"Doc" Joseph P. Dwyer, the soldier in the Warren Zinn photo. R.I.P.
On ABC's This Week Joe Lieberman suggested Barack Obama is changing his position on removing combat troops from Iraq, implying Obama now agrees with Joe's buddy McCain that Iraq is the central front on the war on terror -- and we're winning (h/t C&L).
Completely contradicting Joe, Fred Barnes was on Fox News trying to diminish the importance of Afghanistan (h/t Attaturk), it's escalating violence notwithstanding, because he fears the opposite, that Obama will take troops out of Iraq and send them to Afghanistan, where we're, uh, not winning.
Which is it, guys?
Too much of the media spent last week echoing the McCain campaign's misdirection that Obama was opening the door to retaining combat troops in Iraq. But the Boston Globe sorts it out and simplifies the essential Obama/McCain difference:
Obama, the presumptive Democratic nominee, and McCain, his Republican counterpart, both recently outlined their visions for solving the crisis.
If elected, Obama says, he would immediately withdraw thousands of ground troops from Iraq and send them to Afghanistan to help undermanned US forces defeat the Taliban and Al Qaeda.
"It's time to refocus our attention on the war we have to win in Afghanistan," Obama said in a speech last week. "It is time to go after the Al Qaeda leadership where it actually exists."
. . .
However, McCain, a former fighter pilot and Vietnam prisoner of war, says Iraq, not Afghanistan, is the "central front" in the war on terrorism. He believes that NATO and Pakistan must do more in Afghanistan until the United States can draw down its commitment in Iraq - a position which tracks Bush administration strategy.
The Arizona senator and his foreign policy team warn that pulling US forces from Iraq would embolden Islamic extremists around the world and strengthen Al Qaeda as a national security threat.
McCain's surrogates are worried about this difference, because Obama's position gains support from senior military officials, who have repeatedly explained that our troop commitment to Iraq is shorting the Afghanistan effort.
"I don't have troops I can reach for, brigades I can reach, to send into Afghanistan until I have a reduced requirement in Iraq," Admiral Michael G. Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told reporters at the Pentagon last week. Mullen said the Afghanistan campaign has been running short of troops since the 2003 invasion of Iraq.
"Afghanistan has been and remains an economy-of-force campaign," he said, "which by definition means we need more forces there."
With all the negative news coming from Afghanistan and Pakistan lately -- including deadly bombings on Friday and Sunday in which the Americans claims "insurgents" were killed, while the Afghan authorities claim the victims were civilians -- the McCain surrogates are trying hard to keep the media and voters focused on Iraq and not the consequences of their Iraq policies everywhere else.
It's the same misdirection McCain advocated when he and the Bush regime misled the country into the disastrous Iraq war in the first place. To obscure that strategic blunder, he's doubling down in Iraq, hoping US and NATO forces in Afghanistan can hold on just long enough for McCain and Bush to avoid taking responsibility for both mistakes.
And he's hoping the public will not notice our invasion essentially destroyed much of Iraq and continues its tragic toll on American troops.
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Good Morning! Does McSame ever campaign without his sidekicks?
I just wrote this downstairs and it works for this post as well;
democrats can make it easy on themselves when asked if “we want to win in Iraq”
the answer is;
“we win when we leave, as long as we remain we are failing, don’t YOU want to win?”
and then point out all the claims of this being a “one week, one month, certainly not 6 month war”
democrat when asked if we want to win in Iraq;
“according to the president himself, this was going to be a 6 month war, and when they wanted us out we would leave, they want us out now and this is far more then a 6 month war, the president made our troops lose, he is the most inept commander in chief we have ever had
it is brutally obvious, the president’s claim from the beginning, which he abandoned is true, we can only win when we leave, don’t YOU want to win in IRaq?”
wathc his head explode
g’morning firedogs!
heading off to panera
i think i can help.
iraq is the republican war.
afghanistan is the democratic war.
AQ is, as far as i can tell in neither country and in any event, escalation (in afghanistan) or extension (iraq) of our occupations will do nothing to make us safer or address the real issues wrt suicide terrorism which is primarily driven by occupations.
although either/both locations may be important for launching attacks against iran.
idiots.
