That was the message today in his testimony before the Petraeus/Crocker hearing, when he told us that Iraq has made more political progress since the surge than Americans have:
What I'm about to say, with respect to my colleagues who have consistently opposed our presence in Iraq, as I hear the questions and the statements today, it seems to me that there's a kind of hear no progress in Iraq, see no progress in Iraq, and most of all, speak of no progress in Iraq.
The fact is, there has been progress in Iraq, thanks to extraordinary effort by the two of you and all those who serve under you on our behalf.
I wish we could come to a point where we could have an agreement on the facts that you are presenting to us, the charts you've shown, the military progress, the extraordinary drop in ethno-sectarian violence, the drop in civilian deaths, the drop in American deaths, and the very impressive political progress in Iraq since last September.
Hey, let's be honest about this: The Iraqi political leadership has achieved a lot more political reconciliation and progress since September than the American political leadership has. So we've got to give credit for that.
Yep, the violent extremism in Washington these days is just intolerable. Quoth Scarecrow: "Lieberman is correct. Petraeus should take 30,000 troops and liberate Washington from the threat of extremists. And they shouldn't leave until we have victory. The consequences of losing America to extremists would be catastrophic."
As Josh Marshall observes, Lieberman obviously "sees no harm in overstating the progress in Iraq."
Matt Yglesias says what needs saying:
To state the obvious, America has a heated political debate, but liberals and conservatives aren't shooting mortars at each other and we don't have pitched battles in the streets. To compare the situation in Iraq to the persistence of strong partisan disagreement in the United States is idiotic.
But that's only half the idiocy. While Joe is busy accusing his fellow Democrats of refusing to face reality, he and his fellow Surge Sycophants refuse to even acknowledge, let alone confront, the hard realities on the ground in Iraq. As Scarecrow observed yesterday:
Even if we credit the surge with temporarily neutralizing Sunni forces (while creating further risks of civil war) that only set the stage for competing Shia factions to fight each other for control of Badghdad and Southern Iraq -- with Bush using the fighting as an excuse to keep US forces bogged down in Iraq indefinitely. Fighting one side's grab for power by laying siege to Sadr City's million people risks hundreds of civilian deaths.
Of course, Joe also insists we have to "win" before we leave. And like Cokie Roberts, Lieberman has a, um, flexible definition of "victory" in Iraq -- so flexible, it's now entirely ass-backwards. Up is down. War is peace. Quagmire is victory.
In the real world, today's appearance at the hearing was just all about Lieberman's continuing Zell Millerization, using his "bipartisan" credentials to bash Democrats. We all know when he gets in front of the mikes that he's going to attack liberal critics of the war with whatever Bizarro World version of reality he's adopted that day.
Yet in spite of that, Harry Reid says Lieberman is going to be keeping all his committee assignments next year, including his chairmanship of the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee.
The Courant story includes the usual attempt by Lieberman to relegate his critics to the fringes:
In a telephone interview from Washington, Lieberman said he went on the air expecting to discuss Iraq or the presidential campaign, not his place in politics.
Lieberman said his critique against the "small group on the left" was directed at the online advocacy group MoveOn.org and liberal bloggers like Daily Kos, not any colleagues.
He said he was struck by how the leading Democratic presidential candidates attended the Yearly Kos convention of liberal bloggers, skipping the annual meeting of the moderate and once influential Democratic Leadership Council.
Hmmm. I don't suppose it could be that the candidates appeared at YearlyKos because poll after poll has shown that Americans, by substantial majorities, agree with those dirty fucking hippies and not Joe (and his fellow war apologists in the DLC) about ending the war, could it? In the old days, we used to call that "democracy."
Ah well. We've become accustomed to such gum-flapping from Lieberman. As the story notes:
[W]hen he raises alarms over hyper-partisanship, a term he used in a foreign-policy speech last year, Lieberman focuses on Democrats.
But wait! Joe says that there have been Republican hyper-partisans -- but only back in the '90s:
"I will certify to the fact that the hyper-partisanship has been on both sides," Lieberman said. "There were a lot of Republicans who had a similarly hyper-partisan reaction to anything — literally, anything — that Bill Clinton did during the '90s."
And of course, back then, Lieberman made sure pandered to them, too. It's what he's always done.
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Holy Joe… making noise and saying nothing. What a waste of oxygen and a Senate seat.
