My contempt for Joe Lieberman knows . . . oh never mind.

Glad we cleared that up.
Now – in the spirit of bipartisanship – will Obama tab Alfredo Gonzalez as the Attorney General again?

Just a thought.

Played for chumps once again. They like the money, passion and intellect when running for office but once in it’s a tip of the hat and a so long suckers!

Was also wondering how post partisan Obama could utilize Gonzalez. After all he has experience and has proven himself a real team player. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

That’s OK. I am not going to worry since the Senate obviously doesn’t take Home Land Security very seriously.

And what the dems be saying six months from now when Holy Joe is finally holding hearings in his committee, investigating Obama people for firing DHS & DOJ people planted by the bushies? Dammit, dems, we gave you the White House & both houses of Congress, could you possibly be persuaded to use it for the good of ‘we the people’ or will you prove for all time that you only serve the same corporate masters as your ‘opposition’?

Turn the page.
On to the next round, we are not done with that weasel yet.
I do believe that some Democratic leaders need a reminder of who they work for.
Keep weeding out the worthless turncoat bastards one at a time every chance we get.

Obama will fight like hell to insure that the “people” are able to maintain a second world standard of living and that the elites are able to maintain their power, priviledge, and perfidiousness.

…except as a source of pork.

Thanks Jane.

digg

It took eight years to get rid of Bush, Joe has four left.

“No matter what Joe Lieberman does, the people who are protecting him hate you much more than they hate him”.

The Aristocracy has spoken, huh? Pathetic. Se if the DSCC ever gets another dime from me.

As the mainstream media and pols (perhaps up to POTUS) would have it there is no power. Taken for granted.

I know this is not the case, but having that message means there is some lack of power and they are looking to take more.

Gawd, I wish people would look at the ideas and get over the lables.

Good luck to all those pushing “we are a center-right country”. Not gonna look so good when things get even worse and good ideas on the left were rejected and fought just because.

For me this isn’t just about Lieberman being a corrupt sleaze and liar; it’s about that darn oversight. So now what do we do to break up this little protection incumbency racket? Primary? I’d love to see Harry Reid challenged.

“This is about telling you that you mean nothing. That democracy is a nice word, but it should never threaten the entitlement of the most exclusive club in the world.”

Well this is it, I thought we already knew that only we are the kind of people that work hard in any case.

The joy I felt Nov. 5th is fading fast.
In anticipation:
http://www.facebook.com/photo……=668841693

The Dept. of Homeland security is just bad news. Child abuse? No problem I guess for the Senate.

I didn’t give to the DSCC or the DCCC this go round, since they are still in the incumbant protection racket.

And protesters are not taken seriously at all – but they still get their heads beaten in.

So we are up to two whammies there. Hold up a sign and get beat up, if you are in the Senate organize a terrorist strategy against the opponent (on your side) and its still OK.

That is why Dodd et al, all LIEberman enablers should have primary challengers, even if they still win, at least make them spend money and be embarrassed by us so called losers.
Dodd has been lying his ass off since he didn’t filibuster FISA…he is just as bad as LIEberman these days.

I’ll put that in the suggestion box.

So now what do we do to break up this little protection incumbency racket? Primary?

Speaking of which, any word on Accountability Now?

Palin/Lieberman in 2012!

I just got off the phone with Evan Bayh’s office. I asked if they could confirm that Lieberman was retaining the chair of the Senate Committee on da Fatherland and Government Affairs. They told me that they could not confirm it, they had not heard.

I told them FDL has confirmed it and I trust FDL. I then told them I was going to contribute to someone, as yet unnamed, who was running against Bayh in the 2010 Democratic Primary in Indiana.

Yes, I mostly gave to ActBlue candidates. But I did chip into the DSCC a couple times this cycle. Not anymore if Droopy keeps his DHS chair. I will not give to an organization that rewards people for ineptness and dis-loyalty.

Doesn’t it seem clear that WE, those of us with ideas and hopes for the future, need to really be GOVERNING ourselves at a local level. We need to push all of this into our State Houses and up into our Governors. Isn’t this just the reality speaking loudly now…Joe Lieberman means nothing–he is a fact of our current governance. Let’s make him irrelevant by focusing on the states. Let’s have “firedoglakes” for every state.

I guess the wonk in the clip downstairs said it all to Huffington: Competency isn’t an issue for a senate committee chair.

joe is a powerful little weasel ain’t he?

There’s one good thing about the vote finally being held – HoJo will disappear into the background (we hope) and we won’t have to see pictures of him or hear his voice. He’s certainly not going to be holding hearings on Katrina.

Jane is dead on. This reminds me of the Catholic Church pedophile scandal. While it can be argued that the pedophile priests are sick and need help (Lieberman in my analogy), no one can defend the actions of the Church hierarchy (in this case the Democratic “leadership” in the Senate) in sheltering and making excuses for the perpetrators of heinous actions.

On topic:

Obama Advisers: Torture Prosecutions Not Likely

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..44540.html

Frank just bitch-slapped Paulson. Not that it’ll do any good, but it was fun to watch.

On that morning swim video the guy said that if competence was means for removal the senate would be in big trouble. Mean while its the rest of the country who is in big trouble.

They have only raised the minimum wage once in like ten years and in that time, how many times have they given themselves raises?? The worst piece of crap I have seen, that was a direct factor in the Big three asking for billions in help now, is that law that made american mpg standards to be 30 mpg in 2020. 20 freakin 20! Some one needs to tell these guys in detroit, “hey ford, start makin a car that does not fall apart after 90 thousand miles, and all three of you start making cars with 30 mpg by 2010!” By 2020 they should be up to 40 mpg and well on their way to alternative fuels. the whole lot of them are letting us down.

Good idea. The fed level still affects the state and local level. Incompetency at the fed level can still be a bitch: re: handling of Katrina.

The end of the Cilizza article says;

“That’s one way to look at it. The other is that the left would be up in arms and far less willing to go along and get along with President-elect Barack Obama’s agenda — particularly if it doesn’t contain the appropriate progressive tilt.

These are the problems of power, the same problems that Republican experienced following the 2000 election. The GOP’s inability to make peace between its warring ideological factions led to its decline in 2006 and fall in 2008. Can Democrats avoid the same fate?”

If the Dems continue this way they WILL suffer the same fate. The amount of people who are pissed is more than they realize, and when the Dems need the netroots to have their backs, they won’t be there, next time.

Reddit this post too!

Quite right Jane. The Honeymoon is OVAH! Before it started.

But make no mistake, their hatred is based on our power. The phenomenal work FireDogLake did on the Irving Libby trial, in the face of the deliberate “indifference” of the MSM scared the living shit out of them.

On the LBGT fron this past weekend’s massive demos testify to the absolute uselessness of the money-grubbing HRC and NLGTF.

Stay tuned. This is going to be fun.

Lieberman as chair of Homeland Security Committee. Bob Gates returning as SecDef. Feel safer already.

Hope Alan Greenspan is a part of Obama’s Economic Team. That would be the trifecta.

That pissed me off enough to comment over there.

Less willing to go along with President-elect Obama? Where’d that come from? He’s not even voting.

No, the netroots will not come unglued. We will become more glued together. We will simply primary-out the losers like we did Lieberman. (Talk to the voters in Connecticut about whether they wished they’d listened to the netroots.) Why do you suppose they’re having a secret ballot?

Barbara Boxer, I’m looking at you. When you don’t respond to emails like you normally do, you’re looking mighty guilty.

Kabuki theater at it’s finest. Posturing, blustering and grandstanding are prerequisites for Dems in Congress.

