A Nixon retrospective seem particularly appropriate tonight.

Hey Eureka…

Eureka !

Loved your comment down thread, newt !

Hey, you with the health care – ante up.

Reid is a colossal suck-up, and it didn’t take him years of practice to achieve it.
Dude is a natural.

BRB – catching up to the previous thread …

When he stared down the growing mob of Progressives and said that HoJo is his BFFAE, Reid showed his hand …

g’evening ES & FirePups!

What’s on my mind tonight? Stressed and bummed about the state of the nation. Beautiful full moon is bringing teh crazies outta the woodwork. blech.

To be fair, he had the blessings of the President-elect, and the permission of McConnell. Frankly, the latter did the trick.

Fucking Joe Lieberman is the Republican’s best weapon, and Reid’s stink-finger courage is a slight second.

To paraphrase Graham Nash: Just a rant before I go.

Later

But, if the demonstrations were huge in every city in this country, the local stations would certainly cover it. The real problem is we don’t recruit college campuses. The problem with health care as an issue is the kids don’t give a shit. They don’t think they’ll ever get sick, never mind go bankrupt paying for it. There is no communication between 52 year-olds and 22-year olds.

As activist-oriented as this group is, how many showed up for the bankster protests? In the most liberal city in the country, less than 100 people showed up-and less than 10 were under age 40. And that cause was sanctioned by Jane.

A lot less talking and a lot more bodies in the street are the only way to save this democracy (or what’s left of it.) Just from reading here for a few years, there are only about 20 posters I know would be rubbing elbows with me on the street. Where are the rest of you? Where are the rest of the entire blogosphere? The rest of the progressives?

{{{{{ NDFG }}}}}

The August Full Moon is my fave …

hellooooo, ndfg.

Howdy All!

It’s that music-type guy from the Rockies.

Got any fresh Floyd on the griddle?

{{{ petro! }}}

Hey, Eureka!!!! I’ve come to the conclusion that the vast majority of Americans (present company excluded of course) are just Bugtussle Dumb.

evening, fdlakers

*waves at newtonusr* helloooo back!

Not sure coverage is the point now. Disabling the machine, fracturing the worker-bee compact is more important.

Who here thinks publicity, at this late date, will get it done?
Perhaps thunderbolts are all that will work.

Not tonight! I’m just getting around to editing and uploading DeGette’s townhall footage from yesterday. There’s some quotes from her that I probably should have gotten to Jane last night or today.

Oh, good stuff?

Woooo all caught up … it’s been quite a week, huh ?

Congress comes back on Tuesday … looks like time for some of Christy’s phone assault on Capitol Hill.

We’re stuck with him until the balance of power changes in the Democratic Caucus. He’s clearly not ineffective enough to bother the majority of them yet.

Ha wa ya ? Ha wa ya ?

If I were a Republican, and I looked over at the Dem Caucus voting pro-Birth conservative Reid into the Leader spot, I would have passed out with glee.

These are all self-inflicted wounds. Every last one of them.

Hmmm – wishy washy on DeGette’s part, except for this funky statement

“I can guarantee you that a bill will not pass out of the House without a Public Option or some robust alternative.”

Whatever that means. She also said co-ops wouldn’t cut it either.

Yep. To.The.Phones.

Edit – reply to Petro @3

ditto!
Haven’t read the thread yet — the comment requires no context.

Some choice huh … BlueDogs or ReThugs …

fine if ya don’t ask for details *g* preparing for a family outing to the Minnesota State Fair tomorrow where we shall encounter everything possible onna stick. deepfried.

I almost feel sorry for some Dems who see the handwriting on the wall – sitting in caucus meetings where the bosses poo-poo the PO, knowing full well that they will lie down on the tracks to stop it, no matter how good an idea it is.
I understand the reticence to commit. Which is not to say that I appreciate it.

One of the things that amazes me about all this is that they probably could have gotten away with doing nothing else right if they’d just fixed health care. Nothing else they’re likely to work on will affect us so profoundly over the next few years. There’s plenty else they should be doing, of course, but it’s the things that really affect people that they notice.

