Thank you Siun. This is so horrible. And it is so important for us not to look away.

Who will speak for peace?

From Gorillas Guides re: white phosphorus being used in Gaza (warning, heart-breaking photo on the right).

Thank you Laura…

The WP photo shakes me …

Who will speak for peace?

We do!

Joe the Plumber, in his first war correspondent report, says we should STFU

Digg this great post right here

Isn’t WP against Geneva? Especially on civilian populations.
I know! Let’s ask the Fallujahns — they’ll know.

Olmert called the war “an unprecedented national effort that restored the spirit of unity to the nation…”

Like the way attacking Iraq restored our spirit of national unity.

The Spirit of Humanity is going to attempt to dock on Tuesday, bringing doctors, medical supplies, journalists and human rights workers.

re restraint. this may get me in some hot water, but while there’s no way in hell i’d call what the israelis are doing to the palestinians in gaza restrained, i do think it’s important to remember it could be worse – and it might get worse. there could be carpet and firebombing and other weapons designed to maximize the number of deaths. there could be mass expulsion.

please don’t see this as a defense of any of the atrocities…. only an attempt to be as accurate as possible, so that if it does get worse we have some words left to use to describe it.

What is happening is against humanity, are we not human?

Yep – that really jumped out at me… had to include it.

Since criticism of Israel is always so anemic, and the U.S. supports it no matter what, I have often wondered why the Israelis don’t execute the final solution.

Yes it’s illegal. And yes the people in Fallujah know about it.

“When men on the chessboard
Get up and tell you where to go
And you’ve just had some kind of mushroom
And your mind is moving low
Go ask Alice
I think she’ll know

When logic and proportion
Have fallen sloppy dead
And the White Knight is talking backwards
And the Red Queen’s “off with her head!”
Remember what the dormouse said;
“FEED YOUR HEAD”…

White Rabbit
Jefferson Airplane

Donation site for the ICRC (you can specify OPT or Iraq).

Has anyone seen any US polls on Israel’s war actions? I find it interesting that US opinion has been sampled relentlessly on the type of dog the Obama daughters should get, but we never see polls about Gaza.

Because, you know, American politicians’ opinions seem unanimous.

That doesn’t mean get drugged, it means get information.

If you haven’t seen this report “Red Cross critical of Israel” on the UK’s Channel 4 news then I urge you to. It’s worth it. It’s been uploaded to YouTube under the title of In The Name Of Humanity as Channel 4 purge their reports after a few days.

The last big polling was before the ground invasion by Rasmussen:
http://www.rasmussenreports.co…..za_attacks

Americans, while far more sympathetic to Israel than the Palestinians, are closely divided over whether the Jewish state should be taking military action against militants in the Gaza Strip.

Forty-four percent (44%) say Israel should have taken military action against the Palestinians, but 41% say it should have tried to find a diplomatic solution to the problems there, according to a new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey. Fifteen percent (15%) are undecided.

I heard a stat on one of the talking head shows indicating a large percentage of Democratic voters oppose Israel’s actions in Gaza. Can’t remember the specifics. I’ll see if I can track down more.

If people there don’t get food and water soon, and if disease continues to spread, they won’t need to carpet bomb.

Since criticism of Israel is always so anemic, and the U.S. supports it no matter what, I have often wondered why the Israelis don’t execute the final solution.

just my opinion…. like us (city on the hill), many israelis (most?) see themselves as the good guys – a light unto all nations. no joke, exceptionalism again. their own self image won’t let them commit atrocities without an “excuse” or “justification” (see us using 911 to “justify” torture).

at the moment i’m glad for anything that provides even the tiniest bit of restraint. but i understand what a thin reed it is.

Only 5 nays in the entire U.S. House last week. Twenty two answered “present”.

The 5 nays were

Kucinich
Moore (WI)
Paul
Rahall
Waters

I did hear a U.S. poll in passing, so can’t provide a link. I was quite surprised to hear that over half were critical Israel, which I thought amazing considering that the U.S. media relentlessly pimps for Israel.

i know.

Settler nation delusions.

All too accurate Fern.

We tend to focus on the horrors of the bombing and miss the impact of the destruction of the complete – and already so damaged – infrastructure.

We also have no idea what things really look like where the ground troops are. There are reports of heavy fighting, reports of Israeli soldiers locking Gazan families in their homes after shooting at them, and taking 500 or more into some sort of custody but the info is still pretty unclear.

A fact constantly in my mind. We are seeing more of what Israel is doing than we saw of what we were doing in Fallujah at the time. It is tempting to think of Gaza as the ugliest of situations…except there’s a log in our eye….

And in Gaza, just as in Irak, Red Crescent/Red Cross medics are being shot at.

The whole world is turning against Israel. Even most Americans do not support this agression and slaughter.

something else… i hope we americans can take what we see happening in gaza now and re-think our response to 911 and what we did to the people of afghanistan.

Amen.

i think so. imo we americans ought to have a special insight into what motivates this.

We complain that we cannot make our Representatives and Senators hear our concerns when evidence is hidden from even curious eyes by our own party – torture policy, domestic spying policy, fiscal policy. The world watches and nods as this atrocity is committed and the sheer absence of media attention attests to what is happening. And still we cannot awaken the our representatives. Shame on the Democrats.

We need a new, tougher way into the halls of power.

Thank you Siun.

Here is something.

50 percent of self-described liberals said they want the Bush administration to do more to resolve the conflict, while 32 percent of moderates and 24 percent of conservatives said they wanted to see more U.S. involvement.

We know these are extracts of reports from the WHO and the ICRC:

WHO | Health services close to collapse in Gaza:

The health services in Gaza, already depleted and fragile, are on the point of collapse if steps to support and protect them are not taken immediately. WHO has called for immediate improvement in the situation to make humanitarian health services accessible by the local people.

Gaza: situation of civilians increasingly precarious, primary health-care worsening:

General situation

The ICRC is still receiving dozens of calls from people in such areas a asking for help. “Yesterday, we received a call from a family of 40 people, including 20 children, staying in a house in the Netzarim area. They told us they had not had drinking water for almost six days because the well supplying water to their house had been damaged,” said an ICRC employee in Gaza, who is herself staying at her aunt’s house, together with 17 other family members who have fled insecure areas near Gaza City.

Numerous calls are also coming from people asking for news about their relatives and friends staying in inaccessible areas. With fibre-optic networks used for landline communication damaged, mobile telephone networks overloaded and no electricity available to recharge phones, it is becoming more and more difficult for the local population to stay in contact with family members. Many people are increasingly anxious and worried about them.

