Ian!

rohrbacher is my critter (here is to hopefully Debbie Cook kicking his butt out in november…speaking of which, need to go make a donation)so he won’t vote for any ‘librul’ bill (tool)

Ian, what’s your view on ending mark-to-market? I really don’t like that idea.

The entire matter should wait till next February when careful deliberation can take place. This on-the-fly approach is strictly for the birds.

thanks yet again Ian !!

have the goopers released their version ???

Senators spinning wildly that public is changing attitude about bailout. Both Martinez & Schumer were on CNBC saying their incoming constituent against/for changed dramatically after Monday’s stock market selloff.

The fix is in.

my rep is doggett, bless his soul. and i used to have defazio when i lived in oregon. bless them both.

i’ll call the senators re today’s vote, but am not expecting any particular santity from hutchison or cornyn.

Need to call this “the people’s plan” vs “the banker’s plan”. Unfortunately, the media is trying to spin the news by claiming that the public is now in FAVOR of the original bailout, due to the stock market plunge. Paulson has our check book ready and Goldman and JPM have their shovels loaded with their toxic junk!

Time for massive taxpayer action via phone calls, e-mails, etc.

Here’s a great article on HOLC.

My sens are Schumer & Clinton. They’d do anything, including selling their firstborn, to bail out Wall St.

Each bill by itself *is incomplete*, together with some work they could make a good, complete, humane solution to financial and economic meltdown which is also acceptable to enough Republicans to pass.

Ian – you’ve given some thoughts to us regarding the DeFazio bill last night. What’s your take on reviving the HOLC? I think it’s part of your solutions you’ve given on this site, but there have been so many lately I have lost track of all the different policy positions.

[as an aside, how do you emphasize a portion a blockquote? - I am using * to do this now]

o/t

EPU’d -

Planned Parenthood Launching Rape Kit ad

hmm DiFi and Boxer are my senators. Boxer could be flipped (i think) but I have long given up on DiFi

Great article!

As an aside, I find it absolutely fascinating that someone from the American Enterprise Institute is actually praising the HOLC. Interesting times indeed.

Can’t get through to Bill Nelson or Mel Martinez. That’s probably a good thing.

whoa. interesting that planned parenthood is getting involved like this but then again, there is a lot at stake

Watching Rep. John Culbertson (R-Texas) on Rachel Maddow’s show last night made me think that there may be hope for a strange-bedfellows coalition for an alternative to the Paulson-Obama nonsense. In particular, Culbertson mention raising FDIC limits and getting rid of mark-to-market as approaches that conservatives favor. DeFazio’s proposed No Bailout Act has those two plus prohibitions on naked and down-tick short sales plus a provision for infusing capital into worthy critical institutions via equity purchases (that, for some reason, aren’t preferred stock).

At Daily Kos, Hale “bonddad” Stewart has a recommended diary where he objects to getting rid of mark-to-market and expresses the opinion that cash infusion won’t work. By omission, I conclude that he probably likes Paulson’s idea of the government buying up toxic assets.

Dennis Kucinich has been circulating a letter from Emory Law Professor, Frank Alexander, advocating that the government only purchase assets by which that can get control of troubled mortgages in order that they can aid the homeowner and thereby the market too.

AEI preaches nothing but poison.

You are absolutely right. It is a common tactic in government to claim crisis to stampede legislators to act. The bailout of banks furthers the notion of trickle down. We should start to think in terms of trickle up. Use the money to develop new technology and to bail out homeowners and pensioners as they come to need it.

Right you are about the Clintons and Schumer. They both view their primary constituencies as resident in the Hamptons and downtown. Both are really not progessive in any sense of the word.

This “Bailout” plan ought to award warrants to the government (by any company so aided) permitting the government to sell off the banks like television licenses when the government (people vote) so chooses. Unconditional or unsecured payments to these banks is an insult to the intelligence and sensibilities of the American people.

It is impossible to get through to Senators or even the Senate switchboard. I have been attempting to make calls to OPPOSE Paulson Plan at tonight’s vote but every line is busy. They must be being flooded with calls.
Saw the house critters (DeFazio, Bobby Scott, Elijah Cummings, Marcy Kaptur..) talking on C-span. They say Congress must not be rushed into passing a plan that won’t work -people should make calls to oppose Paulson – it won’t work, gives him unbridled authority… and they present a much better alternative: stimulate economy, help restructure mortgages to avoid foreclosure,this will stop downward spiral of housing prices and stabilize market, require purchase of mortgages at fair value, not secret highly inflated value,… say fine print in revamped 137 page Paulson plan that Senate may vote on tonight,still gives Paulson/Bush admin all of the authority to do whatever they want …Insist that Congress should follow rules of procedure, hold hearings, listen to experts, deliberate and come up with a plan that will work.

