So, the Dow, after a wild ride, fell almost 400 points. I suppose I should point out that all the crying about how the bailout bill would save the Dow was ridiculous. A large part of this is because Europe had a bad weekend, with multiple financial institutions in trouble, and Iceland is in so much trouble that they do not have the foreign reserves to buy food. The bailout itself won’t actually happen for weeks, since Paulson is setting it up, so even if it might work in theory (it won’t work in theory) it isn’t happening yet. So the entire effect has to be "confidence".
But the problem with the bailout is how discretionary it is. There is no way to know who will get bailed out. And given the way Paulson has acted in the past, with rumors swirling that he has chosen who lives and who dies based on his personal likes and dislikes, if you aren’t in good with Paulson, perhaps you should assume that you aren’t getting bailed?
And the way Paulson is setting it up appears to be to hire Wall Street firms (any bets on Goldman) to do the valuation and figure out what to buy. Anyone see any potential for abuse and conflicts of interest? Would it be in a company’s interest to overvalue stuff that they have a lot of on their books, say? This isn’t necessary, a ton of people (quants) with the necessary qualifications have lost their jobs in the last year. They should be hired and should do the work on a government pay check. They know the game inside and out and they don’t have massive conflicts of interest.
Money will continue to flood into the US, into treasuries and out of stocks, meaning that the dollar will keep going up. The Treasuries can be used as reserves, are essentially cash, and since the Fed has declared that it will pay interest on reserves, the effective interest rate of Treasuries held by banks is actually significantly higher than a treasury held by, say, you. Likewise money is repatriating from overseas, and that is also helping push up the dollar.
The next key point to watch in dollar terms will be when the Treasury finally has to pay for both the bailout and the expansion of the Fed balance sheet. Bernanke announced another 450 billion of loan facilities today, 640 billion was dropped into the market last Monday. The treasuries for all this have not been issued yet. When they are, we’ll see if the money is there. My guess is, actually, that it will.
As for the Dow—it goes up, it goes down. While I’m not a market analyst, I strongly suspect that we have not seen the end of this Bear market. People are going to keep piling out of stocks and into safety and sure returns. So, this won’t be the last market drop.



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Thank God the grownups are in charge.
Oh…Ian, is that meant to read “…after a wild ride,…?”
Do you have any links to what market analyst are saying? i would be very interested in reading their take.
hey, kindsa o/t
lehman bros ceo was knocked out at the company gym!
ot, but not entirely.
i’m listening to a talk James K. Galbraith gave today at the new america foundation on his book “The Predator State: How Conservatives Abandoned the Free Market and Why Liberals Should Too”.
here are a few bits from one of the commenters (not galbraith):
If there’s no company how can it have a gym?
Bush’s tax cuts for himself and his family, friends, and cronies haven’t worked out so great for the economy. Can we all agree now that suppy-side economics really is voodoo economics? It’s time to stop including it as a real economic strategy and certainly time to stop using it as an excuse for cutting taxes for rich guys.
With the States getting in line, I wonder how this will play out?
Bail the banks, screw the states and gov.
Buy overpriced junk
Let the people pay and pay
I wish we could help but oh look at the red ink, just no way to help
Ian, that’s a good thing, right ?
- spent the day trying to learn about Credit Default Swaps, so I’m a little turned around at the moment X~o
did you see the 60 Minutes segment ?, and if so, do you think they did a credible job in explaining the concepts and consequences to their viewers ?
(((SD)))
bom dia
CNBC confirms
may this not be a sign of things to come:
story
As far as presidents are concerned this is the joint responsibility of the Clintons and the Bushes.
It’s mostly the fault of the Republics and they must be made to own it.
(bows) Konnichiwa, Wobbs
(((Wobbs)))
Have you seen today’s Democracy Now!? Amy features Naomi Klein’s speech before the U of Chicago last Wednesday. Definitely worth watching. I think Naomi has a better handle on this than most.
Iceland prepares to rescue its banks
Canary in the Coal Mine?