The number of those who cannot be reached and assisted remains high and aid workers are under growing pressure from Gazans, who urge them to do more to help those in need. “We are doing our best, sparing no effort to come rescue people when we can,” said a Palestine Red Crescent Society paramedic. “We are ourselves frustrated that we cannot do more. Rescue operations are often aborted because of the lack of access. They are also becoming more and more dangerous, and we are getting more and more scared.”

“To hear such words from Palestine Red Crescent paramedics, who are among the bravest – and who have been working under fire, in extremely difficult conditions – makes our call for safe access and security ever more pressing,” echoes Antoine Grand, head of the ICRC office in Gaza.

Gaza: plight of civilians traumatic in ‘full-blown humanitarian crisis’:

Situation in Gaza hospitals

Mr Krähenbühl described the plight of the hospitals in Gaza, where emergency rooms and intensive care units are stretched to the breaking point. Hospitals are overcrowded and staff are exhausted.

“Hospitals now depend entirely on generator power but these generators could break down at any moment from the lack of maintenance and spare parts over the past 18 months. On Monday, there was concern that two hospitals were about to run out of generator fuel. The ICRC is trying to solve this problem by negotiating safe passage for UNRWA fuel tankers.”

Only 5 nays in the entire U.S. House last week. Twenty two answered “present”.

tomorrow there will be another protest outside my representative’s office (mcgovern who voted “yes”).

Do you know which 22 answered present ES?

I meant quite the reverse. Being a settler nation means having to expunge from history all the death and destruction that allowed the “nation” to prevail. Turning that into a virtue. After all, didn’t Ann Coulter call North American indiginous savages? And isn’t that how the European-Americans thought of them at the time? “We” were bringing enlightenment.

I just got a thank-you note from my son’s APUS History teacher, whom he had a full decade ago. She thanks me for my diaries on the employment reports. She is an otherwise solid citizen, but (in the good old days) when I pointed out that the ratio of innocent Palestinians killed to innocent Israelis killed was 3:1, she responded “What innocent Palestinians?”

Thank you Laura. I found this maddening article at BBC in which Israel denies using white phosphorus – - as if the videos, photos, burned people did not exist as evidence! Link:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7823078.stm

I donated to United Palestinian Appeal las week. Will post link later.

Thank you for posting that mfi – the number of medics killed and injured is horrific.

Too, even when the assault stops, then there is the re-building, the loss of infrastructure, the destruction of social space. The Gaza Mental Health Center, bombed out entirely early on. Police stations, mosques, rec centers, halls, university lecture rooms…..I picture trying to regroup. The materials/machinery/workers/planners and engineers needed….

There’s a lot of talk in the Israeli press about getting Gazans to leave for Egypt and camps there … and renewed discussion of doing the same with the West Bank but sending them to Jordan.

And the numbers of shot and jailed in the West Bank are growing. I hope to do a port on that sometime soon.

It’s great to see that diversity of opinion reflected in our political leaders. I wonder what American opinion would be if there was ONE political leader speaking out for peace?

i was referring, with perhaps an over abundance of hope, to those of us who are working to get beyond the self deception.

A very good question.

Kucinich?

I wondered if that were the plan….not to stop until living there is impossible. Nice little seafront property they have there…..

Entire vote record here.

Thank you kindly.

It’s a very short video but it clearly shows Red Cross medic Hassan al-Attal being shot while collecting a civilian’s corpse. The civilian had been killed by Israeli fire from Zemmo, east of Jabaliya refugee camp.

I’ve been wondering if that might be Israel’s primary objective, not so much eliminating the Palestinians as driving them elsewhere. I think we can assume no one asked Egypt and Jordan how many more refugees they would be willing to accomodate.

Everything from the ground up – including replacing many of the people with professional and leadership functions. With an utterly traumatized population.

I can’t image how it can be done…

We do have ONE, Dennis Kucinich.

Field Marshall Olmert: “For many years we’ve demonstrated restraint. We reined our reactions. We bit our lips and took barrage after barrage”.

Analogy : Jews – Palestinians : gas chamber – Samuni house : Zyklon-B pellets – bombs

[snip]
On Friday, the U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs said it had confirmed the account of what happened to the Samuni family. Calling it “one of the gravest incidents” in Gaza since the start of the fighting, the U.N. said Israeli soldiers had packed about 110 Palestinians into the house Sunday, then “shelled the home repeatedly” 24 hours later.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01/09/AR20

What? You want to listen to the one with both substance and hope?

This is the latest I know about what’s on his mind.

Israel May Be in Violation of Arms Export Control Act , Kucinich Requests Report to Congress

WASHINGTON, D.C. In light of press reports that Israeli forces fired on a United Nations school where civilians were taking shelter, Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) today sent notice to Secretary of State, Dr. Condoleezza Rice, that Israel’s actions in Gaza since December 27th, 2008 may constitute a violation of the requirements of the Arms Export Control Act of 1976 (AECA).

When the President is aware of the possibility of such violations, the AECA requires a report to Congress on the potential violation(s). The AECA outlines the conditions under which countries may use military articles or services obtained from the U.S. government, which include “internal security” or “legitimate self defense.”

snip

Looks like I owe you a drink.

This thought has crossed my mind as well.

The place will be unlivable.

A minority of 2?

Thanks for the voting record, Eureka Springs. Just as I figured, my SOB rep voted yay.

I believe that threshold has already been crossed.

In a related vein, this diary post re: working alongside ICRC emergency folk.

Israel needs some serious psychotherapy guidance on appropriate reaction to threats…it is reacting, rightfully to defending itself against constant attacks by missiles from Gaza; but with completely inappropriate force — like a dog that has been beaten the shizzola out of it..but with a vengeance uncalled for and with vengeance toward the wrong enemy.

Israel needs to realize the atrocities that is committing…in Gaza…and as it did in Lebanon…killing innocents with no boundaries..Unnacceptable!!!

The Palestinians are suffering from the vengeance “disproportionally” meted out and inappropriately doled out by an extraordinarily violated populace who live in perpetual fear of retribution, persecution, revenge, and hatred; who were granted lands by international operatives that were lands that belonged to them. They have been imprisoned, starved of all civilized services…food, health assistance….almost as a revenge…they are not the enemy…those who committed the holocaust were the enemy…not the Palestinians.