Usually true, but the HOLC was a government program that was very effective in stemming the same crisis we see now (but too a much lesser extent if you look at the history – 25% unemployment in 1933)

to that OT, here (via TPM poster) is the statment from the police chief regarding charging the voctim and/or insurance company for the rape kit as taken from the Frontiersman newspaper

““In the past we’ve charged the cost of exams to the victims’ insurance company when possible,” Fannon says in the 2000 article. “I just don’t want to see any more burden put on the taxpayer.”

Senators spinning wildly that public is changing attitude about bailout. Both Martinez & Schumer were on CNBC saying their incoming constituent against/for changed dramatically after Monday’s stock market selloff.

i’m curious to know where they are getting their “data.” especially given the response the house members have been getting: House limits constituent e-mails to prevent crash

Kucinich on MSNBC is calling senate bailout a fraud.

Oooh! Just got through to Bill Nelson’s office. The nice young man who answered the phone hadn’t heard yet about Cummings and Doggett working on bringing back HOLC. He said he would definitely pass that along. I encouraged him to have someone on staff contact Cummings or Doggett staff. I also told him I didn’t want to see the Senator support anything like the Paulson proposal. He said he had heard a lot of that sentiment today. He also said Nelson hasn’t yet made up his mind what he is going to do. I brought up the Sanders amendment and he agreed with me that it would be tough to get Republican support for that. Now to go back to trying for Martinez’ line. It keeps dumping to a full mailbox.

Kucinich on tee vee: “This is an outrage…Tax breaks for banks…This is a fraud what the Senate is doing…They are beating the drums like they did to push the War in Irak.”

I could not say it better myself.

Have any of you pups read the Soros plan that he is floating to the dems?

Here is a snippet:

Soros described the plan he outlined in his concept paper in an opinion editorial that appeared in the Financial Times early Wednesday morning, Greenwich Meridian Time.

“Instead of purchasing troubled assets, the bulk of the funds ought to be used to recapitalize the banking system,” Soros wrote.

“The Treasury secretary would rely on bank examiners rather than delegate implementation of [the Troubled Asset Relief Program] to Wall Street firms,” he wrote in reference to the plan first crafted by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. “The bank examiners would establish how much additional equity capital each bank needs in order to be properly capitalized according to existing capital requirements.”

I heart him

Congress gleefully passed a whopping record-breaking budget for the Pentagon without hesitation or pause. They’ve already jumped the shark many times over. I speak of a Congress we don’t actually have, unfortunately.

I believe DeFazio and other proponents are calling it “The No BAILOUTS Act.” BAILOUTS is an acronym for Bringing Accountability, Increased Liquidity, Oversight, and Upholding Taxpayer Security:

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2008/10/01

I think they’re just pulling it out of their asses. CNBC anchors doing same thing. Can you spell self-serving?

I’ve switched to CSPAN’s broadcast of Brookings seminar on the crisis. Some of those jerks say the most amazing things.

Good. I’m still trying to get through to Boxer. Good sign that so many of my fellow californians are calling?

With all due respect, I disagree with both of you. The underlying problem with the credit crisis that banks have no idea what assets they have and therefore don’t trust each other. This has real time effect on the abilities of companies to make short term loans to cover payroll, etc. Stablilizing foreclosures, through a program which has proven to work in the past is a great stop gap measure to at least bring the TED spread under control.

In a comment last night, I do argue for comprehensive reform in the new congress, where proper hearings can be held so that we can obtain empirical evidence regarding what exactly happened with Paulson and why he favored AIG over Lehmann Brothers. Just giving the Bush Administration a sack of dollars with no oversight has a proven track record of abject failure in the past and should not happen at anytime, even in an eventual Obama administration.

Roubini on HOLC

hint, he’s angling for a whole new entity:

Thus, the time of dithering and using band-aid to deal with the financial storm of the century is over and the time to act boldly is now! Lets create the HOME (Home Owners’ Mortgage Enterprise) now!

ps- they are all scared sh**less over at his place today – carrumba!

Oh, and Selise, I’ve thought it over last night and I have changed my mind a tad about doing something now…..

It’s interesting that James Galbraith is an advisor on this. He was one of those recently commenting to the effect that there is no financial crisis.

he nailed it last night by calling it “IMMORAL”

Ringleader DeFazio’s statement about the No Bailout Act:
http://www.defazio.house.gov/i…..038;id=441

John Nichols’s article in The Nation about the No Bailout Act:
http://www.thenation.com/blogs…..ilouts_act

The full text of the No Bailouts Act:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..460/615860

And, again, Ian’s comments on the No Bailout Act:
http://firedoglake.com/2008/09…..azio-bill/

n my opinion, the Paulson bill won’t solve the problem, but will only push it back 6 months or so, at great cost to ordinary taxpayers. If the Paulson bill isn’t defeated we’re going to be back here again, a lot poorer, trying to do this right.

