Update 2 (first update at bottom): I’m getting some information and indications that Dodd may not have been down with this, and that Frank may be leaking that the deal is done in an attempt to "make it so". Also Reid’s office is indicating that Reid is backing Dodd strongly. I’m still not optimistic since I still fear compromise towards the Frank bill, but there is some reason for hope, especially if Reid is backing Dodd on this. Of course, this could all be BS. I guess we’ll find out tomorrow.
(Original post)
I suppose expecting most Democrats to actually stand up to more than breeze’s worth of pressure and alarmism was too much to ask. According to The Hill, a "compromise" has been reached. Details are vague, there’s to be something to "protect taxpayers" but what it is isn’t clear. What is known is that changes to bankruptcy laws, which were in both the Dodd and Frank bills are out because Paulson wouldn’t agree. Of course, I’m sure it didn’t help that Obama on CNN today said that neither stimulus nor bankruptcy changes should be in the bill. When the leader of the party says it, it sort of undercuts your bargaining position.
This is the most unutterable bullshit I’ve seen in 5 years of blogging, and that’s saying something. A five year old child would understand that if someone is about to be completely destroyed unless you help them, they aren’t in any position to bargain. Yet somehow Democrats keep caving to Paulson. That means either it isn’t that much of a crisis, since Paulson seems to feel free to draw lines in the sand "ordinary people get no help if they go bankrupt, but we have to make sure banks don’t go bankrupt"; or if there is a crisis, then Democrats are the world’s worst negotiators.
I can hear people saying "why not both?" Yes, Democrats couldn’t negotiate giving away water to someone dying of thirst in the desert "I won’t drink that water unless you also give me a million dollars!"
"OK."
"No, wait, a billion!"
But it’s also completely clear that there is no crisis that requires this bill to be resolved. Oh, there are things wrong with financial markets, but as every economist who isn’t paid to say otherwise, and even some of them has noted, it can wait and it doesn’t need this solution.
There is no crisis that can be solved by a lousy bill, and this is just a naked power and money grab by Paulson because he knows that Congressional Democrats are punks (that’s the polite word, use your imagination for the word I’m thinking).
I suppose after eight years of bills like the AUMF, the Patriot Act, FISA and so on we really couldn’t expect anything else. I doubt most of these folks will ever show a spine unless it’s their own skin on the line, and probably not even then.
At this point there appears to be little possibility of a good bill. The only thing to do now is to make House Representatives so scared of having to justify this bill to their constituents that there is a House revolt.
(Update: Reuters is reporting that Barney Frank is saying the deal is done. Oh, and for the record, I’m not down on Dodd about this. He’s got both the House and Obama right flanking him, and he’s in the more conservative chamber to begin with. Unless Reid is backing Dodd hardcore, I don’t see that he’s got much room to maneuver to get a good bill out of this. The only thing he could do is pull his bill off the table entirely, come out with something much more hardcore, and try for a showdown. But unless he’s got the caucus behind him, I don’t know if that will work. Still, if he tries it, he’ll have a ton of support from Main Street, indeed, he might become the most loved (and hated, in certain circles) man in America.)
Related posts:
- Shorter Harry Reid: Don’t Look at Me!
- Dodd: Reprimanding Lieberman is “Ridiculous”
- Hey, Harry Reid, Stop Protecting Democrats Who Want to Filibuster the Public Option
- Schumer Raises the Stakes: If Final Bill Has No Public Option, Blame Harry Reid
- Harry Reid “Would Welcome a Legislative Proposal” to Repeal DADT





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*sigh*
Ian, alas, it’s what we stupid americans have gotten used to. Give away the whole hand, w/o any kind of poker smarts. Just like “nancy off the table”.
not exactly gotten used to, but come to expect. Totally frustrating, and so demoralizing.
Lucy, meet football.
Are we really surprised?
Lawrence O’Donnell: McCain has less influence on this than frosh Tester and he is merely a fly to be swatted away.
And what’s even worse is that McShame is cratering and they are still caving.
What that means is that they really want this deal. It’s not a bug it’s a feature.
Meet the new bosses, same as the old.
Did you all see the explanation for $700 billion? As I expected.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/…..ge-number/
i am.
none of that prevented dodd from offering a decent plan – if for nothing else, so we could see what one might look like. instead we got a POS from him.
