Before all the wailing starts about “Obama caved on the public option,” let’s remember that he has approached every issue he’s dealt with so far with this “I’m willing to listen to everyone” front, even though he knows ALL Repubs and several Clinton Dems won’t return the favor.

There’s a been a bunch of stories like this in BigMedia, where the headlines and articles suggest they’ve already “caved” as if it’s a done deal, and I hardly think that’s the case.

In the PR game, it seems obvious to me that they do this to advance their usual “divide and conquer” tactic, and sadly so many Liberals fall into the trap. It’s especially frustrating that the Obama=Bush!!11!! Liberals are doing this at such a crucial moment, when we’re on the verge of getting a public option, and Obama and actual Dems need every bit of support they can get.

It’s crunch time, and hopefully fellow Liberals will choose sides wisely and realize who the enemy really is.

.
How ’bout some REAL news? Michael Jackson’s not dead. He’s alive & well and building a new Neverland in the Wasilla Dome, and backing Palin for Prez in exchange for sleepovers with the grandkids. Perfectly innocent, but of course the LIBRUL media…
.

good luck with that here at the lake

He’s packing Palin, whoo hoo!

Palin, Sanford and Rahm. Isn’t there anything else in the news?

One town you don’t want to park yer car in front of a fire hydrant.

Kissinger:

It is always easy to divide the world into idealists and power-oriented people. The idealists are presumed to be the noble people, and the power-oriented people are the ones that cause all the world’s trouble. But I believe more suffering has been caused by prophets than by statesmen.

That’s right, Hank. Blame it all on Ghandhi, Christ, and MLK Jr.

Why is this creature allowed to consume our precious oxygen?

Mr. Emanuel said one of several ways to meet President Barack Obama’s goals is a mechanism under which a public plan is introduced only if the marketplace fails to provide sufficient competition on its own.

In case Mr. Emanuel hasn’t noticed, the market has failed. That’s why we are talking about a public plan in the first place. Duh!

I’d agree that that headline is probably a little premature.

Rahm may be powerful, but he’s not the POTUS and unlike the previous administration I’m convinced Obama makes up his own mind (good or bad) about the big stuff.

Secondly, I’d be a little leery about context when dealing with the WSJ these days; after all Murdock does own it, and we all know where he’s coming from.

Because some keep paying attention to the old man. Ever read his book Diplomacy?

You really should at least learn to spell Gandhi.

If we don’t even get a public option (we should have single payer) then we need to start encouraging people to change their registration from Democrat to Independent. The Democrats don’t deserve our support and we need to have a way to show it. Between Obama acting like Bush on secrecy and the Dems. doing their best to act like Republicans I’ve just had it. I’m ready to join a new Party. A Party that takes civil liberties seriously and one that cares more about people than corporate sponsors.

And that would change the choices we’re presented with at election time how? I’ve been an independent for 40 years and each election cycle it’s the evil of two lessers.

Sincere (i.e. not snarky) Q. I despise Kissinger, but I shouldn’t let my antipathy lead to ignorance. So I need to read something by him. Is Diplomacy the place to start?

Months ago, Krugman predicted that Obama was blowing it with the stimulus package was too small, noting that by the time we need another round of stimulus, Obama will have lost credibility and not be able to get it. So, now we have:

July 7 (Bloomberg) — The U.S. should consider drafting a second stimulus package focusing on infrastructure projects because the $787 billion approved in February was “a bit too small,” said Laura Tyson, an adviser to President Barack Obama.

[…]

Obama said last month that a second package isn’t needed yet, though he expects the jobless rate will exceed 10 percent this year. When Obama signed the first stimulus bill in February, his chief economic advisers forecast it would help hold the rate below 8 percent.

[…]

“The economy is worse than we forecast on which the stimulus program was based,” Tyson, who is a member of Obama’s Economic Recovery Advisory board, told the Nomura Equity Forum. “We probably have already 2.5 million more job losses than anticipated.”

Republicans, including House Minority Leader John Boehner of Ohio, seized on the latest labor numbers to attack the Obama administration’s handling of the economy.

