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	<title>Comments on: Early Morning Swim</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/</link>
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		<title>By: bonkers</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931414</link>
		<dc:creator>bonkers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:47:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931414</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Repubs are specifically toying with them, and unfortunately many Liberals are playing right along:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1277&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1277&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Repubs are specifically toying with them, and unfortunately many Liberals are playing right along:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1277" rel="nofollow">http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1277</a></p>
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		<title>By: bonkers</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931413</link>
		<dc:creator>bonkers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:44:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931413</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thanks for the reply.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This is exactly what I’m talking about.  I’m proud to call myself a radical Liberal, and when I follow what the Obama Admin is doing I get quite excited.  The list is long, and I’ve spent a lot of time around here linking to a lot of those positives.  However, in my opinion, here and several other leading Liberal blogs have the balance way off in terms of “holding Obama’s feet to fire” versus highlighting the all the great things that are happening.  There are plenty of other sources of info in the New Media that have a more healthy balance.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When you hold someone’s feet to the fire too long, you all get burned eventually.  Because of those positives Obama has enacted, and the fact that he’s consistently said he wants to do much, much more, I feel he’s earned the right to let those feet cool down from time to time.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The DLC Dems on the other hand are not even worth the holding of their feet to fire.  They exist specifically to undermine us and Obama.  That is why I object to lumping Obama with the DLCers.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;As far as surrounding himself with DLCers….yes, that has bugged me, but I’m also learning a lot by watching this, and really understanding the value “keeping your friends close, and your enemies closer.”  That’s an ancient strategy, and even in my own life has proven useful.  I feel that’s what Obama is doing.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Of course, time will tell all, but so far so great in my opinion.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the reply.</p>
<blockquote><p>As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point</p>
</blockquote>
<p>This is exactly what I’m talking about.  I’m proud to call myself a radical Liberal, and when I follow what the Obama Admin is doing I get quite excited.  The list is long, and I’ve spent a lot of time around here linking to a lot of those positives.  However, in my opinion, here and several other leading Liberal blogs have the balance way off in terms of “holding Obama’s feet to fire” versus highlighting the all the great things that are happening.  There are plenty of other sources of info in the New Media that have a more healthy balance.</p>
<p>When you hold someone’s feet to the fire too long, you all get burned eventually.  Because of those positives Obama has enacted, and the fact that he’s consistently said he wants to do much, much more, I feel he’s earned the right to let those feet cool down from time to time.</p>
<p>The DLC Dems on the other hand are not even worth the holding of their feet to fire.  They exist specifically to undermine us and Obama.  That is why I object to lumping Obama with the DLCers.</p>
<p>As far as surrounding himself with DLCers….yes, that has bugged me, but I’m also learning a lot by watching this, and really understanding the value “keeping your friends close, and your enemies closer.”  That’s an ancient strategy, and even in my own life has proven useful.  I feel that’s what Obama is doing.</p>
<p>Of course, time will tell all, but so far so great in my opinion.</p>
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		<title>By: victoria</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931412</link>
		<dc:creator>victoria</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:12:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931412</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;We are not giving them any ammunition.  They make up shit as they go along.  I am not going to encourage Obama to coddle the Blue Dogs by giving him positive feedback about this.  My sister died likely as a direct result of not being able to afford decent insurance despite doing all of the “right” things:  operating a small business; putting her daughter through college - she was the definition of a good, hardworking, taxpaying citizen.  Obama might as well be kissing her off.  This is unacceptable.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We are not giving them any ammunition.  They make up shit as they go along.  I am not going to encourage Obama to coddle the Blue Dogs by giving him positive feedback about this.  My sister died likely as a direct result of not being able to afford decent insurance despite doing all of the “right” things:  operating a small business; putting her daughter through college &#8211; she was the definition of a good, hardworking, taxpaying citizen.  Obama might as well be kissing her off.  This is unacceptable.</p>
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		<title>By: PriscillaQOB</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931411</link>
		<dc:creator>PriscillaQOB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:10:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931411</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thanks for correcting me.  I have been a member of the Democratic party for 30 years and never knew it wasn’t Democrat.  Snark.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;As far as Obama not being a DLCer, he never joined but he surrounded himself with them in very important positions.  You are way off the mark with that one.  Here’s a quote from The Hill. Jume 17th edition:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/dlc-seeks-to-play-bigger-role-in-obama-era-2009-06-17.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://thehill.com/leading-the…..06-17.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“DLC alumni in the administration include Vilsack, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. And though Obama himself was never close to the DLC, his top aide, White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel, has been a longtime backer of the organization.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Emanuel and Bruce Reed, a former domestic policy adviser to President Clinton and the DLC’s president, wrote a 2006 book, The Plan, that laid out the path Democrats eventually took to regain power across government.