This week American Lawyer floated a trial balloon for the next Attorney General. The fluff job began with a casual vignette that showed us how the anointed candidate is connected — and obedient — to Power. Which sounds exactly like what was wrong with all of Bush’s AG’s. After seven long years of depravity in Bush’s DOJ, do you really want four more years of a DOJ prostituted out to corporate clients?
[Eric Holder Jr.] is there to prep Fernando Aguirre, the CEO of Chiquita Brands International Inc., for an interview with "60 Minutes," which will be broadcasting a segment on the company’s past involvement with Colombian right-wing paramilitary forces. Last March, Holder helped Chiquita secure a slap-on-the-wrist plea deal to charges that it had paid off the terrorists.
Aww. Isn’t that special? Another very-well-paid corporate servant just helping another criminally amoral conspiracy corporation — Chiquita — evade punishment for killing anyone who gets in the way of maximum quarterly yield. After all, corporate officers and board members already enjoy effective immunity from criminal prosecution (and personal liability) when they deliberately choose to maximize profits by killing and maiming their employees and the rest of us — either through predictable workplace "accidents" or the intentional collective posioning of us and our fetuses we quaintly call "pollution".
Why not take the next step and kill union organizers? Hey — it worked for Big Carbon during the start of the last Great Depression. Why shouldn’t Big Banana do the same as we slide into the next Great Depression?
After all, killing union activists is just another tool in maximizing corporate earnings — and that’s what America, the legal prostitutes who collectively comprise the corporate bar, and the Bushies’ DOJ is all about, right? And why make a big stink about Big Banana? After all, killing union activists is just the way business works in Colombia — as long as Uribe and the DEA/DOJ’s Plan Colombia run the show:
Between 2002 (when Uribe took office) and 2006, a total of 510 union activists have been slain in Colombia.
"Convictions have been reported in only five cases for the 236 trade unionists murdered in the most recent three-year period, 2004-2006," states a Colombia Fact Sheet released by USLEAP.
The Uribe Administration likes to trumpet the fact that the number of murders of trade unionists has been on a downward trend since he took office. However, to put that so-called good news in perspective, according to USLEAP, each year between 2002 and 2006 the total number of labor-leader assassinations in Colombia alone has exceeded the total killed globally — with 72 union leaders killed in Colombia in 2006, compared to 66 in the entire rest of the world that same year.
After that much bloodshed, you have to wonder if Uribe’s so-called success in reducing the murder rate of unionists is not due to the fact that there are simply fewer labor leaders out there to murder.
Hey, assassinating trade unionists worked for Coca-Cola’s bottlers in Colombia, right? Why deny Big Banana the same advantage?
After all, isn’t that what the noble profession of law is all about: establishing a level playing field with elaborate rules designed to ensure all parties have vigorous advocates who give them "their day in court"?
Sure. When one party is a multi-billion corporation and the other an individual, it has to work well, right?
Or when the multi-billion megacorps simply write their own legislation — and then fund their creature ALEC to use campaign contributions legalized bribery and just purchase the votes required to buy whatever the megacorps need from our state and Federal "Justice" systems.
After all, it worked for the Bankruptcy Law "reform", right? It worked to neuter Superfund, right? It worked to sink universal health insurance, right?
And last year — when Congress knowingly turned the techniques of the women’s suffrage and civil rights movement into federal crimes – it sure worked then, right? But of course, AETA was all about terrorism, right?
And that has nothing to do with the sweet deal American Lawyer’s fluffee Holder negotiated for the Boys From Banana, right?
There was a labor organizer who was organizing banana workers, who was taken off a bus by paramilitaries and shot; people shot in the banana fields; social organizers who were advocating for causes that the paramilitaries were opposed to; a woman taken out and shot in front of her family.
[snip]
We believe that Chiquita is actually essentially engaged in a criminal conspiracy with the paramilitary organizations to control the banana-growing region of Colombia and that it was to Chiquita’s great benefit to use the paramilitaries to maintain a social and political stability within this region to allow them to conduct their extremely profitable banana-growing operations.
What the Chiquita executives probably didn’t tell you is that during this period, when they claimed they were being extorted by the paramilitaries, their Colombian subsidiary was the most profitable arm of Chiquita’s global operations, and, in fact, they continued to buy land in Colombia in the area where they said it was so dangerous that they had to pay protection payments to the paramilitaries. They continued to buy land and expand their operations until 2004, when they abruptly sold their Colombian subsidiary at around the same time that the Justice Department began investigating their payments to the paramilitaries.
Nope, no terrorism to see here with Chiquita. Run along and support their lawyer for AG.
The DOJ, Michael Chertoff, America’s corporate elite, their purchased servants among the WTO, DNC, RNC and the blue ribbon law-firms and law partners who comprise the corporate bar, and our major media would never turn a blind eye to terror, right?
Well, unless the terrorists are Cubans — the right sort of Cubans, that is. Or unless the "terrorists" increase quarterly profits. American justice, after all, is all about equal rights for all.
Unless equal rights to a safe workplace, labor organizing, or safe food/air/water actually cost some stockholder somewhere something someday.
The most prosperous positions for attorneys are as corporate counsel – the consiglieri for the serial poisoners and serial killers otherwise known as corporate America. Members of the Bar.
Who pushes the Bush Reich’s assertion that torture and extra-judicial murder are Executive Privilege? Members of the Bar.
