Last night, I spoke with Anthony Romero of ACLU, who spent the day in Gitmo observing proceedings. When asked whether the incoming Obama administration will finally close Gitmo, the answer is no one knows for certain — but public pressure is essential to making it happen.
Watch as former Gitmo prosecutors, in this new documentary from ACLU and Brave New Films speak plainly about inherent flaws in a tribunal system adverse to rule of law fairness.
There are open questions on whether guilty pleas can be accepted from some pro se defendants — especially those previously subjected to torture, and if plea acceptance could mean potential death penalty sentence due to mental competency concerns. So do trial proceedings go forward — or not?
There is a political undercurrent as well.
How much is kabuki from the Bush Administration to rush closure to protect secrets and legacies? What about the concomitant rush toward martyrdom by high profile detainees, milking Bush failures for worldwide PR value before things are potentially change under a new administration?
Imagine if we had begun this entire enterprise respecting the rule of law, using existing mechanisms which worked well for prior military courts and terrorism prosecutions. There would be no PR splash, and the US would not have to rebuild a tattered legacy on human rights and justice. But here we are.
The BBC had a recent interview with Col. Vandeveld — the prosecutor who resigned because of disagreements over trial fairness and conduct. He had this to say to his hometown paper earlier this year:
"…what I found, and what I still find, is that discovery in even the simplest of cases is incomplete or unreliable."…the deficiencies at Guantanamo have hurt the standing of the United States.
"The result has been a denial of due process, and the derogation of America across the world," he said.
"There is no question that many of the detainees are unrepentant terrorists, some mass murderers, but the quality of justice cannot differ simply because of the gravity of the crime.
So, what has the Bush Administration done to rectify this after recent SCOTUS smackdowns? There are now attorneys assigned to various defendants, but still substantial problems with translators, with counsel/client relations, with serious due process issues from withheld exculpatory material, and with rushed proceedings and a heavy-handed push to finish things before Bush leaves office. Nice shiny windowdressing, but it’s hell in the trenches.
Nothing like a little Potemkin justice for legacy’s sake.
There is a January 4th deadline for motions filings on competency exams. Depending on those and related rulings, trial or plea and sentencing proceedings may go forward from there. Conceivably, sentencing of several of these defendants could be underway before Obama ever takes the oath of office. Is this an effort to tie Obama’s hands?
None of this resolves the conundrum of 60 or so innocents still being held seven years later — who have been cleared of all charges but cannot be returned to home nations refusing to take them or threatening harm if they return.
Don’t we owe the wrongfully imprisoned something better than a tiny cell in purgatory? Especially those found to have been entirely innocent – a number of whom we simply bought through a bounty system?
Why is any of this important?
Because the Bush Administration is stage managing proceedings, even now, so that the worst of American conduct never sees the light of public scrutiny. No matter what sort of filth Khalid Sheik Mohammed may be: Is he more odious than Hermann Goering or Ernst Kaltenbrunner, both of whom were convicted in public trials in Nuremberg? Are we somehow less competent than we were after the 1993 bombings of the Twin Towers, wherein we convicted terrorists involved in US courts?
Why do we seem so small and weak compared to giants like Robert Jackson?
Obama enters office with a clean slate, having promised to close Gitmo. This is a huge moral advantage, pledging to work toward upholding the rule of law and justice.
Riddle me this: what rationale does the right have in trying to force Obama into a defensive crouch on this?
Is it (a) dividing him from his allies up front — both on the left and around the world — so that he’s on the defensive instead of moving things forward from a strong stance? (b) deflating his moral and ethical strengths, attempting to weaken him before he begins? (c) performing CYA, so that their own role in misdeeds never gets revealed publicly? or (d) all of the above and about twenty more things I haven’t thought of yet?
I’m puzzled by what folks like Jack Goldsmith and Benjamin Wittes are trying to do with their "it’s going to be too hard" barrage. But it’s too close to yesterday’s Reuters blip to be a coincidence. Someone’s making a big effort to squelch reforms as stillborn in the Beltway village. If I were Obama, I’d be asking myself who and why…and whose rear ends they may really be trying to cover.
