With all the attention (rightfully) focused on the Senate hearings about how BushCo. authorized torture of detainees, I wanted to make sure this latest story in McClatchy’s detainee series didn’t get lost:
…[I]nstead of confining terrorists, Guantanamo often produced more of them by rounding up common criminals, conscripts, low-level foot soldiers and men with no allegiance to radical Islam — thus inspiring a deep hatred of the United States in them — and then housing them in cells next to radical Islamists.
In other words, they may not have been radical jihadists when they were taken prisoner, but they sure are now. Many of them were released and immediately joined al Qaeda or the Taliban, like Mohammed Naim Farouq, a small-time secular thug who became a Taliban leader and made it onto the US Defense Intelligence Agency’s 20 most wanted list for Afghanistan and Pakistan.
So not only is the Bush administration enraging and radicalizing Muslims in Iraq and everywhere else, but it is materially assisting al Qaeda and the Taliban with their recruiting and training. Brilliant!
I can think of three possible explanations for this travesty:
1) Simple incompetence. I mean, it wouldn’t be the first time. The McClatchy story does make it look like oblivious Gitmo wardens just got outmaneuvered, but with this administration it’s often hard to tell whether the incompetence is deliberate or not.
2) Butt-covering. It’s actually a brilliant strategy to make unlawful indefinite detentions look more palatable by ensuring that all the detainees are dangerous America-hating Islamist radicals rather than a bunch of innocent patsies or garden-variety criminals who were in the wrong place at the wrong time. ("We can’t release them! Every time we release someone, they join the Taliban or al Qaeda and try to MURDER YOUR FAMILY!!!")
3) Symbiosis. The Bush administration, and the GOP in general, depend on the radical Islamist boogeyman to win elections and justify all of the executive branch’s anti-Constitutional power grabs. If they don’t ensure a steady stream of terrorists, they might be forced to relinquish some of their executive powers… or the executive branch.
My money’s on 1, with maybe a little bit of 3. I just haven’t seen much to convince me that BushCo. is serious about actually fighting terrorism. Sure, Dubya loves to talk tough and blow shit up, and he’s given his minions the green light to torture and spy on whoever they want, yet al Qaeda and the Taliban are flourishing, and all the so-called "terror plots" the administration has broken up are comical. The unprecedented powers that Bush obtained through fear of terrorism are doing very little to stop it.
(h/t All-Seeing Eye Of Froomkin)
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Bin Laden’s hiding inside an Etch-a-Sketch?
Aloha, Eli!
Aloha, CTut!
Well, has anyone thought to look there?
Al Qaeda _is_ Bush’s base.
Well, I saw a helluva lot of professional grade CYOA activities taking place at the Senate Armed Forces Committee Hearing today. So I gotta suggest there might well be more than a dash of good ole Number Two in the mix as well.
They’d be nothing without him. And vice versa.
They’re certainly capable of it, I’m just not sure if they were smart enough to think of it.
I wouldn’t rule out two… I would posit that it is an argument utilized by the Rethugs already, but, I disagree with calling it a brilliant strategy and/or butt-covering…
Dang, just think what price that’s gonna fetch on eBay.
Oh, I know they’re already using that argument – I just wasn’t sure whether they were actually working to make it less dishonest.
Why would they even bother trying…? ;-)
Well, we did say one of our goals in Iraq was “training”. Guess we screwed up on who was supposed to get the training.
As al Qaeda stands up, we will stand down…
Great post, Eli. I vote for all of the above. They are incompetent butt symbionts. Probably the best description I’ve heard yet.
They made up a scary monster, more powerful than the previous incarnations of scary monsters. They needed the scary monster to scare us all back under the covers so they could get on with things that can only be done at night when no one is looking.
So they enacted the horrible stories that they made up. Al Qaeda became the government’s self-fulfilling prophecy.
Jeez, that sounds like some kind of horrible hybrid of Porky’s and Alien…
Time to Digg Osama out of the Etch-A-Sketch.
