SOME good news at least.
I suppose I shouldn’t get my hopes up. it’s only the first freaking day of a new Presidency.

WHOO HOO!
it felt SO GOOD to be able to type that!

Wyden: Answering a question about whether we will be moving toward single payer, Wyden says that single payer winds up devolving into an argument with people who are opposed to “too much government.”

So now we are afraid to have an argument in the clubhouse. We didn’t work to get people elected so that they can get together and sing cumbaya.

Wyden says that single payer winds up devolving into an argument with people who are opposed to “too much government.” But if you use the term “universal coverage” and you say that for the same amount of money everyone can have the same coverage as members of Congress, it’s not so polarizing. So basically, no.

Is Wyden part of Amateur hour in politics the GOP has a vested interest cash from the medical industry to listen to the opposing argument….however false it may be.
Wyden is being logical and reasonable to people being emotional lust, greed etc

So basically, no

Either cut off the GOP’s cash from these guys like you cut off a junkie from drugs or start taking away other things that bring them cash like Army bases in their districts.
Emotion works on them and like Junkies, Cash is the only thing they can feel emotion for.

Oh boy, I think I’m going to find my earplugs. Going to be even shrieking & frothing by the wingnuts.
My husband said there was a very pissed off over 60 customer loudly complaining to everyone in the place yesterday about having to see the Obama” crap” all over the tv all day. Someone should have told him to “get over it” but he probably would have had a stroke.

Thanks Jane.
digg

Wyden’s argument makes little sense. If universal coverage and quality care can be provided at the same cost as a patchwork system of questionable quality, what reasonable person could object to using money wisely?

Will someone ask about the Senate’s schedule for The Big LGBT Bill (DADT repeal, DOMA repeal, Mathew Shepard Hate Crimes, Immigration Partner Recognition & iENDA) or isn’t that any Senator’s issue? These should be packaged into noe single bill to limit wingnut frothing to a single piece of legislation.

Whats more important to the GOP to much Government? Or letting people keep cash in their wallet? Government private industry it does not matter who takes the cash it is still taken.
But by not insuring everyone you risk the poor the cooks, nannies, house keepers, landscapers etc of the rich getting sick with the latest strain of antibiotic resistant germs.
And coming into work sick with no paid sick days.
My Grand Aunt had TB she cleaned houses on the gold coast of Chicago.
Read the “Coming Plague” we are over due for a big one.

You had me until “reasonable.”

I would be interested in knowing if these progressive Senators intend to propose any rule changes for the Senate.
I understand that the Senate was intended to be a more deliberative body than the House, but some of these procedural rules, developed a century ago in a horse and buggy world, need to be reviewed.

Universal coverage is about as worthless as tits on a boar hog in reducing costs if you have thousands of insurance companies trying to turn a 17% profit after they have paid sales staffs, advertising, teams of attorneys to deny benefits, CEOs, CFOs, COOs, elaborate headquarters to pay homage to their business accumin and on and on. This is not progressive legislation it is the same old shit wrapped in a new ribbon.

Obama didn’t run on single payer- neither did Hillary as I recall. They don’t run on it because they believe that it’s a loser politically. They may be wrong- but it’s far from clear that they are. In any event- probably the best we can hope for in the short run is some version of sort of universal coverage with an option for many to sign onto medicare. That’s a step towards single payer (and of course the goopers know that it is)- but it may be an easier sell.

What the dems are afraid of is a no holds barred campaign by the insurance companies and drug companies that could kill ALL progress in a few months. Whatever they do, they should do it QUICKLY and not give the opposition time to respond.

one single bill

Heh. The dead enders aren’t reasonable, of course. But Wyden and the rest of ‘em should be saying that anyone who opposes getting the most bang for buck is just plain unreasonable.

I always hate to post about this, because of all the terrific physicians who post here at FDL. This, however, might be relevant. What’s buried in this terrific reporting from the Milwaukee Sentinel Journal, Medical device maker (Medtronic) paid UW surgeon $19 million is that Medicare and the UW Medical School paid this white-collar thug $900,000 to act as chair of their school of Orthopedic Medicine.

Physicians who teach at Medicare supported Medical Schools seem particular targets for these kinds of payments. The high cost of paying these physician teachers is one of the factors that keeps Medical school education so astronomically high. I don’t have more detail, but I hope it’s something Congress will look at.

Is there any way to use that 17% profit against them as a market force? If the least expensive program out there gave me complete, guanteed coverage and explained it clearly without 5000 ifs, and, and buts, I’d take it. I bet a bunch of other people would, too.