The Paulson bill, or better yet,the Dodd-Frank bill solve the IMMEDIATE problem of market credit freeze (illiquidity). This is amuch more immediate problem than the systemic problems (which aren’t even going to be addressed until the next congress…) Paulson, Dodd and Frank are pretty upfront about all this. They’re not trying to solve the sub-prime crisis with the rescue package. They’re trying to solve the immediate problem of keeping boats afloat in a gathering storm. That the sub-prime crisis (and attendant lack of regulation) led to the liquidity crunch doesn’t mean that solving the sub-prime crisis will lead to a solution in the liquidity markets going tits up. It doesn’t work that way: the bulls already inthe china shop and closing the door behind him won’t change the immediate issue.

My subscription expired (to RGE). If you have access, can you give us a synopsis of the entire article?

While I still stand opposed to Wealthfare for Wall Street (aka, the Paulson Atrocity), I now can say that the corporate tax cuts included in the Senate version are OK: essentially, they are the tax credits to wind and solar energy companies that are desperately needed.

The Rethugs want all such cuts to be offset with cuts in services for actual human beings in need (as usual). Same with Blue Dog Rethuglicrats.

I’m all for offsets too: the simplest/biggest/fastest way to offset any actual needed tax cuts is to cut missile defense, cease any more orders for the F-22 Raptor, end the Iraq Debacle, and change the focus of the Afghanistan Debacle from military 1st and foremost to actual, local development aid (not the Milton Friedman version of “development aid”).

I have a question, maybe it’s already been answered and I missed it, but–does anybody here know in what way will raising the FDIC insured limit from $100,000 to $250,000 change, well, anything?? Who does it help? How does it make any difference in the bailout crisis?

scared sh**less over at his place today

They should be. The economy is dropping like a stone. The Institute for Supply Management manufacturing report for September was published at 10amET this morning. It is the first report for the previous month. Not a government effort, but a very good cyclical indicator. The new orders number, 38.8 is the depths of past deep recessions. CNBC just reports that it was “weaker than expected,” without any added commentary on HOW weak it was. Scroll down to the table and look at the new orders number, which is the leading indicator part of the report.
http://www.ism.ws/ISMReport/MfgROB.cfm

September unemployment rate gets published Friday at 8:30amET. It’s likely to be verrrry weak.

fyi – i posted a comment earlier today on the senate’s unanimous consent agreement yesterday for debate and voting today on the sellout bailout. a quick update to that : cspan is reporting that the debate will start when the senate returns from their lunch break at 2:15pm and the vote is expected at 9pm.

Foreign markets (especially London’s, which has been hit much harder than ours by the credit crunch) are freaking out:

In the last two days, governments from London to Berlin have seized or bailed out five faltering banks. In Ireland, where rumors of panicked withdrawals from banks spooked the stock market, the government has offered a two-year blanket guarantee on all deposits and bank debt.

Asia has been less buffeted by the turmoil, though a brief run on a bank in Hong Kong last week brought back dark memories of June 1997, when speculation against the Thai currency sparked a financial crisis that fanned rapidly across Asia, and later to Brazil and Russia.

Economists see a parallel between these two crises a decade apart: once creditors panic and begin to pull out their holdings, the underlying health of banks — or entire countries — no longer matters a great deal. In a global financial system, national borders are porous.

“In this day and age, a bank run spreads around the world, not around the block,” said Thomas Mayer, the chief European economist at Deutsche Bank. “Once a bank run is under way, it doesn’t matter anymore if you have good loans or bad loans. People lose confidence in you.”

In a sign of how vulnerable Russia remains to contagion, officials halted trading on the Moscow stock exchange for two hours on Tuesday morning, fearing investor reaction to the House’s rejection of the Bush administration’s bailout plan. Trading resumed, and after President Bush vowed to win approval of the package, shares bounced back.

“People ask, ‘What on earth is happening with Russia?’ ” said Roland Nash, chief analyst at Renaissance Bank in Moscow. “Russia is reacting to the unprecedented size, complexity and danger coming out of the U.S.”

What about the risk of letting a rapist go free because there was not enough evidence?

It is supposed to help small business who have large working cash balances in their checking accounts. Theory is that you don’t want them to take a big hit if a bank fails. Can’t vouch for veracity of what I just said, merely repeating what I hear.

As I see it (I am not an expert) it is a psychological ploy to prevent a run on the banks. I mean, insurance is only as good as the assets behind it. If it got bad, presumably they’d just crank up the printing presses. 25 percent inflation anyone?

We’re headed for a depression. Might as well stock up on what you can, and learn to grow food plants and animals.

FDIC uses an actuary model that can only be sustained in a period of general normality. Raising the limit is utterly meaningless in the current context.

I favor three policies regarding the govt purchasing toxic assets:
– mortgages only, no derivatives (If one purchases the underlying mortgages, its derivatives evaporate. Meanwhile, the govt can do things with it, like refinance.)
– owners get right of first refusal, whenever their mortgage is changes hands; i.e., they can purchase the mortgage by simply matching the price.
– establish a latter-day HOLC to help homeowners refinance and/or acquire their mortgages.

Where do you get that from? It doesn’t appear that he was saying that in an interview with Harpers.

Truthdig
http://www.truthdig.com/cartoo…..liberator/

It doesn’t perforce spread around the world. The Asian and S. American crises occurred within those spheres.