1,830 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…

Citizen Hamsher and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:

I capitulate, Sister Jane…this inability to get what he wants in positioning the Senate is the fatal mistake of Obama’s administration and he hasn’t even fuckin’ started yet!! Not only did Likuderman need to go but so does Harry Reid…I wonder if that’s what’s in the cards, Obama gets bitch slapped by Likuderman and then quietly euthanizes Reid as leader…I think there is gunna be an internal battle royal over Senate leadership now and if Durbin wins and Fiengold or maybe Boxer get elivated, then maybe the lines have been drwn…but what the fuck is up with Dodd, he can’t be serious about 2012 or can he?

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE FUXCKIN AMMO…TIME TA MAKE WAR ON THE DEMOCRATS!

Then perhaps we should take matters into our own hands. No one on Earth is that clean. Lieberman’s got something in some closet that can come out and bite him in the ass.

Someone knows something.

If you haven’t read Greenwald on a Rahm Emmanuel acedote, it’s a must. Positively jaw-dropping. (Bottom line: pissing off your base is a good thing.)
http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html

When can we drop the “Homeland” and use the original, “Fatherland?”

Actually I think FDL is making progress in this area. I got an email from FDL yesterday asking me to contact the Senator from Wisconsin, who is on the f*cked-up Democratic steering committee. FDL knows what state I am from.

Jane and Christy have always talked about the importance of being active in local government and state races. Here in Milwaukee County we have a neocon County Executive, who cut the staff of the department who administers food stamps. People here can’t get food stamps. Victims are suing him and the state just tried to pressure him by taking away a $2.3 million dollar job training grant.

I stopped giving to the DSCC, DCCC, and the DNC more than two years ago — and only give directly to those candidates I support. I don’t want power brokers deciding where my contributions should go.

Ding!

But I gather that they do hate Lieberman, but just not has much as they hate us. No wonder they’re all craggy-faced gits.

And the answer for why he is powerful is simple.

The left has been foiled again. They can rant and rage but they still do not put the fear into folks to actually change their votes. Their influence would be in question.”

Total bull. Just another form of the fear card to instill apathy. Total bull, We are influence. Check out the election.

I love when something starts out “one Senate aide.” That means,”..bull, bull and more bull.” will follow in the anonymous comment.

this atrocious decision, to keep the Lie, is directly attributable to Obama. Had he not stepped up with hugs and flowers, we might be shed of the sniveling traitor.
I’m wanting to back my new president, i voted for him and celebrated his win, but he did this. And the choice of pulling the Clinton’s into the inner circle has me more than concerned as well.
I have to trust Obama now. But I’m sure seeing a whole lot of “same ol, same ol’” instead of anything resembling “change”.
I kind of figured the honeymoon would be over quickly, but I thought he’d at least have taken office first!

to paraphrase jane: i guess they hate accountability too.

Kanjorski’s up. Was he reelected?

Done. Thanks for the reminder.

Nothing like a slap in the face firs thing in the am.

Its all going to be OK right?

Trial ballon for LIEberman, next up do nothing about Bush:

Administration Moves to Protect Key Appointees
Political Positions Shifted To Career Civil Service Jobs

http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews

Or HuffPo title:
Bush “Burrowing” Political Appointees In Career Civil Service Jobs

At least the Vichy French could blame their gutlessness on the carnage and horrors they had endured at the Battle of the Marne.
Our Vichy Democrats have no excuse for this surrender.

Hey, see this for what it is…dysfunctional, divide and conquer. This has to be from a Rep or Lieb’s office as a tactic to divide and conquer. DON’T fall for it.

The Reps are scared sh–less by the national election and will do anything for Dem demise. As is Liebliarman.

and with the blanket pardons coming at least some of them won’t have to worry about torture.

I don’t get it.

Obama said he wanted LIEman to retain – thats bigger than a vote.

one Senate Democratic aide said bluntly

He said it “bluntly” but this f*****r won’t say it openly or identify him or herself in any fashion. Bravery in action.

Lovely sentiment, but this encapsulates all that is wrong with Washington; how, among other things, we ended up with Kerry being the nominee in 2004, a guy who after all voted FOR the Iraq war, the FISA bill and the no accountability bail out.

It is why we cannot rest even though we at least don’t have a President McCain.

DHS=Department of Homeland Stasi

Kabuki theater at it’s finest. Posturing, blustering and grandstanding are prerequisites for Dems in Congress.

i expect i could have picked any number of issues, but for me, watching the FISA kabuki for a year was a major lesson is what the dem leadership of 110th congress care about. and it’s not us, our constitutional rights or even our right to some say in how we are governed. we are to be manipulated and lied to – not listened to. :(

They fear us enough to keep their vote secret.

Yep.

“The more things change the more they remain the same.”
This is revolting.

Think Progress:

“After talking with many of my colleagues, it’s clear there are sufficient votes to pass the resolution regarding Senator Stevens,” DeMint said in a statement released shortly after the 9:30 conference meeting began. But the GOP delayed the vote on Stevens today, pending the resolution of the Alaska recount.

Joe Lie must really be dishing out those DHS funds.

Thanks. I had googled it in the interim.

If pissing off your base is a good thing the we have to stay pissed off – otherwise they will just move further right in an effort to provoke us.

Yes, NONE of this is truly surprising and we do ourselves no good by wasting energy in despair.

We shall, all of us, be ‘working’ at ‘change’ ’til we drop in our traces …

anyone think joe might have been given some nsa information from cheney?

So that we can keep an eye on him and look into everything he does with a scalpel and spotlight, until he states he is needing a break from the committee responsibility.

We can do that.

The same goes for me.

I wish Senator (I say I fight for you, Maryland) Barb would go off and retire and we get someone half way decent, but I am not holding out hope. This lady fought against an Interstate going through a park in Baltimore in the early 70s and has been using that accomplishment to vote for the bailout and FISA, while clapping for Bush when he said in the SOTU that we need more eavesdropping tools.

And after the war the free French dealt with many of the Vichy collaborators with blindfolds and one last cigarette.

He does not need Cheney. He has access to better lines of communication…

Paulson: Broad definition of financial institution, broad power to disperse money, but no auto companies, prime goal is to stabilize the house of cards of the financial markets and my cronies.

Thanks for the article, good confirmation and with the same players.

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Walz mentioned the letter to the editor to Emanuel on the floor and was stunned by his response.

“You mean the one about how you should caucus with the Republicans?” Emanuel shot back. “That’s a good letter. Makes you look bipartisan.”

To this day, Walz is still amazed. “He had read the letter.”

When I first read this passage, I mistakenly thought that was Walz was “stunned” by Emanuel’s response because Emanuel was telling him that it is a good thing to infuriate your own supporters by voting in favor of a definitively Republican bill to massively expand the surveillance state at George Bush’s behest. No — that point was totally unremarkable for Walz and didn’t register with him at all. Walz was merely “stunned” as in “impressed” — impressed with Emanuel’s political acumen at having read and remembered that letter.

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Actually, a blindfold & one last cigarette is beginning to sound good to me. Just put me out of my misery.

lol Very logical.

Paulson’s just doing what he wants to do regardless of what the legislation sez. In essence, he said FU to Frank.

i don’t get it… why would Obama pass the word that joelierman should retain the chair???? my head is still shaking………..

I know you already know this dahlin’ but this aint about Joe, it’s about them.

posted a little reminder this morning, that crazy Traficant had been voting with Republics off and on since 96, but when he voted for Hastert in the 01 Speaker race, Gephardt immediatley stripped him of his seniority and committee assignments – a full year before he was indicted – uh!