Ian:
It’s 369 … not 396 … just an FYI
i listened this morning and thought it was excellent.
my bold.
well, my dear SD, the money disappears faster than the physical assets. :] btw, Fuld was wearing a heart monitor and the dude who busted his chops had been pumping iron.
I will take that bet. It is a sure thing. It is exactly what Liz Cheney did with Iraki Reconstruction.
Oh, wait, I do not have any money.
Are you serious? Link? Is that why Fuld talked so slowly? Thought he was just running the clock.
Yeah, I heard that an ex Sachs guy is involved. I’ll try to find my linky.
The more I hear and read Naomi the more impressed I am and it’s damn hard to impress this ol’ hippie.
CTuttle has Rachel and I have Naomi. *sigh*
from the article
Yesterday I thought I heard Bank of NY (do they still exist? Off to google) and one other, but not GS.
serious karma
I went to the link. I can’t condone the dude’s behaviour but Fuld certainly had it coming. Probably the worst thing that will happen to him because of his actions.
a one punch ko ain’t no beating, the three minute motherfucker is a beating
I loves ya bro
Digg this post
He’s lucky the guy didn’t take a weight to him.
lol you got that right.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/0…..2008100617
I feel so much better now…/s
Or pull that dull deer antler off the wall.
If that happened in Noo Yawk, Fuld should thank his lucky stars …
Having been on both ends *g*
no deer antlers?
Even trade! Tho, I must say Naomi is quite the Babe too…! ;-)
Well, Bank of NY still seems to exist, but couldn’t find article on its being tapped to be one of the workout institutions.
However, did find this one about Paulson choosing GS employees as advisors.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ded7…..fd18c.html
… he is going huntin’ with Cheney this weekend though … *g*
Corrected, and thank you.
from roubini today: The Fed keeps on wasting time while the mother of all bank runs is underway
this guy is depressing.
I thought I heard that on NPR this morning. Nothing like spreading the wealth amongst friends, eh? Crony motherfuckers will Hoover every one of our pockets given the slightest opportunity.
Another example at my link in 38.
Deer Antlers … ROFL
… lucky that he only got hit with a fist …
Thanks Ian.
digg
Judy Woodruff going full bore on the ayres connection, haven’t heard her mention Keating
Yep, No Crony Left Behind.
Hey Selise, now that Congress has handed over the sweet moolah, there’s no hurry to actually do anything. They were just saying that because like when Bush lied about keeping Rumsfeld on and then asked about it, he was very direct: “I had to say that.”
Oh thank you so much. I will listen to this this evening when the four legged and two legged traffic dies down here in the house.
The smarter they are the better I like ‘em. Even if I were blind it would be an honour to be in her company.
What a coupla hopeless dudes we make.
that name sounds as approximately reassuring as “the clear skies initiative” or “no child left behind”
Hey, Petro, considering McSame’s and Caribou Barbie’s serious geographical deficiencies… Such as Palin Calls Afghanistan “Our Neighboring Country”
It’d be spooky if they controlled the button… One could only ponder whom they’d nuke… Ottawa?
Heaven help us … our Neocon journalists are outta control …
Yep. Old habits die hard.
The Predator State is a very good book and IMO would be a great Book Salon selection.
Woodruff finally mentions Keating documentary
Thanks eCAHN. your link has as many as three GS cronies listed. sheesh. nice racket they got going.
from econobrowser:
haven’t listened to this one yet, but it’s next on my list.
Leafs fans would be ecstatic … *g*
Heh, speak for yourself! Speaking of which, it’s my 18th anniversary today…! ;-)
I saw somewhere that Sardonicus has an ass-kissing op-ed in today’s NYT on Palin.
It’s better than it not being there, anyway. Right now we appear to be in a choice between hyperinflation and deflation. At a guess, they’re going to choose deflation. In which case what they need to do is decouple the real economy from the financial economy so that all this money they’re flooding into the pyramid doesn’t crash into the real economy and cause out of control inflation.
Oops. Thanks. Transposition of digits ftw.
You two are incorrigeable.
bbl pups. hugs to you all.
Happy Anniversary Buddy !
Your better half has my undying admiration for puttin’ up with ya … *g*
hearts a flutter? they are thinking with the wrong head is all
To the bone, Ma’am…! *g*
Have a happy one and many more.