Doesn’t help the Israeli victim, doesn’t help the Palestinian victims.

We are dealing with two very traumatized cultures.

The Palestinians don’t deserve to be the recipients of the anger resulting from the acts perpetrated during WWII. There is zero understanding by the Israelis of the sense of home for the Palestinians…or dignity…or even humanity it seems. They are willing to murder anyone that threatens them. That is the psychosis of this thing.

Stop terrorizing each other.

Israel needs to stand down. The Palestinians need to stand down and recognize the damaged psyche of the survivors living in Israel, and they need to back off and stop lobbing missiles.

The international community needs to mediate with compassion and stop taking sides…there is no right side. There is only pain and mental trauma.

There needs to be a major peace commission to deal with these two traumatized societies and one that will help them. They are both wrong. The Israelis descend from a culture that has suffered fates worse than any society could have imagined would have come to pass. Total horror. Total horror. The thing is…each Palestinian who is burned to death by bombs is suffering the exact same fate… It is a horrendous result of the actions of people who are now dead and those who are alive now (and who continue to support these types of inhumane actions), who continue to propagate horror on the world.

Someone needs to understand and stop pointing fingers.

Everyone’s death is their own Armageddon.

Straight-jackets all around.

a few days ago siun had a youtube audio of a telephone interview with an ISM volunteer who was doing medic accompaniment in north gaza. i was really moved by how the medics were described. iirc, things like: they are the real heros, it’s an honor to be able to assist them. maybe siun knows if there is a transcript. it was inspiring, especially in the midst of so much despair.

Siun, I read a report today that there are large camps of settlers near the border of Israel and Gaza ready to pour into Gaza when the end of this comes.

Check out my 62, Selise. That’s ISM, and the diary is of one of group who’s riding with. There may be a link to the interview you’re thinking of.

No argument from me. The level of physical and moral courage displayed by Red Crescent/Red Cross people is astounding.

Selise – I don’t think there is a transcript but I’ll look for one or create one.

The work of the medics is amazing and they deserve our support.

I’m sorry to say that this assumes the behavior is unconscious, not deliberate. Sadly, this is, I b elieve, a calculated– a well calculated– plan.

Acquarius – if you have a link to that, I’d love to see it.

oh, there are many, i’m still working on it – for example the people who are organizing the protests at mcgovern’s office. clair has been to gaza and her husband has volunteered with ISM and been to palestine many times (was one of the first 3 westerners in jenin refuge camp after the 2002 attack).

Just got an email that Waltz with Bashir won the golden globe – a message perhaps?

As we learned during the last 8 years, even a 70% majority doesn’t matter in many circumstances.

mfi, siun, and all. sometimes when people respond to such atrocities with comments like “a pox on all their houses” or “there is nothing that can be done” – i like to point to people like the medics who can both inspire and prick our conscious.

I have to say the commercial which ran on MSNBC earlier this week… clearly an Israeli sponsored (and produced?) commercial for war… was shocking to me.

Was more than a little stunned at the silence on the internets.

Sure enough.

lol. if we had 70% like clair and scott, i’m pretty sure it would matter because we’d all be putting our bodies in the way of the war machine.

Well, I think that the calculated plan arises out of the history of the trauma on both sides sadly, which is why it never gets resolved. Yes, the Israelis are acting out of a strategy devised after WWII…remember, millions and millions of innocent people were murdered and were accused of getting themselves killed, because they didn’t fight back…they couldn’t! They were disarmed! They were persecuted endlessly, demonized, etc….they had no defense at all. No defense at all! Now…they are in overkill mode. Now…the Palestinians are in their place and perceived as a threat. It is almost like killer bees…one threat..and the whole hive goes after you. It is unprecedented. The actions of the Nazis is still raw…just about a lifetime ago…unprecedented. One can’t expect the survivors of such trauma to have recovered and act normally for many generations..if ever…whatever “normally” means. It is normal to be hypervigilant and reactive after major trauma (like the Holocaust) for heavens sakes…No excuse at all to pass it on to others though. The Palestinians are now suffering. It is all so unnecessary and so assbackwards. None of this needs to be happening. Intervention is needed.

Sadly there are some in Israel that don’t care, they want the arabs gone from “greater Israel”. They would love for some other Arab East of the Jordan river to take them, or for them to be driven into the sea or be collateral damage as they rid the region of resistors.

They want ethnic cleansing. But don’t expect them to fess up to that.

Free Palestine rally in Orlando, FL yesterday afternoon.

Well, if you want Israeli propaganda, here’s the email I just got from my son’s APUS history teacher. I told her never to send me anything pro-Israel again as I despise the country. But if you want to know their rationalization, here it is:

On DEC. 27, Israel began “Operation Cast Lead” to stop Iran-backed Hamas in Gaza from continuing its years-long campaign of attacking Israeli civilians with thousands of rockets, missiles and mortars. Following are facts and figures to help you relate to Israel’s defensive efforts in Gaza:
Iran-backed Hamas Rocket, Mor tar Attacks and Nuclear Developments
9,400+ rockets and mortars fired from Gaza since 2003. [1]
3,200+ rockets and mortars fired from Gaza in 2008 alone. [2]
6,500+ rockets and mortars fired from Gaza since Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005. [3]
543+ rockets and mortars fired from Gaza into Israeli territory during the ceasefire from June 19 to DEC. 19, 2008. [4]
28 deaths caused by rockets and mortars fired from Gaza into Israel since 2001. The dead include Israelis, Palestinians and foreign workers. Since the ceasefire ended, Iran-backed Palestinian groups in Gaza fired rockets and mortars that killed an Israeli-Arab construction worker and a mother of four who was seeking shelter in a bus station as a rocket warning siren sounded. [5]
1,000+ people in Israel injured from rockets and mortars fired from Gaza since 2001, including Israelis, Palestinians and foreign workers. Since the ceasefire, 44 Israelis have been injured and 200 have been treated for shock . [6]
20,000 Hamas troops Israel is targeting as part of “Operation Cast Lead.” [7]
750,000 number of Israeli civilians Hamas is targeting and can reach. [8]
15 seconds Israelis have to get to a bomb shelter once a warning siren has sounded. [9]
8 years that Israel has been hit by rockets and mortars from Gaza [10]
3 mosques in Gaza used as weapons, ammunitions and explosives depots that were struck by the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) during the operation in Gaza. [11]
4 UN Security Council resolutions passed since 2006 to try to stop Iran from enriching uranium. [12]
5,000+ number of centrifuges operating in Iran to enrich uranium, the material used to produce a nuclear weapon. [13]

