voting has begun. 15 min. on cspan

BT! Have to go read now.

Yes, I’ll update after the vote is completed.

The House is getting ready to bend the America people over

And KY stock goes through the roof!

So far, we’ve got 109 yeas and 78 nays.

check out this graphic (posted by bernhard) if you want to cry:

Der Spiegel is a German weekly magazine comparable to Time magazine but with a bit higher relative circulation and about three or four times as thick. The current title picture shows the Statue of Liberty with its flame blown out.

The Price of Haughtiness
An economic crisis is changing the world

Current tally:

112 yeas, 93 nays

I could be wrong, but I think this is a vote on concurring in senate amendment with an amendment. The next vote will be on the bill.
Selise?

Updated count:

122 yeas, 114 nays

well, since it brought Boner to tears, I’m thinking that this must be at least *something* of an important vote. /s

asked this earlier –

what in the world would compel Adam Putnam to vote as Boehner/Blunt want him to ?!?!? – this guy had one viable talking point in the upcoming election and he now appears to be taking it off the table

any of you inside baseball types wanna tell me what possibly could they have offered him ??

Digg it here.

from chris floyd, deja vu all over again:

In fact, this has already happened once in the last 20 years: hardly outside the living memory of many if not most of our media mavens and political operators. The Savings and Loan meltdown — which, once again, saw the Bush Family in the thick of the muck — resulted in a gargantuan bailout of, yes, fraudsters and grafters….like Neil Bush, for one. They wrecked vast financial institutions, devoured pensions, destroyed businesses, ruined the lives of millions of people — and got away clean. What’s more, the extremist doctrine of unregulated greed that led to the crisis was not only not discredited by this crimeful and shameful episode — it was exalted to new heights a short time later… by a young, hip, “progressive” Democratic president elected on a platform of “hope and change,” replacing a failed, incompetent, and highly unpopular Republican president named George Bush.

Yes, it was Bill Clinton, “the Man from Hope,” who oversaw the accelerated dismantling of nearly all of the remaining checks and balances on rapacious Big Money greed. It was Clinton who helped lay the groundwork for outright criminal enterprises like Enron and “legitimate” criminal enterprises like Hank Paulson’s Goldman Sachs and all the other high flyers who gamed a system that suddenly had no rules, except one: make your pile and screw everybody else. (It was also Clinton who gave billions to Halliburton and other war profiteers in a vast “privatization” of the U.S. military, laying the foundation for the world-historical thievery of Bush’s corporate cronies in the killing fields of Iraq; but that’s another story.)

This is the big one.

UPDATE:

136 yeas, 136 nays!

I know it’s snark but has he actually made with the waterworks recently? He’s such a sensitive man.

Elizabeth

Oh boy…Has Nancy passed out yet?

Love your “photo” on Digg!

he’s a fucking fruticake

wonder how Ron Paul’s going to vote….

Does it require only a simple majority to pass?

UPDATE

155 yeas, 148 nays

3 minutes to go.

Yes.

Gotcha. Thanks.
It sure is nice to see a Full House today, isn’t it?

Boehner enlisted in the United States Navy during the height of the Vietnam War. He was discharged after eight weeks of training because of a bad back.[1]

fuckin sissy ass wimp

voting so far has the majority of dems voting “yea” and a majority of the republicans voting “nay”

remind me again why we worked so hard to give control of congress to the dems? i’ve forgotten.

UPDATe

162 yeas, 166 nays

Thanks, guess I’m just photogenic.

bom dia pups

here’s to hoping that this sucker flops on its face

he’ll vote no as it’s a stretch to say this is something the Constitution empowers the federal government to do.

Boner literally had water streaming down his face over some Republican sham being pulled.

why did the leadership bring their precious compromise to the floor if they knew it was going to be this close?

it’s not going to pass

The kind with lots of you know what in it?

gun.to.head.

You mean other than today?

I dunno – can’t quite remember which specific issue he last cried about.

wiretapping?

they’re the party of the people and the republicans are the party of big business.

That’s what they kept telling us. Thanks to Clinton and Rahmbo now, not so much.

(bows) Konnichiwa, Wobbs

At least I don’thave to guess how my critter voted

188 to 207 now

defeated

DOW: -477.89 (-4.29%)

218 is the magic number either way.

