Woo Hoo
10, 9, 8, 7. 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, yay
99 hrs & 59 min

There are some pretty amazing photographs from that plane crash in the Hudson, so glad for a happy ending.

confetti! and streamers!

I think people have been uplifted by the response to the plane crash. At long last, there was competence.

Ed Gillespie
:0===|

Bravo Mathews! i could not have said it better myself. I am glad, unlike other people, that he did not give bush a congrats on this speech or his last 8 years and actually said the truth.

I think people have been uplifted by the response to the plane crash. At long last, there was competence.

But, but, but … the pilots and flight attendants are UNIONIZED!!!

Jeebus that Gillespie is speaking from the White House. I hope they can get it cleaned out by Tuesday.
99 hrs & 47 min

Nice! I expect to be disappointed but that feeling is mild compared to how I feel about Bush.
Peggy Noonan is talking about Bush’s challenge to Obama about keeping Americans safe. WTF Does she not know who was president and who received briefings before 9/11. The pilot involved in yesterday’s plane crash landing, proved that pilots can handle the known. Bush had time to lock the cockpit doors and he chose not to.

Whoops, I expect to be disappointed by Obama..

Oh man, give the lady a Kleenex,
tears for Bush, everyone makes mistakes,
his legacy
like Abraham Lincoln?

Looking at the pictures of the plane from yesterday, with all of the people standing on the wing, I am sure that they felt and were much better off than treading water in the Hudson. Next Tuesday the country will at the least be able to climb onto the wing.
99 hrs & 34 min

Matthews sums up in 4 minutes what we’ve all been saying for the last 8 years.

I watched the 3rd round of questions during Holder’s hearing last night. Specter, Kyl, Sessions, Coburn. Each with their own little agenda. They sounded like the WATBs they are. Absolutely no substance to their questioning at all. Coburn with his 2nd Amendment nonsense and Kyl with his Shield Law whining. Selise, eCAHN, I don’t know how you watch these performances but my hat’s off to you for doin’ it. I was thinkin’ these guys belonged in the bag with the rest of the shit from my litter boxes.

Lol. Then you won’t be disappointed. :>)

Not Holder’s biggest fan, but gotta give him props for calling out Cornryn. 24, surprisingly, does not present an accurate model of American national security.

Well, the amount of luck in the case was unbelieveable: the pilot is someone who has a huge amount of experience and is a safety instructor and specialist. If anyone was going to know how to put that plane down, it was him. The time of the crash was lucky – 3:30 is when the ferries in that area are crewing up and getting out to handle rush hour traffic – so there were large boats already in the area to rescue people in what could have been a horrible hypothermia situation. There was also no big ship traffic in that area at that time. Everything came together amazingly, but the big item was the pilot, Sullenberger – the last time this sort of thing happened was in 1982 in DC, same time of the year, and most of the people on the plane died.

He’ll get the votes for AG

What’s up with Tweety lately. Quotes Shakespeare and John Locke in the context of a Greek tragedy with W being the deeply flawed main character. I feel loke he is the enemy feigning contrition, patting me on the back in search of a good location for his knife.

Good stuff, but watch out.

Given the criticism’s of him, I was pleasantly surprised. With his responses regarding torture, how could Bush crowd ever rest easy unless Bush issues pardons?

Good article by Krugman Blue Texan linked to.

Morning all, just a reminder, Jane on CSpan in a few minutes.

Is today Scooter Libby pardon day?

While not in the same time slot Matthews is having to compete with Rachel on an intellectually honest playing field. Perhaps he’s had a minor epiphany.

Which c-span?

IMO, if Bush does not issue pardons, it will because he already has the votes in the Supreme Court to uphold his raping of the American citizens.

CSPAN 1

Thanks for the videoclip, BT. There was no way I could watch the actual speech, but Matthews’ deconstruction of the entire arc of Bush’s tenure was solid.

And amazingly, Larry King pretty much captured exactly the same thing, albeit in many fewer words: Were we ever close to catching bin Laden? Bush’s I dunno was at once probably honest and incredibly sad…I dunno defines him. About everything the last eight years. And America is paying a heavy price.