Who pushes that Exxon should be let off the hook for letting a known drunk foul Alaska and cause billions of irremediable damages? Members of the Bar.
Who are serving as the uniformed cogs in the DOD’s homicidal Gitmo show trials? Members of the Bar.
Who appear meekly to seek "Justice" before the same federal jurist who — as a U.S. Attorney — railroaded the people’s choice for Governor, Siegelman, into prison? Members of the Bar.
And where are the members of the Bar gathering outside the Federal Courthouses and Pentagon doorways and UC Regents’ meetings to demand their erstwhile colleagues — willing collaborators in corporate crimes and crimes of official Power — be removed from the Bar?
Where are the members of the Bar sitting in the damn doorways of Power until their voices are heard?
*crickets*
Back to Eric H. Holder, former MCI board member, partner at Covington & Burling (with a practice in "White collar defense and investigations: Congressional investigations and internal investigations"), former DOJ Public Integrity Section Federal attorney, former Associate Judge of the Superior Court of the District of Columbia, former US Attorney (and first African-American) of the District of Columbia, former number two – Deputy Attorney General – of the entire Department of Justice!
Twenty-five years of public service – and even with his failure to recuse himself when his buddy John Quinn came calling for a Presidential pardon for a fugitive commodities trader – an impressive one.
Eric H. Holder was even selected to serve on the US Sentencing Commission Ad Hoc Advisory Group "that examined, and made recommendations to revise, the organizational sentencing guidelines".
The same Ad Hoc Advisory Group the USSC relied upon in endorsing government-coerced waivers of the attorney-client privilege and work product productions —
On April 30, 2004, the U.S. Sentencing Commission submitted to Congress a number of amendments to Chapter 8 of the Guidelines relating to ""organizations""-a broad term that includes corporations, partnerships, unions, non-profit organizations, governments, and other entities.
a result that freaked out organizations from the ACLU to the National Association of Manufacturers.
OK – IANAL. Maybe forcing waiver of attorney-client privilege is the best legal innovation since footnotes. But anything so draconian that it brings together the American Chemical Association, NAM, and the ACLU gives me the heebie-jeebies.
Why?
With exceptions such as the ACLU, the EFF, the NLG, EPIC, The Southwest Center For Biological Diversity, and the like, the normative culture in American law appears to have become a culture of depravity.
Like medicine, the cultural norms and ethical norms are generated by the practioners. At any given moment, the norms of both professional communities reflect prevailing values. So at one time in America, physician participation in executions was normative: today it is proscribed. Medicine still has a long way to go: members of my profession are complicit and responsible for torture and for the illegal use of psychotropic drugs in the new "Security State" the Bush Reich has brought upon us.
Even the best-intentioned members of any profession can be so inured to cultural norms that we don’t see what is before us until an outsider tells us the professional norm is naked – and ugly.
I’ve every reason to respect Scott Horton and the attorneys who write for FDL. I believe they are good people with honorable values. Though I’ve never met them, I just know they are: their actions and writings tell me.
Yet even Scott Horton was inured to the fact that a war criminal like John Yoo is a member of the Bar.
But I’m still haunted by a question a student put to me following a presentation I made at Columbia University on Tuesday evening. "If the bar is so serious about this," the student said, "then explain to me how it’s possible that John Yoo and his confederates haven’t been disbarred." I started to answer about the complexity of the disbarment process, but I stopped. The student was right. If the bar were serious about this, it should have used its disciplinary tools to deal with it. This is not a case of an eccentric academic mouthing some cock-eyed theories. It is about a government official using the power of a government office to induce people to commit serious crimes.
Even a genuinely independent and ethical thinker like Scott Horton was brought up
short when Yoo’s bar Card was questioned. To his credit, he admitted he’d never considered it. His interlocutor?
A law student — someone too new to the culture of American law to have been inculcated in the cultural norm of depravity I’ve described above.
The cultural norms of medicine, and especially psychoanalysis, were once every bit as insular, self-absorbed, self-protective, and depraved as is the legal culture I describe above. When I commenced my psych training in the late ’80s it was still routine to meet (and be trained and supervised by) psychiatrists who were now married to the patient they’d started fucking … while they were that patient’s doc. That behavior among therapists is now illegal.
Until the normative American legal culture of aiding those complicit in corporate death squads, mass poisoning (and its progeny: mass carcinogenesis, mass mutagensis, mass reproductive disorders, mass learning disorders), serial killings of industrial employees, and complicity in the same abuses of federal and state power for which the Allies hung Nazi leaders at Nuremberg (and their instruments at other post-war trials) goes through the same wrenching changes medicine is part-way through, the culture of depravity will still be blithely excused as "our adversial system".
The blindness will be so severe that even those touting a candidate for Attorney General will use a high-powered role in securing a "slap on the wrist" for corporate officers’ complicity in death squads as a telling indication of power — rather than a stunning indictment of the candidates’ ethics and morality.
And even a former professor of Consitutional Law who is now the Democratic candidate for President may be blind to the true significance of bringing that high-powered corporate lawyer into his campaign, much less his Cabinet.
After nearly thirty years of Presidents in thrall to corporate power, America is on the verge of social collapse. In selecting corporate servants to staff his Administration, President Obama can speed our goverment and our Republic’s rush to destruction.
In rejecting corporate sevants and the amorality they serve as he chooses his Cabinet, President Obama can reverse the megacorps’ lethal corrosion of our society and Federal Government.