Asked about how much has been lent so far Bernanke temporizes and says he thinks that the country’s credit rating is not in danger which is reassuring coming from a guy who never saw any of this coming.

Waters is scolding Paulson. Paulson;s just gave her a go to hell look.

he never said that. what he said was he’d like to see him remain in the caucus period.

and no I’m not defending him

The arrogance just never ceases to amaze me, that’s all.

While I am/was an Obama supporter, I have said all along that electing Obama was just the very beginning and that some of his positions, especially in accepting right wing memes, were worrying to say the least.

For s***s and giggles I took a gander at Larry Johnson’s house of crazy yesterday (for the first time in 2 months or so). One of their biggest hobby-horses is the fact that they think that many Obama supporters just mindlessly accept what Obama does and says, hence the Messiah references, among other things. Nothing could be further from the truth for me, it actually is offensive to me that we’re thought to just eat any s**t sandwich that we are fed just because we’re on the left side of the aisle.

…again. Ad infinitum.

If pissing off your base is a good thing the we have to stay pissed off…

Strategically pissed off and no drama. Just facts, common sense, strong problem solving skills and a continually growing netroots-grassroots informed base.

why would Obama pass the word that joelierman should retain the chair????

Because you have an image of Obama that does not correspond to reality. The question we should be asking is what kind of politician would want to keep Lieberman where he is.

I love Maxine

.

more Jane upstairs
“The Auto Industry Never Lobbied Against Higher CAFE Standards” And Other Lobbyist Knee Slappers

When will we liberals wake up and realize that the Democratic party treats us worse than the Republicans treated their Christian right moral majority. At least the Republicans threw the right their wingnut supreme court justices and lower court judges and anti-abortion and anti gay initiatives. We do not even get this kind of lip service and won’t from Obama. H claims he will “Stop Torture and Rendition” but apparently will not allow torture prosecutions. Or his flip flop on FISA: “If my flip flop is a deal breaker so be it.” And now that his new AG can come in and withdraw the old AG’s certification in the FISA cases – how much do you want to bet Obama’s answer will be “time to move on.” We need more and better liberal democrats.

Did you notice the inconsistency? Bernanke earlier said that if FRB revealed the identities of the borrowers, there would be a run on the banks. In his later testimony he said that the FRB was lending only to the most creditworthy borrowers with the finest of collateral.

Or this update (I know I did not have more than a momentary lapse of reason thinking anything would happen). Guess my only question is if they gave Joe LIE a ballpark of what the vote would be like so he would not be upset that they gave a few people the OK to vote against since they were sure they had the numbers and did not want it to be unanimous

Greenwald again:

are now reporting that the Senate Democratic caucus has reached a deal with Joe Lieberman, and he will retain his Chairmanship of the Homeland Security Committee. The deal will be ratified in a vote tomorrow morning (and will entail his losing a totally meaningless subcommittee chair).

Nobody who has watched Congressional Democrats over the last many years could possibly have expected any other outcome.

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Again no surprise. Only suprise is going to be how they think this can keep up when people are losing their jobs and homes at a mile a minute and they are giving themselves raises and patting themselves at how clever they are as we burn and spiral down.

The “people” may be left of center but it’s becoming painfully obvious that the Dems in Congress and Obama will govern right of center. IMHO we can expect half-assed solutions to deep entrenched problems. In other words no “renaissance” just retrenchment.

Guess they don’t want to be in Congress after their current terms end.

(Maybe it’s time to split the Democratic Party into the fantasy wing – those who think Lieberman is still a Democrat – and the reality wing. We’re not in the fantasy wing.)

They should have to hold a cacus vote after the new Senate is in session.

I though we just had an election for representation? Oops my bad.

Maxine Waters ripping into how little has been done for homeowners, praises Bair and tells Paulson he should give the money to Bair and let her run with it.

And…?

The Senate is turning into a nearly completely irrelevant (and failed, I might add) institution, much like the House of Representatives. Our Congress is an empty shell of forms and perks and prerogatives. It’s nearly as meaningless as the decadent Roman Senate in the time of the later Emperors.

The real legacy of the Bush Regime is the successful transformation of our government into an autocracy.

We can fuss about how useless the Congress is and how hopeless Our Dems are and how obscene it is that Holy Joe holds on to his ability to stonewall and backstab, but the institution in which he dwells has become an afterthought, an appendage.

Comity and convivality are what really matter in the Senate. Ultimately, their failures enhance the powers of the Executive. Those powers are nearly limitless, thanks to Bush and Addington, Yoo and Cheney.

Until the state of the institution changes for the better, Holy Joe’s presence or absence among the Dems can make a difference only on the margins.

It’s like the surge in Iraq. It was a great success and in fact was so successful that if we remove any troops Iraq will fall completely apart.

i’m only listening. appreciate the visuals.

Reforming the Democratic party is nothing more than a concrete example of the myth of Sisyphus.

Perhaps all the reporting was wrong (this could be).

Here is an example of what we do know:

Lieberman: Obama Has Not Always Put Country First
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes…..try-first/

etc etc etc

For example smiling on stage when Palin 2012 (ha ha ha) campaign trotted out their Obamaz a Terrorist act.

Ah, the arrogance …

My agreements with you, could not be more complete.

At least, I feel we are in good company, D Baker.

If go to the wall we must, then let it be with those who have the courage, humor and understanding to make the best of this journey of tears.

;~D

DWB

Good analogy.

Bair reading through the conditions of the non-Fannie Freddie program she announced a couple of days ago.

Bingo.

At current burn rates WashingtonDC will soon enough find itself without another trillion or three to keep real world problems from pouring into DisneyWorld like WashingtonDC.

Suggestion: If WashingtonDC wants to ignore common Americans then it may be time for common Americans to ignore WashingtonDC.

No taxes without representation? No representation? No taxes.

No money no honey. Phuck the phuckers.

Obama may well prove to be the Messiah. Not for the left but for the right. Talk about irony.

Paulson: i can’t tell you anything more than we’re working on it

Asked what it would mean if Lieberman kept his chairmanship, one Senate Democratic aide said bluntly: “The left has been foiled again. They can rant and rage but they still do not put the fear into folks to actually change their votes. Their influence would be in question.”

Two words: Al Wynn. Our candidate, Donna Edwards, has his seat now.

The whole reason they want to claim we have no influence is because they want to paint us as outsiders with no political base, as people who parachute into local races where allegedly we have no business being. If that was the case, then Ned Lamont wouldn’t have beaten Short Ride in the 2006 primary.

Here’s something to watch for because it’s gonna come sometime during the first two years.

Obama will talk about appointing a commission to look at “saving” Social Security what with the tenuous financial situation and all that. He will then appoint “bipartisan” members of the old guard, people like Lee Hamilton, James Baker, maybe even Greenspan to see how the system can be fixed.

You see, Obama had to get in because no Republican president would be able to get rid of Social Security, just like Bubba had to get in so that welfare could be done away with setting up the indignity of the bankruptcy “reform” that came under Bush/Biden.

We don’t matter and the sooner people stop believing that any of these capitalist tools represent change the better off we’ll be and the sooner we’ll be able to start organizing for the inevitable Lord of the Flies days ahead.

Kinda makes the whole election thingy seem like a big charade, doesn’t it?

If Joe had said those things about someone where I’m from, Obama would have been waiting for him in the parking lot on election night.

Interesting take. Only a right wing Republican, Nixon, could re-establish relations with China. Your take may well be prescient.