Physicians who teach at Medicare supported Medical Schools seem particular targets for these kinds of payments.

My point here was that afaik, all U.S. Medical Schools receive a ton of their funding from Medicare.

Here is the thing about not having a plague every generation big stretchs without a plague give people who are not that resistant a chance to breed.
If TB, Malaria etc hit every 20- 30 years regular then the population is culled of the nonresistant.
My Grandaunt for example lost a husband and a child to TB.
If the antibodies don’t work only the resistant and those who isolate themselves will survive.
Does the GOP really want to bet just how good their Genes are?
Without National Healthcare and paid sick days the common people without healthcare can spread any disease a few extra days before the CDC finds out about it.
A few extra days can mean the difference between a quarantine working or not working.

Re single payer universal healthcare, I would ask why Congress is more interested in protecting insurance company profits than the health of Americans.

And personally if it just a matter of terminology then I don’t care if it is called “the pink monkey hiding behind the chair” payer universal healthcare. But how many more Americans have to die, be diseased, and debilitated because the Congress will not act. After the Paulson $700 billion bailout, it is clear that they can and will act when they want to, even when huge sums are involved.

do it QUICKLY and not give the opposition time to respond.

You may be right about the ultimate form it might take but
1) We need to start at a point of single payer and negotiate down to that ultimate form
2) The opposition has been working on this for a long time. It might be more appropriate to think of us as responding.

I have been under the impression that rescinding the Patriot Act and the Military Commissions Act were to be at the top of Obama’s agenda.

Or is that just my usual wishful thinking?

It seems to be only about the insurance companies, doesn’t it? The current hodgepodge is hardly winning friends in the medical profession itself, I imagine. I don’t know of any doctor’s office where people are overjoyed to deal with cards for this, cards for that. Of course, a functional system might require that Medicare actually get its act together and answer phones, maintain accurate mailing lists — the kind of thing that would make a person think that the institution had blood pumping through its veins and wasn’t a nearly moribund terminal patient itself. (I don’t think that that’s Medicare’s fault at all, by the way. I think that it has become exactly what the insurance companies and their abettors have tried very hard to make it become.)

Where does the insurance company get its operating capital. Do they have investors looking for a dividend? How can they compete with single payer?
Answer they can’t that is why they will fight it tooth and nail.

“I think the Iranian government is hell bent on getting nuclear weapons,” based on the fact that Iranians won’t open up facilities to inspection and intelligence sources. Russia is second to Israel the most threatened by Iranian nuclear capability, so if US and Russia can join together on a missile defense system against an Iranian threat, then he thinks Iran will take that seriously. …….

Says who? This contradicts what the last NIE said, if it was reported on correctly. (I realize that is a big if, of course)

I think that the new administration should do a new NIE before we do anything against Iran, especially doing stupid things like adding countries to NATO.

Good to know missile defense still has backers in the progressive caucus! /s

these are our progressives?

All I can say is there *better* be a government option health care. And there’s *no reason* why employer free choice should have to wait till summer.

If Republicans are willing to kill these things, it’s time to kill the filibuster.

I like the idea of starting high but it better be thought through thoroughly. I have no doubt that the opposition is every bit as strong as it was when Hillary tried to push single payer through. It puts insurance companies in a position where they have nothing to lose, they are fighting for their lives.

At any rate, it seems pretty obvious that neither the pres nor congress has the stomach for that fight now so I just don’t see it happening…I think Obama is hoping for a transition into single payer over a decade or two.

Stabenow: We want to avoid the pitfalls of ‘94. (Not sure why they’re fighting a 15 year-old battle with no acknowledgment that the political climate and public opinion are completely different, but there you have it.) They’ll address it after they tackle the stimulus package but think it will take months of work.

What bubble are they living in have they seen the change in polls in 15 years on the healthcare issue?
Have they seen the change in costs in 15 years for healthcare?
Do they want to be labeled out of touch with the American People come election day?
When not if we push for National Healthcare the Bluedogs are playing it safe walking slow on an important issue.
When a Vette breakin the speed limit is coming around the curve.

Re single payer universal healthcare, I would ask why Congress is more interested in protecting insurance company profits than the health of Americans

The answer is on a post on this very blog earlier today. Follow the $ right from K Street into Harry’s door…..

Right. That’s why my thought was: well, start the picnic without them. Have a really good government system and watch people flock to it. Pretty soon the insurance companies will be superfluous (or some other big word I can’t think of at the moment).