Assume Obama wins the presidency…. Is Holder attorney general?
Holder doesn’t hesitate. "I got to tell you, that’s going to be up to the president," he says. "And I will not be the president. I will also tell you that I am married to a wonderful woman who is a doctor. Her name is Sharon Malone. And Sharon Malone tells me that I won’t be going anywhere except back to my law firm. So I think President Obama is going to have to talk to Sharon, and she’s a pretty formidable person."
Dr. Malone sounds like a very wise doctor to me. Let’s hope President Obama will follow her prescription.
Let’s hope President Obama chooses an Attorney General — and executive appointees — for We the People, not for the megacorps.
We’ve been dying for that.
[image credit: RO-BOT]




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What’s up Doc? Aloha!
Aloha, CT!
g’evening kirk
I’d like to see Edwards as AG…! Speaking of AG’s… Poor AGAG reduced to being being an aide to a special master on a patent case…! My heart bleeds for him…! NOT!
Hi suz – thanks for the mods and techies’ work tonight (and all the time).
Aloha, Suz! How’s your neck of the redwoods? ;-)
Beats flipping burgers which is really all he’s qualified to do.
A subservient position: ideally suited to Fredo’s chief talent.
devoid of real estate buyers but other than that, tis been a lovely day
Nicely ranted, Kirk.
Aren’t American lawyers embarrassed when their Pakistani co-professionals riot in the streets against their Regime? Whatever happened to Mario Cuomo’s call for American lawyers to resist?
As long as lawyers enable lawbreaking, lawbreaking can be made to seem legal.
I would not eat a burger he’d flipped. Might be poisoned.
Not even Looky-Loos?
Heh, ya must’ve been lurking on the last thread, Teddy…! ;-)
*sigh* nope
I’ve been asking that since the Pakistani lawyers took to the streets in their suits
*crickets*
evenin’ !
that sure sounds like yr post is congruent with the thinking of Arthur Silbur:
from the conclusion of his long essay “Blinded by the Story: Liberals and Progressives as Political Creationists”
at http://powerofnarrative.blogsp…..s-and.html
beyond the pale, outside the pasture, not at all in the (D) Party orbit, but there may be a few readers here willing to explore his eloquent, well researched points.
Much as Dr. Murphy does, he follows the evidentiary trails wherever they lead, even if they inconvenience or implicate a (D).
Thanks, Teddy. I sure hope Cuomo keeps shouting out!
(and as the Newsbox article about the two Harvard academic child psychiatrists who somehow failed to know they hadn’t disclosed 1.6 million – each – in drug company funding demonstates, medicine also has a lot of stables to swamp out)
But think of all those tassels on the hot pavement of K street: “oh, the ornamentality”!
our entire country needs a thorough cleaning with liberal amounts of accountability and consequences of actions.
(bows) Konnichiwa, Dr Murphy
This has been, and remains, one of my chief concerns. If Obama appoints people, to any cabinet position, who now represent corporate interests what will cause them to turn their focus to that segment of the population they’ve spent years exploiting and screwing? Or killing.
What we have seen so clearly to our detriment are the hiring policies and practices of political appointees. Dare we hope that, as a hypothetical example, an attorney from the Southern Poverty Law Center would be selected rather than the corporate counsel for GE?
Not related to bananas, but related to the DOJ…Sixty congresspersons signed on asking for a special prosecutor for torture issues.
Agents made a detainee eat a baseball.
loohoo, adding that the news queue, thanks
I want a special prosecutor to take on the lies that lead us into Iraq…!
Suz, it was in the queque earlier today…!
you are correct.. thanks, ct
Say what? A republican called them out?
Good evening sporkovat and Morris and twain and Southern Dragon and LooHoo!
spork, thanks for the link to the silbur essay – I look forward to reading it after the thread.
SD, you put your finger on it. Imagine an AG from a non-profit that actually served the public! I wonder how many decades the AG has gone from one corporate servant to another?
And LooHoo, your observation is spot on: torture under color of authority is official depravity.
You had a wonderful post up today, yourself, CTuttle. I read it as time permits…usually weekends! (Can you save your hot articles for then?)
i want some good old fashioned career civil servants back in positions that require their expertise and not political hacks in charge of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
I’m starting to think that the career people will be invited into congress to testify about what they have observed over the last seven and one half freaking years.
Yep. That’s why I really left the whole R/D framing out of my post.
Will we better off under a D admin than an R? Sure. But will that release us from corporate rule? Only if the D elected consciously rejects corporate power.
Grassley is also taking on the UCLA liver transplant program that gave transplants to mobsters from Japan who just happened to make large gifts to the program.
D’s don’t have a lock on morality (or amorality) – I’m glad when elected officials of either party stand up against abuse of power (though the D’s seem to be far more likely to do so than the R’s).
One thing I’ve noticed while monitoring my sitemeter traffic is that Wednesdays are the ‘peak’ times, however, I try to post the hot topics as they roll in…! ;-)
This American Life: The Prosecutor
You have to do that. Interesting about the Wednesday peak though. Any ideas why?
Hey Suz….
Do you have early duty on weekends or are we just getting lucky?
Hey folks – AL shamelessly floated their possible candidate for AG…
Though that doesn’t excuse my shameless float….
I’d be grateful for digg action. The more attention on the high-powered corporate-connected former MCI board member who helped get the slap on the wrist for the Chiquita execs in charge while the death squads were killing labor activists, the better.
