I’m not sure why Obama has done so poorly in the Puerto Rico primary. I’m not familiar enough with the situation there. I’m suspecting machine politics. Has either Obama or Clinton made any public statement on PR statehood? From the exit polls they are reading on CNN, statehood seems to be an issue.

Wins for Hillary don’t matter. It’s all just white noise. White racist noise. White racist, ehm, Puerto Rican noise.

Why does Ricky Martin hate America?

I guess Hillary is just part of La Vida Loca.

But seriously, Hillary has always run stronger among Hispanics than Obama. For sure, he has some work to do there for the general.

Apparently BOTH Obama and Clinton went after the pro-statehood people- as they were the ones most likely to turn out.

Hillary spent more time in Puerto Rico and it paid off. She probably had more name recognition as well

This whole Puerto Rico thing is ridiculous anyway. The people of that territory are NOT ALLOWED to vote in the general election at all - so why there is a primary there is beyond me.

Hillary - La Vida Loca
Barack - La Vida Broka

What time did the polls close? Seems early for results.

Probably because the democratic party figures that it will become a state eventually and would like to develop the habit of voting democratic.

It’s pretty hard not to know who the Clinton brand is. They spent time there after Bill was out of office. So it is no suprise. When you have Bill, and Chelsea campaigning for her she should have recognition.

As far as I know they are American citizens. But hey so are citizen of Washington DC too.

Hi Betsy,
How are you doing? Any plans for a coming up lunch with any other Pups?

I would imagine for the same reasons that folks in DC, American Samoa, Guam, and the US Virgin Islands are allowed to vote in the Democratic Party primaries and caucuses - they are US Citizens and comply with the rest of the rules as established by the Democratic Party.

Just because they have no vote in the GE does not mean as citizens that they should have no say at all.

Well….from what I’ve heard from plenty of Hispanic activists is that it don’t matter how much ‘work’ Obama does…..

He won’t get much of the Hispanic vote.

And yeah…

Go ahead and call them racists.

That will help a lot.

And to MrMurder,

Perhaps before condeming the voters of Puerto Rico for their choices you should go there and ask them why they voted as they did. The Ricky Martin comment, was that necessary?

You are predicting that McCain will take the majority of the hispanic vote? That’d be BIG news!

As far as I know they are American citizens. But hey so are citizen of Washington DC too.

If I remember correctly, DC gets 3 electoral votes. They don’t have representation in Congress though, just an observer who can’t vote.

(/sarcasm)

hispanic candidate preference:

1) Clinton

2) Obama

3) Satan

4) McBush

Part of the problem of Obama not doing well with Hispanics IMHO has to do with a racist myth perpetrated by whites. It goes something like well, you are both minority groups, but instead of working together to overcome the obstacles - you had better be againste each other because if the one group gets something, the other one loses. This myth operates in both directions in both communities and has seeded relations between Hispanics and Blacks ever since way before the civil rights movement. Hispanics viewed the Civil Rights gains of the 60s as verification of the myth since the language in most of the laws and regulations and the battles were “blacks” and did not appear to include minority communities such as Hispanics and to a lesser extent southeast Asians.

Given the climate of vilification of any and all things Hispanic in this country right now, and the relative silence of black leaders on the issues of immigration and civil rights for legal immigrants, it is no wonder they are not turning out in droves for Obama.

I think he is uniquely qualified to bridge this gap - but it will take a more focused attention on the matter, placing someone like Bill Richardson into his campaign staff at a high level, and developing a strategy for addressing the myth and debunking it, once and for all.

I can’t remember for certain but they are on Atlantic time which normally is an hour ahead of Eastern time but I don’t think they do Daylight savings.

Not sure. I end the school year this week and go directly into extended family mode for most of June.

Hispanics have historically had low voter registration and turnout rates. I think there’s a chance to pick this up in 2008. There’s no way that the Hispanic vote is going to the Republicans in 2008. You can argue that Clinton will run stronger and pick up turnout more than Obama, but I don’t think they will go to McCain. Not going to happen.

That is correct according to my google source.

According to wiki American Samoa, Guam, and the US Virgin Islands also have non voting Delegates while Puerto Rico has “Resident Commissioner”

Cheney really finishes ahead of McBush?

Only when he runs in disguise.

If he runs as himself- Satan beats holy hell outa him.

