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	<title>Comments on: Turning Obama Into A Punchline: How Democrats Can Lose</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/</link>
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		<title>By: libbyliberal</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525279</link>
		<dc:creator>libbyliberal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 09:38:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525279</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;DWBartoo @147&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;D,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I just loved my poem! Just peeked back and found it and was so touched. Thank you.  That gets printed out and put in the scrapbook!  :)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Thanks for being generous with your wit, wisdom and … well, so generous with your generosity!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;L&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DWBartoo @147</p>
<p>D,</p>
<p>I just loved my poem! Just peeked back and found it and was so touched. Thank you.  That gets printed out and put in the scrapbook!  :)</p>
<p>Thanks for being generous with your wit, wisdom and … well, so generous with your generosity!</p>
<p>L</p>
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		<title>By: libbyliberal</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525278</link>
		<dc:creator>libbyliberal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 09:33:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525278</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;dmac @35 … my reply not working…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I recognize “traumatic bonding” with McCain… whereby an individual enthralls others into a roller coaster of relating.. one does not know if they will get a smile or a slap from such a volatile person.  And people misinterpret their own intimidation for respect.  And feel relief and a bit of a high when the negative side doesn’t lash out.  It glues them to the traumatizer. Kind of like the Stockholm hostage syndrome.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;APA says if you have 3 of 7 following characteristics you are dealing with an anti-social personality.  1) failure to conform to social norms, 2) deceitfulness and manipulativeness, 3) impulsivity, failure to plan ahead, 4) irritability, aggressiveness, 5) reckless disregard of the safety of self and others, 6) consistent irresponsibility, 7) lack of remorse after having  hurt, mistreated or stolen from another person.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Martha Stout claims 4% of population are sociopaths.  1 in 25.  She wrote a book called The Sociopath Next Door.  They can be charming, intelligent, etc.  They just lack the all-important conscience.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dmac @35 … my reply not working…</p>
<p>I recognize “traumatic bonding” with McCain… whereby an individual enthralls others into a roller coaster of relating.. one does not know if they will get a smile or a slap from such a volatile person.  And people misinterpret their own intimidation for respect.  And feel relief and a bit of a high when the negative side doesn’t lash out.  It glues them to the traumatizer. Kind of like the Stockholm hostage syndrome.</p>
<p>APA says if you have 3 of 7 following characteristics you are dealing with an anti-social personality.  1) failure to conform to social norms, 2) deceitfulness and manipulativeness, 3) impulsivity, failure to plan ahead, 4) irritability, aggressiveness, 5) reckless disregard of the safety of self and others, 6) consistent irresponsibility, 7) lack of remorse after having  hurt, mistreated or stolen from another person.  </p>
<p>Martha Stout claims 4% of population are sociopaths.  1 in 25.  She wrote a book called The Sociopath Next Door.  They can be charming, intelligent, etc.  They just lack the all-important conscience.</p>
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		<title>By: libbyliberal</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525276</link>
		<dc:creator>libbyliberal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 09:00:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1525276</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;he’s leaning on some slender reeds, easily broken by the avalanche of mud soon to come his way.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Mud from both the D’s and the R’s and the MSM.  Thanks for this blog, Ian.  So solidly sound.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I am commenting late in the game, but I feel like we need to process this “under the bus experience.”  Hey, Reverend, Samantha, Wesley, moveon, and 60s  hippie activists (wow… that one really po’d me)…. I can’t believe he threw the entire “left” under the bus. And I thought Bush had hubris.  And how deliciously titillating to MSM who justifies the strategic wisdom of this decision for a few minutes, to use it later to club him with.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So Bush’s numbers are in the toilet.  We on the left have been screaming about the emperor’s nakedness for eight long years.  Suffered our own form of PTSD when awesomely he was reelected in 2004 … but no one, apparently including Obama, will acknowledge our wisdom and our Cassandra-like warnings.  The first line enablers of Bush and his war … of lemming-like apathy to corporate rapists …. won’t give us our due. I guess we gotta let go of that.  Respect for our sanity.