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So Obama has selected DLC members to oversee healthcare reform, homeland security, interior, secretary of state, and his chief of staff.  But I’m sure they have no influence on policy or legislation.  Right.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;We just seem to disagree about how to approach politics.  You call criticizing Obama “bashing” him.  I call it holding his feet to the fire and making him do what we elected him to do, as he told us to do.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point.  He excluded progressives from the discussions on the stimulus package, ignored our warnings, negotiated with himself and the republicans without need, and ended up with a far too little package that was too tax-cut heavy.  And now the republicans are circling him like sharks as unemployment rises and the depression deepens.  I’ll give him that one — he was newly in office and wet behind the ears.  He didn’t seem to learn a lot from that experience though, because he is repeating it with health care reform.  That’s the problem.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I worked hard to elect Obama, I like him and his family, and I want him to succeed very badly.  But I’m never going to go along with any politician on trust alone.  I’ve been at this game for too long and know that trust leads to disappointment and disaster in politics.  Keep complaining and whip congress like crazy!  And quit living in fear of the opposition using our criticism against Obama.  They will create things out of whole cloth if they can’t find anything else.  Don’t let them drive the agenda that way.  We have a right and a responsibility to seek redress for our grievances against the government.  That’s what we’re doing — not bashing Obama.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for correcting me.  I have been a member of the Democratic party for 30 years and never knew it wasn’t Democrat.  Snark.</p>
<p>As far as Obama not being a DLCer, he never joined but he surrounded himself with them in very important positions.  You are way off the mark with that one.  Here’s a quote from The Hill. Jume 17th edition:</p>
<p><a href="http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/dlc-seeks-to-play-bigger-role-in-obama-era-2009-06-17.html" rel="nofollow">http://thehill.com/leading-the…..06-17.html</a></p>
<p>“DLC alumni in the administration include Vilsack, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. And though Obama himself was never close to the DLC, his top aide, White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel, has been a longtime backer of the organization.</p>
<p>Emanuel and Bruce Reed, a former domestic policy adviser to President Clinton and the DLC’s president, wrote a 2006 book, The Plan, that laid out the path Democrats eventually took to regain power across government.”</p>
<p>So Obama has selected DLC members to oversee healthcare reform, homeland security, interior, secretary of state, and his chief of staff.  But I’m sure they have no influence on policy or legislation.  Right.</p>
<p>We just seem to disagree about how to approach politics.  You call criticizing Obama “bashing” him.  I call it holding his feet to the fire and making him do what we elected him to do, as he told us to do.</p>
<p>As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point.  He excluded progressives from the discussions on the stimulus package, ignored our warnings, negotiated with himself and the republicans without need, and ended up with a far too little package that was too tax-cut heavy.  And now the republicans are circling him like sharks as unemployment rises and the depression deepens.  I’ll give him that one — he was newly in office and wet behind the ears.  He didn’t seem to learn a lot from that experience though, because he is repeating it with health care reform.  That’s the problem.</p>
<p>I worked hard to elect Obama, I like him and his family, and I want him to succeed very badly.  But I’m never going to go along with any politician on trust alone.  I’ve been at this game for too long and know that trust leads to disappointment and disaster in politics.  Keep complaining and whip congress like crazy!  And quit living in fear of the opposition using our criticism against Obama.  They will create things out of whole cloth if they can’t find anything else.  Don’t let them drive the agenda that way.  We have a right and a responsibility to seek redress for our grievances against the government.  That’s what we’re doing — not bashing Obama.</p>
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		<title>By: RevBev</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931410</link>
		<dc:creator>RevBev</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 14:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931410</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think you put this so well.  Those disappointed with this Pres, no matter how justified, find a way to be extremely harsh and shrill in their criticism or righteous indignation.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I see no need for giving the ever-wrong Republicans ammunition for their rants and headlines.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you put this so well.  Those disappointed with this Pres, no matter how justified, find a way to be extremely harsh and shrill in their criticism or righteous indignation.</p>
<p>I see no need for giving the ever-wrong Republicans ammunition for their rants and headlines.</p>
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		<title>By: mapaghimagsik</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931409</link>
		<dc:creator>mapaghimagsik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 14:45:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931409</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well, its hard to say “leave my kids alone” when you parade them around like props in your own personal talent show.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But won’t anything think about &lt;a href=&quot;http://mapaghimagsik.comicgenesis.com/d/20090707.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the fate of poor Alaska?&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, its hard to say “leave my kids alone” when you parade them around like props in your own personal talent show.</p>
<p>But won’t anything think about <a href="http://mapaghimagsik.comicgenesis.com/d/20090707.html" rel="nofollow">the fate of poor Alaska?</a></p>
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		<title>By: bonkers</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931407</link>
