Republicans keep telling themselves that they lost in ‘06 and ‘08 because they weren’t conservative enough and so the "center-right nation" abandoned them. But the reality is, they’re just out of the mainstream on a whole host of issues.
For example, two recent actions by Obama, the banning of torture and the closing of Gitmo and CIA detention centers, enjoy popular support.
From the new WaPo/ABC poll:
A majority of Americans in a new Washington Post-ABC News poll oppose the use of torture in terrorism investigations, backing Barack Obama’s pledge that "under my administration, the United States does not torture."
…
Overall, 58 percent support the prohibition Obama declared before taking office, but there’s a wide gap across party lines: 71 percent of Democrats and 56 percent of independents in the poll said torture should never be used, but most Republicans, 55 percent, said there are cases in which the U.S. should consider using torture against terrorism suspects.
Funny how that "right and wrong/black and white" world conservatives love so much turns gray when it comes to torture.
And on Gitmo:
In a new Washington Post-ABC News poll, 53 percent of Americans said the United States should shutter the controversial facility, finding another way to deal with the prisoners under custody there. But a sizable proportion of all adults polled, 42 percent, and a broad majority of Republicans, 69 percent, said terrorism suspects should remain at Gitmo. Most Democrats, 68 percent, and independents, 55 percent, said they’d prefer another way.
While Republican leaders like John Cornyn and John Boehner continue cheerlead for the continuation these un-American policies, the rest of the country has thankfully rejected them.
Related posts:
- Cheney Led Torture Briefings, Democrats Objected, Post Reveals; CIA, Republicans Mum on Veep’s Role
- Pelosi: Republicans “Appropriated” Torture
- What Did Dick Give Judy to Go Pro-Torture?
- Americans Care More About Having Public Option than Gaining Snowe’s Vote
- Exclusive: New Poll Shows Clear Majorities Distrust Big Corporations, Favor Unions
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lordy
Authoritarian cultists simply believe Daddy needs all the tools in his arsenal to capture and punish Teh Bad People.
this is scary, but confirms some of my suspicious. guess it goes along with the authoritarian personality
yeah. it really doesn’t surprise me.
Blue Texan, excellent piece.
I have been trying to understand precisely and specifically who are the Americans who supported Bush when he left office, supposed to be about 30%. MSM has reported that 70% of registered repubs supported Bush at the end but I have never seen that broken out, e.g., 90% of Idaho repubs versus 20% of Mass repubs etc. I would really like someone to identify the precise demographics of Americans who supported Bush and torture.
Not surprising they are the same folks who prefer to skip ahead to the Second Amendment.
53% isn’t exactly a stunning figure….given the margin of error and opinion drift- this should probably be regarded as a fifty fifty issue.
BT – we should be so proud that “he who should not be named” (according to Rachel) is from Texas! Let’s call him Senator Torture. We need to create a new slew of bad characters now that Chimpy and Darth are finally gone.
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!
(Except Rethugs, who woulda lurved it.)
Gallup has it 35% in favor of shutting down gitmo and 45% opposed- the rest of americans think the question is too hard.
Froomkin has that Obama signed a memo asking for a review of the status of al Marri.
And for those who didn’t catch the Blair hearing for DNI, he said he would not waterboard but declined to call waterboarding torture and he said that he would not pursue those who had tortured under Bush.
Have to factor in the people who think Guantanamo is something you put on nachos.
The data attached to that WaPo/ABC poll is quite revealing. Apparently torture is a “guy thing.” Notice that even Republican women oppose torture 50 to 45, which is quite significant, but even independent men favor torture 55 to 45, and 100% of independent men had an opinion.
If the question wasn’t to hard Bush would not have done his job of totally f**king things up.
53% is a majority, but it sure isn’t a hell of a majority, you know? I wish people were more humane. And I wish being humane wasn’t a political issue, just a bottom-line given, you know. Shit.
That would be a fairly large contingent.
