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	<title>Comments on: Energy Stupid Vs. Energy Smart: It&#8217;s About What People Do</title>
	<atom:link href="http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/</link>
	<description>Firedoglake weblog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 06:17:06 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: nahant</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572991</link>
		<dc:creator>nahant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:54:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572991</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;We were lucky to get in on a program from SolarCity.com that allowed us to sign up for a Solar system with nothing down and a guarantee that it will provide the amount of power it is designed for…11K&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We were lucky to get in on a program from SolarCity.com that allowed us to sign up for a Solar system with nothing down and a guarantee that it will provide the amount of power it is designed for…11K</p>
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		<title>By: Scarecrow</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572986</link>
		<dc:creator>Scarecrow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:48:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572986</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The metering you’re describing is a huge improvement over what most have now.  The California Energy Commission adopted conservation standards for new residential buildings that will require every new home to have that metering.    The guy most responsible is Commissioner Art Rosenfeld, who retires this year — he’s an energy hero, along with his staff guy, John Wilson, and the conservation staff at the CEC.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The metering you’re describing is a huge improvement over what most have now.  The California Energy Commission adopted conservation standards for new residential buildings that will require every new home to have that metering.    The guy most responsible is Commissioner Art Rosenfeld, who retires this year — he’s an energy hero, along with his staff guy, John Wilson, and the conservation staff at the CEC.</p>
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		<title>By: nahant</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572983</link>
		<dc:creator>nahant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:45:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572983</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I am In California and I will have a meter that goes both directions and here they give you credit for any excess power you generate at least thats what I have been told…&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am In California and I will have a meter that goes both directions and here they give you credit for any excess power you generate at least thats what I have been told…</p>
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		<title>By: Scarecrow</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572973</link>
		<dc:creator>Scarecrow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:41:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572973</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;1. Any electricity your system generates means that much less electricity you have to purchase; it lowers your bill.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2.  If you have two-way net metering (a few states), when you generate more than you’re using, the energy flows back through the meter out into the distribution system and transmission system.  If the retail rate is set up properly (almost nowhere), you should be paid for net electricity you produce with the price set at the marginal cost of producing energy in your area.  That’s possible but likely not set up in most regions of the US.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;3.  In some states, you get a tax rebate or credit against the purchase/installation cost of the solar equipment.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;These rules vary in every state.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1. Any electricity your system generates means that much less electricity you have to purchase; it lowers your bill.</p>
<p>2.  If you have two-way net metering (a few states), when you generate more than you’re using, the energy flows back through the meter out into the distribution system and transmission system.  If the retail rate is set up properly (almost nowhere), you should be paid for net electricity you produce with the price set at the marginal cost of producing energy in your area.  That’s possible but likely not set up in most regions of the US.</p>
<p>3.  In some states, you get a tax rebate or credit against the purchase/installation cost of the solar equipment.  </p>
<p>These rules vary in every state.</p>
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		<title>By: nahant</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572959</link>
		<dc:creator>nahant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:33:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572959</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Does installing a solar Electric system as conservation or just me lowering my bill?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does installing a solar Electric system as conservation or just me lowering my bill?</p>
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		<title>By: Scarecrow</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572958</link>
		<dc:creator>Scarecrow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572958</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;In traditional ratemaking, utilities earn money by building things: plants, transmission lines, pipe lines, etc have capital costs that go into rate base that earn a profit — a rate of return.  Their operating costs, such as fuel and purchased power are essentially passed through without profit, though there are states with performance incentives if the utilities is smart in buying low, it gets to keep some of the “savings” for its profits.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So if consumers use less electricity or natural gas, that just means the utility doesn’t have as much fuel costs to pass through, and they have no incentive to encourage conservation.  In fact, if conservation reduces the demand for new plants, they lose the opportunity build more and put the capital costs into rate base, on which they earn a regulated rate of return, usually 8-10 percent.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So in the 1980s, NRDC, the Californian Energy Commission and others promoted rate reforms that would allow the utilities to “profit” from the investments in energy efficiency and conservation, and once we made it worth their whiles, the utilities in California put in over a billion dollars into conservation investments. It was very successful for a while.  When the market restructuring came along in the mid 1990s, it undermined the rationale for that set of reforms.  I left about then, but I think the mechanisms are no longer there.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In traditional ratemaking, utilities earn money by building things: plants, transmission lines, pipe lines, etc have capital costs that go into rate base that earn a profit — a rate of return.  Their operating costs, such as fuel and purchased power are essentially passed through without profit, though there are states with performance incentives if the utilities is smart in buying low, it gets to keep some of the “savings” for its profits.  </p>
<p>So if consumers use less electricity or natural gas, that just means the utility doesn’t have as much fuel costs to pass through, and they have no incentive to encourage conservation.  In fact, if conservation reduces the demand for new plants, they lose the opportunity build more and put the capital costs into rate base, on which they earn a regulated rate of return, usually 8-10 percent.  </p>
<p>So in the 1980s, NRDC, the Californian Energy Commission and others promoted rate reforms that would allow the utilities to “profit” from the investments in energy efficiency and conservation, and once we made it worth their whiles, the utilities in California put in over a billion dollars into conservation investments. It was very successful for a while.  When the market restructuring came along in the mid 1990s, it undermined the rationale for that set of reforms.  I left about then, but I think the mechanisms are no longer there.</p>
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		<title>By: RieszFischer</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572957</link>
		<dc:creator>RieszFischer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572957</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well, I’m glad we have a thread going on a substantive topic for once. This energy stuff is boring. We really need to be talking about Edwards’ affair.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I’m glad we have a thread going on a substantive topic for once. This energy stuff is boring. We really need to be talking about Edwards’ affair.</p>
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		<title>By: RieszFischer</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572954</link>
		<dc:creator>RieszFischer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:29:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572954</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;At least this is something people have some control over– turn your thermostat down in winter and up in the summer– especially when you are away from the house.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I can’t understand why there is so little talk about how to conserve energy.  I hear a lot of bullshit that if you turn your heat down it will only waste more energy.  Talk about stupid!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At least this is something people have some control over– turn your thermostat down in winter and up in the summer– especially when you are away from the house.</p>
<p>I can’t understand why there is so little talk about how to conserve energy.  I hear a lot of bullshit that if you turn your heat down it will only waste more energy.  Talk about stupid!</p>
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		<title>By: CTuttle</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572953</link>
		<dc:creator>CTuttle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:28:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572953</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Aloha, Wobbs!  Are ya back from Brasilia?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aloha, Wobbs!  Are ya back from Brasilia?</p>
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		<title>By: dakine01</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572951</link>
		<dc:creator>dakine01</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:27:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/the-energy-debate-is-about-what-we-the-people-do/#comment-1572951</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/who-did-john-edwards-really-cheat-on/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Swopa upstairs&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://firedoglake.com/2008/08/08/who-did-john-edwards-really-cheat-on/" rel="nofollow">Swopa upstairs</a></p>
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