John McCain hath decided he would like to spend the media cycle talking about the Cone of Silence, and thus Andrea Mitchell getteth taken to the woodshed by Rick Davis today.
But the more interesting McCain story du jour regards a moving tale he recounted at the Saddleback event, about the time he spent in North Vietnam -- the "turning moment" in his captivity where a prison guard wordlessly drew a cross in the dirt.
Yes, I'm touched too. But as Andrew Sullivan notes this morning, McCain managed to leave this pivotal emotional event out of his 1973 biography.
A hauntingly similar story was told by Solzhenitsyn in his 1973 Gulag Archapelago:
Leaving his shovel on the ground, he slowly walked to a crude bench and sat down. He knew that at any moment a guard would order him to stand up, and when he failed to respond, the guard would beat him to death, probably with his own shovel. He had seen it happen to other prisoners.
As he waited, head down, he felt a presence. Slowly he looked up and saw a skinny old prisoner squat down beside him. The man said nothing. Instead, he used a stick to trace in the dirt the sign of the Cross. The man then got back up and returned to his work.
As Solzhenitsyn stared at the Cross drawn in the dirt his entire perspective changed.
I'll leave it to religious experts to debate whether it's more likely that this incident occurred in the cold war Soviet Union or an Asian prison camp, but per Dave Johnson this morning, McCain told the same story in 2000 -- about a different prisoner.
Maybe he's just so reluctant to talk about his captivity that he just didn't want to mention the eerie parallels to his own experience. But it seem that in 2005, the Freepers were calling bullshit, too.
Michael Goldfarb, asleep at the wheel?
Maybe Andrea Mitchell will be getting some company.
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Are any of the mornings shows talking about this today? GMA? Today? Or are we gonna have to wait for KO(Or is Rachel subbing for him this week)?
Since the MSM will say nothing, this deserves to be covered in a political commercial. Is anyone from the Obama campaign listening? Are all the other Democrats still sedated? Are all 527s Republic now?
there was an old movie with Ethan Hawke with similar meme…….John McGiggolo is a real peacock,and loves to strut his stuff…yea he is a peacock with a very embellished tale
sedated from koolaid/ambien cocktail,served at all the posh parties…truth always suffers
This McLiar is like Bushy on steroids…I think Joe Biden should make the final call on this plaglarizing asshole, it’s only fair and a little ironic.
It looks like McCain is already having Reagan moments and he’s not even in the White House yet.
Is this the best and only POW the repukes can come up with to run for prez?..last I remember 70% of US voters didn’t like the idea of invading Vietnam.
that’s a scary thought
Very true…McForgetful wants to resemble Reagan in too many ways. Oldtimers disease runs in the GOP!
lets get REAL here…..Mccain by his OWN words said he was a war CRIMINAL not HERO…meet the press i believe ‘92
What has happened to Andrea Mitchell? Mrs Greenspan’s about as mainstream as you can get and now she’s coming to Obama’s aid. First she called McCain out on the European Wounded Soldiers Fantasy and now the Code of Silence Cheat. Maybe the old girl is really a journalist after all…
The debates will probably wind up being the determining factor
Jane,
How dare you impugn McSame’s integrity. He was a POW fer gawdsakes!
The Military-Industrial Complex needs another idiot-beard.
McCaine is their boy.
the old gray hairs in the gray suits got all the power and all the dough,they pass it down to their “nudnick” kids who get dumber an d dumber with each generation…witness W,and Mc Giggolo……..2 pearls
Funny that the Rayguns despised him>
and to folks on this thread who use Firefox. Don’t. Some nasty bug in it. Use another browser til they get it fixed.
Amen to that, Brother, and don’t forget Tucker Carlson..
