What…no GritTV?

Good morning!

Good morning Toby, egregious, and Marion

I had the Rules Committee meeting on all afternoon, but I’m not up on the nuance and details. However, I was glad to meet Florida State Senator Arthenia Joyner, she spoke for Clinton. She and Rep. Wexler both gave great impassioned pleas for their cases. Sometimes Wexler is too “too” for me, but yesterday he was good. I also liked listening to Sen. Levin on Michigan.

I sure liked Arthenia, would like to see her on the national stage.

Mornin’, I think.

Elliott, my experimental waffles and I are here. I’ve not been on the toobz much in the last 2 days, so I’m a bit vague on exactly who Arthenia Joyner is, other than a Rep. from FL and a Clinton supporter… What have I missed?

‘Morning, Ellie. Thanks for serving up the list of debacles we can watch this morning.

Ickes on MTP should be tasty, although match him up against Daschle isn’t what I’d consider equitable.

I was actually disappointed in Sen. Levin yesterday; while I understand his point about the need for diversity in the primary lineup, I came away from a chat with him a couple of weeks ago thinking he was taking a more measured approach to the settlement of delegate seating, not expecting at all that he would threaten to take the situation to the convention if a resolution on future primary scheduling wasn’t addressed. Talk about throwing the baby out with the bathwater…

I just thought she gave good speech, and had spunk and spirit, plus a killer smile. Won’t judge the argument she made for Clinton, but I sure liked her.

Here’s her State Rep page

well that won’t be any help. I was reacting to the passion I heard I guess. I don’t want it to go all the way to the Convention, I want to beat McCain.

morning jayt, not quite woke up this morning?

Morning all.

Mr.Cbl

I don’t want it to go all the way to the Convention, I want to beat McCain.

Thank you. The sooner we have a nominee the sooner we can start cleaning McCain’s clock. He needs to be beaten like a gong.

Is it true that “Ickes” means “irascible and irrational” in the Land of Clintonia?

I do hope that someone will feel strong enough to watch the Timmeh and Scottie show and let us know what occurs. I just can’t bring myself to watch him. It may be something about the jowls, or maybe that nose… And of course, there’s just the fact that it’s Timmeh.

morning jayt, not quite woke up this morning?

all right – that’s just plain weird – I was getting ready to throw up that same link. (you’re obviously a lady of taste and distinction).

And no, I don’t trust anything before I’ve got at least one cup of coffee in me…

I think “Ickes” means “snarling hired gun of old-school machine politics.”

(nuts, just got a database error…everything okay with the squirrels this morning?)

It’s not on here until 10:00, I may tape it, then I can pick and choose the bits I want to see. It is hard for me to watch, all he is is “gotcha gotcha, I’m gonna getcha” He doesn’t even listen to the answers to his own questions.

the squirrels do seem squirrely

What was the bit between Ickes and Wexler yesterday? Ickes wouldn’t answer Wexler about something.

to watch the Timmeh and Scottie show

I’m wondering as to the extent it’s a “Re-Union Show”.

I’ve been getting those all the time. I’m not sure if that is the warning sign that FDL is having a migraine or what..

Will Scott bring up the fact that Timmeh is Cheney’s go to guy in the media? Time for Russert to retire to the pumpkin patch.

that’s kind of a relief – I thought it was my machine.

Will Scott bring up the fact that Timmeh is Cheney’s go to guy in the media?

Same as my thought @18. I think it’s safe to say that it won’t be *Timmeh* who brings it up…

You know, I was so deep into the event yesterday, typing as fast as my fingers would let me, that some content rolled right through me unprocessed. I didn’t catch it all. I think it was this bit that was in contention:

In response to Clinton Campaign member and RBC member Harold Ickes’ question, Rep. Wexler asks the RBC to recognize that the number of delegates awarded under the Ausman petition is at least as much or more than Clinton won outright in Pennsylvania and Ohio primaries combined. Wexler also makes the point under questioning that candidates should not be penalized for complying with the DNC’s and RBC’s rules.

Wexler was pressing this point pretty firmly, that there was a concession to Clinton here that was of substantial value, and that Obama (and too late, Edwards) and their supporters and voters shouldn’t be further punished for their willingness to comply with the DNC’s rules.

Well, last week I seemed to get a “database error” message and then i could not access the site .. sometimes for hours.. for those of us with tin foil hats in our desk drawers, this is heavy paranoia territory.

I wouldn’t worry too much. Being both a tinfoil adherent and a geek, I feel comfortable with assuming this is a case of the backend (either software or hardware) not keeping up with demand. Doesn’t seem like a DNS to me.

sub-peona??? Was that you? LOL!!

ahh, thanks.

I’m not tuned in to the details of all this, but I can see why emptywheel always refers to it as a clusterf*ck. So you were there all day, too? of course, I should have known!

Was the tossing out of the Hillary supporters warranted or was that political theater?

for those of us with tin foil hats in our desk drawers,

Scarecrow told me the other morning that tin-foil is passe – he’s now into lead.

He may be on to something…

No, it’s a verb, and is conjugated thusly:

icko
ickas
ickat
ickatamus
ickatamis
ickant

It means to be a prickly putz while looking supremely arrogant and bored.

It means to be a prickly putz while looking supremely arrogant and bored.

wow – he’s good….

Oh no, I wasn’t there, watched the entire debacle up to the lunch break on C-SPAN yesterday in order to liveblog the coverage.

Being in Michigan, I had a vested interest in the outcome, particularly since I’m an elected official in the party and a participant in the state district conventions last month that selected the pledged delegates.

All Democrats are divided into three parts, one of which the Baracks’ inhabit, the Clintoni another, those who in their own language are called The Others, in ours them, the third. All these differ from each other in language, customs and laws.

Caesar would be proud o’you!! Illegitimus non carborundum!

You know what, the airways are ours

Talk to the hand.

Good Morning Elliot and Firedogs,

thank you for all those links Elliot – lotta work there – much appreciated.

firedogs can include this in any reminders y’all send out.

btw, thought ickes was an aquarium parasite – Harold, the bane of goldfish everywhere.

Harold Ickes, a committee member and Clinton adviser, said she was reserving the right to contest the decision into the summer. ~ NYTimes

When will this long national nightmare end?