I had a conversation with a friend who’s a McCain supporter, and a Vietnam vet, who thinks Mccain is honorable. While I disagree with the basic premise – McCain is honorable (Keating five anyone?) I try to humor him and not come down like a ton of bricks.
But yesterday, we were talking and he said we have to stay in Iraq because he doesn’t want those who have died to have died in vain. As he was speaking, the flaw in his reasoning was apparent because he had never really considered because the war was predicated on a series of lies, a point he conceded, that those who were dead, mained, etc, had already been maimed and killed in vain.
So I asked him: “If the war was predicated on a lie, isn’t every lost life, lost in vain? Isn’t every life lost nothing more than a paen to a collosal lie? Are you willing to condemn more young Americans to die for nothing? Because every life, every limb , every dollar, ever piece of equipment, every civilian death, has been for NOTHING. It’s all based on a lie, and it’s all been a waste, and it’s been a waste for nothing. Because it was based on a lie.
By the time I finished my diatribe, he was in tears. I admit, I came down like a ton of bricks, but “Bill,” is one of the few who can take my ton of bricks and still love me. He had never considered the a+b=c equation of the war. He wasn’t happy we were there but believed we needed to “get out with honor.” I had poked a hole in his John McCain balloon. But as a VietVet, the specter of more lives wasted for nothing was something he wasn’t prepared to consider. I forced him to consider it, and he broke down.
Whether it makes any difference in who he votes for almost doesn’t matter. I think, as I had done many years before when discussing gay rights, I had exposed him to a way of thinking that wasn’t a part of his world until he was confronted with it.
I think, when confronted with the “We must withdraw with honor,” argument, I believe this is the argument we must use, because it’s the one that has not been considered by the 28 percenters.
Something to think about, eh?
Dugg it Eli for you….come on folks and digg this Post!
When you shake it, you hear something like sand…Mideast sand…we should have known.
Magic 8 Ball (and perhaps El Gato Negro) says: It is decidedly so.
Ruh ro. I’m new at Digging. Do you know how to merge our Diggs after the fact?
Sorry Jim but the link at the top goes to my digg
But I did digg your digg anyways!! So folks you can digg both diggs…
when the Secret Service goes to Andrews AFB to collect W from his trip abroad, they’ll be playing Fetch-a-Wretch
“but it is materially assisting al Qaeda and the Taliban with their recruiting and training” Well…yeah….they’ve been doing this since the Ruskies were in Afghanistan….OBL was CIA sponsored.
Everything was fine, until the Taliban wouldn’t let Unocal run the pipeline through Afghanistan…then oil hit the fan.
And they made a portrait of him using a Retch-A-Sketch…
Well, their mission has changed considerably. From sabotaging the Soviets to undermining the Constitution.
I wish I did. Maybe the Lurkingmod can do something for us???? We do want to support the site!!
Bush/Saudis/Oil…period, end of story.
retort in search of an embodiment: Quench-a-Wench
notice they are starting the terror warnings up again for the campaign season, they even have the local news trying to get some good fear going, what dicks
Definitely, but I think they’ve planned that all along…just look at Cheney’s minority report from years ago on power grab during Watergate. It is all connected.
Watergate…or Iran Contra…so many scandals, so little time….
What else have they got? Immigration, gays, OMG Obama’s a black dude – that’s pretty much their entire remaining toolkit.
I haven’t heard any…what are they saying now….yawn.
If W were saerious about terrorism, fully & quickly implementing Nunn-Lugar would have been on the top of the list.
YES. That, and not letting corporate interests stymie plant and port security.
I still can’t believe Kerry only brought that up *once* in the entire ‘04 campaign (in one of the debates).
Excellent job, TG! A very simple argument not heard often enough…!
