Lieutenant General Gary North, the commander of US air forces in the Middle East, is really pleased with his newest weapons system:
"We can put unmanned aircraft — Predator, Reaper, and other assets — overhead for long endurance periods. We call that persistent stare.
"And with the Reaper, armed with Hellfire and 500-pound precision weapons, we’ll be able to have a deadly stare if needed," he said.
The Reaper was deployed in Iraq for the first time July 17 from Balad Air Base, and has been flying in Afghanistan since September.
The Reaper is also known as a a “persistent hunter-killer against emerging targets to achieve joint force commander objectives"… and it’s deadlier than those manned flights!
The Reaper can fly faster, higher, farther and carry more weapons than its predecessor, the MQ-1 Predator.
Unlike the Predator, which can carry two laser guided Hellfire missiles, the Reaper carries four Hellfires and two 500-pound GBU-12 laser guided bombers, North said.
"It is very, very effective," he said.
You don’t even need boots on the ground to kill Iraqis:
The Reaper, which are flown by a two person crew thousands of miles away at Creech Air Force Base in Nevada, reportedly can stay aloft up to 24 hours at a time, sending back surveillance and reconnaissance data.
And they’re more fuel efficient – one might even say this is a new Green weapon system:
Keeping the average 90 flights of fighters and bombers over Iraq on a given day means flying another 64 sorties by air refueling aircraft.
And in an age of skyrocketing fuel prices, that cost money.
"The thing about unmanned aerial vehicles is they can stay overhead for a long time, and not use a lot of gas," North said.
And if you thought the talk of timetables and possible withdrawals might mean fewer air strikes on Iraqis, think again:
North said as the scale of the conflict is reduced he was be able to use "more and more of these (drones), and reduce the manned fighters and bombers overhead."
I wonder what the SOFA or MOU – which Bush did not manage to get by his deadline of July 31 – says about “persistent hunter-killer” drones flown from bunkers in Nevada?
Tom Englehardt raised the same issue in another context back in March in his must read post, Philip K. Dick Meet George W. Bush :
Nonetheless, it’s a fact that the "right" to missile, bomb, shell, "decapitate," or assassinate those we declare to be our enemies, without regard to borders or sovereignty, is based on nothing more than the power to do it. This is simply the "right" of force (and of technology). If the tables were turned, any American would recognize such acts for the barbarism they represent.
And Ramesh Thakur, Distinguished Fellow at the Centre for International Governance Innovation and Professor of Political Science at the University of Waterloo, reminds us in a discussion of the lack of statistics for Iraqi civilian casualties and the first Lancet study:
For the 18-month period after the war, a U.S. medical team calculated the civilian casualty based on a scientific household survey and came up with the stunning figure of 98,000 deaths, without counting Fallujah (because it had been the scene of the fiercest and most prolonged fighting, Fallujah was categorised as an outlier). Moreover, 84 per cent of the casualties were attributable to coalition air strikes, not rebels, and women and children made up more than half the total killed.
Thakur concludes:
The still sadder fact is that neither the Iraqi government nor the coalition forces have deemed Iraqi lives lost worthy enough to be counted accurately. Dignity in death is clearly not a human right for Iraqis. And no one will be called to account in national or international criminal justice forums.
Let’s hope we can prove him wrong.
———–
Updating earlier news: Ambassador Crocker has sent a representative to apologize to the “Governor of Saladdeen Hamad al-Qaisi for the killing of his son by U.S. troops.”
Azzamzan notes: “Analysts say the apology to Saladdeen’s governor only came when Qaisi and his powerful tribe warned that they would avenge the killing of Husam.”
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Does it still mean that the surge is very successful if all the killing is done from the air? What a depressing Sunday night we’ve got here. January is still months away. The Bush-Dick talent and addiction for harm are unending.
Unmanned bombers should in and of themselves be a war crime.
I think they are being used far more than this article suggests in Afhanistan and Pakistan in particular.
We are foreigners. Our apology is meaningless.
Can a Stinger take one of these suckers out, I wonder?
Hi, Siun. An excellent post, as usual. Phillip K Dick – awesome writer.