[Harry Reid says Lieberman is going to be keeping all his committee assignments next year, including his chairmanship of the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee.
Please excuse me for a minute, I have an uncontrollable need to have a few primal screams in the privacy of the parking lot right now.
So, Lieberman is recommending armed militias for the US?
that guy is unstable.
My contempt for Joe Lieberman will never abate.
Lieberman- idiot
Reid- big ass idiot…just strip that asshat of his committee assignments already
Can we replace Ried now?
You’re on fire today, Jo! Menendez is hammering the facts of the woeful Iraqi situation…!
Menendez is nailing it … wow!
“The consequences of losing America to extremists would be catastrophic.”
Can’t argue with that statement, not after 7 1/2 years of living the consequences of catastrophic extremism in office…
Poor thing… Isn’t that a travesty…!
poor Holy Joe–America’s Least-Loved Public Servant. nobody likes him!
Crocker’s reply : *plop*
a thing of beauty,he gave big compliments in the beginnig teed up the ball….and WHACKED IT…beautiful
Until the next session starts, nine months from now? Because after that, the Ds should have a solid majority that won’t require JoeLiar’s smarminess. He’s the very junior senator from CT, after all, since he didn’t get elected as a D, and Reid needs to be reminded of that, frequently.
Holy Joe doesn’t even deserve my contempt anymore. To give it to him would mean that I have an emotional investment in him. Those days are over! I only have an emotional investment in seeing him crawl into a hole and curl up into a little ball and fade away. That is coming next Jan. one way or the other.
Lieberman’s still angling for a Veep seat … with Kim Jong Il.
there is a great word for it my mom uses,means “beneath my contempt” inferdig?
hahahahahahaha
Thank you for that, I really needed it.
I have been sitting here getting more and more infuriated with that………guy.
What are we, chopped liver? We need to make him worry about FDL as much as he worries about Kos.
Perhaps we’re not advocating hard enough. Perhaps we should start identifying ourselves as firepups when we call, write, or attend a Lieberman event.
Boxturtle (Are there FDL Tshirts? If so, where?)
okay this guy bragging
lmao
Well said.
Petraeus is talking about Fallujah and how safe it is. Wasn’t the city basically destroyed and ethinically cleansed when Preznit Bunnypants had his temper tantrum after the Blackwater contractors were strung up from the bridge?
Any city that is destroyed is probably not going to be a hotbed of activism when it’s being rebuilt (duh). I wonder if that’s the next place for a McVain shopping trip/campaign commercial/photo op?
yea good…blow em up…put em back together …oh goody!
With comments like this, I’m starting to seriously wonder how stable HARRY’S leadership position is for next year. As Tom Ricks noted in his liveblog (h/t Emptywheel):
OK, that’s five folks who might have a problem with Harry’s position on Short Ride Joe. Do I hear ten? How about fifteen? Do I hear 20? 25?
If I were Harry Reid, I’d keep my spokesperson on a very short leash when it comes to Short Ride Joe.
So let us rant about joe. Let us scream at the TV in frustration at the stooges bend over to offer their own personal fellatio of betrayus and cocker. Big deal. Did anyone hear a raised voice regarding the continuing atrocity of 4 million dps? Or, how about the obscenity of an avg 3 hours of electricity. And let us not forget the twenty thousand plus Iraqi prisoners being held in Iraq.
Wake Up and smell the coffee troops. We have been had again. I am tired of watching the public ass kising of the troops and their criminal leaders. Who has the balls to stand up and shout-ENOUGH! I don’t see anyone. Do you?
Boo hoo hoo. Senator Demint is unable to return.
Fallujah is held under almost permanent curfew … the conditions are horrific … but it’s a success per C&P
Has Reid noticed that Lieberman is out campaigning for McCain the Republican candidate?
ohh I like that..beneath my contempt
Harry Reid needs not to be Majority Leader next term. Plain and simple.
Seems that’s completely OK … why is that?
Try here.
bravo
Hey Siun! Thought so… BTW, thanks for encouraging CT to blog over at M&C!
Cardin is calling them out for the lack of progress in Iraq!
there is one word that means that,mom uses it when she is beyond pissed
We had to destroy it to save it.