The effect of poor judgment on the part of fiduciaries all over is the basis of the problem today.

Raising the FDIC limit would make me feel better anyhow.

the link is from my temporary ?/ current ? subscription

it is his whole piece on it

thanks eCAHN, . . .I think X~o

gotta go and see if anyone is spending any hard earned cash on lunch today.
bbl

made all the requisite calls this morning – To The Phones ‘dogs !!!!

Oh, and Selise, I’ve thought it over last night and I have changed my mind a tad about doing something now…..

LOL. i was just reading the response you very kindly left me last night.

Muchas we NEED reason, sanity, and humanity to prevail; doubtless, one way or another, as you say, “The fix is in.”

But the Political Class, wishing to suck up further to the Ruling Class, have forgotten ‘the people’, who, wonder of wonders, are not only paying attention, they are realizing what has ‘gone on’. The fact that this ‘bailout’ mania rewards those who for decades have looted and plundered this society has penetrated the ceredral cortexs of many people and they are not happy.

‘Change’, well beyond what any of the Political Class have imagined, is in the air.

Will the progressive community be able to step up and say, “We have some good ideas about creating AND sustaining the kind of future which all caring, reasonable, and thoughtful (we must encourage the notion that thinking is actually healthy and may be very ‘rewarding’)human beings can embrace, invest in and trust to be better for ALL human beings and not just obscenely benefit a few, clever, manipulative, fearful and small-minded greedy little souls?

Or will the ‘community’ just continue to be reactive, defensive, and falsely modest? Worrying about how EVERYTHING benefits the thugs, without risking putting out better, more humane possibilities.

There appears to be opportunity. People generally want real, substantive ‘change’, and not just something that ‘looks’ good, but, rather, something that ‘feels’ good.

How long a time has it been since that (if ever it was) was true in this nation?

I mean, don’t we all feel better (even when the ‘news’ is not ‘good’) when thoughtful, articulate, grown-up (grown ‘healthy’) adults like Ian demonstrate their capacity to make clear the choices facing us?

As opposed to the usual, self-serving, misleading BS of the Political Class?

Maybe Obama listens to and hears Ian’s thoughtful commentary?

You will permit me the audacity of hope in this regard?

You will also permit me to be disgusted with the prospect that Obama shall prove to be a small-minded neoliberal who feels there is a natural ‘elite’ who deserve all the acclaim, wealth, and power that they can get their hands on.

The people are not cynical, but the Political Class definitely is.

Lehman Hedge-Fund Clients Left Cold as Assets Frozen (Update1)
Other hedge funds are starting to get demands (today is the day)or can’t make the reserve requirement of 50%. Investors see recession even with cailout. As jobs disapear so does the safety net. Central banks across the world are bailing and dumping huge piles of money into the banks to stave off the calls on the shitpile.

What we need is a Dictator. Better yet, we need a Crazy Dictator.

OT: What number comes after Trillion?

Gee, I thought we already had a crazy Dictator. Guess I’ll have to follow your link to find out the difference.

A trillion and one.

Quadrillion. I think.

Set the debt limit to 1 quadrillion dollars, THAT would make it all easy because we have a long ways to go before we hit that number.

From A Bailout We Don’t Need:

Is this bailout still necessary?

The point of the bailout is to buy assets that are illiquid but not worthless. But regular banks hold assets like that all the time. They’re called “loans.”

With banks, runs occur only when depositors panic, because they fear the loan book is bad. Deposit insurance takes care of that. So why not eliminate the pointless $100,000 cap on federal deposit insurance and go take inventory? If a bank is solvent, money market funds would flow in, eliminating the need to insure those separately. If it isn’t, the FDIC has the bridge bank facility to take care of that.
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Next, put half a trillion dollars into the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. fund — a cosmetic gesture — and as much money into that agency and the FBI as is needed for examiners, auditors and investigators. Keep $200 billion or more in reserve, so the Treasury can recapitalize banks by buying preferred shares if necessary — as Warren Buffett did this week with Goldman Sachs. Review the situation in three months, when Congress comes back. Hedge funds should be left on their own. You can’t save everyone, and those investors aren’t poor.

His concerns are more ‘fiscally’ focused than actually trying to solve the crime, it would seem, no?

i just got through to senator kerry’s office. was told that he supports the bailout. i asked for a copy of the legislation so that i could take a look at it, and was told that as far as he (the person, probably an intern, who answered the phone) knew the bill was not available for citizen review – but that it was now over 400 pages long.

now over 400 pages long

That’s encouraging.
/s

i’m listening to cspan2 now – they are currently debating the benefits of selling india nuclear technology even though they have not signed on to the NPT.

if we do this, imo, we have sealed the deal on conflict with pakistan. stupid.

Geez selise, you’re just full of good news this morning.

please don’t shoot the messenger and i’ll try to keep my cool today. *g*

*g* back on you.