Just happened to me for about 45 minutes, but other folks seemed to be able to access FDL. Server migration issues? I’m pretty much tabula rasa about how the interwebs toobz really function…

Good Morning everyone……

It is bright and sunny here in AZ… (of course – the weather channel states …. abundant sunshine) AND not one solar power generating plant in the state (yet)

although we’ll tivo Press the Meat, don’t expect McClelland to timmeh Timmeh with any gotcha’s – he represents a strain of Texas men who are unfailingly polite and would never dream of “being rude” as a guest in someone’s home.

and whither goest Lanny ?? wha ?, no public appearances till the Haldol wears off ?!?!?

Scott McClellan author “What Happened: Inside the Bush White House and Washington’s Culture of Deception.”

I am starting to wonder just what is going on…this is a corporate owned media, why are they giving Scotty’s book play?

it can’t be because of us, if everyone remembers, the official government minutes from england that documented the president was lying us into war, the minutes which came to be called “the downing street memo”

that was much more important and much more verify able and we were incensed

that was not given any play at all, yet Scott is on every single show every day of the week

so what is going on, is the corporate world throwing the president under the bus right now?

I really don’t get it

Is there a typo in the time for Book Salon/Sirota? 5 pm eastern, shouldn’t fdl time be 2, not 8?

Was the tossing out of the Hillary supporters warranted or was that political theater?

I don’t know the answer to that, but it did bring up the specter of the Wall Street Riot…

The media may be slowly realizing that there will be a VERY large broom in November that will be sweeping VERY clean and it may be dawning on them that they’ve been backing the wrong horse.

Short answer to your bus question: yes.

Also, if the Base Servile Media are talking with L’il Scottie [ooops, wait, that’s Barney…], then they can pretend the Pentagon Propaganda Generals weren’t actively pimpin’ IraqWar on their networks.

And whazzup with McCain’s private two-hour trip to Walter Reed?

When will this long national nightmare end?

When Hillary stops listening to Harold Ickes, a committee member and Clinton adviser?

And she really should, in a very pragmatic way. If Obama, who *is* The Candidate, loses to John McCain, Hillary could become the most hated member of the Democratic Party, or in the country at large, EVAH.

Actually I thought the RBC chairs were VERY patient and should of threatened to clear the spectators if they continued to disrupt the meeting. I

t was only a handful from what I understand and there was no reasoning with them on the order of business or just plain “what your Momma taught ya when in public”

So glad everyone’s back. I was afraid I was going to have to tap dance!

sad but true

Short answer to your bus question: yes.

but this does not make sense, he would be impeached if they were throwing him under the bus

in addition, this bus throwing under stuff, it guarantees obama wins the election

it is not making sense

btw, thought ickes was an aquarium parasite – Harold, the bane of goldfish everywhere.

.
TAGG posted this in another thread but surely applicable here:

URGENT!!! Please get this message to as many people as possible….
http://www-taggtheangrygayguy.com

Got it, thanks Prairie

yes, the torch has passed… there may still be some residue to deal with, but functionally the Clinton Era is over.

and perris @ 49:
Unfortunately throwing under the bus and impeachment are not an “if, then”–unless there is a groundswell of demand for a truth and accountability commission or impeachment process after the election.

Linky doesn’t work for me . . . ???

What I think is happening is that BushCo’s power to control the media is waining and that their ability to strong arm what is presented to the public is not being strictly controlled anymore…… that any NSA info on the press doesn’t hold the blackmail power or that ability to blackmail them to “behave” so that they have access isn’t a big deal either…. in 9 months this crew will be out of the WH ….. and everyone knows it too..

Linky busted…

I see why. After the www there is a – in the link. SHould be a .

they are making sure scotty gets as much air time as possible

something big is being worked behind closed doors but I just can’t figure it out, corporate america cannot possibly want obama as president yet they are providing the inusrance

When will this long national nightmare end?

our nightmare will wake up when the whole of the citizenry awakes.

Oh, you were talking about the primary… :)
answer to your question, Wednesday. You read it here first.

Here’s doctored link

I think the question is whether they were merely voicing their displeasure, or if they were disrupting proceedings. Since I wasn’t there, I can’s say; if they were acting like Harriet Christian did on camera, there may have been a reasonable need to eject people. The RBC members have been barraged for some time with opinions on the subject of MI and FL seating plans; to be verbally abused to excess while trying to deliberate fairly and openly is uncalled for.

And as resident of one of the two states, let me point out that the folks I’ve seen on video being belligerent aren’t from MI or FL.

oops! sorry
try this
http://www.tagg-theangrygayguy…..m-cdc.html

Oh, crap, I give up. Doctored link doesn’t work either. (sigh)

and perris @ 49:
Unfortunately throwing under the bus and impeachment are not an “if, then”–unless there is a groundswell of demand for a truth and accountability commission or impeachment process after the election.

actually, if this is indeed a corporate media and if they are indeed insuring scott gets heard, then they are the ones setting the stage for an impeachment

if an impeachment happens we will know it was pre arranged behind closed doors, not with the president but against the president

this is looking very very strange to me, this book is hardly as important as numerous other books and quite a few revelations

very very strange

Thanks for putting together this excellent lineup of what’s to choose from this day, Elliott. Nobody can argue anymore that they don’t know what’s going on with all these resources.

And there’s a karma to seeing MTP bumped down from the front page *g* — altho I’ll prolly choose that over the headache-making of McAuliffe.

Hey, Jason Linkins over at HuffPo does a terrific wrapup on many of the gasbag shows–good for lotsa laughs.

THE first thing is that Obama must NOT mention ANY plans of busting up corporate media strangle hold….. Thom Hartman’s theory is that Howard Dean was the media darling until he stated that before the Iowa primary and then it turned on him…..

It should be our job to say it and wait until Obama takes off AND then push it like crazy….. have our new AG John Edwards do some trust busting … heehee…

Great link! Pups, please read. National epidemic alert!!

see my #61, we have the best techsters in the neighborhood.

oh thanks, will check him out tonight.

I think I saw one borderline hysterical woman on videoclip this morning mention she was from MO.

‘Struth that every state party has its gadflies. Don’t get me started on the ex-stripper in ND. Oh, well, since you asked…at least the Rethugs have her. But Bush put her on the US Civil Rights Commission as the ND representative. Tells me a whole lot about ol’ Gee-Dubya.

Two reasons:

1) The money people have figured out since the Bear Stearns crash exactly how bad off we are. (Want a refresher? Look closely at the chart Ian Welsh posted last week with his piece here at FDL on food and oil prices — the Wall Street folks know this, and they know the root causes.) We are literally on the verge of another Great Depression, and only sheer dint of political will can save our asses.

