In an interview on the Fox News Channel (where else?) George W. Bush set out to lamely defend his legacy on the "Hey, I wasn’t here most of the time Tour":
Bush said he didn’t think he would be viewed as the 21st century’s Herbert Hoover, who was president during the Great Depression. He said he worked to keep the economy from collapsing.
"I’m a free market guy," Bush said. "But I’m not going to let this economy crater in order to preserve the free market system.
On the factual side, Bush is naturally wrong. Hoover didn’t sit on his arse as the economy collapsed, it’s just that he couldn’t conceive of the bigger, bolder ideas that FDR would bring about after he came to office.
Of course, there are other big differences.
– Hoover didn’t lose one war, let alone two.
– Hoover performed great Humanitarian works in the aftermath of both world wars saving millions from starvation and was one of the world’s most popular Americans. Bush tortured people, and bombed and starved millions of them.
– Hoover had only one MacArthur to deal with, Bush had hundreds of pseudo MacArthurs, including himself.
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And for all of that, Hoover lost re-election and Bush got a second term. Doesn’t so much for Americans, or really Democrats.
I don’t get this. Enlightenment, please?
Pseudo-zed for a pseudo-pres-predator, or for a great post there on.
Good morning and a deadline-driven promise to be a-lurking.
MacArthur used underhanded tactics to stop the Bonus Army march on Washington, saying it was to stop the spread of Communism. Hoover was never able to get away from the unpopular move the general made.
Bush has had several of these type of people…Gonzales, Goodling, Libby, Cheney
Bush had hundreds of pseudo MacArthurs, including himself
You know, morons that thought the knew what they were doing.
Underhanded, that’s pretty kind:
Good morning, pups. It’s Collins, Cohen and Kristof today. Ms. Collins, in “Send in the Celebrities” says the mediocrity of New York politics is such that those with reservations about giving the Senate job to Caroline Kennedy often wind up with: “Why pick her when we could have — um …” Mr. Cohen, in “Pan Am Dies, America Lives,” says the cost of saving the auto industry could be a loss of the vitality that has defined the U.S. Mr. Kristof gives us “The Miracle Tax Diet.” He says the new soda tax proposed by Gov. David Paterson of New York is a breakthrough. It could raise $400 million a year but could also help make us healthier.
Here they are.
The coffee, tea and hot chocolate are ready, and I’ve got waffles with Vermont maple syrup. Hoover says it’s his turn to have the keyboard (he particularly likes playing with the F1 key) so I’m going to get another cup of tea. Have a great day.
Wasn’t McArthur the guy who flew back to front? That could explain a lot about Bush’s flight deck appearance!
Worst president ever !
He’s a free market guy alright. He and his cohorts get their money for nothing and their chicks for free while everyone else has to pay up the ying yang. Spit.
you can say that again
Worst president ever ! Dayam !!
Here’s WJ for this morning:
7:00-7:30 NEIL IRWIN
Washington Post
Economics Reporter http://www.washingtonpost.com
Topic: The Federal Reserve on Tuesday cut a key interest rate to the lowest level in history. The reduction in the federal funds rate — the rate paid by banks to other banks for overnight loans – is from 1 percent to a range of 0 to 0.25 percent. The Federal Reserve Board indicated the rate would stay low for some time & said it would consider purchasing mortgage-backed securities and long-term Treasury bonds to help spur the economy. Guest will discuss the Fed’s actions and what impact the steps could have on consumers.
7:30-8:00 Question/Newspaper Articles/Phones
8:00-9:00 JON MEACHAM Uplink Author, “American Lion: Andrew Jackson
in the White House”
Topic: Guest will look at the political career and the Presidential tenure of Andrew Jackson. This is the fifth of our weeklong interview series with authors of new books looking at past presidents.
9:05-9:35 KEVIN BOOK
FBR Capital Markets
Senior Energy Policy Analyst http://www.fbrcapitalmarkets.com
Topic: Yesterday’s announcement by OPEC to slash 2.2 million barrels from its daily production – its single largest cut ever, while bloc outsiders Russia and Azerbaijan announced their own cutbacks of hundreds of thousands of barrels from the market. Guest will discuss the impact this will have on U.S. oil prices, the decline of oil prices so far (crude prices from have fallen from $147 a barrel in July to approximately $44 today), and the cohesiveness of OPEC as an effective and unified organization.
