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	<title>Comments on: It&#8217;s Biden: from MBA Prez to MBNA VP. Text message = Business as Usual</title>
	<atom:link href="http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/</link>
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		<title>By: wmd1961</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1594188</link>
		<dc:creator>wmd1961</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Aug 2008 00:28:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1594188</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I’m able to log in and post. Transient problem.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m able to log in and post. Transient problem.</p>
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		<title>By: shell</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593788</link>
		<dc:creator>shell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 18:24:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593788</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;You would rather have Hillary Clinton?  Are you kidding me?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Biden isn’t my first choice, but he is WAY better than Hillary.  If it had been Hillary, defeat would have been sure.  For the life os me, I can’t see how Americans could be so naive to think Hillary has a chance in 2008 (if Barack loses).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then I realized so many bloggers are very young.  And — just being fron “outside Washington” doesn’t make someone great.  Sigh.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You would rather have Hillary Clinton?  Are you kidding me?</p>
<p>Biden isn’t my first choice, but he is WAY better than Hillary.  If it had been Hillary, defeat would have been sure.  For the life os me, I can’t see how Americans could be so naive to think Hillary has a chance in 2008 (if Barack loses).</p>
<p>Then I realized so many bloggers are very young.  And — just being fron “outside Washington” doesn’t make someone great.  Sigh.</p>
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		<title>By: Margot</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593780</link>
		<dc:creator>Margot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 18:19:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593780</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/06/09/ashcroft_condemns_torture/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Found it.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;“There’s a reason why we sign these treaties,” Senator Joseph R. Biden, Democrat of Delaware, reminded Ashcroft at the hearing. “To protect my son in the military. That’s why we have these treaties, so when Americans are captured, they are not tortured.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Ashcroft, who also has a son in uniform, told Biden, “I care about your son.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Biden also asked Ashcroft whether he believed torture is justified.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;After first declining to discuss “hypotheticals,” Ashcroft finally responded, “I condemn torture. I don’t think it’s productive, let alone justified.”&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/06/09/ashcroft_condemns_torture/" rel="nofollow">Found it.</a></p>
<blockquote><p>“There’s a reason why we sign these treaties,” Senator Joseph R. Biden, Democrat of Delaware, reminded Ashcroft at the hearing. “To protect my son in the military. That’s why we have these treaties, so when Americans are captured, they are not tortured.”</p>
<p>Ashcroft, who also has a son in uniform, told Biden, “I care about your son.”</p>
<p>Biden also asked Ashcroft whether he believed torture is justified.</p>
<p>After first declining to discuss “hypotheticals,” Ashcroft finally responded, “I condemn torture. I don’t think it’s productive, let alone justified.”</p>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: BaxterJ</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593742</link>
		<dc:creator>BaxterJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:52:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593742</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It will be interesting to see how the OBama campaign uses Biden, since he’s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.entertonement.com/collections/1701/Joe-Biden&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a bit of a loose cannon&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It will be interesting to see how the OBama campaign uses Biden, since he’s <a href="http://www.entertonement.com/collections/1701/Joe-Biden" rel="nofollow">a bit of a loose cannon</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Mauimom</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593734</link>
		<dc:creator>Mauimom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:42:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593734</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh, c’mon.  It was probably a Hillary person who leaded to the media to spoil Obama’s carefully crafted surprise.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, c’mon.  It was probably a Hillary person who leaded to the media to spoil Obama’s carefully crafted surprise.</p>
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		<title>By: wmd1961</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593726</link>
		<dc:creator>wmd1961</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:30:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593726</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Biden isn’t what many of us had hoped for as Obama’s first cabinet pick. He’ll help in electing Obama, and he can be spun as providing a more hawkish voice at a high level in the administration which may help bring in some votes. Obama has done some positioning on this already, saying words to the effect of not wanting yes men in his cabinet. While we don’t elect the rest of Obama’s cabinet, we should be pushing for someone strong on civil liberties for AG, and if she’d do it Hillary for HHS.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Anybody else having difficulties with my.barackobama.com? I had a bunch of blogging there last month promoting Accountability Now PAC, and it all appears to have been deleted last night. Hope this is temporary as I want to do some GOTV work again in the fall, to do this I need online calling lists that I can’t currently access.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Biden isn’t what many of us had hoped for as Obama’s first cabinet pick. He’ll help in electing Obama, and he can be spun as providing a more hawkish voice at a high level in the administration which may help bring in some votes. Obama has done some positioning on this already, saying words to the effect of not wanting yes men in his cabinet. While we don’t elect the rest of Obama’s cabinet, we should be pushing for someone strong on civil liberties for AG, and if she’d do it Hillary for HHS.</p>
<p>Anybody else having difficulties with my.barackobama.com? I had a bunch of blogging there last month promoting Accountability Now PAC, and it all appears to have been deleted last night. Hope this is temporary as I want to do some GOTV work again in the fall, to do this I need online calling lists that I can’t currently access.</p>
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		<title>By: hazmaq</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593693</link>