Bruce Bartlett (from Bush 41) on Bush 43
9-11 happened on his watch!

Bruce Bartlett is ripping W apart.

That and the tectonic shift to center-left, or away from the Bush/Republican/Conservative agenda, of the American people.

CSpan 1 – should have started @ 8:40, looks like they are running a bit late, but I’ll bet she’s ready to get mic’ed up now.

Republicans suffering from the Bush Derangement Syndrome (now applied to supporters) believe the Bush administration began on 9/12/01.

That may be true. Still, if I were one of them, I think I would sweat until the statute of limitations runs out. It would have been different if Holder had answered in the same way as Mukasey.

her she comes…………..

Jane Up after commercials
99 hrs & 10 min

This is not my diary – it’s Elliott’s – but it’s a good read to remember what might have been, had Al Gore won in 2000.
http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/3055

IMHO – even if Al Gore had done nothing more than NOT going to war in Iraq and Afghanistan, nothing more than not gutting federal agencies and putting political hacks in charge of places like FEMA, Al Gore’s presidency would have been a raging success in comparison to what has been done to this country, the Constitution, and the world by the last 8 years of Bush/Cheney-ism. And we will have to live with the results of this for years to come.

Exactly! Krugman says so much, so well, and with so few words. And today’s article is one of his best.

Jane!

People with conviction often stand alone………

“It’s all Clinton’s fault!”
smack her Jane

It’s all Bill’s fault.

Sick of people feeling bad for our poor beleagured Bush.

The wingnut callers. Wonder what it’s like being that delusional.

Bush is either responsible or irresponsible. Pick one.

“….mothers huddled over their dead children.” Yes in Iraq, yes in Gaza, yes in Israel and yes in Afghanistan? And yes, in America when the body bags come home from Iraq predicated on a Gliewitz like response to 911!

Do they have screeners?

I prefer either malicious or stupid.

I’ve never gotten through on Cspan – don’t really know if calls are screened.

US Airlines crash is an excellent example of the Triumph of government

-the 320 airbus held together on landing because it was built to federal safety standards
-the flight crew got everyone out alive because they followed federally mandated standards
-rescue was a coordination of city, federal and private business which reflects community.

The pilot was a hero that was some landing, but also helped with his required training and experience. There are a whole host of other levels that the government was involved such as safety equipment on the plane.

Americans deserve that all our local governments respond like what occurred yesterday day in and day out.

Lady Jane’s a little gravelly this morning.

Too many cigarettes and scotch. /s

pardon me, pardon you, pardon Libby to.. taking all Americans for fools

Jane looks good.

Meanwhile, a slow motion Katrina is happening in rural Alaska as the rethugs led by Sarah Palin fiddle and whine.
98 hrs & 59 min

watched Jane’s face during that call, boy is she good at keeping a straight face…

keep calling you will eventually get on!!!!!

Good morning, all:

Krugman’s words MUST be heeded … but a larger accounting is also necessary, of the media, of complicity, as well as the too-ready willingness of the public to ‘believe’ what are clearly fallacious ‘arguments’…

We have been as nation under seige, and it is worth noting those who continue to support, defend or lionize the perpetrators in chief of that massive, unprecedented assault upon reason, tolerance and understanding …

I hope someone asks about future investigations and prosecutions of Bush officials.

Exit stage right… Into Iraq oil!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, I’d have been laughing in the woman’s face.

Krugman, along with the rest of us, will go unheeded. Obama = Fordrama.

remember not to play poker with Jane….. she can bluff ….

A summary of Bush’s speech.

“I may not always be right, but I am never wrong.”

Mathew Sheppard “W” Lets worry about our own citizens first. Killing people to advance an ideology, oil agenda is criminal!!!

Who is Shrub looking and smirking at to his right every time he makes one of inane points.

We shall have to insist.