… and that’s their good side … *g*
((( GdP )))
Congratulations!!! A toast to you and your lovely bride and a wish for many more.
Yeah, I can only speak for myself. If Naomi ever comes to the area I’ll be in da front row you betcha.
Mahalo, I think…! 8-P
“CTuttle has Rachel and I have Naomi. *sigh*”
Oh no you don’t. I have my application in on both of them. And the other Naomi, too. Oh, wait– I just got married last weekend. Well, a bird in the hand is worth three in the bush, I guess.
Bob in HI
If Harper is there, more power to the old goat and the moose lady.
The Lehmann ceo sounds as worthless and lying as Ken Lay. Real trash.
Congrats Ctuttle and to the mrs as well *g*
Right on, Bob! Congrats! So did ya honeymoon on Kauai like you’d mentioned earlier?
Didja mean Roger Cohen ?
What CTuttle said.
Congratulations – and you’re already looking at other women? Just kidding. Have a wonderful life together.
exactly. well… not unless they care that the global financial system appears to be heading off a cliff. (hope i’m being unnecesarily cassandra-like).
from kagro x cracks me up today:
What the future holds:
“All de-leveraging roads ultimately lead to deflation and debt destruction,
which was the natural and progressive path that sliced 25% off the commodity index and caused the dollar rally this summer.
The bailout proposal reversed that course in one fell swoop and reintroduced the specter of hyperinflation. That will work until it doesn’t, which is to say that the patience and appetite of foreign holders of deteriorating dollar-denominated assets is extremely strained.
If they scream “Uncle Sam” and debase our currency, the caveats of a fiat
currency hit home in a hurry. If they don’t, the dollar will rally and asset classes of all shapes and sizes will deflate in kind. ”
“I believe that the government will do another Hail Mary pass, with massive guarantees to the short-term commercial credit system and wide open short-term lending by the Fed (2 or 3 times expansion of the Fed balance sheet). If done on a sufficient scale this action will probably work for a while. But none of these financial measures affects the accelerating recession — which will in turn place more pressure on the financial sector.”
http://www.rgemonitor.com/blog/roubini
Auction house eBay axes 1,000 jobs BUT it is spending $1.3bn on acquisitions, including $820m in cash on internet payments company Bill Me Later, which lets American shoppers make purchases online without having a credit card, to bolster its PayPal payments operation.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/busi…..technology
Nice to see the priorities.
“It’s about unity and perseverance and perspective. It’s about making the world a better place through our actions, our words–even our body language. It’s about sharing what you know, appreciating what we have and communicating our gratitude as a matter of course. There is only one way for us to “win” and that’s to rebuild our nation, and our world, from the inside out.”
http://www.minyanville.com/art…..ex/a/19331
LOL … my thoughts exactly !
Fulds much more arrogant than Ken Lay.
Somewhat OT – During the night a neighbor replaced my Obama sign with a McPalin sign. I live in a neighborhood that thinks itself too good to be anything but Repiglican. So the artist in me got out the red pain and painted a circle and slash over the names and now I have an ever better sign. I’ll let you know how long it stays up.
they put the DOW in Down.
So, has the U.S. Treasury been outsourced to Goldman Sachs yet?
Bob in HI
Nope. Sardonicus is my name for William “The Grin” Kristol. “The Grin” made him sound too much like a wiseguy and he’s never, ever gonna have the balls.
OT, but gosh, I need a laugh.
I got an email from an academic colleague, purportedly from the Manitoba Herald, about the plight of US citizens trying to cross the border into Canada. Pure snark.
It would be unseemly to post it here, w/o prior permission from Ian, and especially so early in the eve.
Ian, I’m sure you can figure out my email addy. Send me an email, and I’ll give you the text.
*spew*
Well, the Rs might not be all that popular in Texas these days. Little Boots completely shut down SA Airport this morning with Air Force 1 and left some not real happy folks in his wake.
helicopter ben? are you serious?
well, i know you’re serious. that was a stupid question. but could you expand on that please?