Kelly !

I have been really busy this week entertainin’ a stream of guests pests from Murkah but I still think the House has the advantage over the Senate and will succeed in getting a strong PO into the Bill that Obama will sign.

Of course I also believe in reincarnation and the inherent goodness in my fellow man …

LOL … give my regards to Norm Coleman.

Lemme tell you, it’s tough arranging to be away from work, participating in the process, defending the PO, because it’s the right thing to do, for a President with a mandate who is pissing it away (not to mention defending him too from nutters, when I’m pissed at him for a variety of reasons.

It’s just draining. But it needs to be done.

[refills wine glass…back to editing]

Back on the thread in a few.

[grins at Petro]

There’s a special benefit to getting out and swinging for the fences, insisting on something. As I have harped on endlessly, Obama has spent his political capital badly. If you are going to get hammered, why not get hammered doing something quickly, that will result in some immediate relief. If they are so worried about electoral fallout, measure looking weak and failing against looking resolute while passing the long ball.

He looks weak, he is losing votes and voter confidence, and he will deliver a plan that enriches insurance companies. Smoke that, Rahm.

EDIT: And as a side benefit, once the deal is done, only then will teh Media™ ask about the efficacy of pouring taxpayer dollars into the gullets of private insurance companies.

ES! Petro!

Margot !

I’m watching the Delroy Wilson video. I’m not a fan of graffiti, but I’d have to say that of all the decorations on this wall, the graffiti is the most interesting.

erm, no. Unless by “regards” you mean me getting violently sick all over him. He is a nauseating little twerp.

Norm’s replacement is doing pretty well, I think. (Ten minute video, but it’s a great discussion – easily better than anyone’s going to see on the TV Sunday morning.)

That is a sparkling piece of conversation.

my family & I were discussing that earlier this evening. What a relief to have him FINALLY in office.

The definition of robust is recently in flux.

Yes ! *g*

i’ll have to prep myself by having some disgusting food onna stick. deepfried. *g*

Yes, it is. He treats his questioners respectfully, and answers their questions. It was much more of a discussion than just about any of the town halls I’ve seen descriptions of, and I think the folks who were in it should have come away better informed. They certainly have more to think about than they did. Half the problem here is that most folks seem to have been given so little useful information by either the broadcast news or whatever else they listen to.

ROFL !!!

As I replied in the last thread….coverage ain’t going to happen in a real journalistic way. Time to move on. Not that bodies in the streets aren’t a good way to engage drivers…it’s the only people they do engage. I’ll continue to show up for street protests, as our family does on a regular basis.
Until we figure out another way to reach mass ignorant Americans who view street protests as “Why do they put themselves out there like that?”, we are lost. They don’t see the issues because it’s just not in their DNA. Regardless of party affiliation. It’s not there.
Crap. Is that the definition of hopeless or the spawn of new ideas? I’m so confused at this point.

Hi PPDCUS

Two things – I suspect an audience in Minnesota is likely to be more civil overall, Bachmannites notwithstanding.
And, the administration is less than covered in glory wrt clarity or even intent.

But yeah.

Time to hit the Hay … gotta get up early to feed the guests pests … *g*

G’nite all and have a great weekend !

Dang, I just get finished editing and Petro leaves! Fine [pouts]

OK, lemme catch up on the thread.

nite petro

I had written some articles about that on my blog. Today, I was looking back at them (I needed them for some background links), and I realized that I wrote that things were basically decided in January, and the next thing I wrote was about him being sworn in in July. Freakin’ amazing.

Garrr! Ain’t that the truth. Maddening.

The people there were mostly inclined to be reasonable, I think, which helped. It also helped that the group was fairly small, so there probably weren’t “sides” per se – no organized groups of people. So, yes, it was a bit easier than some crowds have been.