ES: They are a favourite war toy. The Israelis have also developed a fondness for unmanned drones to do their killing.
killing done from the air…
no, killing from the air is success post surge
it is technology, so fine when it works, and technology not so fine when it doesn’t work (mostly women and children killed)
this administration first approved torture: then outsourced torture; and now turns warfare over to modern technology… very surgical, becoming more and more sterile and analytical…
America becomes less and less humane or human
I grieve for the America I grew up in.
Evening all …
Aswat Al Iraq is reporting a “surge” of civilian casualties (death, woundings, kidnappings, and more) in the month of July. Their site was down before but I will send a link when available.
Not sure that I agree with that, but unmanned aircraft introduce the obviously dangerous element of military personnel who face no danger personally being able to inflict damage and death on others. Whether the targets are military or civilian, this situation has a potential for abuse.
It may be even worse when other nations have this ability, as well. Civilians could be completely at the mercy of the militaries.
“less humane or human” – very important point
Cujo – read the Englehardt piece, it’s very valuable for looking at this issue.
I grieve with you…surely if there are enough of us, we can begin to make a difference. I heard a terrible report this am about Zoriah, I think is the name, who took “forbidden” pictures and who has been outed from embed and finished as war photographer. Pictures so forbidden, in part, because they are so horrendous and graphic about the carnage. Who have we become?
How long can it be between this and unmanned remote-operated tanks?
Zoriah is an amazing photographer … make sure you visit his site:
http://www.zoriah.net/
There’s a chance we’ll host a chat with him once he gets a break.
Thanks. The story was on our PBS station; more of the lies and horror and secrecy.
So the new military target for the insurgents is now an airbase in Nevada?? Won’t Harry be happy…
Just more money in the pocket of the Chinese….
I dugg Siun’s post, though it doesn’t show up top. You can digg it here.
Aloha, Siun!
Oh yeah! With a Stinger, if it flies, it dies…!
Nice to see we’re finally getting a return on our trillion dollar investment… and GREEN weapons at that. Isn’t life (and death) grand?
Of course, eventually terrorists will have remote-controlled flying bombs too, then we can all sit at home and kill each other without having to get up from our comfy chairs. Sweeet.
Siun ,
Thanks for keeping the ongoing killing being discussed. You just have to be devoid of any humanity to engage in this. After using our wonderous atomic weapons it seems anything goes cluster bombs, daisy cutter at 20,000 # the largest conventional ( funny how we accept them as conventional,isn’t it?) bomb ever dropped. Puff the magic dragon a computerized gun platform that covers the area of a football field and on and on . Did I mention Depleted uranium? Imagine all that effort and research put into the battle on cancer or renewable energy? And to a war monger they don’t compute the loss of the road not taken.
nodding … as I was looking at the week’s news (and there is so much going on related to Iraq and Afghanistan right now) this just jumped out as so emblematic
Even with this terrible type of weapon we are not really getting “better” at war. We are losing in Iraq, we are losing in Afghanistan and we just don’t stop. Israel got beaten badly in Lebanon although they had far superior weapons. We need to learn that with all our fancy toys we still lose.
Kirkuk is really getting ugly this past week…! 8-(
Kirkuk is a disaster and about to become a bigger one …
I know there is no humor here…but I find myself wondering if Sr. Bush has mentioned to W that we are in “deep do-do”, as he likes to say. Yeah, then there is no one home who cares or pays attention.
I meant to add that I don’t know the definition of “winning” and “losing” in this instance.
I couldn’t believe the Kurds had the audacity to try and annex Kirkuk to Kurdistan… The Turks called Maliki right off and put the kibosh on that nonsense…
I’ve been surprised at how long it’s taking for Kirkuk to turn into a fireball. Do you have a good (English) news source?
IIRC the Kurds have been trying to annex Kirkuk one way or another for quite some time. They’ve been trying to force Arabs out for the last couple of years. They definitely want control of the oil fields in the area, otherwise they’ll have no oil revenue. I think you and Siun are correct, this is gonna get really ugly.
It’s not kiboshed yet … keep an eye on it. Good sources? just the usual at the moment.
I meant to add that I don’t know the definition of “winning” and “losing” in this instance.
McCain doesn’t know either but as soon as we win the troops can come home.
Turkey has all those troops they mobilized on the border still – and more to come. I hear that this time, they will not back down if Kirkuk does not stabilize.
