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	<title>Comments on: Surprise!  Fannie and Freddie Bailout!</title>
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		<title>By: DrDave</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540942</link>
		<dc:creator>DrDave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:24:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540942</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Turkey little:&lt;br /&gt;
The sky is not falling, more study is needed; if it falls we will buy a new one for our rich friends who paid for our liberry–the one with no books.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Turkey little:<br />
The sky is not falling, more study is needed; if it falls we will buy a new one for our rich friends who paid for our liberry–the one with no books.</p>
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		<title>By: cinnamonape</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540647</link>
		<dc:creator>cinnamonape</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 08:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540647</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Ian, I think you’ve identified a new area of speculative commodities when you point out that Gross, and others, explicitly invested in a sector that looked as if it might go bankrupt. They are in fact intentionally hoping that the firms DO! Then they can hold up to the Federal government the essential need to maintain the industry. It’s a type of corporate black mail…it should have a “name”…and the players in these markets should be identified!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Even worse, they specifically benefit from making as many bad faith loans (or in the case of airlines…creating new “essential routes” as possible. They greater they can spread their influence, and the more people that can be lured into a co-dependent relationship with them, the better. In the case of the housing market the strategy was to offer as many loans to people as possible, whether they were financially secure or not. This increases the likelihood of a bailout.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And yet rather than taking over a clearly mismanaged (or dis-managed) industry or firm…the Federal giovernments actually not only pick up the bad debts of those that did this, but allow them to continue running Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ian, I think you’ve identified a new area of speculative commodities when you point out that Gross, and others, explicitly invested in a sector that looked as if it might go bankrupt. They are in fact intentionally hoping that the firms DO! Then they can hold up to the Federal government the essential need to maintain the industry. It’s a type of corporate black mail…it should have a “name”…and the players in these markets should be identified!</p>
<p>Even worse, they specifically benefit from making as many bad faith loans (or in the case of airlines…creating new “essential routes” as possible. They greater they can spread their influence, and the more people that can be lured into a co-dependent relationship with them, the better. In the case of the housing market the strategy was to offer as many loans to people as possible, whether they were financially secure or not. This increases the likelihood of a bailout.</p>
<p>And yet rather than taking over a clearly mismanaged (or dis-managed) industry or firm…the Federal giovernments actually not only pick up the bad debts of those that did this, but allow them to continue running Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae!</p>
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		<title>By: cleanth</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540612</link>
		<dc:creator>cleanth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:20:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540612</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The banker calls it interest&lt;br /&gt;
And heaves a cheerful sigh;&lt;br /&gt;
The merchant calls it profit&lt;br /&gt;
And winks the other eye;&lt;br /&gt;
The landlord calls it rent,&lt;br /&gt;
As he tucks it in his bag;&lt;br /&gt;
But the honest old burglar&lt;br /&gt;
He just calls it swag.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The banker calls it interest<br />
And heaves a cheerful sigh;<br />
The merchant calls it profit<br />
And winks the other eye;<br />
The landlord calls it rent,<br />
As he tucks it in his bag;<br />
But the honest old burglar<br />
He just calls it swag.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540421</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 05:06:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540421</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If you won’t actually put hard limits on what they can do, yeah.  You just have to say 10/1 credit ratio, period, everything counts.  No credit insurance no nothing, you must have cash or cash equivalents in your account covering it.  You must do due diligence on all loans, which doesn’t mean paying someone else to do it and if you believe a loan is not properly backed up you must not issue it.  If Fannie and Freddie had refused to accept BS loans, they could have stopped most of this cold.  And they knew, they definitely knew.  People always know.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you won’t actually put hard limits on what they can do, yeah.  You just have to say 10/1 credit ratio, period, everything counts.  No credit insurance no nothing, you must have cash or cash equivalents in your account covering it.  You must do due diligence on all loans, which doesn’t mean paying someone else to do it and if you believe a loan is not properly backed up you must not issue it.  If Fannie and Freddie had refused to accept BS loans, they could have stopped most of this cold.  And they knew, they definitely knew.  People always know.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540418</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 05:04:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540418</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I only remember the history as highlights.  It might be worth going over briefly for people.  These guys have been having issues for years and years and years, it was obvious that they would collapse when the bubble collapsed, it was predicted and of course, no one did anything to prevent it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I swear the people who run the US are more worthless than used toilet paper.  Just abysmal.  they aren’t even really making themselves rich, because when everything crashes down including the ecology, if hey haven’t won the death bet, they’re going to get screwed with everyone else.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I only remember the history as highlights.  It might be worth going over briefly for people.  These guys have been having issues for years and years and years, it was obvious that they would collapse when the bubble collapsed, it was predicted and of course, no one did anything to prevent it.</p>
<p>I swear the people who run the US are more worthless than used toilet paper.  Just abysmal.  they aren’t even really making themselves rich, because when everything crashes down including the ecology, if hey haven’t won the death bet, they’re going to get screwed with everyone else.</p>
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		<title>By: wesgpc</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540415</link>
		<dc:creator>wesgpc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 05:03:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540415</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;thakyou Mod, I will remember the guidelines.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thakyou Mod, I will remember the guidelines.</p>
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		<title>By: wesgpc</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540414</link>