If W were serious about terrorism, I would not have been able to cross over back and forth with my friends partying into Mexico in 2006 with nothing more than a wink and a nod….however, when one flys…well, then off come the shoes and out comes the wand….bugga, bugga…
Watergate on CSPAN3 now.
Thanks!
This is one mudslinging link the desperate local AR, GOPer trolls were slinging yesterday.
Looks like it’s from 1994.
Not surprised that it’s not being discussed now.
Maybe it might inspire the critters to actually impeach Shrub/Darth… Particularly, when they compare the piddly charges that Nixon was about to face, and, the seriousness of the charges of this Maladministration…
Ugh. As I understand it, Countrywide gave *all* its VIP customers preferential treatment.
Ya think?
: )
Who hid Osama in the Etch-A-Sketch?
Nope…I think W and Darth could take a person off the street and slice and dice ‘em in public, claim it was for national security…and walk off into the sunset.
Seriously. It is one of the greatest complex crimes ever committed and they will get away with it with the complicity of the wimps in Congress.
they not only fabricate these boogymen, they make certain they create new ones in case the fake boogie men lose their effectiveness
I don’t know if you caught this or if it was mentioned here, I just read it over at think progress and it is what I’ve been talking about forver, it is ICELAND;
BINGO!
They learned their lessons from Watergate. Any mistakes made then won’t be repeated today. Start with the Judiciary. Add the media. Mission accomplished.
This is my fundamental problem with the impeachment process. It may have the trappings of a legal process, but it is 100% political. If impeachment was via an impartial jury rather than congresscritters worried about party loyalties and political calculations, Bush & Cheney would have been convicted ten, a hundred times over.
The first place I’d lokk for Binladen is Crawford Texas.
Doesn’t surprise me in the slightest.
(Iceland?)
Word.
Ya wasn’t he at the last BBQ the week before??
spell check turned my misspelled “excellant” into “iceland” and I didn’t catch it
That is sooooo true. Ding, ding, ding.
Grrrrrr….gnashing…
That’s a mighty creative spellcheck you have there.
I hate it when then that happens:>(
Bwahahahaha…I was thinking they were gonna say AQ was in Iceland next….heh. Love it.
(I wonder how many people would have gone to see “Bill & Ted’s Iceland Adventure”…)
I was thinking maybe we were rendering prisoners there to torture them with cold.
707
No! AQ is in the Gulf of Mexico! Have to drill to get them tho.
Anyone else catch Kinky invoking Hitler on Abram’s? I had only stepped out to the garage for a ciggie after dinner and missed the context.
That would make me squeal like a pig! *g*
spell check this see what yours comes up with;
…Before China does.
What is this… “spellcheck” of which you speak?
It is the War on Icelandofascist Terrorists….
Run Away….and I spit in your general direction….fetchez la vache…
I think it is related to “preview”.
spell check for internet explorer
it is free, and “iceland” too
Perris. We don’t have Spellcheck anymore…. :)
Iceland was the first choice, excellent was second.
Spew!
Great, now I’m out of wine… off to refuel.
nope
it’s a free program, I just posted the link, you install it, then right click on the field you want to spell check and choose “spellcheck” (go figure) and it does the work
you can add words too, nice little program
I spit a ram’s eye at yooooo….(they like to eat ram’s eyes in Iceland, and they live in igloos and worship Thor and the midnight sun)….Heh, heh.
I wouldn’t mind going to Iceland at all.
8)
damn reds.
see my 74
Iceland is free? Do you mean trips to Iceland, or the whole country?
And let’s not forget the Military Industrial Complex that Eisenhower warned us about.
Gitmo… factory for radicalizing sloppily collected enemies and others and ensuring enemies, homicides, suicides, the psychologically crippled … more PTSD … PTSD for everyone with this administration.
Thank you, Eli. Deep and painful to read post.
They have meesiles in Iceland that can hit the US of A in 45 minutes…oh wait…that would be measles…nevermind.