Dow nosediving on likely no vote.

well. I actually support the idea of a bailout.. but this bill as it is, is fundamentally flawed.

time expired

They may not have the votes to pass this sucker.

Hey (((SD))) how are you?

Ds 126 to 82 (?)
Rs 59 to 119
total 188 to 207

time is up but voting continues

27 critters didn’t vote?

time expired

doesn’t really matter – I’ve seen votes where the *majority* of votes cast came after 0:00.

thanks, I was wondering if voting would continue

215 noes now . Down unless changed votes.

No’s at 220

bill did not pass unless they change votes

McCain is going to sing about those numbers!

Not gonna happen.

I think this thing’s toast.

Ds: 132 to 90
Rs 61 to 128

total: 193 to 220

time is up but voting continues

You vicious angry bloggers! Stop picking on the Boner, he is hurting! You bahstads are lucky he performs for you with the lobbyists.

Oy. Zero time on the clock, and they’re still counting votes.

time expired

looks like another thing that don’t mean nuthin

They don’t have the votes!!!

DOW: -625.56 (-5.61%)

Dow is plummeting

199 -223

Vote looks like it’s failed.

Why? He grudgingly said he would vote for it as well

can anyone see real time Dow quotes? what’s the market doing? (not the 5 minutes delayed thing)

Ds: 134 to 94
Rs 63 to 129

total: 199 to 223

time is up, voting continues

still plenty of time for the market to go down by about 750-800 points today.

and then we’ll be voting on something a little bit different in a few days….

There’s gotta be a lot of arm-twisting going on.

They need 25 votes and only 14 haven’t voted. It failed!!!!!!!!!

Dow down 644 pts, 6%

They will try to get votes to change … can keep vote open

Dow down 670

Gingrich supposedly said to vote yes

DOW: -672.47 (-6.03%)

I love the smell of crashing markets in the morning.

Isn’t trading suspended after a drop of 5%?

He is going to spin this as “his” party opposed it more…

Ds: 136 to 94
Rs: 65 to 131

total: 202 to 225

time is up, voting continues

calls for order are heard but ignored

I’m have it up real time. It is nosediving

Dow is plummeting

Dow’s gone vertical. Circuit breakers kick in at -1200.

Let them try the Bernie Sanders plan.

That F*cker was going to cry either way …

DOW: -625.56 (-5.61%)

Whoa! (been watching CSpan) – didn’t know it was that bad – already.

Marginally 133 repubs to 95 dems. that is roughly 40 critters difference. Not much to crow about

Looks like ninety five Dems finally came to their senses. Yippee, failure is a good thing!

The noes above 218. It’s defeated unless they twist arms like they did for the Medicare Prescription Act.

Ds: 139 to 95
Rs: 65 to 133

total: 204 to 228

time is up, voting continues

more calls for order. “madam speaker” “order” ignored

Isn’t trading suspended after a drop of 5%?

10%, I think.

205 yeas 228 nays with 1 R not yet voting

it keeps bobbing up and down between -500 and -600

The nays have it at 228 with no time remaining, but voting continues. (It’s like watching a basketball game where they score 23 more points after the buzzer.) If anyone wants a pony for Christmas, I suspect that they’re asking for it now.

I’m willing to lose money today on the market if the f*ckwads on Wall Street wind up in rags.

That’s just what Harwood just said on CNBC that they would do.

I think shrub should just resign right now. It’s the only sane thing to do.

Lots of calls for order.

Dow seems to improve – at least slightly – when vote is defeated – interesting

CNBC is in crazy mode

Ds: 140 to 95
Rs: 65 to 133

total: 205 to 228

voting continues. calls for order are heard and ignored.

Not much, but this IS McC we are talking about.

Where do we get to see how ours voted?

Thanks, jayt.

Link?

MSNBC showing market down 513.

It is currently at 205 yeas, 228 nays.

Oil’s around $97.

It’s worth the price if the Republics are rendered powerless.

DOW: -462.04 (-4.15%)

hmm market is heading up (for now)

Votes changing.

206-227 now.

BT has a link at the bottom of the post. Give it a while, though.

DOW

now maybe the adults will … I mean the economists who know something will provide the solution to our economy.

