This shit outrages me beyond belief. Why is every man, woman & child in Israel not on trial at the ICC? Why is this not reported by U.S. MSM? I hate this, and no one seems to care.

well, uh, they gots ta protect their teritory, ya know.

with Dick & Co egging em on, I’m sure. where does HoJo stand on these atrocities, I wonder? (not really)

eCAHN, I know how you feel, but there are Israelis who oppose the treatment of Palestinians, and they have been about as effective as — well, what percentage of Americans have wanted the US out of Iraq for years?

But the leaders should be hauled before the ICC for sure. As should many in our govt.

Maybe we have to try harder, and I don’t know how yet. I know I would put my live in danger to save a cat. I have to think that way about this, too. We need more Rachel Corries.

That’s life, not live.

I hate this, and no one seems to care.

i used to think that if only people knew, they would care. now i’m not so sure.

You’re right about trying the leaders only. I was venting.

‘Morning all. This is a pretty fast moving story so please add info if you see updates.

Israel’s occupation of the Territories has been thuggish and brutal. It is comprised of a long litany of violations of international law: collective punishment, reprisals, settlement, targetting of civilians. Israel puts the screws on the Palestinians until they scream and lash out. The Israelis then ramp up the pressure even further blaming their victims for having to do so.

Besides its violence, it is an incredibly short-sighted and counterproductive strategy. The Israelis are closing out the possibility of a two state solution by persisting in these actions. That leaves a one state solution where the “Jewish” character of the Israeli state (always problematic and at odds with history) will be lost, and the two sides will have to learn to live together, share the land and its resources as citizens of a single state. Creating a prison for part of your population and keeping them in it has been tried from the ghettos of Europe to the bantustans of South Africa and it has not worked.

there are Israelis who oppose the treatment of Palestinians

thanks for saying this.

Like Swift & Katyal wrt Hamdan, it would only take a couple of the right lawyers to get this into whatever court would be appropriate. Conviction ought to be a slam dunk.

Hey, Hugh, it’s not counterproductive from Israel’s POV. They’ve been able to keep control of all that land for 60 years and they’re likely to do so for the next 60, demographics notwithstanding. And there’s no cost to Israel. Sure they spend a lot on military, but they’ve turned that into an economic engine, esp exports.

Digg is open, folks; we’re on this early…let’s digg the heck out of it to bring it to the attention of “the powers that be”.

Hey Suin Digg is open for your Post… Great work as per usual!
Pups be sure and Digg this Post!

I don’t think there will ever be a solution to this problem! These parties have been fighting since before Christ was born. We would be pretty naive to think we could get them to live in Peace after alls these centuries they have been fighting over that land!

DIGG
and REDDIT

Good morning Siun. I’m glad you’re on this. I was just gathering stuff for a post at my place re: this. One other thing that’s very wrong is the blockade against the press. Journalists are being kept away from the heart of this story.

These parties have been fighting since before Christ was born.

Not true. For all but several hundred years, the Jews did not control Israel. And for most of history, the Christians were greater enemies of Jews than Palestinians.

Bottom-line is the U.S. prevents any U.N action against Israel for crimes against humanity.What Israel is doing -and has been doing- is obviously illegal but NO ONE in the Western countries will stand up to the U.S.

There is hope given reports of Livni and Obama being in favor of the Arab Peace Initiative but will the Palestinians give up the ‘right of return’?

Someday there will be retribution for the crimes of the Israeli government and the acquiesence of it’s citizens in such policies (just as there will be for Iraq and Afghanistan among the U.S. public) but that doesn’t help the ‘now’ situation.

i think you are leaving out one option – that if life is made so miserable for palestinians enough of them will leave. in this way israel can have both the land and the jewish identity (i think there is a lot of conflict over what this means among israeli jews – i’d guess hebrew cultural identity is a more unifying concept).

why this is not seen as a form of ethnic cleansing is beyond me.

note: i don’t think gaza is widely seen as land israel must have (unlike the west bank). but it’s imperative that the palestinians do not work together as a single political force – and i agree with siun that this the most likely motivation for the recent israeli gov actions.