Sunlight is the best disinfectant even for potential AG’s.
respect for being able to be so clear eyed on what is often simply a blogospheric outpost of the Democratic Party.
which is not, imho, synonymous with Progressive values.
I have no explanation, but, the trend has been a build up from monday peaking on wednesday and tapering off until the next monday… Saturdays and Sundays are relatively slow days…! ;-)
ya’ll are just lucky tonight
Barrack’s cool. He’ll be fine. Edwards’s name has been kicked around as possible AG. I’m not betting on it. And speaking of betting, I KNEW Big Brown just didn’t have it in him to go a mile and 1/2.
spork, I appreciate the link to silbur, but explicitly reject your characterization of FDL. However I won’t further address that topic this evening.
Digg Kirk right here!
Oh, darn, I can’t stay. Have to take the sonny down to the pool.
I know, poor me. I’m just feeling lazy. Worked in the hot sun in the yard all day, but, gotta be the good mom. Guess I’ll do some laps….
I Will Be Back. It’s Saturday night. I might feel like dancing. Or, I might feel like sleeping…
ya beat me to it newton… thanks
Jimmy Carter’s remarks on the swearing-in of his Attorney General, Griffin Bell (my bold):
I couldn’t believe that he finished last… Well, maybe next year will produce a triple crown… This is the longest drought in the history of the triple crown…!
Yay! for FDL. Lucky lucky lucky.
I’ll be back in a little…
You know, of course, that Eric Holder is one of Obama’s “vetters” for VP candidates.
I’m cool with Barack & Eric. This is where I don’t know that I agree with Kirk. I better go back and re-read before I say something that’s wrong.
Oh – the DOJ official who kept silent about Chiquita’s terrorist death squads in Colombia?
Our very own dear Terror Czar: Michael Chertoff.
As is Jim Johnson (through whose Veep selection filter slipped Geraldine Ferraro’s husband’s business dealings in 1984) and Caroline Kennedy.
I would like it if Caroline pulled a Dick Cheney: we looked everywhere, and I’m the best. Pick me.
they shoulda had this guy on the committee
I could really get behind that. A Kennedy !
Chertoff is key to much that is wrong, now. Much that is not currently known.
k, nicely managed.
or as some say, Rangered.
chertoff is doing a heck of a job
Thanks, newton!
And mauimom, I did not know that. Someone who takes money (for his firm) to get a slap on the wrist for Chiquita’s involvement with death squads isn’t someone I’d trust to vet anyone.
and the sound of my and many others’ foot-tapping.
Just say the word …
You know, of course, that Eric Holder is one of Obama’s “vetters” for VP candidates.
oops!!
fuckin’ lawyers…
We need to vet the vetters…!
not all of them by a long shot, jayt!
hope you and all in Indy came through last night OK and unscathed….
Are ya having a mid-life crisis, Jay…?
would love a one day strike of all judical services – shut down the courts in protest of the shredding of the constitution
have all the lawyers in suits out front of all the courthouses, federal, state, and county – with their briefcases, 3 piece suits, and protest signs
Dugg
Maybe, as Kirk puts it, I’m inured to the cultural norms of my profession. Maybe I’m missing the point. But I don’t impute a client’s wrongdoing to his/her/its attorney. I don’t do it with Chiquita & Holder any more than I did with, say, Simpson & Cochran or any other murderer and defense counsel. That said, I would preferr we not get an AG from a corporate environment and I’m pretty confident we won’t. Holder, for example, has alot of years in the AG’s office.
thanks, loohoo – anyone else want to help spread the word?
Well, Chiquita Bananas may be a thing of the past in a short while since all the banana plants are being attacked by some fungus that no one has been able to figure out how to stop. So – we’ll either just have to find some other kind of banana to eat – or do without.
CNN is now saying that rivers are swelling all across Indiana now…! 8-(
and i want to see the men in dresses leading the line – judges have to be involved too
I’d go for that. Seriously. BUt you don’t see many three pievce suits anymore at all. I don’t own one.
Robes, right…? ;-)
Being a major corporation does not preclude you from legal representation, no matter that lawyer’s connections, and no matter the criminality alleged.
Kirk The National Lawyers Guild collectively made the case eo for Impeachment in November 07.
Think the lawyers are split the corporate whores want to promote lawlessness. ACLU and EFF want laws.
Bushco takes illegal activity off shore and shits in other countries that they have the CIA operations destabilizing for them as well as private para military operations.
Outsourcing Crimes and recruiting criminals to do the dirty work. It sucks and has to stop. Enforcing The rule of law is the only way to regulate these outlaws.
I agree with you. Lawyers are paid to do a job, and depending on which side of the courtroom they sit – it can be a job that a lot of people don’t particularly care for (hence all the nasty lawyer jokes).
But based on the results so far of the innocence project – I WANT them there defending. Who knows? It could be me up there next and I am innocent of anything.
hope you and all in Indy came through last night OK and unscathed….
yeah – no damage – but a big chunk of the state is under water.
CTuttle @62 – Are ya having a mid-life crisis, Jay…?/i
nah, got that out of the way quite some time ago. One’s enough, isn’t it? (he said while visions of red convertible sports cars run through his head).
Note to self: Cut that shit out!!
yeup
correct. I think the point is that we don’t need somebody who’d spenmt their life representing major corporations as the next AG. But look, Gonzalez had hardly any time in private pracrtice, did he?