Thanks for that heads up. Think it’s entirely possible.

please saying this. could not agree more – other than to include nafta, telecommunications consolidation, financial system deregulation, etc… to what the corporatists were able to accomplish during the clinton years.

was that malhoney? asking bernanke about aig – since we’re now running the company, we should know what they are doing.

Maloney. She’s mine. Used to think she was a slug, but my opinion of her is gradually improving. She asked good Qs and didn’t granstand.

The surge does allow the troops to be guinea pigs for all sorts of toxic corporate pollution. Oncology and mental ilness are growth industries.

Unfortunately, the dangers of modern war extend far beyond weapons. As Iraqis know only too well, areas of Iraq today are among the most polluted on the planet — so toxic that merely to live, eat and sleep (never mind to fight) in these zones is to risk death. Thousands of soldiers coming home from the war may have been exposed to chemicals that are known to cause cancers and neurological problems.

You win, hands down, the coveted “Prognosticator of the Day”, award, James.

Serious and hearty congradulations, all around.

Why don’t I imagine that you are smiling?

Gotta luv Ron Paul. Blathering about system failure & fiat money.

Link for #118

Put this in the following thread not sure which we’re in:

Great question about whether money that is going to AIG is being paid to holders of naked swaps. These are the ones that are pure bets.

Bernanke is saying you can’t distinguish between the two (equity backed and naked). BS, you can have them prove equity. Bernanke then goes on to say the company would have to declare bankruptcy again BS.

What is important here is that the AIG monies are going to pay off the pure gambles of the naked shorts. This means they are trying to fix the system they are just paying off the bets of their cronies.

she was good.

gotta go take care of sick cat, will be listening and back in a bit…

Obama will talk about appointing a commission to look at “saving” Social Security what with the tenuous financial situation and all that. He will then appoint “bipartisan” members of the old guard, people like Lee Hamilton, James Baker, maybe even Greenspan to see how the system can be fixed

That is my concern as well, but the last time this happened back in ‘83, all they did was shift the tax burden from the wealthy (who had gotten a huge tax cut in 81, after all) to the poor. Part of Clinton’s ‘93 tax hike was removal of the cap on Medicare.

All across the nation, and Atrios referenced it this morning as well, we are seeing calls for austerity and balancing the budget. Just to disagree with you slightly about when such a Social Security commission comes back again (and I think you are correct there), I think that such a commission would serve to pass along tax hikes that need the bi-partisan cover matra in a corporate media world as we have in the U S of A.

Obama HAS discussed removing or raising the Social Security cap from the current $103K. I don’t think he could get it passed without that bi-partisan security blanket are Senatorial Democrats crave (which is the initial gist of this post after all). In other words, such a commission might not be all bad, as long as we shed enough light on its activities. Remember that through efforts by TPM, among others, Bush’s Social Security reform was stopped dead in its tracks and there’s no reason that we can’t pull that off again either.

it’s very important that we pay attention and that we keep a list of people and what they do. whether or not this is a harbinger i’m willing to withhold judgement for now, but i won’t forget it. if Senators or Congresspersons won’t listen, we need to target them for retirement. we need to be consistent and we need to make them feel the pressure. otherwise we’re just pissing in the wind.
i haven’t ever been a true Obama believer because he hasn’t been that clear about what he believes. historically there have been very few politicians who know that much about what they themselves believe. Obama is a very intelligent man, for a politician. is he a man of convictions, one who is willing to stand on them? he doesn’t have to be very good or very intelligent to surpass his predecessor but just doing that will not be enough considering the great peril in which we now find ourselves.
at the moment however i think the responsibility for Lieberman lies totally with the Senate. we have no leadership there or Joe would have already been given the heave-ho. Obama knows this. why would he risk a showdown before he is even sworn in? he’s going to make his first show of authority doing things he feels will have a lot of support, not some gamble that the more reactionary and corrupt elements of the Senate will sabotage.

Caveat: It’s easier to counter a full frontal approach to dismantling social security than it is to fight a steal campaign. I.E. regular war is easier than counterinsurgency.

Benny Bernanke on his profitable Economic meltdown: “Foreclosures are both symptoms and a cause.”

That is such a paradox. But Benny and Hank are such a pair of lying thieving neo-cons.

BINGO!!!

Very freudian typo: meant “stealth” campaign, not “steal” campaign.

Bernanke does a major league quibble. He demands to know where the questioner got a trillion dollar figure from. He then pompously says that the Fed does not spend money. It lends money. He then ducks the question about how much has been spent or lent to help homeowners.

Paulson then weighs in with his standard BS about stabilizing markets helps homeowners blah, blah, blah.

Question: But banks aren’t lending. Bair has a plan. All you have Paulson is that you will examine it. You aren’t doing anything.

Both terms appropriate!!!

I’m trying to remember what “equity-backed” means in the case of CDSs.
* Does it mean that the underlying loan is secured by assets?
* Does it mean that the CDS seller (insurer) has assets encumbered toward paying of should a default occur?

http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..tisanship/
What “bipartisanship” in Washington means

In almost every case, the proposals that are enacted are ones favored by the White House and supported by all GOP lawmakers, and then Democrats split and enough of them join with Republicans to ensure that the GOP gets what it wants. That’s “bipartisanhip” in Washington:

To support the new Bush-supported FISA law:

GOP – 48-0

Dems – 12-36

To compel redeployment of troops from Iraq:

GOP – 0-49

Dems – 24-21

To confirm Michael Mukasey as Attorney General:

GOP – 46-0

Dems – 7-40

To confirm Leslie Southwick as Circuit Court Judge:

GOP – 49-0

Dems – 8-38

Kyl-Lieberman Resolution on Iran:

GOP – 46-2

Dems – 30-20

To condemn MoveOn.org:

GOP – 49-0

Dems – 23-25

The Protect America Act:

GOP – 44-0

Dems – 20-28

Declaring English to be the Government’s official language:

GOP – 48-1

Dems – 16-33

The Military Commissions Act:

GOP – 53-0

Dems – 12-34

To renew the Patriot Act:

GOP – 54-0

Dems – 34-10

Cloture Vote on Sam Alito’s confirmation to the Supreme Court:

GOP – 54-0

Dems – 18-25

Authorization to Use Military Force in Iraq:

GOP – 48-1

Dems – 29-22

On virtually every major controversial issue — particularly, though not only, ones involving national security and terrorism — the Republicans (including their vaunted mythical moderates and mavericks) vote in almost complete lockstep in favor of the President, the Democratic caucus splits, and the Republicans then get their way on every issue thanks to “bipartisan” support. That’s what “bipartisanship” in Washington means.

LaTourette on purchase of National City Bank. Really good. Has his facts all in hand & casts all the right aspersions. Is he congresscritter of anyone here? Seems like a solid citizen.

You’re fantasizing. Obama supported Lieberman. The Congress has bent over backwards for him on this just as they did on the bailout and FISA. You have the information to form a judgment. You just don’t want to because of what that judgment would be.

remember obama seeking out “the lie” in the senate in kind of a physical way? i still think that there is an ulterior motive to obama’s call “for ‘the lie’ to caucus with the dems.” what’s left unsaid is HOOGE.
also,
calling all NY’ers who vaca in conn. time to change your registration to conn!!!
will ned run again? i hope so! he could fire up the troops EASILY against any repub! any other dem would have to work too hard and i’d hate to see a dem party divided and “the lie” slip in…
perhaps he’ll retire early?

When Republicans stick together to meet their goals, it’s Party Unity.

When Democrats do the same, it’s Icky Partisanship.

By the way: Obama’s essentially saying “Not so fast — what’s the actual plan here?” on bailing out the Big Three.

a lovely stroll down memory lane.