2) Internecine warfare between the money people, specifically between the GE/NBC folks and the Murdoch/Fox folks. The GE folks are very much part of the money people above, and have likely come to the realization that change is good and will benefit them. Murdoch, on the other hand, has built his empire on a particular brand of hatemongering and it won’t thrive under change. So GE/NBC took the lead last week with promoting the Scotty Show, while Murdoch/Fox could only rage against the dying of the light.

Well said….

the issue is that this was a official meeting of an organization that was allowed open to the public so that it would be open and transparent but anyone who has attempted to Chair a meeting and maintain order knows…… especially with Democrats…..

Personally there should of been a warning to those hecklers ….. if you disrupt the proceedings of this meeting then security will have to escort you out of the hall.

that was not given any play at all, yet Scott is on every single show every day of the week

ah perris – you apparently have never seen Mean Girls. – Topical Storm Scotty has blown through Beltway Senior High and in it’s wake revealed not just their failure to exercise their duty as mandated by the Founders – but this is the whole kewl kidz dynamic writ large – these petty klowns love, love, love their gossip doncha know . . .and Scott left his Burnbook at the lunchtable and . . .

That one doesn’t work for me either…???

I think that there were warnings from at least one of the co-chairs about disruption.

And although I wasn’t there, I’ll bet people were warned by security folks about disruption. You’ll likely hear from protesters that they didn’t hear any such warning, but I’ve been at enough events like this that I’m pretty certain it’s clear to people that being an asshole will have consequences.

I’m going to bring up another sensitive issue here that hasn’t been discussed anywhere else that I can see. I know that in Grand Rapids at the Obama event where Edwards endorsed, that there were so-called pro-Clinton protesters who in fact were Republican operatives. (Have seen a photo of one known operative in the thick of it.) Has anyone asked whether this was a possible factor — that folks may have been riled up by opposition?

707!

Marion, Elliott and the techs succeeded where barbara failed (sigh). It’s a very important read!

When will this long national nightmare end?

it will end in 2012, I’m afraid.

Go around to various newspaper sites, and read the comments section about what happened yesterday. Read what Democrats who support Clinton are saying.

Yesterday, the corrupt manoevering of the Obama faction on the Rules committee guarnateed that millions of Democrats will not vote for Obama. (Some, but not all, will vote for McCain.)

When Bonier showed up and asked for FULL voting power for the ENTIRE Michigan delegation (if it was split 50-50) after Wexler said that Obama wanted HALF voting power for the people of Florida, Obama’s utter contempt for voters was made manifest.

But the icing on the cake was the complete lack of respect shown to Hillary Clinton — actually stealing delegates from her in order to placate Obama in complete violation of the rules and Charter of the party — was the icing on the cake.

I guess what really kills me is that Obama supporters think that he will bring a new kind of politics to Washington to get things done — the politics of ‘unity’ and ‘hope’ — yet he has been the most divisive candidate that I’ve seen since I started voting 35 years ago.

Shorter Icky (and this is a direct quote from MTP a few moments ago):

“Circumstances change.”

I think Harold has a great future as a Hollywood studio exec.

p.luk, I’ve already seen you frequenting newspapers around the country leaving comments.

wow – that is one big-ass fire at Universal Studios in Los Angeles.

I completely agree that it could be Repug operatives….. since Americablog reported that they received an email about the protest from HRC support group stating that 10K were going to show up with both McCain & Huckabee supporters to fill out the crowd…..

The Repug machine have 15 tons of research on HRC but Obama scares the pooh out of them…… they try to dig stuff up and come up with things that everyone knows is silly……

p. luk try reading this Legal Analysis: Why Ickes is Wrong & Should Resign

in order for ANY delegates to be ‘stolen’, those delegates must have been approved in the first place.

According to the RBC ruling in effect during the period of the 2008 primary elections in MI & FL, no allocation of delegates whatsoever could be sanctioned.

Therefore, the only time that any delegate in either state could possibly be recognized as valid was AFTER yesterday’s acceptance of a majority vote by the RBC to amend its sanctions against MI & FL.

Just checked Newsmeat for donations that meet the $200 threshold for reporting to FEC — neither Harriet Christian or Deborah Foster show up as donors in the state of New York.

Both had the resources to travel to Washington DC, though.

I’m going to hold open the notion that the Republican Party had a vested interest in making things nasty yesterday. More research and facts could close this as an option, but after seeing this in play in Michigan, it can’t yet be ruled out.

Interesting, saw some of Sandy Weil with his good buddy Charlie Rose the other night, sure got the impression (although it was unsaid) that the $M$o$n$e$y$bags-on-Wall-Street’s first priority was to protect their own big fat mostly white ass bottomline. I surely don’t know enough about high finance or even our current high-risk finance; but the vibe I got was there are a lot of individual people who stood to lose everything and they wouldn’t/couldn’t let that happen.

I fully admit I am biased against the $M$o$n$e$y$bags on Wall Street, but I have bad vibe about our economy, depressioned bad vibe.

The RBC members have been barraged for some time with opinions on the subject of MI and FL seating plans; to be verbally abused to excess while trying to deliberate fairly and openly is uncalled for.

except, of course, that didn’t happen (in violation of the charter, btw). The reason that this didn’t go on until midnight was because the fix was in — they made the deal at lunch, and that was that — ten minutes to discuss each resolution, and then a complete trashing of the rules of the Democratic Party to give Obama maximum feasible political advantage.

Seriously — there was no effort to deliberate fairly — no rationale was offered for either resolution that passed, no one got a chance to demand to know under what provision of the rules could that committee take delegates WON by one candidate and give them to another candidate (the Credentials committee could do that, but if you bother to read the rules — which of course no one on this site has apparently done — stealing the Clinton delegates was COMPLETELY corrupt…)

This was Chicago politics — make a backroom deal that ignores every principle of good governance and fair play, and everybody who is on board gets a cut of the profits.

Rayne — I guess now Obama supporters have a problem with free speech?

Seriously — DO NOT complain about Bush violating or ignoring laws after what YOUR candidate engineered yesterday. Because YOU are now supporting Bush III.

you’re serious aren’t you!?!
fire at Universal Studios

More than 100 Los Angeles-area firefighters are battling a large fire on a back lot at Universal Studios, fire authorities said.

There were also reports of an explosion in the Southern California amusement park, said Los Angeles County Fire Capt. Frank Reynoso.

The three-alarm blaze began about 4:45 a.m. PT (7:45 a.m. ET) Sunday and reportedly damaged two “prop” buildings, including a chapel, and a popular ride called the “Cyclone,” Reynoso said.

“It will be awhile before we have it under control,” he said.

Both had the resources to travel to Washington DC, though.