Toby W. You live in NY state, yes? Would you be willing to email at ldta at ess bee cee dot net ? If so, thanks!

this land has been fought over since time immortal, the players may have changed back and forth but this land has been in dispute long before there was any written history!!

These parties have been fighting since before Christ was born.

There was relative peace from AD 70 until 1948.

Abbas is already signally his anger at the Israeli blockade and will raise it at one of the scheduled meetings between Fatah and Olmert this week.

As usual (and like the US in so many places) the thuggish actions of Israel are bringing two sides (Fatah/Hamas) closer.

Bottom-line is the U.S. prevents any U.N action against Israel for crimes against humanity.

That’s why I brought up Swift & Katyal. They fought the U.S. commander in chief to a standstill in wartime. Ought to be a couple of good men out there who will be equally courageous in this case.

Of course, Swift got assigned to the case as a navy JAG officer. But they fully expected him to only bargain out a plea deal on behalf of Hamdan. They never expected him to actually serve as Hamdan’s advocate. But he went all the way.

That’s not true. People there have lived peacefully side by side for ages. It’s only the nationalism and the creation of a nation state(s) which has caused this to explode in the 20th century.

Leaders lead people to war.

People want to live in peace.

To state the obvious, if any people should know better, if any people should have ‘learned’ from their own, lengthy ‘experience’, if any people whose own humanity has been maligned, circumscribed, and denied in some of the most brutal and heart rending ways possible, it is the people who now control the state of Israel.

Which suggests, as selise has pointed out, that ‘knowing’ may not translate into compassion OR understanding.

Thank you, Siun, as always, for permitting us the opportunity of confronting our own humanity … or, as is all too often the case, our lack of such a truly basic ”necessity’.

players may have changed back and forth

Righto. Christians vs. Muslims for most of history. Jews had no part in the battles between Roman empire & WWII.

Juan Cole has been eloquent on the subject for some time. Here’s one of his recent articles.

The only thing the Israelis seemed to have learned from the holocaust is to do it to them before they do it to you.

Exactly – we seem very partial to claiming that folks have had long standing arguments as a way of excusing or ignoring the results of actions of us – and our allies.

Islam honors “the people of the book” – and relations amongst religious groups in Palestine were not so bad until the UK and others decided to give it to one.

Also the genetics of the peoples there shows something quite interesting…the Palestinians are actually descendents of the Jews. When the Samaritans and Judaeans fell under the Roman heel and were dispelled and suppressed they merged with other peoples in the region. When the region became Christianized many converted to that religion, and when Islam came in rthe residents also converted to that. People are nothing but practical to the circumstances. After a few hundred years they absorb into the groups and adopt the religion and cultures of the dominant society.

Thus many of the Palestinians are actually just the Jewish populations who remained in the region and converted to the other religious faiths that became the dominant one for that era.

i haven’t been following the legal aspects all that much – hopefully siun can correct me. …i’m not sure how much court decisions matter. as the route of the wall was first being determined and built in the northwest of the westbank many villages challenged it. sometimes the route would be changed a bit, but mostly the court system seemed (to me at least) to be a way to whitewash the treatment of palestinians. also since it’s a military occupation that makes access to the courts more problematic. groups like halper’s and also phr have tried to push things from the israeli side (i’m sure there are others, those are just the two i’m a little be familiar with).

you raise a good point and one i should know more about.

check your email, Laura…

i’d say counterproductive for the people of israel – but not the political leaders.

