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	<title>Comments on: Bailout 101: Patch the Hull Or Taxpayers Will Be Paying Forever</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/</link>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1654037</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 08:48:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1654037</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The stock market needs to fall about another 20%, minimum. Might as well get it over with.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The stock market needs to fall about another 20%, minimum. Might as well get it over with.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1654036</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 08:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1654036</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It’s not the road to salvation, and yes, of course other nations are making threats.  It was obvious that was going to happen a good 5 years ago.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It’s not the road to salvation, and yes, of course other nations are making threats.  It was obvious that was going to happen a good 5 years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Novista</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653989</link>
		<dc:creator>Novista</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 06:40:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I recall five states went the same route.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recall five states went the same route.</p>
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		<title>By: Synoia</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653671</link>
		<dc:creator>Synoia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 04:03:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I’m serious:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://agonist.org/synoia/20080925/sue_the_bastards_financial_industry_lawsuit&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://agonist.org/synoia/2008.....ry_lawsuit&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m serious:</p>
<p><a href="http://agonist.org/synoia/20080925/sue_the_bastards_financial_industry_lawsuit" rel="nofollow">http://agonist.org/synoia/2008&#8230;..ry_lawsuit</a></p>
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		<title>By: Synoia</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653665</link>
		<dc:creator>Synoia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 04:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653665</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It was Ohio, Detusche Bank was the mortgage holder, and they were Judicial Foreclosures.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;California is a Tustee state, no judicial foreclosures.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2007/11/15/ohio-court-gives-victory-to-homeowners-facing-forceclosure/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.bloggingstocks.com/.....ceclosure/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was Ohio, Detusche Bank was the mortgage holder, and they were Judicial Foreclosures.</p>
<p>California is a Tustee state, no judicial foreclosures.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2007/11/15/ohio-court-gives-victory-to-homeowners-facing-forceclosure/" rel="nofollow">http://www.bloggingstocks.com/&#8230;..ceclosure/</a></p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653579</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:27:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;According to the British it is Stock Market Clobbering Time, as we slip into financial macaca.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt; The US stock market could suffer a devastating crash with shares losing a third of their value this week if Hank Paulson’s financial bailout plan fails, US Treasury officials have warned.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Where could the economy be heading? It is going into the John (McCain).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;One Republican said that the message from government officials is that “the economy is dropping into the john.” He added: “We could see falls of 3,000 or 4,000 points on the Dow [the New York market that currently trades at around 11,000]. That could happen in just a couple of days.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;What is the solution? An investment banker has the answer. Bail them out and ask questions later.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Peter Spencer, economic adviser to the Ernst &amp; Young Item Club, said: “This is the time you have to bail people out and ask questions later. It is very difficult to see how the US banking system would survive without that. This has the potential to make 1929 look like a walk in the park.”
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Geez, it’s like a note from a kidnapper: hand over the dough or the stock market gets it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“The US stock market could suffer a devastating crash …” sounds so reflective, but really seems to mean “The stock market WILL be crashed …”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Could it be that John “Crash” McCain has a hand in this?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“One Republican said ‘We could see falls of 3,000 or 4,000 points on the Dow [the New York market that currently trades at around 11,000].’”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;sounds like they’re not just predicting, but promising a crash&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;‘Peter Spencer, economic adviser to the Ernst &amp; Young Item Club, said: “This is the time you have to bail people out and ask questions later. ..”‘&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;We “have to” huh? I guess the kidnapper has a point, but do we have to just roll over and let them destroy us ONE WAY just to avoid being destroyed ANOTHER WAY?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;What if the bailout is as bad, or worse, than the non-bailout?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Bushies have been playing both ends of the stick: whichever way things go they’re set to capitalize. In this play to give the bailout would put money directly into their hands and to let the market crash would kill the dollar so they can make a killing in gold.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Best seems to be something which doesn’t hand out cash, but really works to solve the problem — not big, but strong government action.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>According to the British it is Stock Market Clobbering Time, as we slip into financial macaca.</p>
<blockquote><p> The US stock market could suffer a devastating crash with shares losing a third of their value this week if Hank Paulson’s financial bailout plan fails, US Treasury officials have warned.
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Where could the economy be heading? It is going into the John (McCain).</p>
<blockquote><p>One Republican said that the message from government officials is that “the economy is dropping into the john.” He added: “We could see falls of 3,000 or 4,000 points on the Dow [the New York market that currently trades at around 11,000]. That could happen in just a couple of days.
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>What is the solution? An investment banker has the answer. Bail them out and ask questions later.</p>
<blockquote><p>Peter Spencer, economic adviser to the Ernst &amp; Young Item Club, said: “This is the time you have to bail people out and ask questions later. It is very difficult to see how the US banking system would survive without that. This has the potential to make 1929 look like a walk in the park.”
