Comments on: Slavery and the Health Care Crisis http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/ Firedoglake weblog Wed, 25 Nov 2009 15:14:14 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: RickCaird http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921551 RickCaird Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:31:41 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921551 <p>I found the source for the claim that 18,000 people die from lack of health care insurance. It is a 2002 rwpoet from the Institute of Medicine. However, there is no link to the actual study, only a press release. But, if you follow through with Google searches, we find it was essentially a meta study (those are always suspect) based on two other studies. One was from<br /> “1971–87 data on 25- to 74-year-olds from the National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (Franks, Clancy, and Gold 1993).”<br /> The second was:<br /> “The other used Current Population Survey (CPS) data on 25- to 64-year-olds from 1982 to 1986 (Sorlie et al 1994)”<br /> This reference appears to be worse that useless for today’s discussion as it is based on data that is at 25 years old and on two studies with different characteristics..<br /><a href="http://www.urban.org/publications/411588.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.urban.org/publications/411588.html</a><br /><a href="http://www.iom.edu/?id=19175" rel="nofollow">http://www.iom.edu/?id=19175</a><br /> Rick</p> I found the source for the claim that 18,000 people die from lack of health care insurance. It is a 2002 rwpoet from the Institute of Medicine. However, there is no link to the actual study, only a press release. But, if you follow through with Google searches, we find it was essentially a meta study (those are always suspect) based on two other studies. One was from
“1971–87 data on 25- to 74-year-olds from the National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (Franks, Clancy, and Gold 1993).”
The second was:
“The other used Current Population Survey (CPS) data on 25- to 64-year-olds from 1982 to 1986 (Sorlie et al 1994)”
This reference appears to be worse that useless for today’s discussion as it is based on data that is at 25 years old and on two studies with different characteristics..
http://www.urban.org/publications/411588.html
http://www.iom.edu/?id=19175
Rick

]]> By: ThingumbobEsq http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921521 ThingumbobEsq Mon, 22 Jun 2009 12:52:30 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921521 <p>Yes, Roosevelt made no compromise by unequivocally stating that the right to health is a human right. On the other hand Adolf Hitler’s T4 program to eliminate “useless eaters” was euthanasia. Ezekiel Emmanuel, Rahm’s brother is Obama’s mentor on health care reform. He has been promoting euthanasia to save money in healthcare costs for many years. Check it out.</p> Yes, Roosevelt made no compromise by unequivocally stating that the right to health is a human right. On the other hand Adolf Hitler’s T4 program to eliminate “useless eaters” was euthanasia. Ezekiel Emmanuel, Rahm’s brother is Obama’s mentor on health care reform. He has been promoting euthanasia to save money in healthcare costs for many years. Check it out.

]]> By: gmmay http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921452 gmmay Mon, 22 Jun 2009 10:47:58 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921452 <p>Considering the 50 million figure is bunk, you might want to go back and fix your numbers. How many are eligible for insurance, but choose to pay for their own? How many are here illegally? How many are eligible for programs but just haven’t signed up? How many are on medicare/medicaid? How many are transitioning jobs?</p> <p>This 50 million is a dishonest number and far more than 200k Americans died in the Civil War. Even on the Union side. It’s difficult to take the anaolgy seriously when the numbers are so far off.</p> <p>The other fact of the matter is that it’s not only the health insurance industry that opposes this government juggernaut. And if anyone quotes the widely discredited NYT/CBS poll about 75% of Americans wanting a government sponsored option (that’s not even CLOSE), I’m going to kick a kitten in your name.</p> Considering the 50 million figure is bunk, you might want to go back and fix your numbers. How many are eligible for insurance, but choose to pay for their own? How many are here illegally? How many are eligible for programs but just haven’t signed up? How many are on medicare/medicaid? How many are transitioning jobs?

This 50 million is a dishonest number and far more than 200k Americans died in the Civil War. Even on the Union side. It’s difficult to take the anaolgy seriously when the numbers are so far off.

The other fact of the matter is that it’s not only the health insurance industry that opposes this government juggernaut. And if anyone quotes the widely discredited NYT/CBS poll about 75% of Americans wanting a government sponsored option (that’s not even CLOSE), I’m going to kick a kitten in your name.

]]> By: Ron1946 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921325 Ron1946 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 05:20:15 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921325 <p>BRAVO! The analogy to slavery fits very well. It has been said that the average american male works and saves his whole life to hand all of his accumulated income and savings to medical care in the last thirty days of his life. It may not happen 100% of the time, but it happens often enough to deny many american males an estate to leave to his descendents (without almost deceitful action), just as slavery denied the descendents of slaves their rightful inheritances, and today’s descendents of pre-Civil War slaves still struggle under the lack of inheritances they should have rightfully received through the passing generations for the past 150 years. “Legacy” admissions to “Ivy League” colleges are another form of “affirmative action for whites” that is still grossly ignored in America today. So, BRAVO!</p> BRAVO! The analogy to slavery fits very well. It has been said that the average american male works and saves his whole life to hand all of his accumulated income and savings to medical care in the last thirty days of his life. It may not happen 100% of the time, but it happens often enough to deny many american males an estate to leave to his descendents (without almost deceitful action), just as slavery denied the descendents of slaves their rightful inheritances, and today’s descendents of pre-Civil War slaves still struggle under the lack of inheritances they should have rightfully received through the passing generations for the past 150 years. “Legacy” admissions to “Ivy League” colleges are another form of “affirmative action for whites” that is still grossly ignored in America today. So, BRAVO!