In related news, the commander of camp pendleton has announced that Marines will no longer be allowed to go to Tijuana- too dangerous. He has yet to restrict motorcycling which has killed more Marines than Iraq.
If you define someone as a terrorist, not a lot of people are going to feel sympathetic.
If you change the question to to ask whether they would torture people “suspected of being involved with terrorism” you might get greatly different numbers. Even from Republicans.
I’m sure most of these sociopaths and bully boys regard themselves as “Christians” as well. Who Would Jesus Torture?
Well given the fact that the Republican Party now constitutes only about 30% of the electorate…having two-thirds of them still in the “Jack Bauer” column, would explain precisely why Bush was still supported by 20% of those polled.
The problem is that none of this torture has ever produced a scenario like the “Jack Bauer” pseudo-drama. Not one “imminent terrorist act” has ever been thwarted. In fact, the most that McConnell and Mukasey could claim is that they had “actionable intelligence”. That means they received information, accurate or not, that they acted upon. Now they may have offed someone that some waterboarded suspect claimed worked with him that turned out not only to be innocent, but actually opposed to al Qaida…but the important thing is that the CIA got “intelligence” and ACTED. Maybe they didn’t actually kill the “exposed” suspect…perhaps they simply sealed him up in Gitmo.
Oh…another phrase they use is “useful intelligence”. That could mean something as simple as the fourth confirming source for an link they already had looked into. Or it could mean that they received information that allowed them to take a shortcut to evidence they would have eventually arrived obtained anyways. Of course, how “useful” is information obtained when you can no longer use it in a criminal trial? That requires you to construct a huge pseudo-legal Tribunal system and off-shore detention centers? That taints your very changes to obtain criminal convictions in a Federal Court because you cut corners?
Jack Bauer likely could go before any jury, show them that his acts were performed under duress, stress and “temporary insanity” from the imminent threat that the nation faced and likely beat the rap due to “exigent circumstances”. I hope that those who acceded to performing these acts, and those who ordered them to torture, also face trial and get the opportunity to show how they protected Americans from “imminent danger” rather than simply obtaining “actionable” or “useful” intelligence.
At the end of the day they are scared, scared little children, fraid of the unseen boogy man. Not that they had anything to do with the predictable blow back boogy man they created from all their meddling in other countries affairs, around the world….. They know what they deserve. And if you listen close for the sounds of a train, a train crying for justice roaring down from the mountain top wait …..
Wait.. Who’s that in the cab , The ghost of Pat Tillman driving the demand for truth train through any republican obstacles they pile on the tracks. Time’s about up, judging from which way the wind is blowing…..
Only Traitors Torture …… Persons not covered by Geneva ……. There are none
Traffic accidents have killed more Israelis than Hamas rockets ever did, but I don’t see the IDF slaughtering bad drivers en masse.
The number of Americans who still love Bush & Cheney is huge, like a large European country’s total population.
The application of the term terrorist is defining them as guilty before an ajudication thereof. If someone is arrested for suspicion of murder they are referred to as alleged murderers until they are found guilty.
“I hope that those who acceded to performing these acts, and those who ordered them to torture, also face trial and get the opportunity to show how they protected Americans from “imminent danger” rather than simply obtaining “actionable” or “useful” intelligence.”
But I seriously doubt they can….
had that poll been taken before we discovered bushco was torturing the poll would have been not only reversed, they would have been appalled they were even asked
however they are tools, they are marionettes, they are puppets, they do what they are told, they think the way they are told and they have been told they must support torture so that their puppeteers might not go punished for their crimes
Yeah, like the population of Byeleorussia vs, the European Union.
Those aren’t Americans; they are pod people.
the reason it’s not possible is the simple fact, no matter what information you think you’ve gained you would have gained better information had you used other techniques
and you would not have created more events that needed to be defended against, torture breeds terrorists, terrorist events and creates more issues.
AND you get less information
The people held in Gitmo must have been very low level in any organization and would therefore know little or nothing about tactics or plans. I don’t imagine that any of them knew anything that would assist us in our “war” so I believe we have tortured people because we liked it.
a point and a question.