Iraq is only the central front in the war for getting unaccountable taxpayer funding for Halliburton and every other contractor with a desire for Ultimate Wingnut Welfare.
I’ve noticed there are no mentions of al Qaeda in Afghanistan, only in Iraq. The Taliban are taking credit for the recent violence in Afghanistan. Pakistan seems to be having more trouble with al Qaeda than anybody else. With Short Ride and McSFB whispering in each other’s ears, with an occasional boost from Graham, they don’t know shit from Shinola, Shi’ite from Shia, or day from night. And Shrub just keeps trying to get his head out of his ass.
OT - good coverage on FISA on democracy now!
oops. forget to mention that amy goodman has mark klein on. doing a great job of ripping pelosi, obama and the democratic leadership taking bush’s side against dodd, feingold and the american people.
Do we have any info on Pelosi meeting with her constituents over the weekend?
And there was a bombing of the Indian embassy in Kabul killing 28 at last count. Juan Cole talks about it.
So here’s a question. Let’s say that we start pulling our troops out of Iraq in an orderly fashion. Who takes care of and evacuates the contractors? And who pays for that? (yeah, I know. We do)
Not much is being talked about in terms of the sheer numbers and costs of maintianing them.
Oh, and if/when Blackwater finishes in Iraq, where do they go next? And who deals with their PTSD?
Morning all..Don’t know if this has been mentioned?
‘Israel has successfully tested a new defence system designed to intercept rockets fired from southern Lebanon and the Hamas-ruled Gaza Strip, public radio reported on Sunday.’
http://current.com/items/89079.....tor_report
Morning Scarecrow.
why is this distinction so hard for the news media to communicate to their listeners?
no, he can’t.
has either presidential candidate said they would withdraw the contractors?
Not sure either has any control over them directly—it would seem that it’s all in the funding of the contracts themselves.
Just thinking about having 100,000 plus of them around here with not much to do stirring up trouble on the home front. Scary.
If the government doesn’t pull them out with the troops, contractors, including Blackwater, will become prime targets. Blackwater may think they’re hot shit but they won’t have the fire support of the military to back their shit up.
Laura Flanders was just on CNN with some loudmouth who kept talking over her.
Economy getting destroyed too: Indymac Bank expected to be in freefall today.
I thought for sure this was the answer to #6.
We need something like a Protective Order to keep W out of Iran…or impeachment would do.
Yesterday Lieberman slammed Obama and Reed didn’t show any passion at all refuting him, shades of Dukakis. When oh when are we going to learn how to counter these tactics?
Repukes rolled out first negative ad against Obama here in Mi at least the first one I have seen. Good ol’ McStain attacks first…just like Obama’s other opponent, gutter politics at best.
even if our ground troops are withdrawn, that doesn’t mean the air war will end. :(
I’d gladly send W to Iran. All by himself. Give him a couple thousand dollars walking around money and leave him there.
I’d think most would leave on their own; we just don’t count them. If Bush leaves the contractors to the mercy of Iraq justice system, as some reports indicate, none will want to stay.
it’s all they’ve got. Although Obama’s starting to give them more to work with.
Most of the close in fire support comes from Army units. They won’t stay to protect Blackwater. AirCav goes where the troops go. Air Force won’t be too keen on protecting mercs either.
on the subject of contractors:
Blackwater’s legal protections might end
link
Right. Maliki and other Arab leaders have just said they’re working on a short term Memo of Understanding, complete with timetable for withdrawal. The SOFA seems to be toast.
RevBev @ 23: Since he’s so infatuated with Irak, I’d rather dump him there with a little walking around money.
thanks for the encouraging info, scarecrow, SD and elliot.
Outstanding!
In case you missed the last link — last sentence — the guy in the picture at the top of the post apparently killed himself last week.
Reminded me of this other picture from a year ago.
as mfi keeps telling us - without the contractors, he thinks we’d have to withdraw from iraq.
Which, if it’s dollars instead of Euros, ought to bring him to afternoon tea time on day one. G’morning, Scarecrow, doggies.
damn. thank you for making sure i saw that. heartbreaking.
