Why does it seem that? Every report I’ve seen is citing a Sprinkles and Pickles (AP’s Liz Sidoti and Nedra Pickler) who are claiming two anonymous sources. These two are the ultimate McInsane fluffers.

This isn’t adding up on a number of levels. I’ll wait for to hear from those getting the text message.

Bankruptcy Biden! Sure to raise the base’s interest. The Audacity of Usury! Woo-hoo!

sigh

Seriously, like your post, eg — hope the Masters’ choice for VP really can do the electoral attack dog role. He does know how to be vicious….perhaps he’ll turn it away from Capitol One’s customers and towards Capitol Hill opponents.

You know, as Keith told us, the ancient plagiarism was really quite a lame charge — Biden had quoted Kinnock many times with attribution, and used the same language in one speech without attributing it. Dukasis’s team seized on that, and the media swarmed. It was a manufactured controversy in a primary campaign with little light and less heat.

he has his flaws, but I kinda like the fighter in ole Teefs ‘n Tufts

Damn, I hope this is a major head fake to let the Conglomerate Press know that there’s a new sheriff in town. It’s not so much about Biden (not great) as it is about the text message promise.

Still holding out Hope for a Dean or Gore announcement and appearance tomorrow in Springfield.

EPUed from the last thread

How does Joe as VP help Obama, foreign policy cred? He voted for the Iraq war and didn’t he want to keep troops in Iraq?
He wants America to help Georgia, yes just what we need a war for an oil pipeline.
He does know how to get things done in politics he can talk.
The problem is the things he has gotten done like the Bankruptcy bill and being seen as tied to the banks are not good things to be when we think that banks are about to collapse.
As far as talking goes he is a quick thinker and an even faster talker he should destroy in the VP debate his problem is he has never learned how to shut up.

hey punaise - good to see you here

He can fight that is good we need someone to go on the counter attack.

Springfield?

OMG: Biden’s just another head fake.

Homer for Veep!

heya Kirk

Biden is Sir Gaffe-a-lot. With the incredibly biased BigMedia, they’lll seize anything he says even remotely wrong, and turn it into a huge story. Dangerous pick if it’s true.

Come to think of it, could BigMedia be making a last ditch, full-on assault to try and pressure Obama to pick an inside the beltway VP? Seems like a stretch, but also possible considering how threatened BigMedia has been acting in regard to the way Obama treats them, and all the inroads we’ve been making in the New Media. This announcement through text messaging must’ve really pissed BigMedia off.

D’oh!

If it’s a fake, it’s a really, really good one.

And on another note, damnit, no fucking Clark.

Fuck.

Whats Biden’s stand on the other issues abortion, gay marriage, the environment, global warming, crime.
What did he want to do if he became President?

Yeah, I figure now’s not the best time to send a personal message, like they invite you to. I might say some things I’d regret.

Huge screw up. HUGE. Been days of build up and tens of thousands of volunteers all empowered thinking they were going to get the scoop and literally waiting on pins and needles. The rug gets pulled from under all of them.

Horrible way to start convention week. Pathetic. At least it wasn’t Bayh I guess.

so much for the over-hyped “find out first via text message” hoopla. I don’t get it.

Good point Biden is really going to inspire who to vote for Obama?

Not sure how relevant it is, but here’s his issues page for his senate re-election site.

I remember him snarling at Ashcroft several years ago. My 17-yr-old son even remembers that.

You guys know I still hope it’s Webb, or Mark Warner. Sigh.

Just another way to introduce new newly mobilized voters into politics

“we’ll betray you and crush your enthusiasm. when we finally lose your vote, it’s your fault — remember that. now give us money and shut up. we have a Village to serve, chumps. quit whining — only Dem consultants get to do that, and since you’re not wearing $1000 K street suits, you’re obviously not in that club.”

(((egregious)))

ABC Radio claiming the text message has gone out and the BO website has been updated: Biden Biden Biden.

Thanks bookmarked it. Lets see how it matches against what he says later.

there’s more than a whiff of that. Lucy pulling the football away as Charlie Brown goes to kick it.

And get your phone number for the ‘file.’

Yes, betray as the first word that came to my mind. It doesn’t matter if someone leaked this to submarine the strategy. It happened and they screwed it up. The fact that it’s Biden makes it even worse. Double whammy.

Maybe we can get some of the dejected newbies to put their time into Blue America instead now?

Obama may be asked whether he’s ready for the red phone if he struggles with text messaging.

Thats a plus!

Another point in his favor, he voted against FISA.

Niether have you…you have been dising the Dem VP choice throughout the thread how does thjat help win an election?

yep. with any luck, maybe even get technewbies to sign up for text messaging — bonus for Barry’s telco masters.

so was this the dreaded “3:00 a.m. call” for east coasters?

I’ve been defending Obama through all the recent criticisms, but this whole deal is inexcusable to me. I’ll go help some local campaigns now and donate only to Blue America candidates. We’ve got to get Alan Grayson to DeeCee!

spew alert for 31 and 36!