1. sometimes an appeal to a person’s self-image as a “good” person works to convince them some action should not be undertaken. something along the lines of: we are a good country or you are a good person. good people don’t torture. therefore we/you don’t torture.
i happen to disagree with the premise, but at least don’t pretend otherwise.
2. a question: something i don’t understand that has come up in many, many threads over time here but never to my knowledge explicitly. why should my sympathy (or maybe empathy?) be greater or less depending on whether i’m aware of something the person has done wrong? realizing i may be revealing a character flaw, this does not compute to me.
Yes, didn’t Thomas More write about this, and didn’t he call it Udopia?
Yup. I think we’re together on that.
DAY 2
Obama Orders Secret Prisons and Detention Camps Closed
possibly for several reasons. But, to me, chiefly for the fear/expectation that people who have committed bad things are likely to commit more.
that’s a great frigging point, allow me;
>
since you’ve defined them as terrorists and you have therefore justified torturing them, you can easily get a confession through that torture that they are indeed terrorists
great point foothillsmike
I’ll have to wait for the full text. The draft text bmaz had up last night closed Guantanamo but didn’t address other facilities.
ps all, obama signs order to close quantanimo!
The majority of men are there simply because they are Arabs; not because they are terrorists as defined by the US.
****************
In March 2002, the AP reported that Afghan intelligence offered rewards for the capture of al-Qaida fighters — the day after a five-hour meeting with U.S. Special Forces. Intelligence officers refused to say if the two events were linked and if the United States was paying the offered reward of 150 million Afghanis, then equivalent to $4,000 a head.
That day, leaflets and loudspeaker announcements promised “the big prize” to those who turned in al-Qaida fighters.
Said one leaflet: “You can receive millions of dollars. … This is enough to take care of your family, your village, your tribe for the rest of your life — pay for livestock and doctors and school books and housing for all your people.”
http://www.commondreams.org/he…..531-10.htm
Another term that I think needs to be really limited is the term enemy. I am listening to Gibbs giving his first presser and he is talking about Iran etc. and using the term. One could say as easily those countries with which we have disagreements.
If MSM would tell the truth..these dead enders for Bush/Cheney would vanish.
More Re-pug games..
‘Barbara Boxer (D-CA), chairman of the Senate environment committee, just confirmed to TPMDC that Sen. John Barrasso (R-WY) is the culprit behind the slowdown in confirming to of Barack Obama’s senior environmental policy nominees, Lisa Jackson and Nancy Sutley. (The Journal outs Barrasso here.)
“We’ll break it,” Boxer said of the Republican logjam. “Once we go public with it, it should go away.”‘
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo…..-delay.php
optimistic at best
they are there because their business competitor wanted them out of action and turned them in, they are there becuase their neighbor wanted a clear path to the wife and turned them in, they are there becuase someone paid them cash and turned them in, they are there becuase their kid beat anothers kid in a school debate and was turned in
they are there because the person who turned them in acted on for promises of water, promises of jobs, promises of political position
of the scores tried, bush has enjoyed but three convictions, even with the kangaroo court specifically designed to make it easy for conviction
The power to name is not to be underestimated. friend.
The same people who are scared to death of terrorists (exactly what the terrorists want) and who believe we must sell our souls to the devil to remain safe, will tell you over and over how “These colors don’t run”, or “Americans are not afraid of anything”.
We have nothing to fear but our own lack of morals. I, for one, will not be afraid.
Wonder if there was ever any documented follow-up on those who turned in their neighbors falsely, or any request for “refunds” for the millions of dollars that have been paid out to such “informants”?
you guys should read this oxdown diary;
it goes on, and calls us to action
Obama is probably just now learning what he’s really got in Gitmo. One would imagine that there are detainees ranging all the way from innocent and harmless- to some pretty dangerous characters. Sorting the sheep from the goats is probably job one.
