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	<title>Comments on: Cornyn Uses Reid&#8217;s Burris Tactics to Refuse Seating Franken</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/</link>
	<description>Firedoglake weblog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 27 Nov 2009 03:37:21 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: oldtree</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1779960</link>
		<dc:creator>oldtree</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 18:11:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1779960</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;little children with guns and ammo.  needless slaughter of the intent of the law.  absent of human value, logic, considered thought for the people of the country.&lt;br /&gt;
  I am typically ashamed of what all politicians do, but when they go into the realm of the absurd they prove they have no place representing us.  More important,  they show that they do not represent us at all, and never have, never will.&lt;br /&gt;
  How many times have they ignored the law, the people of the country, reality?    They fight about the little pieces of turd stuck to their shoes and the world burns.   idiots are in charge.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>little children with guns and ammo.  needless slaughter of the intent of the law.  absent of human value, logic, considered thought for the people of the country.<br />
  I am typically ashamed of what all politicians do, but when they go into the realm of the absurd they prove they have no place representing us.  More important,  they show that they do not represent us at all, and never have, never will.<br />
  How many times have they ignored the law, the people of the country, reality?    They fight about the little pieces of turd stuck to their shoes and the world burns.   idiots are in charge.</p>
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		<title>By: interlude</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778980</link>
		<dc:creator>interlude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 22:33:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778980</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;this is the wrong fight for senate dems. a waste of valuable energy.&lt;br /&gt;
Blago is an embarrassment, his action was an attempt to embarrass Obama…&lt;br /&gt;
but his appointment of Burris is not illegal,&lt;br /&gt;
and Burris may be a good person for the 2 year job.&lt;br /&gt;
when will dems learn to fight the important fights?&lt;br /&gt;
when will dem leaders actually lead?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this is the wrong fight for senate dems. a waste of valuable energy.<br />
Blago is an embarrassment, his action was an attempt to embarrass Obama…<br />
but his appointment of Burris is not illegal,<br />
and Burris may be a good person for the 2 year job.<br />
when will dems learn to fight the important fights?<br />
when will dem leaders actually lead?</p>
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		<title>By: Blue</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778971</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 22:18:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778971</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I don’t see the Senate convening without Franken or Burris as problematic (hell they’d no doubt do a lot better if more than half of them stayed home) but I fail to see a &lt;i&gt;double standard&lt;/i&gt; between provisionally seating Franken who was duly elected (via a recount and transparent analysis of challenged ballots with the outcome dictating only the margin considering absentee ballots -though I do think it appropriate to wait for certification) and the seating of an appointee made by a governor who has been indicted for attempts to sell the seat in question.  The Republicans were going to try an stop Franken regardless of the Burris issue.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don’t see the Senate convening without Franken or Burris as problematic (hell they’d no doubt do a lot better if more than half of them stayed home) but I fail to see a <i>double standard</i> between provisionally seating Franken who was duly elected (via a recount and transparent analysis of challenged ballots with the outcome dictating only the margin considering absentee ballots -though I do think it appropriate to wait for certification) and the seating of an appointee made by a governor who has been indicted for attempts to sell the seat in question.  The Republicans were going to try an stop Franken regardless of the Burris issue.</p>
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		<title>By: brendanscalling</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778966</link>
		<dc:creator>brendanscalling</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 22:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778966</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;harry reid can’t even win a game of Candyland against a 4 year old, how do you expect him to pull this off?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>harry reid can’t even win a game of Candyland against a 4 year old, how do you expect him to pull this off?</p>
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		<title>By: bayville</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778944</link>
		<dc:creator>bayville</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:47:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778944</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Seriously, what are the qualifications needed to become a Democratic leader in Congress?&lt;br /&gt;
A driver’s license?&lt;br /&gt;
A cool car?&lt;br /&gt;
High school diploma?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seriously, what are the qualifications needed to become a Democratic leader in Congress?<br />
A driver’s license?<br />
A cool car?<br />
High school diploma?</p>
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		<title>By: Teddy Partridge</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778930</link>
		<dc:creator>Teddy Partridge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:29:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778930</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;This is a fascinating scenario entirely beyond the capability of Harry Reid to implement or, sadly, to understand.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It also depends (in the immediate swearing-in part) upon the goodwill and collaboration of the sitting Vice President, President of the Senate and sure to throw a monkey wrench if one needs throwing on behalf of the GOPs.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a fascinating scenario entirely beyond the capability of Harry Reid to implement or, sadly, to understand.</p>
<p>It also depends (in the immediate swearing-in part) upon the goodwill and collaboration of the sitting Vice President, President of the Senate and sure to throw a monkey wrench if one needs throwing on behalf of the GOPs.</p>
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		<title>By: cinnamonape</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778926</link>
