((((((JANE))))))

Followed by a good morning and a Jus cogens!

hiya jane. Hi y’all.
What did bill Clinton say?

(((Lady Jane)))

Good morning, all.

Cassie, it’s so nice to see a young revolutionary here.

Bill was complaining about a Vanity Fair article that said he was messing around again.

How was the wedding?

Take a listen.

Says the Vanity Fair reporter is “slimy”, “dishonest”, and a “scumbag”.

Lindsey Graham hair looks like a 5 year did his hair….

thanx. No revolution yet though.

wedding was good. Lotsa fun.

So Bill is blaming the Press why? The Vanity fair article was mean it might be true but I wouldn’t back away from yelling about something like that.
However it is Bill’s life and if he is embarrassed about what he said in confidence, to a complete stranger, in a crowd of people, with no expectation of privacy well then he should watch what he says Bill knows that the GOP and Fox both would send people to trap him.
But I am more concerned with MSM tools saying this hurts them doing their jobs.
I’ll respect the MSM Press more when Judy Miller is forced to give back her pulitzer.

The NYT is having a session tomorrow where you can ask a reader’s representative your opnion of unnamed sources. I sent them a link to the piece I wrote for the L.A. Weekly in 2004 in which I declared they should not be permitted under any circumstances.

can’t hear from the phone. Will try when I get back to a real computer.

You’re living it and actively engaging in it. Revolution is defined as activity with a goal of making fundamental change to the current socioeconomic situation. We are all revolutionaries here but we label ourselves differently because most equate revolution with violence. A revolutionary is the opposite of a reactionary. Obama is a revolutionary while McBu’ush is a reactionary.

Here’s some work from a citizen pundit in Phoenix:

http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..nator.html

He’s been doing this quite a bit lately – enough to where it’s possible he’s now the most widely-read pundit in the city (ah, the magic of traffic…)

We need more like him.

oldie but goodie: amy goodman interviews bill clinton on election day 2000

Fowler’s success points out the basic flaw behind the idea that journalists seeking news must cuddle up to and be wined and dined by their sources. That’s not journalism, that’s star-bleeping.

I thought that a direct quote on tape without the use of trick or leading questions was a Primary Source. Which is a good thing right. What are the rules for using off the record sources I think Pumpkinhead Timmy is wrong about everything being off the record unless the source says its ok.

Every time someone tries to show a big spotlight on the traditional media… from Scotties criticism, Elisabeth Edwards taking about how uneven the media time to HRC vast right wing conspiracy …

It is deny, not report it, say “Who US?” and just belittle them…..

“First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win.”…. we must in the fight you stage…..

Not if Timmeh is your priest, then it is OK.

Otherwise it is sick and wrong.

bill clinton to amy goodman (from interview link above):

You have asked questions in a hostile, combative, and even disrespectful tone

Too bad Amy couldn’t say, “Kiss my ass, Bubba.” The only reason she couldn’t say it was cuz she’ got too much class.

timmeh is old and corrupt. You could learn from “wrong”!

Hi scarlet p.
Got nabbed on my first parkway posting, but got off with a warning.
Note to self: don’t be cheap, bungies not string. keep it up bro and kudos to McSlog and all for their efforts. Peace,
bluejeansntshirt

What are the rules if any of Journalistic ethics and reporting a story Lou Dobbs is still on the air after saying immigrants were spreading Leprosy, Judy Miller still has her Pulitizer, Friedman keeps talking about another 6 months in Iraq, lying, stenography without another confirming source, and just being wrong over and over again.
Where is the accountability?

I am not a professional journalist, so I don’t know how much weight the Code of Ethics of the Society of Professional Journalists has. While it nowhere says that journalists have an obligation to identify themselves as such, it does say the following:

Avoid undercover or other surreptitious methods of gathering information except when traditional open methods will not yield information vital to the public. Use of such methods should be explained as part of the story

http://www.spj.org/ethicscode.asp

It is not clear to me whether failing to identify oneself as a journalist when having a discussion with a public figure in a public venue could be considered “surreptitious”.

Anybody know if this code has any weight at all in the profession? I just found it on the Web, so for all I know it is just some wackaloon bullshit.

oh my word! he must finally have gotten the message that she didn’t grab the title after all. keep him outta the bigwhitehouse. he might steal all the “O”s.

Bill, fgs, GROW UP! You can handle it. Watch Hillary. You’re one of the fans now. NOT the star. Remember?!

suggest he go to his room and sulk outta sight until he can behave like a man.

lol, sounds like bill has been enveloped by the bush bubble.