On a day when the Second Circuit will rehear the Mahar Arar case? Isn’t it time we started asking all of the questions?
(YouTube — Turley on Maddow’s show talking Gitmo and the rule of law)


18 Comments












Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
ZED!
The BBC had a recent interview with Col. Vandeveld
Well worth a watch, imo.
Hey Pups When ya get here Digg this post for the Lake!
Thanks for this, Christy. Unfortunately, the pressure on this isn’t just from the right. Silvestre Reyes today called for Obama to keep Hayden and McConnell in office.
Just distgusting.
Stern up top, but will probably kick this back to the top in a bit.
How the hell can we keep up with the top post coming 3 minutes apart?
But shouldn’t complain I guess busy NEWS day/evening, a shit load of crap happening all at once!
I watched some of the Arar stuff yesterday. The q&a wasn’t as clear-cut as a SCOTUS case. The defense counsel seemed confusing because he couldn’t present an abc line of logic with the barrage of questions coming from many different angles. It took Sotomayer to cut through a lot of the garbage and get down to one or two brass tacks. Then the counsel sounded better focused on those.
In a normal case of a warrant the court is involved.
In Arar they specifically avoided court involvement.
INA rendition shouldn’t involve sending someone to be tortured.
Regardless of what’s legal elsewhere we don’t allow it.
Lying about where the held person actually is or where they’re being
sent has to be some kind of misbehavior.
Refusing counsel to a held person in a reasonable time (meaning, before they’re killed, tortured, sent away, etc.) has to be criminal.
Refusing a held person’s choice to return to their home country of residence is very likely probably misbehavior.
Clearly, the Bush people wanted to avoid the courts so George could play Dictator During a Time of War. But, Arar wasn’t captured by soldiers on a field of battle and they knew that and went to extremes to avoid normal civilian procedures.
The judges were sharp enough to get these points and they’re going to review any any information which might complicate a judgment. But, I don’t see any Constitutional power to the Executive Branch which changes things.
Interestingly it didn’t appear to me to be a case of whether the government can simply pick someone up anywhere and render them for torture. It was, after all, someone who came through an American airport and (immigration law seems to need fixing since) it appears that counts as ‘being in America’ or ‘coming to America’.
It’s one more nail in the Bush Legacy coffin.
Christy,
Have we at last become a nation that is governed by people(?) who have no shame,no sense of human dignity?
Who the in the hell are we?
The psychological testing of human endurance limitations in gitmo is exactly what was done in the German concentration camps. Any wonder he broke? At what point would we chose death?
Did we at one time really strive for truth and Justice or is that just wishful thinking?
( the Video at the top says it’s been removed on my screen)
Peace please.
Sadly, it’s all crap too…! The news, not the posts… Just to clarify…! ;-)
I agree with ya CT all this crap is just pissing me off! The Repukes are truly trying to fuck things so badly that Obama will have hell to pay to get anything right never mind FIXED!
Cheney fucked this gitmo thing up so badly that it’s beyond repair…by breaking the law by holding these people in the first place, by not charging them, by torturing them, he has created a nightmare. They can’t be tried justly because the evidence against them was obtained through illegal torture- they can’t be released because they would create a perfect storm by spreading their stories throughout the world…leading to more terrorist activity against the USofA.
Now Obama inherits the mess….no good options out there.
Great post CHS. Keep it up!
Goldsmith is one of those guys who tries to have it both ways. He was horrified by about 10% of the Constitutional excesses committed under Bush but OK with the rest. Wittes is a second rate enabler.
Christy, you’re a really good teacher. Thanks.
OK, I just read the Goldsmith-Wittes article and that has got to be one of the biggest piles of steaming horseshit I have read in a while. What gets me is their concluding sentence:
I agree but in fact their article is essentially about doing exactly that either by keeping many facets of Guantanamo here or offshoring future detainees to places like Afghanistan.
I also like the line:
Where have these asshats been anytime the last 7 years?
And some of their points are just weird:
Excuse me!? A fair trial is a “complication”. And shades of Hartmann, all they seem interested in are convictions, not rule of law, not judicial process. Not surprisingly they see the prospect of acquittals and short sentences as another problem. It never occurs to them that if the government has a piss poor case maybe that’s the government’s fault and the government’s burden. No, it all about how to get around such inconveniences.