1,828 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN GOEZ ON AND ON AND…

Firepup Fredom Fighters:

Remember when Joe Biden said that Obama would be “tested” early in his administration…well guess what, who’d a thunk it but our erstwhile “allies’, the Israeli fascists, are movin’ ta pre-empt any Middle East peace positioning before Obama even takes office. Now let’s see…the UN has been marginalized and emasculated, the Iraq occupation can’t end without detant with the Syrians and Iranians and there can’t be accomodation with the Syrians and Iranians unless there is a just peace in Palestine…where does that leave us before Obama even takes office?

Jesus with friends like the Israelis the world doesn’t need an outbreak of plague!

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE FUCKIN’ AMMUNITION

There have been mass movement of populations in history such as the moslems moving to pakistan from India. But Kashmir is still disputed territory by both countries.

Nation states where there are large separate ethnic and religious groups living in the same area only works if there is a secular state with religious freedom.

The orthodox don’t want that and probably the Islamists don’t either. They want religious states of their chosing and they don’t want religious freedom in a secular state. There are progressive secularist type jews in Israel, but they are not controlling the agenda and like the fundies in merica, the fundies over there are relentless and won’t give up and DO engage in violence and terrorism – JEWS and ARABS.

The occupation was illegal and Israel has taken land which was not part of the partition agreement. The settlements are salt on that wound which only gets worse and worse.

And who protects the Israelis? The US does because it gives us a reliable friendly country in the region. And they do have something which resembles a democracy even though Arabs are second class citizens… like blacks were/are in the america because of racism. Israel has nukes and that intimidates all the nations in the region and the US turns a blind eye to this.

I didn’t know that. Very interesting.

I had thought that the Palestinians were descendants of the Philistines, who used to occupy what is now Lebanon. Then my memory gets dim, but something happened & the Philistines dispersed, some going south, but some going along the north coast of Africa & settling.

I’m guessing that they’re counting on the world media (and especially the US media) to be focused on the transition period between administrations here in the US.

The Likudniks and Kadimaites (who in many cases are also neocons: look up the history of Doug Feith, for starters) don’t care how badly they look to the rest of the world, so long as their main financial backers in the US will prop them up. But with Sheldon Adelson’s casino empire tottering, Israel’s hard-liners have lost a key sugar daddy.

Why do you think it is not counterproductive for the people of Israel? They get use of a lot of that extra land, have special roads, etc., and don’t pay much for the privilege. The extra cost in taxes are offset (more or less) by the economic contribution of the MIC.

The “Islamists” in West Bank (or is it Gaza, I forget) and S. Lebanon were created by Israel. The former as a foil against secular Fatah, and the latter as a result of Israel’s 1982 invasion.

I had the same thought – the Israeli press is not so partial to Obama (and was quite opposed to him during the election season) and there’s been an increase of “well if the US won’t take out Iran coz they are wusses, we will” rhetoric in JPost etc for the past year. Olmert clearly likes the idea of instigating a major crisis and pushing Obama from the beginning to side solely with Israel while Obama has signalled support for more multi-sided solutions.

Just remind anyone that talks about religion how well it works. Two governments, Two religions that dominate the people and the actions of the government.
Too bad that other “important” religions don’t have their own states so that they can impose real religious rule. Some of you from Utah and Idaho may argue that it has all ready come.
Education is a terrible thing when incomplete or dictated by an agenda. And so it goes.

I’m not referring to courts in Israel. I’m talking about taking Israel’s leaders to court in another coutry for violating Geneva conventions. IANAL but I think they could be convicted in absentia and then could not travel anywhere. Then their convictions would be really bad publicity for Israel.

The only thing the Israelis seemed to have learned from the holocaust is to do it to them before they do it to you.

quick bit of a story i heard second hand (in 2002) about a retired israeli physician. he was 80(?) and yet he still volunteered with phr-israel (physicians for human rights) by going to the west bank with a mobile unit to give free medical care to palestinians. he and his wife (before they had met) had lost their families in the holocaust. their one son had died fighting in lebanon. when asked why he spent so much time helping palestinians, he said that the lesson of “never again” can be learned in two ways: never again for me and mine, or never again for anyone.