Nancy go home
Steny go home
Frank go home
Dodd go home

Term limits…. get some new blood and lock out for-profit lobbyists from congress

Pelosi is deficient in Republican votes, only 65. Imagine, if this passes with Democratic support only. Repeat after me. Worst Speaker Ever.

Ds: 141 to 94
Rs: 65 to 133 (1 R NV)

total: 206 to 227

voting continues despite calls for order.

“‘I don’t like it, and I don’t like the plan, but I see the constraints under which Dodd, Frank, Pelosi, and Reid were operating.’” — Krugman

Well, it wouldn’t have seemed so dishonest if Krugman had listed those constraints. Since he didn’t let’s imagine them: their families were kidnapped by Blackwater and are being held hostage to their votes, their bosses in organized crime made them an offer they couldn’t refuse, all of them really needed the money Paulson will pass them under the table they are just thoroughly corrupt, spineless individuals.

I’m sure I must have left something out…

Pelosi will keep the voting going until they’ve bullied enough to pass it.

He won’t say boo about this. This helps him in no way

Has the vote closed yet? I can’t see the TV right now

Hi, Wobbs. This certainly didn’t come out like I thought and I couldn’t be happier. Tigers got into a brawl earlier this morning. Just what I needed.

sorry, I like Dodd. the rest can go home

market is improving….

saw the DOW drop to -609 in the last 45 seconds of the vote

currently back up around -433

Is she going to stay there all night? Is she going to make a mockery out of it all? Like Delay did a few years ago?

Still frozen on 207-226.

rut roh. No tiger was harmed I take it? i’m thrilled this went down but looks like voting is still open.

Is this going to be another 15 minute vote they keep open until people vote “the right way”???

go figure

I called mine earlier – Lloyd Doggett – I can usually count on him, but this time his staff said there were things he was concerned about in the bill and they’d type my message and give it to him, so I don’t know this time.

I think Dow is bouncing because they are hearing that Pelosi didn’t close voting.

Who’s son is going to get a nice big campaign contribution for this one?

But I suspect there are just too many against to matter. If it takes Pelosi the same 3 hours as it took Delay, the markets will close without a bill.

More calls for order.

DOW: -361.76 (-3.25%)

still headed up. what does that mean?

remember the medicare drug bill the thugs pushed through with a 3 hour 15 minute vote?

As I recall, Nancy with the new regime said never again.

OK then.

Certain DOW stocks were being shorted based on the notion that they needed the bailout when they don’t in fact need it. Shorters had to buy to cover. It’s a charade as usual.

I think the noes should crash the Speaker’s platform and demand that the voting be stopped since the time has expired.

ah ha…

I say come up with a new plan.. stop wasting time.

Have Steney and Rahm just been punked?

I called the Execrable one (Lamar Smith) this morning. Haven’t seen how he voted yet but for once, he and I might be on the same side.

IIRC, the Rethugs kept the vote open for over three hours to pass the Pharmaceutical Bill (Medicare drugs).

Still at 207-226. Vote hasn’t been closed.

Yeah, the margin isn’t that great. The drop in the DOW will likely spook a few into changing their vote. I suspect if necessary, they’ll end up passing a slightly amended version.

Someone said earlier he gave a very good speech against it (pretty sure anyway).

some profit taking?

Ds: 141 to 94
Rs: 66 to 132 (1 R NV)

total: 207 to 226

voting continues – my clock is at 29 minutes

I owe you a beverage of your choice (140).

I have a repug congresscritter and I know he voted no. The only thing I have agreed with him on

have I ever mentioned that I *really* don’t understand this stuff?

P.S. – heading back down again.

Dow bouncing all over the place. now down 479

Paulson will pass them under the table they are just thoroughly corrupt, spineless individuals.

that’s it i’m guessing.

We’ll see. DOW:-453.44 (-4.07%)

Why haven’t they closed the vote? this is creepy

More calls for order.

Actually, I think they’re placing orders for what they get in return for changing their votes…

Order—One Maserati

Dow @ -461.

Absolutely mindboggling to see Democrats provide 68% of the support for a let’s bail out Bush’s criminal corporate cronies and his criminal administration.

You may need to switch to a calendar. *g*

that would make my day year.

Nah, all noise. Pelosi’s gonna pull a Delay and hold the vote open until it passes. Goddamn her to hell.

Could be lunch, too.

“Pastrami on rye.”
“I’ll have the chopped salad.”

