Comments on: First Monday: The Moment Has Arrived — The Fight For Fundamental Freedom In California http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/ Firedoglake weblog Sat, 18 Feb 2012 04:28:23 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: rwcole http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475076 rwcole Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:37:10 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475076 <p>Thought it was Mass. that lit the fuse on this issue.</p> Thought it was Mass. that lit the fuse on this issue.

]]> By: Christy Hardin Smith http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475074 Christy Hardin Smith Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:35:47 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475074 <p>Seth, thanks so much for being here today and discussing all of this — and for all of your grassroots efforts on this and many other issues. Great discussion!</p> Seth, thanks so much for being here today and discussing all of this — and for all of your grassroots efforts on this and many other issues. Great discussion!

]]> By: looseheadprop http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475071 looseheadprop Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:34:09 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475071 <p>As a New yorker, I’m enjoying the executive activism shown by Governor Paterson. </p> <p>By framing the NY response as “we will give full faith and credit” to marriages allowed by other states. He gave powerful momentum, while still managing to essentially pre-empt the GOP controlled state senate and largely taking the issue out of legislative hands for a period of time.</p> <p>This will allow NY institutions whether academic or health care or workplace to establish and refine procedures relating to same sex marriages and dispel any of the fearmogering with a track record of smooth operation</p> As a New yorker, I’m enjoying the executive activism shown by Governor Paterson.

By framing the NY response as “we will give full faith and credit” to marriages allowed by other states. He gave powerful momentum, while still managing to essentially pre-empt the GOP controlled state senate and largely taking the issue out of legislative hands for a period of time.

This will allow NY institutions whether academic or health care or workplace to establish and refine procedures relating to same sex marriages and dispel any of the fearmogering with a track record of smooth operation

]]> By: BobbyG http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475068 BobbyG Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:26:53 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475068 <p>Great thread. Thanks for being here.</p> Great thread. Thanks for being here.

]]> By: Seth Kilbourn http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475064 Seth Kilbourn Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:19:32 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475064 <p>Thanks everyone for a great discussion. I need to run, but I will check back later and try to answer any additional comments or questions. Meantime, please do everything you can to get involved, including joining the <a href="http://www.equalityforall.com" rel="nofollow">Equality For All</a> campaign. We need your help to win!</p> Thanks everyone for a great discussion. I need to run, but I will check back later and try to answer any additional comments or questions. Meantime, please do everything you can to get involved, including joining the Equality For All campaign. We need your help to win!

]]> By: Blub http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475059 Blub Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:15:01 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475059 <p>OK. First of all. Can we make this fight one between Californians, as much as possible? I think the first attacks on gay marriage were in response to the earlier San Francisco marriages were foreign organizations based in Arizona and Virginia. I don’t mind debating this issue with groups from Bakersfield and Victorville, but when groups in Fresno become front organizations for militant jihadist carpet baggers from across the Colorado River, it’s just too much. I know this is all but impossible, but I think we should do what we can to curtail out-of-state contributions to the constitutional referendum campaigns, on both sides. Just a thought…</p> OK. First of all. Can we make this fight one between Californians, as much as possible? I think the first attacks on gay marriage were in response to the earlier San Francisco marriages were foreign organizations based in Arizona and Virginia. I don’t mind debating this issue with groups from Bakersfield and Victorville, but when groups in Fresno become front organizations for militant jihadist carpet baggers from across the Colorado River, it’s just too much. I know this is all but impossible, but I think we should do what we can to curtail out-of-state contributions to the constitutional referendum campaigns, on both sides. Just a thought…

]]> By: MadelineBassett http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475058 MadelineBassett Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:14:36 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475058 <p>Seth–I just wanted to say thanks again for being here today, as well as all of the work you do.</p> Seth–I just wanted to say thanks again for being here today, as well as all of the work you do.

]]> By: Seth Kilbourn http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475057 Seth Kilbourn Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:13:05 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475057 <p>I want to reiterate something I said in my post: The results of the California campaign to defeat this constitutional amendment will have a dramatic impact on the trajectory towards equal rights for LGBT people not just in California, but across the country. If we lose, those who oppose equality for gays and lesbians are not only going to have the momentum to stop further progress in other states, they will have momentum to go after rights and protections that already exist. For the LGBT community, California is ground zero for our fight. What happens here in 2008 will reverberate across the country for a very very long time. We need to ensure the reverberation gives US the momentum and not them.</p> I want to reiterate something I said in my post: The results of the California campaign to defeat this constitutional amendment will have a dramatic impact on the trajectory towards equal rights for LGBT people not just in California, but across the country. If we lose, those who oppose equality for gays and lesbians are not only going to have the momentum to stop further progress in other states, they will have momentum to go after rights and protections that already exist. For the LGBT community, California is ground zero for our fight. What happens here in 2008 will reverberate across the country for a very very long time. We need to ensure the reverberation gives US the momentum and not them.

]]> By: Hugh http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475053 Hugh Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:06:30 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475053 <p>I agree. I don’t see restrictions based on sexual orientation as any different than the racial ones in Plessy v. Ferguson.</p> I agree. I don’t see restrictions based on sexual orientation as any different than the racial ones in Plessy v. Ferguson.

]]> By: Seth Kilbourn http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475052 Seth Kilbourn Mon, 02 Jun 2008 20:06:03 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/02/first-monday-the-moment-has-arrived-the-fight-for-fundamental-freedom-in-california/#comment-1475052 <p>It is just that “hierarchy” that the court talked about in its decision. They basically said there is no reason to have two systems unless one group is inherently less worthy than the other. They based that finding not only on the California Constitution but also the public policy of the state–the decades long work I referred to in my post of getting laws passed in California and case law established that makes very clear gay and lesbian Californians must be treated equally under the law. This kind of public policy and case law was missing in some of the other states where the courts ruled against marriage. Its really important to have the foundation laid for the courts–and now hopefully the voters–to make the right decisions.</p> It is just that “hierarchy” that the court talked about in its decision. They basically said there is no reason to have two systems unless one group is inherently less worthy than the other. They based that finding not only on the California Constitution but also the public policy of the state–the decades long work I referred to in my post of getting laws passed in California and case law established that makes very clear gay and lesbian Californians must be treated equally under the law. This kind of public policy and case law was missing in some of the other states where the courts ruled against marriage. Its really important to have the foundation laid for the courts–and now hopefully the voters–to make the right decisions.

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