of treatment. Especially since it’s an ingrained character flaw — lots of folks she’s kicked aside who initially gave her a stoop up the ladder.

If St. John’s public description of Mrs. McCain as an overpainted tart and a “C” wasn’t enough to cause her to pause in her admiration of daddy, I don’t know what would.

Oh, great, please dish!

Take your umbrella; household objects might fly.

Yes, to a primary for Obama. Too early to say who. The best shot is from an outsider, a real one, not one of the usual suspects.

So, Richard and Colin –
Alaskan contributors excepted,(since 2/3 of us are here!) did you have a favorite essay or two or three that really spoke to you, or challenged you, or made you think of Palin in a way you hadn’t before? Can you share a few impressions?

That’s the really frightful thought. Who would she have under her, so to speak, as vice president. In her Cabinet. How would she interact with a less than totally subservient legislature or Congress. A character out of a Vincent Price film would be more assuring.

Nobody. Even Grayson wouldn’t have the balls for that. Stop dreaming.

The inclusion of the “Buyers Remorse” section was brilliant.

I particularly liked Kathleen Parker: “If BS were currency, Palin could bail out Wall Street herself.”

David Brooks is pretty good also: “Sarah Palin represents a fatal cancer to the Republican Party . . . There has been a counter, more populist tradition, which is not only to scorn liberal ideals but to scorn ideas entirely. And I’m afraid that Sarah Palin has those prejudices.”

I’m guessing that Meghan could definitely add a colorful reaction.

That’s a good question. Undoubtedly the same pro-life hacks will be behind her–the folks who run state right-to-life groups. And of course, the Weekly Standard is so enamored of her. But how much sway do these folks have in early, intra-GOP rule making? I don’t know the answer to that off the top of my head. Will do some digging…

scorn ideas entirely

Now there’s something Brooks is an expert in.

Why is WS enamored of Palin? Short version. I just can’t understand their POV.

Do it!

It would be a True Believer, not a seasoned political operative. My guess would be someone out of one of the TheoCon movement’s political operations.

I think Frank Rich’s She Broke the GOP and Now She Owns It is the best essay to date on Palin’s relation to the party. And I love Rebecca Traister’s essay on the Palin Pity Party. But for me, JoAnn Wypijewski’s Beauty and the Beast essay, which opens the book, is just the best read. Of course, I edit JoAnn–so I might be a little biased!

Why no digging in to the last minute deal with the AG/Palin/pharma over the 30M settlement, the jury was polled and said they were going to award 300M. Previous cases were settled by same pharm with shady back room deals.

You talked me into it. (Needed a push with a feather.)

Thanks for this book! Cant wait to read it! (back to lurking now :)

Sorry – that would be Eli Lilly -

I think JoAnn Wypijewski’s opening piece on McCain is riveting – what a monster McCain is – and Jane Mayer’s poiece on how he came to pick Palin is also eye-opening. I also like the haikus that Hart Seely composed based on extracts from Palin’s speeches

Great choices. I thought Frank Rich’s “Those Republicans who have not drunk the Palin Kool-Aid are apocalyptic for a good reason” summed it up pretty well.

I tend to agree. Grayson will eventually seek a bigger challenge, but I can’t imagine him bumping up against Obama.

The WS actually has a lot of Christian right backing and it has always advocated that a strong religious right is necessary for the GOP to win, so the Palin love makes sense there. ON the national security stuff, the way some neo-cons fell in love with her has always been weird to me. I mean, beyond the fact that they see her as a vessel for their ideas, she doesn’t seem to me to have been a particularly fierce or efficient advocate for neocon ideology.

Everyone – What investigations are still pending for SP? What do you see in the next 6 months as to where SP will be?

That’s why she’s combined the bus and the plane. From the plane, she can direct the bus toward more bodies to run over, far better than when she’s in the bus herself.

It’s the reflected light Sarah shines on McCain that has been most revealing: that he was willing to utterly corrupt his “Country First” and “experience” brand (really all he had going against the Obama juggernaut) to sex up his candidacy. His continued prominence — and regular Sunday appearances on television — are all we really need to know about the GOP/Village’s value system.

Ok here’s a question that tries to tie together the SP thread and the Obama side thread. Let’s say Obama is a centrist, and that, as Naomi Klein puts it, our job then is to move the center to the left. How do we do that when we have a right wing that has really gone off the reservation–when about 25-30 % of the country believes everything Sarah Palin does? I’m really curious what people think..and don’t have the answers myself.

