yo

Ah, yes.

McCain’s Metternich.

My contempt for Henry Kissinger knows no bounds!

Hi everyone on this thread :)
Morning Raven, this was Epu’d to you last thread..

In response to Raven @ 54 (show text)

Yes, in a heart beat. They would then close the straits to ALL shipping and it seems like that would be the time Darth would unleash his hounds of hell. (having first neatly ‘removed’ all ‘conventional’ choices from the chess board)
New moon this weekend.

East Timor Henry made a deal and the Catholics got the Shiv are all GOPers antiCatholic? Are the Tweeties and Modo’s all traitors and propaganda agents against Catholics Rev Wright can do no right but Hagee can do no wrong attacking Catholics.

opps forgot, Dugggg :)

his hounds of hell. (having first neatly ‘removed’ all ‘conventional’ choices from the chess board)
New moon this weekend.

By Hounds are you referring to nukes?

The lesson of Henry Kissenger is that if you want to be famous you have to win over your own countrie’s press. Bush controls the press but its hard to believe that the press respects him.
Henry has been the ultimate elite but unlike Obama he makes the press feel good.
Henry may have controlled the press like Bush does but he also made the press like him.

Later Pups!

Yes, or some new variation they have been waiting to impress us with..
I really think they would do it if they are not stopped.
Scary/Interesting times in which we live today. :(

Good morning, Attaturk:

Henry certainly learned his uber mensch lessons very well …

Attaturk, surely you understand the difference in motivation behind terrorism and realpolitik. The former is done out of hatred and a lust for world domination. Henry was a national leader working tirelessly to further this nation’s ultimately successful to beat back to unrelenting forces of godless worldwide communism. One motivation is vile while the other is noble. Just ask him.

That photo makes him look like a huge fat disgusting spider…which, of course, he is.

Oh well, since there is no hope I guess I’ll jump off the Tallahachee Bridge.

LOL…

Of course, you know if our boys in blue would just bang on enough/the right doors (at the same time)warrants and other legal p/w in hand. The whole WH would be too busy trying to get to their lawyers to blow the world up this week… :)

‘mornin’ all-
There’s a link at this wiki page for anyone who wants to watch the video;

The Trial of Henry Kissinger

I was watching MSNBC this morning and they had Evan Bayh on the Morning Joe show. They never asked him a question about this ABC story that broke yesterday.

Hoosier Responsible?
Clinton Decries China’s Acquisition of Indiana Company — Ignoring Her Husband’s Role in the Sale
By JAKE TAPPER
Apr. 30, 2008

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics.....038;page=1

They then had an interview with John McCain. Mika Brezinski actually asked a good question (she hardly ever does) about the McCain gas tax gimmick but then Scarborough quickly changed the subject. It just makes you want to scream! I posted a comment on their blog (it will probably never show up) taking them to task for both the Bayh & McCain interviews. I’m so sick of this.

This made me cry…True sportsmanship..

Opponents carry injured home run hitter around the bases
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap.....n-Help.php

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....65984.html

Presuming that you are not actually ignorant enough to desire war with the United States, you might be well advised to read the history of the sinking of the U.S.S. Maine in Havana harbor in 1898 and the history of the Gulf of Tonkin in 1964.

Having done so, you will surely recognize that Americans are reluctant to go to war unless attacked.

This threat of War was made against Iran by New World Order Guy, Gary Hart. Probably, “we shall never find out definitely” what sank the battleship Maine. But The “Gulf of Tonkin” was a “False Flag” operation carried out by the United States Government.

We might expect some Blackwater Conspiracy to provoke a War with Iran. Gary Hart has promised to Iran, a neo-con catalyzing and catatrophic event. Iran does have lots of Oil, that belongs to Exxon.

The difference between Wright and Hagee is how they feel about America in their heart of hearts. Wright has been very outspoken and clear about where he’s coming from. He’s been on every news channel 24/7 for several weeks now in his hatred begging Almighty God to DAMN America. I wish he’d give it a rest.