As for Obama’s effect on the news, while he’s certainly done nothing to make things clear, there are plenty of issues that the news could explore in detail, based on what is before committees now. They simply choose not to, I think, because it’s hard and because they know they’ll lose some of their audience to whoever is covering the Michael Jackson funeral.

Dial-up…”Burns my motor to go so slow”.
Night all. Sweet dreams.

Weren’t we expecting kitty pix tonite?

Goodnight, OH.

Kitty pix?

No, you’re right about the news.
I can’t help but feel that if ObamaCo wanted to flex and kill some of the chaff, they could. And it is possible that I mistakenly project mythical prowess upon their communications operation.

Getting out in front and staying there is a luxury, and while governing is not the same as campaigning, it is similar but on a grander scale.

ES has a new kitty…

Hrummph.

In the view of those who run it, it is not the media’s, especially broadcast news’, job to provide useful information.

Quite the opposite.

And yet, I see no pictures.

You hrumphed?

Doesn’t stop me from thinking that this is what I’m paying them for, though. Or, to be more accurate, would be paying them for if they were actually doing it.

hi morris, is that a non-specific hrummph?

Arghh.

Yay! A non-specific “Argggh!”

I’ll play:

GRRRRRR!

Their job, their only job as the see it, is to make money for themselves.

They prove it every day. And they’re not even all that good at that.

Actually, it is a sort of generalized, but semi-specific hrummph.

The arghh, however, was non-specific.

Providing a product worth buying usually makes that process go better. I think that’s the flaw in their business strategy.

testing
Edit: oh great, now it works.

Hey i was just thinking that after a week of non stop health care battling troll swatting and obama bashing that some sober low key analysis would be good. Also thinking, we arent there yet but eventually there will be a vote on a health care bill and it will probably pass, and it will almost certainly not have most of what we want in it, But if we hold congressional progs thier pledge it will be less worse than it could be.We have to wring out of them every benefit and dollar and regulation we can, thats our job and if the coalition fails WE fail. This link is to a piece i thought was good to read, and i felt better after reading it. Its kind of an obama apologia, but a reasonable one that aknowleges his faults and makes the case for sticking together and moving forward.

http://www.politicalaffairs.ne…..view/8960/ it was also interesting to learn that most of on here are a bit to the left of the communist party. GLEN BECK WAS RIGHT! AHHHHHHHHH

Hey, ES
Hey, Pups!
Anybody still here?
Whazzup?

FunnyWheelieDiva

OK! My upload to youtube has finished pre-processing the DeGette Townhall.

No fingers were bitten off during the making of this video.

I know, how booooring. ;]

But I did think it was important to attend, and grab the key take-aways from it since DeGette is Chief Deputy Whip. I cut it down to 4:14, as most of the rest would be re-hash from other townhalls.

Without having read the linked piece, and as inclined as I am to give the benefit of the doubt to the “Democrat” who occupies the Oval:

“if we hold congressional progs their pledge…”

there will be no bill. Or do I have the numbers wrong?

Funny, how did the interview go?

As they say in Chinese:

我 不 知道

Hallooo FWD!

Oh, very nice. She starts off with the anti-trust exemption.

And she appears to have some friendly company, along with the trogs.

Lucky for them until the internet they had a monopoly.

Tough for them (and good for us) now they don’t. And they still haven’t figured that out.

Well, my good news is that I’ve done 2 phone interviews this week, and should be doing in-person ones next week (all for the same position). Fingers crossed. This is for a permanent headcount position with benefits.
God, I hope I get it!

FWDiva

Hi Margot

Yea, Diva.
The assault on science marches forward, hope you bust through.

Yes – it was a civilized crowd. A wee bit of rudeness, but shit, I have had boozed up audiences WAY worse than that one, and come away with a fat tip jar.

She had much the same going on for her.

It was with the big boss, who wants me in person next week. Tough for the new guy, who will be my supervisor, who’s just starting next week. Whew!

FWDiva

Weeeeee! Good!

There’s a full moon out tonight; should I do a quick voodoo dance or something for yer chances?