9:35-10:00 Newspaper Articles/Phones
thank you
I keep thinking about Molly Ivins who said it took Texas years to undo all the damage of the Bush years. I’m sickened by what’s going on. Besides everything else, he’s a thief. Pure and simple.
700 billion divided by 300 million = 23000
Thats $23000 for every man woman and child in the United States !
A reminder what the bank bail-out cost each and every one of us,just multiply that 23 thousand by the number of people in your household.
Could your family use that kind of money?
( $92000 for my family !!)
It’s how it’s being used that’s bothering me. And the refusal to tell us where other bailout money went. It’s a raid on the US treasury like this country has never seen before. And everyone is getting ticked by the bonuses etc that are being handed out but no one is stopping it. We’re just sitting and watching as we’re being robbed.
My grandfather, grandmother and father were among those Bonus Marchers. The family had left Columbia, SC to participate in the march to ask that the promised bonus be given early.
Morning all,
And Goldman Sachs, one of the recipients, made over $10 B and paid an effective tax of 1% compared to 34% last year.
how many people are getting these bonuses? would be interesting to know where our $23000 is going. Kinda a reverse Save the Children. We could band together to adopt a a Wall Streeter and help support the lifestyle to which they’ve become accustomed, cut out the middle man and our dollars will take them farther.
Hello, Ms Sukka, this is Brinks, your home is being robbed would you like us to jump up and down.
I’m self-employed earned a very small fraction of that amount and still paid around 34 %!!
I guess my company is too small for a bail-out! WTF!
Amen, sister! And on top of all that, I fully expect to see the group of dimwits in Washington release the other $350B come the new year. :-(
But not before the firms comply with the new rigid documentation requirement: they have to sign a receipt for the dough, unless they don’t want to.
That is the problem – you are not to big to fail and to small to slather the politicos with money.
Imagine what would have happen if they gave this type of money to every citizen? There would be a spending orgy, and probably a lot of debt paid off (to banks) and jobs created by demand for stuff.
The bailout was supposed to unblock credit in the financial sector which “trickles down” to the consumer (real economy)… there’s that concept again…help the top and the let the crumbs drop to the servants waiting around the table. That didn’t even happen! The money seems to have been swallowed up by the rich to settle some debts and party on with Uncle Sam’s dime and permission. The TARP was really a criminal act of sorts, but “legal” because the government did it… printed money and gave it away. What if we all did that… wrote checks on funds we didn’t have?
Obi now wants to (supposedly) flood the real economy with some of the same “new money” to take a shot at trickle up. I say trickle up because he has to sell it to the top so that they are happy and make more. If they don’t end up with oodles they will not play.
I suspect there are more Madoffs who have made off with money and in a few years when the curtain is completely open Oz and the emperor will be revealed in the naked truth. Capitalism ITSELF is a ponzi scheme for the rich to exploit the workers. Within it there are some fair practices but the framework is nothing more than neo fuedalism or novo slavery or re-planatation dressed up a bit replacing the “company store” with the credit card or “home mortgage”.
Obama will be blamed when the final collapse comes in a few years, but so will the rest of the slackers who “lead” (us into this BS).
CNN was talking about AIG this morn. They’re all getting their bonuses there. Nothing has changed. Many will top a million. Some will get much more. And amazingly, that’s the argument they’re using to justify the bonuses….’it’s what they’ve become accustomed to. If we want them to stay in their jobs, they must get paid this money.’
I feel like I’m in the Twilight Zone.
With any luck, the new admin will come up with better policy than what’s in effect now.
That’s if any of the money is left by then!!
Well now they could send you all that moolah but then the banks know for better than you how to spend it to great effect. You would just waste it on “things” whereas the bankers could buy “instruments” and instruments are far far better than just things and if you do believe me you can ask Bernie or Hank or Ben or Chris.
Ya gotta spend the money instead of showing it as profit.
I think it was used to pay off some pissed off investors etc. who essentially “own our ass” and were not happy that their investments were turning to shit. They bought into the screwed up system and “invested” in US bonds and securities. I suspect they threatened to both cash in their chips and stop buying more junk if Uncle same did not make good on their “investments”.