Reverend Hagee by contrast clearly loves America, but he’s concerned that God might not feel the same way, given how America has been behaving, what with homosexuals getting married and parading it around and all. And he denounces these things out of loving concern for American, concern that America might once again provoke His wrate.

Totally different motivations. You have to peer into people’s hearts. It may seem superficially on the surface that they are doing the same thing. But it’s their motiviation and how the feel about what they are doing that makes all the difference. That why always IOKIYAR.

I also saw Chuck Todd on MSNBC earlier this morning where he & Scarborough were talking about Obama being seen as an elitist. Todd then says how he just couldn’t understand how George Bush Sr. could be considered the everyman and Mike Dukakis was seen as the elitist. I sent him a message that if he really wanted to know the answer to his George Bush Sr. question that he needed to read Glenn Greenwald’s new book. I also gave him a link to Amazon.com. LOL

Just make sure ya leave Billie Joe at home.

BRILLIANT!! And, it seems to me that Todd has quite a bit more depth than most of his caste, so he just may buy and read it.

Apropos of nothing in particular, yesterday as I was driving, I heard Rachel Maddow say that she had once interviewed Barak Obama, and it went very badly. In fact, she said that twice, but I hadn’t been paying a lot of attention. Does anyone know the story on this?

Yet he could understand how John Kerry was an effete pinkie raiser and George Bush was a heroic American?

I wish I could share in your optimism. Sometimes he looks like he has more sense but then you see him a few moments later and he’s right back with the herd. It was at least worth a try.

Exactly.

Mornin’ Attaturk and Firedogs,

um Henry, correction: War Crime Indictments are the ultimate aphrodisiac

in case you haven’t seen it
new MoveOn ad (h/t Jacqrat) (be sure to rate it by clicking on 5 stars)

I think we need to take up a collection to buy copies of Greenwald’s books and send them to all of the talking heads. We could enclose a card…compliments of your viewers. We hope this will help you.

Having been involved in the “Tonkin Gulf Incident” I need to sit down and write out just what occurred during that week in August 1964. The problem is it would take much too much space for the comment section here. In short, there were three “confrontations” that week, which seem to have been morphed into one. One when MADDOX allegedly took a heavy caliber round in the forward gun director from North Vietnamese PT boats. Two when MORTON and RICHARD S EDWARDS opened fire on what was later deemed to be a “flock of geese”. Three when MADDOX was again allegedly attacked. What they did with that information in Washington is history.

It’s so sad that we still have things like this happen:

Woman Gains Silver Star — And Removal From Combat
Case Shows Contradictions of Army Rules

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....v=hcmodule

That would be good. My understanding is that, while we may have over-reacted, the understanding in Washington was that the Maddox and/or Turner Joy were fired upon; ie., the incident was not a burning of the Reichstag.

Attaturk, two great posts.

Chomsky:
On May 27, the New York Times published one of the most incredible sentences I’ve ever seen. They ran an article about the Nixon-Kissinger interchanges. Kissinger fought very hard through the courts to try to prevent it, but the courts permitted it. You read through it, and you see the following statement embedded in it. Nixon at one point informs Kissinger, his right-hand Eichmann, that he wanted bombing of Cambodia. And Kissinger loyally transmits the order to the Pentagon to carry out “a massive bombing campaign in Cambodia. Anything that flies on anything that moves.” That is the most explicit call for what we call genocide when other people do it that I’ve ever seen in the historical record.

Washington understood it that way because that’s what they wanted to understand.

No link handy, but Douglas Valentine has reported that the PT boats involved in the 1st part of the Gulf of Tonkin incident were pursuing SEAL teams that had been conducting raids along the coast. Provocation raids. It seems to have worked.

SouthernDragon, in an appropriate time and place, I would love to read your complete first-hand report of the incident.

Gotta go make the doughnuts. Later, all.