And we also have: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJu0DgpiK8c

If you’re still about -

Followed up on your late night notes on Healin’ Hollers and have been in e-mail contact. Can’t find her products locally so will wind up ordering. The owner seems so nice that I’m gonna try to find some retail placement for her products in several areas of the state. This all on your recommendations. *g*

I’d feel better about Obama’s approach here if the main draw in the senate committee right now wasn’t the Medicare-like trigger option, which fails so miserably. Seeing as how the trigger has never managed to actually, you know, trigger and folks like my parents are paying out the wazoo for their prescriptions.

That’s not change I can believe in. It seems that the Blue Dogs and the Republicans are going to get their way yet again and this “reform” is just going to increase the obscene salaries of the drug and health insurance CEOs.

Of course, I’m just a foolish liberal who falls for the WSJ propaganda. I mean, what else is there to show that Obama has ever caved on anything else so far? Too-small stimulus (jobless recovery, anyone?), TARP, EFCA, bankruptcy cram-down, Iraq and Afghanistan, unlawful detention, DADT, DOMA, ENDA, oh, just ignore those things, they don’t really show how super effective this administration shepherds REAL change through the congress, do they?

I mean its only been 6 months and all. None of those issues are really important to progressive or liberal democrats, are they? And then there was that masterful stroke of supporting Leiberman keeping his chair so he can vote against any public option, right?

Yeah, I’m so encouraged and elated that things are going so well for us all right now, LOLOLOL. It’s so heartening to see my neighbors, friends, and families sink into bankruptcy, my nephew risk his life in Afghanistan, my credit card companies increasing my payments and interest exponentially every month, secrecy in government increasing by the day, the health industry is about to receive another huge government windfall (even if we probably won’t see any change except an increase in fees and denial of care) and the Wall Street banksters being allowed to go back to their gambling and getting those huge bonuses and all. Yep, this is the most amazingest evah progressive adminstration I’ve lived through in 50 years.

This was widely predicted in the reality based community.

Not interested in anything he wrote. Harper’s Magazine ran a series of articles about him a few years back, covering among other things his obsession with toppling the Salvador Allende, the popular president of Chile, and how he used the CIA to pull off the assassination.

Meanwhile, the Muslim minority in China seems to be lighting things up. Maybe Osama and company can start fucking with the Chinese. I will be a good chance to see some real shock and awe when they start offing people.

Bonkers. THANK YOU for your #1 here.

Good as any other, I suppose. He’s also written a few memoirs

Crisis: The Anatomy of Two Major Foreign Policy Crises: Based on the Record of Henry Kissinger’s Hitherto Secret Telephone Conversations (2003)

Vietnam: A Personal History of America’s Involvement in and Extrication from the Vietnam War (2002)

Years of Renewal (1999)

Years of Upheaval (1982)

The White House Years (1979)

it’s always something

roseanne roseanadana

It’s always advantageous to know how others think. Kissinger didn’t act in a vacuum. One of the main lessons of Sun Tzu’s Art of War and Machiavelli’s Discourses.

G’bye all, until dear sonny, the computer wizard, puts us back together again tomorrow. Ack!

Would you believe helpful hubby even packed our 2 elderly but functional radios?! So when mr. thymewannah unplugs us in a lil’ bit, we get our news by spitting on a finger & sticking it up to test the wind. Oye.

I agree with you. I think it’s vitally important to hold this administration accountable, but there are ways and there are ways. As it stands now, Obama is being shelled by the right and the left. Some folks here have a deep mistrust of him and have from the get-go. I absolutely concede that choosing Rahm Emanuel did diddley-squat to mitigate against that. Frankly, I’m not smart enough to run this country. So I watch, listen, wait to see how all of this plays out. And yeah, I make phone calls. And as soon as my legal battle with David’s family is over, I will resurface with LTEs (long story). Do I agree with everything that’s come out of the White House? I don’t. But I voted for the man with some measure of hope (as opposed to delusional euphoria), and the right doesn’t need my shrill voice (I have one) to help them create chaos and mistrust. Just sayin’.

From a POS from ap palin is apparently making the rounds of the morning shows holding pressers from the great fishin’ grounds. Which means anybody who’s tuning in for an all MJ all day session gets to hear her pearls of wisdom. Also.

thas’ alright. don’t bother sayin’ “safe trip” r anythin’. *sniffle*

This also assumes that power-brokers and statesmen are terms that can be/are used interchangeably. Echo of Sportin’ Life: It ain’t necessarily so.