ON A BUS. HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE SOMEONE OF BEING A REPUBLICAN PLANT BECAUSE THEY CAN”T AFFORD TO GIVE $200 TO CLINTON?

this is despicable. utterly and absolutely despicable.

Besides watching the talking head shows….. What is everyone doing today?

Stop. Really. If you are from FL, fine, talk about your state’s politics.

But you know nothing about Michigan’s politics, or how much debate had already been conducted in state.

Emptywheel told you that yesterday at least twice, too, since you’ve apparently forgotten; if you don’t know what you’re talking about, just stop with the accusations.

Mr. lukusiak: What is it that you want now? Do you want the Dem. candidate to lose to McCain so your candidate can run again in 2012? What is your “end game?” I’m just curious.

Good Morning. Today I ventured to the Fox Tv channel and discovered that the round table decided that Scotty was just upset because he was fired. Nobody called Scotty a liar though.

couldn’t resist

Hey cool, I’m away for 2 days an the conversation hasn’t changed. luku+luna?

Sometimes you just can’t hold a reasonable discussion with some commenters. FYI most Floridians voted knowing that their vote would not count for President but that their vote for the property tax issue would. Is Meet The Press worth watching today?

oh thanks for the review, I usu watch the “AllStars” but didn’t get a chance today.

On thing Obama could do to promote party unity would be to respectfully request of Donna Brazile that she take a 6 month sabbatical.
She is poison with the Clinton crowd. And, frankly, although I don’t fully agree with it, after watching Donna Brazile on This Week, I am staring to understand it.

katymine: are you going back to Crete this summer?

Stop with the poo flinging.

I didn’t say that you had no right to comment. You asked people to check out news sites around the country, and I already have — and one thing I noticed before you showed up here at FDL this morning is that you’d already been commenting at various news sites. Apparently I’m no longer allowed to make observations or share them.

Secondly, I didn’t accuse either Christian or Foster of being Republicans or their operatives. I am saying that we should be looking further into the possibility that the Democratic and democratic processes you’ve been having a temper tantrum about have been gamed and manipulated by Republicans. This picture, for example, clearly shows a known Republican operative here in Michigan, involved in a pro-Clinton/anti-Obama protest in Grand Rapids.

Anybody else have a problem with what I said?

that answers some of it but not all

the cia vette this book, now I know there are professionals in the cia but there are also karlyle moles and bush’s father does have his son to protect

how did this book get approved for release?

why is scotty getting play instead of something more troubling like the torture programs and how we’ve LOST information and destroyed our ability to broker treaties

there are more stories that are better, there are better instances of depravity

this must be the first chapter in the book which will culminate at the election I suppose

and I agree, the finanacial institutions must FINALLY realise the neo con agenda will cost them dearly

It’s just like the loud mouth hysterics yesterday at the credentials meeting. Get in front of the camera and make it seem like someone gives a shit about Hillary’s crap.

Yep heading out for this years adventure on June 26th…. flying to Paris, a road trip through France, fly out of Milan Italy to Crete for a week at my favorite place…. coming home on July 19th … woohoo…

Katymine I hope you will write to us when you are overseas. Sounds like a great trip!

Hey, I don’t have answers, just like the rest of the gang.

But think about this: if they are so desperate for a change of subject that they’d let Scotty’s book go out unfettered, well…

I really don’t know whether to be gleeful or terrified.

katymine, I fit in a suitcase…

Oops, the squirrels burped again, submit comment hung and doubled comments above.

Must have gotten some contaminated squirrel chow from China.

That will cost xtra!

Mr. lukusiak: What is it that you want now? Do you want the Dem. candidate to lose to McCain so your candidate can run again in 2012? What is your “end game?” I’m just curious.

my ‘endgame’ is a democratic nominee who can win the white house that I can vote for. It doesn’t have to be Hillary Clinton — if the convention can come up with someone else, I’m totally cool with that. Clinton is merely the lesser of two evils to me…. but Obama is unacceptable to me and a LOT of other staunch democrats — and is going to be unacceptable to a majority of voters in November.

That’s why I suggest that you just sample what is showing up in newpaper comments sections — its not an organized effort, it is a spontaneous expression of anger… the same kind of anger that people on this board have expressed time and time again when Bushco does something outrageous.

Yet, rather than face that anger, Obama supporters are doing stuff like accusing a senior citizen of being a GOP plant — because she hasn’t contributed $200 to Clinton. The sheer ARROGANCE of assuming that every Clinton supporter can afford to give her $200 at a shot is astonishing. The fact that THESE KINDS OF ACCUSATIONS ARE SPEWWED ON THIS SITE ABOUT FELLOW DEMOCRATS WITHOUT COMMENT FROM ANYONE ELSE SHOWS YOU JUST HOW FAR FROM YOUR SO-CALLED PRINCIPLES YOU HAVE DESCENDED.

Your preaching to the choir. Firedoglakers tend to be democrats first and foremost. Fortunately we are able to express opinions and have a honest and reasonable discussions about matters that are important to all of us. P Luk is not interested in honest and reasonable discussion so after yesterday his/her comments are invisible to me and I just skip over them.

sounds awesome.

I liked Crete. If I ever go back I would stay on the Chania side of the island. We stayed near Istro. It looked a lot like So. California (where we live) so it was kind of ho hum. We enjoyed Knossos and Kritsa.

The hotel in Paris has wifi and so does the one in Crete…. if I can wrangle a puter (big question is …. will Elmore share is mac?) will check in off and on…

Can you recommend a good book on ancient Crete history? Have you been to the palace, will you be in Knossos?

OOO, look, he knows how to type in all caps. . .

perris,
I do not think the CIA had any role in vetting this book by McClellan. He was not a CIA employee. He did have security clearances and the overall security apparatus would have had to do some vetting of it for verification of no classified information but the total classified industry within the US Government is far more than just the CIA.

Gosh I wish I could stick around, you are priceless!

thanks for sharing that.

On this Sunday morning, I will pray that God gives you peace and a sense of his/her presence.

You sound very much like many Teddy Kennedy supporters I knew back in 1980, far more willing to have the Dem nominee lose to the Republican to prove a point than to actual win an election.

How did that work out for us as a country?

Yeah. I find it difficult to listen to people when they’re shouting at me…

Never been to Crete, sounds really interesting! We think of things that are a couple hundred years old as really ancient, but that’s laughable when you get to a place like Crete, where time is measured in thousands of years.

Been to Knossos several times. I lived in Crete 31 years ago for a year and went there several times. It was more run down last summer and parts were closed such as the Queens chambers but it was as lovely as I remember….

