Comments on: The Unending War on Social Security http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/ Firedoglake weblog Fri, 17 Feb 2012 20:08:09 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: tk1200 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894520 tk1200 Thu, 07 May 2009 12:51:34 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894520 <p>The past and current attempts to privatize Social Security are nothing less than systematic attempts to feed the stock market money. It’s clothed in all kinds of Catoeque rhetoric, but the design is to take funds and divert them into the private sector, those geniuses of rational/optimal allocation of scarce capital, further decreasing government capital for its responsibilities under the Social Security Act, and further increasing the risk of losses suffered by individuals who participate in the market. No doubt the Blue Dog Democrats will agree that this 20% allocation needs to be mandatory to ensure a permanent source of revenue for stockbrokers, and they will ensure that losses may be deducted from the taxpayers’ following year’s income tax return to ensure that the Federal Treasury is further deprived of revenues. Once again we let the “intellectuals” at the Cato Institute et al to win this argument because we do not challenge their fundamental argument which is that the private sector should decide what is or is not in the public interest. Once you have two or three years of positive returns, there will be a clamor to require 40% of Social Security contributions to be privatized, and then 60%, and then 80%, and then 100%. So when the financial economy collapses again, and it will without serious reform and oversight, what then? What then will be the Blue Dog scheme to funnel massive amounts of money to these geniuses of capital allocation and risk taking? I would like to hear Steny Hoyer’s contingency plans for this scenario because I know that only a fool could not take away the lesson that the American financial economy needs serious reform before any rational person could think of diverting Social Security funds to them for long term retirement investment purposes. Right?</p> The past and current attempts to privatize Social Security are nothing less than systematic attempts to feed the stock market money. It’s clothed in all kinds of Catoeque rhetoric, but the design is to take funds and divert them into the private sector, those geniuses of rational/optimal allocation of scarce capital, further decreasing government capital for its responsibilities under the Social Security Act, and further increasing the risk of losses suffered by individuals who participate in the market. No doubt the Blue Dog Democrats will agree that this 20% allocation needs to be mandatory to ensure a permanent source of revenue for stockbrokers, and they will ensure that losses may be deducted from the taxpayers’ following year’s income tax return to ensure that the Federal Treasury is further deprived of revenues. Once again we let the “intellectuals” at the Cato Institute et al to win this argument because we do not challenge their fundamental argument which is that the private sector should decide what is or is not in the public interest. Once you have two or three years of positive returns, there will be a clamor to require 40% of Social Security contributions to be privatized, and then 60%, and then 80%, and then 100%. So when the financial economy collapses again, and it will without serious reform and oversight, what then? What then will be the Blue Dog scheme to funnel massive amounts of money to these geniuses of capital allocation and risk taking? I would like to hear Steny Hoyer’s contingency plans for this scenario because I know that only a fool could not take away the lesson that the American financial economy needs serious reform before any rational person could think of diverting Social Security funds to them for long term retirement investment purposes. Right?

]]> By: Knut http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894417 Knut Thu, 07 May 2009 07:32:43 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894417 <p>Money at 8 to 12 percent: good bye. Sorry it went into derivatives and CEO compensation: Money in bank at 3%: sorry that doesn’t seem to match the inflation. Oh, well. Seemed like a good idea at the time. Money in house. They always go up, don’t they. Seemed like a good idea at the time.</p> <p>social security is insurance. You pay for insurance to cover the odd chance that things don’t turn out right. As it happens, things are not turning out all right at present, and the people on SS are glad they had that insurance.</p> <p>Learn some real economics. You might start thinking accurately.</p> Money at 8 to 12 percent: good bye. Sorry it went into derivatives and CEO compensation: Money in bank at 3%: sorry that doesn’t seem to match the inflation. Oh, well. Seemed like a good idea at the time. Money in house. They always go up, don’t they. Seemed like a good idea at the time.

social security is insurance. You pay for insurance to cover the odd chance that things don’t turn out right. As it happens, things are not turning out all right at present, and the people on SS are glad they had that insurance.

Learn some real economics. You might start thinking accurately.

]]> By: Knut http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894416 Knut Thu, 07 May 2009 07:29:51 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894416 <p>The sad truth is that because the Thugs with the complicity of the Democrats raided the SS fund in the Bush years, taxes are going to have to go up to pay off the debt the United States government owes the Social Security Administration, which holds the notes. Hoyer is scared stiff that the thugs will go hell for leather after the Dems for raising taxes, although the tax increase was implicit in the original tax cuts put through — may I remind everyone– with Democratic support. It was a shell game all along.</p> The sad truth is that because the Thugs with the complicity of the Democrats raided the SS fund in the Bush years, taxes are going to have to go up to pay off the debt the United States government owes the Social Security Administration, which holds the notes. Hoyer is scared stiff that the thugs will go hell for leather after the Dems for raising taxes, although the tax increase was implicit in the original tax cuts put through — may I remind everyone– with Democratic support. It was a shell game all along.