It would be really nice if they’d kill a lot fewer civilians.
Can’t these expensive drones with their tv cameras show them who they’re actually shooting at? Or do they just figure any group of people they see are insurgents or terrorists or whatever the latest word for ‘enemy’ is?
this type of weapons system is ill suited for anything but a full on declared war with a readily identifiable enemy. The remote operator has a very limited visual experience, and cannot differentiate between between tagets unlees they are obviously uniformed or are a tank or other plain military target.
For an operator to launch a Hellfire missle on a Toyota pickup ten thousand miles away in Mosul for example, would or should be a war crime.
Here’s a pretty good one, eCAHN, Uruk.net…
A few observations from a civilian employee of the Air Force for over 20 years:
1. I wish the generals would stop coming up with these childish phases – e.g., “persistent stare”, etc.
2. Generally speaking, the Air Force has what I would call an internalized “warrior deficiency syndrome”. It seems they are overly concerned with proving their manhood (no women need apply). This was really exacerbated when Gen Tony McPeak was Chief of Staff in the early 1990s. His motto was “just strap an F-15 on my ass and get out of the way”. The non-flying part of the Air Force headed for the exits in a big way during his tour as Chief. BTW, he is one of Obama’s senior military advisers!!
3. The Air Force has always been ambivalent about “killing from a distance”. I remember many discussions at Air War College (during the Vietnam era) on this point. Some of the pilots had no concern about “taking out another hooch” while others were very conflicted.
4. The Air Force and the Army have an ongoing “roles and missions” contest going on about which service will be in charge of the unmanned vehicles programs. With the current screw ups that the Air Force has had on senior leadership, acquisition, loss of space program management (which went to OSD), Air Force leadership is very afraid they might lose the unmanned vehicle management.
5. Another reason the Air Force is afraid of losing the unmanned program to the Army is their concern over the unmanned versus manned mission. The F-22 is a great plane but the cost of it is exorbitant. If they have the unmanned under their control, there is less chance of attack on the F-22 from another service that controls the unmanned program.
Enough for now. I am proud of my service for the Air Force and am saddened by some of the things I see happening now.
Thanks. I bookmarked it & will check it out when I am less tired.
WWI Redux. Without an al-Aurens.
McClatchy covered Kirkuk today.. from the news box.
Battle over oil-rich city threatens to derail Iraqi election
When there’s no human penalty to be paid by using technology as our proxy, we lose our humanity in war. When the results of our actions become no different than a video game, we lose our humanity. This is not progress. It’s a major step backward.
AF has been nuts from the getgo. Cause they can’t see the damage they cause, they’re always hot to bomb the shit out of everything. Creates a kind of mentality that leads to fundies taking over AF academy, not to mention other atrocities of a far worse sort.
When there’s no human price to be paid for us to commit war without end….what’s to keep us from committing perpetual war?
we’re likely there already… what need have we for a tank (surface vehicle) when the drones fly above the surface of the land? the need for a tank is only to armor the crew within… possibly reconnisaince at ground level to verify overhead recon, but likely no advantage beyond drones
overhead drones are a dime a dozen compared to costs for tanks… but I’m no expert
That reporter omitted the other major group that claim Kirkuk as it’s historic capital… The Turkomens…!
OT
Is anyone successful using web enabled cell phones to read FDL?
Lordy, people in Nevada dropping bombs in Iraq. Who would have ever thunk? Imagine if the Iraqis were dropping bombs in America from Fallujah. How many days until the election?
Here’s a story that I haven’t seen in these wars. War always brings drug use and prostitution of subject women. In Afghanistan it is impossible that most coalition troops aren’t heroin addicts, yet I haven’t seen a single story on the subject. And is it possible that in neither country thousands of women haven’t turned to prostitution to keep body & soul together? Yet another story I haven’t read.
IMO if we can get rid of the myth that U.S. soldiers are the best ever (our heroes /snark), we can perhaps make some progress against the war.
This is what comes of violent video games.
Using the old “You are with us or you are with them,” mentality, maybe the military command could arrange to have all the screened Iraqis embedded with a microchip. They could use this microchip much like the surface to air missle systems utilize IFF (identification friend or foe.) The Predator simply queries the target and decides whether it is friendly or not. This would be much more efficient than the old German style of tattooing the arm. (snark)
Indeed they did.