*smooch*

Yep, that’s me. Obama = Bush. Please.

The fact is, the stimulus is 40% tax cuts and probably insufficient precisely because Obama listened to Republicans and “Clinton Dems.” And there are a lot more examples where that came from.

And no one is talking about Obama as “the enemy.” Chill.

dang girl, you only waited a minute!

Happy trails to you, until we meet again.
Happy trails to you, keep smilin’ until then.
Who cares about the clouds when we’re together?
Just sing a song and bring the sunny weather.
Happy trails to you, ’till we meet again.

Some trails are happy ones,
Others are blue.
It’s the way you ride the trail that counts,
Here’s a happy one for you.

Happy trails to you, until we meet again.
Happy trails to you, keep smilin’ until then.
Who cares about the clouds when we’re together?
Just sing a song and bring the sunny weather.

Happy trails to you, ’till we meet again.

Go well, Adie…….we’ll be waitin’ for you…..that’s the bright side of down time.

edit: and dog knows, you ain’t missin’ anything on the tube today.

I agree with pmorlan. Changing registration may be the only way to get their attention since most of us don’t have a spare 1.4 million to wave in front of their snouts every day. We should start demanding that they give their mega pharma/insurance payoffs back. And decline their generous public-financed health care since they believe it is too expensive. This system is broken. I’m sick of seeing my senators and representatives being bribed in front of my face while watching friends and family being ripped off by the people writing the checks. What the hell is wrong with Obama? If he isn’t willing to go to the mat on this he will not only have lost the battle, he will have lost the war. And it IS a war. Screw bipartisanship. The republicans will do whatever it takes to bring this administration down, no matter the cost to the country. Jello Jay was on the mark when he said this is between the good guys and the bad guys.

no one or not you?

True, so true. I guess I’m just frustrated with the fact that Bush was able to push through every single piece of legislation he wanted with a bare majority of 1 in the senate, Democrats be damned (although more often than not they supported everything he wanted too).

We elect a Democrat president with a clear, majority-driven mandate, give the Democrats a solid majority in the house and senate and can’t seem to pass one single piece of legislation without hobbling and weakening it to the point of ridiculousness. Republicans are bad, evil, and just plain crazy but Democrats can’t seem to do anything effective no matter the circumstances.

Such is American politics, I guess. Sigh.

Seymour Hersh would an excellent book on Kissinger, The Price of Power.

I know he’s written a lot, which is why I asked for the one to spend my time with. Thanks.

Girl!!! Best luck with your moving caper. It’s a total pain in the patoot and other body parts, but once you’re there, you’re…there!! Come back soon as you can, eh?

the evil of two lessers.

drive-by on the way out the door:

I’m stealing that.

Yes she is!! Franken is being sworn in at noonish ET.

I know, it sucks.

Damn, BT. I think you’re telling the wrong faction to chill. Just scan the comments and see whose weeping, wailing, and gnashing teeth.

what up CT?

I heard a piece on NPR this morning (I think on the business segment) about a proposed law to prevent a drug company with a patent from paying another drug company NOT to introduce a generic version. This, of course, is but one reason drug costs have skyrocketed. I probably should have been more savvy, but I was appalled!!

Thank you wigwam, it’s on my list as a must read. The Harper’s series about Kissinger was astouding. They presented a mountain of evidence of war crimes against him. With Rockefeller money behind him for legal defense, bringing charges against him was not possible.

It’s John Chancellor’s saying, old CBS newsman.

u guys de best. save the whirl, u will. ;->

Hey, Raven. Just another hot summer day. Staying close to AC until October.

Left ya a comment downstairs, Adie. *smooch*

Here is where much of the problem lies.

Have a save trip. We’ll be waitin’ for ya on da flip side.

I heard that, the drought seems to be making a comeback in the peach state!

In the PR game, it seems obvious to me that they do this to advance their usual “divide and conquer” tactic, and sadly so many Liberals fall into the trap. It’s especially frustrating that the Obama=Bush!!11!! Liberals are doing this at such a crucial moment, when we’re on the verge of getting a public option, and Obama and actual Dems need every bit of support they can get.