		<dc:creator>bonkers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 14:00:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931407</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;My support is full single-payer all the way, but I love what he’s doing with this.  How can you see his press conferences where he talks about the public option, especially the recent one where he was deriding the insurance industry about not being able to handle the competition, and claim he’s not out there pushing hard for this?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So for this, he “has your opposition.”  As I was suggesting in that first comment, he leads every issue with the “I’ll listen to all sides” approach, and this is smart in terms of maintaining public support, which is crucial to passing future legislation.  This is why I feel it’s so important have his back in this crunch time.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;On the other hand, for Mary Landrieu, Ben Nelson, Dianne Feinstein, and the other Clinton Dems who spent decades proving that they have no interest in passing any Liberal policy, I’m all about about going after them.  Hard.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My support is full single-payer all the way, but I love what he’s doing with this.  How can you see his press conferences where he talks about the public option, especially the recent one where he was deriding the insurance industry about not being able to handle the competition, and claim he’s not out there pushing hard for this?</p>
<p>So for this, he “has your opposition.”  As I was suggesting in that first comment, he leads every issue with the “I’ll listen to all sides” approach, and this is smart in terms of maintaining public support, which is crucial to passing future legislation.  This is why I feel it’s so important have his back in this crunch time.</p>
<p>On the other hand, for Mary Landrieu, Ben Nelson, Dianne Feinstein, and the other Clinton Dems who spent decades proving that they have no interest in passing any Liberal policy, I’m all about about going after them.  Hard.</p>
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		<title>By: bonkers</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931406</link>
		<dc:creator>bonkers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:51:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931406</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I honestly believe the DLC, of which the Clintons were founders, was created specifically to stifle actual Liberal reform.  It works on a number of levels in that it makes Liberal complacent since, “hey, we got Dems in there!” and later when people get pissed that nothing is changing, as you seem to feeling, it works in the “divide and conquer” context as Liberals get demoralized and say, “they all suck.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Obama (or Biden for that matter) has never been a member of DLC.  He has actually had run-ins with associated groups.  Remember the lies and vehemence toward Obama from Hillary and the other DLCers from the campaign?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This is my central point in all the Obama bashing that happens here and other places - he didn’t create these problems, and he has already done A LOT to correct these problems, and for this I feel he has earned Liberal support so far.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;For example, people complain that the Stimulus was not enough, I agree with that, but it barely made it as is with all the infiltrator Dems in Congress, and is one of the largest spending measures (i.e. Liberal policy) in modern history.  The DLC Dems are losing more and more power by the week.  As Obama’s approval ratings maintain high level (DKos poll had him going back up this week), these fake Dems like Dianne Feinstein are becoming more exposed and more isolated.  This is great news, and this is why I say we need to know who the real enemy is.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I hope more people can feel more positive about what’s been happening, since there’s a lot to be excited about, and we’re just getting warmed up!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(by the way, it’s DemocratIC President…”Democrat Party” is another language trick they’ve been pushing again the last few years.)&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I honestly believe the DLC, of which the Clintons were founders, was created specifically to stifle actual Liberal reform.  It works on a number of levels in that it makes Liberal complacent since, “hey, we got Dems in there!” and later when people get pissed that nothing is changing, as you seem to feeling, it works in the “divide and conquer” context as Liberals get demoralized and say, “they all suck.”</p>
<p>Obama (or Biden for that matter) has never been a member of DLC.  He has actually had run-ins with associated groups.  Remember the lies and vehemence toward Obama from Hillary and the other DLCers from the campaign?</p>
<p>This is my central point in all the Obama bashing that happens here and other places &#8211; he didn’t create these problems, and he has already done A LOT to correct these problems, and for this I feel he has earned Liberal support so far.</p>
<p>For example, people complain that the Stimulus was not enough, I agree with that, but it barely made it as is with all the infiltrator Dems in Congress, and is one of the largest spending measures (i.e. Liberal policy) in modern history.  The DLC Dems are losing more and more power by the week.  As Obama’s approval ratings maintain high level (DKos poll had him going back up this week), these fake Dems like Dianne Feinstein are becoming more exposed and more isolated.  This is great news, and this is why I say we need to know who the real enemy is.</p>
<p>I hope more people can feel more positive about what’s been happening, since there’s a lot to be excited about, and we’re just getting warmed up!</p>
<p>(by the way, it’s DemocratIC President…”Democrat Party” is another language trick they’ve been pushing again the last few years.)</p>
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		<title>By: bonkers</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931405</link>
		<dc:creator>bonkers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:33:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931405</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Wasn’t really directed at you.  I was addressing the overwhelming amount of commenters here and at other Liberal blogs that constantly bash Obama as if he created the DeeCee cesspool, all while ignoring the incredibly positive things he has made into reality.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’m as chill as can, brutha, since at no point in my lifetime has a publically funded healthcare been so possible.  I want to make sure this happens, and the time is right now.  History is waiting for us.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wasn’t really directed at you.  I was addressing the overwhelming amount of commenters here and at other Liberal blogs that constantly bash Obama as if he created the DeeCee cesspool, all while ignoring the incredibly positive things he has made into reality.</p>
<p>I’m as chill as can, brutha, since at no point in my lifetime has a publically funded healthcare been so possible.  I want to make sure this happens, and the time is right now.  History is waiting for us.</p>
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		<title>By: Raven</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931404</link>
		<dc:creator>Raven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 13:28:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/07/07/early-morning-swim-166/#comment-1931404</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I get GA-FLA tics every year and trun them over so I basically go to home games free. “Gettin over”!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get GA-FLA tics every year and trun them over so I basically go to home games free. “Gettin over”!</p>
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