Israel’s Humanitarian Aid to Gaza
179 truckloads of humanitarian aid that have been delivered through Israeli crossings into Gaza since the beginning of Operation Cast Lead, including basic food commodities, medication, medical supplies, donations of governments and blood units.
106 additional truckloads of humanitarian expected to arrive in Gaza on Jan. 31 [14]
6,500 tons of aid transported into Gaza at the request of international organizations, the Palestinian Authority and various governments since the beginning of Operation Cast Lead. The20World Food Program informed Israel that it will cease shipment of food to Gaza because warehouses are at full capacity, with enough food to last two weeks. [15]

What Israel Gave Up in Hopes of Peace – Gaza Withdrawal Aug. 2005
100% proportion of the Gaza Strip evacuated and handed over to the
Palestinians. [16]
300 square miles of the West Bank evacuated. [17]
21 Isra eli settlements uprooted in the Gaza Strip. [18]
4 Israeli settlements uprooted in the West Bank. [19]
48 graves uprooted in Gaza’s former Gush Katif Cemetery, including six graves of area residents murdered by terrorists. [20]
9,000 approximate number of Israelis, including 1,700 families, who lived in Gaza and the northern West Bank. All of them were moved out as part of the withdrawal. [21]
38 synagogues dismantled in the Gaza Strip. [22]
5,000 school-age children who had to find new schools. [23]
42 daycare centers that were closed in the Gaza Strip. [24]
36 kindergartens that were closed in the Gaza Strip. [25]
7 elementary schools that were closed in the Gaza Strip. [26]
3 high schools that were closed in the Gaza Strip. [27]
320 mobile homes, ordered by Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, to serve as temporary housing for settlers. [28]
45,000 Israeli soldiers and policemen who participated in the Gaza withdrawal. [29]
$1.7 billion the approximate cost to the Israeli government for the withdrawal initiative. [30]
166 Israeli farmers who were moved out of Gaza. [31]
800 cows, which comprised the second largest dairy farm in Israel, moved out of Gaza’s Gush Katif community. [32]
$120 million value of flowers and produce exported annually from Gush Katif and lost following the evacuation. [33]
1 zoo, the “Katifari,” that housed hundreds of animals and was moved. [34]
10,000 people who were employed in agriculture and related industries in Gush Katif, including 5,000 Palestinians. [35]
60% proportion of Israel’s cherry tomato exports that came from the Gaza Strip. Israel’s withdrawal from Gaza extinguished this economic resource. [36]
3.5 million square meters (almost 1,000 acres) of greenhouses abandoned in Gaza. [37]
70 percentage of Israel’s organic produce grown in Gaza – another economic resource lost in the evacuation. [38]
60 percentage of herbs exported from Israel that came from Gush Katif. [39]
15 percentage of Israel agricultural exports that originated in Gaza – exports lost followin g Israel’s withdrawal from Gaza. [40]
$360,000 expected average compensation amount Israel expected to pay to relocate each family. [41]
$870 million approximate cost for Israel to facilitate the resettlement of former West Bank and Gaza residents elsewhere in the country. [42]
$500 million amount of money Israel’s security establishment spent to relocate Israel Defense Forces bases outside the Gaza Strip and build new border crossing facilities. [43]

After Israel’s evacuation from Gaza…
430,000 West Bank Palestinians able to move freely within and between Palestinian-controlled areas. [44]
1 Israeli remaining in Gaza. Staff Sgt. Gilad Shalit was abducted from Israel on June 25, 2006 by Hamas in a bloody cross-border raid in which the terrorists also killed two IDF soldiers and wounded four others. [45]
1.2 million Arabs who remained full and legal citizens of Israel. All Israeli citizens – Christians, Muslims, and Jews – have freedom of speech, religion , press, and the right to vote. [46]
1.3 million Palestinians living in the Gaza Strip many of them in Palestinian Authority-controlled refugee camps, who live under their own leaders. [47]
820,000 Jewish refugees forced to flee without their belongings from Arab countries between 1947 and 1949, and who have never been compensated by Arab governments for their losses. [48]
650,000 Arab refugees who left Israel from 1947-1949 and still need Palestinian leaders who will end terrorism and the culture of hate. [49]

Israel’s withdrawal from four northern West Bank settlements created an area more than twice the size of Gaza’s 140 square miles under Palestinian control and devoid of any Israeli presence. [50]

The demonstrations have been so good – and they are global. I keep being surprised by another country listed when I check the news.

Except that Israel is demographically speaking quite a young country. and the proportion of direct Haulocaust survivors is getting smaller and smaller. Not that there aren’t multi-generational effects from it, but still.

It is almost like killer bees…one threat..and the whole hive goes after you.

Great metaphor.

(and)

Intervention is needed.

And so it goes, round and round. Who will intervene? The United States has lost its credibility (h/t GWB). Even our best prospects are suspect. The United Nations has no teeth, owing principally to (everyone?) the bully dominance of the United States. And so I ask again, who will intervene?

Selise, I’m borrowing a page from your book. Thank you.

And what about the Palestinians, for whom the devastation is current? When will they “forget?”

Siun asked you for a link at #70.

Does anyone else have a link to this stor? I can’t dfind it.

I’ve seen a couple of youtubes from the beginning of the bombing showing settlers watching the bombing from lawn chairs, while sipping beer or licking ice cream, but this is different and makes no sense.

I believe the middle east specializes in long memories.

But seriously – trauma and injustice have long half-lives.

excellent – thank you!

Yes, there are natural gas deposits off the coast of Gaza.

I’m speaking as a shrink who loves her job, believes in therapy and knows that healing and change happens: there’s more to this than trauma. There’s profit and personal/political advantage and a whole lot of other venal concerns at play. And, unfortunately, like the light bulb and the psychotherapist joke, the light bulb has to want to change.

And why should memories be short? It seems to be a U.S. specialty of always trying to forget the past.

wow – has your son’s teacher ever been to the occupied territories?

Is this it?

She is a (approx) 70 year old American Jewess. Don’t know her family history (i.e. whether she lost relatives in the holocaust) or whether she has ever been to Israel or occupied territories. I suspect not, but that’s a guess.

No reason why they should be short.

And I think that memories are more powerful when they are collective – held by a relatively homogenous group with shared experiences and an identity as a people.