Are we going to see the same attacks….. Na don’t think so…
Al Gore invented the internet === McBush stole cross in the dirt story
Yeppers….. no fairness in the old town today…
Anderson Cooper…..the list is endless
they liked his wife,and knew he had ZERO integrity
ya know that IS the whole problem with McGiggolo…he has zero integrity ,will SAY or DO anything to justify his means to his ends…very scary fella imo
And Georgie’s first cousin, Billy Bush, breathlesslly bringing us the latest Britney Spears saga..
that is reason for zillion flip flops
they are fed the big bucks Mothers Milk,from the corporate teet
Was it Mark Twain or Karl Rove who said that a lie is as good as the truth if someone will believe it.
or just avoid cutting and pasting.
hard to do if you want to link to something. Since most of us do that here, better to use another browser for the time being.
off to get my car
buggedinspected.Watching C=span here caller just made a comment tnat McCain in answering the question about when life begins wanted to go back to the question of supreme court justices which hadn’t been asked yet.
I had that problem a couple of weeks ago and downloaded Malwarbytes to get rid of it. Worked great. The main thing is not to believe it when you get a popup that says “Vista Antivirus” has detected a number of viruses.
I guess McCain hijacked someone’s clipboard, too. Let’s hope we can remove his malware also.
Thanks for this post Jane. I don’t know, I’m going to say something somewhat positive (for me) on a Monday: one of these McCain “Moments” will get through the MSM filter. I don’t know if it’s this one, or the next one, or the next one. But one will. And then watch out.
To use a combat analogy, we’ve got to keep shelling the fortress (or is that a Sting lyric? Christy? :) ) until it happens. Gosh knows, we’ve got enough ammunition…
Does the McSame campaign have an appropriations specialist or an appropriations committee?
Peterr said this yesterday on his thread
Peterr August 17th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
16
In response to moondancer @ 10 (show text)
Actually, that “fish in the dirt” story has roots that go back to the first century in Christian history. It’s been told in many places, well before McCain or the Gulag Archipelago, as a way in which two Christians identified themselves to each other in times when the church was living under persecution. The only two people who could possibly verify it are McCain and the guard.
See wiki: Ichthys
good point, we don’t know what happened between McCain and any of his prison guards, but it’s his telling and re-telling of his experience and how it’s morphing into the mythical.
that is true…….
Cheat to win…bluff if they catch you….it’s the Republican way….
Maybe this “Faith Forum” was McCain’s jump the shark moment? Did he dupe Warren…or was Warren his collaborator? He sure didn’t give McCain the same lecture about using stump speech talking points as he gave Obama. Mr. Sunshine’s take was this was Warren’s effort to make McCain more palatable to the evangelicals.
Warren’s on Nightline tonight, Larry King also. Time to press their producers about getting some straight answers from Warren.
Prairie, warmin’ up for T. Boone comin’ to town this week….
Fresh Prairie: A Real Solution...or More Hot Air?
yah………. cause it never happened
Apparently McCain cheated during the Saddleback church event by not being in the “cone of silence” while Obama was being questioned: here
For NYSers and other who are interested, Gov.Paterson is up as Brian Lehrer’s guest on wnyc.org. Tlking about his first 6 months & the future.
There is a strange apologia of Obama over at the NYT by Michael Cohen comparing him to the older Frederick Douglass. I am not an expert on Douglass but it seems very ahistoric to me. As well as the FDR reference,
FDR was trying to ram the New Deal down the throats of the courts, Big Business, and the Republicans. The American people, not so much. And bite size morsels? Where does that come from? FDR taking an incrementalist approach to the Great Depression is a new one on me, but then so is the Frederick Douglass shtick. It all seems a way to explain away Obama being such a disappointment to progressives.
http://campaignstops.blogs.nyt.....index.html
right below the post is a way to get this out far and wide—
spotlight this post.
i am.
is easy.
I cannot understand why Obama is a disappointment to progressives. The alternative is McCain. We are doomed if McCain (or the Republic that repalces him) becomes President. “Progressives” that are disappointed in Obama live in a fantasy world.