The trickiest cases will be those where the detainee is dangerous but where prosecution is difficult due to lack of proper evidence or presence of co-erced evidence- or both. That may only be a handful of cases.
obama is not only getting things done, he is doing it in the light of day, while every move he makes is broadcast around the world
he is not afraid of these maggots…he is stronger then I imagined, let’s hope he keeps it up
I think I read somewhere that some of the detainees were as young as 14. Is that possible? Horrible.
I think the trickiest cases are those of innocent who now are militarized against us becuase of their improsonment and torture
that is SUCH a tough cookie to crack
we were told by rumsfeld himself that the horror of pictures we’ve seen were not even close to the worst.
The problem is that rethugs don’t believe experts. Whether it is the value of torture, environmental warnings, or FDA researchers if it conflicts with their dogma, the dogma is what is important.
Does anyone know what happened to the 1200 of Muslims or possible “terror” suspects that they rounded up right after 9/11?
Where did they go?
Did they try them for anything?
Did they release them?
Did they deport all non-citizens?
I remember a 60 minute story about a naturalized Arab was arrested and his family had no clue where he went and they could not talk to anyone.
true enough, they only believe their leaders, they are marionettes
please contribute to this diary, it’s right on point and really well done by someone who is doing something about it
when you write about only a handful of case, i guess that you mean only those who were a danger when apprehended? i think we have to assume that everyone of them is now a potential danger – we’ve made it so by our inhumane treatment. but to a certain extent we’re going to have live with that.
that is one, although not the most important, reason i advocate that we make every attempt to pay restitution. that means none of them or their families should ever be in need if there is something we can do. that is a moral debt we owe and imo we would be wise to pay it.
Apparently a lot of the Salem witches became witches for the same reason terrorists became terrorists…personal vendettas and greed on the part of their accusers. The same bible-thumping fear mongering psychology was used in both cases because it works so well on the ignorant and compliant.
Republicans love torture for the same reason they love war and hate environmental standards and universal healthcare.
Here are two names from the top. More in the 238 page PDF that is linked to from this page. This is the first Camp Delta Standard Operating Procedures manual that I have found; it says it is an update, so there is at least one previous one. This SOP shows that torture and the breaking of Geneva Conventions was present at the very start of Guantanamo. Obama would have to charge the majority of the DOD to ‘get’ everyone. He would have to charge the US military, the Israelis, sub-contractors, US psychologists, and most certainly, Rumsfeld. He would have to charge the majority of your senators who knew and said nothing.
**************
Camp Delta SOP 28 March 2003
UNCLASSIFIED//FOR OFFICIAL USE ONLY
By Order of the Commander
GEOFFREY D. MILLER
Major General, United States Army
Commander, JTF-GTMO
Official: ADOLPH MCQUEEN
Colonel, Military Police
Commander, JDOG
http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Camp…..re#History
Actually many were innocent and were targeted because they “different” as they didn’t toe the company line. My ancestor was the one who was crushed by a stone because he refused to confess that he was a witch.
Just replace “unpatriotic” for the word “witch” under BushCo we would ALL be witches ;)
Adolph, how fitting.
-G
Mrs. Clinton said she sought a “sense of openness and candor in this building,” and invited people to “think outside the proverbial box,” which drew a yelp from a man in the crowd. She promised “robust diplomacy” and “effective development” to restore America’s standing overseas.
Secretary of State Clinton Arrives at Foggy Bottom
here’s an interesting analogy;
rush has been saying he hopes obama fails
if that were said in Iraq againt bush I think we can safely assume he would see the walls of gitmo
KBR implicated in negligent homicide in death of US soldier by electricution.
-G
Now they may have offed someone that some waterboarded suspect claimed worked with him that turned out not only to be innocent, but actually opposed to al Qaida…but the important thing is that the CIA got “intelligence” and ACTED. Maybe they didn’t actually kill the “exposed” suspect…perhaps they simply sealed him up in Gitmo.
See the Aafia Siddiqui case http://www.bostonmagazine.com/….._siddiqui/
It’s almost as if Tim McVeigh, while being tortured, named Caroline Kennedy, or similar, as a co-conspirator . Anywhere but BushWorld the whole thing would be ludicrous.