Another point in his favor…

With this news, There’s gonna be another pint in my favor, and probably two more pints after that.

Give us all a few days - we will adjust. Ain’t Bayh or Kaine.
Senator McCheese IS NOT an alternative

Yes, they did it at 3:00 AM, aren’t they fucking clever? Except it was all in reverse, the people answered the call. Such an artful masterstroke, or that’s the impression I get from some.

surfacing from the earlier thread just to say:
Good night, all. The best of all possible tomorrows to you all.

nite RonD

Hey Kirk- I remember discussing this issue with someone at FDL a while back, tho based on something lesser from the Obama campaign, from Obama that is- uh, I think it had to do with FISA… and how all of these starry-eyed new young voters were gonna learn a hard lesson… and, what a come-down that would be for them.

Sleep well RonD!

I know!
I don’t remember the details, but I think Biden said his son was serving abroad and he didn’t want our soldiers to be tortured. Does that ring a bell?

Hey VG - that sure was a prescient discussion. ;)

Feh - who cares about mobilizing new voters, anyway?

Hello Punaise- thank you for keeping me laughing, as ever. Much needed. xxoo

Could be worse, at least he didn’t pick another Lieberman type.

Seems rather obvious that they didn’t plan for it to happen like this. Someone leaked it to make the campaign look bad. (Fine, I won’t go into an Clinton conspiracy theories…save it for later)

They were forced to send the text message now, which looks really pathetic.

Kirk- thanks for remembering that… yes, indeedy. Gut instinct.

Could be.
But if I’m Obama, Hillary would not be in this loop. She is the last one I’d tell.

Good morning

So this is what a Friday news dump looks like. Always got there a day late ;-)

Its my opinion based on what I think are the important facts now either convince me otherwise on the facts that I would like Biden for my own reasons.
Or heck if enough people feel as taken for granted by Obama as I do and his moves to the Center like this Biden pick then you won’t have to worry about the election.
I’m already not giving anymore to Obama brcause of FISA
I’m on board to end the war, get national healthcare and green power. I think I’m getting two out of three but if that changes to one out three I’m out of here.
You don’t win change elections with people you win with ideas.
Biden seems like another compromise on the ideas of change.
If you want to win an election convince me you have a good idea and that you have the brains to make it work and the guts to fight for it.
Once again the Dems are lacking Guts.

Better than the other two or three choices being floated: Bayh or that Virginia guy (not Webb, who I would have liked). I’d prefer a leftist…but that probably wouldn’t help get the swing voters. Hillary wouldn’t have helped and I think the Clintons are hoping Obama will lose. So Fightn’ Biden is pretty good compared to past losers like Edwards or Lieberman. Remember how they let even Cheney make them look like fools. Biden can really punch and indeed that past b.s. lifting a speech charge was lame.

About sums it up, though I think the conspiracy is just the media. They wanted to nip the whole thing in he bud, to show that they’re still the gatekeepers.

Sorry drawing a blank but yeah points like you make on ideas like standing up to Ashcroft are a plus in my book. For whatever reason I just seem to remember the negatives.

It was the Obama campaign that created the suspense in the first place, and tweaked it with the text messaging thing.

It makes sense (in a torqued kind of way) that the MSM would be camped outside the homes and offices of the contenders.

Give us all a few days - we will adjust.

exactly. gripe/vent as needed, then follow Tom Waits* and Get Behind the Mule Donkey.

*(youTube cover, unable to find Waits’ version)

hey VG - good to hear from you

…follow Tom Waits* and Get Behind the Mule Donkey.

beauty :-)

I’m sure this VP pick will not help with the poll numbers.

Punaise- thanks! and great music find.

I was, in my limited musical knowledge gonna go with something entirely different, but I can’t beat that one!

horizontality beckons.

BBC has this as a profile on Biden. This would be from a european perspective.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7574085.stm

0h, Punaise- I forgot to add- I actually think the version you posted is better than a “professional musician” version. Loved it.

nite pun

Yep. Piss poor tradecraft.

Team Obama made such a big deal about keeping this a secret…raising the news value on an otherwise quadrennially boring story and ensuring MSM would devote more resources.

“Tradecraft” is about controlling information. Team Obama could control the decision within their inner circle (perhaps) - they definitely could not control the SS deployment.

Competent tradecraft would have recognized that the SS notification ended control of the info, would have anticipated same, and then planned to release the text messages as the SS pulled up to Biden’s house.

That’s cause competent tradecraft would simply assume media surveillance of “high-value” targets…like Biden.

Of course, if Team Obama is now so inured to their SS bubble they’ve forgoten the mere appearance of the bubble is a crucial piece of information, to “piss poor tradecraft” we can add “arrogance”.

Hey - it worked well for Gary Hart’s candidacy, right? Oh, wait…

Tradecraft, tradecraft, tradecraft: information, like energy, comes from somewhere. Thinking through the “somewhere(s)”, containing the “somewhere(s)”, comprehending the limits and failure modes of said containment(s), and fully anticipating/planning for the consequences of those limits and failure modes: that’s tradecraft.