That isn’t investigative journalism, that’s stenography.

i don’t think what Mayhill Fowler is doing is investigative journalism either… more closely related to infotainment.

really – the most important question to ask bill clinton is what he thought of that vanity fair article? i call bullshit on that and recommend giving a listen to amy goodman’s interview of bill clinton from 2000. that’s the real thing.

Been to jail for justice?

and that’s from seven and a half years ago!

guess what y’all! I think grandma is hooked on the lake!!!!

be that as it may… perchance the gentleman should no longer strut around crowing in public et lib.

hint: hush billy. just hush. regular people don’t tell stuff they don’t want other people to hear.

gentleman. . .sheeeeeeet

yep. imo, amy goodman is the best.

I am not a professional journalist, so I don’t know how much weight the Code of Ethics of the Society of Professional Journalists has.

The Code is given out to all working journalists along with a decoder ring and instructions on how to perform the secret handshake. The Code has been especially effective during the Bush Administration because it gave journalists the leeway they needed to totally ignore that this has been the worst President and Presidency in our history.

Got the little family together to watch 3 little pigs vide just now. loved it.

funny u should say that, Dragon. I was just sitting here smiling at the thought of Cassie being representative of the “wired generation”. I think Obama will inspire a lot more, so pretty soon she’ll have lotsa company.

Hi Cassie. You DO make me smile. You’re a very special gal. I hope you’re doing well these days. Been awhile since we had a chance to say “Hi!” *waves*

Got nabbed?!?!

What law were you accused of breaking? I think people have successfully beaten charges for “freewayblogging”…

(if I’m wrong, you might not want to tell me, it could cause Mrs. Gumby to restrict my weekend activities)

Roger that.

Have to agree with Raven, as well. Bubba wouldn’t make a pimple on a gentelman’s ass.

Hi SD,
Great song, thanks. I’ve seen some of your pics (demonstrating) from a while back. Hope to meet someday, hopefully not in the pokey. ;-)

that Bill doesn’t gt that anthing he says in public is essentially on the record and will be shared over the internet shows how much he’s stuck in the last century.

there is no expectation of anonymity anymore. this is a big change and will take time for us to understand all the implications thereof … Rodney King, Bill Clinton, and Eliot Spitzer all illustrate different aspects of that.

thanks adie

lolz!

Why is Bill worried about people knowing he does not like the Vanity Fair article? Why blame the press on this one he gave a direct quote. The Vanity Fair article on the other hand used all off the record sources.

That’s some great ink you got in the Times, Jane.

Poor Widdle Jonathan Alter. Widing in the Waaahhhmbulance, so enverating has his “job” become. Cry me a tsunami, bro’.

welllll, compare the scoundrel with ANY pugnican. Go ahead.

I rest my case.

just ticklin’ yer nose, Raven. Hope you’re doing well. Gawd, I grew up in one-a those old houses with no insulation. Did you say u have heat pump? Sure hope so. We didn’t, and it was awful summer AND winter…

just checked in w/ my sweetie, former journalist by training and profession, who was a member of spj. she said “of course you have to tell people you’re a journalist”. fwiw …

politics of personality?

The officer said I could be summonsed for posting signs on city property.
Heh, a summons. Ignored them before.

grandma said I should ask if any of the front pagers here are trained journalists.

so-o-o, when did the current crop of faux-journalists ever notice there are rules to follow? did i miss something?

Oh yea, we’re all modern. When we bought it 9 years ago be gutted it, new hvac, wiring, insulated ceiling. . .have to keep the wofffers comfy!

Gotta go hang up da laundry. brb

besides the secret decoder ring, secret handshake, etc…. what exactly is a journalist? is there actually such a thing, or is journalism something people do not something they are? or am i hopelessly confused as usual?

serious question.

Here it is…

Sort of legal, I thought I had seen it somewhere. I think where I live, the sign is not to be visible from the interstate.

Definitely stick with the bungee’s, fast, efficient. Thanks to trade conditions, you can get a pack of 2-4 for a dollar at the dollar store. Good flags too, only a dollar. If you have an American flag on yer sign, it’s damn near UNPATRIOTIC for someone to take it down… …at least that’s what I hope they will think.

“there is no expectation of anonymity anymore”
_______

That’s what Bu’ush’s Deputry Director of National Intelligence said publicly last fall. That Americans were gonna have to “re-think their notions of privacy.”

What he meant, of course, was that we would now just have to learn to live with government and their crony corporate surrogates spying on every aspect of our formerly private lives absent any restraint or oversight, in this Anthropoweenie Era of Perpetual Code Brown.