(My theory , in part , it was started by USPS mistakes . Her husband’s name , M. Ajad Khan ; the supposed terror connection : Majid Khan . Both had PO boxes at the same PO)
macaquerman @ 18 (show text)
If you define someone as a terrorist, not a lot of people are going to feel sympathetic.
a point and a question.
Exactly. And that’s how the whole thing, including poll questions , is frame . If the question were asked straight up , “Should we torture people?” , or evenb “prisoners”, the results would probably be even more against it .
As someone alluded to above, the overwhelming majority of our prisoners were not captured by our military (According to Alex Gibney, only 7% in Afghanistan.) They were turned over by somone else , usually for cash . When people know those details , they (at least ones I’ve talked with) tend to be less supportive of the torture/gulag regime . Some can even extrapolate, & empathize, and imagine it happening to themselves. Of course, some of the hardcore authoritarians still find a way to justify it , and trust in the beneficence of our government . ( as opposed to their view of government in every other area ;)
“ignorant and compliant” ?
Maybe fearful and resentful?
Blair Pledges New Approach to Counterterrorism
One area remains taboo – there appears to be a concerted effort to avoid outing existing CIA officers, NSA agents and other current Government employees who executed Bushco orders to torture and commited other illegal acts.
As Greenwald says, average citizens are subjected to the full weight of the law if we break it. Government officials can apparently break the law with impunity and suffer no legal consequences.
Yeah , two of them. See Greenwald’s post from yesterday. http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html
perris @ 50: he is very very strong. it’s clear from the look of him he just doesn’t carry the baggage of recent leaders. amazing. they said he’d fall in line. i guess not. and he’s just getting started. booyah.
Twain @ 51: yes, there are 2 detainees that qualify as child soldiers. it’s horrible. Khadr (now 21) is charged with ”war crimes” while cheneyco walks free.
Yes..after all, the CIA is the ‘child’ of the Gestapo.
************
Gen. Gehlen (middle) was imported along with his Gestapo by the Dulles Brothers after WWII to help setup and train the CIA (operation paperclip)
http://www.nogw.com/cia.html
Then there is the ongoing bullcrap that the Repugs are pushing ….. heard Senator Brownback just this morning how we can’t release them because sooooooooooo many have been captured on the battlefield……. they got their talking points AND I want the facts…….
Where were found on the battlefield?
Who was it that they found?
How many were actually found?
hackworth1 @ 70: i’m seeing a spin of ”good people were forced to do bad things and we should be sympathetic.” i think this is what we are supposed to think, not a summary of what actually happened. we need to know who did what and however sad it is, the rule of law must prevail.
The battlefield is the street in front of their houses.
The thing that got me was the prosecution of Ossama’s taxi driver …. if we put that in context….. then the pilot of Airforce One needs to go on trial after Bush…..
That’s a bit overblown. Gehlen didn’t train our intelligence service and he was not much trusted.
if they weren’t terrorists, well, why we wouldn’t have to torture them would we? so i guess they must all be terrorists! NOT.
cheneyco never wanted the truth about anything.
many were victims of kidnapping for US-paid bounty.
treating them well from now on is all we can do: if we have created an army of terrorists, too bad, we made our bed.
I believe that he was found driving, and as the sole occupant of, a car with to SAMs in the trunk. That’s usually enough to merit an arrest and conviction. He wasn’t sentenced to much.
katymine @ 75: that is a beautiful analogy.
Airforce One is probably better armed….
Maybe, but the gas mileage is lousy.
“…and we should be sympathetic.” No sympathy here… I recall many a mob RICO trial when the Mafioso defendant(s) was wheeled into the courtroom sitting in wheelchair with a oxygen tank by side! Seeking a little sympathy for defendants??
The subliminal media conditioning has already begun. Cheney sitting a wheel chair?
With the services of a good electrician, why not?