		<dc:creator>wesgpc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 05:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540414</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;BTW, I agree completely with Numerian on problems created by GSE status of the FMs.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But then, with current ideological regime in place, it is hard to think of what kind of economic organizational regime in financial system would not produce a crisis: private company, central bank, government agency, GSE -anything would blow up sooner or later.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW, I agree completely with Numerian on problems created by GSE status of the FMs.</p>
<p>But then, with current ideological regime in place, it is hard to think of what kind of economic organizational regime in financial system would not produce a crisis: private company, central bank, government agency, GSE -anything would blow up sooner or later.</p>
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		<title>By: wesgpc</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540405</link>
		<dc:creator>wesgpc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 04:56:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540405</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;My hardhitting , devastating, response:&lt;br /&gt;
Ummmm…. Ooopsie. My bad. Thanks for jogging my memory.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“They were more than uncapitalized, …. Fannie can’t even produce audited copies of their books. Management’s actions were essentially criminal and were designed to produce bonusses. “&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That kind of thing is why I do not like them as GSEs… so, no excuses for me for forgetting about that. I remember reading about that now, and fulminating over it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;thanks for the links.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My hardhitting , devastating, response:<br />
Ummmm…. Ooopsie. My bad. Thanks for jogging my memory.</p>
<p>“They were more than uncapitalized, …. Fannie can’t even produce audited copies of their books. Management’s actions were essentially criminal and were designed to produce bonusses. “</p>
<p>—</p>
<p>That kind of thing is why I do not like them as GSEs… so, no excuses for me for forgetting about that. I remember reading about that now, and fulminating over it.</p>
<p>thanks for the links.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540402</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 04:48:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540402</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;They were more than uncapitalized, they deliberately operated as an alternate money machine for years, operating with far too much leverage and accepting too many mortgages with higher than perceived risk.  Fannie can’t even produce audited copies of their books.  Management’s actions were essentially criminal and were designed to produce bonusses.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://agonist.org/numerian/20070819/the_rise_and_collapse_of_wall_streets_house_of_debt&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;rise and fall of the alternate banking system&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://agonist.org/numerian/20080710/the_foundation_of_the_housing_market_has_begun_to_collapse&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Housing Market Foundation&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They were more than uncapitalized, they deliberately operated as an alternate money machine for years, operating with far too much leverage and accepting too many mortgages with higher than perceived risk.  Fannie can’t even produce audited copies of their books.  Management’s actions were essentially criminal and were designed to produce bonusses.</p>
<p><a href="http://agonist.org/numerian/20070819/the_rise_and_collapse_of_wall_streets_house_of_debt" rel="nofollow">rise and fall of the alternate banking system</a></p>
<p><a href="http://agonist.org/numerian/20080710/the_foundation_of_the_housing_market_has_begun_to_collapse" rel="nofollow">Housing Market Foundation</a></p>
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		<title>By: wesgpc</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540398</link>
		<dc:creator>wesgpc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 04:44:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/13/surprise-fannie-and-freddie-bailout/#comment-1540398</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I can’t help quoting Stiglit’z recent column on the end of neo liberalism. The quotes are from the original aricle, which can be accessed via&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/07/stiglitz-the-en.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://economistsview.typepad&amp;.....he-en.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;BTW: I wonder why it was published in the Daily News of Egypt, rather than the NYT or Washington Post?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;—————————–&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;” The world has not been kind to neo-liberalism, that grab-bag of ideas based on the fundamentalist notion that markets are self-correcting, allocate resources efficiently, and serve the public interest well. It was this market fundamentalism that underlay Thatcherism, Reaganomics, and the so-called “Washington Consensus” in favor of privatization, liberalization, and independent central banks focusing single-mindedly on inflation. “&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[My ed note: I think Stiglitz should have said “unregulated markets, especially those where there is an unequal distribution of information, or contracts are complex and incomplete” instead of just “markets.” Markets are good, usually best form of economic decision making, but you have to watch and regulate them, especiall in situations I mentioned above.]&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;” Though neo-liberals do not want to admit it, their ideology also failed another test. No one can claim that financial markets did a stellar job in allocating resources in the late 1990’s, with 97% of investments in fiber optics taking years to see any light. But at least that mistake had an unintended benefit: as costs of communication were driven down, India and China became more integrated into the global economy.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;~~~&lt;em&gt;ModNote: Edited for length.&lt;br /&gt;
Shorter excerpts will be easier to read here, and will allow FDL to remain within Fair-Use guidelines - 250 words. The link is important. Thanks.&lt;/em&gt;~~~&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can’t help quoting Stiglit’z recent column on the end of neo liberalism. The quotes are from the original aricle, which can be accessed via</p>
<p><a href="http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/07/stiglitz-the-en.html" rel="nofollow">http://economistsview.typepad&#038;&#8230;..he-en.html</a></p>
<p>BTW: I wonder why it was published in the Daily News of Egypt, rather than the NYT or Washington Post?</p>
<p>—————————–</p>
<p>” The world has not been kind to neo-liberalism, that grab-bag of ideas based on the fundamentalist notion that markets are self-correcting, allocate resources efficiently, and serve the public interest well. It was this market fundamentalism that underlay Thatcherism, Reaganomics, and the so-called “Washington Consensus” in favor of privatization, liberalization, and independent central banks focusing single-mindedly on inflation. “</p>
<p>[My ed note: I think Stiglitz should have said “unregulated markets, especially those where there is an unequal distribution of information, or contracts are complex and incomplete” instead of just “markets.” Markets are good, usually best form of economic decision making, but you have to watch and regulate them, especiall in situations I mentioned above.]</p>
<p>” Though neo-liberals do not want to admit it, their ideology also failed another test. No one can claim that financial markets did a stellar job in allocating resources in the late 1990’s, with 97% of investments in fiber optics taking years to see any light. But at least that mistake had an unintended benefit: as costs of communication were driven down, India and China became more integrated into the global economy.  </p>
<p>~~~<em>ModNote: Edited for length.<br />
Shorter excerpts will be easier to read here, and will allow FDL to remain within Fair-Use guidelines &#8211; 250 words. The link is important. Thanks.</em>~~~</p>
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