You know, I thought of that too. But we don’t really know Caroline…at least I don’t.
It could be me up there next and I am innocent of anything.
Argh, the nightmare scenario – ‘Course, that’s why I signed up. Having an innocent client means that, from the signing of the contract to the time the jury comes back with a verdict, the lawyer ages in dog-years.
I’d be right there with my sympathy briefcase, cheering them on!
On the other hand – in these type of cases – I think that the attitude and commitment of the “government lawyer” is an important part of winning cases like this against Chiquita. If the DOJ is in the shape its in right now – with the lawless attitude of the AG and everyone of the political appointees, it does have an effect on the rest of the legal staff. The politcal hacks put pressure on the actual people doing the work – pressure than apparently a lot of them either cannot or will not resist.
Stenographers! Clerks! Marshalls!
I just wish that we could figure out how to get the ACLU lawyers and their friends to represent the detainees at Gitmo. The ACLU would do it in a minute – it’s just that the detainees don’t trust anyone from the US to defend them, and would rather just die. And the government/military won’t let them have lawyers that are not military and in full military uniform apparently. GRRRRR!
Agreed. I also agree that merely reperesenting human rights criminals does not make the attorneys human rights criminals.
If America’s attorneys were neatly divided into criminal advocates and public policy advocates, I would see this very differently.
However, our high-priced law firms seamlessly move between representing corporate criminals in court to advocating for the same white collar criminals in Congress and regualtory proceedings.
Yet the same high-powered firms steer clear of the vast majority of criminal defendants (and almost all the poor ones).
I’m all for a Bar that fully represents all criminal defendants with equal vigor.
I wish we had that now.
The Bar we have disproportionately reperesents the wealthiest criminal defendants, and the same attorneys who do that advocacy pop up in K street and VP vetting committees and Congressional hallways and ask us to pretend their economic interests don’t influence their judgement.
If that were true, why didn’t Eric’s partners choose to be poorly paid public defenders instead of high-paid attorneys that just happen to serve the wealthiest intersts?
US Corporation should be on notice if they break our laws overseas thay will be held accountable or lose their licence.
Actually Eric Holder has a really good record from when he was the USA for DC. He helped get a hate crimes task force going and a bunch of other stuff like that.
If the DOJ is in the shape its in right now…
Hey, Abu’s gone, Mukasey will be soon – DOJ appointments should be mentioned by Obama and staff in the same breath with Supreme Court appointments.
Chimpy’s DOJ has a bit of history bowing to pharma interests, too, as in the case of the Purdue Frederick Co.
These bastards pleaded guilty to what should have been murder on the oxy case, and got fined.
Even Snarlin’ Arlen castigated AbuG for letting them off without anybody going to jail.
It would be nice to adopt something similar to the British system. All the lawyers work for a set fee. They get appointed to cases by the judge – and they can be appointed to either represent the defendant or be the prosecutor. They are required to do the job to the best of their ability no matter which side they are on.
Just a drive BY…. dinner is calling ….
thought some of you might like to see this Video I received from The Young Turks
yesterday (on Pacifica? here?) i heard/read an observer of the Gitmo cases note that after all this time keeping the terrorists on capital show trial carefully isolated, the presiding jurist just happened to let the defendants engage in lots o cross-talk…giving KSH the chance to browbeat those who seemed to entertain the prospect of engaging counsel into refusing counsel –and ensuring more certain executions for the show trial.
I wish the ACLU/NLG were representing all the defendants, also – in a real criminal court in the continental US.
Already been there, thanks.
What is truly a sad diatribe on our current justice system is that we prosecute vigorously the blue-collar criminals and allow the white-collar criminals skate… Blue-collar crime tallies in monetary amounts are dwarfed by white-collar crime totals… Along with the fact that the DoJ’s credibility is shot in many legal jurisdictions, through, either shoddy work or political persecutions… It’s gonna take a lot of time to undo the damage wrought by Shrub’s DoJ…! 8-(
marcy has a great post up addressing that very issue kirk
Didn’t know that. I wonder if they get the same (or more) expertise that way. Does seem really fair at first glance.
wow loky – if we had that system, my concerns about appointing any corporate counsel to public positions would be “moot”.
bmaz has a post across the hall at EW’s on this subject.
I wish the ACLU/NLG were representing all the defendants, also – in a real criminal court in the continental US.
After it has been publicly admitted that KSM was waterboarded?
Yeah, I’d like to see that in a U.S. court too.
you are correct – that was bmaz and not marcy’s post
Thanks prostrate and suz – I look forward to reading that
______
….sorry i got called away for a sec – poop duty. Thinking outside the (litter) can lead to unfortunate outcomes.
Heh, yer on a roll tonite, Suz! ;-)
The image I have is that of the Honorable James S Moody Jr, United States District Judge, Tampa Division.
The judge presiding in the case of U S vs Sami al-Arian et al.
I couldn’t be more disgusted. *spit*
yeap, not even my regular start time and i’m already down 2 strikes
jayt, to be explicit, I respect and honor the role of counsel for individaul accused in our
criminal justicelegal system.It’s my understanding that certain firms have individuals who sort of specialize in what we call “capital offenses” and others who do corporate law. The judges know who all these firms/lawyers are and so are able to select appropriately the ‘expertise’ needed for the particular trial. But defendants, rich or poor – get the same lawyers no matter what. If you’re up you represent whoever is on trial. Period. Fee is the same.