Is this the bipartanship we can expect from an Obama administration?

Democrats have always been more forgiving of their transgressors than have Republicans. If Lieberman tried his little games as a Republican when Tom DeLay was in charge, it wouldn’t have mattered that he was in the Senate: DeLay would have arranged for primary challengers, just like he did for the moderate (read: sane) New York Republicans who voted against impeaching Bill Clinton.

Actually, there’s this.

It means they have an equity interest in the underlying asset. They were trying to insure their house, not take a bet on their neighbor’s.

Current question: PNC take over of National City was done for free. So Paulson is picking winners and losers and the banks aren’t using money to loan out but to buy up competitors.

Paulson: Market loses confidence. Doesn’t say why money wasn’t lent to National City. Just falls back on the old well the way we set it up was so that National City didn’t have a chance. LaTourette points out that National City was well capitalized. Paulson program for healthy banks only.

Me: If they are so damn healthy, why do they need the money?

Paulson: Basically saying screw you.

Agreed – but when Bush had his “mandate” this was the only issue where Democrats did not cave and this was in 2005, when the GOP didn’t need the Dems.

Despite lots of media messages that Social Security is going “broke”, changing it remains highly unpopular, even among rank and file GOPers.

“Trust but Verify” always applies, especially with a Democratic majority in place. It’s why we are the reality based community.

Jane,

Is it too early to launch Lamont’s campaign against Lieberman? I’m willing to sink 100k of my own money into this effort. That’s how angry and frustrated I am with this process.

They’d like us to believe it’s only the left that doesn’t matter but the fact is constituents don’t matter – period.

They talk as though Joe chose to become an Independent. The CT Dems voted him out of office (not just the far left) – he was elected in the general largely by Republicans but that doesn’t matter to Joe or to Obama or to very many in Congress – it’s never been about any of us, it’s always been about them and that’s not going to change with Obama.

This is really a raid on the national treasury. The more Paulson & Bernanke talk the less opaque it becomes. (I always thought it was. My comment is meant to address the issue of how they cease to be able to hide it when questioned.)

Should also drop in this thread that now LIE man will be sitting in critical meetings with them and passing the info along to R’s.

Excellent points!

Actually, in my backyard, the Club for Growth got rid of moderate Wayne Gilchrest and lost their R+10 District to a Dem. There is not a single GOP Congressman in New England because of these tactics.

Tom Delay’s tactics might have had a short term gain, but they have proved a long term negative.

As an aside, I do agree with your point that Dems are generally more “forgiving,” I just also want to point out the long-term consequences that purification measures such as Delay’s can have.

Paulson: This whole program is about healthy banks.
Bwahahahahaha.

Some of the rational on Dem’s bipart is great … umm if we don’t take this DEAL the next one will be WORSE!

And other such chicken little stategem. For instance Muckycasey (US AG), yeah if we don’t take this guy to cover up the crimes at Justice what will we do? Its just a bonus that he will hang a picture of George Orwell in his office.

Frank tells Paulson you can’t see the orange grove for the apple trees.

After Paulson goes off on one of his non-answer apples and oranges shtiks.

This is really a raid on the national treasury.

Absolutely. He and his are looting the Treasury pure and simple.

Paulson’s sockputting W: It’s hard work, and we are working hard.

I think the Bushie financial meltdown/heist is all about “junk bonds” such as CDS. The King of Junk Bonds, Michael Milken disagrees.

Geez. typos, typos, typos. “sockpuppeting” not “sockputting”

This sucks.

On the other hand, I wouldn’t necessarily assume the anonymous asshole of the quote represents the mood of the Senate, considering that it’s almost certainly Marshall Wittman, who everyone seems to dislike even more than they do Lieberman.

Hugh:

And just what is my fantasy? I don’t call not rushing to judgement a fantasy. Assuming that you know what’s going on in my head is more than a little bit rude.

Ackerman uses the bait ‘n switch cliche & likens it to drive to invade Iraq. Seems like he’s got the picture. Now what’s he gonna do about it?

Paulson keeps enunciating the same kind of flim flam that he used as head of Goldman to create this mess. Now he is using it to justify his raids on the American taxpayer. This guy and Bernanke too need to be in a federal prison. It is difficult to put into words how deeply corrupt and enabling Paulson and Bernanke really are. But if you have any doubts look at the amounts they are swinging around. The last I heard the figure was around $3.8 trillion. This is one third of the current national debt and it is what they have run up in the last two months alone. And it has not addressed a single, not one, of the problems associated with the financial meltdown. This is magnitudes of criminality beyond anything we have ever experienced. Yet here they sit blandly blathering for the chumps and rubes.

Second that. Hair-tearing out time.

October surpise. And they used it to elect the stealth candidate.

Shorter Paulson: Be afraid. Be very afraid. Collapse, collapse, collapse. Give us the money so it doesn’t collapse.

I stopped giving to the DSCC, DCCC, and the DNC more than two years ago — and only give directly to those candidates I support. I don’t want power brokers deciding where my contributions should go.

Jane. is this a good response the Senate’s deicion on Leiberman. That Netroots will chose it’s own candidates instead of empowing Democratic leadership for Senate and House races with our money, principly becuase the party chose to hand the gavel to someone who was defeated in the Democratic primary by Democratic voters, secondarily because Leiberman campaigned negatively and dishonestly against Obama, Allen, and Franken.

This guy and Bernanke too need to be in a federal prison.

thank you.

took a break from the other stuff to check in to see if you were hearing the same thing i am.

how is it that frank’s committee does stand up as one and call p&b out? oh yeah, they’re mostly crooks too.,

Didn’t mean to be rude but you are revising history. Obama already has a record re FISA and the bailout. He already has a record re the mostly Clinton advisers he has surrounded himself with: Rahm Emanuel, Robert Rubin, Larry Summers, John Brennan, Dennis Ross. He made clear to the Democratic Caucus in the Senate that he wanted Lieberman to keep his Chairmanship. He has not been a passive player. He has been calling the shots and these are what they are. So I reiterate my position that there is information there to form a judgment.

If you do not think so, I would ask this how long and how much information would we need to form such a judgment, how many caves, how many veers to the right, how many attacks on the base?

Now, now, Hugh, you must NOT crimminalize political behavior, lest Cass have need of a word with you.

paulson says it’s important to stick with the original purpose of the tarp (bailing out his buddies at GS).

i see ian has a topically related post up: Bush to US: Suck on 3 million more job losses

This guy and Bernanke too need to be in a federal prison.

I would suggest ADX-Florence Colorado, governmentese for “administrative maximum” where the federal government puts its “worst of the worst prisoners.

More than half the inmates have murdered somebody in or out of prison, said Blake Davis, Hurley’s assistant. A third of the men are in prison gangs, including the well-known

Aryan Brotherhood, Black Guerrilla Family and Mexican Mafia, as well as lesser known but just as deadly outfits such as the Dirty White Boys. The average sentence is 36 years.

It is spent, typically, in a 12-by-7- foot cell. Beds, desks and stools are made of poured concrete. Toilets have a valve that shuts off the water if an inmate tries to flood his cell by stopping it up. Sinks have no taps, just buttons — inmates used to unscrew the taps and use the plumbing parts as shanks.

A 42-inch window, 4 inches wide, looks out on a one-man concrete recreation yard, which prisoners with good behavior can eventually use.

If there’s no mechanism to recall a sitting U.S. Senator, there needs to be. And Lieberman is just the guy to deserve it.

Is it too early to launch Lamont’s campaign against Lieberman? I’m willing to sink 100k of my own money into this effort. That’s how angry and frustrated I am with this process.