Barack Obama has a choice: He may choose to be the last of the traditional politicians, in which case this nation will erupt into something we cannot imagine ,,, and it will not, initially be ‘good’ …

Or Obama can chjoose to be the first of a different kind of leader, one who does not embrace the thesis of elitism and neoliberalism, in which case ‘change’, though massive and dreadfully necessary will be more pleasant …

Harkening back to my suggestion for our coinage; “IT IS UP TO US”.

Period.

There it is.

I’d have her as a partner in double deck pinocle any day, any time.

A failure to hold bush accountable is criminal!!!!!

You Don’t Know Dick! Cheney Bio Ought to Have Best Title EVAR, So Let’s Help
[aHAHAHAHA] — Christy’s up

SD – you still around?

Yes, siree. To have Lady Jane next to me going into any function in the world would be indescribable.

You rang?

And you may not agree with my decisions, but Look, the results are great.

i gave the harvey audio another listen. just wanted to follow up. do you have a few minutes, or are you off to the salt mines? or maybe this weekend?

I can proscratinate a bit and we can always continue later.

‘kay. you tell me if/when you need to go.

first, i really enjoyed it. love to hear someone talk about the big rip-off with some real outrage.

i took a few notes as i was listening (the second time). will put them here with my comments ( >> are comments i’m writing now).

notes on: A Financial Katrina by David Harvey at CUNY Oct 29 2008.
from southerndragon

pt1

……..

neoliberalism in practice = protect financial institutions at all costs, over the well being of the people. create a good business climate, profits.

neoliberalism ideological mask = it all has to be left to the market, individual responsibility good, nanny state bad

>> amen

crisis is not the end of neoliberalism because they are doing the same damn thing again. only this time it is a financial coup against the people of the entire usa

for an incredible moment all gov. disappeared except bernanke and paulson

>> fear this is true. stiglitz wrote an oped a few months ago about how neoliberalism was dead. but i think he’s wrong. it would be dead in a rational world, but that’s not the world we live in. the b&p moment was an excellent example of the world we do live in.

Nice piece by Krugman. Hope Obama reads it.

While yer writing, I would love Harvey to do an extended analysis of the financial situation. He approaches it form a totally different perspective, which provides an opportunity to come up with real solutions to a system rife with serious flaws ignored or overlooked by the capitalist cheerleaders.

pt. 2

class power being concentrated
being used to rob the people of the usa

>> amen

cleveland data =>
every dot is a foreclosure — needs to be %foreclosure to avoid confounding parameter of population density
sub-prime lending is % — good (the correct parameter)
black pop is % — good

>> this is me putting on my critical data analysis hat. don’t have any reason to doubt the conclusions, but i’m pretty sure that the first figure should be redone, or better yet include a part b. that has foreclosures as a percent of mortgages. would make the rest of the analysis more credible.

i need to look at mortgage data, debt, property booms, financial markets, etc. at some point. looks like there might be some interesting things there.

>> i used to say i needed 6 lives to do everything i’d like to. now i think it’s really 60.

I can’t add anything to that except his emphasis on the connection between excess liquidity and property.

I noticed his distinction between large urban areas in states like NY and CA vs the suburbs in states like FL. As far as FL is concerned he’s dead on. The highest foreclosure rates are in the counties without large urban areas, those areas developed since the sixties. FL has long based its economy on developmental growth. We’re beginning to pay a high price for those decisions re water, power.

I just keep wishing I was 20 with the political acumen I have now.

pt 3

history capitalism is history capital surplus disposal problem (=profits?). compounding.

where are you going to put the 3% growth?
one way is to expand geographically, growth needs to be absorbed somewhere

periods of excess of liquidity. tremendous amounts of money and no one knows what to do with it. well, let’s put it into property. eventually there is a crash.

>> this is where i think i disagree with harvey – that is if i’m understanding correctly in the first place.

>> i don’t think the problem is that there is too much surplus – how could there be with 2 billion people living on $2 or less a day? imo the structural problem is that the surplus is being misdirected. which is what markets are supposed to excel at doing – allocation (of investment, production capacity, etc).

>> misdirected surplus goes to feed bubbles instead of people – not just feed with calories but also with all the things that make for a good life.