</p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<p>Geez, it’s like a note from a kidnapper: hand over the dough or the stock market gets it.</p>
<p>“The US stock market could suffer a devastating crash …” sounds so reflective, but really seems to mean “The stock market WILL be crashed …”</p>
<p>Could it be that John “Crash” McCain has a hand in this?</p>
<p>“One Republican said ‘We could see falls of 3,000 or 4,000 points on the Dow [the New York market that currently trades at around 11,000].’”</p>
<p>sounds like they’re not just predicting, but promising a crash</p>
<p>‘Peter Spencer, economic adviser to the Ernst &amp; Young Item Club, said: “This is the time you have to bail people out and ask questions later. ..”‘</p>
<p>We “have to” huh? I guess the kidnapper has a point, but do we have to just roll over and let them destroy us ONE WAY just to avoid being destroyed ANOTHER WAY?</p>
<p>What if the bailout is as bad, or worse, than the non-bailout?</p>
<p>The Bushies have been playing both ends of the stick: whichever way things go they’re set to capitalize. In this play to give the bailout would put money directly into their hands and to let the market crash would kill the dollar so they can make a killing in gold.</p>
<p>Best seems to be something which doesn’t hand out cash, but really works to solve the problem — not big, but strong government action.</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653548</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653548</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;ian, I think you are going to get some insight from this c and l quote&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;At a Harvard panel discussion yesterday, economics professor Ken Rogoff made an interesting point: The liquidity crisis isn’t real. Or, to restate it: Any liquidity crisis is caused by the promise of a government bailout. Ken said that his many friends in investment banking said that there is plenty of money to invest in financial services, but right now it is “sitting on the sidelines.” Why? Because the financial services industry does not want to pay the terms demanded. As he put it, why do business with Warren Buffett who will negotiate a tough deal, if you believe that the government will ride in soon with cheaper cash?
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;notice my bold, if that’s true, that is game changing
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When the crisis began there was no government money ready to jump into the game. So, at that point their claim they couldn’t loan money had to have been based on real issues (bad mortgage CDOs which couldn’t be valued) or they were playing a game and were planning…PLANNING…to blackmail government. If the government didn’t pony up they were threatening to shut down the economy.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I want the names of those bankers who were holding back. If there was no real liquidity problem I want to know who they are and see their pictures &amp; names &amp; addresses on the Internet so everyone will know who the enemy of America is.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This crap has got to stop and now is as good a time as any to get ‘er done.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>ian, I think you are going to get some insight from this c and l quote</p>
<blockquote><p>At a Harvard panel discussion yesterday, economics professor Ken Rogoff made an interesting point: The liquidity crisis isn’t real. Or, to restate it: Any liquidity crisis is caused by the promise of a government bailout. Ken said that his many friends in investment banking said that there is plenty of money to invest in financial services, but right now it is “sitting on the sidelines.” Why? Because the financial services industry does not want to pay the terms demanded. As he put it, why do business with Warren Buffett who will negotiate a tough deal, if you believe that the government will ride in soon with cheaper cash?
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>notice my bold, if that’s true, that is game changing
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>When the crisis began there was no government money ready to jump into the game. So, at that point their claim they couldn’t loan money had to have been based on real issues (bad mortgage CDOs which couldn’t be valued) or they were playing a game and were planning…PLANNING…to blackmail government. If the government didn’t pony up they were threatening to shut down the economy.</p>
<p>I want the names of those bankers who were holding back. If there was no real liquidity problem I want to know who they are and see their pictures &amp; names &amp; addresses on the Internet so everyone will know who the enemy of America is.</p>
<p>This crap has got to stop and now is as good a time as any to get ‘er done.</p>
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		<title>By: Suzanne</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653519</link>
		<dc:creator>Suzanne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653519</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;thers is a &lt;a href=&quot;http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/obamacommie/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;couple flights upstairs&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thers is a <a href="http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/obamacommie/" rel="nofollow">couple flights upstairs</a></p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653518</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:01:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653518</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Why wouldn’t the financial corps continue to do the same thing over &amp; over again, as long as they know they’ll be bailed out?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Obviously they and muggers do continue until put away.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Why wouldn’t the financial corps continue to do the same thing over &amp; over again, as long as they know they’ll be bailed out?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Obviously they and muggers do continue until put away.</p>
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		<title>By: prostratedragon</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/27/bailout-101-patch-the-hull-or-taxpayers-will-be-paying-forever/#comment-1653516</link>
		<dc:creator>prostratedragon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 02:31:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think Rogoff, far from a liberal or dfh type, is absolyutely right.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Rogoff, far from a liberal or dfh type, is absolyutely right.</p>
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