…..
so here’s my take. i admire dodd for what he tried to do re habeas corpus and fisa. he was the only presidential candidate i sent money to. i don’t regret having done so. but that does not give him license to fuck us over like this. he gets no slack from me for his bullshit plan. i have not problem with him losing the fight. my problem is that he did not try.
You’d think they’d have more sense than to cave so fucking close to the election. The tone deafness amazes me. And to fall for the Booga!Booga! again. Jeeeeeeze.
Give away the whole hand, w/o any kind of poker smarts.
they’re holding four aces – and folding ‘em.
Oh. Fuck. Me.
gdmfkndmcrts
that just too important a link to miss. i know i’ve done this a couple of time already… but what the hey:
So Hank put a gun to our head and congress said “wait, here’s the bullet!”
You should probably get mad at the system put in place in the 1970’s that allowed investment banks to take part in speculation in the residential market. These people are performing (poorly) a task that is essential to the economy. That’s why the dems have no negotiating room; the only other alternative is creating a government mortgage authority and doing away with investment banks and savings/loan altogether.
If you want to toe the socialist line, go for it. But don’t castigate the democrats for continuing to hold on the figment of their dreams called market capitalism.
I kept posting it on earlier threads, but they were switching so fast, it always got EPUd.
dugg
Updated, getting some indications/word that Dodd isn’t down with this and that Reid is backing Dodd. This may not be a done deal. see top of post.
Hiya Suzanne. Where are you now? Doing any diving of late?
I don’t know if the deal is done or not, saying they are near a deal will keep the markets calm and that is what is needed now.
Speakin’ of, after you pups watch the Daily Show tonight, I left a note at the end of Jane’s Letterman thread. Or click my name, it’s a short one.
Major gaffe by Jon.
Spare me. If Fannie had never been privatized and Freddie had been a public entity this would never have happened either. Government has been massively involved in housing markets since the great depression and the times it went wrong were the Savings and Loan (greatly facilitated by deregulation) and now (due to deregulation.) So, in other words, it worked for almost 50 years, half a century, without any significant problems and only stopped working when deregulation became the fad.
Like I just said,they have got to calm the markets.
dove in last nite in my return late late nite thread
any delay is a good thing.
I hope you’re right. But I’m afraid the spines have returned to their vestigial state.
ian – that is a great forking picture heading this post
So how’s about calling McinSane’s bluff and coasting with it over the weekend? Let him wander the corridors of the senate all by his lonesome over the weekend while his colleagues are locked in conference rooms. And we can watch the ghost debate. Fun.
The markets are not in any immediate danger, except for the LIBOR. And many market participants don’t think this is a good deal either. But also, I’m not hearing from inside that it was leaked to calm markets (though I don’t claim I have a ton of good contacts, and I could be getting shitted), that’s the “good adults” theory, which does not explain most of their behaviour.
prediction from chris floyd:
what’s a LIBOR?
and from naomi klein this morning:
I’m also arguing that this is only stage one of the shock doctrine
my bold.
“I’m sure it didn’t help that Obama on CNN today said that neither stimulus nor bankruptcy changes should be in the bill. ” —got that straight !!!
Hopefully this is another of Frank’s ‘mis-statements’ but I read on TPM today that a lobbyist said the deal was 98 per cent done. I guess the Dem’s don’t realize that if they don’t deal with people losing their homes, that is votes against them. Or they figure that those who have lost their homes won’t be able to vote anyway.
When the Chief of the CBO says the ‘deal’ could make the situation even worse and they still plow ahead, one can only hope the Republican’s stand firm and force the ‘dealmakers’ back to the negotiating board.
The real bottomline is that they want to continue the credit models that have proven defunct but just make such credit harder to get.
The article though would lead one to believe the issue of bankruptcy judges is still on the table; I’m wondering if the idea is to have a smaller package and then, once in power, change things. Boxer introduced legislation today to again extend Unemployment benefits.
Not staying up that late these days, but tonight maybe.
nevermind, lurk gave me this link which shows it is: The LIBOR is among the most common of benchmark interest rate indexes used to make adjustments to adjustable rate mortgages. This page also lists some other less-common indexes.
oops. my bad. the last line of the quote should be bold, not an additional block quote.
Sounds about right.