That is correct. My ship, MORTON, in company with RICHARD S EDWARDS relieved MADDOX and C TURNER JOY (the C was dropped in press coverage and she’s been known as TURNER JOY since) the morning after the first incident. MADDOX was proud of the bullet hole in the forward gun director. I vaguely remember some long distance photos of PT boats approaching MADDOX and C TURNER JOY but cannot vouch for their authenticity. It was about 2am local time when we opened fire the second night on patrol. I was in the Combat Information Center (CIC), commonly referred to as Combat, on the radio with the White House watching the incoming contacts being plotted on the DRT (Dead Reckoning Table). The division Commodore was on the bridge and we heard him screaming at the CO (much disliked among the crew), “Do you believe we’re being attacked, Captain?!?!” “Yes, Sir!” “Then open fire, goddamnit!!” You could have cut the adrenaline on that ship with a knife.

11.02.05

WASHINGTON — National Security Agency officers mistranslated interceptions involving the 1964 Gulf of Tonkin incident, and their mistake was covered up by deliberate falsifications, says a researcher trying to obtain an article that lays out what happened.

so, bs / spin ?

link

The DeSoto patrols, as they were known, were specifically to protect South Vietnamese commandos infiltrating the North via PT boats. SEALs weren’t formed until 63 and weren’t involved in those operations.

Henry looks like the evil little troll you would find under the bridge or in the sewer.

Your insights are very valuable. Perhaps you have seen this transcript (from Reddit). This Plunder and Military Occupation of Irak is insane. The corruption, unexplained acts of violence, weapons dealings, oil smuggling and so on, suggests neo-con provocations, run from the top of Corporatocracy.

Secretary McNamara: Right. And we’re going to, and I think I should also, or we should also at that time, Mr. President, explain this Op Plan 34-A, these covert operations. There’s no question but what that had bearing on. And on Friday night, as you probably know, we had four TP [McNamara means PT] boats from Vietnam manned by Vietnamese or other nationals, attack two is lands. And we expended, oh, a thousand rounds of ammunition of one kind or another against them. We probably shot up a radar station and a few other miscellaneous buildings. And following twenty-four hours after that, with this destro

Man, if that ain’t the f***ing truth! LOL.

Wow. I was almost gone…Riveting. To reiterate: I would love to read your complete account.
Now I really must go. Later, all.

But there were UDT Teams right?

Clinton and McCain are ignorant of Econ 101. Cutting gas tax does not lower prices; rather it simply enriches the oil companies and deprives the government of money to maintain bridges and roads. Per this WaPo article:

Harvard professor N. Gregory Mankiw, who has written a best-selling textbook on economics, said what he teaches is different from what Clinton and McCain are saying about gas taxes. “What you learn in Economics 101 is that if producers can’t produce much more, when you cut the tax on that good the tax is kept . . . by the suppliers and is not passed on to consumers,” he said.

Yeah. UDT originated in WWII. In the early days of the SEALs everyone started out in UDT. Those who desired to enter the new SEALs had to volunteer at the end of UDT training. Originally SEALs were trained strictly in jungle/guerrilla warfare. They were to be the terrorist arm of Special Forces. They showed why at Rung Sat.

Seal-UDT

Do not feed the troll.

Bob Kerry

My old man’s APD worked with them, USS Crosby APD 17.

I know I had a notable Virginia accent in those days but it was still English.

Where in Va, my bride is from Appommatox.

“Saving Private Ryan” comes to mind…….. The best of what America has to offer exhibited yesterday on that field. I wonder if our current or past leaders comprehend the “significance” of that single act?

I was born in DC, the first of my family to be born outside of South Carolina in 250 years. We lived exactly one mile from the front gate of Mount Vernon.

Ooops, Kerrey

It’s hard to explain to younger generations, but at that time in the Cold War, under containment policy and Truman Doctrine, we all felt more justified in a “don’t tread on me” outlook. I know that a few years later, I was at an Air Force GCI site in Okinawa when the Pueblo was captured. A bunch of us were discussing it and the consensus was that we needed to knock the crap out of North Korea.

Two days later, most of us had been rushed up to remote GCI sites around the DMZ in South Korea. I asked one of the guys with me who had been vocal in the discussion, “Well Steve, what do you think we ought to do now?”

He said, ” I think we need to cool it.”