The thing is, here’s the progression: 1) The reason these wingnuts say they want such strong “national security” is to protect the lives of the citizen. After all, the first word of “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” is “life.” If they admit that protecting the life of the citizen is a vital reason for governments to exist, then it is only a hop, skip and a jump to..2)government provided single payer health insurance like all the other industrialized countries already have. What if there is a catastrophic communicable disease in this country and we have, what is it now, 80M uninsured and even more under-insured families? Disease will spread like wildfire!

Besides, we already do socialize the losses, so it seems to me, we also need to be able to include the disease free youth and the pretty much healthy in the group rates to bring the rates down in this country. In addition, is there a better way to provide portability? We know we have to do this, the only thing they’re doing now is sweating the small stuff. Ridiculous waste of time.

Well played.

I think it is at the top of the list it is just that if the problems with the economy are not remedied ain’t gonna be any money for anything else.

Levin: “I think the Iranian government is hell bent on getting nuclear weapons,” based on the fact that Iranians won’t open up facilities to inspection and intelligence sources. Russia is second to Israel the most threatened by Iranian nuclear capability, so if US and Russia can join together on a missile defense system against an Iranian threat, then he thinks Iran will take that seriously. He also thinks NATO expansion is an important part of avoiding military action in Iran.

Is Levin on drugs? Is he saying he knows better than the government’s own NIE on Iran which concluded that Iran had given up a nuclear weapons program in 2003? And the chances of getting Russia to sign off on a missile defense system are zero. What rock has he been hiding under for crissakes? Hasn’t he seen how Putin hates the idea and used it to pull out of START II? As for NATO expansion, what expansion is he talking about? The escalation in Afghanistan? Or NATO membership in Europe which Russia is so opposed to? Cripes, what a boob.

My favorite idea for health care is to have the govt. take over payment for every case that exceeds- say $50,000. Insurance companies would have a tough time complaining about such an arrangement- those are the cases that cost them the most. They could sell policies that cover UP TO that limit. The govt. then could take control of the costs on those cases that are costing us the most and impose limitations on payments. The Hospitals and Doctors are likely to support the move because at least they would get paid- just not quite as much.

Yes, Russia is so threatened by Iran that Russia continues to upgrade Iranian weapons systems.

What gibberish.

-G

If Harry Reid needs another EFCA vote, why not provisionally seat Al Franken?

Really, the excuses they come up with are extraordinary. The way the government works now, Harrrrrry, is you announce which Senators are balking, fire up change.gov, generate a million emails from constituents, and CHANGE a few votes.

That’s how it’s supposed to work now. Not the old way. Wait until summer, hell.

He suggested to Holder that he appoint someone like a retired judge or others in his office with a lot of credibility to take all the available information, the existing documentation, and compile it.

This is straight out of Yes, Minister. Compile a report and then compile a commission studying said report. By that time, it is 2 years later and it’s election time again.

Agree. This is a matter of life and death, to me and millions of others.

This is what I say to people who talk about Universal Health Care in other countries as not working.

“Do you really think that their system has been perfected? Have you ever consider that there are politicians (Canada) who work against the socialized medical systems and they may not be fully funded? Don’t you think we could take what works leave what doesn’t? Do you know how many people die every year from lack of any kind of medical coverage in this country?”

The polls in 94 were at least as favorable as they are now- that’s part of what elected Clinton- but they changed dramatically once the insurance companies started their ad campaign.

It’s pretty depressing out there. It shows that the work is only just beginning. Senate Dems just don’t seem to have any fight. You often have to lose a couple of rounds to win. The only thing that can move them is things getting so bad that they can’t do anything else. But I think they’d rather see the Auto companies fail than provide health care for workers.

I think Obama is hoping for a transition into single payer over a decade or two.

Curiously, this is what Democrats have been saying for the last decade or two, or three.

Levin: “I think the Iranian government is hell bent on getting nuclear weapons,” based on the fact that Iranians won’t open up facilities to inspection and intelligence sources. Russia is second to Israel the most threatened by Iranian nuclear capability, so if US and Russia can join together on a missile defense system against an Iranian threat, then he thinks Iran will take that seriously. He also thinks NATO expansion is an important part of avoiding military action in Iran.