>> i think this is a critical point because if true it leads to the question: why is the surplus being misdirected and how can we correct that?

>> if i’m not full of shit on this, would really like to brainstorm on this question. would try to get hugh and eCAHN to play too.

selise and SouthernDragon, in re David Harvey’s piece: I’m sure you have read/heard that Bank of America will receive $100 BILLION more in addition to the $25 billion already received. Also, info that CitiGroup is in line for more.

Talk about choosing the MoneyMeisters over the people!

Sure is a lot of material for an article (or series) on this subject, selise.

pt 4

political and economic pressure put on mortgage companies to expand into subprime market. had previously worked (not sure about when this was 70s-80s maybe?), until this big push from surplus liquidity

surplus liquidity had previously been absorbed (post ww2?) in urbanization and suburbinization.

this time surplus liquidity went global via securitization

financial system innovating to accommodate. derivatives.

goes through 10s 100s of trillions of $ going through derivatives markets.

hedge fund mgr making tons of money. but as cleveland map shows, some people are loosing.

the robbers have a gun to our head. lehman, credit froze. give us $700 billion or we’ll shoot you. blackmail.

equity stakes in banks. nationalization. should think about what kind of banking structure there should be. national reconstruction bank and program.

assets not being used for the benefit of everyone, instead being consolidated for power.

take to the streets after nov. 5
crucial moment because the mask is off.

>> don’t have much to say about this. mostly agree.

>> that’s all i have

He approaches it form a totally different perspective, which provides an opportunity to come up with real solutions to a system rife with serious flaws ignored or overlooked by the capitalist cheerleaders.

i like the idea of stepping back and challenging many of the assumptions and premises.

have you read any michael albert? i read his book parecon (for participatory economics) a few years ago. don’t agree entirely with him, but really appreciated that he also approached the question from a totally different perspective. encourages me to think more “out of the box” or at least makes the box a bit bigger

emphasis on the connection between excess liquidity and property.

yes. i hadn’t thought about that before. don’t have the background or source material at hand, but would like to look at it / think about it some.

good point. something else for me to think about….

periods of excess of liquidity. tremendous amounts of money and no one knows what to do with it. well, let’s put it into property. eventually there is a crash.

If he were giving a lecture on Marx this is where he would go into the production of surplus value, the relationship between the capitalist, the worker and the production of commodities, with money becoming the ultimate commodity. This, of course, leads in to the distribution of wealth discussion.

I think Harvey sees the excess liquidity as being centralized into one class, that class unconcerned with the welfare of others. Their primary concern is turning that surplus into more surplus for their own purposes.

I’ve love to get into a chat with others.

Whoa, shit, I gotta get outta here. My, how time flies when yer havin’ fun.

Be good to yourself, and all other living things.

Namaste

Marcy points to unions as part of the source of competence.

http://emptywheel.firedoglake……login=true

I just keep wishing I was 20 with the political acumen I have now.

lol. need the gray cells (and energy) of my ’20s with the very little bit of wisdom that has come with starting to lose them *g*

catch up with you later, SD. mostly just wanted you to know that i had listened to the talk. thanks for the link.

just a student. in fact, one who’s just opened the course catalogue and is now saying “holy shit” at topics never thought of before. *g*

Until we ’step back’ far enough to consider the ‘function’ of ‘institutions’ within a society, of which ‘economics’ is but one, with the very clear understanding that, to be blunt, these ‘institutions’ are merely as ‘games’ which children would play (in terms of ’sophistication’ and understanding of ‘consequence’) but have bloody real life consequences simply because we are prepared AND willing to KILL other human beings in the pursuit of ‘winning’ these ‘games’, until we step ‘back’ and honestly examine ‘where’ we are and ‘where’ we wish, as a society, to ‘go’,we have little chance of gaining sufficient perspective to rationally and reasonably devise consideral ‘improvements’ or ‘replacements’ for these ‘games’.

A serious, thoughtful and timely discussion is most necessary.

It will NOT be initiated by the powers-that-be, for that would not be in their ‘interest’.