I thought time for voting had expired?

Republicans and some Dems obviously lied about the way they would vote.

I have a ‘little-more-than-basic’ understanding (thanks GE requirements) but that ain’t saying much

good lord – Boner must be weeping uncontrollably by now….

Order—One Maserati

I got a bottle of Karo syrup for that sucker.

The dow is just about where it was when Jr. came into office. I’ve been thinking for a long while that he will go out as he came in regarding that and that only. On other fronts he’s absolutely trashed the country in more ways than we can count.

I hope the dems that voted no and (can’t believe I’m saying this) the repubs stay strong on this

Was there a link upthread to track how individual reps voted? If so I can’t seem to locate it.

Vote is not budging.

can we now say that the market is “flailing”?

He seemed a little drunk last night. I guess he usually is a little bit drunk.

They saw the polls and they’re all up for reelection.

Ds: 141 to 94
Rs: 66 to 132 (1 R NV)

total: 207 to 226

no change from last report.

voting continues – my clock is at 33 minutes

I don’t think they’ll post that until the vote is closed.

If true, it’ll be the only time I know of. Perfect name for him.

Arm twisting, money changing hands, dirty tricks, you and me getting fucked.

Hell no. He’s passing out finacial/tobacco checks.*g*

10 minutes and they’ve only gotten 2 to change

Oh I did not realize the reason the Boner was crying. He ate something that gave him a stomach ache. It was a crap sandwich on a bun. Paulson’s bun.

In a closed-door session with House Republicans, Minority Leader John A. Boehner just called the financial rescue deal a “crap sandwich” – then said he’ll vote for it when it comes to the floor Monday.

Thanks. Makes sense.

to say the least. who keeps yelling for order and why?

Going to his website to see if it’s posted. Thanks.

you don’t know until the vote is closed and registered.

Not like the Senate where they announce it.

They obviously had not thought about the consequences that the bill would not pass. And they made it seem that the votes were there. Now they are trying to twist arms…. very lovely.

Instead they should be making a mea culpea and soliciting proposals from economists and promising a complete revamp of the economic system to be on the floor in the 111 congress.

Now on to other business – OUT OF IRAQ

SLASH the DOD budget that they just rammed through.

Never too late for impeachment

Whoever is up for reelection this November D or R cannot vote yes on this bill. It’s political suicide.

I think whoever it is is trying to force gavel the count.

At that rate, it’ll take another hour or so.

Now, now, let’s not be hard on Nancy. She is showing leadership here while we’re just advocating silly things like fiscal responsibility and respect for the rules.

hmmm – now Mike Vaqueira (sp?), MSNBC congressional reporter, looks like *he’s* having a panic attack…

We have order!

they are all up for reelection except for those who are retiring or those who have been primaried out.

Time stands still when you want it to in their parallel universe

from the chair:
has every member voted?
does any member wish to change their vote?

someone answers yes…..

cousin Kagro X –

This is too many votes for them to twist arms for, I think. Depends on how many Members have fled the floor so they can’t be found for pressuring.

No votes have changed for quite some time now. They look to be stuck at 205, but haven’t brought the gavel down yet.

Found one! 206. Two! 207.

Looks like the wallflowers stayed away from the debate because they were voting no and didn’t want to be pressured, as opposed to voting yes and not wanting to go on TV and admit it.

Now Wall Street knows how I felt when they did this to me. I’m loving it.

I know this makes me a bad person.

205-228 announced.

total: 205 to 228
my clock is at 38 minutes

Be very careful about what you wish for.

Right on, girl. You’ve earned it.

I’m not watching cspan; does this mean it has failed?

Dow still doing bouncy bounce.

YES! Pa-leeze let that bill die! Bring it down on their heads (the bastards scrambling to save Wall Street Robber Barons from taking a bath).

Now let’s move to something that will be acceptable: 10% surtax on all incomes above $1 million/year for couples, $500,000/yr for singles AND a 0.25% tax on all stock and currency transactions. Let the f*cks that are drooling the heaviest for this wealthfare bill be the ones to actually pay for the fix.

They’re all up for reelection – this is the House.

yes. Motion to reconsider and other parliamentary stuff going on. But so far it’s a no go.

They have sent an air force jet to pick up McSame so that he may rescue the situation.

HERE HERE!