You don’t read about American soldiers coming home with Iraqi or Afghani brides either as has been common in other wars.
the wonders of modern technology…I
couldn’t believe the Kurds had the audacity to try and annex Kirkuk to Kurdistan… The Turks called Maliki right off and put the kibosh on that nonsense…
a telephone call? link???
Interesting. Perhaps U.S. male soldiers are getting their rocks off by raping female soldiers. One reads the occassional story about that.
Aah, later on in the article…! ;-)
FF, appreciate your words here
“some of the things I see happening now.”
Here’s a link…
I think it is more that occasional:
http://www.military.com/featur…..77,00.html
the Air Force is a group of individuals
I don’t agree with your statements that there is one attitude in what I see as a group
The raw opium is shipped out of country to be processed into heroin. Smoking opium gives a heavier buzz than smoking heroin, more incapacitating. Just as addicting. The Afghanis also grow weed which they turn into hashish. Afghani finger hash laced with opium was quite the rage in the 70’s.
There is no doubt about the “group” characteristics of the AF. Evidence is everywhere to be found. AF academy. Only service hot to trot on Iran. Etc. Etc. Not saying every AF member is a nutcase, only that’s the way the institution behaves.
not to be picking on you, eCAHN, but here at 47 I also beg to disagree with you lumping numbers together…
“War always brings “
not to be picking on you as you seem to admire statistics, but can you sometimes look to the humans who one by one may or may not add up to the statistics you assume can be lumped together….
Um, just looking for historic regularities as a guide to identifying problems, and when used responsibly, avoiding them. Sorry if you take umbrage.
Time to retire. Good night all.
link, my, oh my,
have Obama’s and McCain’s recent statements precipitated decision making on the part of the Turks and Kurds as well as Maliki et al???
are we previewing unintended consequences?
Nite, eCAHN.
Namaste
Afraid you have gone past my Masters degree education with that comment. You have lost me.
I would say that generalities about groups need to be tightly conscripted less they lose their value.
Evening, all-
In my experience, I have never encountered an organization that promotes groupthink like the USAF. My old shift commander was fond of saying “We push the button, and make it to happy hour by 4 o’clock” and so forth. Nails that stick up get pounded down, and there is NO tolerance for people who ask “why?”. In so far as possible, the institutional mentality IS the mentality of the individuals, as contrary personalities are weeded out.
War is dehumanizing no matter how it is fought, hand to hand or by remote-controlled proxy. I am reminded of a quote by Curtis LeMay, when asked if the U.S. firebombing of Japan in WWII was immoral.
Killing Japanese didn’t bother me very much at that time… I suppose if I had lost the war, I would have been tried as a war criminal…. Every soldier thinks something of the moral aspects of what he is doing. But all war is immoral and if you let that bother you, you’re not a good soldier.
umbrage… casting shadows, no
hoping to open observations, rather than closing possibilities.
Thanks for responding.
Aloha, eCAHN!
Ever get the feeling we (USA) are on the wrong side of history?
We are the primary anti-human force on the planet.
Damn, wish I could read Arabic. Link to al-Maliki’s statement on the roadstoiraq site returns “Unable to Connect.”
RonD…
i’d like to argue with you, but as i divorced out, that’s almost the same as weeded out, so you are probably right… and i’m glad i’m out but I’m one who has always asked WHY and I have started asking Why Not???
so I’ll likely be labeled a troll from time to time, but maybe we can get folks to think!
Here’s what Aswat Aliraq had published from the GZG… I’d give the link , but, the site is still down…
Oh, I saw that at M & C. Thanks. Always nice to be able to read all the references.
” the primary anti-human force on the planet”
umm have you seen pictures of the Chinese with eyes watering and wearing nose masks in the Bejing roadways …and these folks sterilize married couples after one live birth…
please tell us how you define anti-human force, and we’ll continue the discussion, and maybe visit other continents….
I would say that humans are the primary anti-human force on the planet. As a “superpower” one can probably make the case that the U.S. has been leading the anti-human charge but if we drop that baton, somebody else will certainly pick it up.
Heh, I was about to mention that I’d posted on Kirkuk yesterday! ;-)
Time to leap into the arms of Morpheus.