It’s the old meme that we sold america to the highest bidder, but they can’t admit it, of course. They need to keep the kabuki going.
The black out on how the TARP was spent and who got what is stunning. It reveals that this was a heist in broad daylight with all the hard working congress critters in on it.
And BushCo is working overtime to make sure he leaves Obama with so much irreversible Repub policy that it will be nearly impossible to dig out.
Kashkari said that that money was “deferred compensation.” UAW pensions are deferred compensation but since it’s workers instead of capitalists it’s different and it’s okay to wipe out worker’s pensions.
A populace in debt is easy to control !
Who’s gonna complain when they’re too busy working to pay their debts !!
And the big boys conspired and came up with the “credit score” like a branded number everyone has tattooed on their arms (nazis) so they can control the slaves. They made the credit score the most important “thing” we have… and live in fear of. It even is used to “rate your auto insurance” so even if you have a perfect driving record… if you have debt your insurance rate goes up? How is this related to safe driving and “risk” on the road?
we have let the OLIGARCHS completely loot the treasury for 8 years they divided it up amongst themselves like a big pie,but no universal healthcare or education…just wow
..and if we do complain, who’s going to listen? Who’s going to care? UAW is complaining. They’re getting slammed as greedy riff-raff earning $70/hr.
Oh, man, this is not a good way to start the day. Blood pressure rising.
Capitalism as it has been practiced lately is a ponzi scheme, but captitalism itself is not to blame, it is those who choose to whorify it that destroy it. Whoring is always a bad way to go. Those who pretend to support capitalism really don’t. They whorify it and destroy that which should be a good thing. If there were really free markets, without the government grafting contracts to their favored friends, capitalism would really work. Imagine a world without political graft and pull. Imagine a world where those who really have a better horsedrawn carriage…. Imagine if politics were really fair. So don’t blame capitalism, as it is really meant to be, blame the bastards who abuse it and turn it into Corporatism. Seriously, capitalism in some sense is a good thing, it just isn’t as the greedy, miscreant bastards have turned it into.
that cretin and all his pals deserve the MUSSOLLINI and his girlfriends fate
I feel like we’re in quicksand!
On a brighter note…how about those Al Franken votes?
Well folks, time to go do my part in keeping the economy going. ( minus 34% for Uncle Sugar ) !
Catch ya later !!
‘It’s what they’re used to” – what — are these guys a bunch of ‘money addicts’ who will run amok, biting passersby in the neck if they don’t get their fix?
solai -
If you’ve got your BP under control, you might want to check out a four-part set of articles from the Philadelphia Inquirer (via ProPublica) on what has been done in the EPA:
http://www.philly.com/inquirer…..62879.html
(top of page looks blank; scroll down a bit and you will see them)
Morning Swim is upstairs…
I don’t think you understand capitalism or have this notion that competition is good for everyone if it is “fair”. First it never is a level playing field.
Capital always controls and seeks to exploit labor.
The market will favor those with the better hands to play – with or without whoring and cronyism.
I don’t think you understand what I understand. I do think capitalism works if a few don’t try to screw over the many.
This is possible, I think you don’t really understand capitalism. Those who own the capital can fairly share what they earn with those who perform the tasks that create wealth. It is only those with no sense of creativity and reality who say it can be no different. I say it can be different. I say those who own capital equipment today aren’t the same as yesterday. They may think it is so, but the rest of us can make it a different outcome….