Best essay I’ve read at firedoglake in months. And that’s saying something!
Are there more attorneys in congress than ever before? Are there more running in 2008 than ever? Just curious.
Well, I know there is at least one less in the Senate – Jon Tester is a farmer. He unseated a GOP lawyer who was part of the Abramoff lovely little thingy.
thank you.
jayt, thank you: some of my best friends are criminal defendants!
hey et – that is high praise indeed
there’s going to be alot of hopes and anticipation that Obama’s cabinet will be very, very different. There are bound to be some disappointments. Hope AG isn’t one of them. te problem I haver with somebody connected to clients like Chiquita, for example, isn’t that they’re dirty in some way. Rathjer, I think the problem lies in that AG being in a position to have to reguilate and even prosecute these heavy hitters. I expect Obama will appoint someone who can and will do it.
y’know, Suzanne – sometimes the posts here are so good, so html-hip, that by the time you finish digesting everything you can learn from clicking on through, let alone just sitting there and digesting the art of fine writing, you’ve been EPU’d twice over.
Breaking:
Lawyer defends criminal – Why do lawyers hate America?
Cuz sometimes the criminal ain’t a criminal…
some of my best friends are criminal defendants!
lol – you too?
I represented a kid for murder one time – sweet kid who got pushed too hard one too many times. If he hadn’t been incarcerated, I would have, without being concerned whatsoever, let him baby-sit my own then 2 1/2 year old son.
I’m telling the absolute truth.
Didn’t Ted Stevens say something just the other day about how only attorneys should be in Congress?
Oh, and by the way. Anyone who isn’t marching in lockstep with the 28 percenters or whatever that number is down to – hates America – by definition.
yeap – i’ve spent many a night re-reading posts from the day, gaining even more the second time around
I think it should be the other way around – no members of Congress can BE lawyers. We certainly would not have bills that are 900 pages long to say something that could be said much more clearly in about 9!
http://cliffschecter.firedogla…..gislators/
Beerfart, I hope my responses don’t seem like I’m somehow “picking” on you: along with other folks here, you raise good questions that hlep me clarify my concerns and my point.
Though I’m not totally comfortable with Holder’s work in power (did he ever just sit back and resign rather than send one more balck male to prison in our endless “war on drugs”), for the sake of discussion I’ll pretend I think all his work in DOJ was sublime.
But after he left DOJ in 2001, he didn’t go serve the underserved (his spouse is a very successful physician,so income doesn’t seem to be the issue). He didn’t go do work for an NGO or non-profit. Instead, when he had the chance, he went into corporate law – defending white-collar crime cases.
The choices he made – serving the corproate sector – after he was 2nd at DOJ are what disturb me about his ethical fitness for any Federal position of power (or vetting those who will be in power).
Chiquita was entitled to representation; he was entitled to decline to practice in defense of corporations.
breaking kirk radio silence because it’s chiquita—-personal reasons. what is happening is not ok.
what’s the difference between a corporation giving the auc money and getting fined for it and our government giving money to uribe who gives it to auc? doesn’t it make you wonder why they gave money directly? it does me……something isn’t making sense here at all, kirk…..from the getgo…..is it just the blatancy of it? is that what went wrong? it’s just doing business down there, someone went to the wrong bank? it’s what’s going on in many countries, that’s how it’s done…..why did they step out of bounds to make payments through a subsidiary and then cash payments when we are already making millions of dollars of payments through our government to the same people?
i wonder, and at the same time congress was pressured for the trade agreement with columbia, and opposition leaders were being murdered in columbia and ecuador, which violated all kinds of treaties and then you have trade agreements with , crap, don’t want to get out an atlas, can’t remember the name of the oceanside country, the one that we have a base for ’drug running’ base, that is now going to run out, even though the base is south of all countries who traffic above it toward the united states…………we just wanna be there to have a ’presence’…….
a lot is being left out……those are the parts i wish to know.
meanwhile, carl retired, is all of this happening since he retired or did it go on when he was still there?
who’s in charge now?
i have carl stories, but will save for another day. remember, i’m from there.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/ind…..H._Lindner
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Lindner,_Jr.
and this last one pains me, because i always knew him as a decent man, even though a republican.
http://carpebaloney.blogspot.c…..-head.html
Hey, het, hey@!!!! there’s summaries!!!!!
Jeebus, the cronyism never, ever stops:
ET, that is high praise – I just saw it. i very deeply thank you.
I hope the school visit and the trip to Crater Lake (and microbreweries, if any) treated you well!
that was clear and and I don’t think you’ve picked on the profession. I just don’t know enough about Holder, frankly. If her was aoppointed to an Obamam administration, I just hope we’d get the public servant Holder and not the more recent version. It’s possible. we’ll see. I’m sure it’ll be an improvement. (But I said that about Mukasey)
What, you expected Bush NOT to give this to his best bud? Never mind all that messy stuff.
great point, dmac. no difference at all that I can see. In Colombia, both Chiquita and the US Govt are deliberately complicit in crimes against humanity.
suz and ed, in the last thread ian and paul brought up how rereading you get different things out of it the next time around. i then posted on why.
Jeebus….words fail me….
No surprise there. What most people don’t realize about the Gov’t being complicit in these kinds of crimes is that it has been going on for decades – under both Dem and Rep Presidents. So it WILL really be interesting to see what happens when Obama comes to office.