Well, he was not impressive and Waxman was not buying it. Thanks
Ian,
Seems to me that the U.S.A. has the upper hand because of its military power.
Ah yes, Kristol AKA ‘The Brown Nosed One”
Now that is awesome. asshats for taking your sign.
CTuttle,
Naw, we honeymooned in…. Waikiki, in a big condo time share! So the relatives came over every night to play Mah Jong. The last of them finally left on Saturday, and now the Mrs. has a boatload of laundry to do, reclaiming her condo from the remnants left by the relatives…
Fortunately, we had a “pre-honeymoon” in Kauai…
Bob in HI
Heh, If McSame does get elected… I’ll be dusting off my dual citizenship papers and head north myself…!
CONGRATULATIONS!
*tossing rice in your general direction*
Good grief. What is he doing here? Palin was in town over the weekend to raise money, as was Hillary. All of the sudden South Texas is a popular place.
Little brown-nosin’ Nazi groupie. I could carve a better man from a banana.
Are they joking? A guy named Cash’n’Carry gets to dole out the 7 billion?
Who’s running this show?
Dunno. I think he’d been in Crawford and was flying out but not sure. I know at some point today he was in Cincinnati and I think that was after Texas.
They want perpetual war, they’ll get it at any cost. He?
Yyou may find this article interesting given Kashkari’s stay at the Treasury;
I’ve titled it “Same Paulson bullshit, different day”
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com…..on-20.html
Kashkari came over from Goldman’s at the same time Paulson did.
That was the second sign someone stole. The first was on my lot around the corner. They take Obama signs, but leave up the other Dem candidates because they don’t even know who is down ticket.
Henry the W didn’t seem to buy his line about the salaries and bonuses – some decided four days before the company folded – being necessary. Especially since Henry the W has memos from last spring when some of the money guys were saying that the big bonuses and pay hikes were a bad idea. Fuld said that they were just worried about their own wallets.
Now you get to pick the grains outta da keeboard.
T’anks. Or as we say here, mahalo nui loa!
Bob in HI
Conflicts of Interests. You betcha!
Thanks for staying on this Ian.
… that’s funny and sad …
Shrub had some brush he had to harvest.
Get a Wrist Rocket and wait up for ‘em.
Steel ball bearings work great in ‘em…! ;-)
“Many of us in the US are focused on our own woes. But this is a global credit crisis. In today’s Outside the Box, we take a look at the currency markets, which are in an historic upheaval and also look at what is going on in Europe. I suspect that Europe is in for a period of much distress, as the world begins to deleverage That is why one government after another will back the deposits of banks within their countries, for otherwise capital will flee to countries like Ireland and Germany which ARE guaranteeing the deposits for all banks in their borders. . Many European banks are leveraged 50 to 1 (not a misprint). I suspect that more government will do like Belgium and the Netherlands and inject capital directly into their local banks deemed too big to fail.”
http://www.investorsinsight.co…..risis.aspx
Someone on another (gasp) blog suggested I set up a video camera and then youtube it.
Bet he could screw that one up, also. I think he is finally realizing he’s not so welcome. Jerk
SouthernDragon and CTuttle, let’s not go there, ok?
That’s what they were designed for but for remedial lessons in honestly I prefer dried beans.
That’ll work. Smile, You’re on Candid Camera.
Yes ma’am…! I’ll be over in the corner…!
I just know this video will get EPU’d, but it is really good…a commenter at Kos posted it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eu9Z2hXky0
via CR, this american life: Another Frightening Show About the Economy, on commercial paper seize up
Yeah, me too. Damn, this thing keeps fallin’ outta my back pocket.
We use pecans around here, but that is because they fall right out of the trees. But Egregious thinks we are edging too close to violence, so ixnay on the otshay talk.
Let’s see. My first thought was to set them up with something that’ll give an electric shock. Next thought – something VERY sticky and messy. Third thought – glue broken shards of glass. Well, you get the idea.
Warning – IANAAP – I am not always a pacifist.
Thanks Selise; I ‘digg’ this but for the off topic comments.