I mean the program is free, excellant as well however my new word for excellant from hence and forward will likely be “iceland” whenever I see you are on the board!
nahant, it’s good to see you are on duty with the Digging
the rest of you folks, please Digg this post!
Iceland.
So is the Countrywide VIP for senators brew-ha-ha the proverbial horse’s head in the bed? Vote the way we want on FISA or there’s more in store?
“most Iceland, dude. party on.”
With, but not within.
laughed out loud in this diner, they are looking at me like I am a mad man
LOL
I’m by myself, and my dogs think I’m nuts…I’m LMAO…
I needed a good laugh. It was Iceland. Thanks.
The thing is…I believed what I read, and started to wonder…WTF…Iceland? Now what?
a very icelandic adventure!
I thought the topic was Iseman not Iceland.
On Ice in Iceland. Terrorizing blondes!
Rough drafting in Word works like that, too.
We’ll always have Iceland.
(Wait a minute, what about global warming?)
Was she vaporized?
Greenland?
McCane scanned a Navy Ann
I see the administration’s grotesque arrested development… pathological narcissists and sociopaths.. and group think wannabees… playing toy soldiers with human lives…. on an exponential level.
and with their big Pentagon toys and weaponry… what is that quote. When all you use is a hammer, you see everything as a nail. (have to google search the correct saying…)
OT – a couple of hearings scheduled for tomorrow:
Bwhahaha
Update from the previous thread: the total is now almost $127,000. That means we have raised nearly $42,000 today to hold feet to the fire. Way to go, folks!
Yeah, something like, “When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.”
”two most iceland foxes!!”–two wild and crazy guys
Dunno, never hear about her on the media anymore.
Woot!!!
Thanks selise.
Looking ahead, do you know what time Scottie will be on Friday?
Just want to know when to pop the corn.
Vicki, we hardly knew ye.
Well except for McCain maybe.
If there was no there there, wouldn’t she still just be carrying on…oh yeah…
you know what?
we need to let these people know where that money is going to be spent if they give telecom imunity
Of course, if McCain were a Democrat, we’d be hearing her name every day…
Don’t go biblical on us, now.
Oh definitely…
McCain: Get that other *unt trollop the hell out of sight….now!!! Grrrr…
Let’s hope that the plea goes out to the ACLU list tomorrow. We need to go much wider than just the small group of blogs that have been giving to all of our pet causes. We need to make this BIG. A little plug from the MoveOn 3mil+ list would be good too.
Famous words of semi-literate Viking explorer upon discovering Iceland:
“I’s landed in colder places than this…”
Some noise from Obama would be nice too…
go ig-Nor-dick?
This certainly has a snowball effect with this administration with a lazy-assed and corporate-owned MSM … and a cowardly and/or bought Congress.
I keep thinking of those damn trailers after Katrina wondering why they weren’t being used when they were there… and how long did it take to let people use them.. and BTW.. they are dangerous to one’s health….
Is LooHoo around? KO is making Congressman Issa one of the WPIW.
sure would. Gee, what would it look like to have a leader who actually, uh, leads?
It’s been so so long.
Yep, and in his Update III, Glenn notes that even the Pauliacs are joining in. They can really raise the big bucks!
The boat included a Bush ancestor who said “Is our children shivering?”
Heck, we’d be impeaching him! Even before he was elected!
I’ve always thought it really telling that Al Qaeda means…”The Base”….I mean honestly how obvious is that….You think the Saudis would invent a title for a movement called “The Base”…in Arabic….come on…
Remember W talking about the haves and the have mores as being what he calls, his “base”…
It is so obvious….Wco invented AQ.
WIPW = White Punks in Washington?
I was having a Tubes moment. :D
A little formaldehyde won’t hurt.
I mean they use it to embalm you don’t they so it can’t hurt you/S
Hey, if pre-emptive war is a doctrine, I don’t see why pre-emptive impeachment can’t be too.
Ha!