Before we go completely off on the MSM, I would note that the blogosphere and fdl are not free from bias. On June 3 when Obama wrapped up the nomination there was no thread congratulating him on his victory or exploring its historical ramifications. The next day on June 4 there was only one post (by scarecrow) which briefly described both Clinton’s and Obama’s runs as historic. By contrast, yesterday when Clinton withdrew there were 3 threads dedicated to her.

Kassie, David Neiwart is. Which would explain why he’s the editor or whatever that job is that Jane gave him.

He’s not just a journalist, he’s an award winning journalist.

Definitely best to minimize time spent actually posting. String/Zipties: one minute plus. Bungees/Duct-tape: ten seconds. It’s also easy enough to find spots that are absolutely invisible from anyplace except the freeways, like this:

http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..-easy.html

once you realize that Anyplace Within Sight of Traffic is fair game, you can go for a hundred years without getting caught.

I believe Dave Neiwert is but that he may be the only one.

Which is a good thing as there are fewer pre-conceived notions to break through.

It’s not that being a trained journalist is bad (my sister is a retired reporter but she “trained” as an English major); it’s that so many of the current national “journalists” have either forgotten their training or decided it’s irrelevant and gets in their way of sucking up for access to the Kewl Kidz.

Uhhh…someone who writes in a journal?

;)

OMG, don’t get that can of worms open again!

Excellent point BobbyG!

Fair and Balanced!

I’ve heard that somewhere…

I see no reason to go after the press for saying Bill didn’t like the article. Cause well if it were me I would be telling everyone I thought the article stunk especially if it were true. I think Bill is just lashing out at everyone now I don’t think he is acting with a plan. Personal Ego has gotten bigger than the Politics I think.
Still the Press could ask him better questions like why does he think Hilary lost would be an interesting one provided he could look at the question honestly without hurt.

The Good Worthy was making public statements for public dissemination at a public event.

He is now complaining, sort of, about form rather than function. He is accustomed to boom mikes pointed at him from every angle at public events; and had it been recorded by a person with a press “credential” hanging from their neck, even if they were 25 feet away and not visible to the former Pres, we would not be hearing any of this.

This is a case of a public figure making excuses in an attempt to hit the “un-send” button to a statement he now wishes he did not say and wishes was not quoted. Happens all the time. One approach is to focus on the person engaged in journalism in an attempt to distract news consumers from the person making the news.

sláinte,
cl

isn’t bias part of being human? that the best we can do is to try to recognize it and to the best of our abilities honestly own up to it?

selise, seems like a lot of the professions are outgrowths of trade guilds and have an important function in controlling the market and who can participate. MDs, lawyers, prof engs prime examples. Journalism looks like a profession with porous borders, esp’ly once the internet and blogs enter the picture. same thing w/ publishers (closer to home professional base for me): what’s the value of the imprint.

so, yeah, of course, one’s skills, esp’ly those contributing to livelihood, are something you do, regardelss of what the skills are. imho.

Raven! Guess what, bro’? I found a VHS dub I’d made long ago of “84 Charlie Mopic,” out in the garage! oh, YEAH!

“…I’m so short I could parachute off a dime…I’m so short you gotta dig a hole to kick my ass…25 and a wake up…my shit is gettin’ flaky…”

What a great flick.

what exactly is a journalist? is there actually such a thing, or is journalism something people do not something they are?

There are schools of journalism that grant degrees in journalism, academic journals that publish research in journalism, professional societies of journalists, and awards-granting entities that laud people for their journalistic exploits.

Based on all of that, and the fact that journalists present themselves as members of a profession, I think it is reasonable to consider journalism as a profession, and thus something its practitioners are.

On a related note, it is clear that the Framers and Founders considered the Press as playing a unique and essential role in our constitutional republic. This is a role that the vast majority of mainstream journalists have recently been completely utterly deficient at fulfilling.

The simple fact is… Journalism and news gathering in this day and age… suck. Most journos are of a pack mentality and heavily into “gotcha” questions. It’s not just Bill Clinton, but the grieving widow who’s spouse just got crushed by a tractor trailer on I-71, or the proverbial “man on the street” who is supposed to represent each and every demographic and is asked profound and deep questions (”Did you ever get a $400.00 haircut?”.

All journalism in this country is profit-based. Therefore, it will always be inferior and without journalistic standards. The borrom line must be served. Shareholder equity is sacrosant.

I had hoped that the “citizen-journalists” you refer to would open up an avenue of professionalism. I thought that the internet would allow people to independently research and develop stories and ideas. And that some of those stories would be of a fresh angle that might make people stop and think.

But, sad to say, that clearly han’t happened. It’s much easier to ask Bill who he’s banging than try and elicit an opinion about something that actually has an impact on our lives.