There is an article in Politico (Highlighted from TPM) that the McSame campaign is protesting Andrea Mitchell’s comments
http://www.politico.com/news/s.....12594.html
Did MickeyMcSame plagarize?
OK. What the hell were these two candidates for the Presidency doing pandering to the religionists and what the hell has religion got to do with anything in public life. I am an atheist and will not be voting for either of these panderers. I do not want my president to be putting magic and fairies into substantive decisions.
McSame 2000
“Many years ago a scared American prisoner of war in Vietnam was tied in torture ropes by his tormentors and left alone in an empty room to suffer through the night. Later in the evening a guard he had never spoken to entered the room and silently loosened the ropes to relieve his suffering. Just before morning, that same guard came back and re-tightened the ropes before his less humanitarian comrades returned. He never said a word to the grateful prisoner, but some months later, on a Christmas morning, as the prisoner stood alone in the prison courtyard, the same good Samaritan walked up to him and stood next to him for a few moments. Then with his sandal, the guard drew a cross in the dirt. Both prisoner and guard both stood wordlessly there for a minute or two, venerating the cross, until the guard rubbed it out and walked away.”
A non-Christian candidate cannot be elected President.
Narative of the life of an American Slave by Frederick Douglass is one of my favorite writings. I doubt that Douglass would see Obama as coming from the same place as himself. I say no more.
I want to know why in bloody hell the VFW is allowing McCain yet another forum -
this was Cheney’s point guy in the Senate working AGAINST the New GI Bill - you know, the Bill they had pushed for 14 months prior to it’s eventual passage and didn’t even bother to show up and vote his oh so Mavericky conviction
in my “fantasy” world my disappointment in obama is strictly about obama and has nothing to do with mcsame.
it’s when i think about who to support (don’t we all have lots of experience supporting candidate who have disappointed us?) that mcsame figures in.
That is, without doubt and sadly, a truism. But just as a secular democracy can not be run, successfully, by a RNF neither can economic problems be solved by political decisions. Basically we are fucked.
I can’t believe Jane put a link in that took me to McVain’s own website! I avoid that like plague, for goodness sake! The least you could do is warn us, Jane. Other than that, great post.
P.S. For those that think old Andrea Mitchell is really a reporter, just keep remembering that she’s the one that swore everybody who was anybody knew that Valerie Plame was a CIA agent all along, no big secret, until she realized she was the only one making that claim and the authorities wanted to talk to her.
As usual, I believe Andrea put her finger in the wind or took a poll before she started standing up for Obama. She’s just an attention seeker for self-aggrandizement. Obviously she’s sees something in it for her or she’s taking orders from above her pay grade before she started outing McSame’s lameness.
It’s time to put disappointments on hold because the election is too close. We simply cannot afford any more years of Republics in power.
McSame is a Prisoner Of W.
good one, gonna remember that
.
btw, Spencer’s got a few words about Musharraf
Attackerman
Seriously we are not in a fantasy world. I will vote for Obama. I don’t believe I have an option on that one. But I think we are allowed to talk about our disappointment. We have been rip-raging over Bush policies and Dem compliance and accomodation from A-Z, and supporting candidates who are more progressive. Should we drop for instance, fair trade for free trade, because its all overheated campaign rhetoric, because the Obama campaign says so? Obama never represented progressives for me because he was thru and thru DLC. That doesn’t mean that I won’t vote for him. I don’t want “bomb, bomb” iran McSame.
BTW. National Geographic has a gorgeous pictorial on Iran. To think of McSame callously singing “bomb, bomb” Iran really raises my ire. Repukes are freaking barbarians.
Yes, here for example are some of Obama’s ”progressive” positions
Voted for the FISA Amendments Act
OK on SCOTUS overturning DC gun ban
Thinks women who want late term abortions for mental health reasons should tough it out
Against overturning death penalty for child rape
Belligerent on Iran
Backed unified Jerusalem as capital of Israel and then backed off his stand
Wanted to pull down walls in Berlin but said nothing about Israel’s or our own border fence.