Team Obama wouldn’t know it if it bit them in their expensively dressed asses.

I just searched GoogleNews for biden text. Thousands of results came up, but Google offered, “Did you mean: hidden text”. If I could respond, I might say, “Sure, give me all you’ve got, and all Bush and Cheney have got, and all the RNC have got, and all the Intelligence Community and their contractors and partners have illegally got, and …”

Sleep well, punaise.

Off to bed myself - goodnight, pups.

I’ve been defending Obama through all the recent criticisms, but this whole deal is inexcusable to me. I’ll go help some local campaigns now and donate only to Blue America candidates. We’ve got to get Alan Grayson to DeeCee!

Stay tuned, Grayson is our Blue Am guest today…it is today, isn’t it? …looks at clock…looks at empty suitcase for the convention…It will happen.

I guess we’ll just have to put Biden’s feet to the fire. As someone reminded me on the Great Orange Satan, Obama didn’t want a sycophant, he wanted someone who would challenge him and disagree with him. Take that a step further, and all his “We are the change we’ve been waiting for,” rhetoric makes a little bit of sense.

I think I was going somewhere with that, but my brain is mush from all the posting of snorkelcock pics on DailyKos. And trying to keep my head from exploding because of someone actually defending CC companies.

Honestly, of the bland whitebread choices, Biden is probably the best of them. Webb and Warner, while feisty, take away from hard-fought blue seats in Virginia, Bayh is a terrible choice, Chet Edwards suffers from name association/lack of real name recognition (”Edwards? That fella that cheated on his sick wife?”) — so if Obama wasn’t going to inspire AND draw artillery fire by picking Clinton, or be able to score a rock-star pick like Gore, there’s not many good choices left. Clark is media-damaged, sadly; my personal choices were him or Sebelius.

Biden is lukewarm at this exact moment, but we have the Dem convention to put out the platform message and for Biden to issue some punches to McCain — and you know those punches will be good ones. Plus, assuming McCain chooses either Mittens or Lieberman as a running mate, Biden will absolutely destroy them. Lieberman especially; there will be zero bounce for “unity” for McCain once Biden gets through systematically taking that bastard apart. If McCain hopes to score points with a veep pick, he has to go radical, which will dilute brand among the faithful.

Obama’s VP pick is not a strong inspirational one, but I think in terms of the last months of the campaign, it’s a strong tactical one. Biden is a brawler, the kind of guy who’s going to push the buttons of the McCain camp in a big way.

D

Agree.

Plus, assuming McCain chooses either Mittens or Lieberman as a running mate, Biden will absolutely destroy them.

This is going to get pretty good. Biden will relish a shot at ‘insert asshole here (RGJoe would be sweet, but I still don’t believe that McCheese is that stupid)’, and it will probably be the only entertaining debate of the season.

Good morning, I could not go back to sleep after the 3 am phone call. Obama wanted someone to challenge him and Biden is no shrinking violet.

Biden!

attack. Attack. ATTACK.

THE MAVERICK CAN’T REMEMBER ANYMORE.

So Murhpy, you gonna vote the ticket, or not?

Cuz the rest of the hyperbole and general woosin about ‘my pick didn’t win’ is pretty much useless at this point . . .

You wanna win, or whine? *G*

Lemme know . . . the cards are dealt, the pots all in, and yer either hi, low, or hi/low.

And this ain’t the time now to whine . . . once the election is won, and the ticked we VOTED for, is straying, we hold their feet to fire . . . and we treat THIS admin MUCH different than any other, cuz we’ve been burned way too bad.

And you KNOW the only way to hold the feet to the fire is not the ballot box.

It will be time to turn bodies out in the streets . . . LOTS of bodies.

Not shut up, and VOTE will ya! *G*

ALL of yas!!! It’s over, it’s OBAMA/BIDEN!

Get on board, or suffer the loss . . . and doom your sons, daughters, wives and husbands, lovers and the next years of OUR phrelllin lives . . . .

Harumph. ;-)

Yer killin me . . . it’s over . . . how do you not see that?

Yer killin me, too . . it’s over . . . time to group up EG.

Ya know Murhpy, the newly franchised voters of young ages, and different races, and varied callings in life occupation wise, likely don’t have your jaded and narrow visioned perspective.

They just might show up, vote, and win it for us.

You wanna mess with THAT? What’s WRONG with ya?

*softly singing to ones self* … it’s a long way to PUAC, it’s a long , long way to go ….

http://www.independent.co.uk/o.....06480.html

Does the horizon on your world-view include that vista? Robert Fisk again at his very best.

Did you know that he was a POW?

How? How does it make them look pathetic?

*smilessweetly*

And now, if we end up with 59 votes in the Senate, the true brilliance of yet another stupid move by the obama will be known. Good god how many more ways are the Dems going to find to chuck an election that should have been easy.

