Looks like McCain showed up to the President’s "let’s all agree on a bad bill" meeting and started talking about his own bill, with House Republicans. Apparently this bill involves more deregulation to fix the problem. (No, I’m not kidding. This is clearly some sort of pathology) So by the end of Bush’s photo op, the bill was lying in pieces on the floor. I’m glad to see that John McCain’s intervention helped so much in bringing together a deal.
No, really, I am. At this point I can’t see how we get a good deal when the entire Congressional leadership, and the president plus both presidential candidates are onside for a bad bill (just, as it happens, different bad bills.)
So, this may be the last time I am ever thankful for John McCain, but "thank you John McCain. Your glory seeking and complete lack of economic understanding has served your country well today."
At this point efforts should continue to make sure that backbenchers in both the House and Senate continue to refuse to sign off on this mess. No good bill is going to come out of this Congress with the help of this administration. Kill the bill, give Paulson a hundred billion or so on strict strings just so that he and Bernanke can’t blame Congress for the continued economic and financial deterioration which will occur no matter what is done, and go on holiday. January 20th a new Congress can start over with a new President and try and do it right.
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0
YES LESS THAN ZERO
I dont really know what tp make of it all,its just bizzare theatre of the absurd turd
Good. This is a twofer. We don’t want this bad bill, and McCain won’t win on this bullshit. It’s visible to all but the insane that he’s winging it, and the public likes it less and less.
And less deregulation? Geez.
Debate fodder.
Digg
Ian:
How bad is it really? Can things hold together until election day? Because after that, we should be able to get something decent. Not now. Surely Obama knows this.
So, in other words…he can’t now say that ‘it’s all Obama’s (or the Democrats or both) fault that there is no deal.’ Because HE screwed it up trying to be the hero. Great job, Johnny Mac!! In this one totally misguided situation, you really did your duty toward the American People.
Heh. You mean what if all the arsonists in the cellar couldn’t get the house to burn? Ooh, embarrassing. Not only couldn’t they see it coming, it didn’t come when they did see it. Well, we can all hope.
Let.
It.
Fail.
No bill is a good thing, I think. Leave Paulson out there slowly twisting in the wind. Who cares !
thanks for this post too. But you are posting too fast and furious, so enquiring but ignorant minds (and slow typers) like me are getting lost in the dust. In last post I asked where I could find details of how a new HOLC would work, and where you got that $20 billion estimate for rescue and refinance of mortgages.
http://firedoglake.com/2008/09…..nt-1648336
—
As for this new move by McCain, I am not surprised. I think McCain was nearing meltdown on the bailout because he would have a hard time finessing this issue with his big $ lobbying support, Bush dead-enders, and independents he needs to win. In Americablog I read McCain’s pre-suspension statements to press questions that contained strong hints that:
-he was dead-ender on deregulation
-no help for Mainstreet
-he was with reactionary House GOP on recycled corporate tax cuts as policy solution for financial crisis.
That would not fly with independents. And then sooner or later his idiotic and transparent lies about he had a plan and Obama didn’t. And his meaningless padded ‘plan’ would be contrasted and compared in public.
So, I think his stunt is partly an attempt to push a reset button and kick up enough dust so erase his disastrous Mon and Tues. And I think he is desperate to avoid even one or two questions on financial problems in debate tomorrow. In addition to ploy to get rid of VP debates.
So, I hope some one wtites about the total McCain bad faith dishonety and flim flam on this, and explain his duplicity on the financial crisis.
BTY, he has played the ’suspend campaign’ gimmick in 1999 to boost his support, and has played the less than useless calvary to rescue stunt several times before, most recently wrt to immigration (check Thinkprogress today).
I just hope McSame managed to scuttle the deal and the Dems decide to just go home and wait until January.
political theater but I would be overjoyed to see this bill fail
That is my quetion too. In last post I commented that I was encouraged when Frank said best idea was to give them enought to squeak by until after election or Jan 21 2009, and then redo. Not sure I trust Frank to do a good job of that, but I liked the idea. I was encouraged to here talk of limiting it to $100 to $150 billion, and disappointed to see it might be as high as $250 billion.
Me, if I were a Democratic Congressional leader, I would put in the good measures that are needed, but with no hope of faithful execution whatever, so, no hope they would do any good. But my bottom line would be “Shutup. Here is $100 billion. Do not come back here again. Period.”