Scarecrow -
Good Morning. Are you aware of that pictured Soldier’s fate ??
C & L
Oh No!
How very tragic.
Wonder what Fred Barnes has to say about this.
I know—having 2 revs around at the same time can be confusing.
what have we done to ourselves?
Breaks my heart.
There are so many still in Saigon, Baghdad, etc, etc.
Interesting piece about the 2 candidates gambling habits.
Oops, I’m sorry.
Collateral damage my ass!
the “contractors” include blackwater, how many more military would we need if we didn’t have that bushes brownshirts?.
far less then the equal amount of blackwater replaced since they are quite counter productive but imagine what the president would be capable of doing without these brownshirts
We have paid such a terrible price in our families, in the world, and in our souls. It’s heartbreaking….let alone that there are still people who support this war and this criminal Pres. Even Condi is proud we went to Irak. Wonder is she is proud of how we have treated our Vets.
Fancy labels don’t wash the brains and blood of your best friend off of you.
I read about that last night. It would seem that the count of our war dead does not include the suicides. Perhaps Keith could start a new very serious segment profiling one of them per night. He’s about the only one who would dare to do it.
But W. sleeps very well at night. And probably during the day too.
hit is amazing how much this president copies hitler, from “the patriot act” which is plaguerized from hitler’s “enabling act” to torture chambers, to the private mercenaries hitler hired which became known as “brownshirts”
there is no question, the mans model is hitler, no question what so ever
I hear that JOE Lie-berman got blasted by demonstrators when he left ABC studios yesterday,he was attempting to speak to some reporters and the demonstrators blasted him with a(no pun intended)”Bullhorn” he could not take it and jumped into his limo and they pulled off.I hope this is going to be a youtube moment.
I’m not sure she’s proud of it but she has to make believe she is, otherwise the presdient is left flat on the floor
if you watched cheney a few months ago he actually had the nerve to say “everything is going according to plan and Iraq is an unqualified success”
not verbatum quote from cheney but pretty close
Dunno. When I say the pic in the C&L post last night, I immediately thought it was the same guy in the pic from a year ago, but I don’t think it is. If you read through Greg Mitchell’s Editors and Publishers story — on which the C&L post is based, you’ll find the guy basically saying “we were all doing this.”
“Just doing my job,” is a very familiar response, and then they take it home.
Sorry, yes. Didn’t know which soldier you meant.
I know. Even Lady Macbeth was undone by her callous treachery. But BushCo’s best friends live in secure and relatively palatial bunkers, and they never, ever see the blood.
I think this is a very large part of The Shock Doctrine….scary isn’t it? Along with the denial and enablers.
question:
why do many people, who understand how destructive our occupation of iraq is, think that our occupation of afghanistan is a good thing?
can’t wait to see that!
The prospect of wealth without effort.
it is without a doubt the shock doctrine, no question about it
and we are watching the man emulate his hero, his grandfather’s hero, he uses hitler as his role model and template
here’s a hitler question;
did hitler really hate the jews or were they simply his convenient scapegoat?
Here’s the original and the story from the Damir Sagolj photo a year ago.
Read the appropriate passages in Mein Kampf and there will be little doubt as to the answer.
More in Anger than in Sorrow. . .
“We’ll be fighting in the streets,
with our children at our feet,
and the morals that they worship will be gone.
And the men who spurred us on
sit in judgement of all wrong,
they decide and the shotgun sings the song.
I’ll tip my hat to the new constitution
take a bow for the new revolution,
smile and grin at the change all around,
take up my guitar and play just like yesterday,
and I’ll get on my knees and pray.
— We don’t get fooled again.
The change it had to come,
we knew it all along,
we were liberated from the fold, that’s all.
And the world looks just the same,
and history ain’t changed,
’cause the banners were all flown in the last war.
I’ll move myself and my family aside,
if we happen to be left half alive,
I’ll get all my papers and smile at the sky,
though I know that the hypnotized never lie.
Nothing in the street looks any different to me.
And the slogans are replaced by the by,
and the parting on the left is now parting on the right,
and the beards have all grown longer over night.
Meet the new boss.
