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	<title>Comments on: Digging a Hole Big Enough For Two</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/</link>
	<description>Firedoglake weblog</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ACitizen</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1420072</link>
		<dc:creator>ACitizen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 05:45:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1420072</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Come on guys….you know what this is about. This is so the citizenry doesn’t get itself all hot and bothered about….&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Dead Americans….&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Dead Iraqis….&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Trillions disappearing…..&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;$200/barrel oil…no, that’s not a misprint&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But ya know…there’s another Pollster graph ya really oughta take a gander at folks. This one here:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.pollster.com/currenttrends.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.pollster.com/currenttrends.php&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So….let’s use Peterr’s most excellent logic and ask:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Why are the Democrats in both houses still digging. First rule of holes is ‘Stop digging…’ ain’t it?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The answer to this question is the key to what and how and where to the progressive movement must &lt;strong&gt;MOVE&lt;/strong&gt; in the next several cycles.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The evidence is out there….It’s very clear what’s going on but apart from a few posts by Jane &amp; Co. and some by Stoller, fergit Bowers he’s clueless, nobody is talking about this and analyzing it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Oh yeah, taking  on McSame is like shooting fish in a barrel and it does need to be done. But as long as McSame is actually swimming in great big pool built, in part, for him by the Democratic ‘Leadership’ we are not going to be solving the major problems we face.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Lemme know when you realize that McSame ain’t in that barrel you’re fillin’ with birdshot, Okay?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Come on guys….you know what this is about. This is so the citizenry doesn’t get itself all hot and bothered about….</p>
<p>Dead Americans….</p>
<p>Dead Iraqis….</p>
<p>Trillions disappearing…..</p>
<p>$200/barrel oil…no, that’s not a misprint</p>
<p>But ya know…there’s another Pollster graph ya really oughta take a gander at folks. This one here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.pollster.com/currenttrends.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.pollster.com/currenttrends.php</a></p>
<p>So….let’s use Peterr’s most excellent logic and ask:</p>
<p>Why are the Democrats in both houses still digging. First rule of holes is ‘Stop digging…’ ain’t it?</p>
<p>The answer to this question is the key to what and how and where to the progressive movement must <strong>MOVE</strong> in the next several cycles.</p>
<p>The evidence is out there….It’s very clear what’s going on but apart from a few posts by Jane &amp; Co. and some by Stoller, fergit Bowers he’s clueless, nobody is talking about this and analyzing it.</p>
<p>Oh yeah, taking  on McSame is like shooting fish in a barrel and it does need to be done. But as long as McSame is actually swimming in great big pool built, in part, for him by the Democratic ‘Leadership’ we are not going to be solving the major problems we face.</p>
<p>Lemme know when you realize that McSame ain’t in that barrel you’re fillin’ with birdshot, Okay?</p>
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		<title>By: DrBong</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419723</link>
		<dc:creator>DrBong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 03:05:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419723</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;safe travels, dmac&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;you are in the bong household’s prayers.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;nite&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>safe travels, dmac</p>
<p>you are in the bong household’s prayers.</p>
<p>nite</p>
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		<title>By: JEP07</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419625</link>
		<dc:creator>JEP07</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 02:19:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419625</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Downhill skislope?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Downhill skislope?</p>
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		<title>By: dmac</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419589</link>
		<dc:creator>dmac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:57:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419589</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;bonger at 89–yeeees, we have ’met’…..but i had knee surgery, came back to the lake a few months later and ’some people’ were gone……..thanks, i didn’t have the blog site….&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;this one’s for you-&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;a href=&quot;http://farm1.static.flickr.com/173/419131053_f4da825b19.jpg&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://farm1.static.flickr.com.....825b19.jpg&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;gotta go pack, outta town for a few days…no lake…unless i hijack a computer while i’m there.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bonger at 89–yeeees, we have ’met’…..but i had knee surgery, came back to the lake a few months later and ’some people’ were gone……..thanks, i didn’t have the blog site….</p>
<p>this one’s for you-<br />
<a href="http://farm1.static.flickr.com/173/419131053_f4da825b19.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://farm1.static.flickr.com&#8230;..825b19.jpg</a></p>
<p>gotta go pack, outta town for a few days…no lake…unless i hijack a computer while i’m there.</p>
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		<title>By: neurophius</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419574</link>
		<dc:creator>neurophius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:43:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419574</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;All I can say to that is&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;John McCain:&lt;br /&gt;
Worse than Bush&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All I can say to that is</p>
<p><strong>John McCain:<br />
Worse than Bush</strong></p>
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		<title>By: DrBong</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419542</link>
		<dc:creator>DrBong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419542</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;In ‘79 I was probably pretty stoned, too, but gradjiating high school was my only real challenge.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;;~P&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In ‘79 I was probably pretty stoned, too, but gradjiating high school was my only real challenge.</p>
<p>;~P</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: DrBong</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419538</link>