I just hope McSame managed to scuttle the deal and the Dems decide to just go home and wait until January.
But before going home, they need to make it very clear that it was one John Sidney McCain who blew up the deal.
Face it, if *nothing* is accomplished, the market is gonna tank. Let the blame fall squarely on McLame’s sagging shoulders.
shock doctrine in a nutshell.
It’s time for every democratic member of congress to walk out and say that John (comrade) McCain is tanking any type of resolution and close congress now…….
If the GOP doesn’t like the Paulson plan, why haven’t they asked Bush to fire him?
In fact preview is my friend cause I meant to say John (comrade) WcCain…. Remember that M is nothing more than an upside down or backward W.
Yeah, I think they can. Might be a bit ugly, but Bernanke can print whatever money he needs and macroeconomically that’s not much different anyway. It’s really a question of whether they’ll do their job.
But, good chances market would tank after novelty of Hanky Panky wore off, and the infernal unregulated securities machine started tearing itself apart again as housing prices dropped. And will be bad recession anyway. So, will another month of financial panic and credit slowdown make that much difference? Will the costs be greater than commitment of another trillion dollars down the tubes? I am not sure.
Answered in last post, though you wont’ like the answer. :)
If McCrazy has his *own* plan, and thinks he’s gonna sell it to Dem’s and that they will thus allow him to take all the credit, well – there’s that Bridge to Nowhere in Sedona he might try to peddle….
Ian, if you have any opinion about how the WaMu takeover fits into this, if at all, I am interested.
don’t see how that is enough to keep the current system propped up, even for a few months. and especially if people think obama is going to make changes that mean big losses for some. won’t those people be trying to pull their money out of the US system before then?
that’s why, i think maybe, the whole 2 year thing was proposed. because if people think change is coming in january that means more runs now.
Ian, you have a new fan.
The state of my government embarasses me….
i never thought I’d say this, but god bless you John McKKKain you insane selfish nutso bastard.
Absolutely!
Rahm using Paulson to slam the GOP.
This is apparently the Dem message:
http://www.salon.com/politics/…..index.html
I guess McCain and Palin both have trouble, er, speaking.
On Olbermann.
JP’s in pretty good shape, it looks like a partial takeover. They get the good stuff, dump the junk on the public.
that’s a guess, but it seems to be what’s happening.
what i’m trying to ask here is…. can we really kick the can on the cheap? i don’t see how and i don’t trust the Ds to do it. i want to see some attempt at decent legislation, even if we don’t get it, as a starting negotiating point and to show us that the Ds even have a fucking clue what they are doing.
because if they don’t (and i don’t think they do), we need to know that.
McInsane: “I love the smell of greasypalms in the morning.”
Ding.
It’s interesting to see Paulson, Bernanke, et al, saying how if people can’t get credit we’ll be in a deep, long recession. If I remember my history correctly borrowing money to invest in whatever was one of the factors causing the Depression.
“I would suggest that anyone in that meeting that tried to understand what John McCain said in the meeting, couldn’t
Actually idiot amerika understands him perfectly.
I hope Obama realizes that what’s really under discussion is whether he’ll be on a short leash or tied down in a straight jacket come January 20, 2009. Does anybody else see this as a preemptive strike on his presidency?
Well, anyway, for sake of election, I hope somehow, the true bad faith McCain position on this can be made public. More and worse Bush. He was on verge of spilling the beans, and then this stunt is his coverup. He wants give away to financial industry (hoping that will make problems go away), continued irresponsible deregulation, and a recycled corporate tax cut plan as the solution to the financial mess.
He came close to spilling beans first part of this week, and the nonsense you see now is his cover up.
Did you see the dude padding his financial principles with a ‘no earmarks’ pleade to get it up to five points. One Obama plan had five points so the McCain ‘plan’ had to have five points too.
He was running on fumes, and had to do this stunt to get a few more vapors into the campaign carburator.
mccain poisen pilled this bill on purpose because he is shaking in his boots about that debate
Help!
Harry Reid already came out and said they didn’t know what to do, they were trying to figure something out.
IMHO, if the Dems had a clue, they would be linking any loan to Wall Street to an immediate and complete pullout from Iraq and Afghanistan. That’s the lowest hanging fruit I can see next to the Pentagon’s budget.
Talk about the ultimate in unintended consequences! What did he do..did he keep talking about being a POW?