[please say ‘yes’ looking for excuse to do full moon voodoo dancing]

For many news businesses here, the Internet was just the last straw. They laid the foundations of their demise in the ’80s and ’90s. David Simon has an interesting perspective on that (it’s the second block quote at that link). It was the same sort of short-term, big profit thinking that gripped just about every American business back then. They let go all the people who could do the work, and then wondered where the business went.

Network news did similar things, closing their foreign offices, and relying more (ironically) on newspapers. Sometimes, I think the worst fate that can happen to a company nowadays is to have a CEO who’s trained in American business philosophy.

Here’s to hoping that the recent example in Philadelphia served as a wake-up moment for the hoard. What a colossal CF that was. Lacking humanity and all grace is something to behold.

Good luck.

Will the personal interviews be with the same folks you’ve already talked with?

on edit: nevermind, I got it :)

They’ve got a product in Phase III trials, they’re gearing up for launch. So, the company is hiring. Turns out, I have a relatively uncommon skill/technology that they need.
Man, am I ready to get back to work. I filled out my application for federal emergency unemployment benefits today. I honestly thought I’d get 6-months on the first go-round, so I dunno what’s going to happen in the next couple of weeks.
Here’s hoping the stock market likes Obama’s speech. Although that’s usually bad news for actual working or want-to-be working stiffs…
Gotta get all I can out of the last of my IRA money…

FWDiva

Yes, there will be no bill, but what if there is anyway? we arent gods and neither are the progressive caucus. the worst thing to do at that point would be to blow everyhting up. I wouldnt vote for it the way it is, without a PO. I have to belive that the caucus wont either, but they might get some concessions and if they do i dont think they will kill it. and if they dont? Just saying, there IS a vallid argument for not quitting. I dont know what will happen but i know that “it” will happen eventually.

Full moon, NEKKID voodoo dancing?
Yes please. Couldn’t hoyt, right?

FWDiva

Hand on the Monitor for you, FWD.

No idea. Probably not with HR again, they were pretty thorough.
Possibly with Big Boss. Definitely with potential supervisor, and presumably with the work group I’d be joining. I’m thinkin’ that could get to be a long day.

FWDiva

Thank you, Margot.
I’m going to phone my folks tomorrow, I think. Time I got caught up with them, and I prefer to do that when there’s some good news…

FWDiva

Is there any OTHER kind of full moon voodoo dancing? ;]

good luck!

I shouldn’t think so. I mean, if it was me, it’d be the best way to scare away the evil spirits, that’s for dern sure!

FWDiva

drained.

must go.

night all.

Thanks, Morris.
How you doin’ this week?
Night. Sleep tight.
(((Morris)))

FWDiva

I was unclear, and sorry for that.

The last bit of prestige Obama can hope for in the HC battle is to get a bill. If the Progressives can hold together, they will force him to adopt the PO, simply because he believes their threat to blow it up, and he is a defeated President.

I am convinced that there is only one way to get a PO, and that is for ObamaCo to know in their marrow that they will suffer a mortal blow by not getting behind it, and they have only one out – get off their asses and do what we sent them there to do – lead.

Yeah, it is the highest stakes game of chicken the Dems are likely to muster in our lifetime, but unless Obama is actually prevented from following through with a PO by circumstances we cannot know yet, there is nothing but loss for him should he choose NOT to.

I appreciate, but respectfully disagree with anyone who says that when the pinch is right in front of you, you blink. They say turn it down, and I say turn it up.

Goodnight.

nite morris

nite morris. catch ya on the flip.

No blinking. thats the whole point. that in a fight, at the very least wear them out, so they have to give ground to make peace, then there’s peace and we go on together. i dont know, trying to see hoe to turn a lose/ lose into a win win

I am convinced that there is only one way to get a PO, and that is for ObamaCo to know in their marrow that they will suffer a mortal blow by not getting behind it, and they have only one out – get off their asses and do what we sent them there to do – lead.

Definitely agree with this. I ought to. I’ve written it often enough, and I’d hate to think I was suddenly in disagreement.