Opening of CIA Records under Nazi War
Crimes Disclosure Act
Under the auspices of the IWG, the CIA has reviewed and declassified “Name Files” of many Nazi figures and related subjects, including the files on Walter Schellenberg (Head of the Reich Security Main Office Foreign Intelligence Service) and Otto Skorzeny (Hitler’s favorite commando, having snatched Mussolini from captivity). The files also provide new insight into such individuals as Walther Rauff, Krunoslav Dragonovic, and Reinhard Gehlen. (Highlighted below.) The IWG website (www.nara.gov/iwg) provides a full list of the names and subjects, including the 20 CIA Name Files released in April 2001.
Much has already been written on the 25-year relationship that ensued when American officials accepted Gehlen’s offer; but these documents detail the complexity of that relationship as well as the strategic gamble made by the United States in sponsoring the rebirth of Gehlen’s wartime organization. The U.S. Army remained Gehlen’s sponsor until 1949, when the Central Intelligence Agency, after much internal debate, took over as Gehlen’s main patron.
http://www.fas.org/sgp/news/20…..50802.html
A majority of those people who belong to the “law and order” party don’t believe in the Rule of Law?
That’s ironic.
It’s another version of “I was just following orders”.
Good luck with that defence.
However, if you look at Cornyn’s history, his reason for being in Washington is to protect the interests of energy companies—like former Vice President Dick Cheney’s Halliburton and KBR. I believe that Cornyn is less worried about intelligence agents than he is about private contractors who committed atrocities in Iraq in the name of greed, not national security.
Corynyn and Halliburton go way back. When John Cornyn was Texas Attorney General he refused to intervene when Halliburton shredded documents which had been subpoenaed in a lawsuit. Cheney and Co. made no bones about the fact that they shredded the documents rather than turn them over to the court.
If Attorney General Eric Holder were to pursue a case against Dick Cheney’s company KBR and its former owner Halliburton for torture and other human rights abuses, he would find plenty of people willing to testify.
http://journals.democraticunde…..Taylor/363
You are quite right that the CIA worked with Gehlen, and for many years.
What I said was that you were over the top in saying that the CIA was the child of the Gestapo. Perhaps you’re confusing the intelligence service that Gehlen ran with the Gestapo. They were quite distinct.
Hey there, I’m a little late to this thread but curious (without reading all comments): OK, I get the number that this is 53% of republicans. Is that 53% of the republicans they asked and what is the percentage of the general population that that represents? I think these numbers distort the size of the sickos who would support torture.
“To all those brave men and women who have in fact objected to (the Iraq) war we say, bravo. We say welcome, you should be here in Canada,” Silva said at a news conference in Toronto, which was attended by several war resisters and their young families.
The House of Commons passed a motion June 3 calling for a stop to deportations of war resisters, and Silva urged the government to respect that vote.
Writer Mary Jo Leddy, a member of the Order of Canada, said the trials in Nuremberg after World War II established that soldiers are responsible for their actions, and should be allowed to opt out of conflict if they don’t believe in the mission.
“The argument that one must follow orders in all circumstances is no longer justified,” she said. “Following orders is no longer the ultimate test of patriotism.”
http://www.michaelmoore.com/wo…..p?id=13197
Late to this, but the trap image brings back the one thing about the crowd at the inauguaration that got to me. All those fur coats.
Fur as status has come back during the Bush cruelty-to-all-living-things years. GRanted many of the fur coats came from some mink torture facility somewhere, and not wild places – but there is a heck of a lot of coyote fur collaring around these days, too. Some NOT faux.
We have a whole agency in the federal government that uses traps to kill wolves, coyotes, badgers, otters,and “accidental” eagles, dogs, etc. It is called Wildlife Services, and people are calling for Obama to eradicate that agency.
Blindly following orders has long discredited. Our military recognizes that some orders are “illegal”.
As well, objecting to fighting a war on grounds of religion or belief has also been recognized.
On another note, if you’ll excuse me, I would like to say to you that the link you provided @71 led me to a site that was far from a reliable source of information. If you want to use it , do yourself a favor and cross-check it.