Kind of on point, I had very interesting discussion with my (today – yay!) 11-year old about what’s so objectionable about George W. Bush and, after thinking about it, said his inability to accept any other viewpoints than his own due to his lack of curiosity and ignorance.

I like to think that us lefties/progressives/what ever name you want to apply here greatest quality is to adapt to different view point to come to a solution that benefits all involved. In a round and about way it is actually the true free market – the marketplace of ideas run amok.

So, I therefore buy into doing something meaningful now when the time is ripe and I think that creating a new HOLC would certainly fit that bill.

wow. not available for citizen review, huh? Here I always thought they worked for the citizens. how silly of me

They are going to vote on this piece of crap in nine hours, but the citizens are not yet allowed to see it. So much for governmental transparency under the Democrats.

please don’t shoot the messenger and i’ll try to keep my cool today

… for a change. ;-)

Well, they wouldn’t want to create a “run” on Congresspeople, would they? What we don’t know won’t hurt them. If they could keep the contents from us until after the election, I’m sure they would.

Actually, our Congress, mindful of the complexity of modern life, wish to spare us the chagrin of using our widdle minds (risking the very real possibility of brain damage or emotional discomfort).

That is what all good, loyal servants do.

They keep their masters happy.

I don’t know where you go from “there is no financial crisis” to what you are quoting here. If Galbraith was saying that in particular, I don’t think he would writing what you quote there.

Does he say what I (and a bunch of other people here) are saying that the bailout is a S**t sandwich the taxpayers are being asked to wolf down? Absolutely.

In fact, Galbraith is saying what I say here is that:

“comprehensive reform in the new congress, where proper hearings can be held so that we can obtain empirical evidence regarding what exactly happened with Paulson and why he favored AIG over Lehmann Brothers.”

In other words, do the HOLC now to stabilize the market and do proper reform later, as you say in your quoted article.

So raising the FDIC limit is just another instance of the typical repub ploy of “supporting” small businesses without actually doing anything? But I thought that the crisis was about BIG businesses, why hang something for small businesses that doesn’t have anything to do with resolving the current problem onto the new bill and expect that it will do something to garner more yes votes? This was originally Obama’s idea, right? What does it fix? I mean the problem was that home mortgages were failing in sufficient numbers to cause huge amounts of the assets of big banks to lose value in a big way, right? Is this a matter of “we think that the NEXT big effect of the crisis will be small businesses going under because their account balances are too large for FDIC- so we’re going to fix it before it happens”?

Can’t get thru to Cornyn or Hutchison here in TX.

Calculated Risk has a link to a WSJ PDF of the bill here.

Raising FDIC protection is not the core part of the “plan.” It is an ornament. At 400 pages, there will be plenty of ornaments. It’ll probably take a month to sort them all out.

Howard Fineman said last night that this idea has been around for a while and is not Obama or anybody’s in particular, but Obama was “smart enough” to claim it first yesterday. So, no, it’s not his idea, and a lot of people smarter than me think it will be helpful, although I have no clue why?

Just watched the impressive Couric/Palin kabuki dance from last night. Couric does not ask one question about the economy and what to do about it, or Iraq and foreign relations.

Instead Couric serves up so much red meat that it makes me think it’s part of a strategy to help out Mooselini:

What newspapers do you read? (What kind of a question is this?!?!?!) For many Repubes and undecideds, Sarah’s response is a positive since, “She don’t need no stinkin LIBRUL media. Good for her!”

Abortion: Perennial issue which inflames debate. Couric lets her dodge her extreme position, and let’s her last words be “life begins at conception and I wanna reduce abortions.” Majority of viewers don’t get sense of how extreme Palin is by not allowing abortion even in cases of rape and incest-a truly horrifying stance.

Gays: Gay marriage was intentionally used as a wedge issue last election. Couric helps revive it for this one.

DeeCee Establishment: Biden sucks and “aw shucks. I’m just a “normal” person from Alaska.” Brief mention of hypocrisy since McInsane is the Prez candidate, and then “move along, nothing to see here.”

ANWAR: Hey, McInsane and Flailin are both mavericks, so not gonna agree on everything…HAHAHA! Next question!

Global warming: There’s been a coordinated effort to dismiss humankind’s role in advancing global warming in recent years. Couric serves it up nicely for Palin to make the Lush Limpdick and Pox Newz audiences happy.

Religion and Evolution in schools: Palin likes to pray. What’s so wrong with that you silly LIBRULS! Oh, and science should be taught in science class. No follow-up of Palin’s stated extreme views on “creationism” should be taught in schools.

Again, nothing about the most important and pressing issues she would face if elected and McInsane keels over. The complexity of these issues and Palin’s incoherant responses to them would likely end their campaign, so Couric is able to appear “tough” and “fair” at the same time handing the dog whistle to Palin for her to blow.

a very happy birthday to your 11-year old, and wishes for many more to come.