BTW, selise, my in-laws are Jews. My late husband’s family fled from Germany after Kristallnacht. He was 13, and had been sent to boarding school in Belgium (iirc) because he was ADD and it was not a good combo to be a Jewish ADD pre-teen in Nazi Germany. They were prosperous (but not wealthy, if you get the distiction) so they got out intact with some financial resources. They did not prosper in the U.S., but did OK. I think my sister-in-law and my late husband before he died are much more balanced about their views of Israel than my son’s teacher.

Clearly, they don’t want to change, because they think that they have their best solution at the moment (this is still a recent “moment” in time..this if fairly recent trauma…peoples’ entire families, heritage, etc. are all gone forever)…the instinct is to fight still..right now..it’s not really over the instinct is to defend…defend…defend…fight…this will never happen to our families again…etc., plus the questions within themselves…how could this have happened? How did they play us? Why didn’t we have defense? Why did people just get on trains and go to camps? What happened? Why were we not armed? How could that happen to us?? That reaction is totally understandable….at least to me.

Sorta like court ordered rehab doesn’t usually work? Or, so I hear. The lengths we humans will go to avoid change or responsibility.

Well, the Israelis learned well from the holocaust: to kill before they are killed.

Siun, here is the link to the Haaretz article dated today:

http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1054491

Also there is a group of related articles at the end of above. one entitled ‘Settler Group Planning to Re-establish Gaza Bloc’ dated 08/08.
Some of these groups were removed from Gaza in 2005 and compensated for their homes, but have lived in tent cities until they can return to Gaza.
(it is the land God promised them, they have divine right)./s

That is what I’m saying.

Apropos Sameh Habeeb (Gaza reporter and human rights worker Siun links above), for facebook folks, the Sameh is Safe Project. (He’s been getting death threats by phone.)

Thanks. It could well be. If any male in Gaza walked around this week, armed like that, he would be shot dead by any Israeli soldier who saw him.

What I’m saying is: wrong lessons learned from history.

But sometimes, it’s kill, so I win an election. Or, kill, because I want to live here. Or….

Yeah, it is some kind of hyper-response problem. Who to intervene??? The whole world…with compassion and help.

Clearly, neither side is capable of controlling their actions. They need war-adrenalin rehab.

Now I’m trying to remember what I read (and where) that seemed to suggest that the U.S. was helping to fund this initiative. Under cover of darkness, I imagine. But I’m not sure enough to say this is true truth. Trying to remember what I’ve read . . . good luck with that, eh?

Olmert called the war “an unprecedented national effort that restored the spirit of unity to the nation…”

Just like Bush did after declaring war. But has Israel paid any attention
1) we lost the war
2)national unity is back…over 70% of us agree that Bush has to go
3) Short term gains in politics now are not worth worrying about war crimes.
4) No Nation has benefited from a long war.

Sorry, I can certainly understand the collective memory of the holocaust but nothing justifies the actions of the Israelis towards the people of Gaza. We are watching a massacre.

Read my comments again. That is what I’m saying…or I’m just a shitty writer…d’oh.

Where’s Laura? Pretty good example of addiction to chaos (among other things), is it not?

What doesthe term “cast lead” in Operation Cast Lead mean? I used to reload ammo and make black powder bullets, by casting lead. Is this operational terminology less ominous than I imagine?

Thank you so much!

Sameh has been such a brave and wonderful resource.

I hope folks friend him on Facebook and leave messages of support.

I think you are about right. Cast is also a verb with the meaning “to throw”.

True, but WWII is still raw. I remember traveling in Europe as a kid and seeing all of the bombed out buildings everywhere…everywhere…parts of Germany was rubble still in the early 60’s.

How soon we forget when the infrastructure looks normal…the soul and the psyche are not normal…the events are transmitted to the offspring…forever.

I will believe violence will overcome violence when you can convince me that darkness will overcome darkness. M K Gandhi

Governments have been trying to prove Gandhi wrong. They have not succeeded. Nor will they. Ever.

i actually don’t think it’s about being jewish or even necessarily the trauma of the holocaust. i’ve told this story here before, but maybe you don’t know it – i was talking with some people with phr-israel and i asked them, in my ignorance, if cultures could have a cycle of violence as sometimes happens in families (i’d done some volunteering and had some basic training with a shelter for victims of domestic violence) and one of them told me she had asked that same question to one of their doctor-volunteers who was at that time i think 80. he was jewish and although he had survived he had lost his family in germany as had his wife (they met i think in israel). their only son had died while a soldier in the idf. and this retired doctor spent his time volunteering in west bank with a mobil clinic to provide health care to palestinians who could not get to a doc on their own. and what he told the woman who was relating all this to me was the following: when we learn “never again” we have to choose which lesson we learn – never again for me and mine or never again for anyone. i choose the second.

this is all paraphrased from memory, but i think pretty close.

FDL post earlier today that U.S. provided bunker buster bombs.

WW2 ended 64 years ago. We should never forget what happened to the Jews during that horrible time but how long does the world have to pay for it? Do you get to declare that your victimhood is forever?

We are witnessing a horrible military devastation of the Palestinians and their world…coming from a culture that experienced it 6 million fold more…it is overkill…it is psychotic. Killer bees.

I gave the link at 101.

To be used in Gaza or Iran?

oh, selise, this is very powerful.

I didn’t travel to Germany until the late 1980s, and then I noticed all the “new” building built in the footprint of those that had been bombed during WWII. Immediately obvious what destruction the Allies had done. All of them were civilian.

They are now being used in Gaza. We’ll see about Iran.

It is from a poem about Hannukah (IIRC an allegory re: the formation of Israel). I think I saw an article about it in Ha’aretz….and maybe Dion Nissenbaum at McClatchy did a blog on it….

Ding.

But, when your culture and family has been murdered, in your lifetime, or close to it…it is surely never again under any circumstances. Period.

i should say that where i think the memory of the holocaust comes in is in the reluctance to be critical of what the israeli gov does – but not necessarily the motivation to violence against the palestinians.

that’s my tentative take anyway. i’ve just seen too many people freak out when someone (ok, when i) am critical of israeli gov actions. but none of them would ever cause any hard on their own, just i think can’t believe it’s being done.

LS. I believe you mean the very best. But sometimes, evil is banal.

True. Dresden, etc., total disregard by everyone as to who was civilian. It is amazing how quickly they rebuilt Europe….absolutely amazing…like nothing happened…even the death camps are razed.

this sickens me.

help give this post more exposure on the Internet. Please Digg it here. If you are not registered with Digg, this would be a good time to do so.