Dennis Ross is his Middle East adviser
His healthcare plan is not universal or mandatory
He favors faith based initiatives
He voted for Petraeus and Odierno for CENTCOM commander and head of MNF-Iraq respectively
Cass Sunstein is one of his legal advisers
The left side of the blogosphere is supposed to be fact based. I do not think ”fantasy” means what you think it means. You seem to be implying that either Obama is a progressive which the list above shows is patently untrue or progressives are supposed to be content with Obama not because he is progressive but because he is not quite as bad as McCain. This last seems a bizarre claim. Are progressives supposed to be content with Mukasey because he is not quite as bad as Gonzales?
i am not saying you should do otherwise. but that is not my choice.
Yep to all of the above. Progressives are supposed to “fall in line” and do the “right” thing and vote for the least evil. The problem is that the least evil is still evil, still a corporate shill, still a lying SOB. This household has stopped “doing the right thing” and will not play the damn game any longer. Neither evil will get our votes.
It seems absurd to argue that McCain and Obama are just a little different. It’s like Nader saying Democrats and Republics are almost the same. The Bush years have shown the fallacy of that.
Let’s ask an honest question. Obama is a little wiggly on some stuff. What exactly is his policy on Iran? Should we be afraid for this gorgeous country with its ancient heritage and beautiful cultural traditions of poetry etc. etc.?
Ah but. Here comes the mantra. This is no snark.
Go ahead and laugh at me Selise, I can take it.
Surely more than “almost the same”. The “Democrats” have been folding to the wishes of corporate America just as much as the Goops. If in doubt just look at the votes on FISA. And now the oil drilling fiasco. And let us not forget NAFTA.
thank you for that link.
related - obama on iran (from his website):
i’ve picked out some of the worst of his statements (not representative ones). not at bad as bomb, bomb, bomb iran… but not what i would call good either. :(
Thanks and I think everyone should see that pictorial and then think of what McSame is suggesting.
not going to laugh. that was one the big reasons i supported kerry in 2004. but the times are different - most notably there is now a majority of dems in congress.
The war. The Supreme Court. Tax cuts for the wealthy.
How would these be the same if Democrats were in power?
Hugh, I too am dissatisfied with imperfect Obama ever since the FISA vote. In fact, disappointed might not be a strong enough word. However, before we get distracted, I would like to see your list for all of the major candidates: McSame, Barr and Nader. I’d be willing to bet that Nader would be the winner for most of us here if we strictly went by who is on the same side we are in virtually every situation. For that matter, Kucinich has yet to state a position I find as obnoxious as some of Obama’s. OTOH, neither of those candidates has any chance of winning, so it comes down to either McIdiot or Obama. Ergo, I am going to have to vote for the smart guy who will at least come close to some of major issues and who I think will do less harm to this country. I don’t have to like the medicine, but I’m certainly going to have to take it.
Badwater, do you have any progressive positions that Obama supports? Yes, he is against the Iraq war, but he never led or mounted any opposition to it in the Senate, and under his plan the main US forces will not be out until mid 2010 and an indeterminate number of residual forces will be left there.
congress. the democrats are in power. have been for more than a year and a half.
The only “Cone of Silence” involving McCain is the media’s palpable unwillingness to press him very hard, or for very long, on the dodgier bits of his CV and life history.
To be honest, it’s by the thinnest of margins, particularly in the Senate. And too many of them are DINO Bush Doggers in dire need of primary challenges.
Democrats could have filibustered all three of these even when they were in the minority. They could have stopped any of these even more easily since they won the 2006 elections. They didn’t. They haven’t.
And they tend to cave in on those nominations and FISA, eh?
So, will you be satisfied if McCain gains office? I think that will be a historic disaster so, I care not about Obama’s supposed progressive foibles.
That’s true and means that the Democrats need new leadership. But that’s no reason to return Republics to power.