		<dc:creator>DrBong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:22:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419538</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;oh, and dmac, in the very slim chance you have not been properly indoctrinated&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://darkblack999.blogspot.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;darkblack&lt;/a&gt;, meet dmac.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;;~P&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>oh, and dmac, in the very slim chance you have not been properly indoctrinated</p>
<p><a href="http://darkblack999.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">darkblack</a>, meet dmac.</p>
<p>;~P</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: hackworth</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419534</link>
		<dc:creator>hackworth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:20:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419534</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I caught the change in McCain’s vocal stylings yesterday when NPR gave him free air time to tout his health care plan. (His plan will result in more uninsured Amerkins, more sickness and death, carte blanche for insurance companies, more bankruptcies cause by health care expenses. IOW, its a disaster. NPR made it all sound quite reasonable.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Anyway, yes. McCrypt’s voice, inflection and manner of speaking were noticeably restyled.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I caught the change in McCain’s vocal stylings yesterday when NPR gave him free air time to tout his health care plan. (His plan will result in more uninsured Amerkins, more sickness and death, carte blanche for insurance companies, more bankruptcies cause by health care expenses. IOW, its a disaster. NPR made it all sound quite reasonable.</p>
<p>Anyway, yes. McCrypt’s voice, inflection and manner of speaking were noticeably restyled.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: nonplussed</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419531</link>
		<dc:creator>nonplussed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:19:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419531</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I don’t think it was me. I left in 1979, but if you were there then, I just got back from Diego Garcia and I was really stoned…&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don’t think it was me. I left in 1979, but if you were there then, I just got back from Diego Garcia and I was really stoned…</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sporkovat</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419527</link>
		<dc:creator>sporkovat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 01:16:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/04/30/digging-a-hole-big-enough-for-two/#comment-1419527</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;betraying the fervent belief that the 2008 elections will reflect the sentiments of the people, as represented in these polls.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;but, er, what about this other trendline - election 2000 derailed by vote supression and fraud in Florida, handed to Bush on a platter by the Supreme Court, with no real protest from the (D) establishment whose voters were disenfranchised….&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;election 2004 stolen by fraud and suppression in Ohio and elsewhere, with partisan (R) hacks now serving time in Ohio, but again no serious resistance put up by lackluster Washington (D)’s…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;from this we can extrapolate that media bias and superficial, trivial slandering of the (D) candidate combined with (R) dirty tricks might bring the vote counts close enough to steal again… so why should McCain worry about Bush’s approval ratings?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;this isn’t even factoring in more war hysteria, if the war against Iran that (D)’s are doing &lt;em&gt;nothing&lt;/em&gt; to prevent is underway by Nov 2008, and the (D) candidate scampers rightward trying to prove how ‘tough’ they are, alienating those who are sincerely antiwar enough to inhibit their willingness to support the lesser of two pandering warmongers, supressing turnout among those the Democrats think have no choice… &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;the way to avert this at the pass is for the candidate to seriously critique US militarism in the mideast as contrary to the real interests of the USA, as well as being obviously ineffective and morally repugnant. Such an honest and brave stance could galvanize real support from a broad swath of the country, many of whom are tempted to sit this one out, again. Courage and truth can be great allies.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;without this, a (D) candidate could be pulled into the untenable position of wannabe, me-too warmongering while the media recapitulates their propaganda efforts from 2002 and tears down the (D) pro-war posturing as insincere.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;so they’ll lose centrists and moderate (R)’s many of whom are intensely disgusted by the Bushist regime and were ready to vote (D) for the first time in generations of their families, and they’ll lose those who sincerely oppose wars of aggression more than they feel obligated to the comprimised, complicit (D) political faction.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;so, the poll numbers now are nothing to gloat over.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>betraying the fervent belief that the 2008 elections will reflect the sentiments of the people, as represented in these polls.</p>
<p>but, er, what about this other trendline &#8211; election 2000 derailed by vote supression and fraud in Florida, handed to Bush on a platter by the Supreme Court, with no real protest from the (D) establishment whose voters were disenfranchised….</p>
<p>election 2004 stolen by fraud and suppression in Ohio and elsewhere, with partisan (R) hacks now serving time in Ohio, but again no serious resistance put up by lackluster Washington (D)’s…</p>
<p>from this we can extrapolate that media bias and superficial, trivial slandering of the (D) candidate combined with (R) dirty tricks might bring the vote counts close enough to steal again… so why should McCain worry about Bush’s approval ratings?</p>
<p>this isn’t even factoring in more war hysteria, if the war against Iran that (D)’s are doing <em>nothing</em> to prevent is underway by Nov 2008, and the (D) candidate scampers rightward trying to prove how ‘tough’ they are, alienating those who are sincerely antiwar enough to inhibit their willingness to support the lesser of two pandering warmongers, supressing turnout among those the Democrats think have no choice… </p>
<p>the way to avert this at the pass is for the candidate to seriously critique US militarism in the mideast as contrary to the real interests of the USA, as well as being obviously ineffective and morally repugnant. Such an honest and brave stance could galvanize real support from a broad swath of the country, many of whom are tempted to sit this one out, again. Courage and truth can be great allies.</p>
<p>without this, a (D) candidate could be pulled into the untenable position of wannabe, me-too warmongering while the media recapitulates their propaganda efforts from 2002 and tears down the (D) pro-war posturing as insincere.</p>
<p>so they’ll lose centrists and moderate (R)’s many of whom are intensely disgusted by the Bushist regime and were ready to vote (D) for the first time in generations of their families, and they’ll lose those who sincerely oppose wars of aggression more than they feel obligated to the comprimised, complicit (D) political faction.</p>
<p>so, the poll numbers now are nothing to gloat over.</p>
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