Operation Cast Lead Background. No idea if this is a credible source, but . . .

Israel withdrew every Israeli soldier and all 8000 Israeli civilians from the Gaza Strip as part of its 2005 disengagement initiative. In 2007 Hamas accelerated the military buildup of the Izzedine al-Qassam Brigades, which focuses on attacks against Israel and the IDF. There was a substantial increase in rocket fire compared with 2001-2005, the years before the disengagement. Israeli and Hamas negotiators reached an Egyptian-brokered cease-fire agreement June 18 that took effect June 19. The agreement was to last for six months. While Israel had been expected to lift or at least ease the blockade that had imposed severe hardships on the entire population of Gaza, it failed to do so. Israel refused to substantially ease the siege of Gaza imposed in June 2007, and Hamas continued sporadic rocket fire.

On 04 November 2008 Israel raided the Gaza Strip in order to thwart the threat of a tunnel being dug by the Gaza border, killing at least 6 Palestinians. This incident is apparently the “incursion” that HAMAS took as the reason for ending the truce. Hamas retaliated with rocket fire. On 12 November 2008, IDF Paratroopers Brigade forces identified a number of armed gunmen attempting to plant an explosive device next to the security fence in the central Gaza Strip. The gunmen exchanged fire with the IDF forces that arrived at the scene. The IDF had recently identified a significant rise in attempts to place explosive devices on the security fence of the Gaza Strip in an attempt to target forces in the area.