We called it soup

Bill Clinton’s upset because now the whole world knows he hit on Gina Gershon and she turned him down.

this conversation is over

There’s a good post up over at the Orange Satan givng exerpts from Dan Rather’s speech yesterday in Minneapolis. Rather says what we all have known for a long time. That the news business is a small part of corporations that have a lot of regulatory issues with the Feds, and can’t afford to take chances antagonizing them by doing risky news. It’s as simple as awful as that. The genius of Rove was to exploit that vulnerability to the limit.

It would be folly to suppose that it will end with a new administration. In fact, until laws are passed to break up some of these corporations, or at least break off the news part, Obama would be well advised to sending a couple of warning shots over the bows of GE, Disney and Viacom (NBC, ABC and CBS, respectively) to the effect that any shit like what they threw down on the Clintons will cost them big time in the more profitable parts of their business.

John Kenneth Galbraith had a phrase for it: countervailing power.

Even your trash hauler is now “an environmental professional.”

Yeah, that line was priceless.

“Let me stick it in your ear so you can hear me “comin’”…”

there’s a big difference between anonymity and privacy — pre info age, they used to be almost the same thing. but aren’t anymore. Privacy we do need to protect. anonymity is mostly out of the bag, although look at the number of anonymous identities here (including frontpagers and ourselves). gov’t spy agencies are violating privacy. Bill Clinton speaking in public did not have privacy enfringed on.

thank god the rest of the lakers have no idea what we are talking about. . .unless the dragon is done hangin laundry!

There’s just something about fast drying ceiling white on cardboard.
Smells like Freedom to me.

gtg talk to people IN the car. Bye.

I’m so short I don’t have time to start a conversation.

I really don’t think anyone is 100% free of bias we all try.

damn, must been under water breathin through a reed

Bill Moyers on Media Reform and Internet freedom.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0r71L7cojE

I’m so short I don’t have to open the door to go out.

LOL. Carry big brown straws now. Don’t taste as nasty.

Rather than the feared “Show Meee Your Papez, Pleeze, Herr Citizen” neo-nazi Amerika wherein officials will rudely accost anyone at will in public, the TIA types are working hard at making it all techno-surreptitious, using biometrics, GPS tracking, facial and gait recognition, etc.

They’re making progress, quietly.

There are schools of journalism that grant degrees in journalism, academic journals that publish research in journalism, professional societies of journalists, and awards-granting entities that laud people for their journalistic exploits.

Based on all of that, and the fact that journalists present themselves as members of a profession, I think it is reasonable to consider journalism as a profession, and thus something its practitioners are.

Couldn’t much the same be said about Trekkies? Indeed aren’t Trekkies even more of a profession because they wear distinctive uniforms?

“If I have to point my weapon at you again, I’ll pull the trigger.”

correct me if i’m wrong. Obama is a big boy now and has amazing patience and savvy. He, and we all, well, mostly, know it’s better to land a plane smoothly without undue turbulance, especially while there’s a significant crowd of people running in circles, spears in hand, screaming.

As an Obama supporter, I am patient. He, and we, knew there would be crosswinds to contend with. Let’s get people in their seats, lap trays folded away, spears stored in the overhead compartments and with corks on their tips, and when the faces stop looking quite so flushed…

Still,um, Jane? …. *wag wag wag, cookie still balanced on nose*

“Show Meee Your Papez, Pleeze, Herr Citizen”

Awww, man, all’s I got’s a pipe.

“Damn, LT, you can’t even kill a man right.”

The Vaudeville Media doesn’t like the fact that people now realize their shtick is old hat.

The digital media is showing them the door.

-G

LT’s got the quickstep

is bias a problem or is it the pretense of objectivity where there is none? like the faux objectivity of “fair and balanced”

so long as bias is addressed honestly and not denied need it be a problem?

[insert number here} an’ a hook.

I guess I wouldn’t necessarily call him a boy but I get your drift.

Aw, shit, I gotta waste this Lucky to get these damn leeches off.

By the way, in what may be a sign of the times, the Texas Governor’s mansion has burnt up.

-G

BTW, has everyone seen the new Gooper campaign logo?

Linky, please. Karma.

Hey, where do they get these announcers for the Euro Cup, they sound like a bunch of foreigners!

From last night. Very cool.

pick ah link plink

Better than a “steel” leader.

The problem with John McCain is that his idea of a jobs program is war with Iran.

BTW:

U.S. troops increasingly using antidepressants

For the first time in history, a sizable and growing number of U.S. combat troops are taking daily doses of antidepressants to calm nerves strained by repeated and lengthy tours in Iraq and Afghanistan, time.com reports

Jeeez…

Awwwwwwwwwww. *g*

No and I think we address it often here which is good.