I hope I’m not sounding too much like a scold. peace.
Stick with your government’s site then and do your own research. Why would you assume that I ever read one site without checking others? You can distract by saying one site is unreliable, in your opinion, but you cannot change the facts.
http://www.archives.gov/iwg/re…..ober-1999/
The fact that some Canadian officials are fighting to allow your war resistors to stay in Canada, is important. The wars were illegal invasions and it is the opinion of many experts that all NATO forces are therefore committing war crimes. I put the information here for the knowledge of everyone.
Peace is what I want. Anything I can find to help inform is brought here to help attain that goal. Other than a few trolls lately, my information has been received in the spirit in which it is intended. Please, in the future, do not respond to me and I will do you the same honour.
I’m sorry that despite, in the main, being in agreement, that I have given offense by saying that a source was not reliable.
Calling me a troll is perhaps de trop. Perhaps not.
Farewell.
Let’s do the math. Say there are 40 percent republicans. 70 percent of them like the idea of torture. 70*40 = 28 percent dead-enders who were for bush all the way. It adds up. Most from the South, where they are programmed to violence against dark people.
I don’t know how dangerous someone who’s been tortured for seven years in the tank is going to be. What the hell are people afraid of? These guys are zombies, their lives have been taken from them. They may hate the United States (and who could blame them at this point), but since when since Joe McCarthy, have bad thoughts been considered lethal to the nation’s safety? Let ‘m go. Most will be wandering the strength and shacking up in refuges for homeless persons.
I was wondering why they held some of the people who weren’t involved or only marginally involved for all this time.
Do you think that the jailers were too f’d-up to admit error?
You should read more carefully…I did not call you a troll. Broke my pledge, but I will not let you misrepresent what I said. No offence taken..I find the news..I don’t make it up.
I gratified that you did. I wasn’t trying to alienate and feel badly that I did. I did read the troll remark loosely.
Do we know if that money was actually paid out or if it just ended up in some American’s pocket.
BTW, it’s not Byelorussia any more. It’s Belarus.
“Udopia” — ha ha LOL 707 Great.
My guess is that’s already been done, but that Bush wouldn’t release any for fear of appearing weak and stupid.
After all, if you’re in war you’re supposed to have prisoners, right? Of course, he would never call them ‘prisoners of war’. That would’ve gotten him in trouble. Wouldn’t it be nice to just change the name of anything which might cause you trouble. “Oh no officer, that’s not a dead body, just a not living thing.” What a dimwit.
Bush said the Earth was the battleground. So, that doesn’t narrow it down much.
Question is, was the person trying to harm, kill or impede the U.S. in catching Al Qaeda?
Just being on the battlefield doesn’t mean you’re not a medic, local resident or journalist.
It probably was..because they kept turning in people as terrorists. I think that if the money wasn’t paid..there would not have been any more ‘terrorists’ found.
The rewards given were/are not always monetary. The following is from March 2004.
************
The bill, a result of Kirk’s recent mission to Afghanistan and Pakistan, is intended to help the U.S. military and operations like “Mountain Storm” to capture or kill terrorists. The bill also expands the eligibility criteria to receive an award, authorizes non-monetary awards and focuses on increased advertising of the reward available for the capture of Usama Bin Laden.
“Our bill will give the State Department more flexibility in the types of rewards it gives,” said Kirk. “It allows them to provide rewards in commodities- a tractor or farm animals- as well as cash. In this remote region, key commodities, such as a truck, can provide as much incentive as a large cash bounty.”
Congressman Kirk led a congressional mission to Afghanistan and Pakistan in January to review the rewards program and opportunities for the United States and its allies. He met with several military personnel stationed along the Afghan-Pakistani border who expressed concern over whether the rewards program was helping in the capture of Usama bin Laden. Outdated State Department advertising of its rewards was having little impact in a region where very few people know how to read, or write.
http://www.house.gov/list/pres…..40317.html