My view is that a political candidate has to earn my vote. Neither candidate has given me any reason to vote for them so I will vote for neither of them.
Badwater, Who said anything about turning to Repukes to power?
We really should have Naomi Kleined them all during the primary.
you are VERY wise indeed
My language for same thing: I have never voted for a prez, only voted against the other candidate. This time I can’t even do that.
it is sad that if McGiggolo wins it will Dems who let it happen…and i shall leave the country
Thanks Jane–I spotlighted it all over the place, well do more later….hit abd-anything but content, and cnn addresses hard…some assorted others.
Wish Spotlight handled more than 10 at a time.*g*
Sampl.e letter–I changed it around according to whom it was sent.
Made sure Larry King and Colmes and Dobbs got a copy. Had already sent it off early this morning to Diane Rehm and a few (ha) others after reading the early post about it..
====
Why is this not on my tv right now? It deserves as much coverage as Hillary’s being ’shot at’ in Bosnia, if not more.
McCain was caught plagiarizing his Georgia remarks from wiki last week, and now this.
But this time, he speaks of it as his own personal experience, this is different. Much more egregious than plagiarizing recipes or foreign policy remarks.
I would think someone would be ‘all over this’, considering it was said this time in a church and to a pastor. Straight-faced.A much bigger issue than whether he heard Obama’s first half-hour of the forum.
Sincerely,
D——-
—- Ohio
the thinnest of margins is all that is needed to give control of the committees to the dems (except of course for the senate homeland security). and a majority is not needed to block legislation.
the dems could have done a lot with their slim majority - they chose not to and it wasn’t because they didn’t have the numbers.
that said, i expect that the dem majority will be increased this year.
and if ya dont think things could get MUCH worse…se “Great Depression”
your wunnerful,ya know!
good point.
still, obama has played a major bait and switch. don’t see how we could have prevented that. :(
We’re probably not yet in another Great Depression thanks to the reforms of FDR…the ones that the Republics still want to eliminate.
signing statements and executive powers have made that all moot
I think it goes to how distorted our political process has become that there is a presumption that I have a responsibility to support Obama, or that I will somehow be responsible for his defeat, even though he has not bothered to give me any affirmative reason to support him. If Obama loses, it will be his fault, not mine.
i believe that is what the future holds for America
Iran v. McSame
Comments?
i’m going to register a protest vote. looking beyond this election, i’d like show that i do vote but that my vote must be earned. don’t know, but was thinking that if enough people did that, it might make a slight difference in 2012.
oh yes………..because…Repukes will hold their nose ,rally round that fraud,and fight to the death for him…just as they offer up their progeny for the booosh/cheney wars
We were forewarned in so many ways. Debates for instance.
don’t think it was the signing statements. i think it was when pelosi took impeachment off the table.
i was thinking today about the Chinese thing about ancestors,it begins to make sense to me ,in this world of Nepotism
so lets dump her,she has failed miserably
I am not sure I follow you.
thanks, i love it when mccain chokes on his own bad air…
then has to choke on his own spit trying to fix it.
i keep waiting for the ‘real mccain’ to be exposed, and bit by bit he’s doing it, we just have to make sure it gets around the neighborhood.
people mobilize and shout from the rooftops when a child molester moves into their neighborhood, this man is just as evil….i mean it.
use spotlight–it’s easy, all kinds of contacts on there–i don’t have time today to do them all, but i will pick out a few 100 more ….ten at a time, that’s 10 times—-copy and paste your letter if you want to make it easier…i change i t a litlle according to whom it is being sent.