The neo-con version of the New Deal.

It sheems ma world is collapshing around ma feet. At leasht ah got Barney and Pickles.

-G.W. Noodle Nuts

not so much in the last few months. at least to me it has felt more like the battle of competing narratives.

And Barney is mic’d (by Cheney).

The LA Times did a stroy just yesterday on Fowler.

These are gonna be some fucked up folks by the time they get out of the service. I wonder how well SECDEF Gates sleeps at night. He seems like he’s trying to blunt some of the Bu’ush/Cheney disaster but this has got to bother him.

http://www.kxan.com/global/story.asp?s=8447664

Now they’ll be able to spend millions of taxpayer dollars to build a brand new spiffy mansion for the gov. Gonna make some developer happy. But that’s what the Rethugs are all about. Prolly burned it down themselves and will blame an electrical problem or some such. Either that or blame some poor guy like the Nazis did with the Reichstag.

oh me. *sigh* let’s not re-open that can either, ‘kay?

I trust the man to have good judgement.

I’d guess he probably doesn’t give a lot of thanks to Poppy for pushing him into this mess.

That would be “prescription” anti-depressants!

thanks for that amy goodman link, selise. interesting to see the big guy in retrospective …

who’s not?

I think there’s some grey area here. To me, the recording was okay in both instances because there were other people around. If there weren’t, it might not be. Aren’t there laws about recording someone without telling them? Or is that just on the phone? Would it be okay for Linda Tripp to record Monica Lewinsky, put it on the internet and call it news? There’s no doubt it was news. And Linda Tripp could have immunized herself by calling herself a citizen journalist. I realize I’m takng this to an extreme.

Yeah, I don’t think he’ll include this in his “My Finest Hours” chapter in his bio.

southern at 119–they were already spending 10 million to renovate it…..guess someone left the heat gun on stripping wallpaper……..

from tw3’s link page, an article about the renovations of texas gov’s mansion from last august…..
http://www.statesman.com/news/…..ymove.html

so THAT’s where the e-mails were stored.

See, it’s the “Euro” Cup so I thought I’d be real funny and axe . . .well you get it.

It’s taxpayer money, so I don’t think they’re crying over the amount they’d already spent. The contractors got paid so we’re cool.

No, but the comment threads are as free from bias, as your comment so eloquently confirms, as respectful commenters make them. You can congratulate Obama as often as you want.

I also haven’t seen any threads bashing Obama for the fact that he has not been as liberal a candidate as most here would like. I’m a big tent type and I support that “bias,” very strongly.

The attention to HRC is completely warranted. No one was 100% sure when she would endorse Obama and if she would do it enthusiastically. That was and will continue to be very relevant political news.

There is a lot of pluralism within this community on a lot of topics. Posting on topics which do not inflame disagreements we all know already exist, (and which debate at this time appears unlikely to change) seems like a pretty good idea. What separates this community from the legacy media are the comment threads. You and I can express our opinions in a respectful way.

In a number of states it is illegal to record phone conversations unless both sides of the conversation are aware and in agreement that it’s OK. Other states, only one person needs to give permission so it varies.

These recordings by Fowler were done in a public place where there should be no anticipation of them being off the record and private.

Maybe the contractors didn’t get paid…

Personal conversations as opposed to crowds have some expectation of privacy but if Linda Tripp is holding a tape recorder.

Inquiring minds want to know.

What separates this community from the legacy media are the comment threads. You and I can express our opinions in a respectful way.

Should have read:

One of many differences between this community and the legacy media are the FDL comment threads. You and I can express our opinions in a respectful way and receive respectful, uncensored feedback on our positions.

I am always surprised by folks who want to tell Jane and Christy that they “should” write posts on something. Would you go into someone’s home and turn your nose up at the refreshments and demand they make you something else, more to your liking?

Chirsty said the emails on this were especially nasty.

I notice Linda has done quite well since her home went into foreclosure years ago and then was rescued by somebody. Got a face job and married some rich reich winger.

Congratulations on the h/t from emptywheel on her post, “What Happened to the Other Half Million?”

That’s pretty sad.

the issue (for me) isn’t that people have biases because everyone has them (imo, jane’s biases have been apparent since the the triple post on richardson’s endorsement of obama). i just don’t want to have to pretend something that i don’t think is true. that is all.

Dakine01, I already stated I think these instances were fine. I’m just not sure yet what general case I can make from it. I’m asking what if there hadn’t been other people around, if the circumstances had been slightly different. For instance, what if when Marcy had her conversation with Conyers at Starbucks, she’d audio recorded instead of video recorded and hadn’t told him. I don’t know if that would be okay (and I don’t think she’d do it).