Yes, Wypijewski’s Beauty and the Beast was a fantastic opener. We should not forget that it was McCain that started all this, and how the Palin pick fed his own “issues.”

And here’s a Haiku, just to further tempt all those reading this who haven’t purchased the book yet:

These corporations.
Today it was AIG,
Important call, there.

Good stuff.

The existence of the Alaska Fund Trust (her legal defense fund) is still out there. There are also records requests pending for a lot of state emails. They’ve been coming back, of course, with redacted bits. My favorites are the ones that have been redacted due to “attorney client privilege” without being copied to Palin OR her attorney. Two new complaints have been filed in the last week or so – one for doing campaign business on state email accounts, and the other for continuing to collect money from the Alaska Fund Trust after an initial review stated that it was most likely illegal.

There is a two year limit for filing ethics complaints, so there are some who fear that stall tactics will kill anything outstanding.

Christianists. That makes sense. A la Leo Strauss, need a religious diversion to fool the hoi poloi into doing what is good for them, according to the authoritarians. If it works in Saudi Arabia, why not in the U.S.

I don’t know, but if the left doesn’t push back hard, that minority will succeed in continuing to push the “center” farther right, as they’ve done since Reagan. Asymmetrical warfare warriors – at least the real ones – seem to have an advantage progressives have yet to counter effectively. Obama seems to be working as hard to answer that question as he is to improve health insurance practices.

our job then is to move the center to the left.

We just had an almost complete meltdown of the financial system last year. Klein had predicted a lot of what ended up happening. Yet our politicians are offering sorry, pathetic solutions.

I’m more pessimistic than some, and see us getting somewhere like Argentina in the time of the breakdown of their civilian political system from 1976 to 1983. Naomi Klein has made similar observations from her vantage point of having studied what went down in Argentina, Chile and Uruguay back then.

I think it is more likely that Obama will turn more radically against progressives and our ideas than that progressives will find a way to gain traction against the existing establishment.

We’re coming up on our last 15 minutes. The time has just flown! So, if you have any questions for Richard Kim or Colin Robinson, now’s the time to jump in.

It’s the ratchet effect. Another name for it which I’ve forgotten which some one here will remind me of. Vocal extremes ratchet the pols in their direction. It is so far right now that MSM portrays lefties as kooks. Even Rachel has done that. Even though what passes for left in the U.S. is mainstream according to the polls. But the Ds are more interested in campaign contributions than voters, thanks be to Bill Clinton.

Colin,
What’s next for OR books? Do you have any projects coming up you can tell us about?

That’s also part of why Palin is appearing at so many armed forces venues. One of my UAA students, in the National Guard, is getting out because the Christianists have pretty much taken over his entire unit. And he’s a fairly conservative Republican type.

Thanks for your responses to my strategy question. There does seem to be consensus on at least one point–we’re in a tough place….

I had lunch the other day with a retired Army Chaplain. Part of the reason he left was his inability to effectively communicate with so many troops who were not interested in a broad, moderate religious message. Scary stuff. And definitely a segment Palin is reaching for – and getting.

What Teddy said. I have a particular aversion to Ms. Meghan’s “tweets”.

Yes, a story not focussed on enough about how the U.S. military are actually crusaders. I suspect that’s a main reason why the “stretched” military hasn’t broken and why McChrystalball can assert that “moral is good.”

I think it is more likely that Obama will turn more radically against progressives and our ideas than that progressives will find a way to gain traction against the existing establishment.

That would seem consistent with his punch a hippy policies to date, courtesy of Mr. Emanuel. But wouldn’t that play into Ms. Palin and the GOP’s hands, suggesting that Obama and Palin, for argument’s sake, are not that far apart. Isn’t that a giveaway of all his strengths, another unasked for giveaway to the right by Obama?

I don’t want to have a beer with Barrack, nor do I have fantasies of casual intimacy with Sarah. I want federal policies that fairly meet my needs without screwing my neighbors, most of whom have the same needs. Corporate America, empowered by cooperative politicians like Palin, have worked hard to separate how they make money from who does their work that they no longer have neighbors whose needs concern them.

Not sure Colin is still here…so I’ll answer…OR Books has something coming out next by Norman Finkelstein. Now that might generate just as much controversy and interest as Going Rouge!

The left needs someone out there who’s an effective communicator, charismatic and REALLY left. Even if they’re not an office-holder. Someone to have the populist appeal of the teabaggers and who will recalibrate the center.

Wishing is easy, though.

You & I are in the de-tweeted club, when it comes to Ms Meghan, tho.