From 04 November through 18 December 2008, Hamas and affiliated Palestinian terrorist groups fired 213 rockets and 126 mortar shells into Israel. More than 20 Kassam rockets were fired at southern Israel from Gaza on Wednesday 17 December 2008. In response to the continuous rocket fire from the Gaza Strip upon Israeli territory, IDF forces carried out four aerial strikes against terrorist targets in the Gaza Strip on Wednesday 17 December 2008.

~~~ModNote: To keep FDL within Fair Use guidelines, please use a short excerpt (200 words or less), and include the link as you have here, when quoting outside material. Thanks.~~~

Explain…before you flatter me please.

Do you get to declare that your victimhood is forever?

yes.

but that is never a license to create more victimes.

Cast in Lead, poem and operation.

Up until the last several years, I didn’t believe that evil existed in the world. I saw evil as just something really bad, not anything more. I now have a different belief about Evil.

I don’t know whether this has been posted here…

Pro-Palestinian Rally in New York Turns Violent

CNN.com

I’ve read it now. Thank you.

I don’t see your son’s history teacher noting that in 1948 Israel was given Palestinian land to create “Israel”. Can she answer the “why” of why that was done with full American partisanship? As a history teacher, can she find an “Israel” on the map before 1948? Can she also answer to the fact that the founders of Israel were thugs? No, I don’t think you’ll find any of these facts in US “history” books. The traumatization of the Jewish people by the Nazis was not a problem the Palestinians had anything to do with, why did they have to pay for it? If any of our “enemies” were acting like Israel the US would be planning an invasion of that country and has done so for a lot less. Good thing the West is always “right” and is on “God’s side”. This is and always has been a land-grab. The Palestinians live in an open air prison camp. Israel complains about rockets being smuggled into Gaza yet in the last 6 years 11 Israelis have died but over 1,000 Palestinians have also; perhaps the Palestinians are trying to protect themselves against what they see as an aggressor nation and the failure of “democracies” to stand up for them. Given the history of all this,can anyone blame the Palestinians for arming, as best they can, when they have seen their land taken and their people killed and are now living in squalor? And still, they are called the terrorists by our media and our politicians who are also participants in this abomination.

Yes? Even after several generations?

teddy upstairs

{{{{selise}}}}

Wasn’t flattery. Just acknowledging your good will. But sometimes, people do evil for banal reasons. Because it serves their purpose in the present time to do so. I completely agree that trauma happens, that people have unconscious motivations, that there are unconscious group dynamics. AND sometimes, people do evil things because they want to. Consciously, deliberately want to. And therapizing the situation or declaring them out of contact with reality (psychotic) keeps us from seeing that. (And from taking right action.)
I don’t deny that I would rather believe that good people do bad things not on purpose. But, when it’s on a scale like this, I don’t believe it’s true.

God. See, it is insane. The whole thing is psychotic insanity based on past events.

at the risk of you all thinking i’m a total sap. here’s david rovics singing “in one world” (youtube, audiostream). thanks to mrwhy who found the youtube for me earlier today.

So much resentment, so much at stake
And I really don’t remember who was the first to say
In one world
In one village
In one home
Let us live together

Heh. She just sent me an email asking that I remove her from my email list as she can’t communicate with someone who despises Israel.

I would not consider that a neutral description of the situation by any means. Hamas actually did halt rocket attacks – and only very gradually restarted them (with the caveat that it is not clear how many rockets are fired by Hamas, how many by other groups not under Hamas control) in response to Israeli incursions. Even in Ha’aretz, it is understood that Israel entered the “cease fire” of June as part of a larger plan to prepare for the attacks we are seeing now.

That’s just a beginning of what I see wrong. For example, Hamas wanted to extend the cease fire but insisted that the incursions stop and the blockade be opened since at that point Israel had allowed in only 40 trucks every 10 days for 6 weeks and the Gazan people were reduced to starvation. Describing that as “the Islamist militant group Hamas ended the six-month ceasefire with Israel in the Gaza Strip.” is all wrong.

There’s more but I have a puppy who really needs to go outside but I’d suggest looking at my earlier posts on Gaza – you can see them all if you click on my name in the main post – for a review drawn from both Israeli and Palestinian sources.

Should work out well for everyone!

{{{{ET}}}}

Mod…not only that, it was a crappy source! Sorry. Now I lay me down to sleep . . . . g’nite.

so sad.

Barbara – it’s very very hard to find sources – esp normally “serious” sources that are actually accurate. That’s one reason I point often to many of the columnists in the Israeli Ha’aretz – many of them (for example Gideon Levy) are much more accurate that those we find here.

Thanks again, Siun and everyone.

Yes, there truly is evil. A good book, Scott Peck’s, People of the Lie. I keep wondering if things have gotten worse or merely the exposure. But seems like total overload, endless.

Point taken. “that people have unconscious motivations, that there are unconscious group dynamics.”

However, I would not put the rounding up of elements of certain cultures…trucking them on trains to nowhere, death by gas chamber/showers…their skin made into lampshades and soap, the gold from their teeth purged and their bodies thrown into mass graves after being murdered and starved and separated from their family members after being worked to a starvation state and thrown into graves dead or alive…ummmm…oh yeah, 6 million of these people…oh yeah…

I’d say there was some trauma/generational trauma there to deal with…but that’s just stupid me. It is not a matter of my “goodwill” or good intention…or any kind of BS like that..That is all based on historical fact, and I see quite clearly that people who have endured that and those that are immediately descended or saved from the circumstances have grounds for having trauma and behaving accordingly…not that it is right…it is acting out of trauma, and the behavior needs intervention in order to preserve the rest of the world…Geez.

What a load of shit !!!
I don’t support these thugs either.
Also didn’t Hitler use calls for national unity to unite the Germans ,before trying to purge the country of Jews?

Thanks. You’re very kind and very diplomatic! I’m tired. Didn’t read carefully. Note to self: Ummm, read carefully.

OT, Barbara: Any latest nugget on your race up there? Sign of Coleman going away?

Wouldn’t it be easier if the Israelis just sent the Gazans blankets infected with small pox?
There are just exterminating pests,aren’t they ? /s

War is evil unleashed ,and nothing more !!

Does have echoes of the colonial era, doesn’t it.

It is just sickening. Very similar…However, the “Americans” who did this were truly venomized by racism and hatred..sort of like the Nazis..just pure greed and racism, and they wanted their empire to expand…whereas; the attacks on the Palestinians is an overreaction or one could say a completely unreasonable “license” to overreact, by the US and others to go to any lengths to defend themselves to maintain the western footprint in the ME..within certain “boundaries”…using the traumatized mentality of the Israelis; who’ve they armed with nukes….sweet stupidity.

Playing the Victim is an Isreali specialty…even when the victim is really the palastinians. Land, fossil fuel and coastine real estate. Regionally feared power and an authoritarian rule to subjugate a lesser power. That elevates their self worth much like the southern white power subjugated african americans.
How Obama can stand this after seeing the sffects of colonialisn in Kenya is so very difficult to grasp.
Playing the victim while being the agressor is a pshchological stretch. As in mind bending. It is a form of transference. Remeber all the bad that the terrorist did and using that to justify more worse behavior.

Why repeat what someone else did to you? When those acts were done by a different party. The Jews have been hunting Nazi war criminals for decades.
Now will they be hunted thamselves. The killer victims family kills the family of the killer. The Clampets and the McCoys were fearless mountain boys…been fueding fussin and a fighting for generations.
This is a race war that has nothing to do with the Nazis. Sorry LS there is no justification for making a ghetto and then shelling it with kland an sea bombardments and aerial attacks GPS ed by address. This is fucking murder it is not defense. It is a war of expansion. Zion.

eCahnomics, Along the way I’ve learned that these people are pure poison and drain our energy that is needed for positive purposes. I dropped all those “my way or the highway” folks long ago – I’m a much happier person. Let ‘er go and good riddance.

Gideon Levy / My hero of the Gaza war

My war hero likes to eat at Acre’s famed Uri Burri restaurant. He thinks it’s the best fish restaurant in the world, and told me as much yesterday from the porch of the central Gaza City office building from which he has broadcast every day for the past two weeks, noon and night, almost without rest.

My war hero is Ayman Mohyeldin, the young correspondent for Al Jazeera English and the only foreign correspondent broadcasting during these awful days in a Gaza Strip closed off to the media. Al Jazeera English is not what you might think. It offers balanced, professional reporting from correspondents both in Sderot and Gaza. And Mohyeldin is the cherry on top of this journalistic cream. I wouldn’t have needed him or his broadcasts if not for the Israeli stations’ blackout of the fighting. Since discovering this wunderkind from America (his mother is from the West Bank city of Tul Karm and his father from Egypt), I have stopped frantically changing TV stations.

At age 29, he has already seen one war, in Iraq, but he says this war is more intense. He is frustrated that his broadcasts are carried virtually everywhere in the world except the United States, his own country, the place he thinks it is most important that these images from Gaza be seen.