Agreed. Christy said on two occasions that I saw that she voted for Obama.

Is anyone in the least bit concerned about whether FDL supports Obama? Come on.

lessee, no need EVER for /s, eh? works fer me. cept’n with petey. lawsie i kin git in trubble wit that auto-air-mattress just sitting at ma’ desk wit me hands folded. & usin’ a /s would jus’ make it woise. oy & DANG! ;->

p.s., the straw-breathin’ & leech patrol…? heh. tryin’ not to react in public. woodn’ be propuh. s’pose.

so. i be good.

tryng not to pick at certain sores … but i just want to give props to clinton yesterday for her speech. I didn’t hear it, but read transcript and was really pleased.

Oooo…this is a good one…Dengre strikes again:

“It should worry the GOP that TCS found more earmarks connected to Ring and Abramoff than were mentioned in the Albaugh plea. This is just the tip of an iceberg of corruption.

As this investigation grinds on the GOP is in trouble.

And so is John McCain.

Two of Jack’s Native American clients are on the list. Together they took in over $3.6 million in Abramoff placed earmarks in a single section of a single Appropriation Bill. This would seem to suggest that Jack Abramoff was an effective lobbyist for his clients. It would seem to suggest that he did more than just swindle them out of their money. It seems to be evidence that Abramoff used his connections to get Federal funds for his clients in return for the money they gave him.”

http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..843/532075

I read Jane’s posts on Richardson as being about Bill Richardson.

i thought that FDL was not making an endorsement. that is very different from saying that individuals do not have preferences. i thought christy was always upfront about her preferences and i appreciated that.

And thinking about it, just what kind of post would it be? A congratulatory paragraph or two and a rehashing of the ups and downs of the campaign? I can write but coming up with something that would be inspirational and at the same time congratulatory, for me, would be a hard row to hoe. Guess that’s why I’m a commenter and not a blogger.

Off to pound out those laps. . .101 and risin up in here.

great link. thanks!

Would you go into someone’s home and turn your nose up at the refreshments and demand they make you something else, more to your liking?

My mother and father both promised me many many nightmares if I ever did such a thing. Even if the refreshments/food/meal is something that I absolutely detest, I take a small amount and eat it.

I think it’s called being polite.

Keep yer ears on ya.

Exactly. And you smile and say “thank you.” If the experience is just too dreadful to contemplate again, you can politely decline the next invitation.

i didn’t see anyone, at least in this thread, saying what posts should be written.

are you saying that it’s bad manners leave a critical comment on a joe klein post?

FDL gives me a chance to be heard.

That’s really all I can ask and a lot more than I deserve considering how well informed the posters and commenters are.

I shudder to think where I was politically (and wrt understanding the media) when I stumbled onto FDL.

Posting on topics which do not inflame disagreements we all know already exist, (and which debate at this time appears unlikely to change) seems like a pretty good idea.

I am an Obama supporter in only a very generic way. I saw him from March onward as the guy who was going to win the Democratic nomination and since my priority is ending the disastrous Republican rule in Washington I saw Clinton’s continued presence in the race and her attacks on Obama as wasted time, wasted resources, and divisive. The same skepticism that I apply to the MSM I apply to all media including fdl. So when I see a fairly gaping discrepancy in coverage of the two candidates, I am going to question it. It is not exactly a secret that some of the more prominent posters at fdl trended toward Clinton while a majority of the commenters for reasons similar to mine went for Obama. I do not see at all how congratulating Obama on his win or at least acknowledging it could be construed in any way, shape, or form to be inflammatory. In the event, it was simply not done. At the same time, “inflammatory” considerations seem not to have played any role in the dedicating of multiple threads to Clinton and her concession. What I am trying to spark here is not another Obama-Clinton flame war here but rather to raise the issue of undeclared bias and lack of transparency in our part of the blogosphere.

That’s 2. Can we puleeze leave that thing in the closet?
I keep having visions of John Goodman. Oh the humanity!?!

HeheeheeheehawhawHAWHAWHAW *gulp* HAW. Haw. SMACK! owwww.

Or, as I have done a couple of times, find an opportunity to tell my host/hostess in passing that I have always hated certain foods like cheese and liver.

And it can be done later without being obnoxious about it.

Just never at the time of being served would I turn the food down and say “Ewww, I don’t like THAT!”

About frikkin’ time….

“Nearly 60 House Democrats want a special counsel created within the Justice Department to determine whether top Bush administration officials have committed crimes in authorizing the use of harsh interrogation tactics against suspected terrorists, Joby Warrick reported for the Washington Post Saturday.