I spent part of the 1986 election year driving Biden around NH. A nice man, loves trains, can’t stop talking, but milquetoast as a veep. If there was any doubt that obama was in the pockets of big bus those doubts should now be dispelled.

Geebuz, the poll numbers are part and parcel of the same machine that makes money off of elections . . . ignore the polls!

Wait for the election, and in the meantime, advocate for your choice.

Or just vote for McCain and the neocons and the 1% . . . (not that the dem’s ain’t the 1% but that’s another rant some other time). *G*

For god’s sake, they milked a few weeks of free media publicity and saved millions of dollars of ad money . . . the pub’s are doing the same things . .

It’s what passes for a long lost and much needed Fairness Doctrine these days.

Hoss, I just don’t get you as a progressive . . . and your com studies theory is whacked out.

Harumph.

TREX! IS THAT YOU?!?!?!? *G*

Bingo! Thanks. *G*

If there was any doubt that obama was in the pockets of big bus those doubts should now be dispelled.

no doubt at all.

but i’d prefer to have the msg not quite so “in my face.”

neoliberal economics that grind people into the dirt.

imperialism and war foreign policy (biden not only voted for the iraq war, he voted against the levin amendment. and biden was the person pushing for iraq to be divided into three parts kurds/sunni/shia - a recipe for ethnic cleansing and against the desires of the iraq people).

still, i suppose it could have been worse.

There are those who maintain the system is rigged, government is broken, and the nation bankrupted, and the only path to national power is through either the republic or democrat wings of corporate authoritarians. These people’s viewpoint is becoming more and more clearly correct.

What to do:

Try to correct as it is, from within? The resistance and inertia all but make that impossible. Agreement and a meeting of minds must take place. All participants must be participating on a level playing field. Judgments and decisions must be made from facts and seriously considered opinions uncolored by propaganda, disinformation, willful ignorance, etc. The path followed by at least two, or more generations clearly show the antithesis to that happening. The language itself, is manipulated to preclude the possibility.

To correct from without? What manner of power is there to overcome the national deficits of a hyper-power? Not even seriously to be considered.

To leave be, to let collapse from the internal contradictions and cancers of the body politic, may be the wisest course to follow, although there will be widespread collateral damage from the event.

Which ever way it will be, the current governance is unrepairably broken. The economy upon which it is built no longer operates, the purpose of law has been gutted to preclude justice. Little remains of the glue of social adhesion. The experiment as it was is over.

Maybe new founding fathers can engineer another experiment. Maybe that will work, maybe not.

still, i suppose it could have been worse.

Yep but here we go again with the “least worst” choice. What the hell is wrong with a system that has us voting foe “least worst” for pres. and getting “least worst” for veep. Have we no BEST choices.

I must say I was hoping for a choice that would have allowed me to vote for obama but he has, once again, proven to be blancmange when we need meat and potatoes.

Good morning, pups. It’s Collins, Blow and Herbert today. La Collins wrote about “Digging Ourselves a Black Hole.” She says there is nothing we enjoy more than sealing our own doom in the most creative ways possible. Mr. Blow’s column is titled “McCain’s Drill Appeal,” and he says “Earth to Barack: to Main Street America, nuance equals confusion. You don’t have to dumb it down, but you do have to sum it up.” Mr. Herbert says “Voters Want More From Obama,” and that Senator Barack Obama needs a first-rate, crackling-with-excitement populist message, which means a laser-like focus on the economy and jobs.

http://mgpaquin.wordpress.com/

The coffee and tea are ready, and the apple walnut muffins are out of the oven. So now it remains to be seen if Democrats will shoot themselves in the foot again by refusing to stand together against McSame. My guess? It could go either way. Have a good day.

And now, if we end up with 59 votes in the Senate, the true brilliance of yet another stupid move by the obama will be known.

wouldn’t the gov. be expected to appoint a D? or doesn’t it work like that?

Maybe new founding fathers can engineer another experiment. Maybe that will work, maybe not.

Founding mothers might be a better start! The “system” is working just fine for those that devised it. The founding fathers were rich, privileged men slave owners, landed gentry that wanted to stop paying taxes and lip service to their british masters. They wanted to have their own country, to run as they saw fit with monied people allowed to make as much money as they wanted on the backs of whomever they chose. The system is working just fine thank you although, at the moment, I am having trouble remembering just how many houses I own.

To correct from without? What manner of power is there to overcome the national deficits of a hyper-power? Not even seriously to be considered.

profoundly disagree. could not disagree more.

how did jim crow era laws end in the usa? how did india gain it’s independence from british rule?

there is no magic button to be pushed, and i can’t order it from amazon…. but the power a government has is profoundly dependent on it’s citizens. organize the citizens and we will have another government.

I don’t know what system is employed in Delaware but what ever it is taking away a certain Senate seat when we are desperately in need of 60 votes to stop either McSame or obama spying on americans, expanding unitary powers or what ever it just seems foolish.

PS trying to type with two feisty cats helping is not easy!!!

Biden is a hell of alot better than DLC Clinton and Warner. Webb is a damned Republican. I am so amazed at the number of centrists on liberal blogs.