Word.

yea, the republicans will be all over that

but many are in safe seats.

I have been saying this for years at FDL – Term limits

Throw out these slackers.

NOW! NOW!

HEAR HEAR!!!!!

CNBC is in a frenzy … never seen so many hyperventilating folks in one room

See if congress didn’t pass this you can’t get a car loan or a student loan… yea right.

Now let’s move to something that will be acceptable: 10% surtax on all incomes above $1 million/year for couples, $500,000/yr for singles AND a 0.25% tax on all stock and currency transactions. Let the f*cks that are drooling the heaviest for this wealthfare bill be the ones to actually pay for the fix.

exactly. If it’s as bad as they say it is, then there has to be some give from the aristocrats.

Any chance they will come up with a better bill because of this?

Just asking.

What’s going on now? Suspend the rules and pass?

Trading haulted in gasoline and some other commodities – everything tumbling at once

well, there goes my tiny 401k. but i think they did the right thing, if they can only come back with a decent bill.

Has this bill been OFFICIALLY defeated?

True enough.

Re: Post Update that the bill failed – Has Pelosi halted the vote?

Now I can go back to work with a smile on my face. Can’t wait to get in boss’s face.

Maybe all the vibes from us peons helped.

Be good to yourselves, and all other living things.

Namaste

CNBC is in a frenzy …

Has Cramer popped an aneurysm yet?

they can’t pass it … it’s done and now its back to … who knows

You’re so cute.
It’s been a billion years since I took a civics course. What do you think of FDL having a How Your Government Works 101 seminar?

What they mean is, we can’t get a loan from them.

The loans will be made by others.

One of the few times I wish I had cable.

Boy I chose the right (couple) weeks to start buying gold.

The house was not going to be open tomorrow for Jewish holiday Rosh Hashanah (sp)

yes. “better” in the sense that now they will have to bribe the plebes with something sweet to make the medicine go down.

I have been saying this for years at FDL – Term limits

Throw out these slackers.

I don’t agree. First of all, I think voters should have the right to elect or reelect anyone they want, maybe there are steps that could be taken to level the playing field so that incumbents don’t have such a big advantage. Secondly, term limits would force out the handful of really exemplary reps like Kucinich.

actually, in the face of one more large failure, or one step closer to major collapse . . .

Democrats should be out there screaming McStunt emboldened the terrorists in the House

no, they haven’t dug a stake in it yet. motion to reconsider—who knows where that will go.

I keep thinking about the women, the wives, mistresses, daughters, aunts. But MOST of all the wives. Wives of the biggest heaviest duty Wall Street thieves, the “Villa shoppers and furnishers”. I wonder what kind of week THEY’RE having. The unseen women in the background who have that total access to checking accounts with more zero’s that I can even fathom.
The ones whose names we rarely hear. The “$10,000 outfit” club………

Just a side note: The Dow has dropped 500+ points at other times and the world didn’t fall apart.

Trading haulted in gasoline and some other commodities – everything tumbling at once

Areas of the greatest speculation were hoping for a bailout so the party could continue. With the bill defeated, speculators are pulling back.

There is a rain delay in Chitown!

i’m with you on that one ratfood.

I agree. In California, we have a fabulous Senator, Sheila Kuehl. It’s going to be sad when we lose her to term limits.

Dow still bouncing around. Currently at -496

Ever the Pollyanna, RevDeb.
I’m thinking another bank (or two or three) takes one in the brain, and Bu$h speachifies another Threat To All Americans.

SF Chronicle said this morning that DiFi is worth $52m and Nancy is worth $18m. They don’t need my money.

Areas of the greatest speculation were hoping for a bailout so the party could continue. With the bill defeated, speculators are pulling back.

my bold.

well what a surprise. when pelosi said this morning that the party was over, she wasn’t lying.

What do you think of FDL having a How Your Government Works 101 seminar?

i could use that too. or maybe someone knows a book to read that is actually readable?

Plus with term limits, the apparatchiks/staffers/lobbyists wind up even more powerful than they already are.

It will be difficult to bribe the no voters. The no Dems voted against wealthfare for the rich. The no Rethugs voted against it because it didn’t deregulate even more and didn’t serve the rich enough.