Henry Paulson names Neel Kashkari, a 35 year old guy from Goldman Sachs, to oversee the $700 billion bailout program. If this could get any more incestuous Paulson would be having sex with himself. Does anyone want to bet that Goldman Sachs won’t make out like bandits on this bailout? Or that it is a sham? Or a gigantic ripoff?
Mr. gnome suggested that sticky messy idea earlier – something like honey. I might take a gluestick to it and see what happens.
Not gettin’ any of my dough with sucker bets like that.
oooh, i love it.
#104
If ya want GW, we could talk about methodology at the Beach House…!
Bank of NY was bought by Chase
It’ll dry before the thieves make their appearance. Put some used motor oil or a thin layer of used wheel bearing grease, or similar, on the bottom edge. At night they’ll think it’s just dew or something and wipe it on their pants. Even Steven.
I like the element of slyness that suggestion implies. I want you on my side should a need arise for side-choosing.
Or all the edges. I normally pick them up in the middle by the bottom edge.
That’s a name fit for Dick Tracy comics. Goldman’s young stallion Kash Karry is gonna disburse the purse. Every time you think it can’t get any more ridiculous…
i’m listening now. good so far.
Irony overload. Economic Kommander Guy on CNN says ‘We don’t want to rush into this situation, to make the program effective.”
No rushing, no hurry, give it time, turn the page.
Thanks for the link to the summary. This show was mentioned at FDL yesterday, and I’ve been wondering about it.
Bob in HI
KO is gonna have a Palin terrorist special comment tonight. Heh, heh.
Hmmm. I think I will take one of the dogs out for a walk while I think about what to use. I like the oil idea. I need something that doesn’t smell. I’ve got some really foul fish oil pest controller, but that would warn the perp off. Still . . .
The only thing that had to be hurried was getting the loot into Paulson’s pocket. After that, its smooth sailing. So Long Suckers!!! /s
Necessity is the mother of invention. *g* Try to pick something that won’t wash out. And put yer 12-year-old thinkin’ cap on afore ya take th’ dawgs out.
Thanks for the link. Just arrived and didn’t get a chance to see you guys were way ahead of me, though of course I should have known. *g*
There’s a house up the road that’s been for sale for probably close to a year. About a month or so ago, they put up a McCain sign, near the for sale sign. I laugh every time I go by. Pissing off half the potential buyers in this housing market. About par for a McCain supporters’ intelligence.
missed the link yesterday, glad i saw it today though. it’s hilarious (unintentionally). for example, there is a physicist explaining CDS. where is prof foland?
Hello FDL. I used to laugh at my mum’s stories about life during the depression. Not so funny now:
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/0…../index.htm
That’s goooooooood.
While I’m not a market analyst, I strongly suspect that we have not seen the end of this Bear market. People are going to keep piling out of stocks and into safety and sure returns. So, this won’t be the last market drop.
Well, we’re in a cyclical bear. 18 years up, 18 years down. (up 1910-1929, down 29-47, up 47-65, down 65-82, up 82-2K, down 2K til ?. I figure 2018 or so.) We’ve been overpriced for most of the bull (that over 100% of GDP from 88-now), and a return to simple historical median would put the DOW down around 6kish. We might make it back to 3ish before the thing finally bottoms, keeping in mind that DJ plays with the multiplier.
Continuing crisis means down all month.
And given the way Paulson has acted in the past, with rumors swirling that he has chosen who lives and who dies based on his personal likes and dislikes if you aren’t in good with Paulson, perhaps you should assume that you aren’t getting bailed?
The interesting question is, is how long can Paulson continue to mismanage this situation and/or act as though Goldman-Sachs has annexed Treasury before somebody loses it?
max
[’It’s though there were an endless succession of Rumsfelds.’]
Congratulations Bob on getting married!!
There was segment on 60 Minutes last night where the guy talked about the mathematics that went into the formation of the these securitized instruments and the number of physicists that were employed by Wall Street.
Brief OT:
Chuck Todd is a fucking moron.
Carry on.
Does anyone know what’s really going on, apart from shafting Americans?
This may seem OT, but I suspect otherwise.
60 Minutes claims that there’s 50-60 trillion in mortgage paper on Wall Street. Using an average home value in the US of $212,000, this suggests that something over 280,000,000 homes are mortgaged at 100% LTV.