Well, still they get to participate don’t they. If you don’t like that fact take it up with Howard Dean. I can almost guarantee you that you will piss of people of Puerto Rican descent who do vote Democratic.

Yeah, I just was pointing out that DC is the only non-state that has representation in the Electoral College.

Be careful about making generalizations about Hispanic turnout when you discuss Puerto Rico. Their turnout in the 2006 election cycle was 82%! That beats the entire rest of the US by about double. The people of Puerto Rico are very involved in the politics of their own government - in fact they are currently involved in a big contest for their governor - and it is drawing almost double the participation of both Hillary and Obama combined as far as rallies and stuff. People on the ground there felt the turnout for this primary would be low (according to PR standards anyway) with only about 600,000 turning out rather than the 1.8 million of voters who showed up in 2006 and who probably will vote in the elections for their local people.

I’m not sure how you’re interpreting my previous post. I’m personally in favor of PR statehood, if a majority of Puerto Ricans want it. And it appears that they do.

NY - Puerto Rico connection is at work as well. NY has a very large PR population and Clinton is the senator of NY. Does not surprise me at all that she has done well there. I’m glad that they had their vote. Tuesday Montana and Sout Dakota has thie say and then onto the GE campaign.

Had he lived, Roberto Clemente would have been Governor of Puerto Rico, he was bigger than baseball.

This nomination process must have been put together by Rube Goldberg, The Marquis de Sade and The Marx Brothers.
This PR primary is nuts, but so was the Texas Caucus.

I’m not saying they shouldn’t have a vote - they should be able to vote in the general AND have an actual voting rep. They pay US taxes, they are US citizens, and becoming a state should not be the prerequisite for having equal representation (reasons for Revolutionary War anyone?)

As far as statehood, there are two main political parties in PR - both are pretty Dem-oriented in their planks and ideology. One wants statehood, one wants to remain autonomous but get the voting rights mentioned above. A third, smaller party wants to be independent. There is not a huge majority for statehood since the two main parties are pretty well evenly matched as far as candidates, voting, membership, etc.

Whats extened family mode?

Oh, and I forgot one other thing - they have more people than many small Western States, like Montana and Wyoming!

my comment wasn’t in response to your post rather why Clinton has a strong showing in PR and my overall happiness that this process has all but ended (finally)

4:15 - The CNN exit poll tabulations have revised, presumably reflecting the gradual replacement in the estimate model of exit poll interviews with actual votes in the sampled precincts. The current estimate looks to be roughly 69% for Clinton and 31% for Obama.

Here’s one person who likes it:

I love the caucus process. It’s more fun than recess in heaven. I believe in government. I know government can do great harm under Republicans but can save the Constitution, grow the economy, and become people-powered under Democrats.

http://www.kissmybigbluebutt.com/#May_29

And as far as having a say in the election - HA HA HA! Puerto Rico, Montana and South Dakota are having a ratification of a result that they had NO say in.

All the other candidates are not in the race - so even if they wanted to vote for them, they cannot. Except for this election cycle, by the time it gets to the later primaries - there is no “choice” left.

Until this year, that even applied to California - the most populous state - with the most electoral votes - but they had no say in who the candidate would be.

Only when he runs in disguise.

If he runs as himself- Satan beats holy hell outa him.

Satan is already disguised as Dick Cheney.

You ever the both of ‘em in the same room at the same time?

My folks are in Dallas at the moment. Stepmom and Cassie driving here tomorrow. We all head back north Friday for family wedding next weekend. Then back here with my folks for a week, then to NY.

OT, but a pleasant surprise. A while ago either FDL hosted an Act Blue chat with Robert Hamilton, who is running for Congress in the 49th district in California, or someone here spoke extremely highly of him. I tossed a few bucks into his kitty and, to my amazement, got a handwritten thank you note from him. First time that’s ever happened to me…

As you were.

The Constitution only gives electoral votes to states and the District of Columbia, and DC only got their votes in 1961 with the Twenty Third Amemdment. So if PR is to have a say in the general election, there are only 2 options: 1. Statehood, or 2. Constitutional amendement.

sorry, linked to the wrong post - I meant to reply to someone/something else - and now I can’t even figure out what it was.
sorry wobblybits - didn’t mean anything.

Rent Spike Lee’s “School Daze.”

Well done.