IIRC It was a REPUBLIC that was devised, not a DEMOCRACY. That to my knowledge was where developments lead.

Founding mothers might be a better start!

Has it become so politically correct that the language cannot be used?

What you are reffering to is corrections from within, look at the quoted lines, do they correspond?

selise, nomolos, marion et al.

I am a bad person. I started a kitteh blog spot to keep me sane. But, I was wondering how long it would be before I went off the rails.

I think I’ve just gone off the rails, with the latest. Sigh.

http://teh-kitteh-antidote-anecdote.blogspot.com/

ah, i thought your comment re corrections from without was in reference to from outside the party system.

I agree but motivating the masses is darn near impossible. Most people I know can barely keep up with the Washington lies let alone make signs and march in the streets. What we need are four or five viable political parties to shake the status quo. But first we have to get rid of corporate financing, how that will come about is anybody’s guess. The efforts in this household this year is to send money to progressive candidates, no matter where, and to vote for a third party choice in the general (McKinney in this instance). I believe, at the end of the election, if we see that 25+% of the vote has gone to neither of the corporate sponsored candidates, we have a base to work from… sure disparate views will be among the dissenting voters but isn’t that better than better than constantly bowing to the corporate wishes?

I like Joe.

He’s articulate.

And clean.

morning vg!

do i need more coffee or are you going to explain that one? right ear of the kitteh?

p.s. it’s hard to stay sane in these times… but cats help. i see that nomolos is getting help typing and mine are telling me it’s time to play with their bird toy.

Sorry, I thought the reference to hyper-power would indicate extra-national (outside) forces. I can see where better wording could prevent misunderstanding. ;-)

Humour T-Bear. It is my piss poor attempt at humour.

away for daily bread, be good

That blog looks like fun VG.

BTW I too think Founding Females was an opportunity missed. ;-)

And not uppity!

if we see that 25+% of the vote has gone to neither of the corporate sponsored candidates, we have a base to work from

well, if we count the people who refuse to vote out of disgust for the choices, we do have a base. how to organize and make that matter is, imo, just as difficult as you describe. we are such an atomatized (is that a even a word?) culture.

Selise, I was actually working on a post about kittehs who steal gloves. My first clue to that was an article I read in the Boston Globe ~ 2 years ago. And, the photo that accompanied was the one I enlarged. I was trying to see if I could actually read the “my cat steals gloves”, and it I put the photo up in its original form, if others could read.

And then, I got carried away with majorly obscure snark, mostly for my own amusement.

or better reading! *g*

A kitteh blog! What fun! Thanks for letting us know — kittehs are guaranteed sanity protectors. (Well, unless they’re helping you type and studying cause and effect by knocking things off your desk…)

amusement is good.

we are such an atomatized (is that a even a word?) culture.

Would that we could atomize some of the present pack of pathetic politicians

at·om·ize (t-mz)
tr.v. at·om·ized, at·om·iz·ing, at·om·iz·es
1. To reduce to or separate into atoms.
2. To reduce to tiny particles or a fine spray.
3. To break into small fragments.
4. To subject to bombardment with atomic weapons.

Worst Taliban Attack or Worst NATO Blunder?

AFP and al-Jazeera are reporting that the French army refuses to comment on a report in Le Monde that the 10 French soldiers actually were killed by a NATO airstrike responding to the initial attack by militants.

thank you. pretty lame that i haven’t mastered my own language yet….

was going for #3. atomize

1,740 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…

Citizen nomolos:

“…motivationg the masses is darn near impossible. Most people I know can barely keep up with the Washington lies let alone make signs and march in the streets. What we nee are 4 or 5 viable political parties to shake things up…”

I don’t think havin’ 4-5 “viable political parties” will solve the problem of gettin’ folks into the streets…most people are too busy workin’ two or more jobs and keepin up with the mortgage and keepin food on the table ta even have time ta hit the streets and even if they could make the time, the general population has been scared into their bunker existances…we live in a fascist terror state that has convinced people that mass action is impossible and anti-American.

No, Citizen nomolos, we need a political leader and an insurgent arm of one of the existin parties to empower people to take direct action beginnin’ in the voting booth. The next populist mass movement is gunna start from the ballot box and then into the street behind an indentifiable political faction.

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNTION, THERE IS NO MIDDLE GROUND ANYMORE!!

also via antiwar.com, from cnet:

Fatal flaws found in terrorism database

One of the country’s most important terrorism databases is on the verge of failure after suffering from gross mismanagement and technical design flaws that went ignored for months, a congressional investigation found.

A congressional committee on Thursday called for an investigation into a program called “Railhead,” which was supposed to upgrade the National Counterterrorism Center’s integrated terrorist intelligence database, called Terrorist Identities Datamart Environment (TIDE). The database serves the United States’ 16 separate intelligence agencies, and as of January, contained more than 500,000 names (PDF), according to the NCTC. The program has cost an estimated $500 million.

No, not uppity in the least.

Marion- LOL!