This is just another act in a long list of Human Rights violations perpetrated by Israeli government against the Palestinian people. The MSM, as usual, is negligent in its reporting. The story appears in The Boston Globe on page 11, the Washington Post on page 13 and I didn’t find it in the NYTs. It is sad to say, that as long as Palestinians are looked upon as less than human, this type of behavior will continue.

How will Rahm effect Barack’s decisions about this issue?

Yes, lots of good stories about individual Israelis, but they don’t influence Israel’s national policy.

As for “doing it to them before they do it to us,” after listening to Gertz & Gaffney for a hour this morning, I’d say that is one of the “principles” that underlines their view of U.S. foreign policy.

Wonderful story.

Chris Davies who I quoted above tells – at the link – of his attempt to go with a group of Israelis, Palestinians and others to protest the wall. They were not well received by the IDF. It’s a good interview worth reading.

Thats because the Jews were subjected first by the Romans and then by the Arabs! If it were not for the Holocaust it would still be in Palestinian hands. So blame the Western governments especially the British who controlled the lands after WWI until the Jews decided they needed to have a homeland again so they would never be oppressed as they have been for centuries! So yes these lands have been fought over for centuries!! You also forgot the Crusades a very bloody time indeed! You might read a book by James A Mitchner “The Source”

just another

Nope. This is a major acceleration of the anti-human activities of Israel.

Yesirree, it’s all the Romans’ fault. They are definitely to blame for how the Israelis treat the indigenous population today.

When I was young (back when dinosaurs roamed around with human beings it was) the public schools made certain that two very powerful images were firmly fixed in our little minds.

There were ‘movies’ of a atomic bomb explosion … you know, the ones where the shock wave blasts a town into kindling … which we were assured we could weather if we hid under our desks.

And there were movies of nazi arocities, graphic, horrifying and overwhelming …

Perhaps that is why so many politicians of a certain age seem all too willing and happy (but money helps, I might imagine) to ’side’ rather mindlessly with Israel, drunk or sober.

Obama is of another time and might, just possibly, have (it is devoutedly to be ‘hoped’) another sensibility.

I have LONG wondered WHY there has been NO ourage by the media in general, and the pulpits-in particular- as to the inhumane treatment of the hands of Isreal,that Gaza has recieved.Hey, Fundie pastor John Hagee created CUFI-Christians United for Israel. How about CUP-Christians United for Palestine?

That is my favorite book of all time. I read it about every 4 or 5 years. Always find something new. I treasure it.

Why do you think it is not counterproductive for the people of Israel?

the settlers may temporarily benefit financially, but i have a hard time seeing how that is sustainable. they live in fear and hate instead of creating a better future for their children – one based on something other than a militarized economy and politics.

I never said what they are doing is right I have just been saying that this land has been contested over for longer than there is a written history!! Go look back at all my comments ECahn you will see I did not take anyone’s side on this issue! There was a time when both of the current parties did live as neighbors.

linky? thanks!

OMG! I used to sit with my grandfather after church and watch those horrid films. I scared me to the point of catatonia. I could never understand how that was allowed to happen. I would have dreams of about what kind of person I would be if that happened in my world.

Citizen Selise:

Nice story but it doesn’t change the fact that the Israeli and American political oligarchies have created the reality of Israel as a “rogue state” with nukes. Israel is gettin ta look more and more like Pakistan as each day goez by and nuthin’ the “good Israelis” can do like offer pathetic gestures of humanitarian aide will change the reality.

Doesn’t Israel have any Jewish guilt over the treatment of the Palestinians?

You are projecting your own feelings on the settlers. On the few occassions when I have seen any of them interviewed, they seem pretty damned determined to stay, and seem to think it’s the only future for their children.

I apologize if I mischaracterized your comment.

My frustration with going back into the history is that it is endless and can be argued (and I have heard it argued) strenuously by both sides. Don’t see any reason to rehash it.