London Interbank Offered Rate. Basically an interest rate on short term debt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LIBOR
tonight is es’ nite – and i peeked using my magic mod powers and it is most definitely worth staying up for ecahn.
ooh. Magic Mod Powers. Do you need an exorcism?
http://firedoglake.com/2008/09…..rah-palin/
I clearly do not know enough swear words.
fixed
“The real bottomline is that they want to continue the credit models that have proven defunct but just make such credit harder to get.”
Exactly. This is not a solution to the fundamental poblem that supposedly got us here. There is no guarantee it will get us out.
It will guarantee that we can’t do anything about the next crisis. Our blank check will have been cashed and we can labor unhappily trying to pay it off for the rest of our lives.
A little off the topic, but why did I hear wind whistling through the mike during Bush’s address tonight? He was inside, not out in the Rose Garden. It almost sounded like prompts. Anyone else notice?
from scarecrow yesterday:
is this what we have to look forward to? an excuse for obama to govern far, far to the right of where he campaigned? (see clinton 1992)
I clearly do not know enough swear words.
I’m always available for free tutoring is situations as serious as this. *g*
After almost eight years of Bushco, it’s a wonder we’re not yet speaking a language entirely made up of swear words.
Definitely noticed. Fire the sound engineer.
thank you! (TheLurkingMod)
Anyone else notice?
I noted below that it sounded like the mic was attached at stomach level, and that Georgie probably should have eaten before speaking…..
AND, it the most used rate calculation for credit cards.
Perhaps McCane thought that, since his numbers were going down while campaigning, they would go up if he suspended his campaign.
well, it sounded more mysterious than peaking behind the backstage curtain…
This has been unbelievable! My computer blew up last week -maybe that started it and its all my fault. Thanks for your commentary Ian, it was very informative. This looked very bad from that first news release with Paulson and Bernanke saying senseless self-contradictory things late last week.
We are in Marx Brothers government. This summer it was Duck Soup, and now it is Cocoanuts.
What I am hoping for is that they have limited the initial authortiy to $150 billion dollars and made it reviewable. I remember Frank saying that the best thing might be to finagle a temporary fix until after the election and then revisit it. I hope that is the plan.
If Congress has kept the authorization low, and have enough control so only part of it is pissed away before the election, it might not be so bad. I hope that is the plan. From what I hear it certainly is not strong enough, in ways Ian Welsh and others have pointed out.
i wonder how many lives could be saved – to say nothing of improvements in quality of life – by a national health care plan? and how many people will die needlessly if we don’t have one?
That was my first thought. Then I figured the codpiece was snorting into the mike. But it really sounded like something from Poltergeist…
I keep coming back to the belief that America has reached an endpoint.
Throw lime on this fucker and let’s break up into independent regions.
-G
Plus, I was getting suited up back there. Modesty, don’t you know…
Stomach? Maybe they attached it backwards.
Just a thought off the top of my head:
Is it not possible that all these institutional investors took money out of Money Markets all at once to invest in something else? Like the stock market that just tanked and may by some be seen as a bargain?
Why does this have to be seen as a crisis except that the Money Markets broke the dollar?
Been a while since a good fuck thread.
The irresponsible hilarious and tragic nonsense that came out in the hearings from the administration these last two days is also unbelievable . Why were they not laughed out of the hearing room? Why should anyone believe the time from them now? No reason at all.
Sounds good to me, we have oil in Louisiana!!!!
I won’t be surprised to see one in the near future.
Perhaps McCane thought that, since his numbers were going down while campaigning, they would go up if he suspended his campaign.
Maybe McCrazy will refuse to campaign, or give any more interviews – to anyone – until his poll numbers are reported as he wishes them to be reported. No numbers – no comment.
“How’s that for *Change* – all you left-wing-media bastards?”
Not only that, but the sun shines and the wind blows.
PDQ
Pavlovian.Democratic.Quivering.
Sounds like a plan.
Chimpocalypse Now.
America is now a confederacy of dunces run by a league of morons.
-G
By the way, I had to buy a new computer. I’d like FDL to pay for it plub a billion dollars, but you have to meet my conditions. Hand over the money before I smash it.
You are kidding me. Hey!
“Hello? Urban Development? I need $500,000,000 to bring my house up to code.
Uh huh. 2 bedroom, one bathroom. That’s ball-parking it but it’s low, I can tell you that. Right, rural Ohio is really expensive, housing-wise.”