“At the end of the day, if there is one country that can have influence, it’s the United States. It’s frustrating to know you’re not reaching the viewers you would like to,” he told me this week from the roof. On Friday he finally came down, for safety’s sake, after the Israel Defense Forces bombed a neighboring media center.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1054282.html

Absolutely.

Dreadful Dresden fire bombing.

Ah Barbara, not being diplomatic … it is a constant problem for all of us to find reliable information and that is part of the problem, that the info has been so controlled and slanted.

Thank you for passing that along – I keep wanting to send flowers to Gideon Levy!

Nope the death camp near the BMW plant outside of Munich is open for visitors complete with pictures ovens and all. The iron work over the entry gate still says “Arbiet Machen Zie Frei”. We were a student group and kept asking why people smelled the burning flesh and did nothing to stop it. I have always had deep feelings for the Jews of Europe…now not so much.
They knew the agony and are willing to forget USA and others rescued them. It is sickening the meaness and greed. Now they are into the levers of power in our government. What do they want? World domination?

I do believe you crossed a line there in your last paragraph.

from Tariq Ali at rally in London January 8th:

Strike in Norway

An overwhelming majority of Norwegian trade unions have endorsed a new campaign for the withdrawal of all Norwegian state investment in Israel.

Norwegian Union of Shop Workers has called on all its members to ask their employers to remove Israeli products from stores.

Norwegian Church has protested Israel’s invasion of Gaza.

31 of Norwegians supports a total boycott of Israel.

31% of Norwegians…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..re=related

Haaretz reports that Venezuela will send aid to Gaza via Egypt.

How will they get it into the country?

Mods,

Excuse the OT, but I think there is a problem with the video on Teddy’s post.
Something keeps trying to load – can’t use the page at all. I’m on dial up.

Done all I know, clearing cache, shutting down, etc. Programs involved seem to include widgets nbcune nbc and clearspring.

Loads fine on PC and Mac here. I’m afraid a restart may be indicated.

Grassroots Movement to End Occupation Through Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions

The best strategy to end the increasingly bloody occupation is for Israel to become the target of the kind of global movement that put an end to apartheid in South Africa. In July 2005 a huge coalition of Palestinian groups laid out plans to do just that. They called on “people of conscience all over the world to impose broad boycotts and implement divestment initiatives against Israel similar to those applied to South Africa in the apartheid era”. The campaign Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions was born.

Naomi Klein

http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..536/682898

Ah, so that’s why everyone was so horrified when Carter drew the SA parallel.

Cool, boycott. I’m in.

This is as much detail as I could find from ABC:

Venezuela says it has sent an army Hercules C130 cargo plane bearing 12.5 tonnes of medical supplies and other materials for the besieged population of Gaza Strip.

The plane was headed to Cairo, where the relief aid would be transferred to trucks for their overland trip to Gaza, President Hugo Chavez said.

“We count on the support of the Egyptian Government and the United Nations so this life-sustaining shipment can reach the Palestinian people,” Mr Chavez said during his Alo Presidente radio talk show

Thank you kindly.

I’ll try again.
If y’all never see me again, give my regards to LLN *g*
(blankety blank dial up)

Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions or BDS website here:

http://www.bds-palestine.net/

Siun, thanks for another poignant and inspirational commentary.
I will share it along with the following powerful statements being made:
——————————
Stephen Zunes, Alternet
http://www.alternet.org/audits/117475/
How the progressive community addresses the ongoing tragedy in the Gaza Strip in the coming days and weeks may determine the direction for the incoming Obama administration and the 111th Congress, not just in terms of U.S. policy toward Israel and Palestine, but in foreign policy overall.
————————————————————–
Philip Weiss at Huffpo
And our phantom worries mean that we cannot address the incredible, everyday, real suffering of Palestinians that has been perpetrated politically in large part by empowered American Jews who are all over the media and political establishment, some of whom limit debate of the issue by citing a possible infraction of our tremendous freedoms.
————————————————-
Mark Gaffney at InformationClearingHouse
http://www.informationclearing…..e21715.htm
The US has used its UN veto on forty occasions, spanning almost four decades, to shield Israel from accountability. But for this the UN would have intervened to resolve the conflict, long ago. In which case Hamas would never have come into existence and there would be peace in Palestine, today. … But the slaughter of more than 800 Palestinians, as I write, in addition to more than 3,000 injured … Uncritical US support for Israeli-style Apartheid has thus placed the United States on the wrong side of history, an ugly reality that ought to be a source of concern, indeed, of alarm, for each and every American.
——————————————
Richard Silverstein-Guardian
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comm…..stry-media
A reader of my blog has received the following email which documents both the efforts and the agency that originated them. The solicitation to become a pro-Israel “media volunteer” also includes a list of media links which the ministry would like addressed by pro-Israel comments …. … The following were identified as “target sites”: the Times, the Guardian, Sky News, BBC, Yahoo!News, Huffington Post, and the Dutch Telegraaf.
—————————————————————-
Geoffrey Wheatcroft
http://www.informationclearing…..e21713.htm
During the presidential campaign Barack Obama went out of his way to endorse Israel. He has appointed in the form of Hillary Clinton perhaps the strongest supporter of Israel ever to serve as Secretary of State, not excluding Henry Kissinger, a Jewish refugee from Hitler, though even she is surpassed in her commitment by Rahm Emanuel, Obama’s chief of staff.
————————————————
Julia Irwin
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/
Our failure to condemn the totally disproportionate, not to say illegal, attacks by the Israeli Defence Force has changed the way conflict is regarded around the world. Last August, Russia employed the same tactics in its attack on Georgia as Israel did against Lebanon. … How can we criticise brutal regimes elsewhere in the world when we condone worse atrocities when they are committed by Israel? The Security Council has become a laughing stock.
——————————————-
Hillary Mann Leverett on Olbermann
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..02783.html
LEVERETT ON OBAMA: He really should be coming out now with a statement of sympathy for all those who have been killed, Palestinians and Israelis. The fact that he is silent is resonating very strongly throughout the Middle East..
*
LEVERETT (ON H. CLINTON): Her name is magical and influential to an extent in Israel. But throughout many capitals in the Arab world, where I served at the US embassy in Cairo and in the Gulf, there is a lot more skepticism that she is going to be even handed.

Americans cannot boycott Israel…

Antiboycott Laws:

During the mid-1970’s the United States adopted two laws that seek to counteract the participation of U.S. citizens in other nation’s economic boycotts or embargoes. These “antiboycott” laws are the 1977 amendments to the Export Administration Act (EAA) and the Ribicoff Amendment to the 1976 Tax Reform Act (TRA).
Objectives:

The antiboycott laws were adopted to encourage, and in specified cases, require U.S. firms to refuse to participate in foreign boycotts that the United States does not sanction. They have the effect of preventing U.S. firms from being used to implement foreign policies of other nations which run counter to U.S. policy.
Primary Impact:

The Arab League boycott of Israel is the principal foreign economic boycott that U.S. companies must be concerned with today. The antiboycott laws, however, apply to all boycotts imposed by foreign countries that are unsanctioned by the United States.
Who Is Covered by the Laws?

The antiboycott provisions of the Export Administration Regulations (EAR) apply to the activities of U.S. persons in the interstate or foreign commerce of the United States. The term “U.S. person” includes all individuals, corporations and unincorporated associations resident in the United States, including the permanent domestic affiliates of foreign concerns. U.S. persons also include U.S. citizens abroad (except when they reside abroad and are employed by non-U.S. persons) and the controlled in fact affiliates of domestic concerns. The test for “controlled in fact” is the ability to establish the general policies or to control the day to day operations of the foreign affiliate.

The scope of the EAR, as defined by Section 8 of the EAA, is limited to actions taken with intent to comply with, further, or support an
unsanctioned foreign boycott

What do the Laws Prohibit?

Conduct that may be penalized under the TRA and/or prohibited under the EAR includes:

* Agreements to refuse or actual refusal to do business with or in Israel or with blacklisted companies.
* Agreements to discriminate or actual discrimination against other persons based on race, religion, sex, national origin or nationality.
* Agreements to furnish or actual furnishing of information about business relationships with or in Israel or with blacklisted companies.
* Agreements to furnish or actual furnishing of information about the race, religion, sex, or national origin of another person.

http://www.bis.doc.gov/antiboy…..ments.html

You’re welcome. Twice as many flowers now..

sucks when countries go to war, and the suffering and blood spilling is horrible. Why did palestinians vote for hamas,knowing they would fuck with israel endlessly?

Of course that doesn’t apply to Cuba or Iran, to name but two.

If the definition of the prohibited boycotts is limited to “foreign” ones then how does American Naomi Klein’s call for a boycott of Israel run afoul? (Actually I think divestiture is the stronger part of her call.)