Same as the old boss”
Sadly, the young man from a year ago - Lance Corporal James Blake Miller–
who is now jobless, divorced and near suicidal since being discharged from the military after being diagnosed with PTSD. With little aid from his government, per C & L
My Macbeth reference above brought this to mind re W sleeping at night et al:
To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether ’tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them. To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache, and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, ’tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish’d. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: aye, there’s the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come,
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there’s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor’s wrong, the proud man’s contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law’s delay,
The insolence of office, and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover’d country from whose bourn
No traveler returns, puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all,
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o’er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry
And lose the name of action.
(Hamlet had a soul. Bush has hubris.)
OT, but here in an important swing state, Michigan, John McCain is running an aggressive television campaign. First an introduction of McCain the “man” followed by his ‘plan” to address the energy crisis, followed by attack ads on Obama’s lack of a plan on energy. McCain owns Michigan on the airwaves. Obama has run only ads that introduce him to the voters and nowhere near the number of McCains original sell. Is Obama giving up on Michigan so early in the campaign?
Is racism hate? It’s hard to think what else would motivate the need to only allow the “superior” white race.
here’s a scary quote from think progress, scary in the fact that if the president knew what he was doing he could pretty much guarantee a McCain win, check out my bold;
if the president embraced this approach, even for public consumption up until the election, McCain is our next president
it seems he so to needs to prove his point, he wants to cut off his nose so to spite his face
don’t have a copy, what is the passage?
BEY THE MEDIA WHORES have it all so good,if ya play your cards right,loke most do you get a 20,000,000.00 dollar mansion
Friday, September 7th 2007, 4:00 AM
Paula Zahn
The scourned husband of former CNN anchor Paula Zahn says there’s no way he could have mismanaged her millions because she was spending the money as fast as she made it.
Less than two weeks after being sued by Zahn for making “dubious investments” with more than $25 million, her jilted hubby, Richard Cohen, fired back by branding his estranged wife a wastrel who wants to air their dirty laundry in public.
“The $20 million cost of her Connecticut mansion alone (without even including the extravagant nature of Ms. Zahn’s annual expenditures) consumed more than her entire income over their 20-year marriage,” Cohen’s lawyer, Douglas Flaum, charged in court papers filed in Manhattan Supreme Court.
The short version is that Hitler saw the Germany portrayed in Wagner’s Ring trilogy as the epitome of the true Germany. His ire was directed not only at Jews, but Slavs and other non-whites. His railing against the Jews and events such as the “Night of Broken Glass” were convenient political acts. Rove does the same thing, just in a more subtle, non-violent way.
I’m not sure I want to give Hitler this kind of credit but it is possible he created the racism to unite the country, create an enemy and get everyone on board against them, it doesn’t matter who that enemy is
if it was real racism that he did not manufacture for public consumption, yes that is hate
See my 69. Hitler’s ethnic views are scattered throughout the text, which is nearly impossible to read.
Good question. This C&L post by John Perr discusses the “no safe havens” justification and seems implicitly to buy it (in saying Obama is right) while claiming the doctrine is dead. You’re right; few see the occupation of Afghanistan the same as Iraq, but the toll on civilians looks the same.
do we really want to give hitler this kind or intilectual ability?
I would rather think he was indeed a rascist
by the way, any truth to the rumor his real mom might have been jewish?
I think for Cheney, everything is going according to HIS plan.
OK, who here is going to Netroots Nation?
I still haven’t cancelled my hotel room and I’m thinking I need to do something worthwhile this summer.
I think it was widely accepted that Osama Bin Ladin was responsible for 9/11 and resided in Afghanistan. The none-to-lovable Taliban government declined to turn him over to the U.S.. Accordingly, there was widespread support domestically and internationally of the invasion of Afghanistan and overthrow of the Taliban. Additionally, we seemed to have both a security interest and a responsiblity for trying to fix what we had broken as well as finishing the fight against bin Ladin and the Taliban. Also, although there are theories about pipelines and the poppy market, it is arguable that there is nothing in Afghanistan of empirial interest to the United States. Additionally, we had much greater support and cooperation from our tradiational allies, who now bear a portion of the cost and sacrifice.