A good thing is a good thing. Try something else (what I mentioned above – there is a majority of Dems in the House and they CAN pass my suggestion with 100% defection from the GOP and NOT piss off the normal human being citizen.

“motion to reconsider” leave it to the Dems to grab defeat from the jaws of victory; they could have won the election, now they will be seen as being against the public will; maybe that’s a good thing.

Of course she is. She’s Zelda Gilroy!

That’s the trade off. The field cannot be leveled.

Dennis can do his work OUTSIDE of congress like GORE or Carter.

We need to limit supremes terms to one 11 year term.

Our system is clogged with dead wood. I don’t want to lose the good guys, but they will CONTINUE to – do good in other ways. The creeps will sling away. Look a Delay ICK

Trading haulted in gasoline and some other commodities – everything tumbling at once

Areas of the greatest speculation were hoping for a bailout so the party could continue. With the bill defeated, speculators are pulling back.

Good point. Paulson’s hail mary stick-up gample failed. He never should have cried rat.

Dude on CNBC is saying that “on the floor as traders they are concerned but as citizens, maybe not.

What do you think of FDL having a How Your Government Works 101 seminar?

didn’t you know? you’ve been attending one this morning. *g*

To paraphrase myself from earlier: Word.

OK, that isn’t a paraphrase, that is a direct and full quote.

Let’s see how many payrolls aren’t met because of this vote…..

I’ve been called a lot of things around here, but I don’t think Pollyana has ever been one of them.

Personally I think the bill was a stinker with probably lots of fine print that would come back and bite us. But dissecting this kind of stuff is way above my pay grade.

Exactly! NO THEY DON’T.
Yard saleing this weekend, anyone?

I agree with you. ‘twould take balls on the part of the Dems, though.

they can’t pass it … it’s done and now its back to … who knows

I say stop playing games. The government can establish a price for the CDOs. Have financial companies declare their losses according to the government’s price structure. Re-regulate and re-capitalize the markets. It really isn’t that hard to do if they just cut out the BS and back scratching.

Are they really going to try to voice-vote this?

Somebody hand Boner a hanky.

The sky is falling the sky is falling the sky is falling

All of FDL has been a grad course in civics from day one. At least that’s what it’s seemed to me.

Good gosh that would be scary. Someone could get in there and it could be 10+ years before you throw the bastard out

Everything is going down to where it belongs… bloated share prices.

What has religion got to do with gummint?

Is this, like, the longest FDL thread evah?!

The best kind of term limit: vote out those who don’t do their job well, or don’t do it at all. Keep the good ones.

BTW, I noticed Waxman and Wexler didn’t vote.

Are you kidding? there in for life now.

YOU are not “Pollyanna”, RevDeb. That idea was. You’ve been consistently one of the more down to Earth voices in this place. Consistently. The idea that they’ll come up with a better bill, is in my mind, at this point, too optimistic.
But i’m a cynic. I just don’t trust them to do a right thing with this.

One does wonder what the total net wort of the critters is.

They always try. But then some pesky critter calls for a recorded vote.

It scared me for a minute that they were starting the bailout bill with a voice vote but then reality hit. Methinks the thugs wanted the dem names on record. Had they succeeded to do a voice vote on the bill I would imagine the peasants revolting big time.

no where near. The condolences to Jane when her mom died were somewhere around 700 comments.

Like that statement from the movie, Iraq for Sale.
There were 512 ways to do this wrong (talking about the occupation). What I didn’t figure is that we’d go through all 512 of them.
or something like that.

Just repeating what they said on MSNBC but they ususally shut down for religious holidays like Christmas used to be.

You bring up a good point; small business people don’t go to ‘commercial paper’ to meet their payrolls; why do corporations? Aren’t they required to have enough cash on hand to meet fiduciary obligations?

McC – $19m, Hillary – $10m, Kerry – $230m(that’s not counting his wife’s money). This was a partial list of the richest on the Hill – Obama did not make the list.

700 billion, with few of them morally worth a damned dime!

What the rulers don’t understand is that if everything comes crashing down, poor people will still be poor people.

And they don’t realize just how many poor people they’ve created in the last eight years!

Holy Cow! What I’ve (re)learned since I’ve been visiting the Lake.

now there is a bit of breathing space to stop and think. i hope our congress does that.

Respectfully, I don’t think you know what you are talking about.
When things go bad, no one is hurt as badly as the poor.