And, to you and Selise and others, I was taking bets with myself how long I could stave off the urge to make the kitteh blog politically un-neutral…

Not long, apparently… I already went over the line once before, and I thought I’d gotten out of my system… sigh.

And that is not meant to be snarky at all, actually.

Biden is more of a “regular Joe” than ANYONE else on either ticket, at least it seems that way.

Commuted from home to DC everyday to spend time with his remaining family after the accident that took his wife/child. I don’t think Biden EVER had a place in DC.

THAT is family values.

citizen norske - i don’t see how it will ever start with a political leader. we all want a savior, but i don’t think that is a healthy political impulse. better we each take a bit of leadership and share responsibility.

from chris hedges:

I do not trust or believe most politicians. I have covered too many. The question is not how we can get good people to govern. The question is how we can limit the damage of mostly mediocre, callow men and women, who comprise the majority of those who yearn for power, from doing the most harm. This comes through the rigorous checks and balances of a functioning democracy, not self-appointed political saviors. But we always prefer saviors, those who make us believe they have attained moral and heroic summits that elude us.

we must be the check and balance.

I just gleened this from a raw story article and there is something about mccain’s lobbiests that I think we all missed, this is really big and a story should be done just about this even though I guess it’s old news, check out my bold;

In his recent history, Scheunemann was a key member of the Project for a New American Century (PNAC), which lobbied President Clinton for war with Iraq for years before the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001. He was also a signatory on a letter to President George W. Bush, just days after the terrorist attacks, demanding an invasion of Iraq and threatening political consequences if the president did not comply.

now we of course knew the first part, that clinton was lobbied throughout his term to initiate aggression against sadam, what I did NOT know is the second bold, that bush was threatened by the this man and other pnac maniacs!

who else is signatory to the letter to bush?

I think that letter needs to get plenty of play, does anyone have a link to a copy of that

I think picking Biden means Chuck Hagel will have a cabinet position.

ok, I found a referance

“Even if evidence does not link Iraq directly to the attack, … remove Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq.”

here are the signatories

Sincerely, William Kristol
Richard V. Allen / Gary Bauer / Jeffrey Bell / William J. Bennett
Rudy Boshwitz / Jeffrey Bergner / Eliot Cohen / Seth Cropsey
Midge Decter / Thomas Donnelly / Nicholas Eberstadt / Hillel Fradkin
Aaron Friedberg / Francis Fukuyama / Frank Gaffney / Jeffrey Gedmin
Reuel Marc Gerecht / Charles Hill / Bruce P. Jackson / Eli S. Jacobs
Michael Joyce / Donald Kagan / Robert Kagan / Jeane Kirkpatrick
Charles Krauthammer / John Lehman / Clifford May / Martin Peretz
Richard Perle / Norman Podhoretz / Stephen P. Rosen / Randy Scheunemann
Gary Schmitt / William Schneider, Jr. / Richard H. Shultz / Henry Sokolski
Stephen J. Solarz / Vin Weber / Leon Wieseltier / Marshall Wittmann

I believe hagel will get on board for real progressive issues now that he is not tied down to his party

at least we can hope

Norske- going back to an earlier topic- which you raised before the recent political hoo haw-

Listening to original versions- I immediately dug this out for you-

http://firedoglake.com/2008/08.....nt-1593172

I’m jonesing for some freshness, who’s gonna post early morning today, anyone know?

Good pick. I like it and nobody’s gonna tell me differnt

Jeane Kirkpatrick ???? No joke. I thought she was dead.

How many houses does Biden own?

I think this is a great selection… http://www.enewsreference.wordpress.com

LOL. Very clean. Clean’s every important. Those plugs came in really well.

In the “pockets of big bus”? I thought you said he likes trains? Buses are OK. The point is mass transit is important component of any energy policy, right? Whatever, I love trains, so I’m cool with Joe.

Good morning all, Been up for a while trying to wrap my head around the overnight e-mail and reading the posts.
Perris - Chuck Hagel is a good man but his views are conservative w/ the exception of his anti-war position
NFT - We currently have a VP who when told how the american people felt, responded “so” It was contemptible but honest. How many of the people in office really harbor this perception. Yes we can all go to the ballot box every couple of years and all get out in the street in between and we can jump up and down in unison - “so”. What we need is a stick. The only stick that I can see as being available to us is the threat of a constitutional convention.

That’s all that needs to be said in my view.

I think he only has one. If McShame picks Romney they would have the equivalent of a small but exclusive community between them.

The local fishwrap, which since the ChiTrib new ownership is Worse than ever — it was “revamped” (read: news replaced by pictures” or “USAToday’d”), endorsed Grayson’s opponent Charlie Stuart. That and a token will get Stuart on the train. This is what they said about Grayson:

Businessman and lawyer Alan Grayson of Orlando, who also ran in 2006, has made a national name for himself by suing Iraq War contractors for fraud. His impatience with opposing views would hinder him in Congress. His campaign platform — such as mandating paid vacations and pensions for all Americans, and boosting Social Security and Medicare benefits without regard to the funding problems in those programs — is utopian, not practical.