]]> By: nahant http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921256 nahant Mon, 22 Jun 2009 04:47:01 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921256 <p>What Mary Mcc said.<br /> The only solution for the masses is SINGLE PAYER Period. The Big Money Insurance companies have had their chance but like any Big profit center they let GREED blind them to the Truth. All Citizens deserve good quality health care. Amend the Constitution and make Health Care a Right for all Citizens!!</p> What Mary Mcc said.
The only solution for the masses is SINGLE PAYER Period. The Big Money Insurance companies have had their chance but like any Big profit center they let GREED blind them to the Truth. All Citizens deserve good quality health care. Amend the Constitution and make Health Care a Right for all Citizens!!

]]> By: larkohio http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921105 larkohio Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:45:08 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921105 <p>I have never posted on this site before, just lurked. However, this post was just excellent. You are spot on. Health care should be a non-profit proposition. We need universal health care. The time is now.</p> I have never posted on this site before, just lurked. However, this post was just excellent. You are spot on. Health care should be a non-profit proposition. We need universal health care. The time is now.

]]> By: DrZen http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921104 DrZen Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:43:59 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921104 <p>You won’t be marching everywhere. Every four years you all vote Democrat and you’ve got yourselves a party that is going to deliver mandatory private insurance. Nice one.</p> You won’t be marching everywhere. Every four years you all vote Democrat and you’ve got yourselves a party that is going to deliver mandatory private insurance. Nice one.

]]> By: LKN2 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921075 LKN2 Sun, 21 Jun 2009 22:13:16 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921075 <p>The real health care slavery will be a mandate with no public option or cost controls, which the insurers are close to achieving. Imagine the dollars you need to feed and house your children instead going to pay the multi-million dollar salary of a healthcare CEO, courtesy of the government mandate! It is immoral, if not unconstitutional.</p> <p>If there is a mandate, I would suggest a national campaign: Pay your health insurance bill each month, REDUCED by the amount of fraud, waste, and excess CEO compensation of your health plan (30% on average!).</p> <p>Even better, take a lesson from the brave Iranian people and march in the street. Certainly the Republicans would actively support the American people’s right to protest, just as they support the rights of Iranians!</p> The real health care slavery will be a mandate with no public option or cost controls, which the insurers are close to achieving. Imagine the dollars you need to feed and house your children instead going to pay the multi-million dollar salary of a healthcare CEO, courtesy of the government mandate! It is immoral, if not unconstitutional.

If there is a mandate, I would suggest a national campaign: Pay your health insurance bill each month, REDUCED by the amount of fraud, waste, and excess CEO compensation of your health plan (30% on average!).

Even better, take a lesson from the brave Iranian people and march in the street. Certainly the Republicans would actively support the American people’s right to protest, just as they support the rights of Iranians!

]]> By: itwasntme http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921052 itwasntme Sun, 21 Jun 2009 21:42:27 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921052 <p>It strikes me, watching the brave people of Iran make their feelings known, that what citizens need to do is to picket the health insurance companies. Petitioning congress/president doesn’t seem to be helping.</p> <p>Picketing with placards saying “Ghouls profit from sickness” and “sell your health care stocks” “No bonuses for sickness” or some such might be good.</p> <p>Plus, there are Blue Cross and other offices everywhere. Might be good to target Blue Cross one weekend, other HC for-profit providers another weekend, etc.</p> It strikes me, watching the brave people of Iran make their feelings known, that what citizens need to do is to picket the health insurance companies. Petitioning congress/president doesn’t seem to be helping.

Picketing with placards saying “Ghouls profit from sickness” and “sell your health care stocks” “No bonuses for sickness” or some such might be good.

Plus, there are Blue Cross and other offices everywhere. Might be good to target Blue Cross one weekend, other HC for-profit providers another weekend, etc.

]]> By: jimbo http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921004 jimbo Sun, 21 Jun 2009 18:45:28 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/06/21/slavery-and-the-health-care-crisis/#comment-1921004 <p>The big news here is that there is no honor, no integrity (if there ever was) in our democracy, only money. Whores run the system, whose only allience is to money. My question is are these people whores from the gitgo or does the endemic corruption in our systems steal whatever honor and integrity they might have had? Maybe Baucus can answer my question. What about it, Mr. Baucus? Cat got your tongue? or should I say, money got your tongue?</p> The big news here is that there is no honor, no integrity (if there ever was) in our democracy, only money. Whores run the system, whose only allience is to money. My question is are these people whores from the gitgo or does the endemic corruption in our systems steal whatever honor and integrity they might have had? Maybe Baucus can answer my question. What about it, Mr. Baucus? Cat got your tongue? or should I say, money got your tongue?

]]>