“a core requirement of a capitalist society is that a large portion of the population must not possess sources of self-sustainment that would allow them to be independent, and must instead be compelled, in order to survive, to sell their labor for a living wage”
“Capital, according to Marx, is created with the purchase of commodities for the purpose of creating new commodities with an exchange value higher than the sum of the original purchases. For Marx, the use of labor power had itself become a commodity under capitalism; the exchange value of labor power, as reflected in the wage, is less than the value it produces for the capitalist. This difference in values, he argues, constitutes surplus value, which the capitalists extract and accumulate. In his book Capital, Marx argues that the capitalist mode of production is distinguished by how the owners of capital extract this surplus from workers — all prior class societies had extracted surplus labor, but capitalism was new in doing so via the sale-value of produced commodities.[30] In conjuction with his criticism of capitalism was Marx’s belief that exploited labor would be the driving force behind a revolution to a socialist-style economy.[31]
For Marx, this cycle of the extraction of the surplus value by the owners of capital or the bourgeoisie becomes the basis of class struggle. However, this argument is intertwined with Marx’s version of the labor theory of value asserting that labor is the source of all value, and thus of profit. “
“The Austrian economists Ludwig von Mises and Friedrich Hayek were among the leading defenders of market capitalism against 20th century proponents of socialist planned economies. Mises and Hayek argued that only market capitalism could manage a complex, modern economy. Since a modern economy produces such a large array of distinct goods and services, and consists of such a large array of consumers and enterprises, asserted Mises and Hayek, the information problems facing any other form of economic organization other than market capitalism would exceed its capacity to handle information. Thinkers within Supply-side economics built on the work of the Austrian School, and particular emphasize Say’s Law: “supply creates its own demand.” Capitalism, to this school, is defined by lack of state restraint on the decisions of producers.
Austrian economics has been a major influence on the ideology of libertarianism, which considers laissez-faire capitalism to be the ideal economic system.”
“One example of this is his article in the September 1970 issue of The New York Times Magazine, where he claims that the social responsibility of business is “to use its resources and engage in activities designed to increase its profits…(through) open and free competition without deception or fraud.” This is tantamount to Smith’s argument that self interest in turn benefits the whole of society.[41] Work like this helped lay the foundations for the coming remarketization of capitalism and the supply-side economics of Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher.”
“In the late 19th century, the control and direction of large areas of industry came into the hands of financiers. This period has been defined as “finance capitalism,” characterized by the subordination of processes of production to the accumulation of money profits in a financial system.[13] Major characteristics of capitalism in this period included the establishment of large industrial cartels or monopolies; the ownership and management of industry by financiers divorced from the production process; and the development of a complex system of banking, an equity market, and corporate holdings of capital through stock ownership.[13] Increasingly, large industries and land became the subject of profit and loss by financial speculators.
Late 19th and early 20th century capitalism has also been described as an era of “monopoly capitalism,” marked by movement from laissez-faire ideology and government policies to the concentration of capital into large monopolistic or oligopolistic holdings by banks and financiers, and characterized by the growth of large corporations and a division of labor separating shareholders, owners, managers, and actual laborers.[65] Although the concept of monopoly capitalism originated among Marxist theorists,[66] non-Marxist economic historians have also commented on the rise of monopolies and trusts in the period. Murray Rothbard, asserting that the large cartels of the late 19th century could not arise on the free market, argued that the “state monopoly capitalism” of the period was the result of interventionist policies adopted by governments, such as tariffs, quotas, licenses, and partnership between state and big business.[67]”
“After the abandonment of the Bretton Woods system and the strict state control of foreign exchange rates, the total value of transactions in foreign exchange was estimated to be at least twenty times greater than that of all foreign movements of goods and services (EB). The internationalization of finance, which some see as beyond the reach of state control, combined with the growing ease with which large corporations have been able to relocate their operations to low-wage states, has posed the question of the ‘eclipse’ of state sovereignty, arising from the growing ‘globalization’ of capital.[75]”
What is the source you’re quoting? His/her review of Capital Vol 1 is correct. The concept of class struggle is introduced in volume 1 and is expanded in volumes 2 and 3.
Just because certain people abused they system and certain people allowed them to get away with it, doesn’t mean the system doesn’t work.
Sophie, the “system” is fatally flawed. Can it work? Does a car run with one cylinder mis firing? The system has worked – but not for workers! It works for capital! So yes, the system can work.
Please tell me how capitalitalism “works” for workers? for the disabled who can’t “work”? For the old who can’t work?
Capitalism is a system to extract profit – “value added” from the labor of workers. THAT IS WHAT CAPITALISM IS. Are workers paid for their work? Yes, but they are exploited and do not share in the fruits of their labor – that goes to CAPITAL – the owners and shareholders. THAT is capitalism. Sure it works! But for who?