Yes, but it is also part and parcel of this Administration’s policy of doubling down in a crisis. Apparently these fools have never heard of the dictum: Cut your losses. Personally I have no problem with these dopes blowing themselves up. They are all prime candidates for the Darwin Award but I resent like hell them doing it to the rest of us.
Re: on the cheap?
You and I know that nothing’s free, or you get what you pay for.
You’re On It!
1) Demonizes the Democrats as socialists.
2) Distances himself from Bush.
3) Looks like a maverick again.
All’s right in the McCain campaign again.
From CNN.com.
Idiots who can’t see the forest for the trees.
Ian makes a good point in a comments to last post that there IS private equity ready to scoop up some of the garbage securities. It just does not want to pay idiotic prices for the garbage. That is close to other estimates I have seen of around $400 billion.
The Hanky Panky plan is such a ridiculous fraud. Wall Street does not want to face any losses ever, and this might be their last chance at the trough for awhile.
How can anyone read the hearing transcripts of the two mighty finance czars and believe one word they say ever again, is just beyond me.
I left a response to you regarding the oven and such back in that thread
IMHO, if the Dems had a clue, they would be linking any loan to Wall Street to an immediate and complete pullout from Iraq and Afghanistan.
Ding! At least as to Iraq – Obama is pretty well boxed in on continuing in Afghanistan….
Agree.
McCain appears to have also made Bush look bad. Perhaps I am wrong, but I thought Bush wanted a triumphant announcement coming out of his meeting with McSane, Obama, Harry, Mitch, Nancy, and Boner. JMO.
Ah…big picture political chess.
There’s definitely strong evidence for that purview.
History + Current Events = …
That or Main street.
I think it appears that McCain rode into town to save the day and his horse threw him. And his gun, as usual, wouldn’t fire.
What? His Viagara prescription ran out?
i stand corrected.
the shock doctrine doubled down?
i like that one.
they certainly ought to be linking it to something helpful.
Of course, the Rs backing continuing deregulation are pretty much the same ones who would add on Newt Gingrich’s wish from the other night to do away with the Capital Gains tax “to free up money for investment” as part of any bill moving through the Congress and expect all the Ds to follow right along with them.
Here’s a tour-de-force in “false equivalencies” excreted by Pool Boy VandeHEY! and John Harris of Politico infamy:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politi…..tico/13892
Not for those with weak stomachs. Has anyone taught these two that it helps to have an ending when writing a story. What a pathetic attempt analysis.
That’s good to hear. Weebits is gonna be a well traveled little tiger.
argh brain bleach
And his gun, as usual, wouldn’t fire.
Well, it was never a very big gun anyway….
Campaign and bailout on Acme Drill-in-a-pill overdose.
(Someone made an implicit Alan Keyes ref yesterday that got me thinking.)
Yeah she is snuggled on my lap asleep right now. She has really turned out to be a little snuggler
McCain is desperate. He is gambling wildly. Palin was part of that. Going super-negative was another. Suspending his campaign another. The debates another. Now he is spiking the deal to shore up his maverick cred and put himself in the center of things.
His internal polling must show him sucking big time.
fewer regulations…how republican. John McCain is some piece of work
Per selise’s concern above about “kicking the can,” delay of the bailout will really hurt car makers.
The only thing these ratfucks invest in is themselves. With little or no industry to invest in they’re just trading paper for paper for a huge profit.
And I wish I could remember where I read that this very scenario was part of a plan so that the Dem’s couldn’t win no matter where or how they turned.
And in reading the NY Times on the faltering bailout bill, it appears a Capital Gains Tax Cut is indeed part of the wish list of the so-called “Conservative” Rs in the House.
They are already beyond help; their bonds are less than BB and they just got a $25B loan; just a matter of time before GM and Ford are taken over by foreign interests.
I agree.
I also think he is scared silly of the debates.
Good summary Hugh. That is why I think it is important to reveal McCain’s bad faith game:
-his ridiculous lies that he had plan and Obama did not,
-bogus nature McCain ‘plan’ or ‘principles’ or whatever those bullet point campaign thingees are
-his responses to press earlier this weak that gave away that he was just more and worse Bush
Media needs to be encourage to concentrate on that. Suspension and running from debates serves function of hiding his mess of Mon and Tues, in addition to other things.
Boxer nails McCain on Keating Five and wussing out on debate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTM2OYd1hBc
I like it. Also wesgpc’s Hanky Panky. Paulson and Bernanke were pulling a con. The first part was to set up a false choice: the Paulson plan or collapse. The second part was to get Congress feeling it needed to act without facts or thinking.