Everyone has known what the solution is for 60 years. Israel has all the power so there won’t be a solution.

Lisa is upstairs with elton John!

Awfully short sighted of them. Much of their determination is born of religion. They have the “right” to steal the land of those in the way.

Citizen eCAHNomics:

You have nailed it…the settlers are the reality that must be delt with by Israel and as long as Israeli politics is rules by a fascist coalition under the guise of a “national government” there will never be any peace…and I’m afraid that Israeli fascists are capable of nukin both the Syrians and the Iranians and leavin the mess for Obama ta clean up.

Indeed. Will Obama be able to contemplate his better angels with a guy like Rahm as first pick and right-hand man?

Will Obama’s Muslim background – though experimental and far-removed – provide him with better, equitable judgment and fairness in IP affairs?

Yesterday in a dismal post here at FDL, one headliner took affront at a commenter and threatened that commenter (#31) with total banning from FDL sites. That commenter once had a voice at FDL but disappeared, for unknown causes. FDL was greatly diminished by that silence. I spoke up for that commenter on yesterday’s post. Apparently the right of free speech is only for some as long as it doesn’t contradict the headliner. When it comes to the all powerful Washington/Tel Aviv axis of evil, no threat to bring daylight or knowledge will be tolerated by those in power or their propagandists, even when they are found out by their own words. Yesterday’s post was the sorriest I have ever witnessed at FDL, next only to the departure of OKKiddo and Lahoma.

Did any of what you presented above ever get mentioned in the media there? That is one effect of propaganda. If you are immersed in propaganda, how are any of you ever going to have the knowledge and information with which to either conduct yourselves or find justice in your actions. It has been for some time in the world media this incarceration of Palestinians in an act of war against humanity, that is what the US/Israeli military barricade around Gaza and its inhabitants is. The State of Israel is in violation of the Charter of the UN, The Geneva Conventions, and the Charter of Human Rights, but then, illiterate auld Muricans, how would those poor creatures ever know that, exceptional an’ all that they am(sic), gawds choosen /s. That information would have been available here had not a certain voice not been silenced.

Someone is going to have to put manners on the Israelis, a leash and muzzle as well. As with LIEbermann, today my disgust knows no limits. Superb post Siun.

ah, i misunderstood. in 2004 the IJC at the hague determined that the wall itself was a violation of human rights. but it was only an “advisory” opinion. your idea of going after individuals seems like a good one, i just don’t have any knowledge on that one way or the other. there is so much i don’t know, it gets overwhelming sometimes.

Sounds exactly like the right wing Christian Domionists who feel entitled by”anointing’ to subjugate others because of Divine mandate. The ends justifies the means. Sarah Palin and John Hagee are of this militaristic Christian theology. Read Expose’: Christian Mafia”,by Wayne Madsen. You’ll see how this all links together with Israel.

The real outrage of continuing Israeli misdirection and duplicity over,in and about Palestine Occupation by Israel?

The continuing outrage of Israeli illegality,brutality,inhumanity and pathetic degradation of any ethical or moral measure?

That WashingtonDC is and far too many Americans running WashingtonDC are condoning and supporting it.

So far Barack Obama seems not capable or willing to confront this rotted state of affairs.

This shame has a name. American pathetic indifference and hypocrisy.

Thanks Siun for continued spotlighting of what is befalling Palestinian people at the hand of a corrupted and criminally chargeable Israel.

Yes, lots of good stories about individual Israelis, but they don’t influence Israel’s national policy.

not much, ture. but they are up against not only their own racist warmongers – they are up against ours. which ties into your comment re usa foreign policy.

nuthin’ the “good Israelis” can do like offer pathetic gestures of humanitarian aide will change the reality.

if i believed that, i would believe there was nothing we could do either.

re yesterday’s thread. was hoping for a chance to say that i apologize if my attempt at moderation yesterday crossed the line to cowardliness. also the event you refer to (but i presume did not witness?) was, imo, a bit more complicated than that (i did witness it) and i don’t think it’s fair to blame it on silencing someone because of their views. don’t want to bring all that old history here, but if you want to discuss it email me (click on my name and use the contact link).