I like to think that us lefties/progressives/what ever name you want to apply here greatest quality is to adapt to different view point to come to a solution that benefits all involved.

very well said.

i now think i’ve been very wrong in the past about some things. when i remember that, i know i could be just as wrong today. you’ve described (and shown by your actions) what is the gold standard for us – even when i fail to live up to it, it is still what i aspire to. thank you.

thank you!

Just got through to Reid’s office. They said the bill is posted here (and it is).

451 pages! how did it go so quickly from 3 pages to 100+ pages to 451? all in less than a week. it doesn’t pass the smell test, just like the bill itself.

OT
Bill Clinton rally for Obama just starting on CSPAN 1

Not so fast – this comes with other headaches.

Numero uno will be John McCain – bragging (god I can already hear it) how he intervened and stopped the Democrats from pushing the other bill through.

Next comes all the House Dems so foaming at the mouth in fear of loosing their seats, and yet so publicly in praise of the Republican House members who fought the “Pelosi” bill.

Great. But it’s getting worse…
Now comes more House Dems like Kucinich, appearing on TV – and thanking John Baynor and Cantor and the other House Rep. for not allowing the “Democrats” bail out.

It’s odd FDL thinks this is a good bill and Kucinich too – without knowing what the Republicans have and will do. It’s never pretty.
Is this a new Dennis? a new FDL?

KOS knows, and therefore offers this headline:

Bailout About To Get Worse: You’ve Got To Freaking Be Kidding Me

yeah. well, it’s only october – but i decided i needed to start a new year’s resolution early.

Thanks, Jim. Good work.

They didn’t have time to write a short law.

The legislative analyst that write these bills are under lobbyist pressure to protect Wall Street interests over Main Street business and citizen interest. Fascism is marching on and the food banks are ovewr whelmed as are the competition for space in the growing tent cities.
Was it Paul Revere that rde through the countryside warning “the fascist are coming”.

BBL folks. My mower calls.

A few years ago when my son bought a house there was a requirement that anyone who didn’t make a substantial down payment had to buy mortgage insurance. In all of the talk of the mortgage crisis I have never heard that insurance mentioned. Isn’t its purpose to protect lenders if the home owner defaults on his loan?

Got this from an “entrepreneur’s” group.

This offers a peak from the conservative side of things.

[The accompanying e-mail says, as a first point before this attachment: “pray hard” - yep that’ll work /s]

While it appears that they’re on board with fixing some of the predatory mortgage problems including pre-payment penalty issues (unfortunately there is a focus on “sub-prime = poor folks = that’s the cause, which any meaningful observer knows is false)

Of note is this part:

“III. CAPITAL GAINS TAX
a. Remove the capital gains tax completely. Investors will flood the real estate and stock
market in search of tax-free profits, creating tremendous—and immediate—liquidity in
the markets. Again, this costs the taxpayer nothing.”

The conservative mind at work: “Tax cuts costs nothing!”

Hat? Huh?

Numero uno will be John McCain – bragging (god I can already hear it) how he intervened and stopped the Democrats from pushing the other bill through.

Numero uno will be John McCain – bragging (god I can already hear it) how he intervened and stopped the Democrats from pushing the other bill through.
IMHO, the Republican strategy will be to blame this bill on the Democrats, particularly Obama. I’m sure that the ads are already prepared and will be on TVs around the nation tomorrow morning.

I agree.

[smiling proudly]

Thank you! It’s what it’s all of this about – creating a proper future for everyone.

Bill’s still good!

DING DING DING!

PMI – Private Mortgage Insurance
If you owe more than about 80% of your house’s value, you are forced to pay PMI, usually several hundred dollars per month. What happened to this money?

“Insurance” is an integral part of the scam. Not only the kind you’re talking about, but also there was “insurance” on the tranches of MBS. All worthless. Do you remember there was portfolio “insurance” before the 1987 crash? I had forgotten about that, but a friend reminded me a couple of days ago.

Think AIG.

What the Senate is doing is reprehensible, and the classic case of putting lipstick on the pig. Rather than fix the real defects of this bill- attacking the mortgages themselves, rather than “hoping” if we make the rich rich enough, they will take pity on the poor, what Galbraith has called “feeding more oats to the horse in the hopes that some undigested ones will pass through to the birds”.

So they offer unrelated bribes (logrolling) as an inducement to vote for the bill. And as the Senate (the good ol rich boys club that Andrew Bacevich accurately describes has only one purpose: to ensure incumbents get reelected.

Most of the cosmetic fixes are just that. Increasing FDIC insurance does nothing that splitting accounts or adding beneficiaries won’t do. It has already been shown by the National Bureau of Economic Research that attempting to limit CEO pay by capping allowing corporate deductions is ineffective.

And to argue that the attempts to create wealth from derivatives has been known for years.

They’re loading it up with goodies to get the votes. This may turn into a real porkfest!

IMHO, the Republican strategy will be to blame this bill on the Democrats, particularly Obama. I’m sure that the ads are already prepared and will be on TVs around the nation tomorrow morning

Yep, just like they planned to do with the original bill.