		<dc:creator>hazmaq</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:41:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593693</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;As an activist I became disappointed in the mealy turn Obama took toward the center.   But as much as Holbrook and little Ford Jr. want to call Biden a centrist, he’s not.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;His balanced views on foreign policy aren’t centrist nor are his rock solid credentials in backing the rule of law as a Law Professor.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;He has only two issues I disagree and that clashed with Obama’s platform, but he handled them with great diplomacy - the BK vote that Clinton and Edwards also supported and the war vote.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;1.  He’s from Delaware - every Senator represents his own state’s constituents.&lt;br /&gt;
Hillary for example voted with the Republicans and against her own party to continue the use of cluster bombs- because her backers were pro-war.&lt;br /&gt;
And Edwards, for example actually voted for that BK bill- choosing to support his states business owners rather than those poor mill workers.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2.  His pro-war vote.   He’s one of the few Senators I give a break to because he does have his own son on the way to Iraq and does now say he regrets maki8ng that vote.  He was one of the few putting his money where his mouth is.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But one of Biden’s biggest secret kudos?  In a Meet the Press interview in 2004 between Biden and McCain- Biden speaks to his demanding an increase in troop strength -in 2003- warning there weren’t enough troops to ensure a victory.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;He says in the interview (paraphrased): “John’s coming around to the idea”.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Biden reccommended sending more troops -BEFORE McCain.  HA HA HHHAHAAAHHAH!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an activist I became disappointed in the mealy turn Obama took toward the center.   But as much as Holbrook and little Ford Jr. want to call Biden a centrist, he’s not.</p>
<p>His balanced views on foreign policy aren’t centrist nor are his rock solid credentials in backing the rule of law as a Law Professor.  </p>
<p>He has only two issues I disagree and that clashed with Obama’s platform, but he handled them with great diplomacy &#8211; the BK vote that Clinton and Edwards also supported and the war vote.</p>
<p>1.  He’s from Delaware &#8211; every Senator represents his own state’s constituents.<br />
Hillary for example voted with the Republicans and against her own party to continue the use of cluster bombs- because her backers were pro-war.<br />
And Edwards, for example actually voted for that BK bill- choosing to support his states business owners rather than those poor mill workers.</p>
<p>2.  His pro-war vote.   He’s one of the few Senators I give a break to because he does have his own son on the way to Iraq and does now say he regrets maki8ng that vote.  He was one of the few putting his money where his mouth is.</p>
<p>But one of Biden’s biggest secret kudos?  In a Meet the Press interview in 2004 between Biden and McCain- Biden speaks to his demanding an increase in troop strength -in 2003- warning there weren’t enough troops to ensure a victory.</p>
<p>He says in the interview (paraphrased): “John’s coming around to the idea”.</p>
<p>Biden reccommended sending more troops -BEFORE McCain.  HA HA HHHAHAAAHHAH!</p>
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		<title>By: earlofhuntingdon</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593689</link>
		<dc:creator>earlofhuntingdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593689</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Never underestimate Obama’s ability to disappoint progressives, his ability not simply to assuage the Goopers’ fears, but actually do nothing to challenge their priorities or power or to adequately defend his own.  His insistence on “coloring inside the lines”, his unwillingness to draw freehand or use anything but pencil on paper, freezes breath like a dip into a wintry pool.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Biden is demonstrably no threat to Obama’s dominance of the ticket, no threat to the status quo, no challenge to his demeanor, his smile, his it’s OK even though I’m black.  Those who expected him to recognize much less repair the many things George and Dick will leave broken and strewn about the White House lawn, starting with the Constitution, have confirmation they’ll need to do that themselves.  hurrah.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Never underestimate Obama’s ability to disappoint progressives, his ability not simply to assuage the Goopers’ fears, but actually do nothing to challenge their priorities or power or to adequately defend his own.  His insistence on “coloring inside the lines”, his unwillingness to draw freehand or use anything but pencil on paper, freezes breath like a dip into a wintry pool.  </p>
<p>Biden is demonstrably no threat to Obama’s dominance of the ticket, no threat to the status quo, no challenge to his demeanor, his smile, his it’s OK even though I’m black.  Those who expected him to recognize much less repair the many things George and Dick will leave broken and strewn about the White House lawn, starting with the Constitution, have confirmation they’ll need to do that themselves.  hurrah.</p>
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		<title>By: AbrashTX</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593661</link>
		<dc:creator>AbrashTX</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:13:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593661</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;At least the guy doesn’t seem to be anti-choice, like Kaine. I can live with Biden.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At least the guy doesn’t seem to be anti-choice, like Kaine. I can live with Biden.</p>
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		<title>By: dude</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593562</link>
		<dc:creator>dude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 15:31:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/22/its-biden-from-mba-prez-to-mbna-vp-text-message-business-as-usual/#comment-1593562</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The thrust of egregious’ post:  “okay kids! let’s make lemonade of the lemons we have been given!”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I don’t hate Joe Biden.  I don’t hate Obama. I just don’t like either of them.  Biden is stale and while he can get off a zinger once-in-a-while, he is embedded in Washington’s old ways. I don’t care that he takes the train home every weekend.  This is not change and I don’t believe in it.&lt;br /&gt;
Do you believe in death-bed metamorphosis?  That is what it will take for Joe to make any headway with me.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The thrust of egregious’ post:  “okay kids! let’s make lemonade of the lemons we have been given!”</p>
<p>I don’t hate Joe Biden.  I don’t hate Obama. I just don’t like either of them.  Biden is stale and while he can get off a zinger once-in-a-while, he is embedded in Washington’s old ways. I don’t care that he takes the train home every weekend.  This is not change and I don’t believe in it.<br />
Do you believe in death-bed metamorphosis?  That is what it will take for Joe to make any headway with me.</p>
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