-Click-
“Hello? Hello??”
gdmfkinmfkers.
;) Overdue.
Nite, pups. I’m a lightweight these days.
Good to see you ’round, Suz… hope you’re settled.
Plonkers for me.
well, there’s also jayt’s description from an earlier thread where I mentioned that “nancy off the table” is a bad poker player.
re: the Dems, jayt said- we got four aces, and we’re folding.
k. I got it. I’m just slow.
Here’s the best plan I have heard so far: (keeps going for 16 points total)
Kucinich’s Main Street Recovery Plan
1. Health Care for All: Insurance companies make money not providing health care. As the co-author of HR 676, a universal, single-payer, not-for-profit health care system, Medicare for All, I understand millions of Americans want health care that is accessible and affordable.
Medicare for All will help businesses large and small, create jobs as well as save the jobs of thousands of people including those of doctors, nurses and other healthcare workers who are currently leaving medicine because it is run by the insurance companies. $1 in every 3 dollars of the $2.4 trillion spent annually in America for health care goes to the insurance companies. If we take that money ($800 billion in unproductive wasteful spending) and put it directly into care, we will have enough money to cover everyone. We are already paying for Medicare for all, but not receiving it. HR 676 changes that!
2. Prescription Drug Benefit for Seniors: HR 6800 is the MEDS Act, which provides a fully paid prescription drug benefit, under Medicare, for all seniors. I wrote this bill to help alleviate the economic pressure that comes from the high cost of prescription drugs. We can pay for it by letting the government negotiate drug prices with the pharmaceutical companies as well as by permitting re-importation.
3. Stop the Oil Companies’ Price Gouging: As you know, I was the first one to step up to challenge of the corrupt price gouging and market speculation of the oil companies by proposing a windfall profits tax, on oil and natural gas companies, with revenues put into tax credits for the purchase of fuel-efficient American-made cars. However, it may be that nationalization is the only way to put an end to the oil companies’ sharp practices.
I was reading The Family by Jeff Sharlett tonight just before tuning in to the bullshit on NPR. Sweet little fake bio on McAntichrist. Keating 5 made him change his bad ways and present bills for reform. No mention that he then quashed those bills. As citizens in CO. we got screwed during that corporate raid on the But the new story bt “financial experts” is that happened sooooo long ago it has no bearing anymore. Bullshit stories about POW. No mention that he quashed any action to release POW’s still suffering in Nam.[See Truthout,org current story]
Naomi Klein is a national treasure. We must protect her. We must protect Sibel Edmonds. We are so fucked!!! Our children are so fucked. Our grandchildren are so fucked.
Many thanks Ian. I can’t find anyone who is even close to the comprehensive reporting you are providing.
digg
it’s not a bug, it’s a feature.
Walk it all back. What’s in it for the dems to play along? They don’t have to do this, the public would back them up if they slow walked it. Therefore, they are choosing to do this.
Enough for one night.
Oh, and GO CUBS!
g’nite wangdang
I’m on it.
Glad I saw that on my way out, saved to read tomorrow.
Thanks, TBet!
(Hugs Margot, jayt…)
jofish upstairs
sleep well doodle
“Progressives” say to the Democratic Party “we’ll vote for you, and you only, no matter what, forever, and ever, and ever!”
Democratic Party says, “but what if we fuck you like this, and this, and this!”
Progressives say, “Ooh! Ouch! ai! That hurt! we’ll call our Congressperson! and Fax! and email! and and, write letters to our local papers! and gripe amongst ourselves on our blogs!”
Democratic Party says “I must not be trying hard enough. How about 1 Trillion dollars of your money to the obscenely rich Wall Street Playaz whose ponzi scheme has just collapsed? Would that change your repulsive submissiveness any?”
Progressives say “erm, would you use a little lube, maybe, like $10 million dollars to help maybe pay 1% of the interest after homedebtors enter foreclosure?”
Democratic Party says “Done. President Obama promises to phase that in, if the budget allows.”
Hey I have an idea…if the sky is falling and banks have ceased to lend…
Why don’t they do a quick poll to see if people are being denied credit.
I am guessing the answer is NO!
I have not seen any decrease in ads for No money down home loans or offers in the mail for 0% credit card offers. No decrease.
The only thing I see is the powers that be convincing us to give away our future to a bunch of rich wall street fat cats.