This is why the “insurance” idea being floated by conservatives is a loathsome piece of crap and only serves to kick the can down the road for a while and worry about the bill later – you know modern conservative policy – borrow now, worry about paying it back later.

Bailout a Done Deal, So What Happens Now?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..30820.html

I fully support Ian’s efforts about calling and expresing opposition to what is still ‘Paulson’s bill’ BUT also realize that we are not really represented and that the pressures being brought will be too much for many people seeking re-election.

As a quick aside, see this about the market bouncing yesterday:
“Last-Minute Share Rises Cause Trading Suspicions”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10…..ref=slogin

“Why voting against the bailout still makes sense”
http://www.marketwatch.com/new…..aspx?guid={CF8BDB02-793E-4AB3-9163-3B67AC781A98}

As far as I’m concerned, this is all a manipulation by some rich mofo’s; I can’t get an answer to who the ‘dozen or so’ banks that report their ‘overnight lending rates’ to the British banking Assc.( more vestigal appendages of colonialism); if these banks won’t loan to each other at a reasonable rate, take them over, kick out those running them, and ‘grease the wheels’.

This IS the AUMF and the Patriot Act bundled together.

EMERGENCY! EMERGENCY! MUST ACT NOW! DO IT DO IT DO IT OR WE ALL DIE!

Then, plop, here’s a nice, fat bill that NO ONE will actually read but everyone will, nonetheless vote for. Months later, when eyes actually DO read the particulars, they will opine that they didn’t have time to read it and had to act BECAUSE IT WAS AN EMERGENCY! HAD TO ACT! NO TIME TO THINK!

We need to clear out the entire lot of both houses of Congress. They are incompetent or criminal or both, from top to bottom.

CEO pay is a red herring; the real failure of the Paulson plan is that it does NOTHING to address the housing crisis which is the root of the credit crunch.

We live in the same constituency.

You sexist! You are calling Palin a pig with lipstick!

So, we’ve all been paying PMI, but our Insurance co went broke paying off all those other mortgages? And now the banks are coming after us for those (insured) mortgages? Isn’t the point of insurance that the banks have to turn to the insurance co for repayment, not the homeowner? What about those of us who are STILL paying PMI? Are we throwing money away on something that will never be of use to us?

Trust me darling … this is lipstick on the “Bailout Pig”. Does it come with an executive summary and a conclusion!

There is a problem out there that no one is identifying what it is. In the S & L problem everyone points at Keating and he was a bad guy but the real reason for the failure of the industry. The S & L s had portfolios filled with 5% mortgages and less and their cost of funds in order to compete w/ banks was significantly more. Additionally congress eliminated tax deductions for real estate investors who were not hands on. Therefore all of the doctors, lawyers etc mailed in their keys on a lot of property which then went belly up. Something here stinks and maybe it is this insurance scam.

good grief 451 pages? how are members supposed to read this in order to make an educated vote? oh wait, they aren’t

What city? i’m in Palos Verdes Peninsula

If the Dems are going to be blamed by the repubs anyway, why don’t the Dems create a Democratic bill that will be passed by the Democratic majority, that the Dems can take sole CREDIT for??

So we can back the Isaac and Galbraith suggestions. Thank goodness.

Make calls.

I’m calling but can’t through to my senate critters.

Just FYI, I used to work for a developer at the time, and he was doing a masterplanned community on nearly 35K acres. Many, many investors! One was a dentist, and when he lost everything, he committed suicide. I have always felt that that crash was largely the fault of that change in the investment rules midstream. You could trace back to almost the day, I remember Sept. 15, 1987, when the bottom fell out of the land market!

yes; does that surprise you given all that is going on?

Mortgage Insurance was used for a single loan over 80% of Loan to value. the Banks got smart and realized they could make two loans, a first at 80% and a second (Heloc, at a higher interest rate) of 20%.

The banks made more money from the two loans. The consumer paid about the same amount as they would have with one loan with mortgage insurance.

Mortgage Insurance protects the bank from your default. Not you from the bank’s default.

AS soon as you loan goes below 80% LTV, you have to apply to get the mortgage insurance removed.

Fountain Valley.

There was a saying when I was at university

“Bullshit baffles brains”

I’m disturbed particularly because many of these same Dems were not on board with Obama -choosing to play the ass kissing ‘uncommitted’ delegate until the last minute.

Reid Schumer Emanuel and Hoyer -and these other insiders – will pull the same tricks they’ve used for the past 7 elections to NOT help Obama.
It isn’t in their interests to help him win, nor is it in their interests to have a flood of new Progressive Congressmen kick their asses back home.

Here in Az we have dozens of low and middle income properties that were bulldozed for high priced condo and town home communities – but aren’t selling.

Only 7% of the failures were from the lower income brackets – and those were almost all directly related to health and job related issues.

This is greed on greed action creating ganging up to rape pillage and plunder what remains of the American peasant, while Reid and Hoyer and McCain watched.

This strikes me as a very bad idea. How can anyone predict what the value will be in the future? It’s like pulling a figure out of the ether.