No I don’t know of a book but can be on the look out…

lina we stay at a village called Piscopanio which is up the hill from Chersonisos which was the village I lived but now is a HOT tourist trap…

More poo flinging.

You won’t find my name in the FEC reports, either — but I’m a Democratic activist who gives one helluva lot of time. There are folks out there who could also point to me and ask about my background since they won’t find my name in FEC reports in spite of being a Dem activist.

But that cuts both ways: that known Republican operative in the photo I linked also has no record of donations to Republicans with the FEC. But we know he has worked for multiple Republican campaigns.

As I already said once, I’m going to hold open the notion that the Republican Party had a vested interest in making things nasty yesterday. More research and facts could close this as an option, but after seeing this in play in Michigan, it can’t yet be ruled out.

Unless you have facts on your side that you can share, you’re just having a very ugly temper tantrum that does not reflect well on you.

What is wrong with lukisiak expressing his opinions?
I don’t agree with much of what he has to say, but I am not offended or threatened by it.

Apparently the one thing that some Clinton supporters can not forgive Obama for is that he won.

Along these lines there are those white working class Americans that Clinton referred to whose primary problem with Obama is his position on being black, i.e. that he is.

The thing that was interesting to learn or relearn about Crete is how many different nations/city-states who conquered the island starting 4500 years ago…. they fought, lost some and held off others for thousands of years… every where you go there are monuments to or for some battle…

Lovely Monastery had a whole room with weapons used to hold off one siege… they were called the fighting monks …

I think that Americans have become complacent with their freedom and independence…. Cretans have fought to have it for thousands of years…

Maybe if the opinion could be expressed WITHOUT SHOUTING AT PEOPLE…

Like I said yesterday during the RBC meeting, Juno has been reincarnated. I had hoped we would be spared the inane shit but obviously Juno has just changed names and now appears as someone else. Oh, well, I can ignore lukasiak just as I did Juno. I did give him the courtesy of reading his comments yesterday, for a time. When it became obvious he just wanted to throw shit around the room I just said fuck it, not worth my time.

It’s fiction but Mary Renault’s The King Must Die is considered a good representation I believe. From wiki:

he King Must Die is a 1958 Bildungsroman and historical novel by Mary Renault that traces the early life and adventures of Theseus, a hero in Greek mythology. Naturally, it is set in Ancient Greece: Troizen, Corinth, Eleusis, Athens, Knossos in Crete, and Naxos. Rather than retelling the myth, Renault constructs an archeologically possible story that might have developed into the myth. She captures the essentials while removing the more fantastical elements, such as monsters and the appearances of gods. The King Must Die was lauded by critics, with New York Times reviewer Orville Prescott calling it “one of the truly fine historical novels of modern times.” Renault wrote a sequel, The Bull from the Sea, in 1962.

Yo, Raven.

Pssst…. David is upstairs…

Kowabunga, dudes. What happened while we were eating breakfast? Poofling goin’ on. OG, I agree with you. Had the same reaction to the late Juno. Whatever. I’ll read and ponder. But as Marion said, what’s with the shouting dealie? Make that, “What’s with the SHOUTING DEALIE?” /s

perino said the cia vett the book and the president had it for over a month

I’m fascinated with the growing evidence from the Santorini eruption and it’s role as cause of the decline of Crete, and I’m also interested in the real Phoenicians.

I am really looking forward to your trip picture diary. :)

SD Good Morning
You don’t really think they are the same person, do you?

thanks for the recommend Richard, will check it out. :)

Yes, I enjoyed Juno, too. And, she didn’t shout. But really, group think can be dangerous. We all need to listen to and be challenged by differing views.

I don’t think so. Juno is smart and articulate, albeit borderline shrill. This “guy” is far more interested in pitting Dems against each other than speaking on Clinton’s behalf. Inane blather, but hey! Blather on. It doesn’t matter, does it?

The Theory that Santorini was Atlantas was part of the tour of of Knossos 30 years ago….. when archeology dig at Knossos they found a huge stone bowl over turned and when they turned it over it was full of oil, they think it was a lantern and weighted a ton or so…. that a tidal wave evidence was found at Knossos.

I think you mean the Venetians who built forts all over the Med… there are Venetian forts all over Crete both north and south coast…. they were from the city-state Venis Italy….

OK Russert starts out with the blow from Dole

(bows) Konnichiwa, demi

No. I did joke about Juno being reincarnated but they are definitely two different shit slingers. The occasional pertinent comment could be placed in a thimble and it would roll around like a BB in a boxcar.

Sometimes you just can’t hold a reasonable discussion with some commenters. FYI most Floridians voted knowing that their vote would not count for President but that their vote for the property tax issue would. Is Meet The Press worth watching today?

this is a flat out lie. Everyone in Florida knew that a challenge to the rules committee decision in November would be made.

In fact, every HONEST person realizes that there was never any intention to keep Florida and Michigan delegates out of the convention — the assumption was that on or soon after Super Tuesday, there would be a consensus candidate chosen by THE REST of the party, at which point the FL and MI delegations would be seated (possibly at 50%, but once consesnus was reached, voting strength wouldn’t matter).

If you bother to read the rules — and understand the history of those rules — you’d see that there are two provisions that prevent a state from jumping ahead. The FIRST is the 50% cut in the delegations. But the second is the crucial one — its the one that say that if a candidate campaign in a state that has been sanctioned for timing violations, that candidate could receive no delegates from that state.

The INTENT of the timing provision is twofold:
1) Make it possible for less well funded candidates to establish their viability in states where “retail politics” is possible (places like Iowa and New Hampshire…but there are other states where that applies as well).
2) ensure that the the decisions that come out of the early states include input from the various constituencies that make up the Democrat party.

The RBC overstepped their intended authority by sanctioning MI and FL 100% — there was no need to do so, since the “no delegates from the state” provision made it impossible for candidates to accomplish much of anything in states that had been sanctioned.

But this idea that “everyone knew their votes wouldn’t count” is pure BS, because even Donna Brazile isn’t stupid enough to think that it makes sense to treat the voters of Florida and Michigan with that much contempt when those voters were not at fault.

The problem arose when EVERYONE’S assumptions regarding how this race would evolve turned out to be wrong. Back when the decision was made, many, if not most, of the people on the committee were genuinely uncommitted (so when you see a Clinton supporter suggest that this whole thing has been a year long plot to screw Hillary, you’re looking at the Clinton equivalent of an Obot), and those that were supporting a particular candidate were not acting on behalf of that candidate when the decision was made.