BTW, “total warfare” (being willing to destroy every man, woman, child, building, infrastructure) is one of the only ways that works sometimes in getting rid of insurgencies. It’s what the Brits did to the Boers, for example. But even total warfare doesn’t always work. The Soviets did it in large parts of Afghanistan & still lost.
i concur
Thanks.
Somebody has, they stripped him of his superdelegate status.
Now, if Harry could just see the example, and give him a short ride right out of the caucus, that would be just lovely. Strip him of his committee leadership positions. Force him to admit that “lieberman for CT” is just a synonym for “republican ass-kisser.”
YES, and is there anything WE can DO about that?
yea the Brits were real pricks….village inihilation
is crocker shrinking or just sinking lower in his seat?
Time for the toothless FEC to start investigating the $350,000 in petty cash that Joe
used to buy votesdisbursed in his primary against Lamont.Awesome! Many have asked where we could get them…! How long have they been available?
How old is Crocker. As the day has gone on (and on and on and on), he is shrinking into boyhood, white hair notwithstanding.
It’s SOLID, imo. If Hillary gets elected, he’ll be her choice. If Obama gets elected, he’ll keep Harry in order to build bridges.
Boxturtle (And if McBush wins, Lieberman gets an administration post)
visualization: nasty little man disappearing into his own ass
I owe you a coke (no, not that kind), but i just got myself a glass of chardonnay, so perhaps I could pour you one?
JoLie = Benedict Arnold.
cool…
Peter,
For some reason when you go to CaféPress.com and search for firedoglake this design does not come up. Curious. Thanks for finding the right link. I knew it was there somewhere.
Quite a while. I know I bought one back in 06.
Oo, thanks! Black shirt ordered. Design is a little bland, but should get the message across.
Boxturtle (Hey Joe! Come to Ohio for McBush and I’ll give you an FDL fashion show)
Crocker is talking about a Status of Forces agreement, and Cardin just told him not to make it a unilateral agreement without Congressional approval. Interesting sideways slap at the 1600 Crew attempt to make a “Long Term Security Treaty”.
absoultely, wine is my friend.
America has turned the corner on Iraq. Our reps get it. The surge can do this and that and the other thing. It only means Iraq sucks less, but it still sucks. We were sold a bill of goods and now, we are throwing good money after bad, while our bridges collapse, our markets tremble and Americans are being thrown into the streets.
Not a lot of patients out here, or sympathy. John “Twitchy” McInsane will not get the keys to the Whitehouse and we will slowly leave Iraq. This exercise is just who looks more foolish. My money is on Huckleberry.
Biden smacked him about this earlier, that they wouldn’t be entering into any long term agreements without the Congress.
So here’s another pet peeve of mine. I wish that when a Q isn’t answered, the questioner would say: “I’ll note for the record that you did not answer the question.” and then go on to the next issue. Makes the point, politely.
*spew* Bwaahhaahahahahaha
Finally someone brings up blackwater!!!!!1 Go Casey
*pouring” glug, glug, glug. Nothing like the sounds of wine being poured out of the bottle.
Thanks.
You should get a commission.
Heh, following up on Hill’s questions! Just as Casey was questioning C&P on Blackwater, MSNBC cut out…! Bastards!
shorter Crocker “Um Ahh Lie. Um ahh Lie” Tough job
I’m so glad CT is blogging at Main and Central - it’s such an important resource and he’s already doing great work. Lurch would be very happy.
Have any of the Senators mentioned that Baghdad is in LOCKDOWN now?
America must use mercenaries because we don’t have the “assets.” ???
hahahahahahahahaha
The surge is working!
Ya’ll are too kind…! *g*
Blackwater is required because there are not enough State Department security boobs? Gee, how about they hire some, and dump Blacwater. Oh, god that would mean that privatization failed, an unthinkable thought.
Crocker would “recommend” a cancellation of the contract? That and $2 would buy you a large coffee at Starbucks, right?
shhhh … we don’t talk about that just as we don’t talk about the daily air strikes on people’s houses
Been around for a while, but I don’t know how long.
I keep waiting for them to put up an FDL towel, useful for wiping up the snark-induced coffee spills.
John “Twitchy” McCain can walk through downtown Baghdad wearing nothing but a banana hammock.
ahhh vino, wein, vinho…notinglike it in all the world.
nothing like these jack asses either
Why are these underlings testifying?
Where is Rice?
Where is Gates?