The country’s largest Chevy dealer threw in the towel today. Said he can’t make it with a monstrous inventory of nothing but trucks and SUV’s. I’d hate to see the auto industry tank but they’ve got nobody to blame but themselves. Create a market then push it beyond all reason. It’s not like nobody was saying more fuel efficient cars years ago and they absolutely wanted no part of that. Fuck ‘em.
agreed given that he tried to move the vp debate
this might take a few tries..it is a vision thing..I have trouble distinguishing between some letters and numbers…
I thought they had already gotten their “loan”.
Even more Ian upstairs
i could use some good news.
I don’t know what to hope for. Are we being lied to again or is this an imminent threat? Can we just put out fires for a few months and then hope for a good bill or is it true that we can’t wait?
One thing I do fear, however, is that whatever amount of money we give to Paulson, it will be gone within days and they will be back asking for more.
And we will be no further ahead. It’ll be a freeking blackhole as bad as Iraq.
The the novelty McCampaign (h/t Margaret Carlson) going to do tomorrow to mix things up? We should have a brainstorming session on Late Night.
oooh good idea. I’ll start thinking
Yes.
…try 2..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TM2OYd1hBc
Here’s another link if the one you posted doesn’t work:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmFLMNj4uL8
damn! It is a good video..can some else get it off of youtube for me? It is worth watching and I just can’t get the right letters.
The title of it is: Boxer nails McCain on Keating five and wussing out on debates.
Oops. My #88 was in response to BlueButterfly @ #79. ;-)
Thank you very much!
You’re welcome!!!! I wanted to watch it, so I had to find it. ;-)
The Princeton macroeconomist Alan Blinder came up with ‘Hanky Panky’ -both for the dude and the plan.
Amazingly, Blinder is a very good economist, and he is still a declared agnostic on the plan. He must be on a raging tearing drunk this week. I am still dumbfounded that a smart economist like Blinder could be so confused on the Hanky Panky scheme. At least he came up with a good name.
I think we all feel that way!
in my opinion, yes, we are being lied to about this imminent threat.
There is a threat, and we are facing a very bad recession, and hard task of paying for long run damage to nations finances done over last eight years.
But that will be the case regardless of whether the Paulson fraud, or whatever plan, or no plan is passed over next week.
quote Nancy R….just say “no”..that’ll do it..nothing left to figure out…
Hehe.. and if this all works out for the worse than we can all say, John McCain caused the great depression!
It was good wasn’t it? Two minutes and she cut through McCain’s bullshit with a very very sharp knife.
I want to hold out for a 10% added value tax on the top 10% along with a 1% tax on stock transactions to be shared 50/50 between buyer and broker. Let ‘em pay for their own bailout!
She did. Boxer is great when she wants to be. ;-)
but..but…he was a POW! He can do what he wants…
I think the deal was, is, postpone the inevitable collapse until 1-22-09 then blame the new occupant of White house for screwing up an even better economy than Big Bill left us to work with in 2000.
Palin helps out Planned Parenthood…sort of…
People who are against her anti-abortion stance are donating…if they ask for a donor card in Palin’s name..the card is sent to her campaign…
Http://www.rockymountainnews.c…..parenthoo/
I am having a bad link day..
once more…
http://www.rockymountainnews.c…..parenthoo/
I fear the Dems will use this opportunity to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. They will “diligently” try to hammer out a different bailout the rich bill that wont fix the problem and try to push it through, take heat, and serve McInsane.
Best option (but the Dems wont take it) is to fund this bastard ENTIRELY with the Tobin Tax AND with a 10% surtax on incomes over $1 million a year – giving Paulson, at most, 100 billion, until it is determined that this will work – an INCREASE regulation. No taxpayer on the hook at all.
The same McCain who scuttled the bill warned us yesterday that we would face a depression and 12% unemployment by Monday if this bill was not passed by Friday. Paulson met with Republican leaders yesterday or the day before – maybe he told them it wasn’t really an emergency.
When asked how they came up with the 700B amount, a Treasury spokesperson stated that there was no real reason for that amount, they just wanted something really big!
Yupper.
Saying that the answer to this crisis is to give Wall Street lower taxes and fewer regulations is like saying that all Jeffery Dahmer should have been given was a larger freezer.