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I was thinking of the adage about how Republicans fall in line, Democrats fall in love.  And Barack just sent us a massive Dear John letter. Wow.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;IIRC … long ago Joan Baez said wistfully she wished she had had time to become a “person” before she became a “personality”.  I fear this may be happening with Barack.  Potential there for sure… but is it beyond his emotional capacity?  Also IIRC Einstein said evil wasn’t darkness, it just was the absence of light.  Now, we need a leader who can lead us toward the  light … of truth and goodness.  I fear you can’t see the true light,  Barack and how can you lead us to the future if your stride is not sure, but you are puppeted by your ego-strategic mind and those of your “handlers” … lost to the dark.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I SAY AGAIN, BARACK, LEARN TO LET GO OF THE SUPPORT YOU DON’T HAVE, AND HOLD ONTO THE SUPPORT YOU HAVE!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>he’s leaning on some slender reeds, easily broken by the avalanche of mud soon to come his way.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Mud from both the D’s and the R’s and the MSM.  Thanks for this blog, Ian.  So solidly sound.</p>
<p>I am commenting late in the game, but I feel like we need to process this “under the bus experience.”  Hey, Reverend, Samantha, Wesley, moveon, and 60s  hippie activists (wow… that one really po’d me)…. I can’t believe he threw the entire “left” under the bus. And I thought Bush had hubris.  And how deliciously titillating to MSM who justifies the strategic wisdom of this decision for a few minutes, to use it later to club him with.</p>
<p>So Bush’s numbers are in the toilet.  We on the left have been screaming about the emperor’s nakedness for eight long years.  Suffered our own form of PTSD when awesomely he was reelected in 2004 … but no one, apparently including Obama, will acknowledge our wisdom and our Cassandra-like warnings.  The first line enablers of Bush and his war … of lemming-like apathy to corporate rapists …. won’t give us our due. I guess we gotta let go of that.  Respect for our sanity.</p>
<p>I was thinking of the adage about how Republicans fall in line, Democrats fall in love.  And Barack just sent us a massive Dear John letter. Wow.</p>
<p>IIRC … long ago Joan Baez said wistfully she wished she had had time to become a “person” before she became a “personality”.  I fear this may be happening with Barack.  Potential there for sure… but is it beyond his emotional capacity?  Also IIRC Einstein said evil wasn’t darkness, it just was the absence of light.  Now, we need a leader who can lead us toward the  light … of truth and goodness.  I fear you can’t see the true light,  Barack and how can you lead us to the future if your stride is not sure, but you are puppeted by your ego-strategic mind and those of your “handlers” … lost to the dark.</p>
<p>I SAY AGAIN, BARACK, LEARN TO LET GO OF THE SUPPORT YOU DON’T HAVE, AND HOLD ONTO THE SUPPORT YOU HAVE!</p>
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		<title>By: shell</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524990</link>
		<dc:creator>shell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 04:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524990</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If Progressives just clutch their pearls, and moan, “They are so EVIL” — it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Just stay with the facts:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;1.  The GOP is telling the evil lies and acting evil NOW.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2.  Conventional wisdom says Obama won’t play the same gave Dukakis, Gore, and Kerry did.  It sure seems he is, now.  But I hold out hope.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;3.  The Progressives can’t just sit back and HOPE things will turn out OK.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;4.  So, what do we do?  I say start with media.  What do we have?  Keith Olbermann — that’s about it on teevee, as far as I can see.  Radio?  99% right-wing. That’s out.  I realize there are good starts, like GritTV, and others, but they are speaking to the choir. IMO.  Late night TV?  Forget Leno — he will say anything to get a laugh.  Stewart and Colbert?  Yes,  But again, speaking to the choir.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So — what can we do?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If Progressives just clutch their pearls, and moan, “They are so EVIL” — it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.</p>
<p>Just stay with the facts:</p>
<p>1.  The GOP is telling the evil lies and acting evil NOW.</p>
<p>2.  Conventional wisdom says Obama won’t play the same gave Dukakis, Gore, and Kerry did.  It sure seems he is, now.  But I hold out hope.</p>
<p>3.  The Progressives can’t just sit back and HOPE things will turn out OK.</p>
<p>4.  So, what do we do?  I say start with media.  What do we have?  Keith Olbermann — that’s about it on teevee, as far as I can see.  Radio?  99% right-wing. That’s out.  I realize there are good starts, like GritTV, and others, but they are speaking to the choir. IMO.  Late night TV?  Forget Leno — he will say anything to get a laugh.  Stewart and Colbert?  Yes,  But again, speaking to the choir.</p>
<p>So — what can we do?</p>
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		<title>By: prostratedragon</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524942</link>