Why does the Senate allow this silly show by an operational commander and a chief of station in the field? This is the committee that reviews policy? Senators are big thinkers and shouldn’t be troubling themselves with the tacticians.
Send Betrayus and Crockashit back to their offices with notes for their bosses: Your Presence Is Requested on Capitol Hill.
Dude, that was not nice.
I didn’t need that visual.
Brain bleach now required. You should have warned me.
From Mother Jones:
As General David Petraeus and U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker testify before Congress this week about the security situation in Iraq, telling the Senate Armed Services Committee on Tuesday that the surge is working and progress is under way, U.S. embassy officials in Baghdad have been ordered to take heightened security precautions in light of stepped-up attacks on the Green Zone, including one on Sunday that killed two U.S. soldiers and wounded 17 others.
“Sir, what sexual position creates ugly babies?”
“Ask your mother.”
Heh, not just coffee…! I’ve wasted a few beers too…! ;-)
thank goodness the win had kicked in before I had to deal with that visual
Via Atrios:
From Cokie Roberts’ mouth to the AP’s…whatever.
So let me get this straight: Foggy Bottom approved this contract against the recommendation of the on-scene Ambassador?
I was only an intern at State, and it was long ago, so I guess things have changed. Good grief!
They’d just get a note back that said “executive privilege, suck on it.”
What is a banana hammo. . . . oh.
more
Under this new security boost, says a U.S. Embassy official who asked not to be identified, embassy personnel have been told to remain under “hardened cover.” Instructed to avoid their trailers, some embassy staffers are now sleeping in their offices and on cots in the new embassy building, currently under construction
Webb’s up now!
Because the pig-in-the-poke sold by Beloved Leader is that these are the people he uses to make his decidering decisions. And the fucking idiots in the Congress have allowed themselves to be buffaloed into buying into that lie.
You are 100% right, but if either of them Rice/Gate (or both) showed up all they would do is say “Ask Petraeus” or “Ask Crocker”, or “I’ll get back to you”.
Senator Webb’s voice is so deep I’ll bet he has six testicles.
So is that Holy Joe’s car parked in the Capitol Zone next to the armored humvee or the Blackwater APC? I can never tell. Hope he can catch that armored helo flight to the airport; won’t be another one until tomorrow. Tel him to take his ID and own bottled water when he goes to the Senate Gym; the private contractor guards won’t let him in without them.
Where’s the ‘Robust’ diplomacy…?
Where’s Fallon too?
you are so right!
On a day like this, chardonnay sounds more like “blog, blog, blog”. ;-))
Joe Lieberman: Senator concern troll from hell..
He was told not to testify, specifically from Gates and the WH!
Webb aint taking any BS
your killing me
Yeah, I wondered why they did not call ADM Fallon too.. His testimony would be a very interesting juxtaposition to Petraeus. I don’t think he’d hold back either, after all, he’s got nothing to lose.
I can’t believe the Senate Democrats got suckered into another Crock of Betrayus. This is really stupid. The country isn’t deeply divided — Americans want to win! Just ask Cokie Roberts.
yep, split right down the 70/30 middle…
not that Bush and co have anything to hide
Sorry for the OT, but NBC’s Brian Williams & Co., are telling us that American Airlines massive grounding of aircraft ISN’T about safety; it’s about the FAA telling airlines to follow safety guidelines to the letter. Got that. I’m still working on it. We gotta fight ‘em there to keep us safe here. Yup. Still working on that one, too.
Yee-Haw, the Guardian article is brought up…!
Biden is saying we’ll know exactly what is in that ‘agreement’!
BTW Petraeus’ charts can be found here:
http://www.defenselink.mil/pdf.....Packet.pdf
That too!
to quote someone:
“So?”
The day after his retirement is official, I hope to see him up on the hill spilling his guts in front of these folks.
Digby
Joe Biden Just Obliterated Every Administration Argument About Iraq
Joe Biden asked Amb. Crocker where it would be better for American national security interests to eliminate Al Qaeda in Iraq or Al Qaeda along the Pakistan-Afghanistan border. Crocker had nowhere to hide with that question. Spencer Ackerman describes the outcome.
Crocker, in an impossible political position — give the correct answer and humiliate the Bush administration; give the administration’s answer and look like a fool — dodged as much as he could. Then Biden forced him down. Crocker: “I would therefore pick Al Qaeda on the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.”
Game over.
get em biden…we’re hemmoraging money