F them.
Oh a-holes on Fast Money insulting the public and saying we don’t understand the finanacial system. Jerks.
From http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com…..41286.aspx (h/t Atrios):
If the economy was really ready to explode on Monday, I would think Hanky Panky and Bernanke would have been able to explain how their plan was going to work when asked.
They had zip. nada. nothing. They just about admitted they plucked a really big number out of thin air, were going to inject it into the financial indutry and hope that would fix it. Wow, they admitted that on TV right in front of the whole country.
After eight years of failing to be able to grab social security funds and place them in the hands of Wall Street this is their final gambit. Not only do they get billions, they also leave any democratic administration financially incapacitated. It’s a double whammy. Similarly, the “crisis” is a win-win proposition. Either the democrats cave in to their demands, or the democrats are responsible when the chickens inevitably come home to roost. Please democrats, haven’t we already seen this movie?
And presumably, Schumer’s got his lasers focused on bailing out Wall Street — he’s had his finer moments (USAGs), but he’s gotta be Wall Street’s guy in DC.
Whether the caucus is behind Dodd or not, he should do what he thinks is right anyway. If he caves, he’s only going to get rolled. He showed principle on FISA, and IMHO he’s capable of showing spine when he believes that there are principles involved.
And if the Dems participate in bailing out Wall Street — even with CEO payments capped, and even with ‘oversight’, I’m going to view them with utter contempt and derision. They’re acting like a bunch of chickens with their heads cut off — ‘Oh, please, just let us be on camera asking Hard, Tough Questions, then we’ll go bleating off like sheep and step off the cliff to bail out Bu$hCo’s sorry, sleazy asses.’
Given this kind of gutlessness, Bob Barr is starting to look good.
Jeebuz.
Why does anyone care about getting percentages of the companies we are bailing out? These companies are all but guaranteed to fail if they government has a percentage? Why? Because the people who run these companies will look at them and say, “I can work hard for this company which already has a crippled outlook because even if we recover, half of all our profits go to the government. OR I can leave this company and engage in the exact same activity for a new company, where I will reap 100% of the benefit of my work.” Which do you think they’ll choose?
Any company that the government has a stake in will lose all quality employees, and quickly go out of business. Pushing for this requirement is not a good expenditure of time or political capital.
Are you kidding me? He really said they just picked a ‘really big number’?
It’s dead. You cannot sell $700B to anybody once they know you just made it up.
Now Dems get to throw all the oversight, reporting, restrictions, exec compensation and anything else they want on the table and demand it be accepted.
Dem arguments will be based on something real. That trumps b.s. every time.
Why should anyone get mad at something which apparently worked well enough for 30 years?
No, something happened in the last ten years and that has Phil Gramm’s name all over it.
Dems don’t need to negotiate now. We OWN this and can toss it in the trash or offer whatever we want. I only hope they see this as an American problem which needs a solid bipartisan solution. No rush job, sound economics.
After the Bush administration is gone that nightmare will end. You might still feel groggy, but that will pass.
Has the market gone back up as a result of some investments?
More likely they are holding onto cash to stay solvent and, in the case of banks, to be sure they meet their federal bank reserve requirement.
Because banks aren’t lending to anybody holding mortgages (and that’s a lot of people) money (via credit) isn’t flowing and that slows the economy, eventually to a very low level.
That’s just the caffeine talking. Stop reading the tea leaves and use them to make a drink with hot water and maybe some sugar or cream. I feel certain you’ll enjoy it and Bob Barr will fade from your thoughts. You can take that dream on a night train to Georgia and have Georgia on your mind and dream of peanuts and peanut butter and great soul food.
BTW, in Atlanta there’s a great old restaurant called Pitty Pat’s Porch. It’s probably the oldest in town and it’s great — live music too.
I think I’ve suddenly become a free market conservative! Some of these Wall Street companies simply have to go out of business. It’s part of a natural correction in the market. Well, the FBI might help too.
It could be a beginning. The problem is representative democracy doesn’t work anymore. Our representatives have no way of knowing what their constituents want, this is assuming they are honest and not in the bag. The only alternative to representative democracy is for we the people to do it ourselves. Most of us are not ready for the responsibility of making decisions for the group generally. We prefer to bitch about those that do. We are, however, running out of wiggle room. Do we have a viable alternative? That is the question.