Don’t the Israeli’s ever think what their ancestors would say to them permitting or enacting such atrocities against other people?
There’s a psych break there that I just don’t understand. I would have thought, it seems logical, that Israeli’s would be kinder and more compassionate than anyone in this world for what their people have gone through.

Two reports from today’s BBC to show the depravity of the Israelis.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/pro…..727177.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7729487.stm

Just wanted to let you know, T-Bear, that I appreciated your rather direct responses yesterday, as Kiddo and Lahoma were very much on my mind.

I agree, when any are forced to leave, “banning” them to the ‘wilderness’, simply means that we ALL lose.

As Sander O said, many moons ago, the ‘commentors ARE, precisely what makes FDL what is, beyond the capacities and wisdom of the posters, it is the other voices and discussions which are the ‘essence’.

DW

There is sometimes a frustration that comes from combating the great propaganda machines that have evolved. The MSM in no small measure decides what is known and how it is viewed. Yesterday Ken Silverstein outlined how he had been somewhat ostracized for going against the fads of journalism. Why are people like Bill Moyers and Amy Goodman relegated to third class citizenship in a field where they should be considered to be the exemplar.

For what purpose do we give our hard earned tax dollars to a nation of hatemongers and religious extremists?
We give them our money, health care, our sons and daughters bodies the the most vicious weapons in our arsenal – weapons no one else will use – our Congress kow-tows to their interests before ours and they’ve gotten away with breaking every rule, low and treat of both the US and the UN.

Well here’s the answer I’ve come up with: I buy nothing -NOTHING- even remotely connected to Israel.. I will vote for no-one who sides with Israel over all others – that’s you Hillary – - and includes the Jewish candidate who ran for an open seat in my district. I switched my vote- he did lose.

No ‘Democracy’ uses cluster bombs as freely and without regard for the lives of others – including the deliberate mutilation of innocent children – as Israel does.
And I point out this warning to all: in that war with the ‘fledgling Democracy’ that was Lebanon Israel dropped over 300 MILLION cluster bombs not in the small southern border areas of Hizb’allah, but blanketed all of Lebanon. Why? Lebanon had become the jewel of the Mediterranean with a flourishing economy. Israel bombed every one of those industries, hotels and businesses. And in particular, they targeted the entire coastline of Lebanon -to make sure no one ever found their Mediterranean coastline a beautiful place to visit for decades.

That is the purest form of evil I’ve ever heard about, since WWWII.

No ‘Democracy’ uses cluster bombs as freely and without regard for the lives of others – including the deliberate mutilation of innocent children – as Israel does.

how many have we used in iraq and afghanistan?

Thanks for that DW, sometimes one rages in the wilderness it seems. ;-)

how many have we used in iraq and afghanistan?

Much more serious, Depleted Uranium, DU, half life IIRC 450,000 years, not friendly to living things stuff.

YHM

I am always amazed at how s-l-o-w-l-y we seem to ‘learn’ to behave as even moderately mature and thoughtful beings, T-Bear. And how, far too often, we take umbrage when our tail-feathers have not even been pulled.

;~D

Huge difference between anger and assertive, mostly missed by all but the most experienced, the difference between jejune and mature adult. Folks is big animals, it gets hurtful if things get out of hand physically, the directions for posturing got lost with the operational manuel for being human. ;-)

Ah, so that’s what that little booklet was?

And I couldn’t find a ‘repair’ manual anywhere, either.

Fortunately, we are so very much more evolved than our remote early human ancestors. Imagine what it would be like were we all trying to deal with this modern world with the equivalent of cave-man brains? Or even early primate emotional apparatus?

Things would be a mess and our tenure would hardly be, as we now know that it is, assured.