In order to work for the benefit of all, capitalism needs very specific state regulation otherwise it will just be another method of exploiting people. One of the most familiar ploys to impede regulation is the concept of the “invisible hand of the market.” That’s the philosophy that led to our current financial disaster. The invisible hand meme is that one person’s self interest will lead to benefiting others. It’s the central idea behind Ronnie Raygun’s supply side, trickle down economic policies.
Capitalism is simply a means of creating and enforcing hierarchy. The real issue is why we want hierarchy and make no mistake, we do. It may stem from our dependence as children, a seeking of parent figures, but however you read our psychology we have a dearth of self assertion and we expect our “leader” will save our collective asses.
Take the comments on this thread. The theft of public funds is mind boggling even to a somewhat cynical mind, but the question is are we helpless? Is there anything that can be done? I’ve asked this now and then, but no one wants to go there. The choice is simple. We can try to do it ourselves or we can bitch when our annointed representatives do it for us.
I always wonder why “what is capitalism” is never discussed and it seems to be assumed that this is the best system, because it’s our system.
People mistakenly link capitalism with democracy and there is no connection what so ever. In fact, democracy is a neato distraction for the capitalists who go about their business of aggregating wealth will the people vote for leaders who wink at nod at capitalism and cite GDP stats as prof that everything is fine and dandy.
This system has given us the military industrial complex, the heath care industrial complex, the insurance industrial complex, the media industrial complex… All of them are opressing workers and denying them the basic needs for the pursuit of their well being.
We had three legacy guys, Gore, Kerry and Bush. Not much to play with.
I’m say who has the right to determine that the system works only in that way? Who is to say that instead of being to the benefit of some, it cannot be to the benifit of many?
There are examples of businesses in America that treat their employees well. Why cannot this be the norm, not the exception?
I suggest you try to answer your question.
The Visigoths and the Vandals nor the Mongols couldn’t have done a better job of raping, pillaging and looting this country and Iraq.
We have been SACKED.
Well, I’d like to go there, but my congresspeople have benefited so mightily and been so complicit, I don’t really know how. Go up to Washington with pitchforks and torches?
What do you suggest?
As I saw it, practically everyone in this country; right, left and center, up and down, were screaming for congress NOT to give Paulson the $$$ and they did it anyway. Now some folks are saying that “Yes there was a crisis, but not of the magnitude Paulson and BushCO said.” In other words, they lied to US again. Surprise, surprise.
So much for “representative government”
Let me tell you a little story. My neocon brother ran a small insurance agency ( no comment)He and his partners decided to sell it summer b4 last. An economic hit man for a larger insurance company came in and told them the company was worthless because they were too good to their employees (who helped them build the company.
So, my brother ( it was the hardest thing he ever had to do!) went around and asked all his employees if they’d rather lose their bennies than their jobs. Most stayed on, losing their health care plans, pensions and whatever else.
Moral of the story? Work for somebody in this day and age, you’re screwed.
They are playing Monopoly with our $$$$
The blackout on who received the TARP and what they did with it caused me to think deeply about the Why.
And it’s not just the TARP money, the total is up about $2 Trillion now.
What about the Carlyle Group? One of their subsidiaries is a merchants’ bank. And does Paulson’s latest panic relate to Goldman Sachs posting a big loss (this quarter or last, forget which).
Where are Paulson’s millions invested? The Bush Dynasty’s millions?
I understand your disappointment and anger. What I am saying is that is doesn’t have to be that way. I know I wouldn’t screw over my employees. Why does anyone else have to? You can choose to. You can say you didn’t have a choice, but is this the truth really?
Sophie – excellent question and the question leads to the next step which is regulating capitalism – child labor laws, 5 day work week, etc. Repubs scream this is the road to socialism but if you think about thesis-antithesis-synthesis, from robber barons vs communism, the pendulum settles for regulated capitalism. It’s just that the regulations were stripped off and we went back to robber baronism.
We must use the internet to motivate nationwide action-nothing necessarily criminal. We can do things like not going to the movies up to a general strike, anything to show the powers that be that we the people are organized and are not afraid to act. I do not know how to have a conversation amongst millions of people, but as a can do American, I believe it can be done. Maybe something computer moderated with repititous posts eliminated. Most issues don’t have all that many facets. I wish someone with computer savy would think about it.