It is really shocking that these guys are lawyers because they don’t seem to have even the vaguest idea of what the law is about. Can you be disbarred for sheer stupidity?
Hugh, the list of disbarred lawyers would be as long as ET’s version of your list!*g*
Deep into epu land
7 – Not only the items you mentioned, but the facts of the case are that we didn’t even ship Arar directly to Syria – we shipped to Jordan. There was truly no basis in law for shipping Arar, a Canadian citizen (who also was a refugee from Syria with Syrian citizenship) to Jordan. We then had Jordan get in the act with the handoff to Syrian torture, and the guts of the attainder and torture conspiracy is the Syrian torture (as well as the mistreatment here in the states before the handoff – including “disappearing” Arar) but the cleanly and clearly illegal behavior that is factually admitted all around, is that we shipped a Canadian citizen with no tie to Jordan (and no Jordanian warrants outstanding against him) to Jordan. Why?
Why do something so clearly illegal, except as a part of a torture conspiracy step to make sure you could deliver him into Syrian hands?
Larry Thompson, who signed off on the torture shipment paperwork, was just back from his participation (with Goldsmith) in the GITMO torture field trip when he signed off on the Arar handling. James Comey, when he replaced Thompson, fell all over himself filing a state secrets affidavit to protect Ashcroft and Thompson in this case. He has never attempted to correct the record with the court as to whether or not state secrets allegations were made to improperly deflect legal proceedings against torture co-conspirators vs. to defend national security.
CHS – I can help a little with your “riddle me this” and puzzlement. Any en masse move of GITMO detainees to the US is going to involve some that the US still has not been able to bleedback into other countries and obscurity. Your concern as someone who was not involved in authorizing or detaining or abusing those who were innocent, yet held in abuse for years, is to get them out of that abusive detention setting and restore freedom.
BUT, if you and your friends had been direcly involved in what happened with this men and children you’d have some fast answers to the riddles and puzzlement. Under the Geneva Conventions, any shipment of “protected persons” out of country is a severe breach and a war crime. Once the victims of those war crimes are on US soil, with a US court determining that they were never enemy combatants at all – well, that kind of ruling is a de facto ruling that they were protected persons. If they aren’t pows or illegal enemy combatants, there aren’t many other options.
So what do you do at that point? It’s really a question now, for that matter. The rulings on the Uighurs and even by Leon re: the Algerians has already brought some of this to a head. Why did Leon nudge gov so hard on not appealing? Why has gov fought so hard not to let the Uighurs be brought onto US soil to appear before the Judge in their case?
Bc you would then have victims of US war crimes on US soil with the architects of their crimes also on US soil. And a US court ruling that the detainees were not and never had been “combatants” opens up the door to – what do you do, now, about the war crimes? No matter how much evidence is destroyed now and no matter how many lies are told and no matter how much cover up you have on the torture front itself – the existence of these non-combatants at GITMO (and now on US soil) would speak for itself to make the prima facie case on the illegal shipment out of country, something that the Conventions themselves internally recognize as not just a breach, but a grave one.
So for all the kabuki about how dangerous it might be to have terrorists in the US, or how we “need” to be able to use tribunals and the yada yada in Goldmsith’s yammering, the heart of the issue is that we bring the victims of US war crimes onto US soil, with the perpetrators of those crimes also on US soil, and a US war crimes act that makes severe breaches of the Geneva Conventions a domestic crime.
I’m sure the torture victims act concerns are there as well, but they probably feel safer on that front. After all, el-Masri’s suit has been kicked out and there has been a long long time now for documents to get destroyed, stories to get straight, and, quite frankly, victims to be mentally corrupted with the assistance of psychologists and drugs and isolation. But while you might have an evidentiary mess on torture, you don’t on shipment.
Goldsmith, btw, was author of the draft memo that allowed for protected persons in Iraq to be shipped out of country for “enhanced interrogation” efforts. For all Yoo’s deficiecies – even his memos never claimed that all his machinations could be enacted and effected upon protected persons – only on “illegal enemy combatants” Goldsmith(and Philbin, Thompson and Comey) pushed hard for Haynes (who will feature prominently in any war crimes act trials) to be put on the 4th Circuit. He (along with Thompson) was a part of the torture field trip to GITMO.