Leiberman has four years b/f the next election. Dunno about the timing but Shays (R) just lost to Himes (D). Prolly wouldn’t be a bad timing for Lamont to remind CT voters he’s ready to run again if they’ll give him their support.

This is magnitudes of criminality beyond anything we have ever experienced.

Highway robbery, and nearly everyone is going along with it. “We have to do something. I know, let’s turn the nation’s credit card over to the guys that Bush put in charge. He and they have credible track records.”

I have the same sense of dread that I had associated with the Iraq invasion.

same here. think i even wrote something similar the week congress passed the bailout.

i’m very aware of what Obama has done to this point. could he have been any further to the left and won the election?
as a president he may very well prove to be a disappointment to all progressives, myself included. i don’t hold any fervent hopes but there is the possibility that he may do some good. i’m watching, and i’ll watch a lot closer once he’s been sworn in. that’s all i’m saying.

The sorry thing is that most people don’t have a clue how fiat money got us here.
I’m off to the Bear to relax a little.

Yes. (another simple As …)

The agenda of the Bush administration has been to “hollow out” the American economy, not just for now but for generations to come, to line the pockets of the plutocracy. The Iraq war was merely their warm-up act. What’s going on now is their piece de resistance. The Great Heist.

Shock Doctrine on steroids.

could he have been any further to the left and won the election?

Definitely. IMHO, he would have gained votes by standing up to Bush on FISA. Also, he would have gained votes by cutting a better bailout deal for the public. Perhaps fewer lobbyists and pundits would have voted for him, but they don’t really count for all that much, given his massive small donor support.

James, I think you’ve got it.

I’m already sick of this bi partianship and can’t we all just get along stuff.

I cannot believe Obama is standing up for Joey boy.

God. The blush is definately off the rose already.

as a president he may very well prove to be a disappointment to all progressives

He already is a disappointment for this progressive. So far I have seen a lot of bad decisions but no good ones. I have seen him surround himself with tons of conservatives but no progressives. I have seen him make many gestures to conservatives but nothing for us. These aren’t the actions of someone who has any interest at all in progressives.

The problem for us much more than him is that progressives have the ideas that will actually address the nation’s problems and work. He is setting himself up to be an unsuccessful one-term President.

I had a bad feeling about Obama right from the getgo. It was visceral & I had no conscious evidence, but I have learned to trust my kneejerk negatives about people as they have been pretty accurate. (Doesn’t work the other way. My kneejerks positives are notoriously inaccurate.)

As time went on, evidence accumulated. Hugh has the list. But I think the way to articulate my initial impression is that I know this man is highly smart, talented, and ambitious. Yet he told us nothing, or as little as possible. The whole hope thing was a smokescreen to hide his real agenda. Such people can turn out to be very bad dudes indeed.

We need to keep track of the Blue America candidates who came here & told us how progressive they would be. It will be a measure of the depth of the corruption if they turn coat within weeks of arriving in DC. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised.

I think it’s time to pull out the pitchforks.

Yes. Joe the Weasel.

The deal with the devil that progressives made to support the Dem ticket no matter what the Dems actually did over the past 2 years was the equivalent of Pelosi taking impeachment off the table. Just as Bush knew he wouldn’t be impeached, the Dems knew progressives would continue to elect them.

The fact that the Dems ignore progressives and our agenda is entirely our own fault — for now. We either need to be successful in primary challenges to Dem incumbents, or we need to back 3rd party candidates in sufficient numbers to threaten the electoral success of the Dems. I am not suggesting that the 3rd party candidates would win, but if they prevented the Dems from winning, perhaps the Dems would finally get around to representing our interests and winning back our votes.

Any time someone is as vague and nonspecific as he was during the primaries, it sets off my shit detector. Unfortunately, when it came down to him vs Hillary, I didn’t like her much either. Ultimately, I had negative knowledge about Hillary, and only negative feelings about Obama, so I voted for him as someone who might be somewhat progressive.

Yes, but mind my 185. If we support “progressives” who turn the minute they cross the DC line, even that strategy won’t work.

I had same choice. In the primary I voted for Hillary because of “devil you know.”

I can’t believe you people fell for this. You are doing exactly what Lieberman wants. Let me explain this as simply as possible. In this context, a Senate Democratic aide = Lieberman spokesman. He wants you believe that you have no influence because he is scared to death. He wants you to be pissed off at the whole party instead of him so that you’ll take your marbles and go home. Most of all, he wants you to be pissed off at Obama so that Obama will fail.

The only way we’ll ever have influence is to stay in the fight. Don’t get mad, get even. This fight against Lieberman was always a long shot (the Senate is stupidly clubby), but it was worth fighting. The Senate Dems don’t hate us, they just don’t get it. Yet. Time and demographics are on our side, not theirs.

As Greenwald, et al., continually point out and as our “third party” candidates have said forever…as our great writers Gore Vidal and Norman Mailer have always contended, there is a capitalist government that works in obeisance to money. That seems simple. You cannot change that and the theater that accompanies it. There is no real “Left” in government–in fact, doesn’t it even sound wrong if you think about. The Left is about true freedom and the Right is about control…It’s pretty easy to see where government would fall on that continuum.

@WilliamOckham: Well said, sir.

I agree with you generally, BUT

He has only actually appointed one person, the generally loathsome Rahm, but that’s pretty much it. [I’m not counting the people who were already associated with his campaign, such as Jarrett, here for the sake of my argument]

The sounds we have been hearing have come out of the MSM and their surrogates, which has their own inherent bias, which is to conserve as much as possible of the economic status quo. Remember that the main MSM meme has been that “we are a center-right” country. One that is truly proven false – take a gander over at Media Matters for examples.

Vis-a-vis l’affaire Lieberman Obama has in fact just stood back and let the Senate Dems handle it themselves, which I find disappointing.

It is certainly not leadership we can believe in, and the events that have transpired so far on other fronts, such as the non actions in helping the economy are certainly disappointing. Despite what the MSM and Rush Limbaugh might have you think, however, Obama is not actually in office yet and does not have the power to actually do anything. President Pissypants still has that veto pen in his last ditch attempt to destroy the unions once and for all, for example.

The decision to truly vet people and to make sure that they have no clear K Street connections is something that I actually do find hopeful.

Again, my view is “trust but verify,” but let’s not get too far ahead of ourselves here and throw out the proverbial baby with the bath water.

Indeed. To repeat my point wayyyyy upthread, that “Senate staffer” wasn’t the epitome of courage, now was he?

It’s unlikely that there’ll be a democratic candidate other than Obama for in 2012. But if there were a Progressive Party that started working credibly right now toward a 2012 run at the presidency, Obama would have to take note. His “landslide,” was only about six percent. In 2012, the Republicans might have a more attractive candidate and Obama will have more of a record to run against. He’d have to worry now about pissing off his “progressive base.” We’d have a lot more leverage.

Sage advice, WilliamOckman.

Sorry, Ockham …

Not optimisitc about 3rd parties, which is why I have held out hope for more & better Ds. We now have elected enough of them to test whether that strategy is a winner or a loser. If, as I said above, they turn their backs on us once they’re elected, we’ll have to develop a plan b, and maybe that will be a 3rd party.

I can’t imagine which Rethug alive today would be attractive enough of a candidate to offer a reasonable choice. Do you have someone in mind?

I’m not sure I follow you. I’m not talking about supporting progressives per se, I’m talking about withholding support from Dems generally. Heck, I would have voted for Chuck Baldwin if only as a none-of-the-above choice. If a sufficient number of progressive voters do not vote for Dem candidates, then they cannot win. Those voters could write-in cartoon characters if they wanted, the idea is to use votes like a two-by-four to get the attention of Dem leadership and to get them to represent us again, rather than their donors.