Thanks to the over-reaching of the RBC last year, and the subsequent failure of expectations to pan out, the party now has a serious problem. And yesterday, they made the wrong choice — they had illegitimately completely disenfranchised Florida and Michigan voters by their over-reaching, and “half measures” would no longer suffice, because the voters in those states weren’t demanding “half-votes”, they were demanding that their voices be heard IN FULL.

The fact is that Florida should not have been penalized at all, because they did everything feasible to comply with the rules — the fact that some Florida legislators recognized that their efforts were pointless, and that the GOP legislature was going to do what it wanted, in no way should disqualify Florida from the “waiver” provisions that were specifically designed to address this kind of thing.

And had the committee sanctioned NH and IA (SC was, like Florida, completely under the control of a GOP legislature..and its move did not disrupt the ORDER of the primaries, which was a key consideration), Michigan would never have acted. But the committee is a bunch of egomaniacs — they’re like Cartman in his RESPECT MY AUTORITY! mode. So they screwed that up too.

But the fact remains — EVERYONE knew that Florida and Michigan would eventually be seated — that peoples votes would count.

And you take the word of Dana “Lying Sack of Cute” Peroxide? On anything?

not usually but it is not disputed by the publisher and in fact anyone with security clearance is gonna have to get their public work vette

this is bizarre

I’m in FL, heavily involved in the political scene, and you don’t know what you’re talking about.

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Firedoglakers tend to be democrats first and foremost

you’re right there… as long as the DNC makes sure that Obama gets the nomination by hook or by crook, you’re democrats first and foremost.

But it really is contingent upon you getting what you want from the party — because anyone who was truly ‘first and foremost’ a democrat would be outraged by what was done yesterday in their name. Being ‘first and foremost a democrat’ is supposed to MEAN something…and by acting as if what happened yesterday was not blatant political corruption, your acquiesence to what happened tells me that “democrats” are just as corrupt and venal as republicans.

here’s what’s also bothering me;

I was under the impression that if the president did do something to undermine justice for their covert assets being deliberately exposed that he would indeed suffer some “exposure” himself

this did begin to happen but to what avail?

the country let out a big yawn

and the vice president who was VERY vulnerable at the time is still in office, I was almost certain he would have “a health issue” and resign from office

but here we are today, discussing scotty, FAR from the the most important work exposing this presidency

FAR

so I am trying to see the game, I am trying to decipher their strategy, this is a tactic but where is the end game?

scotty does not have the importance in this grand picture to get all this play, he is after all, a pawn

I like the work of this pawn, he threatens to queeen after all.

but what is the game, what are the rules, how far till the end game?

Oh, good. There are a few people here that I do worry about sometimes and I’m so glad you’re not one of them.
(bowing back to you)
BTW, what was the tuxedo fitting for?
New dress code at work? Ha, I’m kidding too.

Firedoglakers tend to be democrats first and foremost

on this I take issue

we are “contitutionalists”

if a “democrat” goes lawless he will have him “unelected” if we can just as if a republican goes lawless

we are “constitutionalists” and perhaps there is the name for the third party this country so desperately calls for

Agree with perris. It’s a pretty big tent here, with a lot of brokenhearted libertarians and real conservatives who are sickened by what’s happend to our country. We have police, FBI, intell folks, etc who would like to see us return to the rule of law, not the rule of the king.

and the vice president who was VERY vulnerable at the time is still in office, I was almost certain he would have “a health issue” and resign from office
Oh, man, how many times have I wondered about that? Especially when Ted Kennedy’s diagnosis was reported.
Doesn’t seem fair, does it?

Good Morning EG
Now, it’s interesting that you say all that. I’ve been wondering if I’m becoming more (truely) conservative about some things lately. As in, what do I really believe and how tenacious I can be about them. Conservative, yet tolerant. Can that be?

where does the scotty game bring us?

where is the end game, will there be even more info released?

isn’t it interesting that the more he is interviewed the more is revealed?

why aren’t these easter eggs in the book?

is he being fed info for interview?

he is white marching forward as a pawn marches to queen, but the file he occupies

BUT HIS FILE IS BEING CLEARED BY BLACK!

You really don’t need sling ad hominems about here which is simply a lack of common courtesy. Everybody understands that you believe that anything which is unfavorable to Ms. Clinton is anti-democratic and now the Party hasn’t the authority to enforce it’s own rules. But please, anyone who dares to disagree with you is not necessarily a “liar”

We all get it, in fact understood it a month ago, how much you despise Obama and by extension, his supporters. You think the world is out to get the noble Hillary, who is the only salvation of our Country. I would be interested in hearing a rationalization of how you and your fellows love our Nation SO MUCH you are willing to let it go to McCain and his minions to be further destroyed. As I understand it, Clintonians are more than willing to punish us by allowing SCOTUS to go to the Federalist Society for the next 20 years or so and allow the Republican President to negate our advantage in Congress and further push the Unitary Executive. Your way or the highway.

My boss’s daughter is getting married on the 14th. I’ve known the family since Jody was knee high to a grasshopper. While not actually an official member of the wedding party, I’m being considered as a part of it. Wedding party = black tie. I told Jody that with my vet bill I couldn’t justify spending the money to rent a tux so she doesn’t know. I haven’t worn a tux since I got married. Gonna be fun.

off to work on this glorious sunday morning

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all

L8tr

Did Russert ask McClellan one question about the media? I missed the first half of the interview.

Tim’s questions for Tom Daschle got dumber and dumber. Do you want to be Obama’s VP? Do you want to be Chief of Staff? Will Obama declare himself the winner? Will Obama wear a blue tie or a red tie on Wednesday? God almighty.

It’s interesting watch old, old clips from MTP when they had a panel of top notch journalists questioning guests. Then watch any episode with Timmeh the Toady and the difference is stunning.

Elliot:

Thanks for the Kaki King video.

Apparently the one thing that some Clinton supporters can not forgive Obama for is that he won.

no, what we can’t forgive is that Obama assumes he has won, despite his abject failure since March to show any signs of being able to win in crucial swing states, losing 7 out of 11 primary contests, getting 500,000 fewer votes than Clinton in those contests.

In terms of winning the nomination, both Clinton and Obama LOST months ago when it became mathematically impossible for either of them to achieve a first ballot victory with pledged delegates won in primaries and caucuses. The fact that Obama lost by a little less is irrelevant, because once it was determined that he couldn’t win, it became a contest to prove to Super-delegates that THEY were the better candidate for the general election.