He may have withdrawn the Bybee memo, but he never issued an opposing memo – he had knowledge that had to have included, at some point, knowledge that the CIA’s analyst who went to GITMO in 2002 to see why the intel wasn’t better discovered – and NOTIFIED THE WHITE HOUSE IN 2002 – that an absolute minimum of 1/3 of the detainees at GITMO not only where not active members of al-Qaeda, nor where they active members of the Taliban, nore did they have ties to either al-Qaeda or the Taliban -but they didn’t even have ANY mujahadeen ties at all.
So not only do you have the war crime of shipment of protected persons, despite any “good faith” claims you might try to cook up for the WH, there have been 6 years of “actual knowledge” of that war crime. And because of the release of names and identities, required by the court but even so withheld until released by a whistleblower, there can be some degree of tracking and identification of victims, even if they are not brought to the US. But if they aren’t brought to the US, physically, the crimes against them aren’t likely to ever make it to a US court.
If you go back and look at the kinds of statements Goldsmith has made, as well as questioning by Graham during the Alito hearings and statements after, and you look at the deliberate attempt in the MCA to make the CSRT determinations of “illegal enemy combatant” determinative and not subject to judicial review, it is very clear, over and over, that the concern about brining GITMO detainees to the US is largely a concern of CYA for war crimes against protected persons.
We do also have the huge and overwhelming issues of what to do about all the torture and depravity and in particular what to do with that torture as it involved not only “real” terrorists like KSM, but the torture and abuse of the children of such “real” terrorists as well. And those are some complex issues – and we are likely not going to be happy with the pro-torture decisions that end up being generated by courts here who will not allow such “real” terrorists to walk and who will not allow any consequences to be visited upon their torturers.
We have already had that, when Padilla was filtered selectively into the criminal court system, with the forum shopping ending up with FLA. Remember all those brave – ishatleast words supposedly by DOJ *leaders* like Comey and FBI officers that you could “never” try in a regular court Bush torture victims? Umm, not so much, eh?
What Comey and Goldmsith helped to oversee was a Criminal Justice system that has no problem whatsoever with taking torture victims and deep sixing their torture, ignoring the mental states effects of that torture and how it impacts the ability to participate in defense (with lawyers appointed by the torturing government) Padilla isn’t the only case – go look at what has been happening in courts from FLA to CA to IL to NY and how torture is creeping into the courts, or torture victims are offered up to the system wtihout any judicial concern or interest or restrictions resulting from that torture.
We have to do something about GITMO, but it won’t be pretty, what we end up doing with torture once the cases hit these shores. OTOH, it has already been very ugly. The same Bush DOJ that all, thousands and thousands, sat silent during the Gonzales hearings and Abu Ghraib revelations, as DOJ solicitied and sponsored torture was exposed – that DOJ also has a legacy now of dragging torture into the courts.
What that does to this country is irrevocable, not matter what Obama tries to offer up as salve and solace.
Thanks, Mary: The role of Jordan in the Arar case has always given me pause and changed my view of Jordan (merely neocon lapdog rather than ancient benevolent monarchy). Jordanian thugs performed the handover.
What a mess: clearly this is going to unravel one way or another and in a big way.
Potemkin Justice indeed.
I don’t see how Obama’s clarity and logical approach has many choices at all. I keep hearing him from the future saying: ”the crimes we now know of are a matter of fact not opinion and our justice system must follow the course set by the rule of law.”
I heard Suskind last night on the CBC talking about his new book. He said many (most?) of the evidence files at Gitmo contain no more than scraps of pocket litter. All this time and that’s what we find. It’s beyond shocking. It’s always worse than we thought would be the worst case. I keep hearing myself saying: ”we knew that, we said that, but we were ridiculed.”
I see Maher Arar from time to time in the neighbourhood here; even his brother is still on the U.S. watch list. Arar says he cannot imagine ever travelling in the U.S. again. No bloody wonder. I am a U.S. citizen and I am afraid.