That’s what’s needed…
tonight, I have called Obama’s Senate office and left a message that he should be exercising leadership on this, I have called Steny’s office and registered a complaint about the “compromise,” and I have given money to hold Bush Dogs accountable.
what’s the next step?
STUNNUNG!!!
Haditha charges dropped against top Marine officer By Dan Whitcomb
2 hours, 32 minutes ago
LOS ANGELES (Reuters) – A military judge on Tuesday dismissed the case against the highest-ranking U.S. Marine charged in the killing of 24 Iraqi civilians at Haditha, whittling down the list of those who must still face justice for the 2005 incident to just the accused ringleader.
ADVERTISEMENT
Military Judge Col. Steven Folsom dropped all charges against Lt. Col. Jeffrey Chessani, who was accused of violating a lawful order and dereliction of duty, at a hearing at the Camp Pendleton Marine base in Southern California.
Folsom’s decision means that, out of eight Marines originally charged in December 2006, six have won dismissals of their charges and one has been cleared at court martial.
The accused ringleader, Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich, still faces court martial. The proceedings against him, however, have been put on hold pending the appeal of a pretrial ruling.
Folsom threw out the charges against Chessani, a 44-year-old Colorado native, after finding that a four-star general who oversaw the case could have been influenced by an investigator who later became his adviser.
The judge ruled that military prosecutors could refile the case but it was not immediately clear if they would do so. The prosecution could also appeal his ruling
Thanks, I saw that!
I bet Barbara Bush would see it as a step up for “those” people….
any excuse at all not to hold anyone accountable for anything…
including murder.
If not now, when? Otherwise, it will be too late when he takes office.
If she bothered to trouble her dirty little mind.
i usually do a weekly list of hearings (generally by monday night). there are about a hundred hearings on this week’s list. i just post a very few of them – guessing what folks here might be interested in.
click on my name for the complete list (with helpful links, etc)
Really, everything is surreal with these guys in power…am I awake? Am I having an LSD flashback? WTF????
Thank you so much selise! Looks like I’m having popcorn for breakfast. : )
Hey, it’s about time. I’ve been waiting on that flashback for about 30 years now.
Thanks so much Selise for all of that information. I can’t wait to listen to McClellan.
BTW, those who didn’t watch the interrogation hearings today…they are on right now on CSPAN 2.
I think I am a flashback….Ahhhhhhggggg
There’s a sentence I never thought I’d see.
OT–gotta tell you… hearing about what is going on in Zimbabwe…. such advanced and diabolical and massive oppression and yet people are being so BRAVE … to struggle to save fair election despite death and dire punishment… I think we citizens ought to take notes… and take heed… be an activist now, cuz babies this slippery slope is moving us fast.
((((mwah!))))
Hahahaha…right…I bet he’ll say all the same stuff he’s been saying….thing is…the hearing is not a book tour gig…I hope he gets that…
Dayem…or is it???
Yeah, I think he gets that, although I still half expect him to answer every question by saying that he’s already addressed it in the book…
Well said.
I like to think, albeit hopefully, that it is “they” that are on the slippery slope….
I wonder how many noncombatant Iraqis have been killed or imprisoned as a result of the assumption that anyone living near the site of an IED (improvised explosive device) detonation must have directly participated in or must have had specific knowledge of the the IED’s placement. How may bomb-planters would plant an IED in their own block?
He’s extremely well-rehearsed…no interviewer has pierced him so far really…It’s going to take a really tricky, twisty questioning to get something new out of him…he’s pretty savvy, and he knows what’s up.
My “pipedream” is that he would bust it out with a real bomb of information, under the cover of…I was under oath. Not likely, though. But one can hope for a crumb of truth.
Interesting question.
ELI.. Nailed it… googled..
By Abraham Maslow in “Psychology of Science”
“I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail.”
Tom Lasseter/McClatchy deserves an award for this series, imho.