We, clearly, owe ourselves a pat on the back.

;~D

President elect Obama: litmus test coming up? Will AIPAC countenance it?

Not so much even concerned about Rahm’s influence. Can Obama find a sufficient voice? Shall we find him hiding under a rock, even a rhetorical rock? Will the lingering stealth Muslim accusations govern his response/cowering? Will he just ignore it as long as the MSM don’t push? One president at a time, blah, blah, blah . . .

Could Bush be bothered to come out strong, or even comment?

Inquiring minds . . .

I agree with everything you are saying. I would have said it yesterday except I was reading the post waaay after EPU. I’m afraid this comment falls into EPU as well. It was a very sorry display.

Not too far from where I am are some caves containing prehistoric drawings comparable to the famous French caves. I tend to give greater credit for ability to the ancestors, they would be equally as capable as ourselves, possibly more, because they had to be good at what they were about, if not, no survival.

Look too at the statistics for illiteracy, currently about 20% in the US, IIRC. The effective illiteracy (my estimation) may run to 60% and up to 80% if critical and analytical skills from reading are considered, the mathematical literacy rate might be a measure of the metric. This may be the substance behind the public reliance on belief, superstition(religion), and myths; none of which are true survival traits but do have social survival value. The emotional apparatus you mention is probably in greater play today than at anytime in the past, there is less survival disadvantage now. As for making a bollox of things, todays person stands supreme and unsurpassed. In only 6℃ (about 40 years) increase, the nest is gone, such is the fouling of that is taking place. Wiser folk than I have prognosticated some dire fate. Still, the ability of the ancestor was equal our own, but not so imbalanced with their world as ours is. When we survive our doings, then is when congratulations are due. There is no guarantee the country will survive this catastrophe.

yes.

and yhm in reply. thanks.

I said “..as freely…as Israel”. You’re right about Iraq and Afghanistan – but in this country both our Congress and our citizens can have an impact on what we do.

Israel has no one checking it’s use of power. Absolutely no one, and could care less of what their neighbors or the world thinks.

And why is that?? Primarily because Rahm Emanuel, along with Steny Hoyer and Chuck Schumer did as their A*I*P*A*C/pro hard-line/pro-business donors ordered them to do by forceing and supporting more like minded Congressional candidates down our throats, and then electing themselves to all the leadership positions. Those leaders teamed up with the Right -who uses the state of Israel -with no regard or respect for their religion- to further their own aims of dominance.
But sadly, to further their own personal gains, they’are willing to play the canary in the mideast oil mine.

The best thing we can do for peace in the Middle East is give the Israelis a new home – where they have no neighbors to share the area with.
And then we could stop all support and let them make their own way in life -for a change. Just like you and I and our children must do.

I do suspect you is astutely correct … in all particulars, T-Bear.

Suggesting that minimal ‘understanding’, should it ‘arrive’ at all, will embody that human lament …”too late … too late …”

Too ‘little’ as well, but that’s kindda rubbin’ it in.

Actually, ’tis possible, perhaps even probable, that very many do understand … but, generally, the ‘elite’ do not, for a rational future holds no respect for their swagger nor praise for their bombast …

And all of our myths preclude any apprehension for those for whom belief promises mansions in the sky or postulates a God who is more factotum than repository of wisdom or compassion …

For a species for whom money is the most important thing, a general bankruptcy of the soul is merely an entry fee … and ignorance is bliss.

The best thing we can do for peace in the Middle East is give the Israelis a new home – where they have no neighbors to share the area with.

i’d prefer to listen to the palestinian and israeli peace activists about what they want us to do to help them. i’m tired to imposing our “solutions” on others.

I have been completely flummoxed by the disconnect between the “right to lifers”, and ,their apparent bloodlust and unquenchable thirst for war-on other’s turfs. Is this a case of “Don’t kill ‘em in the womb,save ‘em for the battlefield”?