Levin is on the take Russia just started the Nuclear Arms race again with a new generation of missiles designed to get past our missile defenses.
Russia worries about our missile defense in Poland.
Russia gave Iran their Nuclear Reactor so just why does Levin think Russia is worried?
This is freakin Amateur hour if Levin wants to repeat GOP/Military Industrial Complex talking points fine…but please get some that are believable is it to much to ask for a politician to tell a good lie anymore?

A bill has to be very carefully reviewed or private insurance will let it serve as the dumping ground for those now considered uninsurable due to preconditions etc. This would then distort rates because of the higher cost to the govt pool.

I wonder if there’s any wisdom to initiating legislation piecemeal, by specialty.

The single biggest problem for most Americans is access to internists/family care physicians who are the gateway to the big ticket items. AFAIK, those physicians are the one group who are in favor of single payer. They’re at the bottom of the physician food chain.

According to Jerome over at Kos this is pretty much what they do in France for people who take private insurance, except that the private insurers have to pitch in, too. That way they don’t skim the cream. As I understood his post from a few weeks ago, there’s a low co-pay for everyone, but everyone is covered, and cojpletely covered for catastrophic events. You can take extra coverage, and see doctors who charge more, but if you get really sick, your insurer has to pay part of catastrophic costs.

My limited experience in France with the medical system was pretty good.

So we start an ad campaign Obama gives a few speeches the Left and the African American vote won’t fall for a GOP campaign against National Healthcare.
Also the GOP didn’t have a President just leave at 22% then.

All this time-wasting going-back-and-forth our public servants do! Why not equip them with biometric voting devices so they can cast their votes while meeting with constituents or, in this case, DFHs? Is someone really apt to change his or her vote for or against Hillary Clinton as Barack Obama’s Secretary of State based on what Diaper Dave Vitter or Big John Cornhole says?

This is straight out of Yes, Minister. Compile a report and then compile a commission studying said report. By that time, it is 2 years later and it’s election time again.

Yes, this has bail written all over it. Why not a special prosecutor? Oh right, he/she might actually do something.

Congress men and Senators should have the same Health Benefits people in their state have if 50% have total healthcare then thats what the Senator gets.

New post

Interesting idea.

One trick some unscrupulous Family Care physicians do is ignore Medicaid requirements that they test children (from families paying with Medicaid for lead poisoning). Since they can’t make any money on those tests, they just don’t run them.

If they miss lead poisoning early, the kid is toast.

Jane,
I’m surprised to see the cast of characters assembled under your banner of a “progressive” media summit. I’m glad to see such a phalanx of progressive bloggers assembled to question these senators, but are these the senators who we should think of as “progressive”??? Where were the true progressives, like Feingold?

Bob in HI

There was no blogosphere, no netroots and no viable organizing capability at that time. I remember having to listen to Rush Limbaugh while working at home doing coding as NPR would put me to sleep and Rush would get me all fired up, but in the end, frustrated, as I thought I was the only one who felt that right wingers just lied all the time.

The fact that some ordinary citizens are actually sitting down with Senators and exchanging views is extraordinary – I think we tend to take things like this for granted, when in those old days the only form of communication between ordinary constituents were written letters.

Zombie lies, such as the apples to oranges comparison of what was spent on Bush and Obama’s inauguration, would sit there unanswered in 94. They now receive much more push-back. I just don’t see Harry and Louise, etc. having as much impact as they did in 94, especially since Harry and Louise and right wing radio were the only forms of push back that Congress critters received back then.

I couldn’t agree more. Against single payer universal healthcare. For banging the wardrums with Iran. There are a lot of adjectives that come to mind to describe these folks but progressive is not one of them.

No, I think we’re the “progressive media,” they’re just pandering.

Hillary confirmed 94-2.

OT Hillary Clinton vote in senate 94 to 2 for confirmation.

Indeed. Maybe they can write a sternly worded letter asking Fourth Branch Cheney nicely to testify in front of this commission /s

Demint and de Vitter

So Levin thinks he’ll be getting Russian cooperation AND NATO expansion, both together? Nice trick – pull Georgia into NATO and get Russia aligned with us? Was Levin equally convinced about Iraq and their WMDs? And isn’t Russia in essence getting regular access to Iranian nuke status by partnering with them?

Why would Reid want a committee? Why would he not instead push for either an outside special prosecutor to be appointed, with Obama and Holder changing the regulations for Outside Special counsel to bring things more in line with the old independent counsel statute (and that way avoid the statutory issues in general) and allow for issuance of reports to Congress. How is a committee going to do anything worthwhile after all these years – other and to impede prosecutions?