I received the following e-mail from the ACLU today:
Dear ACLU Supporter,
A sham spying “compromise” similar to the one we warned you about last week could be rammed through both the Senate and House this week. It’s moving that fast.
Will you write today and let your elected officials know Americans want them to stand up for our privacy?
In a proposal that makes a mockery of the rule of law, telecom companies that broke the law by supplying mountains of personal information to the government without a warrant will be let off the hook.1
Here’s what Senators Feingold and Dodd had to say about Senator Bond’s proposal, which is very similar to what we expect in the coming days:
… under the Bond proposal, the result of the FISA Court’s evaluation would be predetermined… the FISA court would be required to grant immunity.2
Tell your members of Congress to reject a sham immunity “compromise.”
There’s a deeply disturbing premise behind this dangerous FISA legislation: The president simply had to claim his request was legal for immunity to be granted to telecom companies that illegally handed over personal information.
No matter how illegal, offensive or intrusive a company’s invasion of your privacy has been, it won’t make a difference, because if the president gave the company a note claiming their behavior was legal, they’re completely off the hook.
Congress needs to reject this sham for what it is and insist on real accountability for telecommunications companies that broke the law.
Tell your members of Congress you demand accountability, not immunity!
Throughout the extended FISA debate, you and the ACLU have worked tirelessly to protect personal privacy and the rule of law. Together, we’ve given the Bush administration a run for their money, defeating a number of freedom-stealing proposals. Don’t let Congress cave in now.
Thanks for all you do in defense of freedom.
Sincerely,
Caroline Fredrickson, Director
ACLU Washington Legislative Office
1 FISA Deal Close; Votes Could Be This Week, Roll Call, June 16, 2008. (Subscription required)
2 Letter from Senators Russell and Dodd to Senators Reid, Leahy, John Rockefeller and Representatives Pelosi, Hoyer, Conyers and Reyes, June 10, 2008.
————————————————————————–
Now, if they only would urge their members to contribute to the accountability fund….
Among other things.
That psychopathic power of profiteering at the expense of human welfare makes unsteepening our slope profoundly challenging.
Is the world made up of psychopaths and ostriches and heros? Pick your category. 3 groups. People who make things happen. People who watch things happen. People who ask, “WTF happened?”
What is a “non-combatant Iraqi”????
Who uses a word like “trollop” these days? What’s the matter with that guy?
:-)
One who gets shot at but doesn’t shoot back?
My 161 was for you.. oops.
Going to stay up and use my toll free number to call Congress about FISA. Thanks for the inspiration.
the same folks that use the term, ‘whitey’ *g*
4.7 million displaced Iraqis… staggering number
So Eli, have we been good little boys and girls and stayed on topic? Except for Iceland, Iseman, and Issa?
But…but…it’s for democracy…freedom…
Spit.
“Superman” came to save the day…yeah, right. And the bear is Catholic.
Very funny that hammer, Here are toll free numbers for activist
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
Well, in McCain’s defense, it was back in 1992; perhaps Arizonans talked that way then?
American karma…. our tax dollars… want to reverse the karma, too… we’re all on that damn continuum of enablers thanks to the psychos at the top.
The what now?
You are one of the sharper tools in our shed.
Hi BB!!! You are the best.. I was about to go dig out my one number and post. Will jot down the others. :)
Hit reply to sender and make that request yourself.
Teddy Late Nite upstairs!
Late Nite FDL: Wag The Bush
Wow… thanks! The feeling is mutual. Sometimes I feel like a perpetual newbie here… trying to catch up. As a little kid the game I hated most was “musical chairs” … and when I started trying to keep up with the sharpies here… feeling very slow witted in the wise-ass department especially and with bitter theories but not always current with events .. I felt like I was playing that clamoring game that frightened me as a kid and I always gave up with … But I am grateful and addicted to FDL … and grateful for you and other sibling comrades in consciousness!!!
Nice article about Michelle in the Times.
Well I believe Al Qaeda is an invention.