But Obama failed, and failed miserably, to make that case. He lost Texas — not exactly Clinton country. He lost Ohio by double digits — and those losses came at a time when he had all the money, media, and momentum in his favor.

And he lost a slew of other states as well — but more importantly, he showed that he could not adapt his campaign, and appeal to core democratic constituencies. The only voters that he’s “winning” is the Whole Foods nation — he’s not ‘winning’ the black vote, its being handed to him thanks to identity politics. And I’m not trashing identity politics — but when primary victories are built solely on the kind of ‘coalition’ that democrats consistently lose with — AND when Obama has not merely failed to win the support of other key consitutencies, but has deliberately alienated them, there is a very serious problem.

He’s simply unelectable.

Any Democrat who is really a democrat should have been outraged by the race-pimping that was done by the Obama campaign and its surrogates in South Carolina. I don’t CARE if you like Bill or Hillary Clinton or not — it SHOULD HAVE BEEN UNACCEPTABLE to every democrat when Donna Brazile lied about Bill Clinton’s ‘fairy tale’ comment. It should have been unacceptable when the Obama campaign said that people should make up their own minds about whether Hillary Clinton was denigrating the memory of MLK.

But it was accepted by all of you. And you went apeshit when Bill Clinton stated the obvious — that Obama won South Carolina just like Jesse Jackson did….on the strength of the black vote and thanks to identity politics. You all acted as if some white politician who came out of nowhere like Obama did would have gotten 78% of black support in South carolina.

Then, when Obama made his big “Wright” speech about the need for honest dialogue, you all thought it was the greatest thing since the Gettysburg address — but you were clearly NOT interested in an honest dialogue about race, not if you condemned Bill Clinton for perfectly reasonable remarks about the naure of Obama’s win in South Carolina.

What we can’t accept is a dishonest, race-pimping, underqualified, arrogant, LOSER as our party’s nominee…

Hey, Barb, didn’t mean to ignore your comment. Trying to get ready for church. This addiction to FDL can be tricky, huh?
It doesn’t matter? Yes and no.
I know that with your husband’s illness that you are focusing on enjoying the good things. So, no, people fighting over semantics and what is shouting or not or how different people interpret things, not really.
It would be nice if we all were more able to accept each other and use rational arguments, but, hey, we’re all human. Flawed. Unwhole. This primary season has not brought the best in some of us.
Have a great day, Barbara. Feeling good thoughts to David, too.

Paul, you must be getting a lot of good exercise constantly moving those goal posts. I find it odd though that you would say Obama is unelectable when your own candidate Clinton consistently has negative ratings among voters in the mid 40s. My own view is that any Democratic candidate can beat McCain and the way to do it is just to repeat as often as possible: If you want more of the same, vote McCain.

perris…. just FYI, I was quoting someone else. I don’t really think that FDLers are democrats first and foremost.

I don’t think that they are ‘constitutionalists” either — unfortunately, they just devolved into another bunch of hypocritical Obots.

If they were actually “consitutionalists”, they would be outraged by what happened yesterday. But because they liked the outcome, they didn’t have a problem with it.

I mean, how can any “consitutionalist” accept the proposals of Obama at the RBC that Michigan be seated at full voting strengh will a 50-50 split of delegates AND that Florida be seated at half voting strength.

Explain to me how this kind of “logic” is any different from the “logic” governing the rationales of the worst abuses of the Bush administration.

Explain to me how a committee whose limited jurisdiction does NOT, in any way shape or form, allow it to allocate delegates to candidates in any way (there is a commmittee that does have that power, the Credentials Committee) decided to do so anyway in order to provide their candidate with an advantage.

You’ve got all the warning signs you need to know exactly how much respect for the ‘rule of law’ and the constitution Barack Obama will have as President. Yet no one here shows the slightest concern, because just like Bush supporters who don’t care what he does as long as the outcome is acceptalbe, FDLers accept anything at all without protest based on the outcome.

You really don’t need sling ad hominems about here which is simply a lack of common courtesy. Everybody understands that you believe that anything which is unfavorable to Ms. Clinton is anti-democratic and now the Party hasn’t the authority to enforce it’s own rules. But please, anyone who dares to disagree with you is not necessarily a “liar”

I don’t call everyone a liar. But when someone lies, I call them a liar.

I am always amused by the clinton supports that paint all FDLers as obama supporters.

They got nothing except an ability to piss and moan. They’ll be pissin’ and moanin’ after the convention, pissin’ and moanin’ after the election, and pissin’ and moanin’ when the sun rises and sets each day.

I don’t really think that FDLers are democrats first and foremost.

I don’t think that they are ‘constitutionalists” either — unfortunately, they just devolved into another bunch of hypocritical Obots.

So seriously, why are you here then? If we are just a bunch of Obots and hypocritical ones at that, what do you hope to gain by commenting here?

See my 164.

Paul, you must be getting a lot of good exercise constantly moving those goal posts. I find it odd though that you would say Obama is unelectable when your own candidate Clinton consistently has negative ratings among voters in the mid 40s. My own view is that any Democratic candidate can beat McCain and the way to do it is just to repeat as often as possible: If you want more of the same, vote McCain.

First off, Clinton’s negative were just as high when she began her run for the Senate in New York state. She won — because once people got to know her, they realized that she wasn’t the person portrayed by the media. CLinton has a RECORD of being able to get people to vote for her once they get to know her.

What kills me is that you actually believe that a upper-middle class, suburban, female lawyer with degrees form Wellesley and Yale Law has some kind of natural affinity with working people — that they will immediately identify with her, and that she has some kind of “advantage” with them. NOW she does have an advantage with them, because she’s spent YEARS listening to them, and learning how to ‘talk their language’ in a way that is not condescending, but empathetic.

Not only has Barack Obama demonstrated no such ability to connect with voters outside his ‘natural’ constutuencies, he has shown no ability — or more crucially, interest — in learning HOW to do so. If they don’t ‘get’ him, its their fault, not his.

Hillary Clinton knew that she was going to lose in Oregon and North Carolina….but she campaigned in those states anyway, because she knows that your chances to win — or at least be competitive — in November depends a great deal on treating voters in those states with respect.

Barack Obama sent a message to the kind of voters you find all over this country when he refused to actively and personally campaign in Kentucky and West Virginia — that message was “I don’t care enough about you to take a small political hit because I came here asking for your vote, and you gave it to someone else.”

That is what makes Barack Obama unelectable.

In my opinion, Florida and Michigan should have been told to fuck off. They broke the rules. You’re just bitching because you don’t like the outcome.