It is however, in ours and that of the species as a whole.

“War” is another of our childhood ‘games’.

The question is this; Shall we find or discover sufficent maturity to begin this discussion that those who come after us might have any future at all?

Which is not to suggest that our ‘present’ is not of primary importance to those of us who share it, merely that we rather desperately NEED to determine how to get from ‘here’ to ‘there’. There being a better, more humane, and fundamentally honest society. Society being simply how individual people treat other people …

Know what you mean! SD’s article blew open yet another door into the great unknown for me.

About those grey cells, I’m betting you don’t lose a single one. As I got older and dropped the petty concerns, my mental focus got better – still nothing to brag about. heh,heh

I’m from the Stepford wife generation and bought the ‘marriage on cloud 9′ propaganda; did not (could not) gain the formal educational foundation which many of you here at FDL possess. I admire so many of you who are daily using your expertise and skills to promote better ways of solving the world’s problems.

we are prepared AND willing to KILL other human beings in the pursuit of ‘winning’ these ‘games’

this is the biggest assumption i’d like to challenge.

otherwise, i have not answer… am just barely starting to recognize the outlines of some questions.

Which is not to suggest that our ‘present’ is not of primary importance to those of us who share it, merely that we rather desperately NEED to determine how to get from ‘here’ to ‘there’. There being a better, more humane, and fundamentally honest society. Society being simply how individual people treat other people …

question one: are the means and the ends really so distinct?

For our purposes, as human beings, just as the Sun is, fortuitously at just the right distance away, we must understand that ‘means’ and ‘ends’ are part of the same stick.

There are simply too many stones being flung around because people are encouraged to ‘believe’ that that is the way it has to be.

T’ain’t so.

I’m from the Stepford wife generation and bought the ‘marriage on cloud 9′ propaganda

i was taught something similar to this, but it didn’t stick… and i had the benefit of some education (even if not very well rounded to put it mildly). learning to read and learning to learn are imo the keys. (still wish i had several lifetimes to learn all the stuff i missed, languages especially.)

but we are very lucky here at fdl to have so many wonderful teachers.

not sure there is an “end” – only a direction. and the means, as the path we are on, play a role maybe even the biggest role in determining the direction.

or so it seems to me today….

No ‘end’, just the process of finding or seeking ‘direction’.

Remember we are dealing with a mindset which is almost totally incapable of perceiveing ‘consequence’, in essence, we are still playing with our toes …

Beyond the ‘institutions’ of society we must deal with myth, religion, and other conceits by which we may regard others as sufficiently ‘different’ or possibly, at some point, posing a ‘threat’ and too many are willing to let the bigger kids, many of whom are bullies, tell them what to think and do.

I mean heck!, America can’t even deal honestly with sex or death and bnoth have been around for a while …

Gotta go for a while, catch you all later.

;~D

“learning to read and learning to learn are the keys”

BIG STATEMENT THERE, SELISE. I know so many who use reading as purely a materialistic tool. (how do I get mine?).

I see your richest, most productive days yet ahead for you, e-Cahn, Ian, Jim White, Southern Dragon, hopefully Norske and katymine…. can’t name you all….

Just know that there’s one out here cheering you on, even if I no longer physically exist. (I’m planning to live to 110, though).

I’ve got to try to find siun – there’s a subject that needs her.

must run too, but just wanted to let you know if you didn’t already, that you can email siun:

http://firedoglake.com/aboutus/

Thanks, selise, for siun’s address. I’m communicating with bluebutterfly over at Jim White’s oxdown article on the Gaza assault. bb has found so much more on the subject that I. I’ve asked that bb send siun an e-mail on the subject. (white phosphorous and DIME (dense inert metal explosive) being used on people of Gaza.) Info and links at Jim White’s article.

Krugman’s piece in the NYT is brilliant: a call to arms I’d say. We must not let Obama make the choice some people want him to think he has. There is no choice. And the people are coming. The people are coming for the truth.

I sent my e-mail to Siun. Thanks so much, selise.