Vis-a-vis l’affaire Lieberman Obama has in fact just stood back and let the Senate Dems handle it themselves, which I find disappointing.

But of course Obama didn’t stand back. He told Harry Reid that he wanted bygones to be bygones, and the Senate Democratic Caucus went along with him. That Lieberman keeps his Chairmanship was an Obama decision first and foremost.

I didn’t mean to imply “a reasonable choice,” rather, someone slick enough to pose a serious threat to Obama. If Schwarzenegger were a natural born citizen, he’d be such a possibility.

Third parties don’t have to succeed. They only have to frighten an incumbent candidate that they could take away his/her margin of victory. Ultimately, Nader did that in 2000, and that fact would put the fear of God in Obama’s soul were we to form a Liberal Party and back it.

Work to defeat Joe Lieberman in 2012? What a joke. He’ll almost certainly be retiring anyway. And the spineless “Democratic” bastards who’ve been enabling him and the Republicans will still be there, counting on your support, screwing you at every opportunity, and laughing in your faces.

I specifically include Obama in that group, as well as every other member of the Democratic leadership – and yes, that includes Hillary.

Any progressive or liberal who continues to support the Democratic Party after so clear a “f–k you” from the party leadership has no one to blame but themselves. But I’m sure that the vast majority of the netroots will continue to support the “lesser of two evils”.

I was a life-long Democrat. I gave Obama and the Democrats my vote despite FISA, telecom amnesty, and a lot of doubts. And this is the result.

Screw it. I’m going Green.

The only consolation is: Would you rather be saying President-elect John McCain?

There are too many Senators and Senate aides who viewed this through the prism of LEFT/RIGHT. It’s really about RIGHT/WRONG.

In fact, I’ll vote for a Republican over a lame-ass Democrat.

There are however a lot of worthy Democrats, e.g., Al Franken, whom I’m enthusiastic to support. But I’ll take a Republican over a Blue Dog any day.

Funny that that Senate Democratic aide identifies his adversary as “The Left” and not the right.

Seems the message sent by the electorate really hasn’t gotten through to some people…

Exactly! Thanks wigwam for putting it better than I did.

Just to follow up on your point about Nader, the endless finger-pointing and caterwauling at Nader voters for being responsible for Bush’s 2000 victory has served the Democratic Party really well. It tells voters they had better shape up and fall in line and it absolves the party from doing what it must to win those voters back. 8 years of Bush was enough to bring the Nader voters of 2000 back into the fold, but if the Dems continue to alienate their progressive base, I wonder what 2010 and 2012 will look like?

I’ve played the role of Cassandra for a long, long time. My track record on predictions is very high. I don’t LIKE being right when I make depressing predictions, but they usually come true.

So please remember this over the next four years: Obama and the Democratic leadership are going to disappoint you more than you dreamed possible. His Supreme Court picks will almost certainly be MORE conservative than McCain’s would have been. The Republicans and their policies will rule Washington with an iron fist, even if the Dems get 60 seats in the Senate.

McCain would have been a disaster, yes. But the alternative is going to be nearly as bad, and even MORE painful because so many people expect so much better. Government now has nearly unlimited power and NO accountability – as Joe knows all too well, since he’s doubtless smirking and chuckling to himself – and our nation, and quite possibly our species, is doomed.

Damn. I hate having to say things like that. I hope to god I’m wrong…but I really don’t think I am.

Who’s donating to elect Jim Martin in Georgia? What a wonderful world it would be if the Senate Dems had 60 seats or 70 seats or 99 seats!

It’s that simple. I’ve been trying to create “first principle” ideas that should be the foundation of every decision…what would yours be?

I think after reading that disconcerting post about climate change that the first principle should be the health of the planet and our continued existence as living beings. What is next? NOT how can we all be rich. But how can we serve each other.

This is where we need to focus–we need to raise the discussion to important real issues…not the bullshit in our current government and media.

It’s a question of who needs to “shape up.” The democrats should learn the lesson of 2000 and shape up; otherwise, the progressives might turn Green.

Howie, it would appear that you and most of the people on the threads today occupy two rather different worlds …

Cognative dissonance?

I don’t think this can be blithely ignored.

If you postulate a world where the MAJORITY of current d’s are replaced first, then your ‘wonderful world’ might have some genuine appeal.

However, should there actually be no discernable change, that is, a ‘change’ of real and genuine significnce during Obama’s ‘tenure’, then
just exactly ‘what’ do you consider that the d’s shall have to ’sell’?

The ‘lesser weevil’ model does not appear to get better mileage, and seems likely to ‘pollute’ the political environment, quite as much as the ‘greater’ …

Are you saying that until the percentages are overwhelming that the d’s spinal deficiencies should be simply be ignored?

Kingmakers must, ultimately, regard realities somewhat more broadly than simply getting their ‘guy’ or ‘gal’ onto the throne …

Or maybe not.

Or purple with apoplexy as the case may be ; )

Damn fine!

phred, you have a way with colors.

(And I’m glad I had no liquids ar hand, as it is, I’ve had to pick up my chair)

;~D

hmmm … ‘at’ hand … duh.

No, I’m saying screw them!

IMHO, Howie has been working very hard for more and BETTER democrats. His influence is biggest where it’s needed most, i.e., in the primaries.

Thanks for clarifying Howie.

Appreciated the link, AND the sentiment therein contained.

David

What it means is that the Democratic Party doesn’t represent…Democrats. It’s simple, really. Can we have a 3rd Party now?

Thanks ; ) Now that I’ve got my colors down, I’m off to go work on my shapes ; )

He told Harry Reid that he wanted bygones to be bygones, and the Senate Democratic Caucus went along with him.

Do we know this to be a fact? Not trying to be difficult, I’ve seen the reporting, but it’s all speculation and anonymous sourcing, and I haven’t seen an actually properly sourced article on this issue.

Andrea Mitchell and co are already speculating if Clinton is going to get fired from Secretary of State, even though she hasn’t actually gotten the job in the first place, for example.

Please share whatever you discover, phred.

Considering how things are ’shaping’ up, changing ’shapes’ might be a useful skill.

Remember; Simply because things are ship ’shape’ does not mean that they shall float.

;~D

LOL ; )

Just in case I might be misunderstood, I concur wholeheartedly with Howie here.

On the other hand, I think some people (justifiably, I might add) are getting a little carried away here. We are like the Titanic sailing towards the iceberg but, unfortunately, we are a very large ship where course corrections are near impossible on the short term.

It’s very easy to take the speculative reporting, take it as fact, and then speculate further on said “speculative fact.”

The Senate Democrats (and their advisors) are creatures of a culture which has been established by the conservatives over a 40-50 year period.

Another example is that while we look back on FDR as being the President that led us out of the Great Depression, he also adopted some conservative approaches such as balancing the budget in 1936 and ‘37 such as Krugman told George Will on This Weak. Conservative policies that actually ended up prolonging the Depression.

By nature, the Senate is a very conservative, in the literal sense, place. One is elected for 6 years, after all. They’re ruled by David Broder (types) and the Washington Post. If you look at that issue through that prism, I think the overall picture becomes much clearer.

Changing the culture and environment in which the Senate operates would therefore be much more productive than trying to establish a third party from the ground up. I think therefore that the Better Democrats methodology in obtaining progressive ideals is therefore more desirable in my view.

HA! Dissed again!