My support is for a robust public option. If Obama would fight for it as vigorously as he fought for funding for his Afghan Surge, he would have my support. But instead, he is talking about accepting a promise of some hypothetical scenario where insurance-industry CEOs violate their responsibility to maximize profits and turn into insurance fairies who for healthcare that they don’t now cover. In that nonsense, he has my opposition.

From the story about Palin:

“Most candidates, most public officials get to look into a camera and say, ‘you better leave your hands off my kids,’” she said. “Well I haven’t been able to say that. And that double standard that’s been applied, that’s been a little bit frustrating.”

Christ, woman, that’s ALL you’ve been saying!

Oh, spit! That’s right…..totally slipped my mind as I refuse to listen to anymore MJ today. Hopefully C-Span will do the honors. Maybe one of the front pagers will give us all a shout-out as to scheduling.

Yeah, I noticed that. We’ve had some rain in north Texas. All the lakes are full, although other parts of the state are dry. My brother lives in Kerrville, in the hill country, and says they’re really dry. But it’s hot all over. Around here, you have to hug the AC until the Texas-OU game, when it turns really nice.

59 days till football!

I must disagree to this extent. Obama campaigned on liberal positions and policies. They were his implied agenda. But, when he staffed up, he surrounded himself with right-of-center advisers. His policy as president has been state liberal aspirations, do a round of negotiations with himself where he puts forth a proposal that is already watered down, e.g., no single-payer option, and then whimpers that even the watered down version can’t get enough votes because of centrist Dems, so he settles for something this is guaranteed to be ineffective, e.g., he negotiates away even the public option.

IMHO, it’s all kabuki.

What, you don’t like baseball?

Ugh, I watch, actually listen, but it’s my least favorite. Football and the hoop are what I really love. Being able to walk to Georgia games is great.

Hey, that’s great news. Thanks!

I’d love for them to be around for a long, long time. The products are amazing.

I can’t watch on teevee but love to listen or go to the games. Football and hoops, not at all except for Gator football. Actually would love to score a tic to a Gators game at the Swamp.

I get GA-FLA tics every year and trun them over so I basically go to home games free. “Gettin over”!

Wasn’t really directed at you. I was addressing the overwhelming amount of commenters here and at other Liberal blogs that constantly bash Obama as if he created the DeeCee cesspool, all while ignoring the incredibly positive things he has made into reality.

I’m as chill as can, brutha, since at no point in my lifetime has a publically funded healthcare been so possible. I want to make sure this happens, and the time is right now. History is waiting for us.

I honestly believe the DLC, of which the Clintons were founders, was created specifically to stifle actual Liberal reform. It works on a number of levels in that it makes Liberal complacent since, “hey, we got Dems in there!” and later when people get pissed that nothing is changing, as you seem to feeling, it works in the “divide and conquer” context as Liberals get demoralized and say, “they all suck.”

Obama (or Biden for that matter) has never been a member of DLC. He has actually had run-ins with associated groups. Remember the lies and vehemence toward Obama from Hillary and the other DLCers from the campaign?

This is my central point in all the Obama bashing that happens here and other places – he didn’t create these problems, and he has already done A LOT to correct these problems, and for this I feel he has earned Liberal support so far.

For example, people complain that the Stimulus was not enough, I agree with that, but it barely made it as is with all the infiltrator Dems in Congress, and is one of the largest spending measures (i.e. Liberal policy) in modern history. The DLC Dems are losing more and more power by the week. As Obama’s approval ratings maintain high level (DKos poll had him going back up this week), these fake Dems like Dianne Feinstein are becoming more exposed and more isolated. This is great news, and this is why I say we need to know who the real enemy is.

I hope more people can feel more positive about what’s been happening, since there’s a lot to be excited about, and we’re just getting warmed up!

(by the way, it’s DemocratIC President…”Democrat Party” is another language trick they’ve been pushing again the last few years.)

My support is full single-payer all the way, but I love what he’s doing with this. How can you see his press conferences where he talks about the public option, especially the recent one where he was deriding the insurance industry about not being able to handle the competition, and claim he’s not out there pushing hard for this?

So for this, he “has your opposition.” As I was suggesting in that first comment, he leads every issue with the “I’ll listen to all sides” approach, and this is smart in terms of maintaining public support, which is crucial to passing future legislation. This is why I feel it’s so important have his back in this crunch time.