Chinese believe…orphans are basically f***ked,with bad Karma for life,because they have no ancestors to pray for them etc…animals that are orphaned too have a bad prognosis mostly…so wars create MANY orphans and the damn cycle never stops!!! just mho
I don’t think they tend to cave in; I think they dive in wholeheartedly. They’re the next best thing to Rethugs. I just wonder about the breakdown. Wiki indicates that 45.6% of the Dem party is progressive, and that is the single largest category. Another 21.2% is considered disadvantaged (I gather, financially) and the remaining 33.2% are considered conservatives. Here’s what Wiki says about the conservatives:
As near as I can tell, the “disadvantaged” group includes most of the Independents who vote for our socially progressive stuff but are not so doctrinaire they can be counted on always. Wish I could figure out why conservatives would consider themselves Dems, but they really put a chink in the armor of majority votes in Congress.
the more i get to know him ,the more i detest him
Let’s look at this ‘conundrum’ of the lesser weevil from another perspective.
Suppose, just suppose, that the d’s blow this election because they insist upon being republic lite. This election is the d’s to throw away. They appear to be doing so, and that does not include the ‘racial’ factor at all.
The d’s resistance to the r’s plundering and attempted destruction of ‘everything’ has been weak, pathetic and self-serving for the political class, as a whole. Unless I’ve been trapped in an alternative universe and missed real, actual d ‘push-back’ or ‘leadership’, it is reasonable to ask just what ‘important’ legislation the d’s have substituted for actually being the OPPOSITION party, for taking impeachment off the table?
If the d’s totally blow this election, then what reward do they truly deserve?
We are allowing our own mythologies to destroy us.
Two parties? Or one looooong party, with the r’s in the lead and the d’s bringing up ass-end?
Right now, Mc$ame appears (based on numerous conversations with a variety of people, engaged in over the past several weeks) to be perceived as regular ‘folks’ while Obama, fittingly, in this anti-intellectual nation of ours, is being increasingly seen as Adlai Stevenson revisited.
And has he got that reputation by sharing compelling, human-scale visions of a better, more humane and reasonable future? No, he has got it by appearing distant from his ‘progressive’ supporter’s sensibilities and debating the number of angels who can dance on top of certain ‘Christian’ pin-heads.
So?
Things would hopefully be a tad bit (teeny-weeny-little tiny ‘bit’) better were Obama to win.
By this point we should all be CERTAIN that things would be very much better, but, and let me put this straight at you, are we even remotely certain of anything?
We have volitile personalities at the helm and every day we wonder what new collossal stupidity will astound us, mortify us and perhaps herald the ‘End Times’ so widely (apparently) hoped for among the ‘certain’.
Obama had best realize what he faces or he’ll just be another pretty face, flashing by in the rear-view mirror.
I think the belief systems intertwined with Confucianism, Taoism and Buddhism can be complex. Add in variants of those beliefs. Add in that those who go to some place other heaven can still look after their kin in this belief, and there is a sort of privacy in these small homages to the ancestors, I am having a hard time connecting this directly with nepotism.
Nicely put.
I felt the same way, more or less, in another election many years ago. I had every intention of voting for McGovern until his first decision, who to choose as a running mate, crashed and burned. I figured if he couldn’t even make this one important decision, if he couldn’t even vet this VP selection properly, he wasn’t prepared to lead the nation. Of course, I could not in good conscience vote for Nixon, either, so I voted for neither. Well, the moral to the story is Nixon won and the rest is history. Anyone who thinks this country didn’t pay a high price for the Nixon scandal is either too young to remember or somehow out of their minds. We were years getting over that doomed administration and the attendant corruption at the highest levels.
I’m pretty sure we’ll be years getting over the Bush administration also, but I think Obama has a better chance at helping us through the transition than McSame on every level. He may not be excellent, put he’ll be at least 80%. McSame will fail utterly and miserably…less than 55%. I have no choice.
The edits are an interesting read.
Ah, but even in time of war, exile etc., an ancestor can theoretically still look after the kinsman or kinswoman. I know someone who fled a country and years later, her mother still in the home country, told her she divined that the great grandfather was looking after the person who fled.
well…those with well connected well healed families,make out extremely well in a society that is Nepotilistic