Comments on: Don’t Reinvent the Wheel When Fixing America

By: briber

briber — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 14:45:39 +0000

beth meacham wrote: “How could that be good in this Ideal Capitalist Society?”

Simple answer: Insurance companies may not benefit but by controlling healthcare spending (through single payer system), capital that would have been consumed in the (inefficient) health care system would be available for other investments.

-briber

By: ekunin

ekunin — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 12:03:18 +0000

Greetings Ian-I, too, look forward to your posts although we disagree profoundly. You think capitalism can be fixed. I don’t. The US can’t (won’t) learn from others because it is more committed to individualism than anyone else. The problem is the balance to be struck between individual and group. Most nations see a group interest to be protected at least some time. In the US anything the individual does to make a buck goes.

Just as conservation doesn’t fly well because there’s little money in it (Our automobile producers produced gas guzzlers long after it made no sense because there was more money in them. They would still be doing so if our administration didn’t screw things up so the price of oil went through the roof). We didn’t even demand greater fuel efficiency because inefficiency creates more livlihoods. We won’t get more efficient health care for the same reason.

By: Ian Welsh

Ian Welsh — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:49:35 +0000

Canada has worse wait times, or did (it’s been improving and I think the data is showing the gap is a lot narrower) but some other universal systems don’t have worse wait times – and still cost 2/3rds as much. Canada isn’t the gold standard, perhaps silver, though there are advantages to the Canadian system as applied to the US because of its very decentralized nature.

By: Ian Welsh

Ian Welsh — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:47:07 +0000

Hadn’t seen that. A good first step. Insufficient. The incentives need to drive money somewhere else (there needs to be a place to put all this money with better returns) or you need to tax the tar out of them (which requires aid from a number of other countries, who might, mind you, be willing to cooperate).

Tobin on currency and derivatives is the minimum necessary step, I think, though there are some other ways to do the same things. The Fed could also just pull the plug on it, but that would bring a bunch of brokerage firms and banks down — and not just in the US.

By: Ian Welsh

Ian Welsh — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:43:13 +0000

The combination of what you pay in premiums, taxes and reduced wages is certainly more than what you would pay under a well done single payor system.

Here’s the oddity, the US government pays as much per capita as many other countries on health care. US citizens are already paying most of the taxes necessary for single payor without getting it. They pay more, and get less, because the system is so inefficient.

Most people would wind up, at the end of the day, with more money in pocket after medical expenses (whether tax or premium) in a single payor system. That’s simply a function of the average cost being 1/3 less.

By: Ian Welsh

Ian Welsh — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:40:57 +0000

Will do, thanks Laura. I rarely notice what’s happening at the State level, which is something I should rectify.

By: Ian Welsh

Ian Welsh — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:37:44 +0000

Sorry I missed this, some belated answers in EPU land

Petro: too early to tell. I do have some hopes, because I think Elizabeth is very sincere, and given her personal health situation I don’t think she has the time or energy to play political games if Obama isn’t really serious about moving to a universal system. Mind you, the Edwards/Clinton plans weren’t ideal, they were both way overcomplicated by the desire not to go to single payor but to have the benefits of single payor. Nonetheless, both were a big step up from the current situation assuming they were done right. Done wrong, the mandates could make them into a nightmare.

By: ACitizen

ACitizen — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 05:05:22 +0000

This is no longer self-evident. If it was we’d be pumping oil from Iraq among a whole lot of other things. Eventually the Darwinian imperative will overcome any barrier but meanwhile enjoy the dot.com bubble, the housing bubble, the commodities bubble as small groups securitise, finacialise and just, in general, loot their way to enormous fortunes while government’s everywhere jump on the delusional and fictitious ‘Free Market’ train to no where.

Enjoy the ride.

By: BooRadley

BooRadley — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 01:50:48 +0000

Done.

Thanks for the link.

Great post Ian.

By: bertoray

bertoray — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 01:15:34 +0000

Ian Welsh, your input is sound and welcome.
That said, Watch Your Back.
Those profiting 5.3% of US GNP are incentiveized to maintain status quo. (Bushism mine).
Looking forward to your future posts.