Yes - and right now the US is guilty of violating the “no taxation without representation” idea that our country was founded on.

Oh well, topic for another day…

The clinton name in Puerto Rico is in all probability a major factor in her vote, not her magnetic personality but jeebers this is becoming embarrassing for her and for the country. If this candidacy were to be wrested from the rightful candidate by some dark shennanigans concocted by the DLC her administration would have about as much trust as the present one. Go away lady you are annoying!

no prob :)

Our co-commenter Loo Hoo is working on Hamilton’s campaign and mentions him whenever Issa (spit) is mentioned hereabouts.

New name sir?

Don’t think there is any danger of her ‘wresting the nomination’ away from Obama. She would have to pick up votes in PR at a rate that right now she is, but she would also have to win MT and SD by a large margin - and Obama is leading her both places by double digits.

PLUS there aren’t enough delegates (pledged type) for her to catch him - since he does get some delegates from PR even if he loses. He’ll wind up only needing 20-25 of the supers out of the 200 remaining to seal the deal according to the new number.

AHH — that may be why I threw money at him. Would love to see Issa slide down the skids and out of Congress.

Book Salon upstairs with Teddy hosting David Sirota.

Or feel free to stay down here and discuss other topics.

Seconded enthusiastically.

Is Firedoglake’s official Puerto Rico correspondent to busy lounging on the beach to put up a post?

“Too” busy. Gaaah.

He’s been the one fighting for immigration reform …

Clinton is about to speak in Puerto Rico

Clinton: “we are winning the popular vote”

“we have won the battleground states”

“by my second term…”

after Tuesday, “neither senator obama nor I will have the delegates to win”

“which candidate represents the will of the people?”

“which candidate is best able to lead us to victory in November?”

“I am that candidate and I will be that President”

no hint of concession in Clinton’s speech so far

Clinton speaks of her “first term” as President

Clinton isn’t about to concede with two primaries coming up on tuesday.

no, but this was an opportunity to begin to signal that she is not going to conduct a scorched earth policy after tuesday and she chose not to do that…

no hint of concession in Clinton’s speech so far

There’s still 2 more primaries. She has to keep the troops revved up. We’ll see what she does after Tuesday. I don’t any motivation to keep up the facade after that except pig headedness.

she would need 195 of the remaining 205 superdelegates

obama would need 20

per MSNBC

Wow … this campaign is closer than the last Super Bowl … /s

she would need 195 of the remaining 205 superdelegates

obama would need 20

per MSNBC

I think they’re counting on some supers reversing their commitments, which isn’t going to happen to any large degree. If fact, once Obama clinches, quite a few Hillary supers will switch over to him. Remember, no one has made any legally binding votes yet, so any of the supers that have ‘committed’, that just means that they have made a public statement of who they INTEND to vote for. Nevertheless, I don’t expect a major shift. Even politicians don’t like to publicly go back on their word.

I was not expecting Clinton to concede today right after a big victory

but she could have done more to pledge a united front in November

instead she dwelled on how she would be the candidate in November

what if she isn’t? didn’t even acknowledge that is possible

I think that Hillary will “suspend” her campaign after tuesday. She will aknowledge that Obama is the presumptive nominee and lay down her weapons- but she won’t beat em into plowshares. She’ll leave open the possibility that Obama could fall on his ass before the convention and supers could come back to her.

Ok if you haven’t yet digg this

hi nahant

dugg

Time in Puerto Rico:

The time in Puerto Rico runs three hours later than Pacific Time. So it must have been about 4:30 in Puerto Rico when they closed the polls. This being a Sunday, I guess that’s about reasonable.

Hillary pointed herself out repeatedly as a friend of the Hispanics -while kicking the African American and Native Americans out her way as she did so - for todays election.
Hillary pointed herself out repeatedly as a champion of ‘womens’ rights around the world - while kicking the Afghan women out of her way as she and Bill worked with the Taliban in the late 90’s over a gas pipeline.
And Hillary points to herself as a champion on women’s rights’ and the education of women around the world - while kicking the Palestinian women out of her way by joining Israel in blocking all students -mostly women - who qualified for scholarships here - but are blocked from leaving the hovels in Gaza because Israel says so.

As a woman who supports the rights of all women, all the time, this political pandering beast should be sent back to Arkansas -because she was never there when those women, when those ‘people’ really needed her.

She wasn’t there when it counted.