Da noive, huh ?

Really. I don’t know how far you can play the houses thing … or that whole theme….. Regan/Bush won twice and nobody gave a shit that the were rich. ten again, Bush got nailed on that supermarket scanner thing because he looked out of touch. So I guess it has to be played more as out-of- touchedness than just wealthiness.

I like Biden, too. Especially his sharp tongue. I’m feeling really confident that this ticket is a winner.

The ethnic cleansing has been goingon for two years and especially since the SURGE. It’s just not being reported.

What happens with the son about to go to Iraq? I hope they stop that now. Wouldn’t he be a target? As much as Prince Harry or Jenna and Not-Jenna (were they ever to serve)?

and if the Dems don’t win this time around you can bet the U.S. of A. as envisioned by it’s founders will be done for.

i agree - but biden was advocating that policy before, as far as i know, the ethnic cleansing really took off in a big way.

Wikipedia - political positions of Joe Biden.

Voted against “Partial Birth Abortion” (a Fundie invention) and for the Defense of Marriage Act.

I think I’m staying home.

Biden voted for the Defense of Marriage Act?
Is that from wiki or somewhere more reliable?

ACLU Rating:
Joe Biden has an 80% lifetime rating from the ACLU, the second-highest of any major-party 2008 presidential candidate (only Dennis Kucinich, at 89%, has him beat).

http://civilliberty.about.com/....._biden.htm

Lesbian and Gay Rights - Everything But Marriage:
Biden voted for the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996, but has been quoted as saying “I don’t know why we should be frightened of [same-sex marriage].” Although he sees same-sex marriage as a likely inevitability, he has not taken the step of actually supporting it. Instead, he supports a civil unions policy that would grant the same legal rights. He also supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA), federal hate crime legislation that includes sexual orientation and gender identity as protected categories, and the repeal of “don’t ask, don’t tell.”

same site.

They should have had a “pull the trigger” scenario for when the news leaked. To believe they could keep a secret like this till the last moment shows incredible naivete.

This is no longer the primaries. Your choice is not “none of the above”, it is between McCain and Obama.

He stood up to one war criminal (Milosevic) but hasn’t stood up to another (Bush). I guess that’s why they call him a foreign policy expert.

I’m okay with Obama having supported FISA as long as he uses it’s powers on the Bush Admin after they leave office.

Otherwise, Biden doesn’t do anything for me. And why lower the number of Dens in the Senate? What does Biden bring that would justify that?

Hey at least they’ll take Delaware - Biden might have been a better choice in … I don’t know …. the 70s or 80s. He’s been nothing but a blowhard for many years. Not that it matters to me, I wouldn’t have voted for Obama even if he had shown some intelligence and guts with this one decision which, of course, he did not.

“I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American[white guy] who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy, I mean, that’s a storybook, man.”

Morning all, late to the party.

I gotta weigh in here, if only to get myself in trubble.

I’m delighted to see it’s Biden.

He’s incredibly articulate when he’s being careful.
He knows ALL the issues and ALL the players inside and out.
He knows the game backwards and forwards.

He needs a “minder”. We all know that. What better one than Obama?!
Because Obama is showing such finesse and muscle and ability to control the message, I think he’ll have no trouble keeping the fella in line.

What a hilarious head-fake though. “It’s not about ego.”

Hear that, Biden? Good boy. Sit. Stay. heh

Lessee. I’m trying to imagine debates in the fall.

Obama slicing and dicing mcccccaint.

Biden dabbing the corners of his mouth after chewing up what’s left of liarman.

Issues, schmissues. Biden will have to be a team player.

dontcha think?

Well. I do, anyway, fwiw.

Does this mean that both of the major parties are lame ducks? I mean, how much more transparent can’t this sham get?

No, I mean, how much more transparency does one need to see this as a total sham. Or Baby Sham?

Orifice/Blowhard`08!!!111

sorry, no funk at our house.

go help someone.

go help something.

DO something.

the decision was not yours.

it IS Obama’s.

make lemonade.

if we only sit and gripe, who’s… what’s… the sham?

not me.

Guzuntheit!

danak!

barnacle biden

with that mouth he’ll stuck hard on the body politic.

Facts like that can help convince me Solai.
I brought up the bad case on Biden, the counter case earier and in the previous thread.
I still think more of a counter case has to be made to convince me but facts do work with me. The just accept it you have no choice we have to win bunch are not making any points with me.

Just imagine Chris Mathews legs this morning. They are both tingling. He may have to go to the emergency room. No other politician has ever appeared more times on Hardball. Its gonna be funny seeing who gets more airtime. Anywhere a TeeVee camera is, there will be Biden running at the mouth. I was sick of him a long time ago. But the good ole Irish Catholics stick together so it may help Obama with the media. With the voters, not so much.

This is good book marked it

oh. my. god.
“change we can believe in”.

Well… I was online too long last night doing a bit more background on Biden and confess that I stayed up too late because it was such fun.