I know you disagree, but I think those are the reasons.
NPR covering the FISA vote; Obama partially building a relationship with CIA. Changed based on additional information….
well that’s what he would like us to believe, he makes that play every single time his plans fail, and his plans always fail, he even failed out of college
he is indeed a moron, not quite the moron as bush, at least cheney has a pretty good command of our language
Sorry, my 75 was an attempt to respond to Selise’s 54.
I call BULLSHIT
obama means “team b” not the REAL cia…the man has corrupted himself and I am PISSED
now he’s making believe bush was frigging RIGHT to break our law!
I AM PISSED
I meant that his plan had to do with padding the coffers of his buddies. This has been more than a success for them in this regard.
C&L link.
any and all information that was gathered with the president’s request IS LEGAL, THERE IS NO REASON WHAT SO EVER for this man to give telecom immunity, they ARE ALLREADY IMUNE
I am really really scared of this man right now
well that is surely true
I heard that in the earlier broadcast.
They are now one by one cloaking their decision to play for the telcoms in super double secret code that tells we, the people to STFU. They can’t tell us why they are voting for it because it is a secret.
Hitler didn’t plan these events, men like Goebbels and Goering did. Hitler was not the brightest star in the sky, but he had acquired a political acumen second to none by closely observing others and their successes and failures. He had ambitious men around him and a populace reeling from the effects of the Versailles Treaty and the Depression. The Nazi party only got something like 35% of the vote in 1932 but he was Chancellor by the end of January 1933. Combine all that and you end up the the 1000 year Third Reich.
Oh, and his mother was a peasant girl but not Jewish.
The economy has been destroyed by Bush/Republic economic policies ranging from tax cuts for the wealthy to uncontrolled spending. Yet, when McCain promises more of the same, the MSM simply reports his message as if it is credible.
THEY WORK FOR US, THEY BETTER TELL US WHY
man, I am PISSED
feingold is PISSED and these traitors are full of BULL
so it is fairly well established his rascism was convenient rather then actual?
No one going to Austin next week?
No, the other way round.
perris, just lie back and enjoy it /s
I think we hurt ourselves when we call them “tax cuts” for the wealthy
they are “middle class assets given to the wealthy and called tax cuts”
that paints the right picture, it is stealing and that’s the way it needs to be protrayed, “tax cut” is far to benign
Moi? Non.
choke.
got it, thanx, I was hoping you’d say that
G’morning RevD
I think Loo Hoo and TexasBetsy are going. Maybe some of the other Texas pups…Gnome?
It was 5 years ago today that Joe Wilson’s op-ed was printed in the NYT.
Time flies when you’re having . . . . . .
they were at last year’s too.
gonna be a long long week elliott, long long week and long long election
by the way, everyone go out and buy as many cases of protein bars as you can afford, get a case a week.
you will always be able to use these and they are meal replacements in case of “emergency”
a no lose investment…begin your protein bar stash today
oops. yesterday.
Off to swim in the great capitalist cesspool.
Be good to yourselves, and all other living things.
Namaste
I miss joe, he used to stop by a few times, I wish he would say hi once in a while, quite a man, one of the last heroes left in our country
russ is another one
bye SD!
Holy Guacamole!
he sometimes shows up on book salons or when a particularly relevant post shows up. I think he lurks though.
Now we know things are getting tough. BMW’s sales are down almost 3%.
Scarecrow, Southern Dragon, Crosstimbers, and other veteran firedogs -
we lost 3 more Central Texas I/A vets to suicide in the 10 days leading up to the 4th. 2 of the 3 died just as the young man pictured above - accidental overdoses -
spent most of my campaigning time on the 4th speaking to Vets and Vet Groups - as our incumbent opponent has voted against all but 1 benefit bill (btw - most did not know neither this weasel congr. nor McBush voted against new GI Bill)
it was an in your face lesson as to how much we ask of these folks and how very little we compensate them - and a real taste of the breadth and reach of PTSD
in addition I met Vietnam era guys still fighting their govt on Agent Orange related issues - Army guys who pointed out they were ‘lucky’ not to be Navy veterans