		<dc:creator>prostratedragon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 03:51:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524942</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;For this hypothesis —call it hypothesis no. 57 to give it an encoding— to be fruitful, there would have to be some payoff, either immediately or over time, pecuniary or in kind, etc. What could possibly be big enough for someone as ambitious as Obama seems to be?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For this hypothesis —call it hypothesis no. 57 to give it an encoding— to be fruitful, there would have to be some payoff, either immediately or over time, pecuniary or in kind, etc. What could possibly be big enough for someone as ambitious as Obama seems to be?</p>
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		<title>By: ubetchaiam</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524926</link>
		<dc:creator>ubetchaiam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 03:44:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524926</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well said Ian; this needs more ‘diggs’ and lots of ’sharing’. I’m wondering if it will be the VP nominee who becomes the ‘attack dog’ since Obama seems to want to ’stay above the fray’(consistent with the ‘change’ meme he’s trying to birth, e.g. ‘faith based initiative’).&lt;br /&gt;
Indicting Rove would be an excellent step for the Dems and well deserved.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said Ian; this needs more ‘diggs’ and lots of ’sharing’. I’m wondering if it will be the VP nominee who becomes the ‘attack dog’ since Obama seems to want to ’stay above the fray’(consistent with the ‘change’ meme he’s trying to birth, e.g. ‘faith based initiative’).<br />
Indicting Rove would be an excellent step for the Dems and well deserved.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian Welsh</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524904</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 03:23:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524904</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If he loses it’ll be because of decisions he made.  There are consequences to his actions.  If he wants to say one thing in the primary then say another in the general, some people will consider that unacceptable.  He makes the decision, he bears the consequence and it is his responsibility to decide correctly that the number of base voters, money and volunteers he loses by throwing the 4th amendment overboard are more than balanced.  If they aren’t, again, that’s his responsibility.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To put it more bluntly, he either lied in the primary or changed his mind rather fast, and it’s not unreasonable for people to get angry about that. Nor is it their fault that Obama is acting like a weathervane in a tornado.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;His actions.  His words.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;His responsibility.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If he loses it’ll be because of decisions he made.  There are consequences to his actions.  If he wants to say one thing in the primary then say another in the general, some people will consider that unacceptable.  He makes the decision, he bears the consequence and it is his responsibility to decide correctly that the number of base voters, money and volunteers he loses by throwing the 4th amendment overboard are more than balanced.  If they aren’t, again, that’s his responsibility.</p>
<p>To put it more bluntly, he either lied in the primary or changed his mind rather fast, and it’s not unreasonable for people to get angry about that. Nor is it their fault that Obama is acting like a weathervane in a tornado.  </p>
<p>His actions.  His words.</p>
<p>His responsibility.</p>
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		<title>By: wigwam</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524864</link>
		<dc:creator>wigwam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 02:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I was thinking that Bob Shrum might have snuck into the Obama camp.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was thinking that Bob Shrum might have snuck into the Obama camp.</p>
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		<title>By: megpiepie1</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524807</link>
		<dc:creator>megpiepie1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:53:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524807</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thank you Thank you Thank you&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Thank you Thank you</p>
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		<title>By: KayInMaine</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524800</link>
		<dc:creator>KayInMaine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:50:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/07/02/turning-obama-into-a-punchline-how-obama-can-lose/#comment-1524800</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Meg, I don’t like it either. Why is it Democrats turn on their candidate so quickly? LOL It makes my head spin sometimes and if McCain wins it in November we’ll know why! Some will be scratching their heads and wondering aloud…&lt;em&gt;what went wrong&lt;/em&gt;. *sigh*&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meg, I don’t like it either. Why is it Democrats turn on their candidate so quickly? LOL It makes my head spin sometimes and if McCain wins it in November we’ll know why! Some will be scratching their heads and wondering aloud…<em>what went wrong</em>. *sigh*</p>
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