I am not arguing against reform, just a public option that will lead to single payer.

Oh, gees, if that isn’t a contradictory statement, I don’t know what is…

If you don’t have a public option and you don’t have single payer, you really don’t have a REFORM, now do you? It will only be worse, because then you will be FORCED to buy insurance from companies that have proven to be amoral.

They are spending $1.4 million a day to fight real REFORM. They have denied care to folks who dutifully paid their premiums.

Perhaps if you checked out this report on T.R.Reid’s report of health systems around the world–and the slant PBS gave to it.

Or Matt Taibbi’s piece might help open your mind a bit.

Do you favor or oppose, “Having a national health plan in which all Americans would get their insurance through an expanded, universal form of Medicare-for all?”
Favor 58%, Oppose 38%, NA/DK 3%

Like I said, teh stoopid can’t read polls (and probably just can’t read), but seem to be very comfortable with proclaiming knowledge of what Americans want.

Oh yeah, the poll was done by KAISER. Like I’m sure they’d be interested in sckewing a poll that would effectively put them out of business.

In fact, 4 polls this summer showed plurality support for single payer, while 3 of the 4 showed majority support, all at about 57%-59%.

But teh stoopid read those same results and can claim Americans don’t want single payer. Gotta admit, it must be fun to live in a fantasy world all the time where you can just make shit up and that’s the way it is. Good times indeed.

Oh, and sorry mods. I know you scolded yesterday, and I know my tolerance for teh stoopid is zero, so this will be my last post in this thread before I get more “intolerable”. Delete/edit at will.

Explain how the ’public option’ will reduce the deficit? Costs will explode after 4 years…the CBO has reported this.

If Obama drops the public plan and mandates he can get some measure of health insurance reform because most people want health insurance reforms without junking the whole system. New national and regional markets for insurance helping create the conditions for individual insurance empowerment. That is a plan that can pass.

It’s called the Republican plan, and it is as available now to Obama as it was six months ago. All Obama has to do is just say yes.

If the government and the employer were released from providing/administering health care we would see costs decrease dramatically because consumers would see directly how much services and treatments costs. Demand for lower costs would naturally spur innovation and competition. No rationing necessary.

If consumers were responsible for purchasing insurance and paying for care directly, the government would be free to focus on the truly needy and improve the quality and efficiency of the health care services for the impoverished, elderly and our veterans.

BTW, have we seen any polls out there that did ask that follow-up??

I’d be curious, especially in California after hearing the rates of decline there.

And don’t you just have to laugh whenever the trolls bring up the deficit as a reason to OPPOSE health care reform.

I mean how stoopid must you be to not realize that NO reform is worse for the deficit than anything. Gotta give em credit. Stoopid is their consistancy.

Unfortunately none of the current proposals do anything but grow our deficit and do little to bring costs down

Um, yeah…if we had single payer, we would save $350 Billion just from eliminating excess paperwork of the 30% overhead of insurance companies.

That alone would pay for the program.

“Have you ever had to make a major claim due to illness or accident?”

You are living in a bubble.