In a letter to Attorney General Michael Mukasey, the lawmakers cited what they said was “mounting evidence” that senior officials personally sanctioned the use of waterboarding and other aggressive tactics against detainees in U.S.-run prisons overseas, according to the article.”

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/….._0607.html

is tommy Deelayed still in charge of their bugbustin’?

Hmmmm… It would be entertaining in the extreme to have Congress roll out a series of investigations into Repug corruption and lawlessness that marched on through November… [adding popcorn to the shopping list]

I wholeheartedly endorse Jane’s post about citizen journalism. In my opinion, that is what we have to do to get around the controlled-message media. Bill C is totally aware of whether he wants his comments to get out there or not. Bill controls his own mouth.

turn the food down and say “Ewww, I don’t like THAT!”

I was at an Xmas party last year where a 40-something lady did just that. You could have heard a pin drop. Not long after she and hubby were in the back yard (it is FL after all) and hubby could be heard reading her the riot act. They left shorty thereafter.

OT (sorta), but some great lines from Frank Rich this morning …

Obama is a liberal, but it’s not your boomer parents’ liberalism … He never rattles off a Clinton laundry list of big federal programs; he supports abortion rights and gay civil rights with a sunny bonhomie that makes the right’s cultural scolds look like rabid mastodons.

and

Mr. McCain attacked Mr. Obama for being insufficiently bipartisan while speaking to the most conspicuously partisan audience you can assemble in today’s America: a small, nearly all-white crowd that seconded his attack lines with boorish choruses of boos. On TV, the audience came across as a country-club membership riled by a change in the Sunday brunch menu

jus cogens!

I got a bag of puffed corn cereal yesterday at the good food store. Better than popcorn any day. Tasty little treat. Don’t know what butter would do, though. ugh.

hahaha…I lived in a building in NYC where a fire broke out in the apartment 2 stories below me, because a roach bomb exploded because the people set of the bomb and forgot to turn off the pilot light on their stove when they left the apartment.

They have now determined that it was arson. Who has a grudge? Who doesn’t care that the historic building be destroyed? The actual building was empty. Everything had been removed for renovation…It doesn’t hurt Perry politically. Most likely, I would guess, is that someone was disgruntled about something related to the renovation. Just my ignorant guess.

don’t get heat stroke.

And the speculation as to who people supported in the primaries is uninformed.

Mmmm…that sounds kinda tasty…one could be creative with it…either spicing it up or sweetening it up…or not.

Now they’ll prolly blame the Earth Liberation Front (ELF).

Bill C is totally aware of whether he wants his comments to get out there or not. Bill controls his own mouth.

It was his lack of control of other body parts that got him into trouble.

Hmmm… I may try that. I recall enjoying puffed corn as a kid.

I was pleasantly surprised. Same consistency as puffed wheat and cheap. Buck 69 a bag. Arrowhead Mills.

Yes. I think he still has a bunch of rumors ongoing about that part of his character. I’ve always thought that there may be an agreement of some sort between Bill and Hillary, and it’s their business ultimately. One never knows what goes on behind closed doors in a marriage. Oh well.

those funky styrofoam balls floating around in your breakfast bowl ;) … that was a mainstay for our group-house breakfasts … haven’t thought about ‘em in a while.

Yeah. Him. And Elliott Spitzer. And Larry Craig. And David Vitter. And Mark Foley. And Newt Gingrich. And Henry Hyde. And JFK. And Gary Hart. And Wilbur Mills. And a few hundred other politicians of both parties that suffer from zipper control problems.

What I am trying to spark here is not another Obama-Clinton flame war here but rather to raise the issue of undeclared bias and lack of transparency in our part of the blogosphere.

i don’t think we can claim to be members of the reality based community unless we are willing to at least make the attempt to understand our own biases and to be honest as we can about them.

And the speculation as to who people supported in the primaries is uninformed.

Just because someone does not officially state a position does not mean that we should park our critical faculties at the door and assume they do not have one. fdl should be put to the same critical scrutiny that the MSM is.

their business… till it erupts into the news and effects composition of supreme court …

If any of my brother or sister’s or my friends ate dinner with us and did that, that friend was pretty much never invited to stay for dinner ever again.

CHS has some thread newness

That is true.

Sugar Corn Pops. I remember those. Sponsored Will Bill Hickok with Guy Madison. Oh, man, the sugar. So sweeeeeeet. No sugar on these puppies, though.

definitely the no sugar ones … we ate ‘em as barefoot tiedye wearing boulder hippies… no sugar in sight ;)

Thanks Hugh.

Your liberal credentials are unquestioned with me. Your willingness to question Jane is well documented.