I want the gummint to pay the banks what the crap bills are currently worth. If the value is up when the time comes for the payback to the treasury – and I insist on the payback – then it gets applied to the payback. Not paying the book value, or the maturity value – that’s giving the banks a profit whether they’ve earned it or not (mostly not, I suspect).
And the bill has to allow mortgages to be adjusted down, legally, for it to do any good for the economy. Otherwise you’re just sticking a bandaid on a sucking chest wound.

Pay $100,000 to every homeowner with an income under $500,000 and an outstanding mortgage on their only residence. It’d fix things better and probably be cheaper in the long run.

Maybe for the most part but imagine how much they would feel free to emulate Cheney when confronted by overwhelming public outcry (”so”) I would venture to say this measure would have passed today if people weren’t going to face their constituents in a few weeks.

Exactly! Those of us who know how to live on pennies. We could start seminars for the $10,000 outfit females, ya think?

The Rosh Hashanah break was one of the reasons given for taking up the bill and trying to get it passed today. It was almost certainly part of the White House calculation to give as little time as possible for consideration of anything other than the Paulson plan, and although this bill was much longer it still was the Paulson plan.

roll call has just been posted. we can check to see how our rep voted.

mine, mcgovern, voted yes.

Pelosi got pwned by the Rethugs. They lied about voting in favor of the bill. Nancy as Charlie Brown and Republicans as Lucy with football again.

it would help if i included the link.

http://clerk.house.gov/cgi-bin…..number=674

There are plenty of good thinkers who have thought this out and they need to listen to them NOT THE FRIGGIN WALL STREET LOBBYISTS

Bush is probably right now kicking his desk and whining.

more from chris floyd:

The crisis of Wall Street’s financial meltdown has demonstrated, once again, that although the Bush Faction thugs are criminals, killers, torturers, and thieves, without even the slightest competence in governing, they remain brilliant political tacticians. They may be willfully ignorant and brutally stupid in almost every other area, but when it comes to advancing their own narrow interests — at the expense of the political opposition — their low cunning cannot be denied.

Not necessarily true – many will take out loans such as real estate dev. and make draws against to meet payroll. Think of a book publisher trying to get a book printed and distributed to dealers – multi week project with no income.

amen.

My critter Yay..

Can’t stand Engel… We need to sic how on him.

MAybe Bush is riding his bike. Now Paulson, he might be kicking his dog.

Bush/Paulson did not want Congress to have time to think about this. They created a dire emergency that did not hold water. Many days passed and big fish got swallowed up by behemoths, but nobody died from it. The scare tactic did not work.

Well sort of. The working people who have a lot of debt will still have a lot of debt but will either not be working or working for a still declining dollar and will STILL be paying outrageous interest rates. Cap the rates, pay the people the debt gets paid and fuck the wall street whackos.

Thanks; mine did too (Davis-D,CA-53). BUT she ALWAYS does what Pelosi says to do; her constituents indicated:
Yes 19.3%
No 57.5%
Not Sure 23.3%

about supporting the bill. Just got a flash from impeachbush.org:
“House leadership of the Republicans and Democrats is right now doing backroom arm-twisting to get your representatives to change their votes.”

Hope that it’s too ‘aged’ to be correct.

Understood but such is a ‘development’ mode, not an ongoing, biz as usual situation.

Obama is in the pocket of Wall Street.

The vote totals look like the right ones, but the bill title was something about IRC adjustments: “To amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to provide earnings assistance and tax relief to members of the uniformed services, volunteer firefighters, and Peace Corps volunteers, and for other purposes.”

Perhaps they are trying to fix that as the service is now down

Tweety on MSNBC saying McShame couldn’t coral enough votes to get the thing passed – a failure in his ability to lead.

no, i think it was just an old bill number that they used by amending it.

Service back up. The title is still weird: http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll674.xml

Oh! Sorry, but I’m not sure what you mean. :-) It sure helps to confuse people. Well, me anyway :-)

MOJO presents Five Alternative Bailout Plans.

i think – they took an old bill that was just laying around and amended it by stripping out all the old language and replacing it with the bailout.

don’t know why. but that’s how it looked to me.

Thank you, selise :-)

you’re very welcome. sorry i’m not so good at the explanations.

Looseheadprop a few flights up on the DoJ