See “Lions for Lambs”.

Wright! Wright! Wrrrriiigghhttt!

(apologies to BT)

I was down in one of those paddies just South of Charlie Block chasing Joe **&^*.

It’s hard to imagine Bush doing much comprehendin’.

Thinking about this post and the way the Obama campaign is sinking before our very eyes, I am starting to think that the only way out of our mess is bankruptcy and military defeat. France was never so fine as she was between her defeat in 1871 and 1914. I’m reduced to the minimax solution: minimize the chances of nuclear holocaust. If we can escape that, which seems increasingly doubtful, the other things will take care of themselves, though not our or our children’s lifetimes.

Course they were frozen solid!

We watched PUEBLO get underway from Yokosuka on that fateful mission. Just another ship goin’ to sea. No big deal.

A bunch of us were discussing it and the consensus was that we needed to knock the crap out of North Korea.

It was the consensus of us in the 1/79th Arty that, since we had 8 rounds per tube, it would be a really bad idea to go to kicking the crap out of anyone, especially the North Korean Army that was about 3 clicks north.

Yeah, that was the same time the infiltrator’s were sent across to wipe out Park Chung Hee. The Tet Offensive was underway in Viet Nam. It wasn’t hard to believe that the whole thing was being directed from Moscow.

LOL. As I said, we mostly reached that opinion as soon as we were located about 30 miles south. I read T.R. Fehrenbach’s “This Kind of War” while I was there, and the site we were at had been overrun in the first day in 1950.

They rousted us in the middle of the night, someone said Joe had taken a ship. We left a couple people back with thermite’s to blow the crypto gear and headed to our fire postions. Of course we had already been out there chasing the Blue House Raiders for 2 days.

OT-Good story on Howard Dean in the LA Times: Howard Dean has long-range vision for the Democrats

Like crap through a tin horn the old man would say!

I find the “invite and flatter” process appalling. Kissinger is a monster. I don’t understand why the MSM continue to seek out and give air time to his opinions unless it’s the simple answer: freak shows sell lots of tickets, (nevermind who buys them). Though he is not the same kind of monster, the MSM continues to seek out Newt Gingrich to fill air time. And how ’bout the ad for uniting to fight global warming with Pelosi and Gingrich sitting on a couch together agreeing? (Okay, maybe that’s an illustration of Pelosi’s real politics as opposed to “inviting and flattering” Gingrich. :-))

Not suprisingly:

Henry Kissinger regularly advises Bush and Cheney:

Woodward also reports that the president and vice president often meet with Henry Kissinger, who was President Richard Nixon’s secretary of state, as an adviser. Says Woodward, “Now what’s Kissinger’s advice? In Iraq, he declared very simply, ‘Victory is the only meaningful exit strategy.’” Woodward adds. “This is so fascinating. Kissinger’s fighting the Vietnam War again because, in his view, the problem in Vietnam was we lost our will.”

(emphasis mine)

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/09/28/woodward-book/

so many war criminals…

Generational disconnect? Younger folks have no “context” of HK. Now he is offered by the MSM, unchallenged like Newt, and meant to create a perception, right vs reality. Just can’t help but notice all “air time” being purchased by “Big Oil” and other energy interests as they pay millions of dollar to ad firms for these “renewable commercials?”

Yet, Henry Kissinger is able to attend the parties of the swells of the Washington establishment, where quasi-journalists like Ana Marie Cox are able to make snarky jokes, rather than report his whereabouts to Interpol.
Everyone knows he lives in Kent CT, right? So why doesn’t Interpol just arrest him. He hosted a fundraiser there with Chimpy for $10,000 a pop. I think they are trying to unseat Chris Murphy.

You left out my very favorite Kissinger quote!

“Military men are dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy.”

This quote came from Woodward & Bernstein’s “The Final Days”, and has never been denied by Kissinger.

So, yeah, why don’t McCain and Bush have to denounce this man?

My favorite Kissingerism:

“An ‘expert’ is that person who can most effectively articulate the needs of the ruling class.”

I read it somewhere long ago, forget where.