Take 280,000,000 homes, and multiply by 2.8 inhabitants each, giving a U.S. population of nearly 800,000,000 when the real population is closer to 300,000,000. So how could the value of mortgage paper be so high?
Are 60 Minutes sources talking out of their b***s? Is there some undisclosed mortgage fraud? Has Wall Street been buying up mortgage paper from around the world? Has the same paper been sold repeatedly to multiple investors?
An AngryMan wants to know.
As a Muslim would say, until 20 Jan 2009, god willing.
thanks. if prof foland doesn’t show up, i’ll email him the links. he still owes us his rant. *g*
Disturbing but not surprising
bold my emphasis
Perhaps they figure they are the last outpost for goopers and dagnabbit, they’re going to sell to another diehard.
Must be tough on your appraisals though!
Heh, I liked him when he worked alongside Mercurio at the Hotline… Sadly, he seems to have imbibed too much of the GE/NBC Kool Aid…! 8-(
sorry…from Palin rally today in Florida
God I hate Ms Palin reminding me of something not truthful. What a moralist she is. PLus, to watch Ms Cindy be amused at McLiar’s slimey crude attacks. At least the poll numbers are looking good; that’s the best revenge.
Said the bar for McCain/Palin had been set sooooooo high ’snif
Whaddever!
LOL! Sometimes he’s tolerable and other times his needle has so much dust, he starts skipping. I couldn’t believe he said people were holding palin/mccain to a higher standard! what mr. experience is being held to a higher standard than bush. and palin IS being held to a higher standard than the one she holds for herself, that’s for sure, I guess.
or even a non-muslim. i think of it as a way to acknowledge that the future is an unknown.
inshallah
i thought obama had talked about keeping paulson?
when I heard that grating voice full of bull, I just think “people in glass houses, lady”. that woman has pathological amount of gall. As does Heather Wilson…say, why didn’t she get picked?
and one about letting Bin Laden off the hook.
Man o man, you just beat me to it!
For those who don’t know, I think the good doctor is referencing Chuck Todd’s appearance on Hardball, where he just said McCain & Palin are being held to a higher standard than Obama.
Your name is reminding me of a protest sign I saw a man carrying when I was in Crawford to support Cindy Sheehan:
ANGRY WHITE MAN FOR PEACE
The Obama campaign is now anticipating McC’s moves and it’s certainly working. I think they are ready for whatever comes.
Christy’s
McCain’s Keating Defense Call Helmed By Monica Goodling’s Attorney
I guess Palin doesn’t “feel supported” by the polls. that’s her usual rationale for going trollish and stalkery.
And maybe she heard that her “wink” did not quite work. I’ll say.
AngryMan,
I think what’s missing from your equations is the number of second and third “homes”. Here in Hawaii, and in many other places, additional “homes” are purchased as part of an investment strategy. This was perhaps an unintended consequence of making it easier to get a home loan. You might say that these are “speculators.” A lot of the current crisis is related to what these speculators have been doing.
Ian?
Bob in HI
thanks for the recommendation. may have to put it on my to read list – although i’m so far behind, it’s more like a wish list at this point.
fyi – found a good link for the 60 minutes show at greenberger’s website. it’s realplayer, so i think dial up folks can use it too.
Not mortgage paper, credit default swap paper, i.e., sidebets or insurance bets on mortagege backed securities. I know, you need a fucking program to keep track of all the creative terminology. I’m a cunning linguist myself, but the Rethugs put me in awe. Except that their linguism always increase the pain, whereas mine . . .
Ooooo, works nice. Nice catch, selise. Thanks. Verizon DSL not much better than dialup on most evenings. Must be comin’ through some toobz ’bout as big as McSFB’s…
AngryMan — “mortgage paper” refers to the original mortgages (which you are counting) + lots of leveraging. There are many fewer houses than you estimate, but each new mortgage from the last few years has been leveraged to something like 20-30 times its value. That is how you get to the very large number.
Today I saw a clip of Dubya talking to the press about Europe and the bailout plan.
He said he didn’t want to rush it.