The reason I am even hopeful is because of the DNC’s announcement yesterday that they are stopping all lobbyist donations just like his campaign. Of course there is a loophole for the DSCC and DCCC – but it’s a start? Hopefully?? ‘crosses fingers, toes, etc’
This may be a symbolic gesture, financially speaking, but it put McCain in an impossible box. I love that the most.
i think it is a hopeful sign of change … and more changes to come
Kirk, just curious, you have anybody(ies) in mind for AG? I really don’t other than Edwards and I think the chances of that are remote.
Yeah, Obama is nothing if not a pragmatist. He understands that you cannot change everything 180 degrees in an instant. Baby steps because change is hard. Incremental baby steps. But each one gets you closer to the goal.
thers and an unclaimed zed upstairs
No it doesn’t Teddy… Did you see this one about AV gas and Repugs,too…?
Yep. Penny Lernoux’s Cry of the People (and Chomsky and Amy Goodman’s exposure of Carter’s complicity in Indonesia’s genocide in East Timor) long ago disabused of any idea that D and R admins don’t share share complicity in murder for the Corporate State.
With our impending economic collapse – and the loss of our corporate-directed military empire – I have some hope that America’s people will lose the political will to support rape and murder abroad in support of megacorp profits.
We weren’t a perfect nation before we sought power in Cuba, Hawaii,a nd the Phillipines…but at least we weren’t collectively funding war crimes abroad for corporate masters here at home.
Perhaps we’ll live to see the US return to what we once were – a nation without an Empire.
It’s probably better for me to post this here at the end of the thread.
Wow. You guys are such adults.
I just spent the last hour in a spa with a five year old named Daisy.
I sang the Daisy, Daisy song about 20 times. She kept saying Again. She sang along with me the last 10 times or so.
‘Course, her dad had shared a cervasa with me. Only, one. And, with all the singing, it took the hour to down it.
Just a whoa, different scene down there than up here.
Not saying either is better. It is nice to have different experiences, tho.
We’v been well treated, but couldn’t fit in any microbrewery tours – just Heitz Cellars and Pedroncelli wineries. I wnted to visit North Coast breweries, but time ran awy from us.
We’re in Klamath Falls tonight, headed to Portland through Bend tomorrow. A couple nights with one of my brothers and his family, then on up to Seattle for about a week. My longest spell outside of Alaska in 26 years.
Right on – and baby steps, keep thinking baby steps.
Good question – I really don’t either. I’d love to sit back and look at the NGO’s/ law school faculties (free of corporate influence) and learn about the stellar candidates who’ve steered clear of the corporate world and our own endless War on Drugs/Brown People/etc.
In the mean time – we have a new theread upstairs!
Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful particiaption this evening: you learned me.
It’s also a signal to other dems. Barack the man.
John Dean?
Jonathan Turley?
kirk at 128 thanks for answering, however, you missed the nuance part, why did they do that? why did they pay out of hand and extra?
why would they do that? it totally doesn’t make sense to me ever since i first heard of it…….
and who is in charge at chiquita now that carl has retired? did this go on when he was there? i never heard that it did, so, what has changed?
and the links i gave, he had widespread influence, not just because of chiquita, (and udf ice cream is the best, they have their own quickmart/gas/ice cream stores and even the employees are quality and are treated well, was just in columbus the other day and HAD to stop to get a malt) he had his fingers in a lot of things, but was a totally upfront kinda guy from what i knew of him….even though he had a few sleazy friends, milkin and keating….old school with vision. which means you stretch legalities when trying to make something work, but you don’t murder people. was he a part of that?
that’s why it bothers me.
i know times he totally put himself out for others, not just money, well, lots of money was involved, took control of the situation and made it happen…….not the man who would condone taking a life even to save the company he founded. lives simply, would not in a million years condone that to save his house……..
that’s why i wanna know.
=========
and get a clue people, eric holder cashed in his integrity credentials for money and prestige when he left the doj……….risin’ up that ladder is kinda hard to resist……..wouldn’t trust him to watch my dog unless i was payin’ him a competitive rate to do it. and even then i’d have my neighbor check up on him.
wish i woulda known earlier that he was involved with obama…….not good.
Good travels, ET – and Black Butte has a great brewpub in Bend.
Myself, I’m partial to Black Butte Porter…
demi at 139–time with a child is always the best spent time…..especially singing something special in a spa…….
Another terrific post, Kirk, thanks.
It was pretty cool. I told her that song was 100 years old and she didn’t know what a bicycle built for two was and we played rhyming games and, it was fairly special.
But, I have that damn song in my head now. Must pick out a CD and put it on. :)
Obama came out of Harvard and chosae to represent non profits trying to house poor folks. It goes back to the earlier post on intelligence. Some folks have a limbic system that has been surpressed by the culture hence numb
speaking of old songs…… i hadn’t seen the Belmont in a while before this year. “Sidewalks of New York” has been replaced by “New York, New York” ?? I don’t approve.
No surprise there. What most people don’t realize about the Gov’t being complicit in these kinds of crimes is that it has been going on for decades – under both Dem and Rep Presidents.