Here’s what I’d missed until I looked into Biden a bit more thoroughly — the man is funny. He has wit. (As does Obama.)

FDR, JFK, and even (heaven help me) Ronald Reagan had wit. They were funny, witty people. The best politicos are funny, and in that sense Biden is a wonderful pick.

I doubt he’ll rip McCain a new arsehole - I think he’ll be more likely to do something like look with mock concern at the bottom of McCain’s drawers and ask whether he Depends on the GOP for all his crap, or only on even numbered days.

The best political gift (apart from smarts) is a great sense of humor, and it looks like Biden’s got that in spades. I’m hoping this could get fun!

The thrust of egregious’ post: “okay kids! let’s make lemonade of the lemons we have been given!”

I don’t hate Joe Biden. I don’t hate Obama. I just don’t like either of them. Biden is stale and while he can get off a zinger once-in-a-while, he is embedded in Washington’s old ways. I don’t care that he takes the train home every weekend. This is not change and I don’t believe in it.
Do you believe in death-bed metamorphosis? That is what it will take for Joe to make any headway with me.

At least the guy doesn’t seem to be anti-choice, like Kaine. I can live with Biden.

Never underestimate Obama’s ability to disappoint progressives, his ability not simply to assuage the Goopers’ fears, but actually do nothing to challenge their priorities or power or to adequately defend his own. His insistence on “coloring inside the lines”, his unwillingness to draw freehand or use anything but pencil on paper, freezes breath like a dip into a wintry pool.

Biden is demonstrably no threat to Obama’s dominance of the ticket, no threat to the status quo, no challenge to his demeanor, his smile, his it’s OK even though I’m black. Those who expected him to recognize much less repair the many things George and Dick will leave broken and strewn about the White House lawn, starting with the Constitution, have confirmation they’ll need to do that themselves. hurrah.

As an activist I became disappointed in the mealy turn Obama took toward the center. But as much as Holbrook and little Ford Jr. want to call Biden a centrist, he’s not.

His balanced views on foreign policy aren’t centrist nor are his rock solid credentials in backing the rule of law as a Law Professor.

He has only two issues I disagree and that clashed with Obama’s platform, but he handled them with great diplomacy - the BK vote that Clinton and Edwards also supported and the war vote.

1. He’s from Delaware - every Senator represents his own state’s constituents.
Hillary for example voted with the Republicans and against her own party to continue the use of cluster bombs- because her backers were pro-war.
And Edwards, for example actually voted for that BK bill- choosing to support his states business owners rather than those poor mill workers.

2. His pro-war vote. He’s one of the few Senators I give a break to because he does have his own son on the way to Iraq and does now say he regrets maki8ng that vote. He was one of the few putting his money where his mouth is.

But one of Biden’s biggest secret kudos? In a Meet the Press interview in 2004 between Biden and McCain- Biden speaks to his demanding an increase in troop strength -in 2003- warning there weren’t enough troops to ensure a victory.

He says in the interview (paraphrased): “John’s coming around to the idea”.

Biden reccommended sending more troops -BEFORE McCain. HA HA HHHAHAAAHHAH!

Biden isn’t what many of us had hoped for as Obama’s first cabinet pick. He’ll help in electing Obama, and he can be spun as providing a more hawkish voice at a high level in the administration which may help bring in some votes. Obama has done some positioning on this already, saying words to the effect of not wanting yes men in his cabinet. While we don’t elect the rest of Obama’s cabinet, we should be pushing for someone strong on civil liberties for AG, and if she’d do it Hillary for HHS.

Anybody else having difficulties with my.barackobama.com? I had a bunch of blogging there last month promoting Accountability Now PAC, and it all appears to have been deleted last night. Hope this is temporary as I want to do some GOTV work again in the fall, to do this I need online calling lists that I can’t currently access.

Oh, c’mon. It was probably a Hillary person who leaded to the media to spoil Obama’s carefully crafted surprise.

It will be interesting to see how the OBama campaign uses Biden, since he’s a bit of a loose cannon.

Found it.

“There’s a reason why we sign these treaties,” Senator Joseph R. Biden, Democrat of Delaware, reminded Ashcroft at the hearing. “To protect my son in the military. That’s why we have these treaties, so when Americans are captured, they are not tortured.”

Ashcroft, who also has a son in uniform, told Biden, “I care about your son.”

Biden also asked Ashcroft whether he believed torture is justified.

After first declining to discuss “hypotheticals,” Ashcroft finally responded, “I condemn torture. I don’t think it’s productive, let alone justified.”

You would rather have Hillary Clinton? Are you kidding me?

Biden isn’t my first choice, but he is WAY better than Hillary. If it had been Hillary, defeat would have been sure. For the life os me, I can’t see how Americans could be so naive to think Hillary has a chance in 2008 (if Barack loses).

Then I realized so many bloggers are very young. And — just being fron “outside Washington” doesn’t make someone great. Sigh.

I’m able to log in and post. Transient problem.