Hillary Clinton is not a Democrat, except in name. She voted to authorize and has NEVER admitted it was a mistake, and has never apologized. She’s a carpetbagger and an opportunist. Furthermore, she’s Joe Lieberman in a pantsuit. She voted for Kyl-Lieberman.

I don’t hate hillary (and believe me, i HATE her) because she’s a woman, I hate her because she’as a republican.

She doesn’t give a rat’s ass about “hard-working Americans,” she only cares about her own ambition and she’s willing to scorched-earth the party in order to make sure she can run in four years. Of course, if she does that, there isn’t a soul who’ll vote for her in 2012.

So go back to TalkLeft and take your half-wit platitudes with you.

Long past time to just call a troll a troll.

Yeah, you have a point. I’m just to sick or people thinking Hillary is anything resembling a real Democrat. She’s not.

I am always amused by the clinton supports that paint all FDLers as obama supporters.

1) are you an Obama supporter?

2) do you find what happened yesterday acceptable?

That is to sao SO sick OF people thinking Hillary is anything resembling a real Democrat.

I can’t have coffee so I have an excuse. ;)

I do not. It would have been acceptable if the party had said “Guess what? We told you not to change the dates of your primaries and you went ahead and did it. So you’re out. Let’s hope you’ve learned your lesson and we’ll see you in 1012.”

THAT would have been acceptable.

Hillary should be McCain’s running mate. She is a republican.

no and i dunno

In my opinion, Florida and Michigan should have been told to fuck off. They broke the rules. You’re just bitching because you don’t like the outcome.

I’m disappointed by the outcomes. I’m pissed because it was clearly a corrupt power grab — and one that was just so egregiously corrupt that anyone with any intelligence would be insulted by it.

We got rid of the spelling and grammar heat. *g*

I had one English teacher all 4 years in high school, Mrs Cooley. On the first day of every school year one of the first things she said was:

“Of all human inventions, the excuse is the most worthless.”

She wasn’t having any of that “the dog ate my homework” stuff.

You know what really cracks me up? Right-wingers have accused me and my team members, employed by a non-profit that received donations from Soros’ Open Society, as Hillbots.

And then I get labeled an Obama-bot by HRC supporters.

When in truth I’ve always been an Edwards supporter, and a Dean supporter — if anybody with 10-watts of computing capacity ever bothered to check my comments.

Not only has Barack Obama demonstrated no such ability to connect with voters outside his ‘natural’ constutuencies,

Nice use of code language there. This campaign was Clinton’s to lose and she still somehow managed to squander all of her advantages going in and lose it. She lost among regular delegates, she lost among the supers, she lost the popular vote (and spare me all the tortured arguments about how if MI and FL were counted and if the wind was in the West she got more votes than Obama) Despite this, we are to believe that she would make some kind of miracle candidate in the Fall elections. Which do I choose to believe? You or my lying eyes?

They just look for a word to piss and moan about. The content of the comment is not something they want to discuss. Actually, they don’t want to discuss anything. They just want to act like an extremely spoiled 5-year old who has been told by his/her mother that they can’t have a candy bar 10 minutes before dinner. Just send for the waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance.

Explain to me how this kind of “logic” is any different from the “logic” governing the rationales of the worst abuses of the Bush administration.

the primaries are not an election, they are not democratic, they are part and parcel to the rules of the party, those candidates that compete in the primary sign on to those rules

just like a tennis match, it’s not democratic at all, it’s a competition

the primariesa are not set up to run the candidate that gets the most votes they are set up to run the candidate that is going to be best for the party

now that is a pretty subjective task and I am not sure I agree with how we go about it, but I do agree with this;

the primaries are not part of the election, it’s a differant process set up by the party

Yeah I know, I have big fat fingers, that idiot Hil-bot is pissing me off and I can’t have caffeine so I’m typing faster than my brain can work.

But you’re right, the dog didn’t eat my homework, I just didn’t do it. :-D

Yeah, it is the progressive caucus building that brings me to FDL.

Just in passing, there doesn’t seem to be much point in arguing with someone who can see the Obama campaign as the one which was totally self interested and didn’t give a damn about the future of the Democratic Party or the country. There just seems no saving him and a few others. I understand he’s done good work in the past, but that is no longer the case. All the dots he connected proved wrong and he seems to think that just can’t be, somebody has to have cheated him.

That’s why it’s unproductive to continue to feed the trolls. It’s an exercise in futility.

The media is back on it’s same old propaganda campaign. And Fareed Zakaria -noted internationalist -seems to have joined in with the bullshit. Not that CNN needed to add to their more than ample quota of crockery..

Iraq and the US are in a horrible position right now. Seriously and possibly fatally deadlocked in the iron jaws of the US, for anyone to use the words success or mission accomplished when the country is in worse shape than at any other despotic point of it’s history.

Australia is now leaving Iraq- one of our troops last sources of outside aid. Basra, the Southern Oil center once held ’successfully’ by the British has already fallen back by 50%.
We barely held on to Iraq -with the support of others.
That’s gone.
What victories the US could claim -came and went and were stomped on by the like of Bush, Lieberman and McCain.
The media is now dead silent on Iraq. They can’t very well report on it’s failures can they, after just reporting how wonderful things were to feed the Right’s mouthes?

Bush and McCain are 2 bulldogs with their jaws around the oil and the government’s throat, with Petraus -despite the majority of Iraqis now demanding we get the f*** out -pinning down the rest of Iraq -keeping it’s citizens huddled in hovels in fear.

“.. BAGHDAD – Australia ended its combat operations in southern Iraq on Sunday, while the Iraqi government said it has differences with the United States in negotiations over a long-term security agreement.
The official statement by government spokesman Ali al-Dabbagh comes amid growing opposition to the deal among Iraqis who see it as a possible violation of Iraq’s sovereignty and are worried about an extended presence of American troops.”

The same old media and Congressional hacks will continue to feed and profit off of the war profiteers, but luckily -this time – we’ll have a nominee who in the most beautiful of ironies will get media attention when he throws their bullshit right back at them -all of them.

VIVA OBAMA/RICHARDSON?CLARKE(RICHARD)?MCCASKILL?SHINSEKE? ‘08!

Richardson, the guy as brilliant foreign policy credentials, successful negotiations. But I hope you are right, the people that are accusing Obama supporters of not being true Democrats are prepared to allow, or even worse, aid and abet the opposition. I really hope this is merely angry posturing made in the throes of frustration. Hopefully they will reflect upon the relative importance of things, reunify with us and together, we can all move the Country’s urgent business forward.