Levin is in the progressive caucus, right? Even after co-sponsoring the Habeas killing provisions of the DTA (the ones for future cases that he did admit to, if not for disenfranchising current cases?)

I don’t think progressive is what I am.

My son was seen by a local dentist under the Healthy Start plan (Medicaid for kids) and a teeth cleaning took like 10 minutes.
Won’t take him back there next time. That’s enough time to count the teeth and say ok they’re all there, remember to floss, brush, here’s a new tooth brush.

Is it your sense that Obama is going to act like Reed did and somehow pander towards the corporations and K Street? I don’t think he could get away with it openly, but does the Senate (his former friends, after all) work as a proxy? In other words, the ol’ “I tried to get legislation passed, but that darn ol’ Congress wouldn’t do what I wanted them to do….”

Jane,
I’m so glad that there’s now something called a “Progressive Media,” and that some pretty powerful Senators are interested in pandering to it. You go girl! Um, can you maybe get Rachel Maddow to join you? And Murray Waas, and a few others?

I hope and pray that this “Progressive Media” pandering may become a regular weekly feature. Anything you can do to make that happen???

Thanks so much,
Bob in HI

Thanks.

Quality Control in those programs is terrible, but I hope you consider telling someone.

I have told the county dental clinic about it.

Universal coverage is about as worthless as tits on a boar hog in reducing costs if you have thousands of insurance companies trying to turn a 17% profit after they have paid sales staffs, advertising, teams of attorneys to deny benefits, CEOs, CFOs, COOs, elaborate headquarters to pay homage to their business accumin and on and on. This is not progressive legislation it is the same old shit wrapped in a new ribbon.

Yes, so I guess it’s time we explained the facts of life to an industry that has been riding too high on the hog (just to mix the metaphors up a bit)! The “market” general rule of thumb for the value of a commodity is “whatever the traffic will bear.” Ergo, we can no longer bear CEOs and other high ranking officials and boards of directors demands on pay. They are paid way too much compared to their counterparts in other countries! And their bonuses for bad work and extremely lucrative golden parachutes and sweet option purchase deals are draining the economy. It’s like throwing money down a black hole! They need to trim that back; it shouldn’t be hard. At least that’s what they’ve often told labor.

And, btw, we can no longer bear exorbitant profits. We’ve been known to set usury rates; why can’t we set rates for profits beyond which they’ve crossed a line into (? I don’t know what word to use ?) an excessive profits rate. They ought to get used to doing more for less. It really isn’t that great of an idea to put your life into the hands of people or groups whose main motive is profit or possibly greed, anyway!

Actually the only places I’ve had trouble with are private doctors. Clinics that are government funded send out preventative care booklets, as does his Medicaid insurer, to let me know when to make appointments for what.

Anything said about verifiable elections – requiring paper ballots and hand-counted audits of electronic vote tallies? With a successful election under their belt, and so many issues to address, I worry that this one will get missed.

The problem is that with the economy already in the tank we and more importantly they don’t have the luxury to play politics and treat this as business as usual.

Here’s the thing – the only way single payer (or any kind of legislation whatsover in this country which hurts certain corporations who spend lobbying $) ever passes is if we find away to minimize the money in politics. Based on Harry’s actions from last night or the DNC brought to you by AT & T, etc., it appears that is not the case, despite the fact that Obama apparently did not take lobbying money directly.

What I was asking is if “business as usual” is still going on despite the fact that the crisis is so large. My sense is, unfortunately, that business as usual still prevails in the Senate.

Cash is the only thing they can feel emotion for.

brilliant! the Cash party.

new post

I agree. The ship of state has sailed into a hurricane but the captain and crew still think they are on a day outing.

The problems with Levin’s statement about iran are too numerous to list. Let’s just look at one of them: Russia being threatened by Iran if the latter gets nuclear weapons.

Since the Great Game got started over a hundred and fifty years ago, Russia and Iran have found more to agree on than to fight about. There is no threat to Russia from Iran because, unlike the US, Russia isn’t acting like an asshole rogue nation in the Middle East trying to subvert democratically elected governments and arming the only truly nuclear rogue nation in the region, Israel.

A Three Hour Tour

How apropos.

Is Senator Levin saying that without a missile defense system there’s no point in having any health insurance?

Blogs can be confusing, but I hope they can get nuclear weapons abolished.

Brand new Julia upstairs!
A New Kind of History

Wow. Jane Hamsher upstairs with the Honorable Senator Roland Burris!
Roland And Me