Can you believe that guy? People are getting violent and he doesn’t want to rush it.
Send all the golden parachutes out with all of the Crazies, the Bushies and Sarah Palin and let the ‘best man win’.
Bob,
http://static1.firedoglake.com…..r/link.gif
Good point, but the numbers indicate that each of us owns 5 homes. I wish.
AngryMan
In the spirit of 1984 it should be a chilling moment to read that and know what it really means. Hold on tight to your dreams.
OK, help me understand.
I understand leverage where an investor places $100 in a fund, and the fund buys $3600 worth of mortgage paper. But I don’t understand how that creates more mortgage paper. Fill me in.
They probably don’t see the irony of a McCain sign and a house for sale sign side by side. It was probably a foreclosure too.
No. You can base much more paper of a mortgage that the value of the mortgage, that’s the problem. Say, add in default insurance, for example. Package the interest and the chance of fees seperately. Take CDOs with it in it and build CDOs out of those CDOs. Bet on early payoffs. Bet on late payoffs, etc…
Here’s a house owned by Albert. It has an “owner”, a mortgage and perhaps mortgage insurance or other property insurance.
On Wall Street there are two guys (working for the likes of Lehman, GSachs or other): one offers an ‘insurance policy’ (called a Credit Default Swap to avoid insurance regulation) and the other buys a ‘policy’ on Albert’s house. He wants 20 times the value of the house insured.
First, right away, you might wonder why somebody on Wall Street is insuring someone’s home/mortgage. That’s scary. Then he wants 20 times it’s value? Isn’t that a warning that they intend to burn it down to collect? No insurance regulation? OMG, this is bad.
So, you’ve got some value of mortgages out there “insured” multiple times over with leveraged money ($1 borrows $100 buys a lot of multiple of value insurance).
It all adds up to a lot of insurance — ON PAPER.
Then to finish it off…the ‘insurer’ has no real capital to back that non-regulated ‘insurance’.
It’s a scam and there were a lot of people doing it on Mortgage Backed Securities (MBSs) and it’s just incredibly stupid unless you know you’ve got a friend in the White House who will get you that insurance policy payoff.
Bush & Co need to be tarred & feathered & run out of town.
Should you check back, I think they were including derivatives based mainly on mortgages in that figure.
It never ceases to amaze me how difficult it is to track down some of the most basic data on U.S. housing and mortgage markets. For instance, the Fed reports mtgs from commercial banks, but not mtgs overall. But on p.28 of this report (need the pdf to see the illustrations) is a chart at the top of which is reported $7.808 trillion outstanding of first lien residential mtgs, as of early 2007. Second liens would be a much smaller amt, so there’s presumably less than $10 trillion outstanding of residential mortgages.
Some of those loans were kept whole on the books at some bank, or bundled into a simple old-fashioned pass-through kind of bond. The large portion of loans that were written before the early 00s mostly fit here, and are not a big part of this discussion. But the rest, and the majority of those from the last 5yrs roughly, were put through the MBS/ABS tranchmaker or had CDOs written on them, which would leverage up their mortgage-related many times —a factor of 10 sounds quite possible. Then, perhaps the people 60Min talked to included CDSwaps, too. Then the sky’s the limit.
By the way, the report linked above is as close to a classic as the business research community is ever likely to produce. Highly recommened. It made such a huge splash when it went public in spring of 2007, after having been noised about for weeks or more I’ll bet, that anyone remotely close to the upper reaches of the finance community who says they had “no idea” until late that summer just how bad this turkey buzzard could potentially be, is almust surely flat out lying.
Mortgage Liquidity du Jour: Underestimated No More
http://time-blog.com/real_clea….._cash.html">
Please check this out
Grand dad preferred rock salt for memories sake.
I was glad to see Bof A honor their commitment to work with the Countrywide Lenders and I hope JP Morgan Chase honors their personal commitment to Senators Dodd and Shelby to work with the Wamu lenders in the same boat.
This article on foreclosure issues in Sacramento is a very clear presentation of why the bailout does not help and in fact will hurt mortgage holders in distress
http://www.sacbee.com/142/story/1287910.html