Whether he can be convinced of the need remains to be seen.

You know, I really would love to be able to ask Obama why he wanted this job. At least, I would under circumstances where I know I could get a truthful answer. I really have to wonder when we have discussions like this.

I’m wit choo, buddy.
This is THE issue for true Democrats. And as the polls show, it’s not just progressives and not just Democrats.
But for Progressives, it’s do or die time. No PO, there’s really no reason to be “good soldiers”…caving on this really will entrench the personality-over-policy crap that we all hated so much in the last administration.

FWDiva

Hey, when you have the microphone, be ye a drag queen, a comic, or the Prez, that’s how you handle a heckler!

Turn it UP, and turn them DOWN!

The audience loves you! If you take it like a schmuck, the audience becomes embarrased for you, sometimes bored, but nonetheless ready to hit the exits.

TURN IT UP!

A guy who used to hang around here a lot used to say “It’s not a sprint. It’s a marathon.’ You don’t win a marathon in one little stretch. We have to be willing to play a long game. If the health care bill that they come up with is going to set us back, we need to just ditch it and move on, and let whatever happens to Obama happen to him. If he loses the next election, he richly deserves it for trying to screw us (and by “us”, I mean Americans) like this. Let him be an object lesson to the next guy.

Well, Pups,
It’s pumpkin time for me.
Thanks for the company and good wishes.
Have a super weekend!

FWDiva

Goodnight, FWDiva.

The other part of it is this, at least for me – Obama is spent. His political capital (there it is again) is on a bonfire somewhere. He went into August knowing full well that he would take a fearful bruising, and it has been even worse – he has been shellacked. Polls gone to hell; the nation so poorly served by every MSM interest imaginable; he has left it to Congress to do the legislation, knowing that the Republicans would give him absolutely nothing, and he got even less; a catastrophically bungled communications job; many, many people who are genuinely open to reform scared to fucking death.

Leadership shows. It is like a badge, a perfect emblem of steadfastness, and Obama is bare-chested at the most critical time of his political life. He is there to govern, and he is visibly hiding. The country will not tolerate indifference to their expectations, and they should not.

Dude needs to step up.

Ciao, chica!

i am pretty angry with my party right now

nite diva

I dunno much about the chicago machine, but have a sense it might be germane.

How do you think it could be germane? By teaching him that to succeed in politics you follow the money?

If this is the road we have to take, we all better be prepared to do two things:
One – wait a good while until another Democrat sits in the big chair

and

Two – be adamant that if the next guy or gal betrays us, he will suffer a similar fate

We are looking at many more years in the wilderness if we choose this path, and we may not have much left to resurrect when we finally get our guy or gal.

Don’t disagree with a thing you wrote. Not a single thing.

Lemme say this though. I was pissed at him re: FISA and Joh Brennan before the general, and have been in the position of voting for Obama, and defending him all along the way since the Election. It is truly tiresome.

But I realized something. And that is, it is up to ME to actually agitate for change, and not just from behind the keyboard. Going to these townhalls and talking with the nutters, and the un-nutters who are conservative but only know what the reich wing organs are pumping to them is VERY USEFUL.

It’s the example of my parents. My dad THINKS he is some sort of Eisenhower Republican, you know fair, thoughtful. I just keep pulling back the onion skins and showing him how shitty St. Reagan was.

My dad is not all the way there yet. But he certainly questions, and a lot along progressive guidelines, what the hell we are letting the government do!

I’ve got him to be anti-torture, anti-war (albeit only from the fiscal side) and pro-health care reform, given his own history.

Being a big, loud, vocal example, with listening skills, is working for me with people I interact with. And I am not being bi-partisan in the least!

It’s fun to not back down from the “liberal” label, when you do it with FUN in yer brain!

So, who cares what Obama does, in a certain sense. I’m sticking with my behavior and I’ll just continue to point out to my conservative, center and lib friends,”Hey, Obama was right/wrong/indifferent on Issue X.” People know when you’re telling the truth about what you feel.