Market Watch summary on the Bailout;
“So faced with all that, there’s a credible and defensible argument against a bailout bill that will cost yet another $700 billion. The entire notion of a “Wall Street bailout” is hugely unpopular with American voters on principle. And voters will wind up thinking the bill is a failure because they’re going to be in a recession anyway.”

Washington, DC-Today USSA President Carmen Berkley released a statement (below) about the current economic situation facing students. Please read it, forward it to a friend, post it on facebook, and call your representative or senator to let them know students need federal financial protection too. Call (202) 224-3121

“Students are in disagreement with a Wall Street bailout on the backs of students and working families in this country. We all know that American college students are graduating with more debt than ever before. Nearly two thirds of the 15 million college students (over 66 percent) graduate into debt that averages $19,300.

The United States is loosing jobs at record volumes and both low income and middle-income families are facing economic crises. The last thing young people will stand for is a golden parachute for Wall Street. Young people make up one of the largest voting blocs in this election and students are making a genuine and decisive impact in this 2008 cycle.

Where is the golden parachute for students, and the families that help them pay for an opportunity to realize the American Dream? We cannot stand by while parents take out fewer loans because of economic hardship forcing financial burden on the youth of the United States.

One thing is clear, this economic crisis will affect the United States for years to come and the generation that will suffer this burden in the long term is the youth of our nation. Student debt and this economic bailout will place more financial restraint on Americans struggling to pay off college loans. A generation of college graduates will not have the purchasing power that is anticipated and will scarcely be able to contribute to a slowing economy if nothing is done to protect them.

We call on congress to stand united in this election to say no more bailouts on the backs of students and working families in the United States. If congress is to pass out any golden parachutes before they break for recess, we ask that they save one for students too.”

Wall Street has been running out of liquid capital for some time now due to the inevitable effects of the faith-based sub-prime mortgage Ponzi scheme. The Fed, (a private, quasi-governmental institution) has been taking extraordinary steps to infuse capital into the largest failing money/credit/insurance processing corporations – basically by taking them over and re-assigning their debts. The Fed “Well” has run dry of its capacity to generate wealth by fiat via the Federal Reserve System The U.S. banking system is unable to continue to fund the Wall Street faith-based party further because of the increased cash on hand reserves required for their value-overstated holdings. The Federal Reserve System, failing in its Critical Mission to keep a stable U.S. monetary and fiscal system afloat, has now cried for uncle- as in Uncle Sam, the heretofore unknown government agency we can now call the Federal Taxpayer Reserve System.

Paulson’s Plan is a trickle down approach. The plan sprays $700 billion of as of yet non-existent taxpayer money onto Wall Street, which will reap huge fees for those companies Paulson selects to process this new Wall Street windfall. The idea is that Wall Street will assign “realistic” and specific dollar worth values to individual swaps and mortgage “packages” held by the banking system and insurers. The U.S. taxpayer would then “own” (as Soros calls them) “the dregs” of the economic barrel, while the “good stuff” will be held by Paulson’s Pals.

Last night, Representative Dennis Kucinich called the current bailout plan immoral.

What Soros proposes is to bypass Paulson’s Pals altogether, and to have the individual banks holding the questionable “securities” assign values, which can then be sold to the Federal Taxpayer Reserve System directly. By bypassing Wall Street, Soros estimates a monetary impact leverage increase of 12 times the actual money spent purchasing the mystical securities. (In the retail trade, this process is called Eliminating the Middle Man – in this case the Wall Street Aging Wunderkinds who created all these faith-based, sucker seeking securities in the first place.)

Soros also calls for lowering the minimum cash on hand requirements so important in containing the S&L debacle from the Reagan/Bush era.
(He calls the lowering “increase their leverage” of the recapitalized banks.)

Soros also critically calls for addressing the very root cause of the problem – renegotiating mortgage terms between the principals, making Wall Street participation in the process unnecessary, further keeping their fees/commissions to approximately zero dollars to the taxpayer.

If I seem unduly harsh of Mr. Paulson, let me explain. I have been a payer of federal taxes longer than Mr. Paulson has.
Mr. Paulson until recently headed Goldman Sachs. The approximately $750 million dollars he made at Goldman Sachs was in no small part due to his creating and selling the securities which Secretary Paulson is now in such a hurry to have Wall Street resell (the worst of those securities) to the U.S. Taxpayer – that would be me. Enough!

P.S. When Mr. Paulson left Goldman to become the U.S. Treasury Secretary, Goldman Sachs decided it had to much exposure in the magical mortgage securities market, and unloaded them onto other “innocents”. That is why Goldman Sachs stands today, and why Lehman Brothers, a competitor to Goldman, is gone.

I used the term faith-based in the context of (.. the full faith and credit of the U.S. Government – that which lacking, the U.S. dollar is merely artistically colored paper.)

Some AICPA documents on fair value and mark-to-market accounting:

http://www.aicpa.org/mediacenter/fva_faq.htm

Thanks Ian.

digg

Depends how its done. But I have no confidence in them doing it right.