]]> By: PJEvans http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894301 PJEvans Thu, 07 May 2009 02:19:04 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894301 <p>Make the congressional pension plan use the same contribution and payout schedule as SSDI. Yes, they’d have to get used to not being in the top 10 percent in income after they retire, but they should have invested all those donations from the banking and insurance lobbies in reliable vehicles if they wanted to maintain that Village lifestyle. /s</p> Make the congressional pension plan use the same contribution and payout schedule as SSDI. Yes, they’d have to get used to not being in the top 10 percent in income after they retire, but they should have invested all those donations from the banking and insurance lobbies in reliable vehicles if they wanted to maintain that Village lifestyle. /s

]]> By: Hugh http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894299 Hugh Thu, 07 May 2009 01:32:09 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894299 <p>Social Security has sufficient funds to fully finance the retirement system to 2040 if the government honors its commitments and pays back the surpluses and the interest accrued on them. A lot of the current attempts to “fix” Social Security, I suspect, involve welching on these commitments. The government has various options. It can pay shortfalls which the surpluses were meant to cover and which should begin to occur around 2017 by dipping into general revenues to pay them. It can raise the retirement age and reduce benefits. Or horror of horrors, it can remove the income caps on the rich and fund the shortfalls to 2040 and beyond. </p> <p>Even in a worst case scenario, SS should be able to fund 74% of its commitments in 2040 and beyond. So no, it will not run out of money even if nothing is done. It just won’t be able to meet all of its commitments. That is far different from not being able to meet any of its commitments.</p> Social Security has sufficient funds to fully finance the retirement system to 2040 if the government honors its commitments and pays back the surpluses and the interest accrued on them. A lot of the current attempts to “fix” Social Security, I suspect, involve welching on these commitments. The government has various options. It can pay shortfalls which the surpluses were meant to cover and which should begin to occur around 2017 by dipping into general revenues to pay them. It can raise the retirement age and reduce benefits. Or horror of horrors, it can remove the income caps on the rich and fund the shortfalls to 2040 and beyond.

Even in a worst case scenario, SS should be able to fund 74% of its commitments in 2040 and beyond. So no, it will not run out of money even if nothing is done. It just won’t be able to meet all of its commitments. That is far different from not being able to meet any of its commitments.

]]> By: sad4america http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894296 sad4america Thu, 07 May 2009 01:20:50 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894296 <p>I guess I just choose to look at the potential and great benefits out there and see how on my limited income I can make the best future for myself. That means planning for the worst as well. I can’t deny that “real wages” have gone down but I’m also not going to wallow in it. I am going to look and see that that is a real trend and in order for me to succeed and have a comfortable life I am going to need to make decisions that best suit my and my families needs and then go out and do it.</p> I guess I just choose to look at the potential and great benefits out there and see how on my limited income I can make the best future for myself. That means planning for the worst as well. I can’t deny that “real wages” have gone down but I’m also not going to wallow in it. I am going to look and see that that is a real trend and in order for me to succeed and have a comfortable life I am going to need to make decisions that best suit my and my families needs and then go out and do it.

]]> By: kirk murphy http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894293 kirk murphy Thu, 07 May 2009 00:57:44 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894293 <p>late, but woo-fuckin hoo!</p> late, but woo-fuckin hoo!

]]> By: robspierre http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894291 robspierre Thu, 07 May 2009 00:39:01 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894291 <p>We now know that 401Ks are the sham that we merely suspected back when companies were ending the private pension. So now we need to be planning for INCREASED Social Security benefits–something akin to a true national penison plan. </p> <p>For most of us, our parents got higher real wages during their life times plus a defined benefit pension plus continual increases in Social Security. How do these Republicrats expect those of us with less real income and no pension to manage to invest enough money to retire when their buddies on Wall Street are stealing interest and principle? How are we expected to make ends meet? </p> <p>Funny you should mention the following:</p> <p> “Cannibalism would be a more acute problem.”</p> <p>Problem solved. I wouldn’t eat a Republicrat (one knows where they’ve been). But I am told that pigs will eat Republicrats, and I’ll eat pigs!</p> We now know that 401Ks are the sham that we merely suspected back when companies were ending the private pension. So now we need to be planning for INCREASED Social Security benefits–something akin to a true national penison plan.

For most of us, our parents got higher real wages during their life times plus a defined benefit pension plus continual increases in Social Security. How do these Republicrats expect those of us with less real income and no pension to manage to invest enough money to retire when their buddies on Wall Street are stealing interest and principle? How are we expected to make ends meet?

Funny you should mention the following:

“Cannibalism would be a more acute problem.”

Problem solved. I wouldn’t eat a Republicrat (one knows where they’ve been). But I am told that pigs will eat Republicrats, and I’ll eat pigs!

]]> By: Phoenix Woman http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894289 Phoenix Woman Thu, 07 May 2009 00:31:55 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894289 <p>(((nahant)))</p> (((nahant)))

]]> By: Phoenix Woman http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894288 Phoenix Woman Thu, 07 May 2009 00:31:12 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2009/05/06/the-unending-war-on-social-security/#comment-1894288 <p>It helps if you’re consistently employed at a job where you can afford to save. But real wages in America have — aside from during the last term of Bill Clinton’s — steadily dropped since the mid-1970s.</p> It helps if you’re consistently employed at a job where you can afford to save. But real wages in America have — aside from during the last term of Bill Clinton’s — steadily dropped since the mid-1970s.

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