One more late-night thought along these lines:
If I were the current Ambassador to China (and former Utah Governor) – Republican Jon Huntsman – I would be watching that joint session very, very closely. He is a tremendously attractive candidate.
As Teddy mentioned once (and I agree with him), politically, there is very little to distinguish Huntsman from Obama.

Agreed. There’s nothing better for Democracy than getting off your ass.

Maybe, but the one thing that remains true in politics is that they’re always changing. I really don’t even want to predict what’s going to happen in the 2010 elections right now. It’s too far away, and there are lots of things that are uncertain. I think the best course is to keep on plugging. Elect progressives where we can, and try to get at one chamber nominally under control of progressives. Right now, that looks like the House.

In any case, we really don’t have many choices, do we? If Obama won’t lead, then he’s toast. The thing to do is figure out how to minimize the damage and move on.

Things are going to be bad in the U.S. for the next few years, regardless of what we do at this point. The unemployment, the real unemployment, will remain high. Hopefully, we can rebuild some in the meantime, and make some investments in the future. To do that, though, we need to change the balance of power in Congress, and in the White House.

Anyway, I find it hard to be Mr. Positive, but when you only have crummy choices, you pick the best one. We’ve played the “let’s limit the damage” game by electing anyone who was willing to call himself a Democrat, and look where it’s gotten us. If all we do for the next few years is keep these guys from fucking up any more, then at least we’ve done more than has been done in the last decade. We’ll just have to build from there.

Well, I can tell it’s late, because I can barely write anything coherent. I’ll stop now.

Oh, wait, I’ll just add one more thing. Much of the rest of the world built itself back up at the end of WWII. That’s one of the reasons we have such a time competing now (although I’d say it’s the least of them). Korea was a burnt-out husk in 1953. They built themselves into a power in less than thirty-five years. They did that by being industrious and by educating themselves. I was amazed at what I saw there back then, and it was easy to tell where they were headed. Societies can come back. They’ve come back from worse than we’ve managed to do to ourselves.

We’ve played the “let’s limit the damage” game by electing anyone who was willing to call himself a Democrat, and look where it’s gotten us.

We weren’t wrong. Just unfortunate.

I am out, too. nite pups

Anyway, with that, I’ll say goodnight.

Good morning firepups. Anyone up?

Good morning, pups. It’s Collins, Blow and Herbert today. Ms. Collins has “An End of Summer Quiz:” The theme for the summer of ’09? How about “Ghoulish”? It’s not a word you normally attach to “vacation season,” yet here we are. Have you been paying attention? Mr. Blow, in “The Prince of Dispassion,” says in debates, and particularly in the health care debate, facts are not sufficient. President Obama needs to move Americans with passion, conviction and faith. Mr. Herbert, in “Reliving the Past,” says President Obama is being told, as Lyndon Johnson was told about Vietnam, that more resources will do the trick in Afghanistan. It is no truer now than it was true then.

Here they are.

The coffee and tea are ready, and I’ve got French toast with warm maple syrup this morning. Ah — adventures in home repair. Hoover pushed out the corner of a screen (BAD kitteh…) so today I embark upon my first adventure in replacing window screening. I’m full of theoretical knowledge, but practical experience is sadly lacking. Wish me luck! Have a great day.

Good morning.

I guess that either Simon Johnson is presently in the other hemisphere, or else this thought was keeping him up Friday night:

Private sector capture of the state is bad enough, wherever it happens in the world. But when the capturers have an unparalleled ability and willingness to “tax” the rest of us, we should really be afraid.

Maybe Cujo will see this … a post is needed because it’s a good question, but hardly now. Maybe after allergy season, or something.

My guess: what’s special about Chicago politics is not venality —hardly!— but operating style. An overview is available in this book, especially chs. 1&2. I see Amazon is almost out of stock; could be quite relevant, or at least there are a lot of enquiring minds turning to a book that’s been out 6 years.

Radio Rwanda has finally found something so heinous that even they won’t broadcast it.