I am going to question it. It is not exactly a secret that some of the more prominent posters at fdl trended toward Clinton

My take would be that very early on Jane saw the split. Once she saw it, she did everything she could to make sure the split wasn’t permanent. Throughout this whole primary process, Jane has continued to cover Jena, which is the most fearful issue for Americans who have ancestors who were slaves. I haven’t seen any comments at FDL requesting more coverage of Jena, but Jane still covers it.

I think Clinton’s rousing endorsement of Obama yesterday was a confirmation of Jane’s handling of this. Everyone knows FDL will support the Democratic candidate for President. That’s not news. I think Jane understands that there’s a strong visceral connection to HRC based on close she got to being POTUS. I don’t know how you congratulate the other candidate without appearing to be dancing on the grave of those hopes. Not hopes for Hillary Rodham Clinton, but the hopes of a significant portion of an entire gender.

OT I also am concerned that “congratulations” too often focus on this candidate as the first candidate who is “black” aka African-American. I think that reinforces the GOP talking points. They don’t want anyone to forget for a millisecond that Obama is an angry “BLACK.”

If FDL does want to do something in that direction, I hope they’ll approach it from the other side. This the first candidate from either major party, of either gender who was not 100% European American. The strangle hold that white supremacist attitudes has had on the upper echelons of our government is weakening. As pluk never tired in reminding us, the Democratic party has embarked on a remarkably dangerous and unprecedented journey. It’s easy to focus on Jackie Robinson as a first. What’s tougher is to focus on the legalized white supremacy that kept all his predecessors out of MLB.

You are one of my favorite commenters here. You routinely bring a lot more than I, in terms of intelligence links, and new informaiton. I apologize for not highlighting the respect I have for your posts sooner.

Goin’ upstairs. New GRITtv, too.

Very well said.

Well said, as per usual.

Chocolate frosted sugar bombs. MMMmmmm.

It is not exactly a secret that some of the more prominent posters at fdl trended toward Clinton while a majority of the commenters for reasons similar to mine went for Obama.

It must be wonderful to be a mind reader. I have no idea who Jane supported here as she called BS on all sides of the primary when she saw a campaign (or the media) saying and doing stupid things.

I know who Christy and Dave Neiwert and some of the others supported only because they specified in comment threads once or twice. But they also ALL managed to call BS on the candidate they supported AND the other campaigns when warranted.

Calling out misogyny and racism on all sides does not a “trend” make.

sugar bombs. you sure got that right. couldn’t stand ‘em.

Good one! Bring on the town hall meetings, folks!

The message morphing in response to who the listener is is NOT something I want in my elected officials. Be real, no matter WHO is listening, assume the world is listening, and say what you mean, and mean what you say. That’s how I would like our politicians, ESPECIALLY candidates, to behave. Period.

Superb post, Jane.

My bias is well stated. I’m pro-choice and write about women’s issues. It’s why I went to Connecticut for Ned Lamont, it’s why I oppose Joe Lieberman and the Democrats who put Alito on the Supreme Court, it’s why I fight NARAL, it’s why I raised money for Ciro Rodriguez (and started Blue America) and it’s why I write about sexism in the media and the problem of putting Democrats like Richardson with sketchy pro-choice credentials in positions of power. That doesn’t mean I supported any of the presidential candidates over the others, it means I wanted to urge them all (and the media) to represent the interests of women. I still do.

I realize the blogosphere got dumbed down to the point it could only view things through the lens of “do you support Obama or Clinton” but there is a larger perspective that we will hopefully get back to now that the primary is over.

appreciate your comment – are you saying that you didn’t have a preference or any bias in the dem presidential primary?

i know i did, even if it sometimed varied from day to day.

one doesn’t have to think that everything is about clinton/obama to think that some things may be affected by how we see (and saw) that race.

i liked this bit from bill moyers this weekend:

Edward R. Murrow told his generation of journalists, no one can eliminate their prejudices. Just recognize them.

I guess the lesson we learn here is — we’re all not like you.

That doesn’t mean I supported any of the presidential candidates over the others

It, of course, doesn’t mean that you didn’t support one of the candidates over the others either. The Richardson posts I am thinking of had less to do with his “shaky” pro-choice stand and more to do with the fact that he as a superdelegate chose to support Obama and not Clinton. There is a difference between not having a preference and having a preference but not stating it. I am concerned that the left side of the blogosphere is taking on aspects of the right side and the traditional media, where our behind the scenes discussions and agendas are OK but theirs are not. Transparency is about letting readers have access not only to the frontpage but also to the back room. It is not that we do not trust you but that we like to verify that trust with facts and an open process.