Out in 2012? Well, folks. Only I and other voters in CT can determine that and they spoke loud and clear two years ago. You see, the majority of us Nutmeggers have grown quite attached to good old Joe – whether he’s a Democrat or and Independent matters little.

If he wants another term in 2012, he can pretty much count on it. It’s all those pesky “unaffiliateds”. They never can be counted on. They generally don’t have a partisan agenda.

While I am inclined, DBaker, to agree with the logic, you and Howie promote, unless and until the ’system’ is dominated from the school board level to the presidency, by progressive sensibilities, the Senate and to a lesser degree, the House will, barring a substantial change in what is ‘acceptable’, continue to swear its first allegiance to money and its influence.

Until there is genuine electoral ‘change’, the power of which lies soley with Congress, and we have little reason to expect Congressional enthusiasm for such change, democracy is, effectively, hostage to encumbancy and entrenched ‘interest’.

Until there is a ‘effective’ method of punishing, literally, those who tell us that their hearts are ‘pure’ and then find convivial the “club’s” exclusivity and prerogatives and desert those who empowered them (Howie may have some thoughts on this), or like a Lieberman, ingratiate themselves sufficiently with their fellow clubies or the ‘opposition’ (making use of the Rovian ‘tactics’ thereby supplied) we face an uphill struggle with which Sisyphus might be familiar.

Time is of some essence and neither major political party is friendly, today, with our hopes OR our dreams.

That said, we are, all of us, in it for the long slog.

DWB

Thanks, Jane, you’ve put it in a nutshell.

Let’s just call amnesty right now for all criminals, tax-evaders, child-molesters and plain whatever, for this is what Reid has to say on why that traitor and Bush-policy defender Lieberman gets to keep his Homeland Security Committee chairmanship:

Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said he was very angry by Lieberman’s actions but that “we’re looking forward, we’re not looking back.”

(all quotes here from HuffPo)

Actions once committed are always in the past, so it seems that Reid & Co suggest we just live with fate, scrap the idea of Justice, and move on. Don’t do anything about it. Change nothing. And by all means, don’t forget to keep those in power who promoted the ideas, policies and ideals CONTRARY to those espoused and voted for in this election.

Added Reid: “Is this a time when we walk out of here and say, ‘Boy, did we get even?’”

But it’s not a matter of ‘getting even’. It’s a matter of being able to push new policies through, set a new agenda.

“It’s time to unite our country,” said Lieberman

It’s not a matter of ‘unity’- as Lieberman would sell it- when you keep the previous party and policies in power. That’s unity and solidarity with your opposition and their policies while BETRAYING your friends and voters.

“Lieberman’s grasp on his chairmanship has gotten stronger since President-elect Barack Obama signaled to Democratic leaders that he’s not interested in punishing Lieberman for boosting McCain and criticizing Obama during the long campaign.”

So this is the change we need?

Like a headache.

I am wrong as witnessed by this

While Obama is not saying it directly, I will take Mr. Dean’s word that it came down from up high, so to speak.

continue to swear its first allegiance to money and its influence.

This is a whole other subject, but it is why we need to get rid of the ability of people and corporations to buy politicians under the mum of “first amendment rights”

No other country in the world has the amount of legal lobbying that we have in this country – in Western European countries they call it what it really is “bribery,” and actually prosecute people for it…..

Ah, you disagree with SCOTUS, then that MONEY equals speech?

And, DBaker, I am not so certain these are seperate things, as taken all together, IT is the means by which democracy is made a sham and the rule of law is quickly becoming both a joke and a bludgeon by which to run rough-shod over justice AND hope (however audacious).

Incidently, from my perspective you were not ‘wrong’, merely unduly hopeful, I recognize the symtoms, as I have been suffering a bit of late from the same contagion … it would appear that a widespread ‘recovery’ is in the offing, however.

;~D

You know, this is crap:

No matter what Joe Lieberman does, the people who are protecting him hate you much more than they hate him.

No, they’re just completely indifferent to what we think. DOn’t portray it as what is isn’t, problem resolution only comes from portraying it as what it is. And we shouldn’t be pissed off because of Joe’s campaigning. What we should be pissed off about is that he has stalled the work of his committee, while committee chair as much as if he was a pet rock. We need to be as pissed off as the villagers in a Frankenstein movie, before they give a shit that we’re pissed off.

What we should be pissed off about is that he has stalled the work of his committee, while committee chair as much as if he was a pet rock.

Actually, it’s perfectly acceptable to be piss’d off at Short Ride for both his actions against the Dems on the campaign trail AND his refusal to perform any oversight of the Bush Admin, including his failure to hold the promised Katrina related hearings.

They are not mutually exclusive by any means.

I hope this puts to rest the notion that this is all some master stroke of kumbayah, of keeping your friends close and your enemies closer.

Where do you get that? From the comments of a Senate aide??

It IS a master stroke of kumbayah. Everybody knows Lieberman is a putz, but now he has to be a good little putz and not piss off Big Daddy. Just imagine him on the other side of the aisle, whining and snarking through Obama’s first term.

I’d have preferred that they burned Traitor Joe at the stake, but what would that have gotten progressives? “Hey, we burned the guy, so you lefties just shaddup now. You got what you wanted, didn’t you?” Seriously, Jane: I think your take on this buys into the argument that the left is powerless and ignored. Why look so hard for signs of betrayal? If one looks, one will find. I mean, don’t we have WORK to do?

Onward!

I do believe that some Democratic leaders need a reminder of who they work for.
Keep weeding out the worthless turncoat bastards one at a time every chance we get.

Absolutely. “Stinky” Hoyer is another one. As for their “We must bend over and stick our heads up the asses of our corporate overlords” understanding of the Democratic sweep during this past election, “For the first time in decades, we are a true national majority party—and if we want to stay that way, we must govern like one,” (Stinky, here) I don not think “True National Majority” means what they think it does…

meanwhile, Obama says he’s committing the U.S. to 80% emissions reduction amid a strong repudiation of Bush anti-Kyoto policies.

more conservative than McCain’s…??
rubbish. absolute rubbish.

But make no mistake, their hatred is based on our power.

That is a mistake. Their impudence is based on our inability, or our unwillingness, to hurt them. Until that happens, nothing will change. These people only worship power. If you don’t have any, they’ll piss on your head until their bladders are empty, and then go have an extra-large coffee.

I keep writing this here, and keep getting the same foolish responses. When you’re willing to do something that will get their attention, let me know.

Their impudence is based on our inability, or our unwillingness, to hurt them.

That is the sum total of their power. Agreed.

And I liked your piece yesterday.

Actually, it’s perfectly acceptable to be piss’d off at Short Ride for both his actions against the Dems on the campaign trail AND his refusal to perform any oversight of the Bush Admin, including his failure to hold the promised Katrina related hearings.

Among democrats, sure, but the reason to take his seat as chair away from him is because he’s sat on on his hands, not because of who he campaigned for. Don’t you get the important difference in this? It isn’t partisan, it’s just clearing out the dead wood. The purely partisan portion has no place on the Senate floor.

The way to get their attention is to start doing the people’s business in congress, and to stoutly oppose these people when they run. The congressional Democrats need to call attention to the obstructionistic tactics of the Republicans for the last 2 years (blame where blame is due). If they suck, run ads about why they suck when they’re in their primaries. There’s no reason that we can’t stick an oar in to get more reasonable Republicans, too, or to try to turn centrist Republicans and Independants away early, toward Democrats.

We really also, out to have an amendment to the US constitution saying that any law that abridges the rights of any two consenting adults to marry in a civil ceremony, with all attendant rights, is unconstitutional.