On the other hand, for Mary Landrieu, Ben Nelson, Dianne Feinstein, and the other Clinton Dems who spent decades proving that they have no interest in passing any Liberal policy, I’m all about about going after them. Hard.

Well, its hard to say “leave my kids alone” when you parade them around like props in your own personal talent show.

But won’t anything think about the fate of poor Alaska?

I think you put this so well. Those disappointed with this Pres, no matter how justified, find a way to be extremely harsh and shrill in their criticism or righteous indignation.

I see no need for giving the ever-wrong Republicans ammunition for their rants and headlines.

Thanks for correcting me. I have been a member of the Democratic party for 30 years and never knew it wasn’t Democrat. Snark.

As far as Obama not being a DLCer, he never joined but he surrounded himself with them in very important positions. You are way off the mark with that one. Here’s a quote from The Hill. Jume 17th edition:

http://thehill.com/leading-the…..06-17.html

“DLC alumni in the administration include Vilsack, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. And though Obama himself was never close to the DLC, his top aide, White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel, has been a longtime backer of the organization.

Emanuel and Bruce Reed, a former domestic policy adviser to President Clinton and the DLC’s president, wrote a 2006 book, The Plan, that laid out the path Democrats eventually took to regain power across government.”

So Obama has selected DLC members to oversee healthcare reform, homeland security, interior, secretary of state, and his chief of staff. But I’m sure they have no influence on policy or legislation. Right.

We just seem to disagree about how to approach politics. You call criticizing Obama “bashing” him. I call it holding his feet to the fire and making him do what we elected him to do, as he told us to do.

As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point. He excluded progressives from the discussions on the stimulus package, ignored our warnings, negotiated with himself and the republicans without need, and ended up with a far too little package that was too tax-cut heavy. And now the republicans are circling him like sharks as unemployment rises and the depression deepens. I’ll give him that one — he was newly in office and wet behind the ears. He didn’t seem to learn a lot from that experience though, because he is repeating it with health care reform. That’s the problem.

I worked hard to elect Obama, I like him and his family, and I want him to succeed very badly. But I’m never going to go along with any politician on trust alone. I’ve been at this game for too long and know that trust leads to disappointment and disaster in politics. Keep complaining and whip congress like crazy! And quit living in fear of the opposition using our criticism against Obama. They will create things out of whole cloth if they can’t find anything else. Don’t let them drive the agenda that way. We have a right and a responsibility to seek redress for our grievances against the government. That’s what we’re doing — not bashing Obama.

We are not giving them any ammunition. They make up shit as they go along. I am not going to encourage Obama to coddle the Blue Dogs by giving him positive feedback about this. My sister died likely as a direct result of not being able to afford decent insurance despite doing all of the “right” things: operating a small business; putting her daughter through college – she was the definition of a good, hardworking, taxpaying citizen. Obama might as well be kissing her off. This is unacceptable.

Thanks for the reply.

As far as all the good things he has done so far that you elude to twice, I’m not aware of any at this point

This is exactly what I’m talking about. I’m proud to call myself a radical Liberal, and when I follow what the Obama Admin is doing I get quite excited. The list is long, and I’ve spent a lot of time around here linking to a lot of those positives. However, in my opinion, here and several other leading Liberal blogs have the balance way off in terms of “holding Obama’s feet to fire” versus highlighting the all the great things that are happening. There are plenty of other sources of info in the New Media that have a more healthy balance.

When you hold someone’s feet to the fire too long, you all get burned eventually. Because of those positives Obama has enacted, and the fact that he’s consistently said he wants to do much, much more, I feel he’s earned the right to let those feet cool down from time to time.

The DLC Dems on the other hand are not even worth the holding of their feet to fire. They exist specifically to undermine us and Obama. That is why I object to lumping Obama with the DLCers.

As far as surrounding himself with DLCers….yes, that has bugged me, but I’m also learning a lot by watching this, and really understanding the value “keeping your friends close, and your enemies closer.” That’s an ancient strategy, and even in my own life has proven useful. I feel that’s what Obama is doing.

Of course, time will tell all, but so far so great in my opinion.

Repubs are specifically toying with them, and unfortunately many Liberals are playing right along:

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1277