Be good to yourselves, and all other living things.
Namaste
Siun, have you heard from Du since the ‘horde’ has returned…? 8-)
Aloha, SD!
I was attached to SAC, and believe me, they screen you constantly. We would go on alert, and they would run exercises without telling you they were not real…and you would be closely observed. People who questioned the orders, or hesitated to launch, would be reassigned and/or disciplined immediately. People who think Air Force personnel would refuse to follow orders to launch on Iran or anyone else are not being realistic.
I hear he’s doing fine. It’s good he got some time with the horde!
‘night, Southern Dragon, from the other side of the bay.
That’s why I didn’t put the two together until I went back and peeped the excerpts. Wish I could get hold of the microbe from Farscape that enables one to understand or read any language about 20 minutes after injection. *g*
Colour me gone.
teddy is upstairs
Nite, RonD
One thing that tripped me out with the USAF was that when ya’ll had ‘exercises’ you’d all wrap out at 4 or 5 pm and then start up the next morn at 7 or 8 am… In the Army, when we’d do manuevers it was 24/7 until it was over…! 8-P
Any failure to comply could only occur higher on the command chain, i.e. some general might retire a little earlier than intended. It wouldn’t stop the order from being implemented.
We got better food than you guys, too….:)
Rachel Maddow says Iraq news on networks is about 2 minutes per week now.
Myopic bombing drops. How “cheap” non-American lives are regarded by our government, our media, our populace? How myopic the majority of this country is.
‘
I disagree ratfood. Yes, war is horrible, no question. But when only one side experiences the pain and devastation of war, this is transforming. As bad as WW2 was, both sides learned, intimately, the horror and folly of war. Now that we have a technological advantage to wage a war that has no human price to be paid on our side, our perspective and thinking about the humanity of waging war changes….and not for the better. We reduce our ‘enemy’ to cartoon characters on the screen…the ‘game’ can be played over and over with no consequences to be paid by us.
I keep thinking of narcissistic little boys with their Pentagon toys and the lives in jeopardy are just little toy people. Empathy never got conditioned and cultivated. Patriarchal mindset … power and control and competition and not partnership paradigm of win/win. When all you have is a hammer… everything becomes a “nail.”
I agree it is a disturbing trend, although I don’t think a point will ever be reached where the human loss and devastation of war will be completely one-sided. If nothing else, enemies will be made and they will strike back sooner or later.
Having said that, as a nation we have already reached an alarming stage of emotional detachment. I refer to the relative complacency of those without friends or family serving in Iraq or Afghanistan. Sure most people are unhappy that we’re still in Iraq but not enough to demand an end to the occupation. Even worse, to date the presidential candidate who says we won’t leave until we win but can’t define victory is polling (roughly) even with the candidate who says he’ll get us out.
over and out (for tonight)
rf
That bothers me, too.
To the guys who are participating in this, this is just another version of some online MMPOG, Battle Dawn, Gindis Army Commander, WOW, you name it.
They can’t envision that they are causing great human suffering or that maybe they are wrong. So removed and amoral.
Does this mean the work of the Airforce can be outsourced to Halliburton or Blackwater seeing as it doesn’t require actual pilots? Provides some cover as contractors aren’t actually responsible for any ‘accidental’ deaths if the wrong target were bombed.
Wait a minute. I’ve got a son in Kirkuk. What’s happening there?
Very late here & haven’t read comments, since sick kitty needs my attn soon.
But, that reaperthingie. It isn’t shaped like a boomerang by any chance, is it?
It’s impossible to keep up with the curses booshcheeney have loosed on the world. May they have many many sleepless nights into eternity.
i keep seeing a steady parade of incidents reported in the news, briefly of course (damitall!), about families, kids, wedding parties, ordinary busses carrying innocent civilians, houses with sweet innocents who thought they could escape the mayhem by moving away from their former home… bom*ed to smithereens by these dreadful weapons.
you say the high poohbah in charge is pleased.
i think he’s rotting from inside out.
he’s just too intentionally numbed to feel any responsibility.
that’s what standing back and playing with dangerous toys can do.
it removes identity, and the soul as well.
dr. strangeluv, meet so-&-so, yer spawn.