		<dc:creator>cinnamonape</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:25:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778926</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Wait a second. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;1) The numbers used above for the cloture motion are only legitimate AFTER the new Senators are seated. Clearly the acceptance of seating of new members is contingent on standards established in prior situations (i.e. Landrieu). What Reid could do is place Franken up as Senator #1. If the Republicans want to have a cloture motion they would have to undertake it with 2/3rd’s of the sitting (carryover) members, since no “freshman” or carryover incumbents (Coleman, or even Cornyn) have been seated. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In that case the Republicans would have to attain 40% of the 55 sitting Senators (26 votes). The Democrats would have 37 (except for two complications). Sanchez and Clinton still hold their seats (pending resignation), Chambliss and those voted out of office do not hold seats in the new Congress. So the Republicans still have the percentage (40%)  to actually create a filibuster with that stipulation because Obama and Biden have resigned, and their replacements are contingent on the acceptance by the carryover Senators. It looks as if the Republicans would have just enough (even without the Independents) to block accepting Franken.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2) Now lets say Reid places the new (and re-entering) Republican members of the Senate last on the approval list of votes, just after Franken. I think Reid would control the order of the “acceptances” and call a motion on seating Franken at any time.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Would he then be able to include all the new Democratic members in the vote minus the re-elected Republicans. As the votes to allow these new members in they could quickly swear their oath, and then vote. So slowly all the initiates would accumulate the Democratic quorum of seated members until it was 55D-26R (2I). Democrats would then have easily the needed numbers to seat Franken…even without Obama, Biden or their replacements.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then the Senate could move ahead on seating the re-elected Republicans. The sweet irony of this would be that Cornyn himself would not be allowed to vote as these members are introduced, since he was just re-elected…technically he’s not a “member of the new class”. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Of course, the Republicans could filibuster ANY new member being seated, I suppose. But that would look really nasty and almost like a coup-de-tat. And Cornyn would be on the outside looking in. This would be a “nuclear option” for the Republicans…and remove much of their leadership. Reid could then state that they would have to clear their offices, fire their staffs, and lose their seniority if they had a “disruption of service”.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I suspect that they’d come to their senses pretty quickly.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;3) Can one filibuster a non-budget or law activity in the Senate. This is a “rules” procedure and may not be subject to the same blocking methods available to disrupt the passage of laws.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wait a second. </p>
<p>1) The numbers used above for the cloture motion are only legitimate AFTER the new Senators are seated. Clearly the acceptance of seating of new members is contingent on standards established in prior situations (i.e. Landrieu). What Reid could do is place Franken up as Senator #1. If the Republicans want to have a cloture motion they would have to undertake it with 2/3rd’s of the sitting (carryover) members, since no “freshman” or carryover incumbents (Coleman, or even Cornyn) have been seated. </p>
<p>In that case the Republicans would have to attain 40% of the 55 sitting Senators (26 votes). The Democrats would have 37 (except for two complications). Sanchez and Clinton still hold their seats (pending resignation), Chambliss and those voted out of office do not hold seats in the new Congress. So the Republicans still have the percentage (40%)  to actually create a filibuster with that stipulation because Obama and Biden have resigned, and their replacements are contingent on the acceptance by the carryover Senators. It looks as if the Republicans would have just enough (even without the Independents) to block accepting Franken.</p>
<p>2) Now lets say Reid places the new (and re-entering) Republican members of the Senate last on the approval list of votes, just after Franken. I think Reid would control the order of the “acceptances” and call a motion on seating Franken at any time.</p>
<p>Would he then be able to include all the new Democratic members in the vote minus the re-elected Republicans. As the votes to allow these new members in they could quickly swear their oath, and then vote. So slowly all the initiates would accumulate the Democratic quorum of seated members until it was 55D-26R (2I). Democrats would then have easily the needed numbers to seat Franken…even without Obama, Biden or their replacements.</p>
<p>Then the Senate could move ahead on seating the re-elected Republicans. The sweet irony of this would be that Cornyn himself would not be allowed to vote as these members are introduced, since he was just re-elected…technically he’s not a “member of the new class”. </p>
<p>Of course, the Republicans could filibuster ANY new member being seated, I suppose. But that would look really nasty and almost like a coup-de-tat. And Cornyn would be on the outside looking in. This would be a “nuclear option” for the Republicans…and remove much of their leadership. Reid could then state that they would have to clear their offices, fire their staffs, and lose their seniority if they had a “disruption of service”.</p>
<p>I suspect that they’d come to their senses pretty quickly.</p>
<p>3) Can one filibuster a non-budget or law activity in the Senate. This is a “rules” procedure and may not be subject to the same blocking methods available to disrupt the passage of laws.</p>
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		<title>By: Teddy Partridge</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778924</link>
		<dc:creator>Teddy Partridge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:19:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778924</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Since when did actions against Democratic governors by Bush-appointed USAttorneys become a certain mark of wrongdoing?  Fitz’s colleagues put Siegelman in prison, forced Spitzer’s resignation, and have allowed the California GOP House delegation to remain free while utterly corrupt.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I wouldn’t be so quick to decry a Democratic governor who has been arrested, but not indicted (”I need more time, please….”) by a Bush USAttorney.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Since when did actions against Democratic governors by Bush-appointed USAttorneys become a certain mark of wrongdoing?  Fitz’s colleagues put Siegelman in prison, forced Spitzer’s resignation, and have allowed the California GOP House delegation to remain free while utterly corrupt.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t be so quick to decry a Democratic governor who has been arrested, but not indicted (”I need more time, please….”) by a Bush USAttorney.</p>
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		<title>By: runfastandwin</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778912</link>
		<dc:creator>runfastandwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:01:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;Make them do a real filibuster, bring in buckets to defecate in, phone books to read from, cots to nap in, and we’ll see how long those decrepit old bastards hold out.  Not more than 48 hours, probably more like 24.  Unfortunately Reid won’t do it, I don’t know why but he just won’t.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Make them do a real filibuster, bring in buckets to defecate in, phone books to read from, cots to nap in, and we’ll see how long those decrepit old bastards hold out.  Not more than 48 hours, probably more like 24.  Unfortunately Reid won’t do it, I don’t know why but he just won’t.</p>
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		<title>By: raven333</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778911</link>
		<dc:creator>raven333</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 20:56:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/cornyn-uses-reids-burris-tactics-to-refuse-seating-franken/#comment-1778911</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I wonder if perhaps Reid doesn’t like Franken.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder if perhaps Reid doesn’t like Franken.</p>
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