That is our karma he have been fucking over other human being on behalf of special interest for long time. It drives me crazy remember all those Central American Countries we saw it on film in books but never never on our media. Now we must stop them. Please contribute to human rights groups that are fighting thesw atrocity. Kirk do you know some who are particularly effectivw?
demi-uhhhhhhhh i have that same song stuck in my head……been tryin’ to get it out for a while now, but then i realized it was kinda pleasant and decided to explore it for a while……lotsa memories……..
i can’t count the times i have been taken back by the ’kids’,now adults, who i played ’auntie’ to, that i took the time to do what you did…who said later how they remembered it..i was shocked they remembered, but they did……..is as good as gold……solid memory bank they use later…….and then they do it in their own lives.
thanks.
beerfart–i don’t even know ’sidewalks of new york’, but won’t do…….even in cincinnati in bars when new york new york would come on we would all gather and sway together, and sing loud, even in ohio……….so, i even without knowing the other song, i can’t imagine it replacing it since it held sway in ohio and we weren’t even new yorkers.
Yankee home games: Frank’s if they win, Liza’s (the original iirc) if they lose. Actually, I think I like Sidewalks better, too, but they’re both good sing-alongs.
Thanks, Kirk. Reading this late. Hard to wrap my mind around it. Knowing that the abstract evil is out there, but hearing the literal horror …. concrete events…
Inculcated in the cultural norm of depravity … so well put. Denial…. boiling frogs…. desensitization… learned helplessness … the status quo is depraved. It is so not part of the solution it is the problem. We are all enablers to this monstrousness.
Listening to a program on AirAmerica I think they said of the imports brought into this country last year, 40% of them came from China. And 90% of those were recalled. If I got that right. Then they were talking about how so many cheap toys… okay.. 70-80% of all toys from there exposed kids to toxins. I was trying to jot down the statistics but they were blowing my mind and maybe I got them twisted… but you get the idea.
So you got death squads over bananas and children being poisoned from greed and incompetence.
Remember Yosarian in Catch 22? If you aren’t acting crazy in a crazy situation you are crazy, but if you are sane enough to go crazy from a crazy situation then you can’t get out of the situation … i.e…. war because you are sane enough to go crazy from it.
And how about the Kevin McCarthy version of Invasion of the Body Snatchers. Lots of pod people who went to sleep on us. I have been dozing a lot myself over these years.
I read in a book by Robin Norwood that living with an alcoholic is like having a car accident every day. The level of shock and stress. Chronic shock and stress. Having our addict personalities at the helm of this country … well, there you go. We go…..
I nominate Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.
His Ring of Fire show on Air America is proof he knows who’s burying the bodies and where.
I agree. Let’s hope we have an Attorney General that looks after our interests not those of our corporate “citizens”. I really think that we need to make our feelings known about this crap long before the election and so I applaud Christy for taking the first step in that direction.
I’ve been wondering about Obama’s choice for AG for about 6 weeks, brought it up on a drug law reform listserv trying to get ideas.
Looking at Holder’s Wikipedia entry shows someone suggesting the following short list:
Eric Holder
Former Senator John Edwards,
Arizona Governor Janet Napolitano,
Alabama Congressman Artur Davis,
Michigan Governor Jennifer Granholm.
All of the above have links embedded in Holder’s entry. None seem particularly inspiring or likely to have fire in the belly to make it a department of Justice as opposed to a department of law.
wmd1961, I’m not familiar with Napolitano, Davis, or Granholm’s work as attorneys; I don’t know how much (if any) time they spent being paid to represent corporations and/or corporate officers.
Based on Edwards’ career litigating against corporate interests, I’d like to see his values in the next AG.
On a broader level, readers above brought up the fact that Chiquita’s attorney Holder is also vetting Obama’s candidates for VP. (I don’t think I could stand to know if Senator Obama is also relying upon Holder to vet other Executive Branch appointees.)
Americans are reeling under energy “deregulation” (thanks for Enron, corporate lawyers); the bankruptcy “reform” (thanks for penury, corporate lawyers); lethal corporate health “insurance” non-coverage (thanks for death, corporate lawyers); epidemic levels of chemically induced cancer and endocrine disruption (thanks for infertility and more death, corporate lawyers); and offshoring/hollowing out of our manufacturing base (thanks for WTO/NAFTA’s gift of the Rust Belt, corporate lawyers).
Here’s a bright idea for Harvard Law grad Obama: Senator, haven’t we given corporate lawyers enough already? Start over with a selection committee with no corporate lawyers: no Holder, no one else from the corporate bar. We’ve had nearly thirty years of corporate lawyers running our health and our economies into – and under – the ground, Senator.
We deserve better, Senator – please deliver on the fine rhetoric about change.
On a broader level, just a word about optics. Unfair as it may be, the Rethugs will try to make hay about Senator Obama’s connections with Rezko.
Holder failed to recuse himself when his buddy requested a pardon for Mark Rich: we all know how well that worked out.
Holder also chose to accept Chiquita – after 4,000 AK-47’s went through Chiquita’s private port to death squad terrorists – as his client.
No one made Senator Obama accept Holder to vet his candidates for Veep or any other Executive office. And only Senator Obama can free himself of the connotations a person with Holder’s history of poor choices would bring to your campaign and or administration.
I want to see Senator Obama win because I want our Republic and people free of the deadly effects of corporate power. That’s why I hope to see Senator Obama’s campaign – and President Obama’s administration – take affirmative steps to close the corporate bar out of the White House and the Executive Branch.
If not now – when we are literally dying at home and in Iraq from unchecked corporate power – when?
oops – bungled order of snip in above
please consult original
would correct, but comments close in less thanone minute
final two graphs should precede snip