The Air Force is known for its peculiar, intense, exclusionary brand of evangelizing. I guess being third in the hierarchy is a challenge to a warrior’s self-esteem. Or it might be the air in Colorado Springs.

Sure Jeanne, The next OR Book will appear in January. It’s by Norman Finkelstein and argues that the fall out-from the Gaza invasion at the beginning of this year has begun to weaken the commitment of American Jews towards Israel. Norman sees this an optimistic sign, born of a tragedy. After that we have an original book on writing fiction by Jospeh O’Neill, Monica Ali and Zoe Heller. And a little further down the line (we’re only doing one book a month) Liza Featherstone is writing on how focus groups work in discerning our preferences, both in toothpaste and politicians. Please watch our space http://www.orbooks.com

suggesting that Obama and Palin, for argument’s sake, are not that far apart.

Dream on. The right will only villify O as being to the left of Stalin (or whoever). Their words bear no relation to reality.

Ding.

What’s the risk/reward ratio? There’s no campaign contributions in being a leftie, and there’s a lot of risk. Ain’t gonna happen.

Thanks, Colin. All of those sound really exciting! I’m bookmarking your site for sure. And congratulations on such a stellar debut. Going Rouge is really wonderful.

What about you, Richard? Anything coming for you that you want to share?

Thanks for taking time today to chat, I really appreciate all your answers.

And, folks, you should really buy & read this book. Even I, who forswore all things Palin not three weeks ago, had a great time revisiting her rise to pre-eminence. And as I typed earlier, it will be a terrific reference going forward, since she clearly isn’t going away.

But Obama’s handlers might make that argument, to appeal to the right center. Ms. Palin’s handlers, of course, would make it clear that she is not a Magic Whitey.

As we come to the end of this lively Book Salon,

Richard, Colin, Thank you both for stopping by the Lake and discussing your new book and Sarah Palin.

Jeanne, Thank you very much for Hosting this great Book Salon.

Everyone, if you haven’t bought a copy of Going Rouge, here is a link.

Thanks all.

Risk/reward ratio? You mean selfless idealism with no ambition for personal gain is dead? ;-)

Yes, thank you all for an interesting, committed discussion of your work. You’ve raised the bar high for those who follow, and we hope there are lots of them.

It’s been my pleasure. Thanks everyone!

Great topic. Finkelstein’s writing style is not very melodious, though.

There may be a need for a book along those same lines, but constructed like Going Rouge – a lot of essays on the topic Finkelstein is covering. Phil Weiss has a long list of writers who have already taken on the same subject as Norm is here. One of your current book’s contributors, Max Blumenthal, has dealt with that in his own inimitable way.

Good luck with all your new ideas!

In or outside the Village?

I just want to plug the Nation’s Obama at One issue, coming out in January. There will be a RANGE–I promise!–of opinions reflected: the joys, but also the heartbreak reflected in some posts here tonight. So look for it.

Dya think? When exactly would you place the obit? 1/20/93?

Thank you Beverly and Jeanne for hosting this. I much enjoyed it. I’m now signing off in London, where it’s midnight.

Gnite and bless you for putting up with us at such a late hour.

Jeanne – delurking from Okinawa. Your Mudflats blog is one I check just about every day.

I agree with the overall responses here about SP being a force to reckon with going towards 2012. What I’m hoping will be a factor to knock her out of serious contention is the way that she keeps herself in a bubble — always walled off from any candid, non-scripted interaction with someone who isn’t vetted and previewed. To do well enough in the early primaries, the candidate has to appear ‘normal,’ without a perception of being walled off. McCain’s 2000 bus tours come to mind, along with Bush’s ‘folksy’ interactions with the press during that same campaign.

I’m just hoping that SP’s scorched earth tactics to date won’t give her that ‘free ride’ with the press if she does indeed become a serious GOP primary contender in 2012.

Dave in Okinawa

Marta Evry is upstairs!
One Voice For Choice-Women Candidates Phone Bank Against Stupak In Mar Vista, CA

Just got my 3 copies today and will be after AKM, Shannyn and Elston to sign them. Thank you O/R books for doing all that you have

Sorry I wasn’t here earlier! Was at One Voice For Choice phone bank.

Thanks so much for being here, Richard and Colin, and to Jeanne for the wonderful intro. It was a really fun effort to take part in this book and I hope you guys do more.

Wow, you’ve just said what I’ve been trying to say in pieces re why I’ve turned SO negative on Obama.

Thanks.

She’s not going to run for president, she just wants all the cash and none of the responsibility.